Guild Wars 2

… what is answer to it? I can’t do crap on my thief to even remotely help my team vs such crap.

If i go in, i die to aoe. If i don’t go in, my team is doing 4v5. Try to hold point? Nope. Try to capture point? Nope. Just aoe/condi spam on every point.

inb4 go backstab them, jk blinded, jk blocks, jk immob/daze for ages

as you can guess i faced 3 necros/2 nade spam engis team

Cynz.9437:

… what is answer to it? I can’t do crap on my thief to even remotely help my team vs such crap.

If i go in, i die to aoe. If i don’t go in, my team is doing 4v5. Try to hold point? Nope. Try to capture point? Nope. Just aoe/condi spam on every point.

inb4 go backstab them, jk blinded, jk blocks, jk immob/daze for ages

as you can guess i faced 3 necros/2 nade spam engis team

Try facing 2 minion necros.You get instashot and you wouldn’t even get a hit on either necros or their pets.

mini.6018:

Cynz.9437:

… what is answer to it? I can’t do crap on my thief to even remotely help my team vs such crap.

If i go in, i die to aoe. If i don’t go in, my team is doing 4v5. Try to hold point? Nope. Try to capture point? Nope. Just aoe/condi spam on every point.

inb4 go backstab them, jk blinded, jk blocks, jk immob/daze for ages

as you can guess i faced 3 necros/2 nade spam engis team

Try facing 2 minion necros.You get instashot and you wouldn’t even get a hit on either necros or their pets.

i actually don’t have much of problem vs minimancers (outside of pet blocking)…. i have issues more with condi/aoe spamming necros

AoE honestly is fine it’s punishment for grouping up.

this game just needs more counterplay with skills
i.e travel time on necro skills. They have only kittenty animations thus low counterplay making them frustrating to fight, unless you’re a thief i guess. Thiefs however, have too much everything- as well as low counterplay.

Reevz.2617:

AoE honestly is fine it’s punishment for grouping up.

this game just needs more counterplay with skills
i.e travel time on necro skills. They have only kittenty animations thus low counterplay making them frustrating to fight, unless you’re a thief i guess. Thiefs however, have too much everything- as well as low counterplay.

what?

my point is: as necro or engi i can safely spam aoe and cover entire point (outside of graveyard) so as thief i have 2 choices: stay in aoe and hold point fo sec and die or run out of aoe and lose point and probably die to condi anyway

Probably just disengage and come back when they leave or just harass them on and off. The game’s pvp design is kitten, there’s not going to be a way to actually fight back in a LOT of situations.

First off i main necro, just so you know where i come from (however i dont play Condi spam bs, i play power/non dhumbfire)

That being said, exept if the necro has well’s (wich i use) his aoe… is really not as dangerous as you state.. staff aoe’kitten for absolutely nothing if condispecced/got nerfed recently, Scepter/dagger aoe’s are very much telegraphed and can be avoided without any problems.

Now if he is a condispammer that uses wells… well his damage will be more significant indeed, but that also means he has no supportskills=/=easykill.

Now grenade Engi’s yeah… they can flatten an entire area.

So my question is, cause i really wonder this when i read about the aoe’s… what are the aoe’s taht you are so scared off? (necromancer based) and if you say marks,.. well dont trigger them, let the warrior trigger them.

Renquist.9530:

First off i main necro, just so you know where i come from (however i dont play Condi spam bs, i play power/non dhumbfire)

That being said, exept if the necro has well’s (wich i use) his aoe… is really not as dangerous as you state.. staff aoe’kitten for absolutely nothing if condispecced/got nerfed recently, Scepter/dagger aoe’s are very much telegraphed and can be avoided without any problems.

Now if he is a condispammer that uses wells… well his damage will be more significant indeed, but that also means he has no supportskills=/=easykill.

Now grenade Engi’s yeah… they can flatten an entire area.

So my question is, cause i really wonder this when i read about the aoe’s… what are the aoe’s taht you are so scared off? (necromancer based) and if you say marks,.. well dont trigger them, let the warrior trigger them.

hard not to trigger marks when they cover entire point… besides you assume i have warrior on team, what if i don’t? it doesn’t matter anyway as nearbly allies get affected anyway

Cynz.9437:

Renquist.9530:

First off i main necro, just so you know where i come from (however i dont play Condi spam bs, i play power/non dhumbfire)

That being said, exept if the necro has well’s (wich i use) his aoe… is really not as dangerous as you state.. staff aoe’kitten for absolutely nothing if condispecced/got nerfed recently, Scepter/dagger aoe’s are very much telegraphed and can be avoided without any problems.

Now if he is a condispammer that uses wells… well his damage will be more significant indeed, but that also means he has no supportskills=/=easykill.

Now grenade Engi’s yeah… they can flatten an entire area.

So my question is, cause i really wonder this when i read about the aoe’s… what are the aoe’s taht you are so scared off? (necromancer based) and if you say marks,.. well dont trigger them, let the warrior trigger them.

hard not to trigger marks when they cover entire point… besides you assume i have warrior on team, what if i don’t? it doesn’t matter anyway as nearbly allies get affected anyway

Okay true enough that it is hard not to trigger them if they cover small points, and sure you might not have a heavy with you to trigger them/ that being said, what is it that your so afraid of then?
The palrty 3 bleeds?/chillbains? putrid is the only one that actually does any decent damage and no decent necro should use it just like that considering its a condicleanse… i mean i get it it’s annoying that he can fill a point with marks.. but people are greatly overestimating the damage marks do.

Renquist.9530:

Cynz.9437:

Renquist.9530:

First off i main necro, just so you know where i come from (however i dont play Condi spam bs, i play power/non dhumbfire)

That being said, exept if the necro has well’s (wich i use) his aoe… is really not as dangerous as you state.. staff aoe’kitten for absolutely nothing if condispecced/got nerfed recently, Scepter/dagger aoe’s are very much telegraphed and can be avoided without any problems.

Now if he is a condispammer that uses wells… well his damage will be more significant indeed, but that also means he has no supportskills=/=easykill.

Now grenade Engi’s yeah… they can flatten an entire area.

So my question is, cause i really wonder this when i read about the aoe’s… what are the aoe’s taht you are so scared off? (necromancer based) and if you say marks,.. well dont trigger them, let the warrior trigger them.

hard not to trigger marks when they cover entire point… besides you assume i have warrior on team, what if i don’t? it doesn’t matter anyway as nearbly allies get affected anyway

Okay true enough that it is hard not to trigger them if they cover small points, and sure you might not have a heavy with you to trigger them/ that being said, what is it that your so afraid of then?
The palrty 3 bleeds?/chillbains? putrid is the only one that actually does any decent damage and no decent necro should use it just like that considering its a condicleanse… i mean i get it it’s annoying that he can fill a point with marks.. but people are greatly overestimating the damage marks do.

1 fear mark + scepter spam + death shroud (if i am still somehow alive) GG

Okay… maybe, but tahts going a whole different direction, this has 0 to do with area of denial of points, or the so called aoe spam, this is a 1v1 situation, wich honestly if your good a thief still has a very good chance of winning,… this scenario is something completely different in a teamfight what the topic as about no?

This game just has too much cleave damage flying around for its own good.

It’s ok to have weapon sets that are designed for AoE damage, like the Thief Shortbow or the Guardian Staff. Using these weapons commit you to the play-style for a while.

But in GW2 most popular weapons deal AoE, and the cleave radius in quite generous. And that’s not even account for all the targeted AoE there is, like Mesmer kitten, Necro wells etc.

And since everything can be used very liberally without consequence (aka. spammed) there’s never a reason to hold back. Just plaster that node with AoE and hope for the best.

Dee Jay.2460:

This game just has too much cleave damage flying around for its own good.

It’s ok to have weapon sets that are designed for AoE damage, like the Thief Shortbow or the Guardian Staff. Using these weapons commit you to the play-style for a while.

But in GW2 most popular weapons deal AoE, and the cleave radius in quite generous. And that’s not even account for all the targeted AoE there is, like Mesmer kitten, Necro wells etc.

And since everything can be used very liberally without consequence (aka. spammed) there’s never a reason to hold back. Just plaster that node with AoE and hope for the best.

You are right on all acounts, however i have to use this opportunity(spelling) to educate some people, not pointed at anyone btw, just general.

the big bad Aoe spammer (necro apparantly) has NO cleave whatsoever on any if its weapons, well not entirely true, staff 1 but who cares about that, also wellmancers do give up x amount of supportskills wich makes them an easier target if not built around, it… in other words a staff wielding wellmancer is a free kill in pvp.

I feel like i need to defend the class to much, im not a rabid (pun intended) necro fanboy, its just there are so many misconceptions about the clas flying rampant to the point i get whispered for being a condispammer while mainwielding an axe -_-

The capture points are way too small in this game except legacy mid. You can just blindly spam aoes and they will cover the entire point. It’s like fighting someone in a telephone booth. I feel this is the main reason nobody enjoys Conquest

RoRo.8270:

The capture points are way too small in this game except legacy mid. You can just blindly spam aoes and they will cover the entire point. It’s like fighting someone in a telephone booth

This is very true.

Not only that, but we only have one kittening game mode.

I’m sure other roles would be more appreciated if we had things like capture the flog or team deathmatch or something…

If you’re fighting a comp such as that your team will probably be getting dropped during teamfights. If they have that comp and it’s 5v5 at the node, it will be hard to survive it.

When I face something like that in soloQ I would try to encourage my teammates to not trickle in and die repeatedly. It’s better to regroup and try to make sure you can hold your other point and if they have all of their team at one node and there’s no chance of survival, it’s probably better to retreat and backcap. I’m speaking only from a perspective of dealing with this during soloQ where it’s a matter of salvaging whatever you can.

If they are a hard comp to beat and you’re fighting them on a node they own, they’re already winning and there’s not much you can do other than trying to not yield more points.

if it’s 4v5 and you’re saying there’s no chance for you to win that fight anyways, then youc an go cap other points, other objectives. you could easily swing a match if your opponents always stick in one group.

Renquist.9530:

Okay… maybe, but tahts going a whole different direction, this has 0 to do with area of denial of points, or the so called aoe spam, this is a 1v1 situation, wich honestly if your good a thief still has a very good chance of winning,… this scenario is something completely different in a teamfight what the topic as about no?

the topic is about aoe and condi spam and small points…
i also as thief have hard times dealing with it since i either can try to win fight but lose point or lose die and lose point.. either way points lost

Cynz.9437:

Renquist.9530:

Okay… maybe, but tahts going a whole different direction, this has 0 to do with area of denial of points, or the so called aoe spam, this is a 1v1 situation, wich honestly if your good a thief still has a very good chance of winning,… this scenario is something completely different in a teamfight what the topic as about no?

the topic is about aoe and condi spam and small points…
i also as thief have hard times dealing with it since i either can try to win fight but lose point or lose die and lose point.. either way points lost

So basicly your saying that because you cannot win versus someone who uses area of denial its completely broken? gg, besides wth are you doing trying to hold a point as a thief, that aint your job.

Renquist.9530:

Cynz.9437:

Renquist.9530:

Okay… maybe, but tahts going a whole different direction, this has 0 to do with area of denial of points, or the so called aoe spam, this is a 1v1 situation, wich honestly if your good a thief still has a very good chance of winning,… this scenario is something completely different in a teamfight what the topic as about no?

the topic is about aoe and condi spam and small points…
i also as thief have hard times dealing with it since i either can try to win fight but lose point or lose die and lose point.. either way points lost

So basicly your saying that because you cannot win versus someone who uses area of denial its completely broken? gg, besides wth are you doing trying to hold a point as a thief, that aint your job.

yes, i realize i shouldn’t be defending point but you don’t have choice in soloq anyway… besides, what is my job a thief? teach me how to pvp… no matter what point i went to it was flooded with aoe… ironically the only way i can kill engi atm is spamming shortbow aoe

is it not general problem with pvp? go do some spvp or tpvp…. it is all mindless aoe spam

either points need to be bigger like graveyard or aoe spam needs to be punished/not being as rewarding

same goes for conditions, you shouldn’t be able to build really tanky and for dmg at the same time

You do have a choise… you just dont do it. simple your class is neither designed/equipped to do it aka you handicap yourself.

Is aoe spam to easy/rewarding? yes absolutely, however as a thief you can choose the fights, is every point contested with 2 aoe spammers? go to the point with 1 or none, you also (hoepfully) have 4 other teammates who can peel off you, or you can just use them as distraction to get the kills in.

The options are numerous, no one forces you (especially a thief who has the best engage/disengage tools in the game) to stand on a point eating aoe spam.

Cynz.9437:

… what is answer to it? I can’t do crap on my thief to even remotely help my team vs such crap.

If i go in, i die to aoe. If i don’t go in, my team is doing 4v5. Try to hold point? Nope. Try to capture point? Nope. Just aoe/condi spam on every point.

inb4 go backstab them, jk blinded, jk blocks, jk immob/daze for ages

as you can guess i faced 3 necros/2 nade spam engis team

The problem is that this forum has a longstanding tradition of telling people that conquest is about holding points. It’s not. It’s about controlling the map by killing opponents.

Dagger thief can do a lot vs. a team like that, but not if you try to be a hero. If you’re running a spike thief, shortbow until a viable target opens and then spike him. If you open on full-health opponents swinging your daggers, you will probably not last.

If you dislike playing a spike damage style (wait-wait-wait-spike) you’ll want to experiment with other builds/professions.

So, I’m confused…The original post looks like someone was in a sticky situation and was looking for advice on what to do next time. The thread then turned into random complaints that really have nothing to do with acting on the situation but to manipulate the game so the situation doesn’t happen again.

For one, this is a reasonable situation that I run into every now and then. Secondly condi specs are hard counters for any thief. This doesn’t make them Op just a counter to your prof. and a reasonable position to question what to do next. Now I don’t know how many condi spammers were at this particular point or how many teammates you had with you but, assuming they were focusing another teammate on the point I would usually stay to see if I could burst one of them down, if I had difficulty then I would probably have left and helped at some other point. A lot of the time it’s better to leave a point your team can’t take to take one you can. for a more insightful view I would need more info.

A full condi team has its strengths but definitely its downsides. Just about any comp in teamQ would have some condi remove/immunit. In soloQ you can’t strategically build your team to make sure you have dps, bunkers, condi removes, etc…Yes condi spammers are challenging to deal with, but so are bursty builds and bunkers. It doesn’t make any sense to complain about small cp’s or how srong your counter is against you. Just accept it was a bad situation and you couldn’t do much with what you had, instead of changing things that could/would hurt other aspects of the game.

Condi bunkers is a cancer of sPvP. Something must be done.