Guild Wars 2

azuzephyr.7280:

style.6173:

azuzephyr.7280:

style.6173:

azuzephyr.7280:

Phadde.7362:

You’ll be dead face down in the mud if you’re running such cheesy builds.

Is that why there are so few thieves and warriors in the meta right now?

Do you even play TDM? The meta is currently AOE condi spam. If everyone in a thread disagrees with you, you might want to ask yourself why.

Not really, in fact that’s a very stupid thing to say but I had fun at your expense none the less so thank you.

It’s ok. It just takes some people longer to learn than others. You’ll understand eventually. As others have said though, if you don’t enjoy the game mode, don’t play it. At least that way, you can go post on a thread where you know more about the topic.

What in your adequate view makes you believe that you know anything about this topic?

I’d like to know before I make judgments on who should be able to comment on pvp matters, particularly given the quality of people brought in since the patch

Okay guys.. Calm down, I’m sure we’d all prefer that you guys take your kitten contest to another forum. This is an important thread to some people (like myself) that would like to discuss the pros and cons to new map types, and specifically courtyard.

Plus my kitten is biggest.

EDIT: apparently it was censored.. e-kitten.. Fill in the blanks lol

Hmm…so the argument is that TDM isn’t viable because it’s so obvious that it’s imbalanced.

…but no one can agree on how it’s imbalanced.

Something doesn’t add up, lol. But, I guess that’s what happens when you have people arguing about a “dominating meta” 2 days after a balance patch.

Phadde.7362:

azuzephyr.7280:

What in your adequate view makes you believe that you know anything about this topic?

I’d like to know before I make judgments on who should be able to comment on pvp matters, particularly given the quality of people brought in since the patch

Really don’t want to be rude or anything, but I think we should stop trying to convince you of anything since it seems impossible and doesn’t takes the thread anywhere.

But the same isn’t true of people who agree with you, for some reason.

Anyway according to some posters people who don’t agree with the hivemind shouldn’t be allowed to post which was rather illuminating as to the quality of their argument.

You aren’t here to convince me, thanks all the same for the offer.

Plenty of people whom I know first hand played at at least the top 100 in team ques have resounded my sentiments about balance not supporting TDM in ranked; https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/pvp/pvp/Can-we-PLEASE-get-new-game-types/page/2

There is imbalance in conquest, but imbalance that is at least kept in check by the design of conquest, which is what classes have up to now been designed around.

If you’re trying to actually convince anyone and not just circlejerking the idea of an arena without thinking what it’s going tro do to people trying to play ranked competitively then convince me that it will have positive impacts on class representation/build diversity/removal of cheese.

Because I’m telling you, it will worsen those things if forced into ranked. And that’s not what pvp needs.

SkylightMoon.1980:

After almost 2 years of the game being out, i think we all really expected new game modes. TDM should honestly be one they implement. After seeing the immense success of courtyard, it would be in Anet’s best interest to create a new mode along with several new maps for a TDM mode….

It is weird that it has been so long with only one Game mode. . . If they keep the new one it’ll be quite a refreshing contrast to Conquest.

azuzephyr.7280:

Phadde.7362:

I don’t really see any good examples of how a TDM game mode wouldn’t work; If you don’t like it, don’t play it.

Examples;
Perma stealth
Spamming fight resets til you win
Insta-gib
Unkillable bunker

If you don’t like it don’t play it is precisely what we have now. I don’t like it and I don’t play it, there’s no reason given to put it into rated play forcing people who don’t like it to play it.

You used wow example in your argument. And then brought this?
As an old player arena hardcore player, rank 21 player from season 11, let me remind you that 2v2 and 3v3 arenas in wow had:

Perma stealth (Blizzard had to implement that eye thingy buff to fix it). Spamming fight reset until you win (RMP, it was called I think). Insta-gib. (Warlock with cunning, rogue with legendary in season 12. And RDW triple dps, and many more)
Unkillable. resto shaman+ warlock with demon armor= unkillable bunker in 2v2. And guess what: arena is still the most popular gamemode in wow even though it has a lot of unbalance. I don’t know why it wouldn’t work with gw2.

Healers? Mana? Stealth breaking on hit? No group stealth whatsoever? I’ve said it before, actually, but it appears it needs repeating, again.

And actually no, since RBGs have been given equal rewards as arena they are now the more popular pvp choice than arena. Arena was only more popular because it was the only way to get the best gear.

I’m also doubting the accuracy of your pvp claims if you think RMP was fight reset spam. Only the rogue who was lowest priority target could reset fightfor themselves only and their stealth broke on hit. A thief in GW2 can fight reset their entire team on a 50 second cooldown that can be camped in.

azuzephyr.7280:

Healers? Mana? Stealth breaking on hit? No group stealth whatsoever? I’ve said it before, actually, but it appears it needs repeating, again.

And actually no, since RBGs have been given equal rewards as arena they are now the more popular pvp choice than arena. Arena was only more popular because it was the only way to get the best gear.

I’m also doubting the accuracy of your pvp claims if you think RMP was fight reset spam. Only the rogue who was lowest priority target could reset fightfor themselves only and their stealth broke on hit. A thief in GW2 can fight reset their entire team on a 50 second cooldown that can be camped in.

Bro you’ve spent like 20 comments arguing with people about why TDM would be imbalanced when TDM like fights already happen in game and tournaments for 2v2 3v3’s are already hosted and its not unbalanced,. Your entire argument has been based around shadow refuge being too OP and being able to reset the fight. I and other have given you good reason why stealth isn’t broken in these fights and why its easier to counter than you say.

“Healers? Mana? Stealth breaking on hit? No group stealth whatsoever? I’ve said it before, actually, but it appears it needs repeating, again.”

Good healers don’t go oom that easily. In 2v2, healer were so strong that blizzard finally decided in mist of pandaria to implement battle fatigue, which is not A CLASS MECHANIC, to counter this design issue. Have you ever experienced 45min fight just to end up in a draw? It was pretty common back then before the fix.

Stealth breaking on hit? No group stealth whatsoever?

I’m just going to counter your claim with 2 sources:
http://www.wowhead.com/spell=114018
http://www.wowhead.com/spell=108208/subterfuge

“And actually no, since RBGs have been given equal rewards as arena they are now the more popular pvp choice than arena. Arena was only more popular because it was the only way to get the best gear”

There is a huge difference between “popular game mode” and “popular game mode for its reward”. In other word, hardcore players, including me (I was a gladiator back then) took 3v3 more seriously than rbg. In fact, rbg was mostly used to gear faster, and than get into 3v3 with the best pvp gear possible. Because well you know, wow is gear gated.

“I’m also doubting the accuracy of your pvp claims if you think RMP was fight reset spam.”

It was: rogue had preparation and vanish, and mage had two iceblock to reset the fight almost at will whenever they get in trouble. Cross-CC and avoiding their opener is key to win against them. They might not be as insane as gw2 thief+(profession). But, If you consider wow gameplay, it is.

“I’m also doubting the accuracy of your pvp claims”

Got gladiator title in cataclysm season 11, and left mist of pandaria last year.

A lot of your concerns can be fixed by game rules…
1. Make stealth not stack, Shadow refuge gives 4-5 seconds of stealth, and each tick refreshes it to 4-5 seconds rather than stacking it. Same with P5+D2 spam, have it give like 3-4 seconds of stealth, but not stack. Big issue solved there. It’d work like Mesmer stealth does now.

2. Have the arena give perma detection after 10 minutes of a match, it should never even come to this with the above change, this probably isn’t even needed but if it is still and issue, this would clear that up.

3. After 10 minutes all healing received is cut in half, immortal bunkers would just be wasting their own time and would phase out rather quickly. People would need some sort of assault on their team to win.

4. Balance elites some. 2v2 and 3v3 are basically what you see in tPVP anyways, if the elites are that unbalanced then they need to change regardless of the mode being in the game or not.

5. Restrict class duplicates.

6. You can’t OOC once a game starts, best out of 3.

BAM 90% of your issues are fixed… And what do we have? A game mode worth spamming rather than fighting in circles for the rest of our lives.

I’m telling you now, because you are free to roam in your fights, 2v2 and 3v3 is already more balanced than a typical 5v5 conquest game which favors mobility WAY too much. I know because I’ve played a lot of both. Only major difference is 2v2/3v3 doesn’t make me want to kill myself because people can’t AOE spam on a circle and win like a bunch of kitten s, and playing the “immortal guy who does nothing but roll on a circle” doesn’t do much good for 2v2/3v3, hence AFAIK no team has ever won a 2v2 tourney with a bunker guardian. (Or any bunker at that rate?)

These aren’t guesses… Many people already partake in fan-made 2v2 and 3v3 tournies all the time. It took me what? 5 minutes to come up with a good list of ground rules to fix most of your issue. Any more pop up? Give me another 5 minutes and I could fix that too. I’m telling you, not much has to change because people ALREADY DO THIS.

If you don’t WANT to do it, then don’t? It’s a pretty simple concept…

ronpierce.2760:

If you don’t WANT to do it, then don’t? It’s a pretty simple concept…

That’s the issue going around, OP is asking for ranked play. People can TDM right now, that’s a pretty simple concept tbh and one you would have come across all on your own if you had, I don’t know…read?

You can put whatever rules into your tournies you want to balance it, they need it. But a TDM in ranked play – would you even suggest that Anet would put in enough barriers to stop cheese plays like you have suggested? Absolutely not.

SkylightMoon.1980:

azuzephyr.7280:

Healers? Mana? Stealth breaking on hit? No group stealth whatsoever? I’ve said it before, actually, but it appears it needs repeating, again.

And actually no, since RBGs have been given equal rewards as arena they are now the more popular pvp choice than arena. Arena was only more popular because it was the only way to get the best gear.

I’m also doubting the accuracy of your pvp claims if you think RMP was fight reset spam. Only the rogue who was lowest priority target could reset fightfor themselves only and their stealth broke on hit. A thief in GW2 can fight reset their entire team on a 50 second cooldown that can be camped in.

Bro you’ve spent like 20 comments arguing with people about why TDM would be imbalanced when TDM like fights already happen in game and tournaments for 2v2 3v3’s are already hosted and its not unbalanced,. Your entire argument has been based around shadow refuge being too OP and being able to reset the fight. I and other have given you good reason why stealth isn’t broken in these fights and why its easier to counter than you say.

Do you have any actual source other than ‘I saw it in 2v2 fanmade tourney?’ Because the representation of SR, thieves and spike damage in high level group play disagrees with you, but argue away. SR refuge is one example of a broken mechanic that would be totally out of place in ranked TDM

These aren’t hard rules… They’re pretty standard, actually… Elite rebalance and stealth stacking nerf BOTH need to happen ANYWAYS… 3-4 “rules” on a gameplay that don’t affect anyone except people stalling isn’t going to be the end of the world, they’re standard Arena map rules.

People want it ranked because its more engaging and fun, and right now, it’s unrealistic to do this because it constantly has to be set up. What if I said to do 5v5 you had to constantly make a team and find another team to fight and Hotjoins and tournies went away…? Think this out, you’ll get your answers. It’s one of the most popular formats of PVP in mmos, it wouldn’t be hard for them to add, they don’t even need to make them a leaderboard yet, just make it so we can progress in reward tracks and que so fights are found for us, I’d be happy. And so would a LOT of others…

My guess is TDM is the hardest to balance as it will really show any imbalances in classes fast. So they are trying to get that sorted first. TDM and capture the flag are my favorite modes though so I hope they come soon

azuzephyr.7280:

SkylightMoon.1980:

azuzephyr.7280:

Healers? Mana? Stealth breaking on hit? No group stealth whatsoever? I’ve said it before, actually, but it appears it needs repeating, again.

And actually no, since RBGs have been given equal rewards as arena they are now the more popular pvp choice than arena. Arena was only more popular because it was the only way to get the best gear.

I’m also doubting the accuracy of your pvp claims if you think RMP was fight reset spam. Only the rogue who was lowest priority target could reset fightfor themselves only and their stealth broke on hit. A thief in GW2 can fight reset their entire team on a 50 second cooldown that can be camped in.

Bro you’ve spent like 20 comments arguing with people about why TDM would be imbalanced when TDM like fights already happen in game and tournaments for 2v2 3v3’s are already hosted and its not unbalanced,. Your entire argument has been based around shadow refuge being too OP and being able to reset the fight. I and other have given you good reason why stealth isn’t broken in these fights and why its easier to counter than you say.

Do you have any actual source other than ‘I saw it in 2v2 fanmade tourney?’ Because the representation of SR, thieves and spike damage in high level group play disagrees with you, but argue away. SR refuge is one example of a broken mechanic that would be totally out of place in ranked TDM

I gave an answer to that. Something that needs to happen anyways… but did you really just say “Do you have any other source than actually witnessing it first hand”?????? People are telling you it WORKS because it already does… It’s just not realistic for organization purposes and we get nothing out of it. It’d be great if it was more accessible and rewarded us. I’m rank 37 and have EASILY put in enough time to be rank 70+ (new rank system). I just spend most of my time in 1v1 / 2v2 /3v3 rooms because they’re more balance and more fun than fighting in circles where AOE is artificially made king and bunkers/decappers run rampid that serve no COMBAT purpose other than push people around or live within a circle forever (tPVP) and a constant stream of 4v5 in solo ques because of a broken entry system…

Dahkeus.8243:

Hmm…so the argument is that TDM isn’t viable because it’s so obvious that it’s imbalanced.

…but no one can agree on how it’s imbalanced.

Something doesn’t add up, lol. But, I guess that’s what happens when you have people arguing about a “dominating meta” 2 days after a balance patch.

Capture point, and TDM is imba.. People want to complain.. Sucks because we finally have variety, now a bunch of kittens (censored myself) decide that NOTHING SHOULD EVER CHANGE! I’ve been waiting for variety since a month after game release. These people need to shut the kittens(did it again!) up.

ronpierce.2760:

These aren’t hard rules… They’re pretty standard, actually… Elite rebalance and stealth stacking nerf BOTH need to happen ANYWAYS… 3-4 “rules” on a gameplay that don’t affect anyone except people stalling isn’t going to be the end of the world, they’re standard Arena map rules.

People want it ranked because its more engaging and fun, and right now, it’s unrealistic to do this because it constantly has to be set up. What if I said to do 5v5 you had to constantly make a team and find another team to fight and Hotjoins and tournies went away…? Think this out, you’ll get your answers. It’s one of the most popular formats of PVP in mmos, it wouldn’t be hard for them to add, they don’t even need to make them a leaderboard yet, just make it so we can progress in reward tracks and que so fights are found for us, I’d be happy. And so would a LOT of others…

Then Ronald you should be happy, but you/OP need to think a fleshed out answer because asking for TDM in the same ranked system as our current conquest as OP has done is cancerous. OOC rules is still easy to cheese, most 3v3 etc games are player moderated with blurry rules to basically stop any team from cheesing the match in some way like stalling with bunkers/stealth. Your OOC suggestions are a start but consider how easily it’d be get ping someone to stay in combat and continue to camp in stealth. They would never put in automated rules harsh enough to stop cheese plays successfully.

If you are happy to play through that stuff, great! But that stuff needs it’s own ques, nowhere near our current que system, that’s what you need to look at suggesting

JPSnow.8296:

My guess is TDM is the hardest to balance as it will really show any imbalances in classes fast. So they are trying to get that sorted first. TDM and capture the flag are my favorite modes though so I hope they come soon

“show any imbalances in classes fast”

I agree, but still. We either get stuck with conquest mode forever, or finally get TDM as an alternative for players like me. For players like me, conquest mode is not my cup of tea, hence I casually play tpvp. Implementing TDM is the move Anet could do, so I can have the chance to bright for once…

ronpierce.2760:

Yes, I did, do you have a response?

Because it’s great that you believe you should be above rank 70 but love TDM. I don’t care, it doesn’t do anything to strengthen your argument, it’s just you shouting louder because you want it and don’t care what it would do to the current system [in the way you/OP have suggested]

azuzephyr.7280:

SkylightMoon.1980:

azuzephyr.7280:

Healers? Mana? Stealth breaking on hit? No group stealth whatsoever? I’ve said it before, actually, but it appears it needs repeating, again.

And actually no, since RBGs have been given equal rewards as arena they are now the more popular pvp choice than arena. Arena was only more popular because it was the only way to get the best gear.

I’m also doubting the accuracy of your pvp claims if you think RMP was fight reset spam. Only the rogue who was lowest priority target could reset fightfor themselves only and their stealth broke on hit. A thief in GW2 can fight reset their entire team on a 50 second cooldown that can be camped in.

Bro you’ve spent like 20 comments arguing with people about why TDM would be imbalanced when TDM like fights already happen in game and tournaments for 2v2 3v3’s are already hosted and its not unbalanced,. Your entire argument has been based around shadow refuge being too OP and being able to reset the fight. I and other have given you good reason why stealth isn’t broken in these fights and why its easier to counter than you say.

Do you have any actual source other than ‘I saw it in 2v2 fanmade tourney?’ Because the representation of SR, thieves and spike damage in high level group play disagrees with you, but argue away. SR refuge is one example of a broken mechanic that would be totally out of place in ranked TDM

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/pvp/pvp/GW2PvPTV-2v2-Tournaments-Starting-11-23/page/2#post3251851
This is a tournament a dev acknowledged, set up by blu the shoutcaster, and it was a tournament that had some very decent pvpers participate in. Also, ive given you reasons why SR isnt OP. You havent responded to them but just continued to say its broken.

azuzephyr.7280:

ronpierce.2760:

Yes, I did, do you have a response?

Because it’s great that you believe you should be above rank 70 but love TDM. I don’t care, it doesn’t do anything to strengthen your argument, it’s just you shouting louder because you want it and don’t care what it would do to the current system [in the way you/OP have suggested]

What…? I said I want it and it’d be great to get rewards as anyone in conquest doing a mode that’s very popular in the game and just needs actual support? Yeah…

I fixed literally every kitten issue you could have in TDM 2v2/3v3 in like 6 rules. You didn’t give a single reason why it wouldn’t fix your issues you just keep going on about “it’ll never work”. In that case, Conquest will never work because AOE is artificially OP cause you’re forced to fight in a circle and bunkers will reign supreme because all they need to do is be able to stand in a circle and not fight… Oh wait…

From experience, 2v2 and 3v3 is already more fun and engaging than conquest is.

Eve.1580:

Dahkeus.8243:

Hmm…so the argument is that TDM isn’t viable because it’s so obvious that it’s imbalanced.

…but no one can agree on how it’s imbalanced.

Something doesn’t add up, lol. But, I guess that’s what happens when you have people arguing about a “dominating meta” 2 days after a balance patch.

Capture point, and TDM is imba.. People want to complain.. Sucks because we finally have variety, now a bunch of kittens (censored myself) decide that NOTHING SHOULD EVER CHANGE! I’ve been waiting for variety since a month after game release. These people need to shut the kittens(did it again!) up.

Really there are only two people in this thread that actually seem to be against TDM, though it’s almost exclusively azuze that’s being… passionate about it.

azuzephyr.7280:

ronpierce.2760:

If you don’t WANT to do it, then don’t? It’s a pretty simple concept…

That’s the issue going around, OP is asking for ranked play. People can TDM right now, that’s a pretty simple concept tbh and one you would have come across all on your own if you had, I don’t know…read?

You can put whatever rules into your tournies you want to balance it, they need it. But a TDM in ranked play – would you even suggest that Anet would put in enough barriers to stop cheese plays like you have suggested? Absolutely not.

What’s your actual problem with this game mode? You seem determine that it just won’t work at all. A lot of people on this thread argues against you and really seem to enjoy it and don’t really seem to be all that worried about the potential issues that you’ve pointed out.

Are you perhaps afraid that if this Game mode gets into ranked that it somehow will affect Conquest? What could actually affect you negatively here?

No, actually ron, I’ll invite you one more time to go back and have a little read because I think it’ll come back to you in future.

It will never work in the same ranked system as Conquest, it wont. If you want ranked TDM you need to look at making a totally separate que system for TDM – I think this is the fourth time I’ve had to say it to you, so I really want you to absorb the information now.

If you are happy to TDM, that’s great, I suggest you take your own advice and ’don’t play what you don’t like’ but you need to actually think through your suggestion before you put weight behind it because plenty of people, myself included, don’t want anything to do with TDM coming into this meta.

SkylightMoon.1980:

ive given you reasons why SR isnt OP. You havent responded to them but just continued to say its broken.

No, you haven’t, you’ve given me your own little anecdotes about how you don’t think it’ll happen, and that people just don’t play cheese builds [right…]

If you want to give me reasons why SR wouldn’t be OP if it was forced into my rated que alongside conquest then tell me how you’d handle organized teams doing the following;

-Stacking more than one SR for assurance even if you did reveal one
-Stability stacking in SR
-S/p + shortbow stealth stacks to literally permastealth a team camping in SR

azuzephyr.7280:

No, actually ron, I’ll invite you one more time to go back and have a little read because I think it’ll come back to you in future.

It will never work in the same ranked system as Conquest, it wont. If you want ranked TDM you need to look at making a totally separate que system for TDM – I think this is the fourth time I’ve had to say it to you, so I really want you to absorb the information now.

If you are happy to TDM, that’s great, I suggest you take your own advice and ’don’t play what you don’t like’ but you need to actually think through your suggestion before you put weight behind it because plenty of people, myself included, don’t want anything to do with TDM coming into this meta.

SkylightMoon.1980:

ive given you reasons why SR isnt OP. You havent responded to them but just continued to say its broken.

No, you haven’t, you’ve given me your own little anecdotes about how you don’t think it’ll happen, and that people just don’t play cheese builds [right…]

If you want to give me reasons why SR wouldn’t be OP if it was forced into my rated que alongside conquest then tell me how you’d handle organized teams doing the following;

-Stacking more than one SR for assurance even if you did reveal one
-Stability stacking in SR
-S/p + shortbow stealth stacks to literally permastealth a team camping in SR

Just by curiosity, what do you mean by: “don’t want anything to do with TDM coming into this meta.” Are you scared that it might affect conquest meta? May I ask you how if it’s the case?

As far as I remember, even in games that you brought in your argument such as wow has an horrendous start when they first implemented arena in Burning crussade. Fun fact: blizzard officially stated that they regret implementing arena in their game. It might be the reason why anet want to test it first, so they can avoid a huge fiasco.

azuzephyr.7280:

It will never work in the same ranked system as Conquest, it wont. If you want ranked TDM you need to look at making a totally separate que system for TDM – I think this is the fourth time I’ve had to say it to you, so I really want you to absorb the information now.

So this is why you’re so sour about this? I’ll just quote my own, old answer here:

Phadde.7362:

azuzephyr.7280:

If you don’t like it don’t play it is precisely what we have now. I don’t like it and I don’t play it, there’s no reason given to put it into rated play forcing people who don’t like it to play it.

Missed this bit. No-one’s talking about forcing people to play this. It’s completely bonkers to put it in the same SoloQ or TeamQ as Conquest.

I don’t think anyone is arguing that it’s a good idea to not have this in a separated ranked queue. Might have misunderstood you as this might not be your issue with all this.

Um.. Wait he’s worried it wouldn’t work because 2v2 / 3v3 doesn’t que well with 5v5 conquest? That’s what he means it won’t work? No kittening kitten… they become their own que…………..

Phadde.7362:

Are you perhaps afraid that if this Game mode gets into ranked that it somehow will affect Conquest? What could actually affect you negatively here?

What a fab question, lets look at it like this [again, I’m repeating myself but people do like to ignore what they don’t like]

TDM mixed with conquest would be the same situation as high end team matches without any of the major drawbacks. Spike is still super high, stealth is still super strong, basically any class who has no non-counterable defensive cooldown is the target because getting the first kill is pivotal and often spells success [necro becomes ideal target]. Teams usually start out in mass invisibility, call the target, curtain goes out and either moa or straight up insta-gib them with spike and heavy CC>stealthstomp – only countered by stealth res.

The big drawback to spamming stealth like that is that the team spiking the necro loses initial point advantage. That will be gone in TDM there would be nothing stopping stealth spam, nothing stopping people camping out in SR, nothing stopping people spamming fight resets. What would be the point in playing the spike ‘target’ classes like necro/ranger? Do you believe that is in any way balanced?

It happens now but ultimately they pay for the fight reset by losing conquest points, there’d be no downside in playing that junk. Without even trying I can already see ways around pierce’s ruleset to still make the same play with little risk.

And yes, I probably do come off passionate about it, but frankly people aren’t thinking through their ideas, have flimsy/idealistic evidence which is at best anecdotal and seem to not care that what they are suggesting would impact on our current pvp mode.

Make your own ruleset for your own que system and enjoy it, more power to you. I have absolutely no intention of playing a game mode which would be so easily abusable as TDM in ranked play, not with certain classes/abilities the way they are currently and there is so far no good reason given to show it would positively impact pvp to make it so.

ronpierce.2760:

Um.. Wait he’s worried it wouldn’t work because 2v2 / 3v3 doesn’t que well with 5v5 conquest? That’s what he means it won’t work? No kittening kitten… they become their own que…………..

What can I say, you can’t force people to read, its obvs asking too much

All I’m going to say is it’d be separated from Conquest, and if you haven’t already tried it, you have no room to argue against it and how “theoretically” it might not work when others have played it and can tell you those concerns need not apply, and any other issues can be fixed with basic arena rules.

Actually that’s totally false, I’ve tried plenty of 2v2, they work fine with player moderation to stop cheese plays. Without player moderation it’s a guarantee that will happen without recourse

The only cheese stopped is:
-Double bunker (stopped even easier with arena rules of 50% healing across the arena after 6-10 minutes, or 25% after 5 minutes and 50% after 10, etc)
-No class stacking (Arena rule, easily applied)
-Stealth has never been an issue, but if you change stealth to not stack for thieves similarly to Mesmer as I had suggested before, you wouldn’t have that issue anyways. Arena rule to disable stealth after 10 minutes.
- Rebalance some elites. (Needed in conquest just as much as TDM)

What issues are you having now?

ronpierce.2760:

All I’m going to say is it’d be separated from Conquest, and if you haven’t already tried it, you have no room to argue against it and how “theoretically” it might not work when others have played it and can tell you those concerns need not apply, and any other issues can be fixed with basic arena rules.

He did make some good points though. Some mechanics in this game have no counter which is counterproductive in any 2v2/3v3 death match format which is all about: Position, Peeling or CC, focus, and MORE IMPORTANTLY managing CD ( saving cds to counter key moves.), etc.

But still, once anet decides to fix it, I do think DM will suit gw2 perfectly.

Sorry for drawing false conclusions I guess… It just felt like you’d need a really good motive to not just drop a heated discussion about a game mode which you seem to have no interest in playing yourself. You say that we’re not thinking things through and that it wouldn’t work in practice, yet this is not what actually playing 2v2, 3v3 etc. in the Courtyard and elsewhere before its existence shows.

ronpierce.2760:

All I’m going to say is it’d be separated from Conquest, and if you haven’t already tried it, you have no room to argue against it and how “theoretically” it might not work when others have played it and can tell you those concerns need not apply, and any other issues can be fixed with basic arena rules.

He has probably played in the Courtyard quite a bit, otherwise it would indeed be very odd to make the argument that this absolutely doesn’t work.

Poplolita.2638:

He did make some good points though. Some mechanics in this game have no counter which is counterproductive in any 2v2/3v3 death match format which is all about: Position, Peeling or CC, focus, and MORE IMPORTANTLY managing CD ( saving cds to counter key moves.), etc.

But still, once anet decides to fix it, I do think DM will suit gw2 perfectly.

Really getting hyped up about this now =D Gief Rated! May the best combatants win!

I do play courtyard, I’ve played the 3v3 and 2v2 custom arenas while they were up and my guild does team que and 2v2 matches for fun

ronpierce.2760:

What issues are you having now?

Get a grip please

azuzephyr.7280:

I do play courtyard, I’ve played the 3v3 and 2v2 custom arenas while they were up and my guild does team que and 2v2 matches for fun

ronpierce.2760:

What issues are you having now?

Get a grip please

Nice issue, very well thought out.

Why bother typing an elaborate response? You don’t bother reading it and just get shady for the sake of it, I’ve repeated myself to you enough times already, more than I would to the kids I teach

And I repeatedly told you why they are not issues and easy to fix in the same way they have in other games without them even feeling weird or out of place. You ignored them and told me to get a grip.

You’re totally right, after you hadn’t read a thing I posted and just went cray I did choose to ignore you, it was the logical choice.

But still even in your fixes, you haven’t thought those through, but choose to believe what you will.

Well, the answer to all of your problems is out there. Enjoy. Stop ranting about how stuff “can never work” when you have no clue, thanks, friend!

You’re not getting a grip

You’re pro-denial of something a LOT of people want and what is more combats got competitive because the devs would actually have to use their brain for 15 minutes and might have to make a few balance changes, as if they don’t already.

You get a kitten grip.

ronpierce.2760:

You’re pro-denial of something a LOT of people want and what is more combats got competitive because the devs would actually have to use their brain for 15 minutes and might have to make a few balance changes, as if they don’t already.

You get a kitten grip.

azuzephyr.7280:

I have nothing against TDM

azuzephyr.7280:

I do play courtyard, I’ve played the 3v3 and 2v2 custom arenas while they were up and my guild does team que and 2v2 matches for fun

azuzephyr.7280:

If you are happy to TDM, that’s great

Would you care to add anything else to the discussion or is this kinda it?

You quoted you saying you like it? Great. You can’t say you like something then tear it down repeatedly and think it holds any grounds… I have you answers to the proposed issues with TDM and you refused to acknowledge them and say that its impossible for it to work. Hats not showing much support.

I do like tdm, I just want them to be supported so I can que for them with others who like to tdm, doesn’t affect you at all. Quit being so dismissive because you haven’t made a single point that holds and substance.

Your view [despite clearly ignoring where you’re wrong] has been acknowledged and given the merit it deserves

Totally. “Can’t be done, nope, nope, nope, nope.” Your logic and reasoning skills astound me. Keep up the good work.

Can you guys just agree to disagree instead of turning this into a “1v1 arena” ?

Phadde.7362:

Poplolita.2638:

He did make some good points though. Some mechanics in this game have no counter which is counterproductive in any 2v2/3v3 death match format which is all about: Position, Peeling or CC, focus, and MORE IMPORTANTLY managing CD ( saving cds to counter key moves.), etc.

But still, once anet decides to fix it, I do think DM will suit gw2 perfectly.

Really getting hyped up about this now =D Gief Rated! May the best combatants win!

Hell yeah!

Poplolita.2638:

Can you guys just agree to disagree instead of turning this into a “1v1 arena” ?

But I like 1v1.

ronpierce.2760:

Totally. “Can’t be done, nope, nope, nope, nope.” Your logic and reasoning skills astound me. Keep up the good work.

You were done a long time ago, you just kept peddling

One word, Courtyard.

azuzephyr.7280:

You were done a long time ago, you just kept peddling

It’s better to not even respond to Ron, he is the one who defends his cheesy MM necro to the death, without ever acknowledging the problems AI spam cause.