Guild Wars 2

Some ideas i have for SPVP:

- Reduces Burst Damage.
- Of result of that, increase the time u have to wait for rez, so the kill mean something.
- No score for killing.
- Of result of that, the score system have to change, u must have more score points for winning than for losing. If u zerg killing ppl and lose u dont have score so u dont do that… zerg problem resolved.
- Of result of that, the stupid design of the PVP Browser (i thought it was a temporaly design in the beta, never thought this would come to live), must change… Im thinking a queue system, and if u leave, u have a penalty so u dont go and search for a team that are free winning (this last thing should not happen if the queue system works)

Some Notes:
- The Score should be the reflection of someone who wants to win.
- That motivate ppl for playing for winning than for killing.
- That motivate diferent builds, not a dmg/burst build.
- That trains you for Tournaments.

Some Experiences:
- I have the luck of playing a match without thieves, guess what?… It was fun!
Next match… in my team i have 6 thieves vs 4 thieves… all normal again, i think?
All the same stupid builds… Heartseeker/Pistol Whip.
- I try a thieve, but a pistol/surv build, they are balance, they do a ton of dmg and they have a nice survivability with the stealth. the problem are those abilitys, and the burst in general.

Sorry for my English.

Please let me know your thoughts.

If you reduce burst and take away points for killing then control and bunker builds will reign supreme. The game will become about just trying to survive long enough on the point for your team to hold it.

The majority (not ALL, just most) of the issues that people have stem from Hot Join PvP. When in TPvP with a group that has been built to play roles and people support each other, the game works beautifully. When in Hot Join, with group compositions being completely random and most people are building for DPS only (not control, not defense, not group support) you get wildly varied results. Even when one or two people are in Support or Defense builds, if the other team is built for Glass Cannon DPS and they focus you, you won’t survive.

It’s similar in PvE Dungeons. When you build a group that is comprised of people who are using pure DPS Traits and Utilities, you’re going to have a hell of a bad time. However when people in the group switch out their soloing Traits/Utilities for ones with more Group synergy, things go much, much smoother.

The way this game is designed, it’s true that the standard Trinity is gone. However that doesn’t mean that Group Synergy is gone. In fact, in this game, Group Synergy is an absolute necessity to perform at the peak of your ability.

Now, forgive me if I’m way off here, but isn’t the dodge mechanic meant to do just that? I understand that you’re probably talking about a flat reduction of damage across the boards—but you would never suggest that they reduce all damage by 100% right?

In the same line of thought: you can’t dodge 100% of attacks. It’s true, just impossible to do it. If you could, it would be a lot like reducing all damage to 0. Instead, ANet has put the choice in YOUR hands as to which “bursts” you want to deny. If you’re the only target around and there are 8 people lining up their biggest shots. . . you can completely NEGATE, not just reduce, every point of damage they put out—twice!

That situation is absurd of course, remotely possible but totally unlikely. It does a good job of illustrating just how little room there is to complain, at least in my opinion. With the ability to completely ignore attacks at a consistent rate, the problem becomes more about deciding which attacks are a priority and anticipating when they’ll show up. If you’re outnumbered to the point where two dodges aren’t enough—mixed in with your defensive utility(you’re packing this, right?!), it’s not really a “burst” issue is it?

Jest im total agreed with u, and i understand that synergy. but that only works in teams, not in pugs. My point of view is for the SPVP not Tournaments (i apologized if i wasnt clear).

“If you reduce burst and take away points for killing then control and bunker builds will reign supreme. The game will become about just trying to survive long enough on the point for your team to hold it.”

And thats not okey, because….?

U prefer that go zerg and killing anything thats moves with 100% dmg builds, no important if i win, im going to have a lot of points, is better?

Also, Im saying Reduce the busrt damage, not eliminate… I’m sure it will remain viable in Tournaments.

I have to be clear with this, if a hight % of ppl are doing the same over and over, thats causes ppl to do the same it become a caos. if u enter a SPVP and saw Thieves every where with warriors just because the burst damage, u have to admite that something is wrong…

Im a Ranger, with near 2k toughness and i fight 3 v 1 and that 3 dosent have thieve/warrior… im goint to do a nice battle, why? because my build is semi-tanky, BUT if there 1 thieve in that 3s im dead, instantly. Nothing i can do about it.
(Im not saying i have to win a 3v1…)

Bad ideas, Arenanet developers know what they are doing… you don’t. Your changes would ruin the game and make it a Condition dominated game, trust me, I play condition builds.

The thing is, most people go full damage in 8v8 because they are rewarded for points and not for trying to win. I’m sure they’re cooking up some way to discourage that but even if they don’t you have to realize that 8v8 and 5v5 are basically two different games. PvP is balanced around 5v5 which takes things like fewer people and group synergy into account.

Find yourself some decent players, play some tournaments and see for yourself that burst isn’t really that big of an issue. Assuming everyone plays their profession well, the burst damage is high enough to be useful but low enough that counter play is available.

Ecliptica.7509:

Jest im total agreed with u, and i understand that synergy. but that only works in teams, not in pugs. My point of view is for the SPVP not Tournaments (i apologized if i wasnt clear).

But you can’t balanced for SPvP and TPvP separately. Adjust for one and the other becomes imbalanced. TPvP is a more serious avenue of competition and as such should take precedence so long as SPvP isn’t irreparably damaged.

Ecliptica.7509:

And thats not okey, because….?

U prefer that go zerg and killing anything thats moves with 100% dmg builds, no important if i win, im going to have a lot of points, is better?

Because it doesn’t solve the problem but shifts it. From Glass Cannon to Tanky Builds. As it is now, Glass Cannon isn’t that powerful provided you have a well balanced team. It’s not unlike joining PvP Matches in other games. Sometimes you end up with no healers while the opposing team has 4. Team with healers will die less. It’s the nature of random match ups.

Also, Im saying Reduce the busrt damage, not eliminate… I’m sure it will remain viable in Tournaments.

I have to be clear with this, if a hight % of ppl are doing the same over and over, thats causes ppl to do the same it become a caos. if u enter a SPVP and saw Thieves every where with warriors just because the burst damage, u have to admite that something is wrong…

Yes.. with the population of players. People will tend to choose the path that they perceive to be the easiest though perceptions can often be deceiving. As the game matures, people will see the strength in other builds and the weakness in the current popular builds. Things will change but it takes time.

Yes.. with the population of players. People will tend to choose the path that they perceive to be the easiest though perceptions can often be deceiving. As the game matures, people will see the strength in other builds and the weakness in the current popular builds. Things will change but it takes time.

Im a Ranger, with near 2k toughness and i fight 3 v 1 and that 3 dosent have thieve/warrior… im goint to do a nice battle, why? because my build is semi-tanky, BUT if there 1 thieve in that 3s im dead, instantly. Nothing i can do about it.
(Im not saying i have to win a 3v1…)

Because that’s the build of the Thief. I’m a conditions Thief and if I fight you 1v1 it will be fairly even simply because my Conditions eat through your Toughness and I’m not quite as squishy as Glass Cannon Thief.

And yes, in a 3v1 with against no Glass Cannon you’d last longer than a 3v1 with a Glass Cannon.. but at the same time if it’s a 3v1 with all 3 being Condition builds, you’ll die even faster because your Toughness doesn’t defend Conditions. It’s the nature of the game.

Stop trying to offer balance suggestions in the mindset of a player. Offer them from a developers viewpoint. Don’t balance the game around yourself, balance the game around the game.

Consider this scenario:

You die to another player in a 1v1. You curse to yourself, quietly think, “Wow he’s so overpowered.” And continue on your way.

Consider the next scenario:

You die to another player in a 1v1. You think about what his build was, what he did to kill you, and what you could have done to counter it.

Which is the most productive?

Larynx is smart, he is looking at things objectively.

To address the OP concern, toughness and defensive utility skills counter burst damage. However, most people do not take them because they have the mindset that they must deal tons of damage. Thus negating defense.

For me the biggest problem is the lack of penalties. You fail your burst combo, no prob try gain in 10 secs. But if you fail dodging you are dead. Little bit unfair.

burst does seam a bit OTT on some builds. there is a lot of nukeage potential in some professions.

personally I dont consider a nuke kill to be fun to do, I’d prefer fights to be longer and require tactics other than just go through nuke rotation, get kill, run away until you can do it again…thats not pvp, that boring as kitten.

no.
anet wants spvp fights last at max 20-40 secs. reducing damage is not the right way. learning to play is better instead

Aza.2105:

Larynx is smart, he is looking at things objectively.

To address the OP concern, toughness and defensive utility skills counter burst damage. However, most people do not take them because they have the mindset that they must deal tons of damage. Thus negating defense.

The problem with this thought is that toughness doesn’t help all that much against the amount of burst that’s in the game right now. I refuse to run a build for any profession without at least 1500 toughness, and in all honesty normally won’t run one that isn’t upwards of 1800. I believe toughness is the most important stat in the game right now precisely because of all the insane amount of damage that can be put out.

Despite this, I can still be killed almost instantly if someone does manage to land his burst on me. On the other side of the coin – just so we don’t have people claiming I’m simply bad – I can down people who have lots of toughness at an incredibly rapid pace as well.

The thing is, I’ve never seen a game where someone’s burst could be 50% of a player’s total health pool – and in this game, some bursts can be in excess of 100% of players’ health pools! The damage as a whole is just too high across the board, and its compounded by CCs (making dodging impossible) and by focus firing. Both of these are of course perfectly legitimate and indeed correct tactics for opposing teams to be using. The problem is that the damage is so high overall that these legitimate tactics become far too powerful and virtually uncounterable.

Shukran.4851:

no.
anet wants spvp fights last at max 20-40 secs. reducing damage is not the right way. learning to play is better instead

I can see this for 1 v 1 fights, and I think it makes sense. For team fights, on the other hand, this is woefully, woefully low.

Maybe it’s just my opinion, but by a wide margin the most fun I’ve had in other MMOs’ capture point battles (or any PvP battles, for that matter) have been those long drawn out battles lasting minutes at a time or even the entire length of the match. I’ve also found that by an equally wide margin, it is these battles that have had the most strategy and tactics to them. The way damage multiplies exponentially in the game right now with each additional player, it’s 1 v 1s which can last a minute or more and team fights which are typically over before they start.

Theif and warrior burst is way over the top. This needs to be adressed rather soon cause its ruining the experiance

disagree with all this SO MUCH. Burst is an attractive build, you will see a lot of it in the current META. Like noobs in LoL picking Master Yi.

As a pistol whip thief with 21khp, do you know how STUPID i feel waving my sword around in the air at nothing? There are many ways to break stun. If I catch with your pants down, I deserve to see your.. wait.. where am i going with this… What I mean is, if I catch you with my stun chain, and land my burst, you should be dead, its what I’m good at. I also run shadow refuge, shadowstep, and haste for their utility. Quickness stomps/revival? stun breaks? group area stealth? Thieves guild is a bit OP, they took care of Heartseeker, I expect them to take care of TG, also Shortbow needs some love. I used to use SB for IA, but now I just use DD and Heartseeker all over the map. Pretty ridic.

Inb4 THIEF BURSTOMGWTF

I play all other classes, thief is just my personal favorite, been playing rogues in D&D sessions since I was 6.

rom.9726:

disagree with all this SO MUCH. Burst is an attractive build, you will see a lot of it in the current META. Like noobs in LoL picking Master Yi.

As a pistol whip thief with 21khp, do you know how STUPID i feel waving my sword around in the air at nothing? There are many ways to break stun. If I catch with your pants down, I deserve to see your.. wait.. where am i going with this… What I mean is, if I catch you with my stun chain, and land my burst, you should be dead, its what I’m good at. I also run shadow refuge, shadowstep, and haste for their utility. Quickness stomps/revival? stun breaks? group area stealth? Thieves guild is a bit OP, they took care of Heartseeker, I expect them to take care of TG, also Shortbow needs some love. I used to use SB for IA, but now I just use DD and Heartseeker all over the map. Pretty ridic.

Inb4 THIEF BURSTOMGWTF

I play all other classes, thief is just my personal favorite, been playing rogues in D&D sessions since I was 6.

As Elementalist I have been killed in 3-5 sec by warrior/Theif. Being Immobilized or stunned so there was no way to neglect any of that damage. Now I ask you, do you think this is fun?

As an elementalist I too have been killed in 3-5 seconds by war/thief.

I ask you, is dieing ever fun?

And BTW, its called Mist form.

quick add, I will say I think eles are one of the weakest classes in the game right now if you don’t build in a particular way and they need some more love. But should a thief/war be able to kill a clothie like that if they catch them? My answer is yes.

in the current meta I play VERY cautious Ele, I make sure there is AT LEAST one other person between me and somebody else. In a 1v1 the situation is obviously different, and if you see a thief coming at you in a 1v1 as a smart player I think you have a lot of options. Its when the zerg comes that kitten gets complicated because they can stealth steal in, stunlock, and burst you down if you’re not careful. I check all my targets when I see a zerg and if I see a thief, I KNOW he’s coming for me, so I stay back, support my team, and once he’s locked onto a heavier armor class I go in for the kill.

rom.9726:

quick add, I will say I think eles are one of the weakest classes in the game right now if you don’t build in a particular way and they need some more love. But should a thief/war be able to kill a clothie like that if they catch them? My answer is yes.

No profession should be able to kill any other in 5 seconds. It’s just silly and goes against not only the spirit of PvP in general, but also so many of the kinds of things that ANet claimed they held dear when designing this game’s PvP.

3sec duration 75sec cd. 8sec Cd on Thousind blades or what ever its called. Also, due to the CD, you have to be sure he is using Thousind blades so at that point you are at 50% Hp.

I don’t mind dying, but I sure do mind getting nuked to death in a couple of secounds by 1 players

I’m gonna say it….

If you get caught by hundred blades, you did something wrong.

I feel embarrassed when it pops up on my kill list after I die. If I’m on mumble, I’d rather lie and say it was heartseeker spam. It is really one of the easier combos to avoid.

Im pretty sure they have a charge immobilize thing with 1h and shield, so all they have to do is swap to 2h and eat me. And thats only for 1v1 situations.

When more people are involved you are likely to be chilled or w/e so that your escape abilities are limited.

And I’d agree with you if the ability had like 20-30sec CD, but its only 8 secounds. You can waste that ability all you want and still be darn effective.

burst damage classes are biult around damage (you don’t say?) calling those builds Glass Cannons.
it means that my job is to kill you as fast as possible because if you don’t die i have to run out of the combat.
personal skill is what distinguishes a good player from a mediocre one. no offence to anyone, really. just i think it is not passed enought time to make us “proplayers” of gw2.

oh and the game is balanced around capping the points to win, not burst down the noob and win. glass cannons can’t cap points

I don’t know if this is only a Elementalist problem (could be, we seem squishy) but I seriously think that the burst damage atm. is too much at least for my class.

You could argue that ‘’well im a glass cannon’’ but I cant dish out that much damage. As a condition spec you are pretty strong over time, but you’ll be dead long before you see that happen (in many cases).

I don’t wanna sound like a whine, I have a lot of pvp experience, and the 1st thing I did was to spend a lot of hours on trying different builds and so on and so forth, but even if I went highly defensive I could still be bursted quite fast, and I’d be lacking any real offensive abilities to compete.

Otiz.3259:

I don’t know if this is only a Elementalist problem (could be, we seem squishy) but I seriously think that the burst damage atm. is too much at least for my class.

You could argue that ‘’well im a glass cannon’’ but I cant dish out that much damage. As a condition spec you are pretty strong over time, but you’ll be dead long before you see that happen (in many cases).

I don’t wanna sound like a whine, I have a lot of pvp experience, and the 1st thing I did was to spend a lot of hours on trying different builds and so on and so forth, but even if I went highly defensive I could still be bursted quite fast, and I’d be lacking any real offensive abilities to compete.

There’s no question you’re correct. People with 2000 toughness and 25k HP are getting bursted only slightly less quickly than glass cannons right now.

Heck, I’ve played builds that had great survivability, 2 or 3 defensive utility skills, etc., and found that not only could I be bursted down just as fast as in a glass cannon version, but I could also burst other people down in silly amounts of time despite focusing so heavily on defense in my build.

i have seen a stream of an ele with 14 (or 16?) thousand hp roaming and destroying every single opponent all around the map. maybe 2.5k armor. and he could tank even in 2v1. am i mad? maybe. but if you are skilled there is nothing you can’t do with your class.

Shukran.4851:

i have seen a stream of an ele with 14 (or 16?) thousand hp roaming and destroying every single opponent all around the map. maybe 2.5k armor. and he could tank even in 2v1. am i mad? maybe. but if you are skilled there is nothing you can’t do with your class.

If he’s 1v2ing it’s almost certainly more a matter of how awful his opponents were than how effective his class could be.

Skolops.2604:

Shukran.4851:

i have seen a stream of an ele with 14 (or 16?) thousand hp roaming and destroying every single opponent all around the map. maybe 2.5k armor. and he could tank even in 2v1. am i mad? maybe. but if you are skilled there is nothing you can’t do with your class.

If he’s 1v2ing it’s almost certainly more a matter of how awful his opponents were than how effective his class could be.

ofc. can’t be him a good player, must be noob opponents. so here there is no good ele around? it is sad

Can you link that vid. possibly? Cause i’ve been looking for recent vid’s without luck.

Believe me I blame myself before I blame the game, but I don’t think this is a skill issue.

http://www.gw2build.com/videos/

don’t remember his name. try to look every ele stream there and maybe you can remember me the name of the player.
i dont like to tell lies.

I just went into the mists to play with my thief a bit. I practiced against the NPC classes in the mists. All of them except the elementalist and the engineer DODGED ROLLED to evade or blocked/countered my pistolwhip combo on several occasions. Do I need to make a video to prove it? NPCs were able to do this, that means you folks can to.

What you don’t like is the QUICKNESS ability. Haste grants me quickness, it also procs off of a trait when I crit, and a sigil on my MH weapon. It means I attack twice as fast. Warriors, Mesmers (10sec quickness AOE Elite HELLO??), Rangers, Engineers all have this, maybe more not sure, all are able to access it via sigils. What happens with pistol whip is my first attack in the combo is a daze when i’m stealthed, then pistol whips first chain attack is also a daze, leading to multiple stuns. HOWEVER, the wind up in PW is extreme. I mean, you can see it coming from a mile away.

Heartseeker is still a bit broken. The fact it is a gap closer is what really makes it extremely strong, and easy to use. Thieves just have to target you and bam spam 2 and they do extreme dmg. It’s not a broken skill, and the adjustment was a good step. Damage over 50% might still need to be looked at and the gap closer frankly needs to go.

Hundred blades CD is a lil low, but honestly this one is really easy to avoid.

Sorry guys, I really feel this is a combination of a L2P issue and the fact that some classes are still very unbalanced/broken and HAVE NO BUILD DIVERSITY. Combine that with 8v8 pubstomp zerg mentality and you have a lot of frustrating situations. I advise you to play more 5v5 tournies and you will see less burst and more sustain. The current meta is still very Condi heavy so take removal.

edit: maybe after 2 heartseekers the initiative cost goes up? after 4 it increases again?

edit 2: I’ve been meaning to write a long post about this, but the second point is that there needs to be different balancing for sPvP, PvE, and WvW. Let’s face it they are three entirely different games and pretending like you can balance all the skills in the same realm is just old fashioned and dumb. Thieves Guild is insanely strong in PvP, in PvE it’s just a great elite, in WvW it can be neglible.

edit 3: just 1v1 the engineer NPC again and he blocked my entire PW combo Twice in a row. like 8 blocks popped up. So really the only easy kill i had was Elementalist. (I’ll be honest when I put my game face on all the Npcs are easy kills, but I’m doing this for testing purpose so theres no reason to steam roll them. I steal stealth in, pop quickness and then PW twice in a row. Like I said thats a normal tactic for sPvP (not the best one just one of them) and when used here against NPCS they regularly evade/block/counter.

Haven’t had issues with a pistol whip Theif, dunno why we’re going there?

Heartseeker + the haste thing is what rapes people

rom.9726:

I just went into the mists to play with my thief a bit. I practiced against the NPC classes in the mists. All of them except the elementalist and the engineer DODGED ROLLED to evade or blocked/countered my pistolwhip combo on several occasions. Do I need to make a video to prove it? NPCs were able to do this, that means you folks can to.

What you don’t like is the QUICKNESS ability. Haste grants me quickness, it also procs off of a trait when I crit, and a sigil on my MH weapon. It means I attack twice as fast. Warriors, Mesmers (10sec quickness AOE Elite HELLO??), Rangers, Engineers all have this, maybe more not sure, all are able to access it via sigils. What happens with pistol whip is my first attack in the combo is a daze when i’m stealthed, then pistol whips first chain attack is also a daze, leading to multiple stuns. HOWEVER, the wind up in PW is extreme. I mean, you can see it coming from a mile away.

Heartseeker is still a bit broken. The fact it is a gap closer is what really makes it extremely strong, and easy to use. Thieves just have to target you and bam spam 2 and they do extreme dmg. It’s not a broken skill, and the adjustment was a good step. Damage over 50% might still need to be looked at and the gap closer frankly needs to go.

Hundred blades CD is a lil low, but honestly this one is really easy to avoid.

Sorry guys, I really feel this is a combination of a L2P issue and the fact that some classes are still very unbalanced/broken and HAVE NO BUILD DIVERSITY. Combine that with 8v8 pubstomp zerg mentality and you have a lot of frustrating situations. I advise you to play more 5v5 tournies and you will see less burst and more sustain. The current meta is still very Condi heavy so take removal.

edit: maybe after 2 heartseekers the initiative cost goes up? after 4 it increases again?

I’m sorry, but if you wouldn’t stun the NPCs then I don’t know what to tell you. Anytime I’ve ever tried, those NPCs die pretty much instantly. As a thief, moreover, you should have had them immobilized the entire time.

I’m sorry, but if you wouldn’t stun the NPCs then I don’t know what to tell you. Anytime I’ve ever tried, those NPCs die pretty much instantly. As a thief, moreover, you should have had them immobilized the entire time.

read the edits. I know what I’m doing. Obviously I can immobilize them the whole time cause they are just dumb NPCS, but to handicap myself I am setting up a controlled experiment. People ITT are complaining they have no way of stopping burst. These NPCS proved them wrong.

Ortiz: You often see PW and Heartseeker hate in the same sentence.

rom.9726:

I’m sorry, but if you wouldn’t stun the NPCs then I don’t know what to tell you. Anytime I’ve ever tried, those NPCs die pretty much instantly. As a thief, moreover, you should have had them immobilized the entire time.

read the edits. I know what I’m doing. Obviously I can immobilize them the whole time cause they are just dumb NPCS, but to handicap myself I am setting up a controlled experiment. People ITT are complaining they have no way of stopping burst. These NPCS proved them wrong.

Ortiz: You often see PW and Heartseeker hate in the same sentence.

You’re missing the point, though. If you’re not immobilizing them, then you’re not doing the very thing which is what’s causing people to be unable to stop their – and anyone elses’ – burst.

Heck, I can dodge a heartseeker, a pistol whip, 100 blades, or anything else. The problem is when the thief comes up and pops his venom to basically immobilize me for the duration of the attack. Even if I bring 2 things which can break immobilize (something that’s very hard to do for several classes), I still can’t escape.

For the record, I really don’t tend to have problems with thieves and typically beat them 1 v 1. It’s in team fights where these kinds of things happen.

Just to add my opinion on all this i think the burst damage at moment is alright.
I also think whole idea of giving higher score to the winning team is also not good of an idea, way everything works right now is alright.
As for the idea of a “queue and penalty for leaving” i also don’t think this is a great idea. Devs idea to drop in and out of a pvp room as i please especially if i have to leave for reasons is good to me.

Finally on all this i didnt want to bring up “world of warcraft” but alot of ideas seem to make me think of way that games PvP operates, i cant say ideas even then were great and queue times were usally also pretty long and leaving if i had to the penalty was just annoying.
Also if i remmeber right when a team used to start losing the whole team pretty much vanished which makes me think again a penalty system doesnt work that well.
Sorry if post might seem abit ranty but just expressing my opinion, i think devs so far have done a great job with how pvp works as a whole.

You’re missing the point, though. If you’re not immobilizing them, then you’re not doing the very thing which is what’s causing people to be unable to stop their – and anyone elses’ – burst.

Heck, I can dodge a heartseeker, a pistol whip, 100 blades, or anything else. The problem is when the thief comes up and pops his venom to basically immobilize me for the duration of the attack. Even if I bring 2 things which can break immobilize (something that’s very hard to do for several classes), I still can’t escape.

For the record, I really don’t tend to have problems with thieves and typically beat them 1 v 1. It’s in team fights where these kinds of things happen.

yawn so you want me to start with devourers venom on? fine. now, venom, stealth steal, PW. THE NPCS CAN STILL BREAK IT. Sorry, I guess I need to put up a video. Remember the point isn’t to faceroll these NPCS, anybody can do that, it’s to prove that even an NPC can avoid this burst. I’m guessing the heartseeker thief ppl are talking about usually gets lucky with a crit mug (5k) backstab (10k) then Heartseeker spam (10k quickly) Sure not many people will outlive that, but the point is its avoidable, you’re just not trying hard enough and I’ve already said Heartseeker needs more work. Obviously, you have more of a hard time in a team environment, complexity and confusion is where a thief and stealth/burst/stuns shine. The point is all these things are negatable. What IS TRUE, is that Anet needs to give more tools to classes and better build diversity so classes can build for burst defense.

inb4 you cant faceroll NPCS NOOBBBBBBBBBB

edit: for your info the stealth 1 skill for sword is a 2sec daze, PW is also a stun… sooo you understand why i dont need venoms to keep a person immobile?

godkittenOP, i liked your post, and was agreeing with it in my head until i saw it was a well veiled bash on thieves.

S/P really doesnt have that much survivability, especially a burst build one. even tho whip is supposed to evade, ive had more then once where im at full hp, i steal into say 3 people, then immediatly haste/whip…i die as i get my second whip off (which contrary to popular believe doesnt gaurantee death for those 3 targets, even if some got low). thats right, in the span of about 4 seconds i go from full to dead while pistol whip “evading” lol

and no i didnt expect to take on those 3 and win, but i had my team right behind me, figured i could get some damage off and stealth/dodge…nop, this is why i dont use whip builds much anymore, that and unless your using your utility skills to support landing your PW, your gonna have trouble ever landing it.