Guild Wars 2

Anet if you guys want this game to be esports it’s time to let conquest go. Not only the balancing is horrible but this game has the worse game mode for esports also which doesn’t help with the balance at all. Time to get a piece of paper and start from scratch.

Start from scratch? They do not have time and they do not want to.
And where does ArenaNet officialy say this game will become ESport?

Not going to happen mate. Conquest is the foundation sPvP is built on, for better or worse. I’d personally like to see some really small changes made to skyhammer, spirit watch, courtyard and Capricorn and then just throw them in ranked. Variety is more important then small unbalances IMO.

@Valkyriez.6578
Balance is always more important than variety, but conquest mode, spirit watch and skyhammer are fine. If there is something imbalanced in these maps/game mode, it’s not them, but classes. Classes are (compared to first year of GW2) stupidly imbalanced.

tico.9814:

Anet if you guys want this game to be esports …

You seriously believe they actually think after 3 years this game will become “e-sports”, it is a marketing exercise (which has probably back fired given the Twitch chat), nothing more.

Don’t think it’s a matter of starting from scratch, new modes are always welcomed, I like the new one, would be nice to have more maps… if this new modes should be included in leagues … maybe.

yeah NO, please dont speak for all of us.

tico.9814:

Anet if you guys want this game to be esports it’s time to let conquest go. Not only the balancing is horrible but this game has the worse game mode for esports also which doesn’t help with the balance at all. Time to get a piece of paper and start from scratch.

Please stop,

If you want to complain about balancing,patching,bugs, and a few other things thats fine. Conquest is a great system and imo mobas are lame.

Would i like to see other type of game modes for fun? Of course but conquest has the most layers of any type of PvP.

Where to rotate, are people counting heads(the guy who leaves mid to run far and theres already 2 people killing 1 and still jumps in) are you targeting, do players builds complement each other, do you fight in the circle, do you fight outside the circle?

Conquest is the closest thing to a real sport when it comes to a video game because you have the ability to create a shaq type of player who dominates in the circle or to play from the outside like a steph curry. Its probably really hard for games and casual players because everyone wants to see the stats/bars/numbers so they can crunch.

PLease though if you dont like conquest then dont play it because i refuse for death matches and mobas to be the only way to play PvP in games.

It’s kind of funny when I started pvp, I hated conquest because I hated fighting on points. Then I was excited to hear they will come out with Stronghold. But then they manage to make stronghold boring too, hated having to grab supplies and too many zerging. Then I go back to conquest as the map designs are more balance and encourage 1v1 or 2v2. I now prefer conquest over stronghold. Of course, I’m hoping they could come up with a new pvp design that discourage zerging while not forcing players to fight on points would be perfect.

tico.9814:

Anet if you guys want this game to be esports it’s time to let conquest go. Not only the balancing is horrible but this game has the worse game mode for esports also which doesn’t help with the balance at all. Time to get a piece of paper and start from scratch.

I would agree, Conquest is a “stand on the point” game mode which honestly isn’t a good fit for esports. It promotes people playing the tankiest builds available and nothing will change that as that is what the game mode promotes. Unlike other games where varieties of class types are favored due to differing roles in taking objectives this one is just “stand on the point”.

It also has terrible balance to begin with regardless. Heavily nerfing the meta classes then buffing the not as meta classes is not balance. At best that is flipping the scales and saying “well it is ok now” when really all you did is change which things are too strong rather than finding a happy medium for everything. (this means less nerfs and less buffs).

The fact that Balance isn’t even seperated between PvP and PvE as well as WvW is very telling to how seriously they’re invested in esports. They want the money, they just don’t want to work for it (thus toss money into the pots hoping it’ll catch on).

This is why I hate forums, a bunch of idiots like the guy who posted this. Conquest is the best game type for sPvP because of the following reasons:

1. Rotations. Knowing how to rotate is what wins you games.
2. Player vs player interactions for a node. Unlike Stronghold where you can bum rush the Lord.
3. Far more entertaining. Better than watching pve such as Stronghold.
4. They already tried other game modes such as team death match (Courtyard) and nobody liked it.
5. High tier pvpers don’t enjoy Stronghold. AG tried to get a Stronghold tourney but no one wanted to play Stronghold.
6. Conquest is the only game mode where player skill is required.

Someone at Anet got this crazy idea that PvP needed PvE content, i assume to attract more players into PvP and gave us conquest, anda bunch of other maps that have a myriad of PvE content.

The idea behind PvP is to play other players… not bosses, not dolyaks, not trebuchet, bomb carrying skritt or archers, certainly not sky lasers that one shot you or any of the other nonsense we are being asked to do. And nothing that takes a mario brothers type of puzzle jump to get too on a multi layered map.

They have killed WvW and are on their way to doing the same in PvP with adding more and more of this garbage into sPvP.

Bottom line, if it isnt another player, it has no role in PvP. Please tell whoever got this wild hair up their rear end to stop forcing PvE content on us and get back to basics, especially if you are trying to make e-sports a reality.

Nick.7621:

This is why I hate forums, a bunch of idiots like the guy who posted this. Conquest is the best game type for sPvP because of the following reasons:

1. Rotations. Knowing how to rotate is what wins you games.
2. Player vs player interactions for a node. Unlike Stronghold where you can bum rush the Lord.
3. Far more entertaining. Better than watching pve such as Stronghold.
4. They already tried other game modes such as team death match (Courtyard) and nobody liked it.
5. High tier pvpers don’t enjoy Stronghold. AG tried to get a Stronghold tourney but no one wanted to play Stronghold.
6. Conquest is the only game mode where player skill is required.

I can resume your post in one sentence:

“Conquest is the best pvp mode because all other maps are even worse!”

Champion’s Dusk, Courtyard, Spirit Watch and Skyhammer are flawed maps. Conquest only works the because its remaing four maps are actually decent/ good.

Valkyriez.6578:

Not going to happen mate. Conquest is the foundation sPvP is built on, for better or worse. I’d personally like to see some really small changes made to skyhammer, spirit watch, courtyard and Capricorn and then just throw them in ranked. Variety is more important then small unbalances IMO.

Yup. Courtyard for example should be a single cap point 5v5

Doon.2364:

It’s kind of funny when I started pvp, I hated conquest because I hated fighting on points. Then I was excited to hear they will come out with Stronghold. But then they manage to make stronghold boring too, hated having to grab supplies and too many zerging. Then I go back to conquest as the map designs are more balance and encourage 1v1 or 2v2. I now prefer conquest over stronghold. Of course, I’m hoping they could come up with a new pvp design that discourage zerging while not forcing players to fight on points would be perfect.

The Stronghold map is just too small and too simplistic is the big issue. There really isn’t that much depth or strategy in the game mode because there really isn’t much of a purpose to winning a fight or rotating the map when you can just summon things to do the work for you.

Or just add some new maps. The only thing that really bores me about this game is the same maps

I agree that conquest needs to go. At the very most, high level conquest play encourages good rotations and that’s about it. For fun, I got a group of guildies and we all ran the maximum amount of CC and tank, even if it meant hitting like a potato. We played about 7-8 games that night and lost none. We literally ran in circles, out rotating and chaining our knockbacks and basically survived endlessly and kept all the points either perma contested or capped for us. Conquest promotes and encourages boring bunker builds, not actual fighting which is what many fans of PvP enjoy. Conquest reeeealllly needs to go.

GW2 has such a beautiful combat system with great depth. We need to capitalize on this combat (and remove the passives) if we’re to keep the veterans engaged and draw in more newbies. Why do you guys think BnS is so big overseas? Emphasis on combat and nothing else. This may seem bland for most (and it is, somewhat), its obvious that people would rather see some actual mechanical skill in play rather than what’s been going on lately. Waaaay back about a year and a half ago, GW2 used to be about the combat, but changes have made bunkering for days more and more appetizing. They may have removed cele and broke ele/mes, but that isn’t enough (relax, I agree that ele and mes shouldn’t be relegated to potato tier).

I get it that not everyone enjoys MOBAs, but its obvious that the formula they’ve got going on works and works well.

Tl:Dr combatcombatcombatcombat

DeceiverX.8361:

The Stronghold map is just too small and too simplistic is the big issue. There really isn’t that much depth or strategy in the game mode because there really isn’t much of a purpose to winning a fight or rotating the map when you can just summon things to do the work for you.

This is why I prefer conquest maps. I have some guild mates of mine that will not even group up unless Stronghold is unchecked, cause of how much they don’t like its play style.

the rotation argument isnt due to the PvE element though, thats a bit of a false idea.
if you see that someone is on the gate you should react whether its a human or npc. Rotational elements would exist either way.
Now if you are referring to the lords and such as secondary objectives, this is can agree with at least partially, but trebs, sky lasers, and the npc requirements to get thru gates and stuff i just cant get behind

KayCee.4653:

DeceiverX.8361:

The Stronghold map is just too small and too simplistic is the big issue. There really isn’t that much depth or strategy in the game mode because there really isn’t much of a purpose to winning a fight or rotating the map when you can just summon things to do the work for you.

This is why I prefer conquest maps. I have some guild mates of mine that will not even group up unless Stronghold is unchecked, cause of how much they don’t like its play style.

Thing is, with just a slightly bigger map, another lane, and self-healing lord while OOC, the format could play quite well.

If they wanted to add more game modes they wouldn’t have to “start from scratch.” There are other games with different modes and map layouts that they could effectively copy. I imagine that the problem from their perspective is that more game modes mean more separate queues.

kdaddy.5431:

tico.9814:

Anet if you guys want this game to be esports it’s time to let conquest go. Not only the balancing is horrible but this game has the worse game mode for esports also which doesn’t help with the balance at all. Time to get a piece of paper and start from scratch.

Please stop,

If you want to complain about balancing,patching,bugs, and a few other things thats fine. Conquest is a great system and imo mobas are lame.

Would i like to see other type of game modes for fun? Of course but conquest has the most layers of any type of PvP.

Where to rotate, are people counting heads(the guy who leaves mid to run far and theres already 2 people killing 1 and still jumps in) are you targeting, do players builds complement each other, do you fight in the circle, do you fight outside the circle?

Conquest is the closest thing to a real sport when it comes to a video game because you have the ability to create a shaq type of player who dominates in the circle or to play from the outside like a steph curry. Its probably really hard for games and casual players because everyone wants to see the stats/bars/numbers so they can crunch.

PLease though if you dont like conquest then dont play it because i refuse for death matches and mobas to be the only way to play PvP in games.

Well said, conquest has a simplicity in its rules but depth in its tactics. Like the best games.

However I would like to see other game types. Don’t see why they can’t use the current maps for a DM mode just for example.

Senario.2038:

I would agree, Conquest is a “stand on the point” game mode which honestly isn’t a good fit for esports. It promotes people playing the tankiest builds available and nothing will change that as that is what the game mode promotes. Unlike other games where varieties of class types are favored due to differing roles in taking objectives this one is just “stand on the point”.

The way its done in GW2 is not a ‘stand on your point’ mode. Its a rotation mode.

^which is why S1 was “rotation mode”? Which is why bunkers (or bruisers) eventually find their way to the top of the meta, regardless of how many changes take place? Anets bashing their head against the wall. There were times where balance was quite nice, but conquest always fosters the most cancerous bunker builds so gameplay eventually stagnates.

It’s only logical the most durable and mobile builds become the best builds when the primary method of scoring points comes from not leaving a small area on a map which by design forces team fights frequently, so sustaining while outnumbered is pretty critical, and punishing deaths in general, as is traversing the map rapidly to make ganks happen faster.

We will never have TDM in GW2…and thats just sad.

RA and TA was the most fun I ever had in an online PvP game (Not counting Planetside 2).

I for one love conquest, so please let it be. I would rather see them implementing more game modes for some diversity.

morrolan.9608:

kdaddy.5431:

tico.9814:

Anet if you guys want this game to be esports it’s time to let conquest go. Not only the balancing is horrible but this game has the worse game mode for esports also which doesn’t help with the balance at all. Time to get a piece of paper and start from scratch.

Please stop,

If you want to complain about balancing,patching,bugs, and a few other things thats fine. Conquest is a great system and imo mobas are lame.

Would i like to see other type of game modes for fun? Of course but conquest has the most layers of any type of PvP.

Where to rotate, are people counting heads(the guy who leaves mid to run far and theres already 2 people killing 1 and still jumps in) are you targeting, do players builds complement each other, do you fight in the circle, do you fight outside the circle?

Conquest is the closest thing to a real sport when it comes to a video game because you have the ability to create a shaq type of player who dominates in the circle or to play from the outside like a steph curry. Its probably really hard for games and casual players because everyone wants to see the stats/bars/numbers so they can crunch.

PLease though if you dont like conquest then dont play it because i refuse for death matches and mobas to be the only way to play PvP in games.

Well said, conquest has a simplicity in its rules but depth in its tactics. Like the best games.

However I would like to see other game types. Don’t see why they can’t use the current maps for a DM mode just for example.

Senario.2038:

I would agree, Conquest is a “stand on the point” game mode which honestly isn’t a good fit for esports. It promotes people playing the tankiest builds available and nothing will change that as that is what the game mode promotes. Unlike other games where varieties of class types are favored due to differing roles in taking objectives this one is just “stand on the point”.

The way its done in GW2 is not a ‘stand on your point’ mode. Its a rotation mode.

Conquest is really like a actual sport.

Think about it, at ages 5-10 kids who play basketball or soccer tend to follow the ball or run to the player with the ball.

The middle school and you start learning the actual game and then high school where talent really starts becoming a factor and so forth and so forth.

People who talk about sitting on points really dont have a clue about the game. Its like the guy cherry picking in basketball, he sits back trying to get a easy lay up after every basket and in theory its great but it never really works.

I was on 3 AG teams and none of them worked. The 2nd team i was on wanted to play 2 turret engys, a shout bow warrior, a mesmer with portal and a thief. They wanted to play only 2 points because in theory we should dominate these 2 points the entire time. Crazy thing happened it didnt work and 2 people sat there kind of pointing the finger but not really saying it and suggestions were not taken.

Its funny how people want to simplify the game but small things create different impacts on a game. For instance the WTS with ORNG and The Abjured when ORNG won it.

You dont think the Abjured spent alot of time thinking of counter builds to what there potential team comp was? Simply put what makes conquest so hard is everyone has a different opinion on how to win and therefore you get the clashes and the uninformed saying they know it all.

Conquest isn’t about holding the point? Then explain why cele bruisers have been dominating the meta for the last two years. Can you honestly tell me that the new meta won’t involve the tankiest build possible? Rotating is literally the only concept you have to master as a player to be good at conquest. After that comes individual skill with your class, but it comes second to rotating. If you look at mobas, which you think are lame, they’ve got several mechanics you have to master to operate at a high level ASIDE from your mastery over your champion.

Simply put, conquest is a terrible game mode that promotes only the most cancerous metas and needs to see major changes or a new mode needs to be made.

Nick.7621:

This is why I hate forums, a bunch of idiots like the guy who posted this. Conquest is the best game type for sPvP because of the following reasons:

1. Rotations. Knowing how to rotate is what wins you games.
2. Player vs player interactions for a node. Unlike Stronghold where you can bum rush the Lord.
3. Far more entertaining. Better than watching pve such as Stronghold.
4. They already tried other game modes such as team death match (Courtyard) and nobody liked it.
5. High tier pvpers don’t enjoy Stronghold. AG tried to get a Stronghold tourney but no one wanted to play Stronghold.
6. Conquest is the only game mode where player skill is required.

Going in response from the top down, this is gonna be good.

1- While knowing how to rotate in gw2 is important, it is not the only thing required that would determine player skill “if there is such a thing in gw2 SPvP at this point in time based off the current balance”. So therefore your point on this one is lacking.

2- You can literally have player interactions regardless of what game type you create for any purpose, death match you have players interacting with each other, capture the flag you have players interacting with not only each other but the flag as well, etc. Your point here is suggesting that unless it’s conquest there is no interaction, or less thereof. Which is clearly wrong, new game modes that implement new mechanics well should be encouraged.

3- Far more entertaining is a matter of opinion. However I’d be willing to bet that more people would be willing to watch a smaller game type than a larger one involving 5 man teams. If you don’t believe me then I could simply use blade and soul 3v3 tag team as an example. It gets more viewers and is easy to understand from a new spectators point of view, or a veterans, and has less players overall when it comes to players on each team. It seems to me that you’re just emotionally invested towards conquest regardless of how bad the game mode is to watch or to play. When most people think of conquest, they think of this. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5SS0Ksz7RIs

The concept of that video still hasn’t changed today. A mess, a cluster kitten of players fighting in a circle, and when it comes to a spectators point of view people hardly understand what’s happening, not to mention the shout casters for the most part doing a poor job “which most of the time isn’t their fault” because it’s very difficult to call things other than “downstate” or some generic call because there is simply too many things happening at once.

So when you sit here and dribble nonsense from your mouth like “it’s more entertaining”, you’re the minority. Because only a small viewership on twitch agrees with you.

4- Courtyard wasn’t even a new game mode, it was an tacky poor implemented add on. Did it get it’s own que like stronghold? No. It was a slideshow of a feature with little effort involved and nothing more. Deathmatch could still be implemented in the game, however courtyard had to be the worst implemented version of deathmatch I’ve seen in a Mmo. And the solution to this problem is simple, and which there is more than 1.

- Make deathmatch round based, no respawn. Meaning for example if it’s 5v5, if one team kills the other team once, the round is over. And make it best of three rounds. This would simply fix why Courtyard was such an utter failure. The way courtyard was, if someone died they would simply run back in creating a snowball effect, because by the time they were to re-enter the fight, chances are their team is probably already dead. Therefore you tweak the game mechanics to where this doesn’t happen.

Not only would this work but it would encourage the people your playing with to stick together, rather than going in guns blazing like a bunch of mindless chickens with their heads cut off knowing they would simply respawn to try again.

- Make it some type of 3v3 team deathmatch tag match like blade and soul. It’s fun, engaging, and simple to watch. And with any of these suggestions I would say make the team consist of 4 people or less.

5- You’re right on the fact that only the minority of people enjoy stronghold, however saying that conquest will be the only viable game mode because of a failed design of stronghold makes no sense whatsoever. As a matter of fact I lost brain cells reading number 5 on your list. Because I was expecting legitimate reasons that conquest offered from your point of view that makes it good and the only logical choice of a game mode, but instead you blame another game mode of something that has nothing to do with conquest. Nice job, you’ve proved nothing.

6- Oh man, where do I even begin. In fact this is just outright laughable. I’d hate to see you play another game around a game type that didn’t consist of you fighting over a node/circle/thing on the ground. There are countless “no pun intended” other games, and game modes within those games to where player skill is required. Again you’re reinforcing your statement based off the fact that stronghold is a failure, and a-net hasn’t come out with a game mode yet that is a success. So of course Conquest is going to be the go to game mode by default.

But in short, this is what I don’t enjoy posts that come from people like you. Completely illogical, you brought nothing to the table in terms of an argument, and delusional in terms of opinion based off what I’ve read. Well have a good one, back off to play a game I enjoy but wont name because of risk of being infracted.

Countless

I’d really like to see more game modes such as a capture the flag type mode.