Guild Wars 2

Hi guys,

I have been reading a lot about group compositions, group roles, and I believe I understand how some roles, like tank particularly, in gw2 are significantly different than in some more classicaly structured MMOs.

However, I keep seeing stuff like “Chronotank” or “Reaper Tank” which leads me to believe that tanks still exist in gw2 maybe just not exactly as they do in those other classic structures, or not as I am thinking of them.

I have read the wiki about Aggro and Tanking and studied the meta builds for these Chrono and Reaper tanks… But I am still having problems with a fundamental question.

What is the role of the tank in a group in gw2? And how is it accomplished?

Thanks very much in advance, I am pretty new and have mostly experienced only open world content.

The “tank” designation exists in some raid encounters. In the Vale Guardian, Gorseval, Keep Construct and Xera encounters, the boss will aggro on the player who has the highest Toughness stat. That player becomes the tank.

The role of the tank in those encounters is to be able to survive the boss attacks (generally not too hard) and position the boss properly for the various mechanics (this takes more skill). Chronomancer is a popular tank because it’s not a class that puts out good DPS on its own in the first place, and it has many blocks/evades along with Distortion to be able to survive the boss attacks, letting it tank without requiring too much Toughness. It’s possible for a properly geared and skilled Chronomancer to tank for a raid encounter and still be able to fulfill the primary goal of the class, keeping the raid fully buffed with Quickness.

As a rule of thumb, there are no “tanks” in GW2. It’s not an applicable concept most of the time.

Even in raid encounters, where Xiahou Mao is correct they do exist, it is not the classic “tank” role in other games. It’s entirely reasonable to have a few people fill the role, swapping out, and it’s not about standing still and being hit a lot.

The fact that cloth wearers are the current common “tanks” probably helps cement that.

As others have mentioned, tanks in gw2 only ever exist in raids, they have no purpose in any other gamemode. The way you become tank is by having the highest toughness in your group (which is very easy to achieve, since most people have the default value of 1000, with warriors occasionaly spiking up to 1400 with their traits). Therefore as long as you have over 1400 toughness, you will consistently hold that boss’ aggro.

The reason why chronomancers are usually tanks, is because of how their class works. They have access to a lot of dodges and blocks, while still doing pretty okay damage and providing a lot of boons. Basically, you can tank without sacrificing any of the abilities you would have otherwise. This means, you have to play very well. 1 or 2 attacks can still easily down you, so you need to make use of your blocks, evades and distortion mechanic to avoid all kinds of damage.

There is also the “minstrel” chrono tank, which is a lot more “tanky” in the traditional sense, allowing you to take much more hits before going downed. You basically trade all your damage for extra survivability and very good healing to your group. Nevertheless, even the minstrel build takes a lot of effort to play properly and efficiently. You still need battlefield awareness and you’ll have to time your skills very well.

So basically your role and goals as a tank can vary (dps/buffing/healing/…), but it will require some solid understanding of the game and very attentive gameplay. I would definitely NOT recommend starting out as a tank, since it’s pretty much the most difficult role in raids.

Awesome, thanks! That has helped a lot.

So there are some cases where a tank would hold aggro, but that is encounter specific, and atypical.

Yeah, the clothyness was also confusing to me @SlippyCheeze but understanding this now it does make more sense.

@Tarasicodissa But it seems like this toughness preferred boss target system is dependent on the specific boss of the encounter, correct?

Also @Tarasicodissa, Indeed particularly since my experience as a more traditional tank in WoW for example seems to have no benefit in gw2. This question comes from a very meandering path of questions that goes something like:
What do I use my 80 boost on?
Mesmer
Why?
They are annoying to level
OK, what can a Mesmer do?
Everyone likes Chronotanks
Oh? I thought there were no tanks in gw2…
Well there aren’t…
Oh, um…

So…
When the encounter does not rely upon a more classic aggro management related, positioning based use of the tank (as it usually doesn’t) it is just that the “tank” is the epicenter of a giant clump of AOEs that are generally buffing the raid (a raid being the only place you would find a “tank” in gw2).

And the classes chosen for this role are those that have generally not great dps because their concentration on raid buffing does not decrease raid damage because their dps contribution was not significant in the first place.

But… the “tank” must be survivable enough to be in the middle of the action… making certain professions/specializations better suited for this role because they are the proper combination of MoreUtilityThanDPS and Survivability.

PrinceOfTheImpure.1508:

@Tarasicodissa But it seems like this toughness preferred boss target system is dependent on the specific boss of the encounter, correct?

I mean the design for raids is in such a way that they try to shake it up so not all encounters are as static that you could plausibly write them off as ‘tankable’.. I think their approach is pretty good imo. Take a look at the encounters that don’t req any tank at all, and see if u can figure out why/how that is the case (two examples listed below).

Sabatha- obvious. if sab and all mini bosses aggroed permanently on one player, whole grp could stack on opposite side and just ‘cheese’ the encounter in this way.

Slothasor - If there were a tank, agreeably it would be easier. But it would also be boring and a snoozefest and could arguably be ‘cheesed’ to some extent as mentioned. They did a clever thing by including a fixation mechanic so that each player (given enough attempts or a chance at RNG) can be a tank for this boss momentarily and hold aggro albeit for a short duration.

Also @Tarasicodissa, Indeed particularly since my experience as a more traditional tank in WoW for example seems to have no benefit in gw2. This question comes from a very meandering path of questions that goes something like:
What do I use my 80 boost on?
Mesmer
Why?
They are annoying to level
OK, what can a Mesmer do?
Everyone likes Chronotanks
Oh? I thought there were no tanks in gw2…
Well there aren’t…
Oh, um…

So…
When the encounter does not rely upon a more classic aggro management related, positioning based use of the tank (as it usually doesn’t) it is just that the “tank” is the epicenter of a giant clump of AOEs that are generally buffing the raid (a raid being the only place you would find a “tank” in gw2).

And the classes chosen for this role are those that have generally not great dps because their concentration on raid buffing does not decrease raid damage because their dps contribution was not significant in the first place.

But… the “tank” must be survivable enough to be in the middle of the action… making certain professions/specializations better suited for this role because they are the proper combination of MoreUtilityThanDPS and Survivability.

I think you’re missing the point. Chrono is/has been in a unique position for a while in that their class-specific boons are simply one of the best dps boosts for groups, second only to perhaps war banners. Their support is that good, that u can really overlook the fact of their mediocre dps and make them a staple for any grp in raids. As to if they make the best tanks? No, probably not. Guard or a full defense-traited necro for instance would prob make a better ‘tank’ bc they can ignore most hits and wouldn’t have to even bother dodging. But think of it this way, for ideal team comp you must have like 1-2 chron anyway for their boons as mentioned above. Their boons (quickness/alac) are huge boost to team dps hence why there are chronos every group. So rather than replace anyone with defense-traited necro for example (who would u replace – an ele, and give up a massive chunk of group dps?) u can simply adapt to this and use the tools u alrdy have at ur disposal. So weakest link in the chain in this ideal comp is chrono, since their dps is next to worthless even in zerker gear. Solution? Well heck y not turn their awful dps into an asset rather than a crutch. Slap some toughness stat onto their gear, make them tank. So doesn’t matter that they aren’t the best tanks, u are alrdy killing two birds with one stone so y complain. They can tank well bc of their their class mechanics as well as their complimentary wep sets, but w/o their class-specific boons (that is, if it were removed entirely from the game) I highly doubt they would remain the go-to tank class otherwise.

To answer ur other question, yes there are guides to learn to tank the ‘tankable’ bosses. I made a post that lists which I consider to be easiest bosses to learn to tank.. if need more info then jus ask. But remember also, ‘chrono’ does not necessarily mean ‘chronotank’. As there are usually two chrono in ideal team comp (mirror comp) , it’s up to u which of u wants to be the tank for any given encounter. This can be achieved pretty simply in truth. Simply bring some zerker trinkets so u can easily swap out gear to lower ur toughness. Having access to legendary weps also helps bc u can just swap out stats without replacing them. Ez pz rite?

Also, here’s the link to that,
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/dungeons/Best-way-to-start-raiding/first#post6448208

PrinceOfTheImpure.1508:

@Tarasicodissa But it seems like this toughness preferred boss target system is dependent on the specific boss of the encounter, correct?

Also @Tarasicodissa, Indeed particularly since my experience as a more traditional tank in WoW for example seems to have no benefit in gw2. This question comes from a very meandering path of questions that goes something like:
What do I use my 80 boost on?
Mesmer
Why?
They are annoying to level
OK, what can a Mesmer do?
Everyone likes Chronotanks
Oh? I thought there were no tanks in gw2…
Well there aren’t…
Oh, um…

So…
When the encounter does not rely upon a more classic aggro management related, positioning based use of the tank (as it usually doesn’t) it is just that the “tank” is the epicenter of a giant clump of AOEs that are generally buffing the raid (a raid being the only place you would find a “tank” in gw2).

And the classes chosen for this role are those that have generally not great dps because their concentration on raid buffing does not decrease raid damage because their dps contribution was not significant in the first place.

But… the “tank” must be survivable enough to be in the middle of the action… making certain professions/specializations better suited for this role because they are the proper combination of MoreUtilityThanDPS and Survivability.

Let me be a bit more specific:
Vale Guardian, Gorseval, Keep Construct and Xera are bosses which lock on player with the highest toughness. This is where a “chronotank” comes into play.
Sabetha spits fire at the player furthest away from her, so you usually have someone assigned to kite those attacks. That person is usually druid though, not chronomancer.
Slothasor will randomly target one of the 10 players in the squad and randomly switch targets throughout the fight, which means everyone has to be ready to kite him around. There is a clear visual marker above that person, so everyone can easily see who is currently tanking.
Matthias will use one of his attacks (hadoken) at one particual person that he locks on at the beginning of the fight. However, he will physically follow the person that is the furthest away from him (which is not even entirely consistent).
Other bosses and trash mobs use similar aggro mechanic as open world bosses and mobs (I assume), which is a combination of toughness, proximity, how much DPS you’re doing and possibly some other factors.

Also, let my try to explain a bit more clearly why chronos are usually tanks in gw2 raids. They can tank on top of doing their regular job, without sacrificing anything. If you look at any other profession in gw2, they would have to give up a lot of their personal utility to be able to tank. And if you dedicate one spot purely for a (traditional defensive) tank, you are basically giving up 1 person worth of DPS and support. So with chronotank, the squad and job distribution will look exactly the same it would look in any other fight, without a tank. So chronos can easily pick up or drop “tanking” on the fly, without making any significant changes or sacrifices to their build. You are basically condensing two roles (standard buffing chrono + a tank) into one person.

If you are looking for a class to use your lvl80 boost on, I will definitely agree mesmer is the best choice. They are annoying to level indeed, because they have very low personal damage (compared to other classes), even with a fully offensive build. Good chronomancers are always very much sought after, because it’s hard to play them and very few people can do it. And even if you don’t feel like playing chronomancer in a raid, there are many more places in the game where they shine. They are amazing for dungeons and fractals, they can help people in open world (portals at jumping puzzles,…) and do very well in any type of group content in gw2. Only thing they suck at is solo play, because of the “supporty” nature of their class. Which is why lvl80 boost is a good idea, since you’ll be able to skip the solo leveling process.

Also, as many people often recommend, do NOT use your level 80 boost on the class that you plan on being your main. It is very valuable to go through the game the “oldschool” way, slowly leveling your character and getting to learn its abilities and game mechanics. As soon as you reach level 80, most people will assume you understand your class well and are able to play it properly. But unfortunately due to the fact that many people just boost their way to lvl 80, you have a lot of max level noobs in the game, who have no idea how anything works. Keep in mind that being max level =/= understanding the game.
A lot of max level content assumes you understand your class and can play well. If you just boost to 80 and hop straight into endgame, you will hit a brick wall.

PrinceOfTheImpure.1508:

@Tarasicodissa But it seems like this toughness preferred boss target system is dependent on the specific boss of the encounter, correct?

Outside of raids it is much, much less predictable. Inside them, easier to manage, but there is absolutely no assurance that ANet will continue to use “most toughness => tank” for future raid wings, raids, or content.

PrinceOfTheImpure.1508:

Also @Tarasicodissa, Indeed particularly since my experience as a more traditional tank in WoW for example seems to have no benefit in gw2. This question comes from a very meandering path of questions that goes something like:
What do I use my 80 boost on?
Mesmer
Why?
They are annoying to level
OK, what can a Mesmer do?
Everyone likes Chronotanks
Oh? I thought there were no tanks in gw2…
Well there aren’t…
Oh, um…

Actually, your WoW tanking experience will be extremely valuable, at least as far as it was experience with “active mitigation” tanking, rather than passive “stack block” tanking.

GW2 is all about the active mitigation. Positioning, dodging out of attacks, timing your defensive skills, those are all things that are common between every GW2 class and WoW tanking — while those poor DPS saps be all “but why is champion eat my face naow” because they are not used to any of that stuff.

PS: to your very first question in that chain, I suggest you use the level 80 boost on “a free set of exotic soldiers gear”, and call it a day. Skipping levelling isn’t really a huge boon like it is most places.

Also, it’s 80 hours of gameplay through relevant, at least somewhat interesting content that you will eventually have to complete if you decide to create an (old world) legendary, so why not use levelling time to do it?