Guild Wars 2

Since last update, we see more and more turrets engis and spirit rangers (always have been there). what we see is that nearly 75% of dps from these kinds of build come from adds whose not depending on the player skill.

Thing is, those kinds of builds allows passive advantages against most of commun builds. I think it should be great if some of these “passive skills” would be nerf.

In organized play though type of build are quite weak.

Indeed they are weak in tPvP, but in sPvP they are much stronger.

It’s bad game design to have ai which takes far less management be as strong as it is. sPvP is supposed to be where you learn to play PvP… but why bother learning/experiencing all of the depth in this game if you can just have the ai do most of the work for you?

Say you do choose to go do tPvP. You now have a sudden jump in skill required because of the things you should have been learning all along… but didn’t because the ai was better before. This generally leads to frustration and/or people quitting.

Poor balancing for skill seems to be a long running problem though (just look at the passive healing of healing signet) and I don’t see the dev’s changing any time soon : /

Seeing more thieves running around with Thieves’ Guild and eles with their actual elemental summons.

What in the kitten is going on with the adds and summons lately….

Not to mention. That it takes more time to kill a torrent then a thief or a mesmer…

and whats with this parrot and rock dog

People like to play with their brain turned off

It’s getting really annoying. These things should be weak to high AOE damage. However it is a living nightmare to get these turrets to actually die.

ParadoX.3124:

what we see is that nearly 75% of dps from these kinds of build come from adds whose not depending on the player skill.

I’m sorry, you say Spirits do 75% of the DPS? I’d love to know how.

you see more spirit rangers? what , spirits have been nerfed alot. i dont see many of them at all lol

The patch just increased more rng and more ai. Fire + air + turrets hitting me before i even know i’m out of stealth

Turrets are the worst if them. High dmg and much harder to take down due to structures not being crittable. Typically ill just spam cluster bombs while LoSing until all the AI is dead. But if they drop supply crate im outsie

Bhawb.7408:

ParadoX.3124:

what we see is that nearly 75% of dps from these kinds of build come from adds whose not depending on the player skill.

I’m sorry, you say Spirits do 75% of the DPS? I’d love to know how.

Okay, let’s remove burn h24 from a bunk ranger, the other part of its dps is the pet

Honestly guys, as a turreteer player since long before the bug fixes and ‘buff’ patch, I’m very strong while on a point, but very weak if ranged out. A meteor shower+lava font can destroy all of my turrets and without them I’m just a pew-pewing annoying bee, a warrior with stability on and a good focused hammer burst + explosive shot can do as much, or a ranger with LB at 1500 range can easily choose between killing every single turret I have while I cannot do a thing about it, or just luring me down and forcing me to leave the point.
It’s true that against some classes in a 1v1 scenario I’m almost unbeatable due to the enormous area control turrets apply, but I’m just as much screwed against other professions.
I don’t want to say it’s a L2P problem, because it’s a superficial answer, but if a insert a random class here walks directly into my 3 turrets + supply crate ones, taking a huge amount of direct damage + conditions while being stunned/dazed/blinded/knocked back/knocked down/launched/blocked/interrupted, it’s his own incapability of formulating a good strategy against a point holder, not a ‘turrets are op’ issue.

So, in conclusion, if a thief scouts a turret engineer at his close points, the right thing to do isn’t shadowstepping to his unavoidable death inside the turret forest, but shifting to mid or far and sending an appropriate class to dispatch him.

That’s teamwork, you know, and isn’t an AI problem.

I dont say it’s OP, I just say that this shouldnt be this powerfull compare to the effort you put in to play, you could just spam 1, you’ll do nearly the same dmg that if you would use every skills on your bar, which is not normal

I have seen 1, I repeat 1 spirit Ranger in the last 4 months or so.

I play in Europe, so it may be different in NA.

I play everyday to at least do my daily and play a lot more when I want to complete a track, doing both solo q and team q.

So that’s 1, lone spirit ranger out of 1,000’s of players. Spirit Ranger seems really, really unpopular in Europe.

Engineers with turrets on the other hand you see 1-2 of them per game, very, very popular build in Europe. My Necro loves them, she eats them and there turrets for breakfast.

@OP:

I agree. Turrets, minions, and spirits should all see a nerf. All three of those are the lowest skill cap specs in the game. My comments apply to those adds that are created through utility skills, or are passive through a rune set.

I personally do NOT have a problem with any adds that come from an elite skill. The cooldown is much longer which means the player needs to think much more about the timing of using the skill.

turrets maybe, minions maybe, but spirits? turret engi / minions both don’t see any play in top tier , they get demolished, it’s a useless spec only used in solo que / hotjoins to annoy people. not sure that warrants a nerf. spirit ranger is easily countered by many classes and has been nerfed continously since last summer when they were extremely overpowered.

seems like a l2p issue to me

How about instead of nerfing builds, you simply have ANet remake them so the summoned creatures do very little without input from the player. I made a fairly large post focused on minions, but the gist of it is that they can make the full summon builds less passive by:
1) Stop letting AI pick aggro on their own, make all aggro based on player action
2) Change passive offensive traiting to enhance the active skills
3) Focus the strength of full-summon builds to the active skills OR heavily gate the passive strength behind limited uptime

So for people discussing AI, I will pose this question: Do you believe the trade off for AI is better or equal to the skills they are now lacking?

For example, as an engineer I would never move to turrets due to the lack of mobility. I need to help my team take points and defend points. If I have to manage turrets, I won’t be as mobile. While healing turret has cleanses, I like potions for cleanses better than the turret.

For my necro, it’s the same deal. I like wells and DS for points. In fact, if you want brain dead, wells are as brain dead as you get.

So is it that it’s annoying to fight but can be mitigated or is this really an issue that is more than a “learn how to counter.”

Bhawb.7408:

How about instead of nerfing builds, you simply have ANet remake them so the summoned creatures do very little without input from the player. I made a fairly large post focused on minions, but the gist of it is that they can make the full summon builds less passive by:
1) Stop letting AI pick aggro on their own, make all aggro based on player action
2) Change passive offensive traiting to enhance the active skills
3) Focus the strength of full-summon builds to the active skills OR heavily gate the passive strength behind limited uptime

Yea I guess it would be better like this, this is exactly what the game should tend to, like gw1 when you had to push the heros skillbar to be efficient. It would be great if a dev could give us information about what they think about AI atm

I believe in removing a lot of these extras that don’t depend on player skill at all. In GW1 MM necros quickly became to OP in Random Arena, and Team Arena, they were shortly nerfd. These needs to happen again.

gesho.9468:

and whats with this parrot and rock dog

Parrot has a massive pile of health and the rest of the stats on the runeset buff might