Guild Wars 2

Intresting. .

This is neat thanks for sharing!

Thanks for sharing!

Have you taken aftercast time into consideration? It can be pretty heavy (e.g. thief sword, mes GS unless they abuse cancel animation) and sadly is not documented in the wiki (because reasons?)

Did you take the trait that lets engi’s auto attack with rifle faster?

shion.2084:

Did you take the trait that lets engi’s auto attack with rifle faster?

Traits can be turned off and on, aftercast cannot.

Shadowstep.6049:

shion.2084:

Did you take the trait that lets engi’s auto attack with rifle faster?

Traits can be turned off and on, aftercast cannot.

doesn’t invalidate either question or mean his post was in response to you.

How am I not surprised that the bottom of the list is filled with elementalist skills that are so bad nobody is even using them.

insanemaniac.2456:

Shadowstep.6049:

shion.2084:

Did you take the trait that lets engi’s auto attack with rifle faster?

Traits can be turned off and on, aftercast cannot.

doesn’t invalidate either question or mean his post was in response to you.

pretty sure the idea of the list is not taking into account modifiers like food/traits/amulets etc.

Shadowstep.6049:

insanemaniac.2456:

Shadowstep.6049:

shion.2084:

Did you take the trait that lets engi’s auto attack with rifle faster?

Traits can be turned off and on, aftercast cannot.

doesn’t invalidate either question or mean his post was in response to you.

pretty sure the idea of the list is not taking into account modifiers like food/traits/amulets etc.

and here we devolve into arguments about how the list should be built:

whats the point of a tier list if its inaccurate? if the trait is normally taken, why should it not be included (or vice versa)? why should there not be 2 entries, one with and one without? how do you know what the OP was thinking when you are not they and why are you trying to answer for them?

Thanks for sharing, but its best if viewers can see this with a little content to it though. Eg. guardian hammer only generate that much in the end provided that opponent sits in symbols.

insanemaniac.2456:

Shadowstep.6049:

insanemaniac.2456:

Shadowstep.6049:

shion.2084:

Did you take the trait that lets engi’s auto attack with rifle faster?

Traits can be turned off and on, aftercast cannot.

doesn’t invalidate either question or mean his post was in response to you.

pretty sure the idea of the list is not taking into account modifiers like food/traits/amulets etc.

and here we devolve into arguments about how the list should be built:

whats the point of a tier list if its inaccurate? if the trait is normally taken, why should it not be included (or vice versa)? why should there not be 2 entries, one with and one without? how do you know what the OP was thinking when you are not they and why are you trying to answer for them?

because those are variable and not permanent, depending on build you migh have the trait or not

this list is just base numbers

Even with the buff we just got, Mesmer’s highest auto attack DPS is only halfway up the list, and only barely above 50% of what thief staff can output. The next highest Mesmer autoattack DPS is in the bottom 25% of the list, and GS and Staff are absolutely pitiful, only beating the autos on ele from the defensive attunements….. Yet apparently our damage is great on all of our weapons, considering none of them except sword were buffed last balance patch

Warrior rifle… Tjeez so bad.

I knew it was bad but this bad? Even condi weapons do more dmg with power compared to rifle lol.

100b = around 1200 ?

Can you do 100b with 2000 power? I really wonder how much AA are better then thia iconic 100b skill :-P

OriOri.8724:

Even with the buff we just got, Mesmer’s highest auto attack DPS is only halfway up the list, and only barely above 50% of what thief staff can output. The next highest Mesmer autoattack DPS is in the bottom 25% of the list, and GS and Staff are absolutely pitiful, only beating the autos on ele from the defensive attunements….. Yet apparently our damage is great on all of our weapons, considering none of them except sword were buffed last balance patch

you can’t look at those dps in vaccuum
you forget some of those weapon sets are ranged -> less risk compared to melee
you also forget class mechanics – thief is way squishier than mes atm for example; their main dps also comes from AA (rest is utility mainly) where other classes rely on actual weapon set spells (2,3,4,5) for dmg because otherwise thief would just dump all ini in high dmgging attacks (staff 5 is probably closest example)
then there is thing like scaling – some sets scale better with certain stats than other

Shadowstep.6049:

OriOri.8724:

Even with the buff we just got, Mesmer’s highest auto attack DPS is only halfway up the list, and only barely above 50% of what thief staff can output. The next highest Mesmer autoattack DPS is in the bottom 25% of the list, and GS and Staff are absolutely pitiful, only beating the autos on ele from the defensive attunements….. Yet apparently our damage is great on all of our weapons, considering none of them except sword were buffed last balance patch

you can’t look at those dps in vaccuum
you forget some of those weapon sets are ranged -> less risk compared to melee
you also forget class mechanics – thief is way squishier than mes atm for example; their main dps also comes from AA (rest is utility mainly) where other classes rely on actual weapon set spells (2,3,4,5) for dmg because otherwise thief would just dump all ini in high dmgging attacks (staff 5 is probably closest example)
then there is thing like scaling – some sets scale better with certain stats than other

If we take it outside a vacuum the disparity gets even larger though. Outside of extremely niche scenarios, mesmer DPS is the worst in the game, and its not like our utilities and other weapon skills make up for it. Hell WoC, our main damaging utility (our only directly damaging utility skill other than power spike), deals damage on par with or worse than some weapon skills on other classes.

OriOri.8724:

Shadowstep.6049:

OriOri.8724:

Even with the buff we just got, Mesmer’s highest auto attack DPS is only halfway up the list, and only barely above 50% of what thief staff can output. The next highest Mesmer autoattack DPS is in the bottom 25% of the list, and GS and Staff are absolutely pitiful, only beating the autos on ele from the defensive attunements….. Yet apparently our damage is great on all of our weapons, considering none of them except sword were buffed last balance patch

you can’t look at those dps in vaccuum
you forget some of those weapon sets are ranged -> less risk compared to melee
you also forget class mechanics – thief is way squishier than mes atm for example; their main dps also comes from AA (rest is utility mainly) where other classes rely on actual weapon set spells (2,3,4,5) for dmg because otherwise thief would just dump all ini in high dmgging attacks (staff 5 is probably closest example)
then there is thing like scaling – some sets scale better with certain stats than other

If we take it outside a vacuum the disparity gets even larger though. Outside of extremely niche scenarios, mesmer DPS is the worst in the game, and its not like our utilities and other weapon skills make up for it. Hell WoC, our main damaging utility (our only directly damaging utility skill other than power spike), deals damage on par with or worse than some weapon skills on other classes.

Be happy you are not stuck playing healer 24/7 like ele.

I don’t think mesmers were ever meant to be consistent dmg dealer (sup necros) but be more about spike dmg (same as thieves which can’t stay in melee for longer than 2 sec and have like crappiest ranged option in game lol).

The game is actually relative balanced atm (outside of HOT specs being blatantly broken compared to core), do you want s1 mesmers lol? You want more dmg? What would you trade for it?

Shadowstep.6049:

insanemaniac.2456:

Shadowstep.6049:

insanemaniac.2456:

Shadowstep.6049:

shion.2084:

Did you take the trait that lets engi’s auto attack with rifle faster?

Traits can be turned off and on, aftercast cannot.

doesn’t invalidate either question or mean his post was in response to you.

pretty sure the idea of the list is not taking into account modifiers like food/traits/amulets etc.

and here we devolve into arguments about how the list should be built:

whats the point of a tier list if its inaccurate? if the trait is normally taken, why should it not be included (or vice versa)? why should there not be 2 entries, one with and one without? how do you know what the OP was thinking when you are not they and why are you trying to answer for them?

because those are variable and not permanent, depending on build you migh have the trait or not

this list is just base numbers

Shadowstep.6049:

you can’t look at those dps in vaccuum

at least you figured it out later.

insanemaniac.2456:

Shadowstep.6049:

insanemaniac.2456:

Shadowstep.6049:

insanemaniac.2456:

Shadowstep.6049:

shion.2084:

Did you take the trait that lets engi’s auto attack with rifle faster?

Traits can be turned off and on, aftercast cannot.

doesn’t invalidate either question or mean his post was in response to you.

pretty sure the idea of the list is not taking into account modifiers like food/traits/amulets etc.

and here we devolve into arguments about how the list should be built:

whats the point of a tier list if its inaccurate? if the trait is normally taken, why should it not be included (or vice versa)? why should there not be 2 entries, one with and one without? how do you know what the OP was thinking when you are not they and why are you trying to answer for them?

because those are variable and not permanent, depending on build you migh have the trait or not

this list is just base numbers

Shadowstep.6049:

you can’t look at those dps in vaccuum

at least you figured it out later.

Pulling comments with different context – oh dear.

Mesmer Sword third strike, is that the damage with or with out boon? Because in pvp every one has boon and the dps will be even lower
No wonder they buff blurred frenzy in pve by 100%

Mesmer Greatsword- 1.4 sec – 573 = 409 , (Range: 1200)
Did you count mesmer GS 3 ticks here?
I know mesmer GS auto is weak but not this weak.

Shadowstep.6049:

insanemaniac.2456:

Shadowstep.6049:

insanemaniac.2456:

Shadowstep.6049:

insanemaniac.2456:

Shadowstep.6049:

shion.2084:

Did you take the trait that lets engi’s auto attack with rifle faster?

Traits can be turned off and on, aftercast cannot.

doesn’t invalidate either question or mean his post was in response to you.

pretty sure the idea of the list is not taking into account modifiers like food/traits/amulets etc.

and here we devolve into arguments about how the list should be built:

whats the point of a tier list if its inaccurate? if the trait is normally taken, why should it not be included (or vice versa)? why should there not be 2 entries, one with and one without? how do you know what the OP was thinking when you are not they and why are you trying to answer for them?

because those are variable and not permanent, depending on build you migh have the trait or not

this list is just base numbers

Shadowstep.6049:

you can’t look at those dps in vaccuum

at least you figured it out later.

Pulling comments with different context – oh dear.

idk why you are arguing with me lol

Ranger GS autoattack definitely has not higher dps than LB autoattack at 1000+ range. Some other numbers seem a bit off too. The wiki isn’t always 100% accurate. Of course it doesn’t really matter, because this list is meaningless anyways. It says absolutely nothing about how good or bad a weapon or class is in PvP (and even in PvE those numbers are not really relevant). So i don’t understand why people try to make conclusions based on this list.

UmbraNoctis.1907:

Ranger GS autoattack definitely has not higher dps than LB autoattack at 1000+ range. Some other numbers seem a bit off too. The wiki isn’t always 100% accurate. Of course it doesn’t really matter, because this list is meaningless anyways. It says absolutely nothing about how good or bad a weapon or class is in PvP (and even in PvE those numbers are not really relevant). So i don’t understand why people try to make conclusions based on this list.

Auto attack is pretty important. Many professions spam auto attack a lot in PvP. Engi uses hammer auto. Rev uses sword auto. Thief uses dagger auto. Ele uses dagger auto.

Some weapons are bad because the auto is bad. I can tell you mesmer GS is bad in current pvp because its auto is bad. The weapon has good 2-5 skills but terrible auto prevents it from being a meta weapon.

Ranger staff is a strong weapon and its strong auto party helps that. As a utility weapon, it still gives decent damage pressure by auto

Yet mesmer staff, which is second lowest weapon on the list, is meta. (Dps between druid staff aa and mesmer GS aa at max range isn’t that much different btw, i tested it once. Imo the reason why power mes isn’t meta is, that condi builds synergize better with the meta traitlines and without those traitlines mes lacks defense/sustain. Buffing GS aa won’t change much unless the dmg gets increased to ridiculous levels. Mesmer GS has always been more about burst and it was good in the past.)
Many weapons that are high on this list are trash and some with low autoattack dps are meta. This list IS meaningless. There are plenty of other things that have to be factored in when talking about how good or bad a weapon is.

UmbraNoctis.1907:

Yet mesmer staff, which is second lowest weapon on the list, is meta. (Dps between druid staff aa and mesmer GS aa at max range isn’t that much different btw, i tested it once) Many weapons that are high on this list are trash and some with low autoattack dps are meta. This list IS meaningless. There are plenty of other things that have to be factored in when talking about how good or bad a weapon is.

True, and even when comparing the auto-attacks DPS is not everything. Some autoattacks are simply way easier to avoid than others, and some can have additional effects.

nice informative list

ofc everyone reading it has to take note of the fact that some skills are more powerful because of how the autoattack works
(big Aoe, small Aoe, single target, conditions since they were not included for simplicity, easier or harder to apply full dmg..)

still in general this list gives especially new players an overview for which weaponskill on which class is best to use when autoattacking

Exciton.8942:

UmbraNoctis.1907:

Ranger GS autoattack definitely has not higher dps than LB autoattack at 1000+ range. Some other numbers seem a bit off too. The wiki isn’t always 100% accurate. Of course it doesn’t really matter, because this list is meaningless anyways. It says absolutely nothing about how good or bad a weapon or class is in PvP (and even in PvE those numbers are not really relevant). So i don’t understand why people try to make conclusions based on this list.

Auto attack is pretty important. Many professions spam auto attack a lot in PvP. Engi uses hammer auto. Rev uses sword auto. Thief uses dagger auto. Ele uses dagger auto.

Some weapons are bad because the auto is bad. I can tell you mesmer GS is bad in current pvp because its auto is bad. The weapon has good 2-5 skills but terrible auto prevents it from being a meta weapon.

Ranger staff is a strong weapon and its strong auto party helps that. As a utility weapon, it still gives decent damage pressure by auto

GS is “prevented” from being a meta weapon because most mesmers aren’t skilled enough to play power shatter, and because condi chrono has a much lower skill floor. That’s about it, not because of the auto being bad.

OriOri.8724:

Exciton.8942:

Auto attack is pretty important. Many professions spam auto attack a lot in PvP. Engi uses hammer auto. Rev uses sword auto. Thief uses dagger auto. Ele uses dagger auto.

Some weapons are bad because the auto is bad. I can tell you mesmer GS is bad in current pvp because its auto is bad. The weapon has good 2-5 skills but terrible auto prevents it from being a meta weapon.

Ranger staff is a strong weapon and its strong auto party helps that. As a utility weapon, it still gives decent damage pressure by auto

GS is “prevented” from being a meta weapon because most mesmers aren’t skilled enough to play power shatter, and because condi chrono has a much lower skill floor. That’s about it, not because of the auto being bad.

Builds are meta because the most skilled players consider it best against other skilled players. The skill floor of power is indeed much higher, but even if you are a great player, power shatter is not as good. And one of the main reason is the lack of sustained damage. Once the GS + F1 burst is done, you’re left during 10s trying to survive while hitting like a wet noodle. With all the blocks and invuln, your F1 burst will probably be at least partly neglected by a decent player, so you are left with nothing.

So yes, the GS AA is part of the problem, not really the skill floor.

This post is useful and useless.
It show a basic appareance of a weapon damage, but if you don’t take in consideration also the condition damage you will never have a real ranking of the different class weapons.
Example: someone wrote that the ele scepter is bad and other stuff, but that ranking focus only over the Direct Damage, then don’t take count of the Condition damage that the ele scepter can inflict (a burn every AA can be a huge thing, or at last a good thing also without any condition damage/duration stats).

At the same level, this ranking is useless because don’t show the real strength of a weapon. A Two handed weapon have 5 skills to fight with, a Main Hand weapon have 3 skills, plus 2 from the OH weapon, and that skills are frequently stronger in damage than the AA.

That’s a curious and funny ranking that show how a untraited class that only AA is better than another one focusing only on the direct damage.

Unluckly that ranking is not a DPS ranking because lack of condition damage variations and for that is by itself useless.
(we can also count how is easier or harder for every weapon to hit the enemy. A ranger LB AA can hit easy but a necro GS AA will really hard hit an enemy)

Anyway, thanks for that funny ranking.

OriOri.8724:

Exciton.8942:

UmbraNoctis.1907:

Ranger GS autoattack definitely has not higher dps than LB autoattack at 1000+ range. Some other numbers seem a bit off too. The wiki isn’t always 100% accurate. Of course it doesn’t really matter, because this list is meaningless anyways. It says absolutely nothing about how good or bad a weapon or class is in PvP (and even in PvE those numbers are not really relevant). So i don’t understand why people try to make conclusions based on this list.

Auto attack is pretty important. Many professions spam auto attack a lot in PvP. Engi uses hammer auto. Rev uses sword auto. Thief uses dagger auto. Ele uses dagger auto.

Some weapons are bad because the auto is bad. I can tell you mesmer GS is bad in current pvp because its auto is bad. The weapon has good 2-5 skills but terrible auto prevents it from being a meta weapon.

Ranger staff is a strong weapon and its strong auto party helps that. As a utility weapon, it still gives decent damage pressure by auto

GS is “prevented” from being a meta weapon because most mesmers aren’t skilled enough to play power shatter, and because condi chrono has a much lower skill floor. That’s about it, not because of the auto being bad.

That is bullkitten.

Are you saying all mesmers in ESL tournament are not skilled enough to play power shatter? No.

People play condition shatter simply because it is stronger, no matter what skill level you are at, it is simply the stronger variant. Also the build takes skill to play well, try dueling other good condition mesmers if you think the build takes no skill.

And GS auto damage is weak compared to pretty much all ranged weapon in the game. This is a fact and objective. Whether you believe weak damage is equal to bad is your own personal business.

this needs an update and a clap

op pretty please return to us :’(