Guild Wars 2

The new thief sword abilities are way too strong. Evasion + boon stealing all while hitting for 1.5-3.5k? It’s impossible to deal with this for most professions.

I had Lac.Strike crit for 9k once.

Just saying.

Ant.3415:

The new thief sword abilities are way too strong. Evasion + boon stealing all while hitting for 1.5-3.5k? It’s impossible to deal with this for most professions.

Haha, 3.5k xD
My 2730 toughness mesmer got hit for 5.3k from that xD

Well toughness doesn’t reduce damage very well anyway.

So funny how people were complaining about Backstab damage. Now it’s LS damage. Get real. And the only way LS is going to crit for over 5k or 6k is with like 10+ might stacks.

It’s not the sword abilities that is the problem, it’s the amounts of vigor a s/d thief can have when properly built. If you want to balance the build. Sword abilities are fine.

“Stealth thief is OP”. Thieves finally use a non stealth based build.
“Evasion thief is OP”. Thieves can’t win :^T

I don’t like the evasion builds. Not as fun as stealthing to me.

Just make lac. strike a 50%Chance to rip 1 boon since it’s such a spammable move and leave the damage alone. Problem solved

-Weapon ability that teleports? Yes
-Spammable with zero cool down?Yes
-Can it remove stuns? Yes
-Wait..it can’t bypass immobilize too..can it? Yes it can..doesn’t matter if you have 20 conditions on you. You will still be teleported a max range of 1200 so by the time you reach them, immobilize is gone or they stealthed.
-Hmm..well at least you can’t use it to bypass downed abilities, Can you? You must kittening can!

Well..how about the other Sword skills? Don’t tell me that they can spam boon removal abilities with zero cooldown and evading while doing it? Don’t tell me the boon steal is unblockable?
Well..yes and no..all of the above is correct except they don’t remove them..they actually steal them..

Kudos to the dev -nicknamed Mr.Carry Me More Plz- responsible for the thief class balance. You continue to astound me.

Harrier.9380:

I had Lac.Strike crit for 9k once.

Just saying.

The skill doesn’t have a high enough coefficient to hit that hard, unless you went full glass against another very glassy build, realistically speaking.

Arganthium.5638:

Harrier.9380:

I had Lac.Strike crit for 9k once.

Just saying.

The skill doesn’t have a high enough coefficient to hit that hard, unless you went full glass against another very glassy build, realistically speaking.

Same Coefficient as HS 50%-25%. Thing is it allows you to steal might so if the enemy has high might you can and will hit hard.

Puandro.3245:

Arganthium.5638:

Harrier.9380:

I had Lac.Strike crit for 9k once.

Just saying.

The skill doesn’t have a high enough coefficient to hit that hard, unless you went full glass against another very glassy build, realistically speaking.

Same Coefficient as HS 50%-25%. Thing is it allows you to steal might so if the enemy has high might you can and will hit hard.

Yes, I realize that. It also requires you to use another skill with a fairly weak coefficient first, and then use the second skill which hits like CnD does, has an awfully short range, and only steals might last.

So the counter is not to use Empower when you’re standing next to a thief… That’s about it. Usually we don’t steal might, and even when we do it’s usually only a stack or two. But against builds that stack might high (i.e. HGH), boonsteal is a hard counter.

GTOLegend.4175:

Just make lac. strike a 50%Chance to rip 1 boon since it’s such a spammable move and leave the damage alone. Problem solved

It is not spamable !
You ( and all whiners in here ) should perhaps learn how this skill works !
And, yes its not blockable but dodgeable / blindable / kiteable !

Also, if you have been hit for 9k LS, then you were hit by a GC thief, with +might buffs and most likely had some vulnearbility stacks on you.
Also you had less then 50% health and would have died anyway.

If you really think thief’s sword abilities are broken feel free to reroll thief and own others .. you will soon realize thakittens now as easy and OP as you think !
And i would be glad to see more of these QQ-thief’s OP rerollers – it’s so funny to kill them in 3 secs while they don’t understand how eg. BP works

XII.9401:

-Weapon ability that teleports? Yes
-Spammable with zero cool down?Yes
-Can it remove stuns? Yes
-Wait..it can’t bypass immobilize too..can it? Yes it can..doesn’t matter if you have 20 conditions on you. You will still be teleported a max range of 1200 so by the time you reach them, immobilize is gone or they stealthed.
-Hmm..well at least you can’t use it to bypass downed abilities, Can you? You must kittening can!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=93QkFtgY06E

Well..how about the other Sword skills? Don’t tell me that they can spam boon removal abilities with zero cooldown and evading while doing it? Don’t tell me the boon steal is unblockable?
Well..yes and no..all of the above is correct except they don’t remove them..they actually steal them..

Kudos to the dev -nicknamed Mr.Carry Me More Plz- responsible for the thief class balance. You continue to astound me.

I could have taken you seriously, but when you complain of stealth in a build that never stealths (or almost never), i know you are just a common QQer. Please tell me how the thief is gonna stealth after using shadow return?
“-Hmm..well at least you can’t use it to bypass downed abilities, Can you? You must kittening can!” and how the hell is this related to thief sworf abilities? All your post and flawed arguments say to me is that you can’t deal with thieves and just came crying to the forums begging for a nerf instead of learning to play.

Other classes have a stunbreaker with a cooldown of 40sec and the thief gets it for free. Mesmer has also nice possiblities to break stun with weapon skills.

Varonth.5830:

Ant.3415:

The new thief sword abilities are way too strong. Evasion + boon stealing all while hitting for 1.5-3.5k? It’s impossible to deal with this for most professions.

Haha, 3.5k xD
My 2730 toughness mesmer got hit for 5.3k from that xD

Well toughness doesn’t reduce damage very well anyway.

FS+LS have same damage as autoattack chain.
6 sec combat vs heavy golem (2600 armor) with 2347 power 62% crit dmg all attacks were critically
auto attack chain:
1890 Slice
1855 Slash
2643 Cripling Strike
1891 Slice
1858 Slash
3171 Critpling Strike
2278 Slice
Total: 15586 DMG
FS+LS
1657 Flaking Strike
3188 Larcenous Strike
1663 Flaking Strike
3192 Larcenous Strike
1774 Flaking Strike
3608 Larcenous Strike
1787 Flaking Strike
Total: 16869 DMG

And Thief hit you with 2730 armor “no toughness” for 5300DMG ?

Evilek.5690:

snip

Fun fact: Golems don’t have any might for you to steal.

Harrier.9380:

Evilek.5690:

snip

Fun fact: Golems don’t have any might for you to steal.

Of corse Mesmer have 25x might to steal

A backstab deals 60% more damage than a larcenous strike. Whenever you see big numbers, keep that in mind. 9k larcenous? That’d be a 14.4k backstab.

How often do you see 14k+ backstabs? Furthermore, the “evade builds” for S/D do not get anywhere close to that damage.

People should look at the number of hits before posting damage done.

But I do believe the skill itself needs some balancing. If it’s going to steal boons, it should deal damage or at least that amount of damage.

But basically if you don’t boon stack, you need to dodge/block/invul and AE your brains out. They are pretty annoying and sometimes really hard to deal with due to the constant evading and stealthing (at least for a condition build). They are not unbeatable however.

But I state again, it needs some balance tweaking for sure.

With thief it’s the combination of everything. Many times I’ve fought 1v1 and I couldn’t land more than 1 skill on them every few sec, even with a build full of daze and stuns. Thief can open out of stealth on me and deal a ton of damage for free. If I use stun or anything they simply use their sword #2 again. If that’s down there’s still shadow step. It’s frustrating to fight when they are always either invisible, evading, dodging, or you’re dazed. If you land anything they teleport away, stunbreaking of course. They also shed conditions while invis and they steal your boons. It’s pretty ridiculous.

The damage is not huge, but it’s enough to take down non-bunkers and bunkers have no chance to kill them anyway. I’m against nerfs to their damage, I just want to be able to use my kitten skills on them, right now it feels like there’s nothing I can do.

Did you see Jumper’s stream/build? He goes in whit 5 seconds of stability from runes of Lyssa every 45 secs and can reset a fight whenever he wants, even better than using stealth.
A single weapon skillset shouldn’t be able to do all this things:
- inmobilize
-shadow step (in/out) whit 0 cd. This skill also doesn’t need direct vision of your target…
-stun break
-gap closer (it’s an animation similar to hs)
-remove boons
-steal boons
-dodge
-does very good dmg, Larcenous strike does 504 base dmg. And it’s not like you choose between utility or burst, you do both, pressing 1 key.
And i’m just considering 2 of 5 skills of this weapon set. I’m not considering utilities/elites or they second weapon set. Jumper uses S/D also as secondary, lol.

I mean I know thieves have 0 access to boons, but this is a little too much imo. And fix runes of lyssa for elites whit short cds, a thief whit stability is just god mode.
Old thieves were more balanced QQ.

Don’t forget to factor in:

S/D steals boons, so not only do you hit harder, the opponent just lost his protection and regen.
Besides, Backstab is burst/spike damage, while Sword has incredible sustain. It generally does way higher DPS in a longer fight.

Mug was simply a mechanic the devs didn’t like. But apparently, they are quite fond of implementing another mindlessly spammable gimmick skill that has no downside into the game.
S/D is boring to play, very annoying to play against and uninteresting to watch, imo.

To be honest, kudos to the thief that manages to coordinate his burst between all the aegis, boonsharing and invulnerabilites without mug.

Stof.9584:

Don’t forget to factor in:

S/D steals boons, so not only do you hit harder, the opponent just lost his protection and regen.
Besides, Backstab is burst/spike damage, while Sword has incredible sustain. It generally does way higher DPS in a longer fight.

Sword dealing more sustained damage than Dagger is a myth, which is based on the fact that autoattacks are slower and numbers are bigger. In terms of dps they are pretty much equal. Dagger Training will actually put Daggers ahead, that’s how close it is.

The main advantage of the sword is the cleave on the autoattack. Daggers on the other hand will leave your target permanently poisoned, which is quite strong.

The problem is still, the initiative system. A hybrid of ‘initiative’ and cooldown would be much better in my opinion.
The problem with the initiative system is, that it not only allows spamming the same ability over and over, but it actively encourages a thief to do so. Since all skills share the same ressource, they basically battle for these ressources. If one skill is just marginal better, then you will just keep on using that skill, because why wasting limited ressources on something which does not do the job well.
Why should you throw a dagger on someone, if you can heartseeker/infiltrators strike jump spam him instead. Even if you miss with those 2 abilities, they place you next to the target, and allow you to keep hitting them with melee attacks.

Since thief should be allowed to use the same skill in a row, I just thought of a system like this:
Instead of initiative, the bar shows 4 chargecounters. These 4 are the charges for each of your weaponskills. You can save up to X charges for each skill.
Skill have a cooldown, just as other classes weapons have cooldowns, but if the cooldown is over, instead of making the skill available, it adds one charge to the respective chargecounter. An example:
Infiltrators Strike has a cooldown of 8s and allows to save up to 2 counters.
The fight starts, and the thief has those 2 charges available. He uses Infiltrators Strike and uses up one charge of Infiltrators Strike, and Infiltrators Strike goes on ‘cooldown’. 8 seconds later, this charge refills again. Retreat doesn’t use up a charge. So if the thief has to retreat within these 8 seconds of ‘cooldown’ he can retreat, but as he still has one charge left, can use Infiltrators Strike again. If he does, he uses his last charge of Infiltrators Strike. Now he has to wait until the cooldown is over, which will add a charge to Infiltrators Strike, until he can use that skill again. Since the over skills don’t share the same chargecounter, he is still allowed to use these skills.

Traitwise thief could get some of the more traditional traits, like cooldown reduction on certain weapons.
New, mechanic based trait could include bigger chargecounters for certain skills/slots (you can now save up to 3 charges for dual skills for example), instant recharge of a single charge when specific conditions are met etc.
It would also make weapon swapping more usefull, as the new skills would come with their own chargecounters.
Balancewise it allows for better finetuning (currently adding or removing 1 initiative of a skill changes everything of the weaponset) by modifying cooldowns on a per skill basis.
And of course, weaponskill wouldn’t be spamable and would on the same time not battle each other for limited ressources.

Swrd is fine the way it is

Med.6150:

Stof.9584:

Don’t forget to factor in:

S/D steals boons, so not only do you hit harder, the opponent just lost his protection and regen.
Besides, Backstab is burst/spike damage, while Sword has incredible sustain. It generally does way higher DPS in a longer fight.

Sword dealing more sustained damage than Dagger is a myth, which is based on the fact that autoattacks are slower and numbers are bigger. In terms of dps they are pretty much equal. Dagger Training will actually put Daggers ahead, that’s how close it is.

The main advantage of the sword is the cleave on the autoattack. Daggers on the other hand will leave your target permanently poisoned, which is quite strong.

dagger dps is FAR higher than sword’s.

Under 50% health ( where HS becomes also more rewarding) the difference is esponential.

People simply like to to cry on forums when something is annoying to fight against ( like mesmers, phantasm mesmers or P/D condi thieves) when actually they might even need some buffs.

OH dagger is terribad. Sword may even need some damage buff, and a thief seriously needs to be able to share stolen boons.

Actually S/D STILL NEEDS BUFFS TO BE ON PAR WITH A+ TIER PROFESSIONS like guardian, mesmer, ranger and engi ( with ele following closely).

Currently the thief ( D/P and S/D) is slightly superior than necro, which is slightly superior than war. The thief NEEDS BUFFS.

Stop complaining and l2p, seriously. All these whinings on forums are getting old and unnecessary.

Varonth.5830:

The problem is still, the initiative system. A hybrid of ‘initiative’ and cooldown would be much better in my opinion.
The problem with the initiative system is, that it not only allows spamming the same ability over and over, but it actively encourages a thief to do so. Since all skills share the same ressource, they basically battle for these ressources. If one skill is just marginal better, then you will just keep on using that skill, because why wasting limited ressources on something which does not do the job well.

The argument is sound, however, if we look at most thief weapons we can detect the following:

- There’s a prominent damage skill
- The other 3 skills are utility skills

The exception really is D/P with Heartseeker and Shadowshot being both prominent damage skills on the same weapon set.

So given this fact, I think that the issue goes beyond the initiative system and more towards the question “Why is it mostly more beneficial to spam the damage skill instead of the utility skills?”

S/D still needs buffs.
LS was overfed.

Varonth.5830:

The problem is still, the initiative system. A hybrid of ‘initiative’ and cooldown would be much better in my opinion.
The problem with the initiative system is, that it not only allows spamming the same ability over and over, but it actively encourages a thief to do so. Since all skills share the same resource, they basically battle for these resources. If one skill is just marginally better, then you will just keep on using that skill, because why wasting limited resources on something which does not do the job well.
Why should you throw a dagger on someone, if you can heartseeker/infiltrators strike jump spam him instead. Even if you miss with those 2 abilities, they place you next to the target, and allow you to keep hitting them with melee attacks.

Disregarding. Initiative is fine.

What is really impressive is that some people think that stealing 20 stacks of might is OP while being able to maintain it for 40 seconds, therefore giving the thief enough time to steal it, is completly fine. This community…

Asomal.6453:

What is really impressive is that some people think that stealing 20 stacks of might is OP while being able to maintain it for 40 seconds, therefore giving the thief enough time to steal it, is completly fine. This community…

What about stacking stealth in combo field smoke? This community…

dovrak.4376:

Asomal.6453:

What is really impressive is that some people think that stealing 20 stacks of might is OP while being able to maintain it for 40 seconds, therefore giving the thief enough time to steal it, is completly fine. This community…

What about stacking stealth in combo field smoke? This community…

While doing no damage to anyone. Now that’s hella OP!
Oh, are you talking about stacking for your team? Those 5 seconds at the cost of all your initiative are game changing I’m sure. Inb4 make smoke field an elite, is so stronk!

Asomal.6453:

What is really impressive is that some people think that stealing 20 stacks of might is OP while being able to maintain it for 40 seconds, therefore giving the thief enough time to steal it, is completly fine. This community…

No stealing 20 stack of might is not op.Being able to spam an ability that can steal 2 boon ,has evasion,cost only 4 ini ,is a gap closer,does good damage is the definition of something op..And people want this shared??! :S
This community..

Question on LS, does stealing a boon consider multiple stacks of might as ONE boon or will it only steal up to 2 stacks at a time?
IMO, it should only steal (on stack-able boons) up to 2 stacks a shot.

Asomal.6453:

dovrak.4376:

Asomal.6453:

What is really impressive is that some people think that stealing 20 stacks of might is OP while being able to maintain it for 40 seconds, therefore giving the thief enough time to steal it, is completly fine. This community…

What about stacking stealth in combo field smoke? This community…

While doing no damage to anyone. Now that’s hella OP!
Oh, are you talking about stacking for your team? Those 5 seconds at the cost of all your initiative are game changing I’m sure. Inb4 make smoke field an elite, is so stronk!

Initiative is a joke. Get initiative regen from traits/utilities and done. Not sure why I’m discussing this, there are lot of broken mechanisms that people just abuse.

dovrak.4376:

Asomal.6453:

dovrak.4376:

Asomal.6453:

What is really impressive is that some people think that stealing 20 stacks of might is OP while being able to maintain it for 40 seconds, therefore giving the thief enough time to steal it, is completly fine. This community…

What about stacking stealth in combo field smoke? This community…

While doing no damage to anyone. Now that’s hella OP!
Oh, are you talking about stacking for your team? Those 5 seconds at the cost of all your initiative are game changing I’m sure. Inb4 make smoke field an elite, is so stronk!

Initiative is a joke. Get initiative regen from traits/utilities and done. Not sure why I’m discussing this, there are lot of broken mechanisms that people just abuse.

Are you willing to trait for initiative regen, trading damage for it, just to stealth your team mates for a few seconds? And like I said, you can’t damage anyone in the process, else you get revelead.

kostbabis.8791:

Asomal.6453:

What is really impressive is that some people think that stealing 20 stacks of might is OP while being able to maintain it for 40 seconds, therefore giving the thief enough time to steal it, is completly fine. This community…

No stealing 20 stack of might is not op.Being able to spam an ability that can steal 2 boon ,has evasion,cost only 4 ini ,is a gap closer,does good damage is the definition of something op..And people want this shared??! :S
This community..

It does a bit more damage than the sword 3rd auto attack, so I’d say it does OK damage. And not everybody want it to share, just one person posting in this thread.

Mrbig.8019:

Med.6150:

Stof.9584:

Don’t forget to factor in:

S/D steals boons, so not only do you hit harder, the opponent just lost his protection and regen.
Besides, Backstab is burst/spike damage, while Sword has incredible sustain. It generally does way higher DPS in a longer fight.

Sword dealing more sustained damage than Dagger is a myth, which is based on the fact that autoattacks are slower and numbers are bigger. In terms of dps they are pretty much equal. Dagger Training will actually put Daggers ahead, that’s how close it is.

The main advantage of the sword is the cleave on the autoattack. Daggers on the other hand will leave your target permanently poisoned, which is quite strong.

dagger dps is FAR higher than sword’s.

Under 50% health ( where HS becomes also more rewarding) the difference is esponential.

People simply like to to cry on forums when something is annoying to fight against ( like mesmers, phantasm mesmers or P/D condi thieves) when actually they might even need some buffs.

OH dagger is terribad. Sword may even need some damage buff, and a thief seriously needs to be able to share stolen boons.

Actually S/D STILL NEEDS BUFFS TO BE ON PAR WITH A+ TIER PROFESSIONS like guardian, mesmer, ranger and engi ( with ele following closely).

Currently the thief ( D/P and S/D) is slightly superior than necro, which is slightly superior than war. The thief NEEDS BUFFS.

Stop complaining and l2p, seriously. All these whinings on forums are getting old and unnecessary.

LOL! kitten right MrBig, people cry on the forum when they lose to something…WAIT!

You’re the same MrBig who cried for months on this forum against D/D eles , cried so much until both auras got nerfed, RTL got nerfed and traits got nerfed!
But thief…not matter how many thieves we find in sPvP, WvWvW..thief will be always UP because he can die in zerker gear to 3 opponents in tPvP spamming aoe on a point?!
GIVE ME A FREAKING BREAK!

A weapon set with basically perma vigor, signet of energy, spammable evasion,teleport, daze, blind,cripple, immobilize is..UP?That must be why every thief, and his dog, cat, hamster, barber etc etc…run S/D

Ladies and Gentleman welcome to GW2, the most balanced and fun game of 2013…hold on do you play thief and mesmer right? No?..KK then I give you 2 options:

A) Uninstall and wait for ESO or some other game
B) Delete your profession and switch to thief or mesmer, because devs play them ( therefore you’ll never get nerfed…like never a serious nerf..NEVER) and because you automatically become a PRO

P.S I’ll prob get an infraction for this post…but I don’t care..at all!

Already stopped playing, got bored in the end to have to fight every day against hordes of mesmers and thieves, you don’t get a single sPvP match without thieves and mesmers in it, not a single tPvP without double mesmer or triple thief

You can’t leave base in WvWvW without getting ambushed by 2-3 thieves moving in group spamming that kittening flanking strike like the PRO they are or spamming blinding powder and HS for even more awesomess

But in the end..thieves are UP…:(

dovrak.4376:

Initiative is a joke. Get initiative regen from traits/utilities and done. Not sure why I’m discussing this, there are lot of broken mechanisms that people just abuse.

Yeah, go for x/x/x/30/30 for max ini regen together with RFI + IS ( blocking 2 of 3 Utilslots ) .
I will laugh at your dmg , compared to other specs or professions.

You either have high initiative regen OR high dmg.

As a thief you need 30Points in CS ( critical Strikes ) to deal dmg !
Try for yourself if you don’t belive me.

Arheundel.6451:

Mrbig.8019:

Med.6150:

Stof.9584:

Don’t forget to factor in:

S/D steals boons, so not only do you hit harder, the opponent just lost his protection and regen.
Besides, Backstab is burst/spike damage, while Sword has incredible sustain. It generally does way higher DPS in a longer fight.

Sword dealing more sustained damage than Dagger is a myth, which is based on the fact that autoattacks are slower and numbers are bigger. In terms of dps they are pretty much equal. Dagger Training will actually put Daggers ahead, that’s how close it is.

The main advantage of the sword is the cleave on the autoattack. Daggers on the other hand will leave your target permanently poisoned, which is quite strong.

dagger dps is FAR higher than sword’s.

Under 50% health ( where HS becomes also more rewarding) the difference is esponential.

People simply like to to cry on forums when something is annoying to fight against ( like mesmers, phantasm mesmers or P/D condi thieves) when actually they might even need some buffs.

OH dagger is terribad. Sword may even need some damage buff, and a thief seriously needs to be able to share stolen boons.

Actually S/D STILL NEEDS BUFFS TO BE ON PAR WITH A+ TIER PROFESSIONS like guardian, mesmer, ranger and engi ( with ele following closely).

Currently the thief ( D/P and S/D) is slightly superior than necro, which is slightly superior than war. The thief NEEDS BUFFS.

Stop complaining and l2p, seriously. All these whinings on forums are getting old and unnecessary.

LOL! kitten right MrBig, people cry on the forum when they lose to something…WAIT!

You’re the same MrBig who cried for months on this forum against D/D eles , cried so much until both auras got nerfed, RTL got nerfed and traits got nerfed!
But thief…not matter how many thieves we find in sPvP, WvWvW..thief will be always UP because he can die in zerker gear to 3 opponents in tPvP spamming aoe on a point?!
GIVE ME A FREAKING BREAK!

A weapon set with basically perma vigor, signet of energy, spammable evasion,teleport, daze, blind,cripple, immobilize is..UP?That must be why every thief, and his dog, cat, hamster, barber etc etc…run S/D

Ladies and Gentleman welcome to GW2, the most balanced and fun game of 2013…hold on do you play thief and mesmer right? No?..KK then I give you 2 options:

A) Uninstall and wait for ESO or some other game
B) Delete your profession and switch to thief or mesmer, because devs play them ( therefore you’ll never get nerfed…like never a serious nerf..NEVER) and because you automatically become a PRO

P.S I’ll prob get an infraction for this post…but I don’t care..at all!

Already stopped playing, got bored in the end to have to fight every day against hordes of mesmers and thieves, you don’t get a single sPvP match without thieves and mesmers in it, not a single tPvP without double mesmer or triple thief

You can’t leave base in WvWvW without getting ambushed by 2-3 thieves moving in group spamming that kittening flanking strike like the PRO they are or spamming blinding powder and HS for even more awesomess

But in the end..thieves are UP…:(

It is so touching. You totally made me cry.

Arheundel.6451:

Mrbig.8019:

dagger dps is FAR higher than sword’s.

Under 50% health ( where HS becomes also more rewarding) the difference is esponential.

People simply like to to cry on forums when something is annoying to fight against ( like mesmers, phantasm mesmers or P/D condi thieves) when actually they might even need some buffs.

OH dagger is terribad. Sword may even need some damage buff, and a thief seriously needs to be able to share stolen boons.

Actually S/D STILL NEEDS BUFFS TO BE ON PAR WITH A+ TIER PROFESSIONS like guardian, mesmer, ranger and engi ( with ele following closely).

Currently the thief ( D/P and S/D) is slightly superior than necro, which is slightly superior than war. The thief NEEDS BUFFS.

Stop complaining and l2p, seriously. All these whinings on forums are getting old and unnecessary.

LOL! kitten right MrBig, people cry on the forum when they lose to something…WAIT!

You’re the same MrBig who cried for months on this forum against D/D eles , cried so much until both auras got nerfed, RTL got nerfed and traits got nerfed!
But thief…not matter how many thieves we find in sPvP, WvWvW..thief will be always UP because he can die in zerker gear to 3 opponents in tPvP spamming aoe on a point?!
GIVE ME A FREAKING BREAK!

A weapon set with basically perma vigor, signet of energy, spammable evasion,teleport, daze, blind,cripple, immobilize is..UP?That must be why every thief, and his dog, cat, hamster, barber etc etc…run S/D

Ladies and Gentleman welcome to GW2, the most balanced and fun game of 2013…hold on do you play thief and mesmer right? No?..KK then I give you 2 options:

A) Uninstall and wait for ESO or some other game
B) Delete your profession and switch to thief or mesmer, because devs play them ( therefore you’ll never get nerfed…like never a serious nerf..NEVER) and because you automatically become a PRO

P.S I’ll prob get an infraction for this post…but I don’t care..at all!

Already stopped playing, got bored in the end to have to fight every day against hordes of mesmers and thieves, you don’t get a single sPvP match without thieves and mesmers in it, not a single tPvP without double mesmer or triple thief

You can’t leave base in WvWvW without getting ambushed by 2-3 thieves moving in group spamming that kittening flanking strike like the PRO they are or spamming blinding powder and HS for even more awesomess

But in the end..thieves are UP…:(

This is PvP forum. WvW forum is that way.

In tPvP the thief is by far inferior to top tier classes, but still is playable.

There’s a reason why those classes are up ahead, there’s a reason why S/D ele is still superior than the thief ( even D/D is superior, altough inferior to S/D) even after all the nerfs the ele received, and do you know what these reasons are ?

Because they offer more group utility. Because this is a team game and is based around a team.
The only worthwhile thing a thief brings on the table is shadow refuge.

You can cry all you want, ele nerfs were warranted and needed ( altough i may disagree with some of them) because ele was OP as kitten and even top ele players were laughing like crazy when they could facetank 3 people at far arriving there even before their opponents and simply leaving the fight to go contesting anywhere else when things were going bad, without getting punished for overextending.

I was crying about the ele and the ele got nerfed, and most top players were happy, just like i was.

Don’t you think that probably i was right ?

kostbabis.8791:

Mrbig i think you need to come down to earth…
Thief sharing stolen boons?So your teammates can run with 10 sec of prot and stability and 25 stack of might cause a poor guy activated an elite or you came across hgh or a staff guard?
Thief needs damage increase in sword????With those kittening boon stealing and evasion you need to hit more?It already hits WAY TOO MUCH for what else it can do.
Dagger offhand has 1 bad skill and that is number 4.They can do whatever they want with it after they balance the other skills.
I cant stop loling at the idea of a thief sharing boons..

Than you’ll lol even more when these things will happen. Jon Sharp and the balance team said 2 SOTG ago they’re goin not only to think about traits to share stolen boons, but also to rise thief base damage because it’s too low and it’s impossible to build a thief without going full squishy.

All these noob eles crying on the forum because S/D thief stole their boons are going to have bad days in the future i believe.

Remember, skilled S/D eles are one of the toughest fights for a S/D thief.

Sadly , ONLY SKILLED eles.

^ it will never gonna happen.Thief sharing the stolen boons when stealing those is so easy and spamable will never happen.
Tbh a lot of things you said never happened.Like s/d thief never been used at top level while jumper yesterday was showing it in its full glory.Anyway this is pointless..

@Mrbig
Rather than call use noobs…why don’t you PRO player, show us a video of you as ele against a s/d thief ?

I can bet 20g right now that the video will never come and you will keep calling people noobs while playing as “PRO” on the thief.

In all your awesomess you still mix valkrye ele, triple cantrip cleric ele, double arcana ele..all in the same spec, pls I’m looking forward to see you playing this awesome 30/30/30/30/30 spec with 6 utility slots.

In tPvP the thief is by far inferior to top tier classes, but still is playable.

http://www.twitch.tv/loljumper/b/410992947

I’ll keep waiting for you Mrbig to show me how to play ele, as apparently you’re so much better than me

Arheundel.6451:

@Mrbig
Rather than call use noobs…why don’t you PRO player, show us a video of you as ele against a s/d thief ?

I can bet 20g right now that the video will never come and you will keep calling people noobs while playing as “PRO” on the thief.

In all your awesomess you still mix valkrye ele, triple cantrip cleric ele, double arcana ele..all in the same spec, pls I’m looking forward to see you playing this awesome 30/30/30/30/30 spec with 6 utility slots.

you can see top S/D eles fighting against thieves on twitch anytime you want.

Take a look at phantaram, zoose, ultima and all other eles.

Regarding me, i occasionally fight against very good eles giving me hard fights while also occasionally run into very bad eles who don’t know what to dodge and miss their burst.

It’s all about the player.

kostbabis.8791:

^ it will never gonna happen.Thief sharing the stolen boons when stealing those is so easy and spamable will never happen.
Tbh a lot of things you said never happened.Like s/d thief never been used at top level while jumper yesterday was showing it in its full glory.Anyway this is pointless..

Lol then i believe Jon is totally clueless and says stupid things, because he said it and you can easily listen to him saying it.

And i never said “S/D will never be used at the top”, i simply said D/P is still superior in a coordinated team.

S/D is more selfish and stronger in 1vs1 situations, reason why it can be used easily in unorganized teams while doing good.

Jumper build is an absolute gimmick which has to totally sacrifice mobility and AoEs ( aka: shortbow) in order to be so strong 1vs1.

It’s EXTREMELY niche and has lot of drawbacks, something forum QQers tend to ignore most of the time.

“oh, that double S/D thief just killed me, now i’ll go to the other point, smash a couple of button and stack boons like crazy while forcing people out of the point with mad AoEs, HURR DURR”.

Just think for a second at what your class is capable of, instead of QQing on forums.

Yeah right…the rest of the eles are so bad that we don’t even know the difference between water and fire attunement, when I see a thief , I smash both hands on the keyboard and press randomly all buttons on the mouse…but when I see the thief is still alive that’s when I come to QQ on the forum -_-

Arheundel.6451:

Yeah right…the rest of the eles are so bad that we don’t even know the difference between water and fire attunement, when I see a thief , I smash both hands on the keyboard and press randomly all buttons on the mouse…but when I see the thief is still alive that’s when I come to QQ on the forum -_-

for all you thief’s so OP QQers – perhaps you should accept that most of your problems come from behind the keyboard

http://www.twitch.tv/teldoo/c/2367904

I play Thief and i agree OH Dagger, after nerf, is horrible

BUT

FS + LS give too much for not big cost in initiative, you have good damage, evade, 2 boon stolen (with unblockable hit) and the only thing you have to do is spam #3 with dodge in the middle. Only for 4 initiative cost in total.

Too easy and too high reward for this action, anet need to smooth this action, increasing initiative cost or only 1 boon stolen or hit can be blockable or less damage.

At the same time they can improve OH dagger to balance this nerf.

lvis.3824:

Arheundel.6451:

Yeah right…the rest of the eles are so bad that we don’t even know the difference between water and fire attunement, when I see a thief , I smash both hands on the keyboard and press randomly all buttons on the mouse…but when I see the thief is still alive that’s when I come to QQ on the forum -_-

for all you thief’s so OP QQers – perhaps you should accept that most of your problems come from behind the keyboard

http://www.twitch.tv/teldoo/c/2367904

Did you read the OP or even the title of the thread? By when dagger thief possess sword skills?….

Ty PRO thief, it seems you still need to learn how to differentiate dagger from sword

MarkPhilips.5169:

I play Thief and i agree OH Dagger, after nerf, is horrible

BUT

FS + LS give too much for not big cost in initiative, you have good damage, evade, 2 boon stolen (with unblockable hit) and the only thing you have to do is spam #3 with dodge in the middle. Only for 4 initiative cost in total.

Too easy and too high reward for this action, anet need to smooth this action, increasing initiative cost or only 1 boon stolen or hit can be blockable or less damage.

At the same time they can improve OH dagger to balance this nerf.

Honest thief players are rare but very welcome, I’m glad to see players of your kind

I don’t care about the boon stealing, it’s that perma evasion that is completely broken, signet of energy + FS and the thief practically can enter perma dodge state

I don’t know whether people understand that S/D as a set is much, much weaker in terms of survivability than D/P. All people see are S/D thieves with 30 in acrobatics dodging left and right. Guess what, you can spec 30 into acrobatics with D/P too. Try it and you will understand that the extra evade from FS isn’t exactly stronger than even a blind.

Having limited stealth capabilities, no blind and daze on demand, this weapon set needs to have that evade and it can not cost more than 3 (and still without the boon steal it would never have a shot), because else it’d not be in line with say Death Blossom or Disabling Shot (both evades last longer). The damage from larcenous, as posted above is pretty much up there with heartseeker and shadowshot as well.

If you take the boon stealing off this weapon set, there’s realistcally no point in utilizing it. Dropping it to a single boon steal isn’t going to shut up anybody either as it’s still “spammable”, according to some people.

MarkPhilips.5169:

I play Thief and i agree OH Dagger, after nerf, is horrible

BUT

FS + LS give too much for not big cost in initiative, you have good damage, evade, 2 boon stolen (with unblockable hit) and the only thing you have to do is spam #3 with dodge in the middle. Only for 4 initiative cost in total.

Too easy and too high reward for this action, anet need to smooth this action, increasing initiative cost or only 1 boon stolen or hit can be blockable or less damage.

At the same time they can improve OH dagger to balance this nerf.

Doesn’t need an ini boost.
Old FS wasn’t rewarding enough. New FS+LS is overfed and needs to come back to reality. Agree about /D.
S/D is getting overrated as hell though.

While people are talking sword.
Sword sets are all pure physical no condi damage and other than D/P scale the worst with their own class mechanic trait, brb zero condi damage to benefit from Trickery.

The vigor is not inherit to S/D and can be tossed on literally any thief set for the same effect. The only difference is a 4 ini cost which is brought into line with any other thief defense now that FS doesn’t cancel.