Guild Wars 2

…you still allow Asura in competitive play. Is this because:

• You still don’t understand it’s a problem?
• You don’t know how to fix it?
• You thought people would eventually stop complaining?

The only thing left is you legitimately think there’s no problem with it (which is silly) or you have something to gain from it (which makes no sense)

Obvious solutions:

• Make Asura much bigger
• Give an option to make all enemy character models human (so on there own screen they have whatever animation miniaturization they wish while on yours they can be seen) <— this is the obvious choice
• Add cast bars, goes against your game ideal but you’re not leaving us with any options here

I have absolutely no clue why this isn’t addressed yet, many of us saw this problem before the bloody beta started.

I agree with the op

i would like to add some other things that make the game less fun that it should be in spvp

1) too much aoe dmg (since we have to stay on a point to cap it aoe is too much effective)
2) too many pets
3) too many passive abilities

spvp should be focussed more on players skills (active abilities) instead of passive ones or pets or brainless aoe

They said they would help this issue by making animations bigger, that was said a couple months ago though..

Why they haven’t removed Skyhammer yet? Why the Rating in the Leaderboard is still hidden? Why there is no Skill-Ceiling in this game? Why there is only one game-mode in PvP? . . .

For every question you will ask about PvP there is the one answer? PvP was unfinished at release and they couldn’t handle all the fixes and requests due to not have enough staff.

Empathetic Fighter.2065:

Why they haven’t removed Skyhammer yet? Why the Rating in the Leaderboard is still hidden? Why there is no Skill-Ceiling in this game? Why there is only one game-mode in PvP? . . .

For every question you will ask about PvP there is the one answer? PvP was unfinished at release and they couldn’t handle all the fixes and requests due to not have enough staff.

Skyhammer problem would be not hard to fix – just delete it

I would be totally ok with them removing asura from PvP if I could wear my asuran cultural armor on a human.

The funniest thing is GW2 was supposed to be the action based combat mmo but between condis, random procs and Ai it became the most passive mmo combat in existence.
If you read this devs , do something about condis already.I should just go search for a combat mechanics features advertise pre launch to have a good lol moment.

Its rare to read a thread where you agree with every post, but so far with this one I just find myself nodding in agreement with everything said.

Asura, braindead aoe spam, passive abilities/ai, skyhammer all issues that hold the game back- add an overload of effects that make it all too chaotic (although a lot of this stems from the excessive aoe and ai).

That said, I think you should come back and play OP because there are a lot of other things that make the game great and I haven’t found a “fantasy” style mmo with spvp (battlegrounds) that can match it, despite its faults.

i also hate asuras, pet spam, mindless aoe, SKYHAMMER etc
but all games have their grimes i guess

Yeh it is ridiculous. And lol @ any pros who say its not big deal. Its a huge kittening deal. I have played more tournaments than almost anyone and I found it frustrating and impossible to handle really. Asuran warriors earthshaker was a particular problem. But do too was any asuran beneath all the effects of an ele or the ai of a mesmer/ranger/necro. Its a huge issue and one they could fix with the super adventure box technology. But things like this take someone to sit down and just spend a week fixing it. Seems like anet try to do too much and so nothing gets done.

mini.6018:

The funniest thing is GW2 was supposed to be the action based combat mmo but between condis, random procs and Ai it became the most passive mmo combat in existence.
If you read this devs , do something about condis already.I should just go search for a combat mechanics features advertise pre launch to have a good lol moment.

They cant because they buffed all anti-condi things including immunities and condi clears to the sky. So any condi nerf needs a reversal of the buffs to things like automated response, zerker stance, diamond skin, null field, etc

Lordrosicky.5813:

mini.6018:

The funniest thing is GW2 was supposed to be the action based combat mmo but between condis, random procs and Ai it became the most passive mmo combat in existence.
If you read this devs , do something about condis already.I should just go search for a combat mechanics features advertise pre launch to have a good lol moment.

They cant because they buffed all anti-condi things including immunities and condi clears to the sky. So any condi nerf needs a reversal of the buffs to things like automated response, zerker stance, diamond skin, null field, etc

So why not just advocate both?

Lordrosicky.5813:

mini.6018:

The funniest thing is GW2 was supposed to be the action based combat mmo but between condis, random procs and Ai it became the most passive mmo combat in existence.
If you read this devs , do something about condis already.I should just go search for a combat mechanics features advertise pre launch to have a good lol moment.

They cant because they buffed all anti-condi things including immunities and condi clears to the sky. So any condi nerf needs a reversal of the buffs to things like automated response, zerker stance, diamond skin, null field, etc

Condi should only exist as debuff/control not as a main damage source since as a fore it’s a broken mechanic.Even in other pvp based mmos condis (dots) were never as strong.In AoC a necro with dits needed to channel spells and enter spellweaving(autoimmobilize transfomation with no defense abilities) to kill and even then it took almost 60 seconds.

5 second burst from full hp to dead is beyound any joke especially for an action based.

Keep condis as debuff/minor damage only and buff powerspecs on classes that lack solid ones if you want to ressurect the game especially in spvp where condi beats power 20/1 risk/reward ratio.

I think hating on Asura is not solving the root of this problem. They are~cute, you see.

What if, we can work on Asuran animations and make them more exaggerated/visually distinct than what they current are?

Ferik.3127:

I think hating on Asura is not solving the root of this problem. They are~cute, you see.

What if, we can work on Asuran animations and make them more exaggerated/visually distinct than what they current are?

What about you give players the chance to see the enemies as the race they want?

I think that the best solution is to only have humans in sPvP. Make it so that the first time you enter the Mists with any other race you get to design a human.

Geiir.7603:

I think that the best solution is to only have humans in sPvP. Make it so that the first time you enter the Mists with any other race you get to design a human.

Well, some might want to see people as norns, to have less problems reading animations.

redslion.9675:

Ferik.3127:

I think hating on Asura is not solving the root of this problem. They are~cute, you see.

What if, we can work on Asuran animations and make them more exaggerated/visually distinct than what they current are?

What about you give players the chance to see the enemies as the race they want?

To ban asura is one thing~I’ll stop defending them if you so desire.
But to make all races look human is entirely another thing.

Nullifying the racial choice of all other players just for your own convenience. Or I should say, nullifying those choices because you as a player have not the skill of reading and recognizing key skill animations.
What is the difference between this and making cheesy builds for players that cannot play competitively?

Is this what people would perceive as quality gameplay design?

Ferik.3127:

redslion.9675:

Ferik.3127:

I think hating on Asura is not solving the root of this problem. They are~cute, you see.

What if, we can work on Asuran animations and make them more exaggerated/visually distinct than what they current are?

What about you give players the chance to see the enemies as the race they want?

To ban asura is one thing~I’ll stop defending them if you so desire.
But to make all races look human is entirely another thing.

Nullifying the racial choice of all other players just for your own convenience. Or I should say, nullifying those choices because you as a player have not the skill of reading and recognizing key skill animations.
What is the difference between this and making cheesy builds for players that cannot play competitively?

Is this what people would perceive as quality gameplay design?

I’m not negating your choice. You are not forced to look like anything. I just make sure that an artistic choice doesn’t hinder the gameplay. I already can decide not to see the colour of your armor. And might actually be easier with people who have lagging problems. And is STILL less restrictive than banning asuras. Why the hell one that plays asura in pve should be forced to make another character for spvp, or another contrieved effect?

And I could say the same of players who play min size asura: they have not the skill to deal with telegraphed moves, so they play like that. I won’t because people might actually like them.

It’s like saying it’s cheesy to change keybinding.

And more than that, if races don’t make much of an advantage, why should that be a problem?

P.S.: I play max sized norn, so I don’t see why that should be an issue.

I call them bridge builds that connects the casuals from the competitors as a result of no bridge mode. Once we get a game mode less strategically competitive the game could blossom away from micro managing rng metas on smallest scaled goblins. Essentially, and was at launch, asuras are the competitive race so everyone should be rolling them or a largest scaled norn for things like mesmer that competitively adds to the difficulty due to screen clutter.

The most likely option is to both re-standardize the asuran height scale in spvp as well as working on the animations.

Amstel Steel.2058:

I call them bridge builds that connects the casuals from the competitors as a result of no bridge mode. Once we get a game mode less strategically competitive the game could blossom away from micro managing rng metas on smallest scaled goblins. Essentially, and was at launch, asuras are the competitive race so everyone should be rolling them or a largest scaled norn for things like mesmer that competitively adds to the difficulty due to screen clutter.

The most likely option is to both re-standardize the asuran height scale in spvp as well as working on the animations.

But that would take an awful lot of time. And would make your character look different than how you wanted it to be.

redslion.9675:

Amstel Steel.2058:

I call them bridge builds that connects the casuals from the competitors as a result of no bridge mode. Once we get a game mode less strategically competitive the game could blossom away from micro managing rng metas on smallest scaled goblins. Essentially, and was at launch, asuras are the competitive race so everyone should be rolling them or a largest scaled norn for things like mesmer that competitively adds to the difficulty due to screen clutter.

The most likely option is to both re-standardize the asuran height scale in spvp as well as working on the animations.

But that would take an awful lot of time. And would make your character look different than how you wanted it to be.

Yes, I agree.

These are all valid points. Don’t expect them to address any of this any time soon. They don’t have the resources and pvp isn’t that popular. They will never say it but that is obviously the case because these points have been brought up many times and are 100% valid and the Devs really are not stupid people as much as we knock them. Complete lack of resources.

mini.6018:

Lordrosicky.5813:

mini.6018:

The funniest thing is GW2 was supposed to be the action based combat mmo but between condis, random procs and Ai it became the most passive mmo combat in existence.
If you read this devs , do something about condis already.I should just go search for a combat mechanics features advertise pre launch to have a good lol moment.

They cant because they buffed all anti-condi things including immunities and condi clears to the sky. So any condi nerf needs a reversal of the buffs to things like automated response, zerker stance, diamond skin, null field, etc

Condi should only exist as debuff/control not as a main damage source since as a fore it’s a broken mechanic.Even in other pvp based mmos condis (dots) were never as strong.In AoC a necro with dits needed to channel spells and enter spellweaving(autoimmobilize transfomation with no defense abilities) to kill and even then it took almost 60 seconds.

5 second burst from full hp to dead is beyound any joke especially for an action based.

Keep condis as debuff/minor damage only and buff powerspecs on classes that lack solid ones if you want to ressurect the game especially in spvp where condi beats power 20/1 risk/reward ratio.

Fine, if they want to nerf condis and buff the direct damage of condition weapons then fine. That can be done. Why does condi lack the risk that power specs have? I am confused. If anything it is more risk as the counters can be harder.

Its not a lack of resources, they actually have more people working on the game now than they did at launch. They need to prioritize and character size in pvp isn’t a priority. That being said, I would like to have an option to have all characters appear as human in spvp. Little rats errr Asura everywhere…….

Yep there are no cast bars in this game so we have to rely on reading animations. Good luck with that in the mess of pets and particle effects

Ferik.3127:

redslion.9675:

Ferik.3127:

I think hating on Asura is not solving the root of this problem. They are~cute, you see.

What if, we can work on Asuran animations and make them more exaggerated/visually distinct than what they current are?

What about you give players the chance to see the enemies as the race they want?

To ban asura is one thing~I’ll stop defending them if you so desire.
But to make all races look human is entirely another thing.

Nullifying the racial choice of all other players just for your own convenience. Or I should say, nullifying those choices because you as a player have not the skill of reading and recognizing key skill animations.
What is the difference between this and making cheesy builds for players that cannot play competitively?

Is this what people would perceive as quality gameplay design?

At the moment Asura are the cheese that many players in spvp leverage to give them an edge- an advantage that has nothing to do with skill.

Quality game design would not include such an obvious option for players to get an “unfair” advantage in a game supposedly designed to be a competitive, level playing field.

Going further, even if all players became scaled down Asura, thus levelling the playing field, the issue is that the overall quality and skill level of the game suffers because that would be the equivalent of making all animations more difficult to read, all spell effects more extreme, and all players being able to hide behind AI etc more easily- effectively exacerbating many of the things spvpers feel are weak points in the game.

So yeah, Asura are a fundamental issue for spvp, and blatantly obvious one at that.

this pvp has bigger problem not with the gameplay or mechanic but the QQing of so many players above my comment. if u cant see an asura or having a hard time targetting it. learn to play! and go away stop playing pvp less QQer will attract more players in this community and then the game itself.

Lord Hammer Hand.4815:

this pvp has bigger problem not with the gameplay or mechanic but the QQing of so many players above my comment. if u cant see an asura or having a hard time targetting it. learn to play! and go away stop playing pvp less QQer will attract more players in this community and then the game itself.

It’s not a learn-to-play issue, sorry. Your gameplay isn’t up to the level where you actively dodge skills correctly. Just because you do not understand the problem at hand does not mean it doesn’t exist.

Jax.5261:

• Give an option to make all enemy character models human (so on there own screen they have whatever animation miniaturization they wish while on yours they can be seen) <— this is the obvious choice

Only do this, People should be allowed to play the character they want to play so they can feel some kind of connection to their character (I don’t feel such a connection, but many people have this need). This fixes everything by normalizing enemy characters, minimizing the amount of different animations a new player has to learn, and will make the game much easier to view from an observer perspective. Also add in a drop down with the similar options as team colors “enemy team, all, everyone but me, none”.

Now if only Spectator mode would have a way to see the difference of red team aoe’s from blue teams AoE’s people might have a better idea on what is going on in a teamfight.

Please ban certain names as well.

I played against a Team Wrongname once, it was a very effective gimmick. Then there are names with Illusionary Warlock.

Lord Hammer Hand.4815:

this pvp has bigger problem not with the gameplay or mechanic but the QQing of so many players above my comment. if u cant see an asura or having a hard time targetting it. learn to play! and go away stop playing pvp less QQer will attract more players in this community and then the game itself.

Once you stop playing 8v8 hotjoin and actually play some proper matches, you will soon realise that being able to judge what your opponent is doing is part of your gameplay. An important part. Asura are very small and extremely hard to see.

No one has an issue targetting them, no one is saying they cannot see them. We are saying its very hard to see the animations for moves on them, thus giving them a clear advantage. Watch tournaments, almost everyone will be using asura, its a clear cheese advantage.

Only people who disagree are either not understanding the issue, or are abusing it to their own advantage. Thats it.

redslion.9675:

Ferik.3127:

redslion.9675:

Ferik.3127:

I think hating on Asura is not solving the root of this problem. They are~cute, you see.

What if, we can work on Asuran animations and make them more exaggerated/visually distinct than what they current are?

What about you give players the chance to see the enemies as the race they want?

To ban asura is one thing~I’ll stop defending them if you so desire.
But to make all races look human is entirely another thing.

Nullifying the racial choice of all other players just for your own convenience. Or I should say, nullifying those choices because you as a player have not the skill of reading and recognizing key skill animations.
What is the difference between this and making cheesy builds for players that cannot play competitively?

Is this what people would perceive as quality gameplay design?

I’m not negating your choice. You are not forced to look like anything. I just make sure that an artistic choice doesn’t hinder the gameplay. I already can decide not to see the colour of your armor. And might actually be easier with people who have lagging problems. And is STILL less restrictive than banning asuras. Why the hell one that plays asura in pve should be forced to make another character for spvp, or another contrieved effect?

And I could say the same of players who play min size asura: they have not the skill to deal with telegraphed moves, so they play like that. I won’t because people might actually like them.

It’s like saying it’s cheesy to change keybinding.

And more than that, if races don’t make much of an advantage, why should that be a problem?

P.S.: I play max sized norn, so I don’t see why that should be an issue.

My main is a max sized Norn Guardian so~alright, I am convinced. Sort of.

I still think it is odd to integrate. Wouldn’t it somehow mean a waste to animation development? Armor dyes are much cheaper to make in comparison to armor SHAPES (i.e. Races), when people choose to standardize everyone to human they potentially miss out on very well-design animations of non-humans. This would especially be an issue for PvP-only players. I am one of those players.

Also, seeing my enemy as human making like say Asura voices is….it simply breaks the immersion.

Ferik.3127:

Also, seeing my enemy as human making like say Asura voices is….it simply breaks the immersion.

Get your finest straw man arguments here! Just two dollars!

Ferik.3127:

Also, seeing my enemy as human making like say Asura voices is….it simply breaks the immersion.

I’d welcome that: finally having the chance of seeing races with more than one voice. It would actually enhance the immersion for me.XD

i agree on option

asked for it for option a while as well

Jax.5261:

[…]

• Give an option to make all enemy character models human (so on there own screen they have whatever animation miniaturization they wish while on yours they can be seen) <— this is the obvious choice

^THIS !

Jax.5261:

• Give an option to make all enemy character models human (so on there own screen they have whatever animation miniaturization they wish while on yours they can be seen) <— this is the obvious choice

I have absolutely no clue why this isn’t addressed yet, many of us saw this problem before the bloody beta started.

While this is the right choice it is not as easy as you make it seem. Yeah it may have seemed like a problem more than a year or so ago, but it was definitely not a key issue. Now it is a more prevalent issue and can, maybe be resolved.

But to clue you in on why it is not addressed yet, the amount of programming it would take to ensure animations do not bug and the model textures is one reason, as well another might be would something like this end up being mandatory?

EDIT: Lowering spell particle effects would also help this problem for the players that have issues seeing asura animations.

Lopez.7369:

In the next year or so the developers will finally succumb and add enemy cast bars. Balancing animations is proving too difficult for them.

I prefer this much more. Let’s promote this idea instead

EoNxBoNx.9213:

Jax.5261:

• Give an option to make all enemy character models human (so on there own screen they have whatever animation miniaturization they wish while on yours they can be seen) <— this is the obvious choice

I have absolutely no clue why this isn’t addressed yet, many of us saw this problem before the bloody beta started.

While this is the right choice it is not as easy as you make it seem. Yeah it may have seemed like a problem more than a year or so ago, but it was definitely not a key issue. Now it is a more prevalent issue and can, maybe be resolved.

But to clue you in on why it is not addressed yet, the amount of programming it would take to ensure animations do not bug and the model textures is one reason, as well another might be would something like this end up being mandatory?

EDIT: Lowering spell particle effects would also help this problem for the players that have issues seeing asura animations.

I am almost 100% certain I saw a dev or community manager say that normalizing asura size in some way was possible and not some pipe dream. That was back during the community development drive on the forums when the devs were posting a lot, I can’t remember the specifics unfortunately.

In the interim, any player-organized events should be banning Asura from play.

At least try it for one tourney & judge the feedback. I predict the viewership would be thankful.

An ESL Weekly would be the easiest to test with. If player-run tourneys start banning them with regularity, ANet will take more notice.