Guild Wars 2

Perfect example of why GW2 will never be competitive.
Both players are just spamming their skills. The warrior is trying to glose the gap and the engineer is fleeing while throwing grenades behind him.
None of what is seen in the first clip requires any skill at all, from neither of the players.

Clip two is also an example of why the risk/reward and CD balance in GW2 is a mess. He killed a person simply because he got a single skill off, a skill that has 7s cooldown and if it misses it has an internal cooldown on 3 seconds.

To anyone in this thread replying: “lol. perfect rotation. u bad”
Congratulations, you are in the 10% that still has not realized that nothing in GW2 takes any real skill. None of these players did anything 80% of this community couldn’t have done.
If these clips were uploaded to show why GW2 is not a skill-based game, then you succeeded.

The point I was making is you sometimes need to sacrifice what you want to do with your character to build to survive the meta. How many mesmers do you see running both IoL and Portal now? Very few (I think probably ifluenced by Helseth) because mesmers just dont live without that extra selfish utility. Even going so far as taking Lyssa’s Runes and Mass Invis (this may be also due to power creep meaning Moa is no longer necessary).

But the point is forced to adapt. There will always be some classes you NEED to outplay – how do you think mesmers feel vs S/D? But you can do your best to mitigate how hard they counter you.

By the way, OE, did you use internet radio to listen music and if so, which one?

google.3709:

for the people who like to argue everything just to be right:

Mace/Mace

• 1 Daze(15s cd)
• 1 Stun(7-10s cd)
• 1 Knock down 25s cd

Hammer

• 1 Stun 7-10s cd
• 1 Knock Down 24-30s cd
• 1 Push Back 20s cd

Rampage

• 1 push
• 1 Stun
• 1 Knock down

[utility]

• Stomp

so.. Engineers lowest stun break CD is 40s. vs 10 CC’s most in a lower cd, and all the warrior needs to land is 1 stun break or no stun break you realistically have to outplay them, while all the gotta do is land one of the spammable stun on you

These are the tools that build has to take out the Warrior;

Pistol/Shield
*1 Blind
*1 Push back
*1 2 second block with 1 second stun when hit and 2 second daze when thrown

Grenade Kit
*1 Blind
*1 Chill

Bomb Kit
*1 AoE blind
*1 AoE immob
*1 AoE knockback

Also, 5 dodges back to back.

These are the tools that build has to take out the Warrior;

Pistol/Shield
*1 Blind
*1 Push back
*1 2 second block with 1 second stun when hit and 2 second daze when thrown

Grenade Kit
*1 Blind
*1 Chill

Bomb Kit
*1 AoE blind
*1 AoE immob
*1 AoE knockback

Also, 5 dodges back to back.

and all the warrior need to do is land one cc in between and your dead gg.
spamable cc in a game where cc is the single most strong thing you can do and on top they let cc have good dmg and on top of that have a tanky build lol the weed at anet is prob amazing can i get some?

cottage.3274:

These are the tools that build has to take out the Warrior;

Pistol/Shield
*1 Blind
*1 Push back
*1 2 second block with 1 second stun when hit and 2 second daze when thrown

Grenade Kit
*1 Blind
*1 Chill

Bomb Kit
*1 AoE blind
*1 AoE immob
*1 AoE knockback

Also, 5 dodges back to back.

and all the warrior need to do is land one cc in between and your dead gg.
spamable cc in a game where cc is the single most strong thing you can do and on top they let cc have good dmg and on top of that have a tanky build lol the weed at anet is prob amazing can i get some?

Isn’t that the risk you take from not grabbing a stun break?

lel, is this guy for real… If you dont bring a stun-breaker, be prepared to get stunned no matter how ‘good’ you are (spamming aoe around you doesnt take much skill btw). I too would like to run triple arcane utils s/d on my ele, but considering the current stun meta, i’ll be a complete idiot to rely purely on my overconfidence to dodge right?

Btw nice little description of yourself LOL
“Hi, I’m ostricheggs! I’ve played GW2 tourneys since before time itself and I know more about them than almost anyone else. I’m rank 63 in PvP and I multi-class but am renowned for playing engineer!
If you have any questions dont be afraid to ask!”
Nice ego, when do you host your skyhammer farms btw? haha

AtoBoss.2906:

lel, is this guy for real… If you dont bring a stun-breaker, be prepared to get stunned no matter how ‘good’ you are (spamming aoe around you doesnt take much skill btw). I too would like to run triple arcane utils s/d on my ele, but considering the current stun meta, i’ll be a complete idiot to rely purely on my overconfidence to dodge right?

The stunnbreaker engineers have right now has a 40 sec CD (vs the warrior hammer stunn on a 7 sec CD). On top of that they dont have stability as far as i know (will be added next week).

Whatever you might think of a certain player or his build. Seeing any player going from 80% to 0 during one stunn sequence is kittened. Just like its kittened how i can kill people from 80% to 0 during a single fear on my necro or …

This thread is proving what I’ve been saying about looking for advantages with objective reasoning.

A stun Warrior build clearly wins vs. OEggs’ Engineer build a lot easier than Engineer wins vs. Warrior in a 1v1. So if I see a Warrior on the map I’m going to bring a class and build that has stability uptime without sacrificing damage.

The best classes for that are Guardian and Warrior right now.

The way I see it, bringing that Engineer build when there’s a Warrior on the map is asking to be farmed or seriously challenged all match. Same thing when an S/D thief is on the map and someone brings a Mesmer or Ele. If your teammates aren’t peeling for you, it’s a 4v5.

I plan on not getting wrapped up in class identity, favoring objectively deciding what class gives me the best chance to win overall.

Come on now people can’t be serious with the stun break nonsense. Most people run 1 or 2 stun breaks in there build warriors have access to literally 3 or 4 stuns if they spec a certain way(and possible immobilzes as well )and the most powerful of them with a sigil last 4 seconds and can be used like every 8 seconds. In some one on one or two on two situations if they fight goes on more then about 20 seconds they will lock you down eventually for at least 4 seconds straight, if not more, unless they are total bads. Thats an eternity and you are toast if the players are good.

Ya the math isn’t there for Warrior stun defense right now on any class that doesn’t have stab uptime.

Also, Warrior has higher armor and health than any other class so they start with more defense that comes with the package.

I don’t really see the point of trying to 1v1 a Warrior right now.

XII.9401:

The devs implemented mechanics that don’t reward skill. This game favors stealth and numbers over skills heavily. Worst of any mmo.

The smart pvpers realized that 3 months into the game and ditched it.

Skillfloor inexistent.

I cant be bothered to read this thread, but going off just the videos, this is just another classic example of poor play. I have fought that same warrior many-a-time to much better results, using a build with 2.1k armor. Just like in your eley video of “lol i eat all da spirits en i die xDD” this is simply poor play on your part leading to your death. #thetruthhurts

There are many people here not getting it. It’s not about stun lock builds. At the time of theorycrafting stunlock, it was a necessity to counter terror necro. All other warrior builds simply couldn’t hold up. It was a joke. Countering engineers was a welcome by-product, as like many condi classes at the time they would need to be heavily outplayed.

The skill cap was reasonably high, as missing a stun and letting them ‘get free’ would make things tricky. This build could counter condi classes, but with the low condi removal and zero regen risk/reward was reasonable, though perhaps lower than burst builds. These builds were largely unviable to all but about ten players though.

I could go on, but I’ll just give it straight; nerfing CC isn’t going to increase risk/reward. Nerfing healing signet will. Nerfing berserker stance will. At th moment you may as well just run axe/axe on a glass build.. And it’s still dull as hell.

Dirame.8521:

cottage.3274:

These are the tools that build has to take out the Warrior;

Pistol/Shield
*1 Blind
*1 Push back
*1 2 second block with 1 second stun when hit and 2 second daze when thrown

Grenade Kit
*1 Blind
*1 Chill

Bomb Kit
*1 AoE blind
*1 AoE immob
*1 AoE knockback

Also, 5 dodges back to back.

and all the warrior need to do is land one cc in between and your dead gg.
spamable cc in a game where cc is the single most strong thing you can do and on top they let cc have good dmg and on top of that have a tanky build lol the weed at anet is prob amazing can i get some?

Isn’t that the risk you take from not grabbing a stun break?

stun break 40s cd, skull crack 8s, earthshakers 8s cd on most builds, everything else is between 20-30s, would it really make that much off a difference, also berseker stance and warrior has the most stab in the game :]

also none of those skills are going to kill the warrior, if anything they will simply stall ur dead for a while longer. ( unless you got GoD mode enable like Got does)

stun break or no stun break, you literally have to outplay the other person regardless of their skill level, while all he needs to do is land 1 stun.

lol @ zone in denial, warrior’s op bro get over it.

oh yeah the engineer counters of blind/chill/cc etc, oh wait nvm berserker stance and stability. teldo was actually gonna reroll to warrior before we decided to call it lol.

Locuz.2651:

AtoBoss.2906:

lel, is this guy for real… If you dont bring a stun-breaker, be prepared to get stunned no matter how ‘good’ you are (spamming aoe around you doesnt take much skill btw). I too would like to run triple arcane utils s/d on my ele, but considering the current stun meta, i’ll be a complete idiot to rely purely on my overconfidence to dodge right?

The stunnbreaker engineers have right now has a 40 sec CD (vs the warrior hammer stunn on a 7 sec CD). On top of that they dont have stability as far as i know (will be added next week).

Whatever you might think of a certain player or his build. Seeing any player going from 80% to 0 during one stunn sequence is kittened. Just like its kittened how i can kill people from 80% to 0 during a single fear on my necro or …

You guys can’t be so narrow minded and only count it as stun vs stun break. You have to also consider all the other things he can use to defend himself and those things usually reduce the need for a stun break.

At this point it’s hard to argue that anybody can reliably hard counter Warrior 1v1 so guess what I’m playing when I come back in solo queue? lol

Your build leaves you totally open to stun > you get stunned > opponent is clearly terribad. Right.

So once you accept that this thread was a mistake due to abysmal logic, one good suggestion has come from the discussion surrounding it. In your stream just now you proposed that stunbreakers come with a brief stability. This would work well to promote stunbreakers as an effective counterplay to current CC spam.

I main engineer too, and dabble in the other classes to improve my gameplay. From this experience I can say with assured confidence that CC warrior is not the no-skill counter to engineer that you claim. Although CC is our major weakness, there are traits and abilities to minimise it and provide counter-play. Spending time running a CC warrior will also help you to learn their rotations and weaknesses to capitalize upon on return to your main.

I will agree that Warrior CC is in need of some slight shaving down and I think the stunbreak suggestion and the removal of the short internal cooldown on skullcrack misses would go a long way to achieving that balance. 

Rangers get protection on dodge and 50% endurance regen, so there’s another option. They have Rampage as One and can hold off on their condis until Zerker stance is down.

Guardians have really high armor level and short protection cooldowns, plus really strong direct damage, and stability.

Melandru runes help vs. stuns on all classes. 1k condi damage hits pretty hard having 1.2-1.5k doesn’t mean anything if you’re dead vs. warrior in every single 1v1 that you don’t dodge his low cooldown stuns.

Do those add up to winning vs. warrior reliably? No, but at least they help

The fact you have to lose damage to prolong your death just means the warriors sustain gets more and more effective as you’re losing damage.

Ostricheggs.3742:

I am perturbed that you have the gal to imply that I’d run rampant with a skilless and near immortal build if I wasn’t hard-countered by a stun warrior.

That’s exactly the point. You chose to use a build that has no easy-outs. It requires good twitch-reflexes to function properly, and the skill ceiling of the build is high and is capable of doing huge plays. The first video is a good example of that; again, the engineer dragged 60% of the enemy team into Henge and enabled the rest of his team to control the rest of the map.

The second video is an example of what happens when a high skill ceiling, high skill floor build is used inadequately. The engineer nonchalantly galloped up to the warrior within 130 range and gets himself skull cracked (which means the warrior had full adrenaline, implying that the warrior was fighting the engineer previously and was trying to disengage). Instead of letting the warrior go and doing the right thing of capping/holding the point, the engineer makes a very poor decision of going off the point, galloping into some random corner of the map, getting stunned when all cooldowns and dodges are available, and dies for no reason. That’s all.

That is not a good example of skill vs reward – that’s an example of poor decision making with a build that requires good decision making. The engineer tied that noose around his own neck for using that build.

do according to you, whoever gets stun locked it’s due to poor decision making on their part! interesting….

so, if he gets stunned twice, does that make him a terrible player then ? 3 times maybe he should quit the game, specially since adrenaline is sooo kitten hard to get and skull crack is over telegraphed

Let Arenanet figure out whether or not it’s balanced. I don’t see the point of running builds that don’t put you and your team at an advantage, or make you inherently weak to something popular

It’s everyone’s choice what they run when they queue up and have that minute and a half to analyze the team comps.

I understand what both OE and Zone are saying and while I do agree that warrior is OP, you can’t expect to beat every class and every spec with one single spec. It’s just not realistic.

Well this most certainly got derailed again. I can’t wait to make another ambiguous and pretentious set of highlights under a title that seems like I’m trying to prove a point!

Also, you people don’t understand engis. It’s almost comical the lack of knowledge of why I chose elixir R and why I chose these highlights. If you even ask that in the first place then you shouldn’t be commenting, everyone who plays engi knows it’s too good to not run and stunbreaks won’t help against stun wars.

Zone, my offer still stands!

Ostricheggs.3742:

Well this most certainly got derailed again. I can’t wait to make another ambiguous and pretentious set of highlights under a title that seems like I’m trying to prove a point!

Also, you people don’t understand engis. It’s almost comical the lack of knowledge of why I chose elixir R and why I chose these highlights. If you even ask that in the first place then you shouldn’t be commenting, everyone who plays engi knows it’s too good to not run and stunbreaks won’t help against stun wars.

Zone, my offer still stands!

It’s not the warriors fault to stunlock against no-stunbreak build as it’s not the engis fault for AR against a condition build. So what… this game has too many bad traits and skills. You can do everyday a video of something that is broken, it’s standard in this game

Empathetic Fighter.2065:

Ostricheggs.3742:

Well this most certainly got derailed again. I can’t wait to make another ambiguous and pretentious set of highlights under a title that seems like I’m trying to prove a point!

Also, you people don’t understand engis. It’s almost comical the lack of knowledge of why I chose elixir R and why I chose these highlights. If you even ask that in the first place then you shouldn’t be commenting, everyone who plays engi knows it’s too good to not run and stunbreaks won’t help against stun wars.

Zone, my offer still stands!

It’s not the warriors fault to stunlock against no-stunbreak build as it’s not the engis fault for AR against a condition build. So what… this game has too many bad traits and skills. You can do everyday a video of something that is broken, it’s standard in this game

Yea, it’s fun to rile people up and get yelled at for being bad though

Ostricheggs.3742:

Well this most certainly got derailed again. I can’t wait to make another ambiguous and pretentious set of highlights under a title that seems like I’m trying to prove a point!

Also, you people don’t understand engis. It’s almost comical the lack of knowledge of why I chose elixir R and why I chose these highlights. If you even ask that in the first place then you shouldn’t be commenting, everyone who plays engi knows it’s too good to not run and stunbreaks won’t help against stun wars.

Zone, my offer still stands!

I think it depends on what you’re trying to do. There are some top engies who don’t run it, but of course that comes at a heavy price, since engineers are pretty awful at rezzing outside of elixir R. I stopped running it and don’t miss the self-rez at all, since I don’t die as much. But that makes my build now 100% selfish, so…I guess I’ll just keep it to solo queues.

I do agree that your threads continue to get derailed—the point is that stunlock builds are lolworthy, not which of you played/built better. However, I think the sigil of paralyzation fix in three days will go a long, long way, so maybe this is not the right time to get frustrated over stunlock builds.

Empathetic Fighter.2065:

It’s not the warriors fault to stunlock against no-stunbreak build as it’s not the engis fault for AR against a condition build. So what… this game has too many bad traits and skills. You can do everyday a video of something that is broken, it’s standard in this game

I can’t agree with that line of reasoning, either. The same logic would say that the United States has too many problems to worry about homelessness, so good luck and stay warm. That is an exaggeration of the problems and an illogical response.

Crysis’s build will be barely effected by any change to the paralyzation sigil change. It runs only 2 stuns each of which will only lose 1 second of stun. It is OP against anyone who does not run a massive amount of stun breaks, blinds or aegis. I personally think the problem with the build is its rate of application not with the length of the stuns.

If the rate were toned down a warrior may have to start counting dodges and watching for blinds and aegis, but with how many disables they have SPAMMING = WIN.

I personally run Virtue Guardian and I find it a nice respite when having to fight Crysis rather than a H/L warrior. Crysis does not run any stability and spams the heck out of his disables where H/L just lays down a bunch of AOE I would have to concede the point in order to avoid.

On the front of easy classes. I put bomb/grenade engi in the ame group as Necros, Warriors and Spirit Rangers. They have an enormous rate of condi application, such that almost any condi removal does not work and all they have to do is spam where the enemy is in order to hit them. I do not understand the nostalgia for previous metas, Fresh air ele used to be big and they were mostly spamming air attunement, heartseeker thief, sword pistol quickness thief, bulls rush/hundred blades warriors, BM ranger, Staff ele, and so on were all big before when the game was “balanced”

hehk.8705:

Crysis’s build will be barely effected by any change to the paralyzation sigil change. It runs only 2 stuns

…

Crysis’s build >< cheers dude

Phaeton.9582:

hehk.8705:

Crysis’s build will be barely effected by any change to the paralyzation sigil change. It runs only 2 stuns

…

Crysis’s build >< cheers dude

Crysis’ build
You’re welcome.

Darnis.4056:

Phaeton.9582:

hehk.8705:

Crysis’s build will be barely effected by any change to the paralyzation sigil change. It runs only 2 stuns

…

Crysis’s build >< cheers dude

Crysis’ build
You’re welcome.

More of this

Go on Ill ask whats the crysis build ? lol

I can say right now my Warrior and Ranger take zero skill to play and usually top the charts in points. I don’t even have to think to play them. Necro pretty much the same. I just don’t like casters.

I deleted my Ele…

tcbear.2357:

Lighter.5631:

Sweetbread.2679:

silentnight warrior.2714:

This is what happens when “insert class here” dont dodge, use stunbreakers, stand still and do nothing against “insert class here too”.

I totaly agree with your title. It was not the extreme skill of the warrior but the extreme lack of skill of the other player, he let him reach 130 range with the mace and with vigor and 2 dodges to use he just stand there. What to expect?

Just that you know MAYBE the burden of skill shouldn’t be entirely on one person. I love the whole “yeah op you didn’t pull of that insane skillshot correctly, its your fault!” defense, when the person they were fighting against required basically 0 skill to pull off their win AT ALL. Sheer deluded idiocy.

0 skill? you didn’t see that warrior was running away in the 1st place? why would a class that requires 0 skill to win run away?! i know right! mind blown!

and that warrior actually had defensive trait and stunbreaks.
thats the risk and reward right there and being outplayed for mindlessly chasing.

and you know what, a defensively speced engi can take 3 full hb of a ppv war and not going lower then 70% i know, mind blown as well, war can’t touch a stunned engi, i know, so unreal! not to mention that a single blind and their stun are wasted.

lol this kid. You really have to stop what you were doing in this forum, check your history by yourself, can you realize that about 90% of your post were talking crap to others? All the things you were saying just wrong. SO WRONG. It is 0 skill indeed, especially when you see a warrior running a full cc set up, you can immediatly understand that this warrior has no skills, the only thing he can do is run a cheesy spec and make himself viable.

tell me a thing i said that is wrong. full CC set up? lol do you even know how weak that is, all of the “OP” meta warrior builds right now are not more then 60% of CC in the set up.
You should seriously start to think, just because i disagree some obviously wrong statements with legit arguments mixed with some crap talking, doesnt mean im wrong. if anyone is crap talking, you are 100%, look at your comment, pathetic. also saying kid doesnt make you any more mature then anyone, just stop.

Hi this is Crysis the warrior in the video and yep I’m running mace mace hammer in light of the next patch’s change to stun duration. I believe it might even be stronger with the change to staggering blow.

I am proud of my build and I must say it takes more skill than most will admit. Been playing nothing but warrior since the first beta and mained hammer knocked down warrior in guild wars 1 even.

Also I blew my frenzy by mistake in the first video, I would of had him the second he jumped on henge…

0
10 IV
30 III IX X
0
30 III VIII XI heal sig, bulls charge/stab/stomp/kick, frenzy, zerker stance, signet of rage (lyssa runes)/banner (Divinity)/rampage(Melandru runes… 10 trait under defense changed to II)

Aetherized… Hammer (Paralyzation), Mace (Paralyzation), Mace (Energy)