Guild Wars 2

I think anet might have broken something with chill dmg since last patch. or they plain overbuffed it. Actually pre-patch i thought it was already strong and needed a small nerf. But now it definitly needs the nerf. Pls nerf chill dmg.

realy 1500 dmg ? you call that OP ?

eles that can tank 3 players while spamming you for 3k dmg left and right nonstop with bilions of aoes i call that OP.

Can you provide more evidence than a tiny screenshot of one instance? Over on the Necro boards, they are talking about Chill doing roughly 700 damage per tick.

Zoltreez.6435:

realy 1500 dmg ? you call that OP ?

eles that can tank 3 players while spamming you for 3k dmg left and right nonstop with bilions of aoes i call that OP.

I’d call that OP, since it ticks every second.

tested with 1760 base condi damage, 25 vul stacks and 25 might… was ticking for 1100

either something was broken for you or bursting + corruption stack really makes such a huge difference?

oh and eles can’t tank 3 players nor will they spam 3k damage left and right…

Did the necro have 25 might stacks? Were you inflicted with Vulnerability? That is definitely not base damage chill, something’s going on here.

Yeah, this is weird, I just tried it and chill is doing around 600 damage in full condi gear.. with might and vulnerability you can get it up to 1k, but at that point burning/poison/bleeding are doing way more so it’s the least of your problems.

Jekkt.6045:

tested with 1760 base condi damage, 25 vul stacks and 25 might… was ticking for 1100

either something was broken for you or bursting + corruption stack really makes such a huge difference?

oh and eles can’t tank 3 players nor will they spam 3k damage left and right…

yes they do feelt like a bunker ele lol

Zoltreez.6435:

Jekkt.6045:

tested with 1760 base condi damage, 25 vul stacks and 25 might… was ticking for 1100

either something was broken for you or bursting + corruption stack really makes such a huge difference?

oh and eles can’t tank 3 players nor will they spam 3k damage left and right…

yes they do feelt like a bunker ele lol

you’re not making any sense..

Srsly? People seem to complain about everything these days.

When running a full condi build chill does 650 base dmg and just like Kharr stated it will be the least of your problems when the necro reaches high levels of might.

I’ve seen Engineers do 19k burn dmg in 3 ticks, if you want to complain about condis start there please and leave necros alone :P

DH is op, reaper oki.

LOL 1,5k…broken?
burning says hello.

the only possible way i could think of 1,5k chill being dangerous is if you made a very specific build with, Terror and Shivers of Dread in a terrormancer build, maybe throw in Dhuumfire

@Zoltreez.6435 yes i call that op, it constantly ticks because they have so many chill sources. Removing doesnt help. it gets constantly reapplied. Also this is not their only dmg source. Its a normal necro. Chill is more their soft cc instead of dmg source, well it was

@Cogbyrn.7283 it was just a standart rabid reaper build. mightstacking pushes it up to that number. he was alone (we were testing in an arena) so it was only his own mightstacks, no other sources. I honestly dont know how many vunerbility stacks i had. But keep in mind that Reaper can ez get 25 vunerbility stacks in 1v1 and also can get 20-25 mightstacks. This is insane in 1v1s (also in teamfights. but in 1v1 reaper will win everything now i guess). Perma chill is already hard (more cds on skill and well you cant disengage). This amout of dmg is too much imo

Liewec.2896:

LOL 1,5k…broken?
burning says hello.

burning is not constantly on you. At least not in an amout that does1,5k dmg. Also Burn guards only have burning as dmg source. not all other conditions like reapers do

edit: it was not a specific build. classic rabid reaper as eu reapers run it (proto, moldrak, posi). We tested it on our server. No courruption sigils or stuff. Classic reaper with might + vunerbility

Jekkt.6045:

Zoltreez.6435:

Jekkt.6045:

tested with 1760 base condi damage, 25 vul stacks and 25 might… was ticking for 1100

either something was broken for you or bursting + corruption stack really makes such a huge difference?

oh and eles can’t tank 3 players nor will they spam 3k damage left and right…

yes they do feelt like a bunker ele lol

you’re not making any sense..

These people have evidently never played ele lol. The ignorance spouting out of their mouths is astonishing.

Chill is most definitely broken. Not only was it already a really strong condition before the damage trait, there are a ridiculous number of sources of chill through sigils and runes in this game that reapers can just keep it on you permanently now. At 700 damage per tick, it only takes about 15 to 20 seconds for a reaper to faceroll any melee class.

The difference is that Chill only stacks to 5 or 6 seconds so you need to keep re-applying it. So technically spamming chill is actually not a great idea, unless you cover it with a bunch of other condis.

Anti.9156:

@Cogbyrn.7283 it was just a standart rabid reaper build. mightstacking pushes it up to that number. he was alone (we were testing in an arena) so it was only his own mightstacks, no other sources. I honestly dont know how many vunerbility stacks i had. But keep in mind that Reaper can ez get 25 vunerbility stacks in 1v1 and also can get 20-25 mightstacks. This is insane in 1v1s (also in teamfights. but in 1v1 reaper will win everything now i guess). Perma chill is already hard (more cds on skill and well you cant disengage). This amout of dmg is too much imo

How long does it take a Reaper to get 20-25 might stacks in 1v1? How long does it take a Reaper to get 25 vuln? If you let a Reaper spam Shround #1 on you, yes, Might and Vuln can be stacking quickly. Otherwise, what is hitting you that you can’t dodge? GS #3 stacks 12 vuln, but is fairly slow.

As others have said, by the time Chill is ticking for 1500 (I still want to see it for myself), you’re already in a world of hurt. Odds are, the burning from Shroud #1 alone (assuming a Dhuumfire condi spec) would be destroying you.

Also, it’s funny to say you can’t disengage from Chill. Necros always complain about how Chill doesn’t keep anyone from disengaging, because movement-based abilities are no longer affected at all by Chill in their speed/distance.

Necros already get balanced by super extreme cases that don’t really happen in a real situation. If you’re standing in an Arena, letting a Necro stack Might/Vuln for several seconds, in a full Condi spec, then Chill may tick for 1500. I’d need to see it for myself, not just some snippet of combat log completely taken out of context. But if that’s even the case, what about other classes that stack 25 might? What do they start doing to you?

Can you let any class do whatever it wants for 15+ seconds and expect to live? The whole idea behind Necromancer was a class that gets stronger as the fight goes on. That’s basically never been the case. It finally might be the case, but now chill damage (a condi that is removed by/reduced in duration by the largest number of skills/traits, I believe (I could be wrong)) is “broken”.

TL;DR: I disagree with your assessment.

Sorry for the double post, but I just ran a test. On the indestructible golem, with Rabid amulet, 25 might, and 25 vuln, Chill was ticking for about 1100 per tick.

Very curious how you see 1500.

@Cogbyrn.7283 for might stacks, it doesnt take the reaper long. signets and stuff push it fast. for vunerbility, it comes with the chill. 25 is quickly reached, but its obviously not always on you. As i said there was a standart rabid build. no GS3 or kitten like that. standart rabid. If you think its fine. wait till you get run over by condi necros. I just want to point out that i think its too strong and hope the developer keep an eye on it. hopefully nerf it before the pro league quailifier hits. Reaper already did 1 to 1,2 million dmg per game pre patch. It will be even more. combine that with their tankyness (deathshroud). Thats just too much

to clarify. When i say nerf it, i dont mean to totally gut it. Just shave it a tiny bit so its back in line. not a hard nerf that makes it unviable. But as it currently stands. I dont know what class can 1v1 condi reaper, so it needs a little nerf

Bring it in line with what? How much damage should it do at full Might/Vuln stacks? How much damage does Burning do at full Vuln/Might?

And how did you get it to do 1500 damage? I used a standard Rabid build and maxed my buffs/target’s debuffs.

The fact that you don’t know what can 1v1 a Condi Reaper doesn’t mean it needs a nerf. You admit that you don’t know, so why are you jumping to conclusions? Something out there probably can solo a Condi Reaper, and if not, then we need to figure out what exactly is making it so Condi Reaper is not 1v1able. If Chill did 200 less damage per second at 25 might and 25 vuln, would some class suddenly be able to 1v1 a Condi Reaper? From 1100 to 900 damage at that level? Or is that not really it?

Just tested now on Indestructible Golem,with 25x invul and 25x might chill was doing 1039 dmg. With same stats 5x stacks of burning doing 2600 dmg.

Tman.6349:

This would have to be some silly build including 25 might/vuln/corruption +Sigil of Bursting and Berserker Runes. I’m trying to think of ANYTHING else and drawing a blank, unless one of the other % modifiers has been bugged.

Edit: or thie snippet is taken from WvW, which would be more feasible.
Edit2: or Anet broke the scaling which doesn’t seem to be the case in other posters’ experiences.

Also taking that trait kills the reaper’s 1v1 sustain because they can’t take blighter’s boon.

I am really interested on how you hit 1500 chill damage

I tested a maxed condi damage reaper with a warrior helping maintain max might and vulnerability as well as providing strength banner and extra 150 condi damage from fury and the best chill tick was around 1405

The poor golem was not too happy

3k damage with the air overload? The ele run a zerk build so just one shot him and the problem is finish. Guys it´s hard to overload an element, you can esayli controle the ele or just go out of area. If you wan to speak about broken things with have a serious subject with a certain class

I think it was chill rune maybe which can do that dmg
Try it maybe

Chill should never do DoT. Its plain stupid.

average chill dmg seems to be around 1100, which in my opinion is too much. Seeing that the build brings enough damage condition even without chill.
It is already a bit too strong that this class ez can stack 25 vunerbility and 25 might on its own. This is dd-ele all over again

I finaly realized what made this 1500tick btw. It prolly was the last chill tick. Dmg of the last tick is added up together with the remaning time as far as im aware. So no wvw, corruption or anything else.
Pre patch Condi necs made around 700-900 dmg ticks with full 25 might. I think it was already really strong back than. Condi nec is already really tanky, and they still did above 1 million dmg per game in total. So i would like for anet to get it on a pre patch level again. With this patch it is about a 200dmg per second buff for reapers (perma chill—> from 700-900 to 900-1100). A buff for necro overall was not needed. Seeing that most of the new teams to compete for pro leagues all play with a necro now shows how strong necro even was pre patch (edit: teams CC, Boon, Exaltation, and we (pwn) wouldve played with one aswell, but sadly na-eu rule forced us to switch him out)

Anti.9156:

I finaly realized what made this 1500tick btw. It prolly was the last chill tick. Dmg of the last tick is added up together with the remaning time as far as im aware. So no wvw, corruption or anything else.

If that’s true, that’s really interesting. Thank you for highlighting it!

i have to test it again. I can only tell you that it was a normal arena with normal condi nec build. we didnt try to max it. We were just quickly testing the new dmg while waiting for our scrimm partners

would be fair if other classes would have acces to chill does damage too.

LastHope.8127:

would be fair if other classes would have acces to chill does damage too.

wow, unbelievably good logic here. hey why don’t we also give necros invulns, cause that would only be fair. but Then we could give death shroud to thieves cause reasons and then…

Gizmorage.6412:

LastHope.8127:

would be fair if other classes would have acces to chill does damage too.

wow, unbelievably good logic here. hey why don’t we also give necros invulns, cause that would only be fair. but Then we could give death shroud to thieves cause reasons and then…

Youre confusing unique game mechanics to a condition….

LastHope.8127:

Gizmorage.6412:

LastHope.8127:

would be fair if other classes would have acces to chill does damage too.

wow, unbelievably good logic here. hey why don’t we also give necros invulns, cause that would only be fair. but Then we could give death shroud to thieves cause reasons and then…

Youre confusing unique game mechanics to a condition….

Isn’t only Necros turning non-damaging conditions into damaging conditions a unique game mechanic?

LastHope.8127:

Gizmorage.6412:

LastHope.8127:

would be fair if other classes would have acces to chill does damage too.

wow, unbelievably good logic here. hey why don’t we also give necros invulns, cause that would only be fair. but Then we could give death shroud to thieves cause reasons and then…

Youre confusing unique game mechanics to a condition….

It’s unique game mechanic basicaly, same as traitable damage on Fear. However damage ticks on Chill are like a bad joke, they hit as hard as Terror, while Chill last for eternity.

have you never heard of dhuumice? it’s dhuumfire’s big brother. after the dhuumfire nerf it waited for the right time to enter the stage, now that the 10s chill duration skills are here everything’s perfect.

Jekkt.6045:

have you never heard of dhuumice? it’s dhuumfire’s big brother. after the dhuumfire nerf it waited for the right time to enter the stage, now that the 10s chill duration skills are here everything’s perfect.

Dhumfire is fine (it requires melee autos in DS to hit).
While Chill doesn’t, you can apply it with anything. Some people will say “chill doesn’t help in keeping people in melee”, even if so, 9/10 ChillReapers play without GS… and 10s of Chill is between 7-10k of damage.

Edit:
I think they should remove Chill DoT trait completly, move Dhum in it’s place (it’s good only for Reaper anyway) and give new GM trait for SoulReaping.

Morwath.9817:

LastHope.8127:

Gizmorage.6412:

LastHope.8127:

would be fair if other classes would have acces to chill does damage too.

wow, unbelievably good logic here. hey why don’t we also give necros invulns, cause that would only be fair. but Then we could give death shroud to thieves cause reasons and then…

Youre confusing unique game mechanics to a condition….

It’s unique game mechanic basicaly, same as traitable damage on Fear. However damage ticks on Chill are like a bad joke, they hit as hard as Terror, while Chill last for eternity.

And how is Terror doing right now…? Much effectiveness right?

Dhuumfire is terrible on base necro.

Morwath.9817:

Jekkt.6045:

have you never heard of dhuumice? it’s dhuumfire’s big brother. after the dhuumfire nerf it waited for the right time to enter the stage, now that the 10s chill duration skills are here everything’s perfect.

Dhumfire is fine (it requires melee autos in DS to hit).
While Chill doesn’t, you can apply it with anything. Some people will say “chill doesn’t help in keeping people in melee”, even if so, 9/10 ChillReapers play without GS… and 10s of Chill is between 7-10k of damage.

Edit:
I think they should remove Chill DoT trait completly, move Dhum in it’s place (it’s good only for Reaper anyway) and give new GM trait for SoulReaping.

seems like you never got to know old dhuumfire when it was released in 2013. it was the most broken thing back then. funny thing is, chill damage is stronger than old dhuumfire.

oh the powercreep.

@Morwath
Fortunately, I doubt Arena net after the BB is doing to be stupid enough to follow any of you guys terrible balance suggestions while burning is still around.

Sagat.3285:

And how is Terror doing right now…? Much effectiveness right?

You know why Terror isn’t performing right? There are actualy two reasons:
-> They messed trait lines and it’s just not worth to get all Terror (Fear) supporting traits without completly giving up on things that make Necro playable.
-> Power creep everywhere (it’s not competitive anymore, e.g. Chill is 10x better).

Jekkt.6045:

seems like you never got to know old dhuumfire when it was released in 2013. it was the most broken thing back then. funny thing is, chill damage is stronger than old dhuumfire.

Playing since release… but yeah, chill is stronger, so it will be fixed sooner or later, same as DH traps.

PlatinumMember.5274:

@Morwath
Fortunately, I doubt Arena net after the BB is doing to be stupid enough to follow any of you guys terrible balance suggestions while burning is still around.

Not sure if you’re serious. Aren’t you talking about guys who nearly nullifed all weaknesses of profession by just making one superior trait line that is required to stay competitive?
I doubt it too, mostly because how horrible balancing is going on lately (Blind on Druid overperforming? 400% nerf!).

Anti.9156:

I finaly realized what made this 1500tick btw. It prolly was the last chill tick. Dmg of the last tick is added up together with the remaning time as far as im aware. So no wvw, corruption or anything else.

Sadly, not true. Any partial seconds of Chill would be counted up and delivered 1 second later.

For example, a Chill doing 1k damage/tick that lasted 2.4 seconds would show the following in the combat log:

1,000
1,000
400

Although depending on when it was applied, you might get:
200
1,000
1,000
200

or

400
1,000
1,000.

You will not see:
1,000
1,400

So where that 1.5k tick came from is still a mystery. I don’t know if it’s possible without Corruption and Bursting sigils at max in PvP.

well again: no corrution sigils or anything like that. classic signet condi reaper with his kittening 25 might stacks. It also doesnt really matter where the 1,5k came from. In my opinion chill dmg shouldnt go above 1k. Chill is already a really hard condition to have on you. Longer cds and cant disengage. I really hope it gets shaved

May have been a double tick. I’ve seen Terror do over 2.5k in a single tick because it added two ticks together. Same with burning, where one tick will be something like 59 and the next will be 3k. Probably the same thing that happened here. What’s 750 + 750? 1,500. And 700 is a very achievable Chill tick.

lmfao this thread.
You do need to realize that it will only “possibly” hit that high if you get to 25 might and you have 25 vuln and that’s going to take quite some time. Not like we can keep the 25 might for long if so much as a clone taps our shoulder or a thief steals or god forbid another necro comes along and boop, its now a fat stack of weakness.
Need to realize that this game has always had specs that with counteract each other as well as synergize. It’s how team play in gw2 is formed. If a engi goes to a point that a necro holds, why do you waste your time? That’s like me going to try to 1v1 a diamond skin ele. Bang my head against a wall and eventually die regardless. So you have teammates +1 fights like this or rotate out so you can go somewhere else or hell just avoid that fight altogether and +1 another fight forcing a 4v5.
Basically this thread is like me coming on and going, I hate dskin eles because I can’t apply pressure as I lack the necessary power to break the threshhold through their sustain. It must be too strong. Yea I get annoyed, but I leave him and work around my weaknesses. Welcome to Gw2 Pvp.

SaintSnow.6593:

lmfao this thread.
You do need to realize that it will only “possibly” hit that high if you get to 25 might and you have 25 vuln and that’s going to take quite some time. Not like we can keep the 25 might for long if so much as a clone taps our shoulder or a thief steals or god forbid another necro comes along and boop, its now a fat stack of weakness.
Need to realize that this game has always had specs that with counteract each other as well as synergize. It’s how team play in gw2 is formed. If a engi goes to a point that a necro holds, why do you waste your time? That’s like me going to try to 1v1 a diamond skin ele. Bang my head against a wall and eventually die regardless. So you have teammates +1 fights like this or rotate out so you can go somewhere else or hell just avoid that fight altogether and +1 another fight forcing a 4v5.
Basically this thread is like me coming on and going, I hate dskin eles because I can’t apply pressure as I lack the necessary power to break the threshhold through their sustain. It must be too strong. Yea I get annoyed, but I leave him and work around my weaknesses. Welcome to Gw2 Pvp.

I like this logic.

‘’Chill damage seems to be too high.’’

‘’lol omg mate, don’t duel this spec then.’’

‘’??????’’

You should be complaining about Diamond skin, it’s quite dumb.

But I don’t because an ele is at a huge risk if he drops below 90%. So if a power class does that which isn’t too hard for them then conditions can be applied.
Tbh, if they didn’t have it they would die so much faster.

And I don’t talk from a duel perspective, I talk from a conquest perspective.

Anti.9156:

Liewec.2896:

LOL 1,5k…broken?
burning says hello.

burning is not constantly on you. At least not in an amout that does1,5k dmg. Also Burn guards only have burning as dmg source. not all other conditions like reapers do

edit: it was not a specific build. classic rabid reaper as eu reapers run it (proto, moldrak, posi). We tested it on our server. No courruption sigils or stuff. Classic reaper with might + vunerbility

Burning is something Reapers have decent access to now though since the RS auto attack is fast enough to maintain 5+ stacks of burning as long as you keep attacking which basically outpaces their other condi damage.

So just so we’re clear.

You’re complaining at what appears to be a single 1.5k chill tick, with no other real information in the screenshot and little other information other then “classic condition reaper”.

Did we all forget the 4-5k marauder autos with spinal shivers auto proc that can take away anyone at half health in one life blast?

If that’s been seen as fine for years then this chill, which you’ve not shown any more instances of it being that high, is fine.