Guild Wars 2

Certainly you can do 1800 damage to us, but lets be honest, with auras healing 1k each, getting back those 1800 isnt too hard.

Binary skills shouldnt be here.

Suggestions could be; apply resistance for 2 seconds (5 secs ICD) when 3 condis are applied.

Team Conquest is 5v5, not 1v1

• Why would you 1v1 an ele on point if you play a condition class?
• Rotate?

One simple guide to know if a Diamond Skin change idea is good is, “With the proposed change, would you want to use the trait?”

Alekt.5803:

One simple guide to know if a Diamond Skin change idea is good is, “With the proposed change, would you want to use the trait?”

Of course the anti-ele faction will say yes, it’s a no brainer.

Another completely passive trait you have no control over? Noty.

Like I said, I’m an ele main…im usually the one on the ele side, not 1v1’ing him. The problem comes to how they synergize with another bunker/healer, druid/mesmer/ele. Basiclly it becomes impossible to kill me, or even do anything for that matter. Very little involvement of my part other than “spam all heals off CD”.

It doesnt promote healthy gameplay.

Fortus.6175:

Like I said, I’m an ele main…im usually the one on the ele side, not 1v1’ing him. The problem comes to how they synergize with another bunker/healer, druid/mesmer/ele. Basiclly it becomes impossible to kill me, or even do anything for that matter. Very little involvement of my part other than “spam all heals off CD”.

It doesnt promote healthy gameplay.

The other team can just rotate.

Why?

The meta tempest have bad mobility.

I for one have no problem with eles, it’s just a matter of teamwork.

Even if you remove DS, eles to begin with have very good condi removal, nothing will change, if ever they will get SH.

Stop saying this cause its not.

If other classes could play dps this wouldnt even be a thing. Also in the abjured first match today int he por league the only player i think died was wakkey who was playing DS skin ele so please explain.

Diamond skin ele has Big counter, is called direct damage classes such as but not limited to marauder hammer engi, trap guard, power ranger, thief ect.ect then once they get you down to 90% they condi the livin daylights out of you and splat. I think its good that tempest must choose either no crit in earth or no condi above 90% both have strong counters if you know how to play.

StickerHappy.8052:

Team Conquest is 5v5, not 1v1

• Why would you 1v1 an ele on point if you play a condition class?
• Rotate?

It doesn’t always work out that way. In an ideal setting, with perfect communications and rotations you won’t have to, but there have been a few times in coordinated teams where I’ve played wanderer’s and had to hold a point against a tempest until fights elsewhere on the map could be resolved so that I could switch off with someone or get a +1. Since switching to Viper reaper I haven’t noticed to be as much of an issue if I time my condi bombs in the very brief moment of vulnerability before the tempest heals up, but if I ran anything else, like cele, carrion, or wanderer especially it felt a lot harder to not be hardcountered.

kdaddy.5431:

Stop saying this cause its not.

If other classes could play dps this wouldnt even be a thing. Also in the abjured first match today int he por league the only player i think died was wakkey who was playing DS skin ele so please explain.

Wakkey played bunker mes today, abjured ditched tempest, though they might come back to it pending the “balance changes”.

Diamond skin is broken and should be adjusted. No passive skill/trait should hardcounter whole build. It’s like ranger’s bark skin would give imunity to direct dmg when agove 90% health. Cause why not right? Bring condi and stop crying? Ofc not, that would be broken same as diamond skin.

I’m all for nerfing the crap out of terribly-designed passives. I want to see more passives nerfed too (all those offensive passive procs like panic strike and incendiary powder especially). I would love to see traits modify active skills in interesting ways to promote different skill usages, as opposed to making hard-counters.

My previous suggestion:
You become immune to the following conditions depending on your current attunement:
Fire: Chill, burning
Air: Weakness, torment
Earth: Cripple, bleed
Water: poison, confusion

It creates interesting play for both the ele and the enemy. No matter what your strategy, even something like a burn guardian, you have significant windows to do your thing (save all your burn burst for after they leave fire, profit), while as an ele you have new defensive options if you intelligently use your attunements. Both sides can know what is going on and adjust their play actively to respond to one another – this is good design.

I don’t think it’s broken, it’s just bad design.

Like you said, binary.

eureeka.5368:

Diamond skin ele has Big counter, is called direct damage classes such as but not limited to marauder hammer engi, trap guard, power ranger, thief ect.ect then once they get you down to 90% they condi the livin daylights out of you and splat. I think its good that tempest must choose either no crit in earth or no condi above 90% both have strong counters if you know how to play.

Direct dmg is a counter to everyone.

And atleast Stone Heart only works in earth attunement, maybe they should make it the same for diamond skin.

BlackBeard.2873:

I’m all for nerfing the crap out of terribly-designed passives. I want to see more passives nerfed too (all those offensive passive procs like panic strike and incendiary powder especially). I would love to see traits modify active skills in interesting ways to promote different skill usages, as opposed to making hard-counters.

My previous suggestion:
You become immune to the following conditions depending on your current attunement:
Fire: Chill, burning
Air: Weakness, torment
Earth: Cripple, bleed
Water: poison, confusion

It creates interesting play for both the ele and the enemy. No matter what your strategy, even something like a burn guardian, you have significant windows to do your thing (save all your burn burst for after they leave fire, profit), while as an ele you have new defensive options if you intelligently use your attunements. Both sides can know what is going on and adjust their play actively to respond to one another – this is good design.

You are forgetting to look at the other side of the coin.

How bout condi spammers?

Yes I do agree with being skillful, but condi spamming isn’t either. So i think DS is fair.

StickerHappy.8052:

BlackBeard.2873:

I’m all for nerfing the crap out of terribly-designed passives. I want to see more passives nerfed too (all those offensive passive procs like panic strike and incendiary powder especially). I would love to see traits modify active skills in interesting ways to promote different skill usages, as opposed to making hard-counters.

My previous suggestion:
You become immune to the following conditions depending on your current attunement:
Fire: Chill, burning
Air: Weakness, torment
Earth: Cripple, bleed
Water: poison, confusion

It creates interesting play for both the ele and the enemy. No matter what your strategy, even something like a burn guardian, you have significant windows to do your thing (save all your burn burst for after they leave fire, profit), while as an ele you have new defensive options if you intelligently use your attunements. Both sides can know what is going on and adjust their play actively to respond to one another – this is good design.

You are forgetting to look at the other side of the coin.

How bout condi spammers?

Yeah….@BlackBeard “tends” to forget always about the other side of the coin :* ridiculous burst ( like 12k dmg with 1-2 skills on 8-10s CD); braindead condi spamm( chill/chill/chill/torment/torment/torment/confusion looolololo); CC/daze spamm etc etc*

Delete all invulnerability and immunity, except stability.

Pow is not always an answer, you need boon striping.
With perma prot -40% dmg marauder can do ridiulosly low dmg on some tempest builds 1v1 ,tough nut to break.

Ds was here for a long time and was not that much of problem
With auras it is…

The problem with your proposal, if Diamond Skin sucks, which in my opinion sucks already, a GM trait that has no effect other then that %90 HP threshold, what would you take as GM.

Stone Heart, I stick to earth no more then 2s in fight, then it is useless, written in stone, do we have any valid Signet build that worth taking this trait.

I take Diamond Skin because there is no other viable trait that help me me out, it helps me in first 5-6s of the fight, then it drops in any case. Give us more viable earth GMs then lets discuss this again.

What you say might be true for solo queue, but with coordinated burst of a team, Ele can’t keep that %90 HP threshold, everybody playing bunker builds in solo queue and can’t dent that %90 HP is not Ele’s fault.

Engineer has two words for you Elementalists defending Diamond Skin: Automated Response

nearlight.3064:

StickerHappy.8052:

Team Conquest is 5v5, not 1v1

• Why would you 1v1 an ele on point if you play a condition class?
• Rotate?

It doesn’t always work out that way. In an ideal setting, with perfect communications and rotations you won’t have to, but there have been a few times in coordinated teams where I’ve played wanderer’s and had to hold a point against a tempest until fights elsewhere on the map could be resolved so that I could switch off with someone or get a +1. Since switching to Viper reaper I haven’t noticed to be as much of an issue if I time my condi bombs in the very brief moment of vulnerability before the tempest heals up, but if I ran anything else, like cele, carrion, or wanderer especially it felt a lot harder to not be hardcountered.

kdaddy.5431:

Stop saying this cause its not.

If other classes could play dps this wouldnt even be a thing. Also in the abjured first match today int he por league the only player i think died was wakkey who was playing DS skin ele so please explain.

Wakkey played bunker mes today, abjured ditched tempest, though they might come back to it pending the “balance changes”.

Thank you for the update, when i saw they were running the same comp and they got up 100-5 7 minutes into the first match i quit watching.

So to correct my statement, watch the first week of the ESL and you will see wakkey get killed on DS skin ele. Explain that

I’ve learnt to ignore all diamond skin nerf advocates simple for the fact that they aren’t very good at this game. Anyone who has played to higher tiers will see that the trait is actually fine. Or I would even go as far as to say we need a buff, but that’s debatable.

To overcome diamond skin one must outplay the ele with cunning and speed.

It’s not overpowered at all… in 2vs2 or 2vs1 (u’r the one) ur Hp drops soooo easily … and then enjoy the condi spam again o/ till heal + healing rain ready and enjoy the come back of DS for another 3 sec o/

In teamfight if i’m focused … (on staff cleansing build) i’m getting destroyed in5 sec full hp to death.

But all ele earth trait line is bad designed anyway

StickerHappy.8052:

Team Conquest is 5v5, not 1v1

• Why would you 1v1 an ele on point if you play a condition class?
• Rotate?

It’s the mechanic, not the viability

• No other trait in the game counters a build-type.
• No other trait in the game counters a build-type.
• No other trait in the game counters a build-type.

It’s a terrible, passive, trait mechanic that shouldn’t exist. You can’t justify it.

ofc you can justify it. Condies are kitten OP these days… and it’s another way to “counter” condies for a short period of time.

Saiyan.1704:

It’s a terrible, passive, trait mechanic that shouldn’t exist. You can’t justify it.

It really is terrible design. Might as well be playing rock paper scissors.

Except it’s not even close to being overpowered. It serves 0 purpose against power based players, and only slightly counters condi based players. If you can’t do 1800 direct damage or can’t get help from a teammate to break through it because your too bad to do it yourself you don’t deserve to beat the ele.

But Diamond Skin with Elemental Shielding and Hardy Conduit is just about the funniest thing to do to a condi build in a 1v1. Even better if they’re in melee

hurrado.2346:

Except it’s not even close to being overpowered. It serves 0 purpose against power based players, and only slightly counters condi based players. If you can’t do 1800 direct damage or can’t get help from a teammate to break through it because your too bad to do it yourself you don’t deserve to beat the ele.

Again, why do people assume Im fighting the ele? i AM the ele.

40% damage reduction, 3 auras, a healing skill, 10% damage reduction from frost aura, elite to give me another aura.

Effective health is a lot more than 1.8k, on top of that I have over 9k of healing in a matter of seconds. You cant see things in a vacuum, truth is; even with 2 people, it can be tough to break through my health.

Fortus.6175:

hurrado.2346:

Except it’s not even close to being overpowered. It serves 0 purpose against power based players, and only slightly counters condi based players. If you can’t do 1800 direct damage or can’t get help from a teammate to break through it because your too bad to do it yourself you don’t deserve to beat the ele.

Again, why do people assume Im fighting the ele? i AM the ele.

40% damage reduction, 3 auras, a healing skill, 10% damage reduction from frost aura, elite to give me another aura.

Effective health is a lot more than 1.8k, on top of that I have over 9k of healing in a matter of seconds. You cant see things in a vacuum, truth is; even with 2 people, it can be tough to break through my health.

If 2 people can’t break through your diamond skin, I’m most definitely certain you’re playing at lower tiers of pvp. Which makes your argument really weak.

Supreme.3164:

StickerHappy.8052:

BlackBeard.2873:

I’m all for nerfing the crap out of terribly-designed passives. I want to see more passives nerfed too (all those offensive passive procs like panic strike and incendiary powder especially). I would love to see traits modify active skills in interesting ways to promote different skill usages, as opposed to making hard-counters.

My previous suggestion:
You become immune to the following conditions depending on your current attunement:
Fire: Chill, burning
Air: Weakness, torment
Earth: Cripple, bleed
Water: poison, confusion

It creates interesting play for both the ele and the enemy. No matter what your strategy, even something like a burn guardian, you have significant windows to do your thing (save all your burn burst for after they leave fire, profit), while as an ele you have new defensive options if you intelligently use your attunements. Both sides can know what is going on and adjust their play actively to respond to one another – this is good design.

You are forgetting to look at the other side of the coin.

How bout condi spammers?

Yeah….@BlackBeard “tends” to forget always about the other side of the coin :* ridiculous burst ( like 12k dmg with 1-2 skills on 8-10s CD); braindead condi spamm( chill/chill/chill/torment/torment/torment/confusion looolololo); CC/daze spamm etc etc*

Uh, that isn’t neglecting the other side of the coin.
Some condi builds being a little too strong doesn’t change the fact that Diamond Skin is poorly designed and could be HEAVILY improved.
He never said braindead condis are fine.

I main a reaper and I have to say the only thing that annoys the heck out of me is the fact that ele’s when above 90% don’t get effected by my non damage condi’s. I throw a fear oo immune, I throw chill to bad immune..and that’s what really gets to me. I don’t care much about the the immunity to damaging conditions at 90% but dang is it annoying to have nothing you throw at a ele stick and all you’re seeing is immune after immune

Fortus.6175:

hurrado.2346:

Except it’s not even close to being overpowered. It serves 0 purpose against power based players, and only slightly counters condi based players. If you can’t do 1800 direct damage or can’t get help from a teammate to break through it because your too bad to do it yourself you don’t deserve to beat the ele.

Again, why do people assume Im fighting the ele? i AM the ele.

40% damage reduction, 3 auras, a healing skill, 10% damage reduction from frost aura, elite to give me another aura.

Effective health is a lot more than 1.8k, on top of that I have over 9k of healing in a matter of seconds. You cant see things in a vacuum, truth is; even with 2 people, it can be tough to break through my health.

You must play against bad players. Diamond skin has been around for ages and now that people are using it on bunker tempests it’s suddenly OP when it is easily counterable.

Malchior.5732:

Supreme.3164:

StickerHappy.8052:

BlackBeard.2873:

I’m all for nerfing the crap out of terribly-designed passives. I want to see more passives nerfed too (all those offensive passive procs like panic strike and incendiary powder especially). I would love to see traits modify active skills in interesting ways to promote different skill usages, as opposed to making hard-counters.

My previous suggestion:
You become immune to the following conditions depending on your current attunement:
Fire: Chill, burning
Air: Weakness, torment
Earth: Cripple, bleed
Water: poison, confusion

It creates interesting play for both the ele and the enemy. No matter what your strategy, even something like a burn guardian, you have significant windows to do your thing (save all your burn burst for after they leave fire, profit), while as an ele you have new defensive options if you intelligently use your attunements. Both sides can know what is going on and adjust their play actively to respond to one another – this is good design.

You are forgetting to look at the other side of the coin.

How bout condi spammers?

Yeah….@BlackBeard “tends” to forget always about the other side of the coin :* ridiculous burst ( like 12k dmg with 1-2 skills on 8-10s CD); braindead condi spamm( chill/chill/chill/torment/torment/torment/confusion looolololo); CC/daze spamm etc etc*

Uh, that isn’t neglecting the other side of the coin.
Some condi builds being a little too strong doesn’t change the fact that Diamond Skin is poorly designed and could be HEAVILY improved.
He never said braindead condis are fine.

Pretty much this! I have been campaigning for EVERYTHING to be nerfed, and poorly designed traits/skills to be reworked. Diamond skin falls into that second category, but it doesn’t mean the first category should be ignored. This thread just isn’t about the first category.

BlackBeard.2873:

Malchior.5732:

Supreme.3164:

StickerHappy.8052:

BlackBeard.2873:

I’m all for nerfing the crap out of terribly-designed passives. I want to see more passives nerfed too (all those offensive passive procs like panic strike and incendiary powder especially). I would love to see traits modify active skills in interesting ways to promote different skill usages, as opposed to making hard-counters.

My previous suggestion:
You become immune to the following conditions depending on your current attunement:
Fire: Chill, burning
Air: Weakness, torment
Earth: Cripple, bleed
Water: poison, confusion

It creates interesting play for both the ele and the enemy. No matter what your strategy, even something like a burn guardian, you have significant windows to do your thing (save all your burn burst for after they leave fire, profit), while as an ele you have new defensive options if you intelligently use your attunements. Both sides can know what is going on and adjust their play actively to respond to one another – this is good design.

You are forgetting to look at the other side of the coin.

How bout condi spammers?

Yeah….@BlackBeard “tends” to forget always about the other side of the coin :* ridiculous burst ( like 12k dmg with 1-2 skills on 8-10s CD); braindead condi spamm( chill/chill/chill/torment/torment/torment/confusion looolololo); CC/daze spamm etc etc*

Uh, that isn’t neglecting the other side of the coin.
Some condi builds being a little too strong doesn’t change the fact that Diamond Skin is poorly designed and could be HEAVILY improved.
He never said braindead condis are fine.

Pretty much this! I have been campaigning for EVERYTHING to be nerfed, and poorly designed traits/skills to be reworked. Diamond skin falls into that second category, but it doesn’t mean the first category should be ignored. This thread just isn’t about the first category.

Nerfing diamond skin won’t do anything except delete the auramancer build

Supreme.3164:

BlackBeard.2873:

Malchior.5732:

Supreme.3164:

StickerHappy.8052:

BlackBeard.2873:

I’m all for nerfing the crap out of terribly-designed passives. I want to see more passives nerfed too (all those offensive passive procs like panic strike and incendiary powder especially). I would love to see traits modify active skills in interesting ways to promote different skill usages, as opposed to making hard-counters.

My previous suggestion:
You become immune to the following conditions depending on your current attunement:
Fire: Chill, burning
Air: Weakness, torment
Earth: Cripple, bleed
Water: poison, confusion

It creates interesting play for both the ele and the enemy. No matter what your strategy, even something like a burn guardian, you have significant windows to do your thing (save all your burn burst for after they leave fire, profit), while as an ele you have new defensive options if you intelligently use your attunements. Both sides can know what is going on and adjust their play actively to respond to one another – this is good design.

You are forgetting to look at the other side of the coin.

How bout condi spammers?

Yeah….@BlackBeard “tends” to forget always about the other side of the coin :* ridiculous burst ( like 12k dmg with 1-2 skills on 8-10s CD); braindead condi spamm( chill/chill/chill/torment/torment/torment/confusion looolololo); CC/daze spamm etc etc*

Uh, that isn’t neglecting the other side of the coin.
Some condi builds being a little too strong doesn’t change the fact that Diamond Skin is poorly designed and could be HEAVILY improved.
He never said braindead condis are fine.

Pretty much this! I have been campaigning for EVERYTHING to be nerfed, and poorly designed traits/skills to be reworked. Diamond skin falls into that second category, but it doesn’t mean the first category should be ignored. This thread just isn’t about the first category.

Nerfing diamond skin won’t do anything except delete the auramancer build

So, change Diamond Skin and change Auramancer accordingly so it doesn’t need to rely on cancerous passive traits?

Malchior.5732:

Supreme.3164:

BlackBeard.2873:

Malchior.5732:

Supreme.3164:

StickerHappy.8052:

BlackBeard.2873:

I’m all for nerfing the crap out of terribly-designed passives. I want to see more passives nerfed too (all those offensive passive procs like panic strike and incendiary powder especially). I would love to see traits modify active skills in interesting ways to promote different skill usages, as opposed to making hard-counters.

My previous suggestion:
You become immune to the following conditions depending on your current attunement:
Fire: Chill, burning
Air: Weakness, torment
Earth: Cripple, bleed
Water: poison, confusion

It creates interesting play for both the ele and the enemy. No matter what your strategy, even something like a burn guardian, you have significant windows to do your thing (save all your burn burst for after they leave fire, profit), while as an ele you have new defensive options if you intelligently use your attunements. Both sides can know what is going on and adjust their play actively to respond to one another – this is good design.

You are forgetting to look at the other side of the coin.

How bout condi spammers?

Yeah….@BlackBeard “tends” to forget always about the other side of the coin :* ridiculous burst ( like 12k dmg with 1-2 skills on 8-10s CD); braindead condi spamm( chill/chill/chill/torment/torment/torment/confusion looolololo); CC/daze spamm etc etc*

Uh, that isn’t neglecting the other side of the coin.
Some condi builds being a little too strong doesn’t change the fact that Diamond Skin is poorly designed and could be HEAVILY improved.
He never said braindead condis are fine.

Pretty much this! I have been campaigning for EVERYTHING to be nerfed, and poorly designed traits/skills to be reworked. Diamond skin falls into that second category, but it doesn’t mean the first category should be ignored. This thread just isn’t about the first category.

Nerfing diamond skin won’t do anything except delete the auramancer build

So, change Diamond Skin and change Auramancer accordingly so it doesn’t need to rely on cancerous passive traits?

Was referring to meta auramancer, the concept itself won’t disappear, it will change to something less team support and more self-sustain…either way a skilled ele would still triumph over cancerous and effortless condi spam, meanwhile the true intent of these threads remains hidden to the masses these thread are not merely focused on diamond skin, the real aim is to destroy the last bastion of hope against condi spam.

The diamond skin nerf crusade is just a facade, I guarantee you that with the trait gone…the same necros(+ lone burn guard) will jump on the next nerf crusade which is ele sustain in general with more emphases on the ele ability to recover from mindless condi spam

Supreme.3164:

Malchior.5732:

Supreme.3164:

BlackBeard.2873:

Malchior.5732:

Supreme.3164:

StickerHappy.8052:

BlackBeard.2873:

I’m all for nerfing the crap out of terribly-designed passives. I want to see more passives nerfed too (all those offensive passive procs like panic strike and incendiary powder especially). I would love to see traits modify active skills in interesting ways to promote different skill usages, as opposed to making hard-counters.

My previous suggestion:
You become immune to the following conditions depending on your current attunement:
Fire: Chill, burning
Air: Weakness, torment
Earth: Cripple, bleed
Water: poison, confusion

It creates interesting play for both the ele and the enemy. No matter what your strategy, even something like a burn guardian, you have significant windows to do your thing (save all your burn burst for after they leave fire, profit), while as an ele you have new defensive options if you intelligently use your attunements. Both sides can know what is going on and adjust their play actively to respond to one another – this is good design.

You are forgetting to look at the other side of the coin.

How bout condi spammers?

Yeah….@BlackBeard “tends” to forget always about the other side of the coin :* ridiculous burst ( like 12k dmg with 1-2 skills on 8-10s CD); braindead condi spamm( chill/chill/chill/torment/torment/torment/confusion looolololo); CC/daze spamm etc etc*

Uh, that isn’t neglecting the other side of the coin.
Some condi builds being a little too strong doesn’t change the fact that Diamond Skin is poorly designed and could be HEAVILY improved.
He never said braindead condis are fine.

Pretty much this! I have been campaigning for EVERYTHING to be nerfed, and poorly designed traits/skills to be reworked. Diamond skin falls into that second category, but it doesn’t mean the first category should be ignored. This thread just isn’t about the first category.

Nerfing diamond skin won’t do anything except delete the auramancer build

So, change Diamond Skin and change Auramancer accordingly so it doesn’t need to rely on cancerous passive traits?

Was referring to meta auramancer, the concept itself won’t disappear, it will change to something less team support and more self-sustain…either way a skilled ele would still triumph over cancerous and effortless condi spam, meanwhile the true intent of these threads remains hidden to the masses these thread are not merely focused on diamond skin, the real aim is to destroy the last bastion of hope against condi spam.

The diamond skin nerf crusade is just a facade, I guarantee you that with the trait gone…the same necros(+ lone burn guard) will jump on the next nerf crusade which is ele sustain in general with more emphases on the ele ability to recover from mindless condi spam

Wow.
I guess I left my tin foil hat at home.

Malchior.5732:

Supreme.3164:

Malchior.5732:

Supreme.3164:

BlackBeard.2873:

Malchior.5732:

Supreme.3164:

StickerHappy.8052:

BlackBeard.2873:

I’m all for nerfing the crap out of terribly-designed passives. I want to see more passives nerfed too (all those offensive passive procs like panic strike and incendiary powder especially). I would love to see traits modify active skills in interesting ways to promote different skill usages, as opposed to making hard-counters.

My previous suggestion:
You become immune to the following conditions depending on your current attunement:
Fire: Chill, burning
Air: Weakness, torment
Earth: Cripple, bleed
Water: poison, confusion

It creates interesting play for both the ele and the enemy. No matter what your strategy, even something like a burn guardian, you have significant windows to do your thing (save all your burn burst for after they leave fire, profit), while as an ele you have new defensive options if you intelligently use your attunements. Both sides can know what is going on and adjust their play actively to respond to one another – this is good design.

You are forgetting to look at the other side of the coin.

How bout condi spammers?

Yeah….@BlackBeard “tends” to forget always about the other side of the coin :* ridiculous burst ( like 12k dmg with 1-2 skills on 8-10s CD); braindead condi spamm( chill/chill/chill/torment/torment/torment/confusion looolololo); CC/daze spamm etc etc*

Uh, that isn’t neglecting the other side of the coin.
Some condi builds being a little too strong doesn’t change the fact that Diamond Skin is poorly designed and could be HEAVILY improved.
He never said braindead condis are fine.

Pretty much this! I have been campaigning for EVERYTHING to be nerfed, and poorly designed traits/skills to be reworked. Diamond skin falls into that second category, but it doesn’t mean the first category should be ignored. This thread just isn’t about the first category.

Nerfing diamond skin won’t do anything except delete the auramancer build

So, change Diamond Skin and change Auramancer accordingly so it doesn’t need to rely on cancerous passive traits?

Was referring to meta auramancer, the concept itself won’t disappear, it will change to something less team support and more self-sustain…either way a skilled ele would still triumph over cancerous and effortless condi spam, meanwhile the true intent of these threads remains hidden to the masses these thread are not merely focused on diamond skin, the real aim is to destroy the last bastion of hope against condi spam.

The diamond skin nerf crusade is just a facade, I guarantee you that with the trait gone…the same necros(+ lone burn guard) will jump on the next nerf crusade which is ele sustain in general with more emphases on the ele ability to recover from mindless condi spam

Wow.
I guess I left my tin foil hat at home.

This is Supreme, who has been on an anti-condition crusade for who knows how long now.

Can’t say I’m surprised he thinks anyone who doesn’t like Diamond Skin as-is wants condition builds only on top, since that isn’t too far off from his line of thinking. He’s 100% wrong, of course.

No Diamond Skin – No Ele in competetive play……

PowerBottom.5796:

No Diamond Skin – No Ele in competetive play……

Then fix Ele

Malchior.5732:

PowerBottom.5796:

No Diamond Skin – No Ele in competetive play……

Then fix Ele

Then fix condition spam?

how about changing that trait to give 2 sec resistance when you switch to earth (less passive play)

There many ways i think is ok:

1:changing to earth for 4 sec resistance 10s internal cd
2: if hit above 70hp, 25% got 4 sec resistance, 10s internal cd
3: using earth skills got for 4 sec resistance 10s internal cd

Supreme.3164:

a skilled ele would still triumph over cancerous and effortless condi spam,

oh wait, I know how to do these too!! :

A skilled ele will not easily die to 2 people while perfectly maintaining their diamond skin in a 1v1 scenario, specially versus condi spammers. You must be playing above your MMR if people can easily kill you when you are using the meta auramancer

There, I too can fall into fallacies, and as you can probably see, it will take us nowhere.

Conditions are OP on the stronger side, nobody denies that, specially reapers. That is just another issue that has to be tackled as well, because we don’t play the game in a vacuum. Diamond skin is also in a poor state, you also can’t deny that if you do care aout game balance’s health.

Dont believe me? Look at the current state of PvP:

http://massivelyop.com/2015/12/15/guild-wars-2-e-sports-team-ragequits-over-design-meta-technical-issues/

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/pvp/PvP-needs-to-be-fun-to-play-watch/

Right now we are pretty much a joke of PvP because nobody wants to admit whats broken and what isn’t. Your attitude is not helping the game’s PvP, it is only making it be more of a joke, as if we already weren’t!

I already gave my constructive criticism, I want the game to succeed, thats why, as an Ele main I want to point out whats holding us back, so that we might reach a better state of the game.

Fortus.6175:

Supreme.3164:

a skilled ele would still triumph over cancerous and effortless condi spam,

oh wait, I know how to do these too!! :

A skilled ele will not easily die to 2 people while perfectly maintaining their diamond skin in a 1v1 scenario, specially versus condi spammers. You must be playing above your MMR if people can easily kill you when you are using the meta auramancer

There, I too can fall into fallacies, and as you can probably see, it will take us nowhere.

---

Conditions are OP on the stronger side, nobody denies that, specially reapers. That is just another issue that has to be tackled as well, because we don’t play the game in a vacuum. Diamond skin is also in a poor state, you also can’t deny that if you do care aout game balance’s health.

Dont believe me? Look at the current state of PvP:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NhYGyHhTRYk

http://massivelyop.com/2015/12/15/guild-wars-2-e-sports-team-ragequits-over-design-meta-technical-issues/

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/pvp/PvP-needs-to-be-fun-to-play-watch/

Right now we are pretty much a joke of PvP because nobody wants to admit whats broken and what isn’t. Your attitude is not helping the game’s PvP, it is only making it be more of a joke, as if we already weren’t!

I already gave my constructive criticism, I want the game to succeed, thats why, as an Ele main I want to point out whats holding us back, so that we might reach a better state of the game.

The thing is you are saying it is bad, you are not counter proposing something.

I will say this, if anybody will change/nerf Stone Heart, when they are at it they should change the Overloads.

I am sick and tired running left/right while channeling Overload like headless chickens. It is so against the concept of Ele, sightseeing for 5s and doing nothing.

Let the Overloads be fire and forgets, start it and do something else, change attunement, anything, then we can discuss your proposal about Stone Heart nerf.

And what exactly that youtube video proves, both guys running the Overload without stability and instead regen/vigor, in any 1vsX they will be stun locked and die in nano second.

And before Elite specs, if 2 D/D Cele will fight against each, the result will be exactly same, a fight that go for forever.

Hard counter are always a bad idea design because it is frustating for the players countered and it bring to the game a stone scissors paper meta.
For a long time now, build and skills are more important than the player’s skill and only leave to spvp teamplay to counter build.
Diamond skin is just the visible part of pvp design problems in gw2, there are lot more: mobility imbalance in a game mode where rotations are mandatory, zerk builds making auto attack spam too powerfull encouraging low gameplay, fire and air sigil proc stupid efficiency in zerk for 0 skill needed and more generally too much auto cast, proc, OP passive (diamond skin) etc etc

Fortus.6175:

hurrado.2346:

Except it’s not even close to being overpowered. It serves 0 purpose against power based players, and only slightly counters condi based players. If you can’t do 1800 direct damage or can’t get help from a teammate to break through it because your too bad to do it yourself you don’t deserve to beat the ele.

Again, why do people assume Im fighting the ele? i AM the ele.

40% damage reduction, 3 auras, a healing skill, 10% damage reduction from frost aura, elite to give me another aura.

Effective health is a lot more than 1.8k, on top of that I have over 9k of healing in a matter of seconds. You cant see things in a vacuum, truth is; even with 2 people, it can be tough to break through my health.

Lel I just saw an Ele for the pro league got destroyed in 5 sec ( in 2vs1) … well ok he was from NA but still !(spookie vs APex) Stop saying crap =D

Glenstorm.4059:

I’m all for making DS a better, more active Grandmaster, but only if stuff like braindead condi spam and auto-attack spam are nerfed as well.

+1

Don’t forget it’s a GRANDMASTER trait … things like" 2 sec resistance on earth" are adept on revenant (mallyx with 5 sec inner cd… we have 8 -10-20 sec to come back to earth)