Guild Wars 2

Guardians are great point holders and can keep players off of a point long enough to at least neutralize it. Have you tried playing against a good engineer? They do it better.

Mesmers are fine. Learn to kill the right one or aoe them all down when he is dumb enough not to dodge away.

100B warriors = dodge (you get 2 of those unless you go with the right weapon swap to get 3!).

Thief = They get an aoe invis to prevent death. Guess what. Guardians get a 10 second bubble to prevent it also. Elementalists get a shield to prevent it. Other classes have other utilities to prevent death/ensure death.

I don’t notice many players using stability. What you will begin to see in paid tournaments are teams that utilize quickness, knockbacks, stability. the reason we have so many players crying is because the vast majority use cookiecutter max damage specs. Easily played, easily killed.

The idea behind this is to learn your class, think of it from a team aspect and not individually. Everyone cries about one class in particular when the ONLY THING we should be seeing on the forums is a issue with a team of 5 players together. individually, you shouldn’t have an issue if you take off your panties and put some big boy pants on (exluding the ladies).

Cheers for the advice Khronus – roll a necro then let me know what we’re all doing wrong in a bit more detail. I’d be fascinated.

roll an elementalist and tell me how to get out of pwhip plz

Jae.5138:

roll an elementalist and tell me how to get out of pwhip plz

Mist form

60 sec cd defence against a spammable number 2. makes sense

any more kitten rebuttals, please?

Jae.5138:

60 sec cd defence against a spammable number 2. makes sense

any more kitten rebuttals, please?

Are we talking about heartseekers or pistol whips? Cd reduction trait is bugged on mist form atm, so 75 sec.

either one is stupid with quickness.

What about our downed states? I’ve learned the elementalist’s down state can’t say thief’s or mesmer’s is balanced.

pistol whip has a 130 range. Their steal has a 45 second cooldown. There quickness buff the same. Quickness is the only thing that makes pistol whip strong, because the stun does not last long enough on a non quickness pistol whip to get the full damage. If you mist form 1 pistol whip as he costs it, the thief has lost. He has burned 3 cooldowns to try to do the damage he can with it, and now he doesn’t have it for another 45 seconds. He’s forced to shortbow away or die. Like Khronus said, everyone is fine. This is literally a learn to play situation. The ONLY spec that needs some damage tweaks for thief is backstab. The pvp in this game was designed to be fast paced yes, but 2 shotting someone before they can react to push their defensive key is broken. Other than that, everything is a l2p issue and you should l2p.

You’re right all classes have their strengths and weaknesses however as balance is right now some professions have more strength than weakness. Example being a thiefs high damage and high survivability (you mentioned the survivability part in your post but forgot to add the part where thieves have the highest burst in the game)

You claim that people arnt thinking in a team perspective. But people are already beginning to understand guardians are a staple in nearly all tourney comps because you will not hold mid point without one.

Some QQ may be directed toward 8v8 hornlike but there are still some balancing discrepencies in tournament format

“pistol whip has a 130 range.”

i stopped reading there. the range doesn’t affect the skill in any way.

Jae.5138:

60 sec cd defence against a spammable number 2. makes sense

any more kitten rebuttals, please?

If they hit you with a full unhasted pistol whip, then it’s not your class that’s the problem, it’s your gaming skill.

they did hit me with full hasted pwhip.

quickness has 45 second cd? big kittening deal. the problem isn’t the cd. no class should be able to kill another by spamming one button every 45 seconds.

Seems like you haven’t even met backstab.

Jae.5138:

they did hit me with full hasted pwhip.

quickness has 45 second cd? big kittening deal. the problem isn’t the cd. no class should be able to kill another by spamming one button every 45 seconds.

Haste has a 60 second cooldown, not 45. And like i said. Mist form for a hasted a pistol whip.

Payneful.7934:

Jae.5138:

they did hit me with full hasted pwhip.

quickness has 45 second cd? big kittening deal. the problem isn’t the cd. no class should be able to kill another by spamming one button every 45 seconds.

Haste has a 60 second cooldown, not 45. And like i said. Mist form for a hasted a pistol whip.

1. mist form has longer cd

2. by the time you react with your mist form, you lost a lot of hp already. (and don’t give me bull kitten about how you can react fast enough to avoid any damage. that’s only possible if you react to other random stuns as well with mist form.)

3. if the first pwhip engage fails, the thief simply pops guild of thieves to stall time until next quickness pwhip

Jae.5138:

Payneful.7934:

Jae.5138:

they did hit me with full hasted pwhip.

quickness has 45 second cd? big kittening deal. the problem isn’t the cd. no class should be able to kill another by spamming one button every 45 seconds.

Haste has a 60 second cooldown, not 45. And like i said. Mist form for a hasted a pistol whip.

1. mist form has longer cd

2. by the time you react with your mist form, you lost a lot of hp already. (and don’t give me bull kitten about how you can react fast enough to avoid any damage. that’s only possible if you react to other random stuns as well with mist form.)

3. if the first pwhip engage fails, the thief simply pops guild of thieves to stall time until next quickness pwhip

Run.

Jae.5138:

Payneful.7934:

Jae.5138:

they did hit me with full hasted pwhip.

quickness has 45 second cd? big kittening deal. the problem isn’t the cd. no class should be able to kill another by spamming one button every 45 seconds.

Haste has a 60 second cooldown, not 45. And like i said. Mist form for a hasted a pistol whip.

1. mist form has longer cd

2. by the time you react with your mist form, you lost a lot of hp already. (and don’t give me bull kitten about how you can react fast enough to avoid any damage. that’s only possible if you react to other random stuns as well with mist form.)

3. if the first pwhip engage fails, the thief simply pops guild of thieves to stall time until next quickness pwhip

1. You just said in your previous post that mist form is a 60 sec cooldown.

2. Eles can just heal to full in water attunment, then switch back to air/fire, and destroy the thief.

3. Thieves guild has a 3 minute cooldown and a very long cast time. Long enough to interrupt because of how obvious the animation is. You walk over to them and updraft them then proceed to destroy them.

1. i had it wrong, mist form is 75 sec cd

2. we cannot heal to full in water attunement. we have no kiting abilities in water attunement (except the long cd frost armor), so we can heal to a point (many a times with poison on us) while slowly walking away, and thief bashing on us from behind.

3. i’m glad you brought up our heal, because elementalist is the only class that cannot reduce the enemy’s healing. this forces us to kittenage heavy.

4. water attunement does nothing without lots of healing power, which I have. This results in further vitality and/or toughness and/or damage

5. we can’t save updraft for guild. besides, no thief uses it out in the open unless they’re bad

1. No problem. You seem to be assuming all of the thieves cooldowns are up, so then you have to assume the ele’s are too. Thief uses hasted pistol whip…..ele uses mist form…..crisis averted. If the fight lasts for another minute, both of you are doing something wrong.

2. Frost armor is the most amazing kiting ability ele’s have. With that on, the thief will not be bashing on your from behind. And yes, with a valkyrie’s amulet, you will heal yourself to full in water attunement.

4. Valkyrie’s amulet

5. Where’s your elemental?

Have you ever seen phantaram play his ele? He only has around 13k HP, but he can soak up and heal so much damage and at the same time he does a lot of damage. And yes, every time he goes to water attunement he heals to full. Check out his build if you haven’t already.

1. sound argument. i accept that
2. i do use valkyrie’s amulet. hence the 14k hp
3. elemental is hardly a protection against a thief. especially if the guild is used

phantaram gets oneshot during quickness pwhip too.

you argue that if mist form is up, quickness pwhip is averted. but what if it’s not up?

look at these following cases:

1. mist walk not up, quickness not up => sound duel
2. mist walk not up, quickness up => death in one 5 seconds by thief
3. mist walk up, quicknessnot up => sound duel
4. mist walk up, quickness not up => again, sound duel

i believe that in no situation should an elementalist get killed without being able to lift a finger against another.

You mentioned phantaram. He runs one stun breaker: mist form. Again, because he has to run damage heavy (and heal heavy) at the cost of low hp, and no stun breaker to be viable.

Jae.5138:

1. sound argument. i accept that
2. i do use valkyrie’s amulet. hence the 14k hp
3. elemental is hardly a protection against a thief. especially if the guild is used

phantaram gets oneshot during quickness pwhip too.

you argue that if mist form is up, quickness pwhip is averted. but what if it’s not up?

look at these following cases:

1. mist walk not up, quickness not up => sound duel
2. mist walk not up, quickness up => death in one 5 seconds by thief
3. mist walk up, quicknessnot up => sound duel
4. mist walk up, quickness not up => again, sound duel

i believe that in no situation should an elementalist get killed without being able to lift a finger against another.

You mentioned phantaram. He runs one stun breaker: mist form. Again, because he has to run damage heavy (and heal heavy) at the cost of low hp, and no stun breaker to be viable.

I’ll tell you what’s probably going to happen to thieves that will make pistol whip not so bad. In order for a thief to land pistol whip (because it’s incredibly hard other wise) they first pre-cast pistol whip and towards the end of the castbar they use steal which teleports them to their target and continues the pistol whip that they precast. I think Anet is going to change that so that thieves will have to use steal (or infiltrator’s strike) first to get to their target then start casting pistolwhip. This gives whoever it is they are attacking time to dodge roll away.

Another thing. When a thief uses haste all of their endurance is drained and they cant regen endurance for a period of time. At this point the thief is pretty much helpless, allowing you to updraft or earth 4 easily.

it’s not so much that thieves are the problem. after all, it is a team oriented pvp system and i can see how current pwhip isn’t all that great in a team match (it’s a channeled ability without any reflect)

however, it is overpowered in 1v1 situations like the one mentioned above, and 1v1 is quite frequent in the game as well.

also, updraft often has to be used defensively when the mist form is down.

so because you see a stream of a player who probably started playing 10 months ago at gw2, allow you to play his same build and playstyle and allow you to whine?
long time ago everyone used his own brain to be creative and build a character, now we need someone else that think for us.
if you can’t deal with only 1 stunbreak , put 2. if you can’t survive with 14k hp, change amulet. and so on. . .
what if, in the future, proplayers will say game is balanced as it is now? because usually, games are balanced by the highest level of playing possible, not at noob level.
sorry for my english

Yeah, Mesmers are a problem to kill thanks to the faulty auto targeting and Guardians…

I dont know where to start.

High Armor, Immobilize, Defense and AoE spells… I dont get it.

As far as Engi goes, I myself play Engi and much like Mesmers, we tend to pick the most annoying skills. Like The Net Turret and Rocket Turret with Explosive turret with the Elite Stun Skill Supply Crate with a Gun and Shield loadout (just look at the potions!), again all thanks to the faulty Auto Targeting.

And as Engi, the classes that give me most problems are the Guardian and Mesmer, I dont mind the other ones since you can perma disable them for a long time before they do any damage.

My recommendation to the community
Engi, Mesmer and Guardian are the best classes for sPvP.

Jae.5138:

roll an elementalist and tell me how to get out of pwhip plz

Any cantrip, take your pick they all break the stun. Most thieves will steal to you, if you see a thief shadow step on you all you have to do is dodge roll after that. Pistol Whip is an interesting skill, the can move and strike with the initial hit, after about .75s they’ll lock themself into place because of the chain hit animation (similar to 100b and blurred frenzy locking the warior and mesmer professions, respectively).

people seriously think that perfect balance is already achieved?

giggle

Jae.5138:

roll an elementalist and tell me how to get out of pwhip plz

Lightning Flash

Now here’s a project for you: roll a necro and tell me how to get out of devourer venom/pistol whip spam w/ haste; even better, devourer venom/pistol whip + panic strike trait.

I think we can all agree that devourer venom and pistol whip makes it extremely free, then haste on top of that just makes it donations to the blood god.

Fynd.4890:

Now here’s a project for you: roll a necro and tell me how to get out of devourer venom/pistol whip spam w/ haste; even better, devourer venom/pistol whip + panic strike trait.

I think we can all agree that devourer venom and pistol whip makes it extremely free, then haste on top of that just makes it donations to the blood god.

Same way as every other profession should be doing it, stun breakers. Spectral Walk (probably not that commonly used, not sure), Spectral Armor (probably your best stun breaker, as it gives protection and life force when hit…), Plague Signet (though that’s probably either not used or the active is used specifically for the condition removal, but oh hey, what happens if you send your immobilization onto the thief?)

Everything is imbalanced, nerf it all. The QQ about pistol whip is just fascinating; it’s a skill you beat by dodging as long as you have something (an instant condition removal, a teleport…) to get out of the initial immobilize.

Seriously, I love how everything feels just so good in this game. Every once in a while you see that ele who plays like a guardian and oh my god he doesn’t die either and heals 3x faster, nerf that! That thief who you barely manage to hold off against again and again, only to find him 2.5k range units away after a single stealth. The ranger who leaves you with half your health, 20 bleeds and a poison in the 4 seconds their spider’s immobilize lasts.

Most of the imbalanced-feeling stuff isn’t 1v1-related at all since it’s a team game. Ever tried to beat a good guardian-support ele pair? 3 people need coordination to end that fight. Engineer just juggling your whole team off a point while laying on the damage, hiding behind allies when in danger? Mesmers dropping off an ally through a portal to a fight you should’ve won? Nerf it!

i think that eles Dragons Tooth is quite balanced, big dmg, big delay, control needed when using, ok… but what is balanced on thief? he does 3x more dmg as ele, from stealth, with teleport and with builtin ministun or immobilize when using venom… thats not balanced imo… and they both have same hp and thief have even more armor…

The title alone should cause a lock.
Apart from that: I do agree, that very few are utilizing all abilities yet. Stability for one is one of the things people use too little. Some things like engi-bombs can be anticipated, other can’t, and stability often has a longer cd than the knockdown/back itself.

The most important is however: How do we know, when things are balanced? Lets just assume, that a very few very ppl playing on a professional level find it balanced. Does that mean, that the game is only for them? Or should it be made for the ones, who can’t be bothered to even read the description of the spells, but just use the specc given when you enter Mist? Even among the best, how do we know, that the ones finding the so-called “weaker” professions balanced are simply not better players, that just like the challenge?

It sure came as a surprise for me, that I could do so much with a “weak” class, and I am not really going back, since I have far too much fun. Some times I think, that people just play the game in too few dimensions. But again: The glory-system tend to promote that way of playing.

I was honestly expecting very little posts with this thread.

However I am excited at the amount of players continuing to QQ about the same things lol.

As far as most of you, please stop crying. Look at all of your abilities as a 5 man team and go from there. I WILL SAY THIS, quickness seems like if anything WAS out of balance, this would be it. I have NEVER had a issue with a thief. Even when they did have quickness. 100B warriors make me laugh and every single time I am standing over their dead body while I finish capping the point i tell them in /say “One trick pony is stronk”.

This game is EXCEPTIONAL and you guys just need to take a step back and rethink your approach to SPvP. Drop everything you know about 1v1 and focus on who is WITH YOU when you fight. Counter your issues with the help of your allies.

konvay.2157:

Fynd.4890:

Now here’s a project for you: roll a necro and tell me how to get out of devourer venom/pistol whip spam w/ haste; even better, devourer venom/pistol whip + panic strike trait.

I think we can all agree that devourer venom and pistol whip makes it extremely free, then haste on top of that just makes it donations to the blood god.

Same way as every other profession should be doing it, stun breakers. Spectral Walk (probably not that commonly used, not sure), Spectral Armor (probably your best stun breaker, as it gives protection and life force when hit…), Plague Signet (though that’s probably either not used or the active is used specifically for the condition removal, but oh hey, what happens if you send your immobilization onto the thief?)

Stun break does not get rid of the immobilize from devourer venom, maybe now you see my point ?

It’s sad that this thread is still up. Speaks volumes about the current opinion of Anet.

Anyway, your QQ thread about QQ’s is unnecessary and plain stupid. You don’t even mention what class you main, and how easy it is for you to deal with all these things (I’m going to assume you play Guardian, which effectively counters everything in this game).

Either way, if you ever bothered to play the rest of the classes, you would see that they do not have the same options of Aegis and Stability like the Guardians so readily do.

You only get 2 Dodges, while most of the abilities you mentioned can be spammed.

Whenever somebody makes a thread (like me), it is usually about how effective something is vs the effort it takes to do it.

I could tell you I made a Thief and was owning both in sPvP and tPvP, but you probably wouldn’t believe me.

I will tell you I’m going to make a Guardian and show everybody via video how I dance at a point while my opponents throw everything at me.