Guild Wars 2

I love GW2 pvp, I really do. That is why I find it so incredibly depressing that I’m probably going to have to leave pvp entirely. I play on a team you see, a guild 5 man team.

I have wanted a solo-duo queue for a long time in this game, because I don’t find it fair nor enjoyable to come up against players that prove to be little challenge basically because of their inability to communicate. It’s not fair to throw teams against solo players and I’ve agreed totally with this. I want these players to be able to play the way they want to. Many of these players however don’t seem to give a crap about me and my friends.

They keep talking about how more people will enjoy the game when they can only play by themselves. The problem is that people with someone to play with don’t feel this way. Many players that only play solo seem ok with screwing everyone else over for something that seems entirely petty to me. Screw the fact that a multiplayer game should encourage playing with friends. Who gives a crap about being social right? Why shouldn’t you and your friends who all play the same game play separately at the same time. That makes a lot of sense right?

Why can’t there be a full premade queue? Because of long wait times? I’d wait an hour for a 5v5 match, and that’s not a joke. I wouldn’t wait 30 seconds for a solo queue game. Why? Because it’s not fun to be thrown into a game where the team composition is whack, strategy is wonky, and where people are not cooperative and often openly hostile.

I know I sound upset, it’s because I am. I care about this game, but apparently Anet has chosen to abandon players like me and my friends. This is my first topic on this forum and probably my last as I’ve been enjoying myself in-game before this newest development and never had much to comment here about.

I’m out, I’ll be back if I can play with my friends again. Even if I have to queue for an hour to do so. If not, then I’ll look for a game in which I can do so instead.

Best Regards
Xebioz

I was one of the people who advocated a solo/duo queue but it was never meant to be at the expense of team queues as I take part in those too…

Both is what I thought we were voting on, not one or the other. For all we know it could be just the one season…. Maybe next season we can have both

You’ll still be able to queue full 5 man premades in unranked.

You can always play with a team in unranked.

The sacrifice you make here is that you can’t COMPETE as a team. Unfortunately the game currently doesn’t have enough teams to have a competitive team queue. So to help the better future of the game, you have to make sacrifice here. If we can have a successful solo/duo competitive game mode, I am sure there will be more chance to create a team queue in the future.

Tamasan.6457:

You’ll still be able to queue full 5 man premades in unranked.

So what you’re saying is that I can play pvp without getting any pvp rewards, no leaderboards, no leagues, no nothing and this is my great consolation prize? No thanks. I play pvp for the competition of getting better every season and so forth, off-season I don’t play as much because I find the seasons give me something to strive for. And I don’t want to queue against solo and duo players in unranked where they have no chance against my team and where most people play horribly. The solo/duo queue will kill five man teams in unranked too, since there is no point for many of the teams to practice.

So basically I will be stuck with no rewards and a long queue time to play against people that will lose based on an unfair disadvantage

I’d rather switch games to be honest than to be treated like garbage.

Exciton.8942:

You can always play with a team in unranked.

The sacrifice you make here is that you can’t COMPETE as a team. Unfortunately the game currently doesn’t have enough teams to have a competitive team queue. So to help the better future of the game, you have to make sacrifice here. If we can have a successful solo/duo competitive game mode, I am sure there will be more chance to create a team queue in the future.

Says who? You? What is enough? What is the problem? I keep hearing this over and over again but noone will tell me how many is needed. And it’s just based on speculation. A full premade only queue has never been tried has it? How do you know noone would do it? It’s pure speculation.

Exciton.8942:

If we can have a successful solo/duo competitive game mode, I am sure there will be more chance to create a team queue in the future.

This sentence makes no logical sense. What incentive is there to risk creating another queue when you have successful soloQ? More population? Note this is more soloQ population if its successful, not representative of teamQ.

I’m a soloQ player and I’ve advocate a lot on having double queue even when others implied this is just a “test season”, simply because removing teamQ generates absolutely no data on teamQ perspectives even if you’re just testing. This is basic research selection bias.

Players can argue teamQ population is too little to achieve teamQ with decent waiting time, but they’re kitten lying to themselves if they say its technically difficult. Generating 2 queues will allow you to consolidate data on teamQ population and its effect on soloQ in just one season, after all we still have people like OP who’re willing to wait (which can do open world now btw) for decent match. But it looks like ANet decides to take baby steps.

Personally I doubt restricted to soloQ will bring back much of the lost population “that teamQ driven away”, players will simply find other things to complain and there are many other valid reasons to leave.

And no, forcing team players to fight in unrank, where we have more people who are testing builds, have no map awareness or no drive to win, is simply worse for both sides of the match. You simply dump the same problems to unranked. These experiences achieve nothing for team players except discouraging them from forming teams.

If you think Anet doing their best to insure even matches for everyone is being treated like garbage, then there’s no common ground here and further discussion is pointless.

If you really are as good as you think you are, then you have nothing to fear from this solo/duo trial. You’ll be matched up with similarly high skilled players against a team of similarly high skilled players. Maybe you’re overreacting before even seeing what this season is going to be like.

Tamasan.6457:

If you think Anet doing their best to insure even matches for everyone is being treated like garbage, then there’s no common ground here and further discussion is pointless.

If you really are as good as you think you are, then you have nothing to fear from this solo/duo trial. You’ll be matched up with similarly high skilled players against a team of similarly high skilled players. Maybe you’re overreacting before even seeing what this season is going to be like.

Even matches for everyone? How won’t a 5v5 only queue be even? You’re arguing against a strawman of your own creation there my friend as I never wanted a single queue. So stop pretending I did.

If I am as good as I think I am? What is this? I never said I was a god at this game, I said with my team I am better than a bunch of individually better solo players. That is just a fact of life, and that is why we are implementing solo/duo queue in the first place, an idea which I agree with.

Not giving me an outlet to play with my friends is not “ensuring everyone gets even matches” it’s just ensuring that I can’t play with my friends.

There used to be in the past a separated queue for teams and soloq with no restriction and let me tell you this OP : many so called teams opted to always play in the soloq queue for easier competition against disorganized pugs.

All you’re saying, all you’re asking..was already done in the past and people abused it for easy reward farm

“queue too long” “not enough teams” " want to play with my friends"….these were the excuses you’d hear frequently and that’s why they merged soloq and teamq

You don’t want go unranked with your “friends” because you miss on the rewards?Why should be rewarded for playing a full premade vs pugs in ranked?

Supreme.3164:

There used to be in the past a separated queue for teams and soloq with no restriction and let me tell you this OP : many so called teams opted to always play in the soloq queue for easier competition against disorganized pugs.

All you’re saying, all you’re asking..was already done in the past and people abused it for easy reward farm

“queue too long” “not enough teams” " want to play with my friends"….these were the excuses you’d hear frequently and that’s why they merged soloq and teamq

You don’t want go unranked with your “friends” because you miss on the rewards?Why should be rewarded for playing a full premade vs pugs in ranked?

How about you stop telling me what I think and answer my actual points instead? I don’t want teams to be able to go against solo queue. So stop pretending I didn’t say all along that I wanted a separate 5v5 queue where no such abuse would be possible.

Again, stop fighting strawmen and argue the point. The fact that noone on your side is able to seems to be an indication of how valid the points are.

Edit: All from my OP, so instead of seeing some underhanded motives next time how about you read it?

“I have wanted a solo-duo queue for a long time in this game, because I don’t find it fair nor enjoyable to come up against players that prove to be little challenge basically because of their inability to communicate.”

“Why can’t there be a full premade queue? Because of long wait times? I’d wait an hour for a 5v5 match, and that’s not a joke.”

I clearly state there separation of queues, so no, not asking for easy farm.

Evan Lesh.3295:

Not enough full parties play to keep an entirely separate 5-man queue healthy 24/7. However, that doesn’t mean teams shouldn’t have a structured place to participate in PvP. This will be part of the the discussion around the followup poll regarding solo/duo queue.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/pvp/Season-5-looks-terrible/first#post6421991

azyume.6321:

Evan Lesh.3295:

Not enough full parties play to keep an entirely separate 5-man queue healthy 24/7. However, that doesn’t mean teams shouldn’t have a structured place to participate in PvP. This will be part of the the discussion around the followup poll regarding solo/duo queue.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/pvp/Season-5-looks-terrible/first#post6421991

Which is the most comical point of all. What he is talking about here is basically long queue times. So instead of allowing me to wait, he stops me from being able to play all together because he doesn’t think I should wait.

How does that make any sense? Is he afraid of complaints of long queue times? Does he think there will be less complaints when the queue times are then made infinite?

When your solution to a problem is to multiply it by an infinite, you know you’ve dun goofed somewhere.

Premades farming pugs is not competitive , stop whining. If you think you are competitive then go to pro league tournaments you and your team. Let everyone else have a fair envrironment by disallowing premades

Emdrix.6124:

Premades farming pugs is not competitive , stop whining. If you think you are competitive then go to pro league tournaments you and your team. Let everyone else have a fair envrironment by disallowing premades

Another person who displays lack of reading comprehension.

For those who find it TL;DR
He wants to have 2 queues, one for 5 men only and one for solo/duo. He doesn’t care about the time, just want at least one opportunity to actually play with friends.

Emdrix.6124:

Premades farming pugs is not competitive , stop whining. If you think you are competitive then go to pro league tournaments you and your team. Let everyone else have a fair envrironment by disallowing premades

I’m all for having two queues, so stop arguing against a strawman. You’re the one set on trying to force me into your queue, I don’t want to be in it.

NICENIKESHOE.7128:

Emdrix.6124:

Premades farming pugs is not competitive , stop whining. If you think you are competitive then go to pro league tournaments you and your team. Let everyone else have a fair envrironment by disallowing premades

Another person who displays lack of reading comprehension.

For those who find it TL;DR
He wants to have 2 queues, one for 5 men only and one for solo/duo. He doesn’t care about the time, just want at least one opportunity to actually play with friends.

I believe the one with reading comprehension problems would be you…

The OP clearly states that he doesn’t want to go unranked with its team because he’d lose on the rewards

After that I’ve said that in the past we had separate queue and that didn’t stop “teams” from going in the soloq queue regardless to farm pugs for easy wins.

In the end me and other people on this thread don’t care if the OP and his team are a beacon of morals in this harsh world, he possibly represent maybe 5% of the teams playing GW2 casually, if given the chance with soloq/teamq separate queue, many people would surely abuse the system…as it was in the past, even more now with revamped rewards.

I’m sorry for the OP and his friends but…as stronghold has showed us, the majority of players out there, lack the morals, principles or any resemblance of sportmanship

Stronghold got killed for one reason only : stacked premades farming pugs, stacked premades with double druid/ele+reaper farming pugs for easy legendary title..at least for season 1/2.

The community has no more time to waste for this kind of BS

You stuff so many words into someone you don’t know. If you take your time to read the whole thread again he clearly stated he understands solo/duo Q and would want another teamQ for 5v5 only. 5v5 only. 5v5 only. I probably have to state it 3 times so you won’t miss it, or in his words:

“Why can’t there be a full premade queue?”

Even if teams were able to enter soloQ in the past, it is clearly outside of his premise. You’re bound by your first impression of the past and assume the rest of your argument on that, which is clearly a strawman argument.

Its not hard to stop teamQ from entering soloQ, as ANet decided to implement this season. So do tell me why can’t they make a queue where only 5 men can enter and block 5 men entry into solo/duo queue?

Supreme.3164:

NICENIKESHOE.7128:

Emdrix.6124:

Premades farming pugs is not competitive , stop whining. If you think you are competitive then go to pro league tournaments you and your team. Let everyone else have a fair envrironment by disallowing premades

Another person who displays lack of reading comprehension.

For those who find it TL;DR
He wants to have 2 queues, one for 5 men only and one for solo/duo. He doesn’t care about the time, just want at least one opportunity to actually play with friends.

I believe the one with reading comprehension problems would be you…

The OP clearly states that he doesn’t want to go unranked with its team because he’d lose on the rewards

After that I’ve said that in the past we had separate queue and that didn’t stop “teams” from going in the soloq queue regardless to farm pugs for easy wins.

In the end me and other people on this thread don’t care if the OP and his team are a beacon of morals in this harsh world, he possibly represent maybe 5% of the teams playing GW2 casually, if given the chance with soloq/teamq separate queue, many people would surely abuse the system…as it was in the past, even more now with revamped rewards.

I’m sorry for the OP and his friends but…as stronghold has showed us, the majority of players out there, lack the morals, principles or any resemblance of sportmanship

Stronghold got killed for one reason only : stacked premades farming pugs, stacked premades with double druid/ele+reaper farming pugs for easy legendary title..at least for season 1/2.

The community has no more time to waste for this kind of BS

I agree with you totally, we shouldn’t allow premades to play against solo/duo queue.

Can we actually skip this false argument since it has nothing to do with what I’m talking about in this thread?

I want a 5v5 only queue, with ONLY full premades, NOONE else. The fact that you think that that is ganking pugs tells me that either you have misunderstood what Nike and I have told you this entire time, or you have some paranoia that makes you think that somehow A 5v5 only queue will somehow spiral into them queuing with Solo/Duo, WHICH I DON’T WANT.

I highly encourage Yannir’s option. I’ve not pursued such organizer because I don’t teamQ much but it’ll help with your situation and keep your GW2 experience going in season 5. It may not be perfect, but at least having a set event time also save you lot of wasted time in waiting.

Lobstertail.1075:

Exciton.8942:

You can always play with a team in unranked.

The sacrifice you make here is that you can’t COMPETE as a team. Unfortunately the game currently doesn’t have enough teams to have a competitive team queue. So to help the better future of the game, you have to make sacrifice here. If we can have a successful solo/duo competitive game mode, I am sure there will be more chance to create a team queue in the future.

Says who? You? What is enough? What is the problem? I keep hearing this over and over again but noone will tell me how many is needed. And it’s just based on speculation. A full premade only queue has never been tried has it? How do you know noone would do it? It’s pure speculation.

I think they stated several times that majority plays solo/duo and the old team queue was removed because of lack of players.

You need to understand that there has be priority for development power. Ideally, they should develop another queue and ranking board for team. But the structure will definitely be different and separate from the solo queue. It takes time to build that. Many players don’t want to wait for another couple of months for a team queue.

Exciton.8942:

Lobstertail.1075:

Exciton.8942:

You can always play with a team in unranked.

The sacrifice you make here is that you can’t COMPETE as a team. Unfortunately the game currently doesn’t have enough teams to have a competitive team queue. So to help the better future of the game, you have to make sacrifice here. If we can have a successful solo/duo competitive game mode, I am sure there will be more chance to create a team queue in the future.

Says who? You? What is enough? What is the problem? I keep hearing this over and over again but noone will tell me how many is needed. And it’s just based on speculation. A full premade only queue has never been tried has it? How do you know noone would do it? It’s pure speculation.

I think they stated several times that majority plays solo/duo and the old team queue was removed because of lack of players.

You need to understand that there has be priority for development power. Ideally, they should develop another queue and ranking board for team. But the structure will definitely be different and separate from the solo queue. It takes time to build that. Many players don’t want to wait for another couple of months for a team queue.

^This

P.S I suggest people in this thread to keep personal attacks ..to a min, the report button is there for a reason

Supreme.3164:

P.S I suggest people in this thread to keep personal attacks ..to a min, the report button is there for a reason

I suggest you take your own advice. There are alrdy several posts by you in this thread that are ripe for the that same button. No offense intended. You have a very aggressive writing style that could use a bit of tempering.

if you want to play 5v5 competitively with both teams being full premade then you’ve been playing the wrong game the whole time and i think it should’ve gotten to you pretty obvious that not a whole lot of people are willing to play pvp in a full premade team

throwing a fit just because you cant earn rewards for rolfstomping solo players with your buddies for one season is just sad

Lobstertail.1075:

I love GW2 pvp, I really do. That is why I find it so incredibly depressing that I’m probably going to have to leave pvp entirely. I play on a team you see, a guild 5 man team.

I have wanted a solo-duo queue for a long time in this game, because I don’t find it fair nor enjoyable to come up against players that prove to be little challenge basically because of their inability to communicate. It’s not fair to throw teams against solo players and I’ve agreed totally with this. I want these players to be able to play the way they want to. Many of these players however don’t seem to give a crap about me and my friends.

They keep talking about how more people will enjoy the game when they can only play by themselves. The problem is that people with someone to play with don’t feel this way. Many players that only play solo seem ok with screwing everyone else over for something that seems entirely petty to me. Screw the fact that a multiplayer game should encourage playing with friends. Who gives a crap about being social right? Why shouldn’t you and your friends who all play the same game play separately at the same time. That makes a lot of sense right?

Why can’t there be a full premade queue? Because of long wait times? I’d wait an hour for a 5v5 match, and that’s not a joke. I wouldn’t wait 30 seconds for a solo queue game. Why? Because it’s not fun to be thrown into a game where the team composition is whack, strategy is wonky, and where people are not cooperative and often openly hostile.

I know I sound upset, it’s because I am. I care about this game, but apparently Anet has chosen to abandon players like me and my friends. This is my first topic on this forum and probably my last as I’ve been enjoying myself in-game before this newest development and never had much to comment here about.

I’m out, I’ll be back if I can play with my friends again. Even if I have to queue for an hour to do so. If not, then I’ll look for a game in which I can do so instead.

Best Regards
Xebioz

Ever since the game has gone free to play it’s been simplified for casual players. We have the proof today that they don’t care about good organized gameplay, to a point where they consider their elite players a nuisance to their game.

Shame on them really, but that’s what you get when you sacrifices your initial vision to appeal for a mass of new whinny players. Everyone thinks that they are legends material even if all they do is use the metabattle condi-spam builds. Even the post old-trait-system meta was created just to make it easy for those with no reflexes or skill.

This is not the Guild Wars you are looking for.

You want a competitive Team Q but unfortunately mixing solo players against premades is absolutely not competitive. I voted for Solo/Duo Q but I also wanted a separate TeamQ for premades.

As been said before anyone who bemoans losing the ability to queue as a team against solo queuers in ranked is basically just upset because they cant farm pug soloers. (Not saying the OP since he said he wants “competitive”).

TL;DR we really need separate Solo/Duo Q and Team Q In ranked.

Lobstertail I have a conspiracy theory: they didn’t make a separate team queue because they think that without it, wannabe 5-mans will still enter the solo/duo queue as individuals or duos. That will increase the number of total players in the solo/duo queue and overall reduce the queue time, making solo/duo supporters happy. Also thanks for this thread, shoutout to Supreme and Emdrix (and Spartacus) for the quality entertainment.

Lobstertail.1075:

How does that make any sense? Is he afraid of complaints of long queue times? Does he think there will be less complaints when the queue times are then made infinite?

Because long queue times have a habit of becoming infinite regardless.

Long queue times put off players, which causes them to leave, thus increasing queue times even more. Which results in more players leaving, thus lengthening the queue times more. This repeats until there are not enough players left to sustain the queue and it dies completely.

This is a well documented problem too. For example SW:TOR did a solo queue and team queue split when they overhauled it’s ranked system in 2.4. What happened as that the team ranked had a ~20min queue when it started, but that queue time increased to several hours by mid season 1, and by the time I quit the game team ranked was dead and the only matches where done by prearrangement between guilds.

Exciton.8942:

Lobstertail.1075:

Exciton.8942:

You can always play with a team in unranked.

The sacrifice you make here is that you can’t COMPETE as a team. Unfortunately the game currently doesn’t have enough teams to have a competitive team queue. So to help the better future of the game, you have to make sacrifice here. If we can have a successful solo/duo competitive game mode, I am sure there will be more chance to create a team queue in the future.

Says who? You? What is enough? What is the problem? I keep hearing this over and over again but noone will tell me how many is needed. And it’s just based on speculation. A full premade only queue has never been tried has it? How do you know noone would do it? It’s pure speculation.

I think they stated several times that majority plays solo/duo and the old team queue was removed because of lack of players.

You need to understand that there has be priority for development power. Ideally, they should develop another queue and ranking board for team. But the structure will definitely be different and separate from the solo queue. It takes time to build that. Many players don’t want to wait for another couple of months for a team queue.

Development power isn’t really the problem they have stated before, just queue times. There is no reason the structure couldn’t be the same while they’d work on it for a new season, just (it has to be different yo). Just seems to me they want teams to abandon the concept entirely and abandon their friends to play with randoms to make things more streamlined.

Again, discouraging multiplayer in a multiplayer game is the most idiotic thing I think I’ve seen in this game yet

Lexander.4579:

if you want to play 5v5 competitively with both teams being full premade then you’ve been playing the wrong game the whole time and i think it should’ve gotten to you pretty obvious that not a whole lot of people are willing to play pvp in a full premade team

throwing a fit just because you cant earn rewards for rolfstomping solo players with your buddies for one season is just sad

So what if not as many want to play 5v5? I have said many times I don’t care about long queue times so stop saying I want one queue, it’s getting quite irritating.

Crinn.7864:

Lobstertail.1075:

How does that make any sense? Is he afraid of complaints of long queue times? Does he think there will be less complaints when the queue times are then made infinite?

Because long queue times have a habit of becoming infinite regardless.

Long queue times put off players, which causes them to leave, thus increasing queue times even more. Which results in more players leaving, thus lengthening the queue times more. This repeats until there are not enough players left to sustain the queue and it dies completely.

This is a well documented problem too. For example SW:TOR did a solo queue and team queue split when they overhauled it’s ranked system in 2.4. What happened as that the team ranked had a ~20min queue when it started, but that queue time increased to several hours by mid season 1, and by the time I quit the game team ranked was dead and the only matches where done by prearrangement between guilds.

So they think players might abandon the game because they can’t play as a team? So basically they have just guaranteed their own worst scenario then by doing it for themselves by not allowing queue in the first place. The logic behind what you state does not make any sense.

I recommand you to make a guild with the purpose of creating team based matches. Create your community around it, try to maintain it with at least 250 regulars player.

Then show Anet that the player base is here and that you can make regular matches happen. Then maybe team based queue will be a developer focus again.

There are only advantages to this solution :
- you get to know people that share the same mindset as you
- you are able to play team based matches
- you have the nice feeling to have accomplished something

The problem isn’t your team OP, it’s the professional teams that outweigh PUG teams in Ranked. This makes it unfair for SoloQ and DuoQ players in Ranked since a 5 man party has the potential to be a group of very experienced players versus a group of mixed players – you know the outcome of that.

Unranked does have up to 5 queues though, and that’s what matters. Ranked is a really competitive environment that’s trying to be fair to everyone, giving no individual an advantage over the other.

If an ESL team was to play against a PUG team, what would be the outcome? It might feel like I’m grasping at straws here, but it’s the inevitable truth.

If you wanna play with your buddies, a casual game of Unranked would be the preferable way 2 go.

Lobstertail.1075:

Crinn.7864:

Lobstertail.1075:

How does that make any sense? Is he afraid of complaints of long queue times? Does he think there will be less complaints when the queue times are then made infinite?

Because long queue times have a habit of becoming infinite regardless.

Long queue times put off players, which causes them to leave, thus increasing queue times even more. Which results in more players leaving, thus lengthening the queue times more. This repeats until there are not enough players left to sustain the queue and it dies completely.

This is a well documented problem too. For example SW:TOR did a solo queue and team queue split when they overhauled it’s ranked system in 2.4. What happened as that the team ranked had a ~20min queue when it started, but that queue time increased to several hours by mid season 1, and by the time I quit the game team ranked was dead and the only matches where done by prearrangement between guilds.

So they think players might abandon the game because they can’t play as a team? So basically they have just guaranteed their own worst scenario then by doing it for themselves by not allowing queue in the first place. The logic behind what you state does not make any sense.

Because having a dead queue opens up other issues. If the queue dies to the point that nobody is queueing, then you open up the possibilities of unscrupulous players using the empty queue to win-trade. (another issue SW:TOR had with it’s team queue)

Exploits aside there is no logical reason to spend development resources on a system that you know is going to fail.

Crinn.7864:

Lobstertail.1075:

Crinn.7864:

Lobstertail.1075:

How does that make any sense? Is he afraid of complaints of long queue times? Does he think there will be less complaints when the queue times are then made infinite?

Because long queue times have a habit of becoming infinite regardless.

Long queue times put off players, which causes them to leave, thus increasing queue times even more. Which results in more players leaving, thus lengthening the queue times more. This repeats until there are not enough players left to sustain the queue and it dies completely.

This is a well documented problem too. For example SW:TOR did a solo queue and team queue split when they overhauled it’s ranked system in 2.4. What happened as that the team ranked had a ~20min queue when it started, but that queue time increased to several hours by mid season 1, and by the time I quit the game team ranked was dead and the only matches where done by prearrangement between guilds.

So they think players might abandon the game because they can’t play as a team? So basically they have just guaranteed their own worst scenario then by doing it for themselves by not allowing queue in the first place. The logic behind what you state does not make any sense.

Because having a dead queue opens up other issues. If the queue dies to the point that nobody is queueing, then you open up the possibilities of unscrupulous players using the empty queue to win-trade. (another issue SW:TOR had with it’s team queue)

Exploits aside there is no logical reason to spend development resources on a system that you know is going to fail.

SW:TOR was dead outside of team queue anyway, so comparing the games is really stupid anyway. There are plenty of solutions to all the problems you state here, above in the thread. Certain primetimes for team queue for example

If ganking of pugs is a big problem (which it is) you can’t at the same time say there are no teams. To think they are all ganking for the purpose of ganking not as a consequence of being forced against solo/duos like myself is quite pessimistic. Many of these horrible ‘gankers’ are so only because the game makes them be by forcing them into the same queue.

Abelisk.4527:

The problem isn’t your team OP, it’s the professional teams that outweigh PUG teams in Ranked. This makes it unfair for SoloQ and DuoQ players in Ranked since a 5 man party has the potential to be a group of very experienced players versus a group of mixed players – you know the outcome of that.

Unranked does have up to 5 queues though, and that’s what matters. Ranked is a really competitive environment that’s trying to be fair to everyone, giving no individual an advantage over the other.

If an ESL team was to play against a PUG team, what would be the outcome? It might feel like I’m grasping at straws here, but it’s the inevitable truth.

If you wanna play with your buddies, a casual game of Unranked would be the preferable way 2 go.

So first off we are assuming an ESL team would play against a pug team which would assume massive matchmaking issues. Not as big as the ones the game developers have been disregarding for years and now force me to take part in if I want to play ranked though (class-combo whackery is a good example).

The fact that you imagine there being only 2-3 teams wanting to play 5v5 which would cause such issues does to me seem like a massive leap of faith. If there are enough teams to be considered the biggest hindrance to good gameplay because of ganking you can’t at the same time pretend that there are no teams willing to play in a team queue.

Lobstertail.1075:

I’d wait an hour for a 5v5 match, and that’s not a joke, …….. I’ll be back if I can play with my friends again. Even if I have to queue for an hour to do so.

Xebioz

Organize skrims and join some community tournaments.

Theyre mostly end up more fun that what you get from a random qpop.

Thats just adivce, youre not wrong either.
Its a trial to getting a proper soloq back, we got LAN events for the esport high end, so hopefully something like an ingame daily/weekly mini tournament system will come in future to fill the void.

Just wanna clear some things up and drop my opinion. OP clearly just wants a separate queue for 5-man teams only. This would not effect solo queue players in any way, and the fact that Anet has chosen to not allow a team of friends to compete in this pvp league in a game mode constructed around 5-man teams in an mmo is just mind blowing. On the subject of the ancient split queues, there was a solo queue and team queue. The team queue allowed for teams of any size to join, that was it’s fault. It pushed away players with less than a 5-man team because they were getting destroyed, and there weren’t enough 5-man teams to sustain adequate queue times. Then the queues were merged, and we are all aware how that turned out. Now we have solo/duo queues only.

So now there is no option at all for 5-man teams to play competitively, in an mmo. Now on the argument of there not being enough teams for a team queue, OF COURSE THERE ISN’T! Anet hasn’t made a single attempt to promote Team Queue at all. You give the option of Team Queue and Solo Queue, provide the exact same rewards and incentives for both, of course the majority of players are going to take the easiest route possible and play Solo Queue. Why go through the trouble of finding 4 other players to team up with and wait through longer queue times when you can just hop in as a solo player and progress much faster? If Anet is curious as to why Team Queue isn’t popular, they have only themselves to blame.

As a primarily Solo Queue player, I’m glad there will be a Solo/Duo Queue. However, long queue times or not, I just really can’t believe they would remove Team Queue completely. Solo Queue is fun and all, but a truly competitive environment can only be found in 5v5 Team Queue, and personally I will always feel that is what they should focus on when implementing these Leagues. At the very least let these teams have somewhere to compete in the Leagues too, I mean, just, wow.

As others mentioned, you can still play kitten man teams in unranked. I do all the time and I’ve had just as much fun doing that.
This change was something recent and was voted on by the community. They did care which is why they had the poll as opposed to just making a sweeping change.
It is also not a change set in stone. When I started pvp they had a queue that was exclusively for teams. For various reasons, that went away but it’s possible we could see it’s return.
ive seen countless threads about why people are leaving pvp forever. My class got nerfed, don’t like this matchmaking or that, issues with team composition, etc. etc. nature of any game layout means some people don’t always get exactly what they want. Also that way in real life. Nothing wrong with making suggestions or offering criticism but can we please have enough of these “im leaving forever” tantrums?

A compromise may be to add another queue for 4- or 5-man premades, and a pref for soloq people to see if they want to be included in those matches, to round out the 4 man groups. One bonus of this is that it lets soloq people find teams/guilds they may want to play with in the future, which is hard right now.

4/5ers will probably have long queue times, but not much can be done about that. Not sure its worth having something similar for 3- man groups, they should probably only be matched with 2 duo or 4 soloq.

Lobstertail.1075:

Lexander.4579:

if you want to play 5v5 competitively with both teams being full premade then you’ve been playing the wrong game the whole time and i think it should’ve gotten to you pretty obvious that not a whole lot of people are willing to play pvp in a full premade team

throwing a fit just because you cant earn rewards for rolfstomping solo players with your buddies for one season is just sad

So what if not as many want to play 5v5? I have said many times I don’t care about long queue times so stop saying I want one queue, it’s getting quite irritating.

its not about queue times its about the matchmaking being easily exploitable if there isnt many players in the matchmaking pool

Solstace.2514:

As others mentioned, you can still play kitten man teams in unranked. I do all the time and I’ve had just as much fun doing that.
This change was something recent and was voted on by the community. They did care which is why they had the poll as opposed to just making a sweeping change.
It is also not a change set in stone. When I started pvp they had a queue that was exclusively for teams. For various reasons, that went away but it’s possible we could see it’s return.
ive seen countless threads about why people are leaving pvp forever. My class got nerfed, don’t like this matchmaking or that, issues with team composition, etc. etc. nature of any game layout means some people don’t always get exactly what they want. Also that way in real life. Nothing wrong with making suggestions or offering criticism but can we please have enough of these “im leaving forever” tantrums?

Everyone is aware of the vote, some just didn’t realize they would remove 5v5 entirely. Also, it’s really not fair to the people wanting 5v5 that they can no longer participate in this league as a team just because solo players outnumber them. And as previously mentioned, unranked does not offer the same matchmaking or rewards as ranked nor will it guarantee him that his 5 man team will be matched up against another 5 man team. There has also never been a separate 5v5 Team Queue. The old Team Queue that existed allowed teams of any size, and was one of the reasons people did not enjoy it. And again, the lack of people wanting to make teams and compete in a 5v5 Team Queue is due largely in part to Anet never making an effort to facilitate or promote Team Queue.

Of all the “I am quitting the game because of X” threads, this one has pretty solid reasoning. Anet is preventing the OP from participating in this entire League season with his friends.

Im with OP. If teams cant participate in league in what is supposed to be the best MMO to date whats the point? Solo players in pvp dont make sense to me, if you like playing on your own thats great I played solo for a long time too, but there are plenty of other spaces to do so PvE, WvW & Unranked. Now this is just my opinion but those who arent doing everything they can in a COMPETETIVE league to win they shouldn’t really be there to begin with. If all solo players are there for are the rewards thats fine but winning PvP requires cooperation, teamwork and strategy, which is why pugs dont work, thats just basic logic. I dont want anet to impeach players from playing how each wants to play but if players really wanted better chances of winning they would just bite the bullet gather their friends or join a guild. I guess its moot point now anyway, I’d be interested to see what the feedback for this season is. I wont be leaving pvp like OP though, cause I also love it and i used to play solo anyway, so you may see me out there this season with my one friend but i’ll be salty af.

For season 6, add a 5 man team queue. Make the rewards better than solo/duo queue to help compensate for the longer wait. And to make it more attractive for players to form teams.

Keep the solo/duo queue with the following change. When a team wins, the team re-enter the solo/duo queue as a team. After 3 consecutive wins, they get put into the team queue.

Now you provide solo players the ability to meet and form teams and help feed the team queue.

As a Solo-Queuer, let me just say that I support you OP.

Even though I appreciate that soloq is coming back, it shouldn’t have been at the expense of teams.

What you suggest is what we had in the past, two separate queues of 5-man teams and individuals. You’re not the only one! I still do, for these past couple years, ever since it was taken away.

SlimChance.6593:

For season 6, add a 5 man team queue. Make the rewards better than solo/duo queue to help compensate for the longer wait. And to make it more attractive for players to form teams.

Keep the solo/duo queue with the following change. When a team wins, the team re-enter the solo/duo queue as a team. After 3 consecutive wins, they get put into the team queue.

Now you provide solo players the ability to meet and form teams and help feed the team queue.

How about No to your weird idea

Keep two different queue separate. Why should solo players be forced to put in team queue just to facilitate team queue players?

Exciton.8942:

SlimChance.6593:

For season 6, add a 5 man team queue. Make the rewards better than solo/duo queue to help compensate for the longer wait. And to make it more attractive for players to form teams.

Keep the solo/duo queue with the following change. When a team wins, the team re-enter the solo/duo queue as a team. After 3 consecutive wins, they get put into the team queue.

Now you provide solo players the ability to meet and form teams and help feed the team queue.

How about No to your weird idea

Keep two different queue separate. Why should solo players be forced to put in team queue just to facilitate team queue players?

Because it shouldn’t really make that much of a difference to Solo players, meanwhile teams get screwed over for a whole season because a majority refuse to play a game mode the way it should be played.
Players make it sound like teams are unfair or taking an easy route when in reality solos in pugs are just making things difficult for themselves. Imagine a teamQ only, there is the option of looking for a party similar to finding dungeon and raid parties where you LFG in HOTM and get to choose your team comp before joining Q, effectively cutting out half the middleman of MM. If there were only teamQ for ranked there would probably be more stable queue times and players really do only have themselves to blame if they lose. Even if its just a group of randoms if you know your classes and builds, choose your matchups and communicate even just a bit teams can still be beaten.

I didnt want to say it but your game philosophy is truly idiotic if you think you can hop in ranked solo in a 5 man team and win without working with your teammates. the reality is teams dont actually hold that much of an advantage over pugs, they are actually just being defeated by their own disorganisation.

Ioras Dagnir.3927:

Exciton.8942:

SlimChance.6593:

For season 6, add a 5 man team queue. Make the rewards better than solo/duo queue to help compensate for the longer wait. And to make it more attractive for players to form teams.

Keep the solo/duo queue with the following change. When a team wins, the team re-enter the solo/duo queue as a team. After 3 consecutive wins, they get put into the team queue.

Now you provide solo players the ability to meet and form teams and help feed the team queue.

How about No to your weird idea

Keep two different queue separate. Why should solo players be forced to put in team queue just to facilitate team queue players?

Because it shouldn’t really make that much of a difference to Solo players, meanwhile teams get screwed over for a whole season because a majority refuse to play a game mode the way it should be played.
Players make it sound like teams are unfair or taking an easy route when in reality solos in pugs are just making things difficult for themselves. Imagine a teamQ only, there is the option of looking for a party similar to finding dungeon and raid parties where you LFG in HOTM and get to choose your team comp before joining Q, effectively cutting out half the middleman of MM. If there were only teamQ for ranked there would probably be more stable queue times and players really do only have themselves to blame if they lose. Even if its just a group of randoms if you know your classes and builds, choose your matchups and communicate even just a bit teams can still be beaten.

I didnt want to say it but your game philosophy is truly idiotic if you think you can hop in ranked solo in a 5 man team and win without working with your teammates. the reality is teams dont actually hold that much of an advantage over pugs, they are actually just being defeated by their own disorganisation.

So, five pugs can be as coordinated as five TS bois? Man, this post is going down the hill

Exciton.8942:

SlimChance.6593:

For season 6, add a 5 man team queue. Make the rewards better than solo/duo queue to help compensate for the longer wait. And to make it more attractive for players to form teams.

Keep the solo/duo queue with the following change. When a team wins, the team re-enter the solo/duo queue as a team. After 3 consecutive wins, they get put into the team queue.

Now you provide solo players the ability to meet and form teams and help feed the team queue.

How about No to your weird idea

Keep two different queue separate. Why should solo players be forced to put in team queue just to facilitate team queue players?

The solo/dou players can leave the que anytime they wish And re-que back into the solo/duo queue. But remember, team que would have better rewards so it might be worth it to try the team queue.

Krysard.1364:

So, five pugs can be as coordinated as five TS bois? Man, this post is going down the hill

Obviously not to such a degree I’m just saying its not impossible, but like I said before if your not doing everything you can to win in a competitive league and that also means not trying to join premade teams and playing as a unit ofc you’re ganna have a bad time and need to rethink what you are even trying to accomplish. PvP has nuance but its simple at its core when you know your role, the rotations and choose your match ups these are things ranked players should know. I played with my guild last couple of seasons using discord and we still lost some games occasionally and not just against other teams, I’m not an incredible unstoppable hardcore player I only rank at ruby, I almost broke into diamond but it wasnt to be. That just came down to the same reasons any team loses premade or pug, a difference in skill/bad coordination/team comp+matchups and some dumb decisions. I always play with the mindset that there is always more that I can do to win, I want the rewards as much as the next player, so for me as an ex-solo player who was pretty green at PvP last year that meant joining a PvP guild and learning the druid and mesmer meta’s inside out and I found playing and winning as a guild is so much more fun and rewarding than solo. Which is why I find this really frustrating, cause now I cant play with the friends I’ve made since joining my guild.

Again moot point now, lets see how solo and duo goes. But it doesnt change the fact its a huge slap in the face to players who put in the effort for league. Im ganna stop kittening now, gl this season everyone.