Guild Wars 2

Bunkering shouldn’t be available through invulnerability, that includes evades.

There is no counterplay to invulnerability, especially with such abundant alacrity application.

A diamond skin ele, or a bunker gaurd (rip) are what bunker should be. There is counterplay.

are you telling us that diamond skin is fine ? and a good design ?

Jelzouki.4128:

Bunkering shouldn’t be available through invulnerability, that includes evades.

There is no counterplay to invulnerability, especially with such abundant alacrity application.

I guess this makes s/d daredevil even more OP then, since they have even more evade uptime.

Zoltreez.6435:

are you telling us that diamond skin is fine ? and a good design ?

I think so. From my experience, tempest protects and heals can be interrupted. Bunker mes however can’t because it is on all the time basically.

Shovel Face.4512:

Zoltreez.6435:

are you telling us that diamond skin is fine ? and a good design ?

I think so. From my experience, tempest protects and heals can be interrupted. Bunker mes however can’t because it is on all the time basically.

a single trait alone should NOT counter a whole build
even if it has counter play its still not ok.

Shovel Face.4512:

Zoltreez.6435:

are you telling us that diamond skin is fine ? and a good design ?

I think so. From my experience, tempest protects and heals can be interrupted. Bunker mes however can’t because it is on all the time basically.

Most of the protection that a tempest gives is from either insta-cast or passive auras, lol.

Diamond Skin IS fine. The problem is the kitten meta where condis are the only reliable way to deal damage to people so Diamond Skin naturally shines. Power builds are dead because of the abundance of “block block immune evade block invulnerable block chill block”.

RonDonJonVanDam.1289:

Power builds are dead because of the abundance of “block block immune evade block invulnerable block chill block”.

You do realise most of the stuff you just listed also affects condi builds right?

To a degree sure, that doesn’t change the fact the best damage classes in the game are the ones who mash out AoE condi fields with the exception of DH.

Random Weird Guy.3528:

RonDonJonVanDam.1289:

Power builds are dead because of the abundance of “block block immune evade block invulnerable block chill block”.

You do realise most of the stuff you just listed also affects condi builds right?

Not the same since power builds generally rely on big hitters and cc chains where condi builds can just spam constantly and don’t really rely much on damage cooldowns.

Jelzouki.4128:

A diamond skin ele, There is counterplay.

Say that to a full condition build.

Jelzouki.4128:

Bunkering shouldn’t be available through invulnerability, that includes evades.

There is no counterplay to invulnerability, especially with such abundant alacrity application.

A diamond skin ele, or a bunker gaurd (rip) are what bunker should be. There is counterplay.

I facepalmed when i read this.

Invun = Does not contribute to point capping.

Reduced block duration too.

And you guys are still whining?

HOW?

StickerHappy.8052:

Jelzouki.4128:

Bunkering shouldn’t be available through invulnerability, that includes evades.

There is no counterplay to invulnerability, especially with such abundant alacrity application.

A diamond skin ele, or a bunker gaurd (rip) are what bunker should be. There is counterplay.

I facepalmed when i read this.

Invun = Does not contribute to point capping.

Reduced block duration too.

And you guys are still whining?

HOW?

because they try to 1v1 it while at the same time never play it to learn how to counter play it

power mesmer has better chance to win atm versus bunker mes 1v1. also a good thief or any fast condi spamm class if they learn the mesmer rotation.

ppl seem to want mesmer out of the support meta and left out with guard and staff ele (btw staff ele become in some way better than support mesmer)

we shall see what anet think in 30 days

Trigr.6481:

Jelzouki.4128:

A diamond skin ele, There is counterplay.

Say that to a full condition build.

Why are you playing full condi to start with?….

Zoltreez.6435:

Shovel Face.4512:

Zoltreez.6435:

are you telling us that diamond skin is fine ? and a good design ?

I think so. From my experience, tempest protects and heals can be interrupted. Bunker mes however can’t because it is on all the time basically.

a single trait alone should NOT counter a whole build
even if it has counter play its still not ok.

If you played Ele enough you would know its not Diamond skin that causes the problems…

I wonder if condition builds would find fighting an Ele easier if the Ele didnt have protection spams and -67% damage negation from physical hits. I wonder if that would make it easier to hit an ele for 1,700 damage to drop below the DS threshold.

Just a thought.

Diamond Skin needs to go

I agree that chronobunkers are still a bit too strong vs most builds.

At the same time…Diamond Skin is NOT what bunkers should be. It’s blatantly overpowered.

Supreme.3164:

Trigr.6481:

Jelzouki.4128:

A diamond skin ele, There is counterplay.

Say that to a full condition build.

Why are you playing full condi to start with?….

In what part of my previous statement do you see a word related to me playing a full condition build?

Chrono bunkers are killable in a team fight.

Tempest bunkers on the otherhand….

Viele leute sucht neue spiel , weil , kein fair … Es gibt nur 5 klass ele guard necro mesmer und engi …. Im pvp oder wvw nur 5 klass .
Ok guild wars 2 die andere 4 klass löschen sie [ war, revenant , tief , ranger ] alle leute spielt nur diese 5 klass …. Das ist mega unsinn ….geben sie zurück meine alles geld bitte … Mein geld mein item meine zeit und mein energie ist jetzt tot …
Seit 3 jahre mache ich diese power item … 5 legendary , alle ascended item und astralaria alles jetzt tot … Sorryy …
Was fur ein recht ist das ? Ein guard er hat rare item er ist neue spieler er kann nicht gut spielen aber er jann mich nur mit trap und longbow töten was ist loss .v? Guild wars ist jetzt guard wars 2 oder condi wars 2 … Meine viele kollege hat diese spiel gelöscht wegen diese idiote un fair … Und viele sucht neue spiel … Wo ist unsere arbeit ? Weg … Sorry

Ross Biddle.2367:

Chrono bunkers are killable in a team fight.

Tempest bunkers on the otherhand….

So are you telling me tempest bunkers are unkillable in a TEAM fight?

If you are, something is clearly wrong

Atm chronobunker shouldn’t be a priority in nerfing, there are clearly other builds that can survive well while do something outside of ressing downed players.

Aurashare celes tempest can provide excellent team healing while giving protections, regen and many aura that could change team fights (namely shocking aura), while doing moderate damage to people using overcharges. Other ele skills that was dominating the previous meta still stands, so really they’re still bruisers with bunker survivability. Couple those aura heals with DS and damage mitigations (40% from spammable protections, 10% from close range trait, 10% from frost aura) and you’ll have a great 1v1 bunker. They can die in focus fire in teamfight though, but their boons and auras can provide a lot of attacking opportunities for their teammate.

Chronobunker can only really stay alive and res downed people, and before you ask for more nerf in Precog, it doesn’t have that much uptimes in battle. Chronobunker still lack the punching power to down a player by themselves or in team, especially if you have competent players in opponent team. Their alacrity share is unreliable and inconsistent in a mobile team fight, especially if the cap point is large or opponent decide to drag the fighting ground wider. It is true that chronobunkers are harder to kill than tempest in a teamfight, but by now you would’ve think people will stop focus fire on bunker when there are other more deadly opponents around.

So in the end aurashare celestial eles provide a lot of offensive supports in teamfight while bunker mesmer only have a handful of skills to offer for offensive. Indeed chronobunkers give a lot of defensive options but the fight will often end in a landslide when other teammates messed up or get focus on. As for 1v1, I’d argue that both can handle them very well but chronobunker will clearly failed at killing any competent people.

It is worthwhile to say that the current meta stands partly because viper rev and marauder engi has excellent survivability AND damage at the same time. It is quite rare for competent players to fall easily and quickly. When they do get downed they only need chronobunker to pick them up once or twice before recovering into long and frustrating sustain fights. If glasscannons fall quickly and frequently when focused on then a single precog or even time warp won’t matters much in the end, and chronobunker will lose one of its major roles in the meta.

Chronobunker is fine tough. It’s not completely unkillable like the new DS auramancer. 2 guys should be enough. sometimes the trick doesn’t lie in killing it rather in keeping them busy. It hits like a wet noodle. And can’t do anything else then support. even bunker tempest now can hit you for 3 to 4 burn stacks if you don’t watch out.

It can be focused down. When you are having a skirmish have a few of them keep the mesmer busy so that it cannot spam boons or well of precognition. It’s thier CC and wells that kitten you up. keep them busy and you are good imo.

Xanctus The Dragonslayer.2318:

Chronobunker is fine tough. It’s not completely unkillable like the new DS auramancer. 2 guys should be enough. sometimes the trick doesn’t lie in killing it rather in keeping them busy. It hits like a wet noodle. And can’t do anything else then support. even bunker tempest now can hit you for 3 to 4 burn stacks if you don’t watch out.

It can be focused down. When you are having a skirmish have a few of them keep the mesmer busy so that it cannot spam boons or well of precognition. It’s thier CC and wells that kitten you up. keep them busy and you are good imo.

Again with the unkillable DS auramancer, I have never seen of these.

Can you enlighten me?

Tempest can be focused down, are we even playing the same game?

don t forget about scrapper kittened sustain on marauder.

It would be pretty interesting see how the pro league would actually be a lot more enjoyable to watch if chronobunker wasn’t a thing. You wouldn’t have two chronobunks on each point with a portal ensuring everyones survival. It’s just ridiculous, if you can’t see this problem then you’re part of the problem.

Where is the window of opportunity to kill this build????

bunkering with evades and invulnerability is just so broken.

take a look at bunker gaurd, its bunkering was based on small burst heals and blocks.

for christ sakes how can you not see this???? alacrity + invulnerabilities = cancer

Jelzouki.4128:

It would be pretty interesting see how the pro league would actually be a lot more enjoyable to watch if chronobunker wasn’t a thing. You wouldn’t have two chronobunks on each point with a portal ensuring everyones survival. It’s just ridiculous, if you can’t see this problem then you’re part of the problem.

Where is the window of opportunity to kill this build????

bunkering with evades and invulnerability is just so broken.

take a look at bunker gaurd, its bunkering was based on small burst heals and blocks.

for christ sakes how can you not see this???? alacrity + invulnerabilities = cancer

YOU CANNOT BUNKER A POINT WITH INVULN

I quoted you multiple times yet you still ignore it, l2p issue or?

StickerHappy.8052:

Ross Biddle.2367:

Chrono bunkers are killable in a team fight.

Tempest bunkers on the otherhand….

So are you telling me tempest bunkers are unkillable in a TEAM fight?

If you are, something is clearly wrong

Team vs Tempest, you can force him off point.

Team vs Tempest with supporting team, he should be fine.

Regardless, the Tempest can always go Pink Panther: Exit, stage right poof

One thing I find annoying in this meta is that everybody is well into their “meta” builds. So when you throw two immovable objects at eachother you get obvious results. Of course solo you’re stuck with the luck of the draw. Meanwhile on the otherhand, if you had a couple of unstoppable forces come at the one immovable object, you can start getting somewhere.

but… it… rarely… happens -_-u

StickerHappy.8052:

Jelzouki.4128:

It would be pretty interesting see how the pro league would actually be a lot more enjoyable to watch if chronobunker wasn’t a thing. You wouldn’t have two chronobunks on each point with a portal ensuring everyones survival. It’s just ridiculous, if you can’t see this problem then you’re part of the problem.

Where is the window of opportunity to kill this build????

bunkering with evades and invulnerability is just so broken.

take a look at bunker gaurd, its bunkering was based on small burst heals and blocks.

for christ sakes how can you not see this???? alacrity + invulnerabilities = cancer

YOU CANNOT BUNKER A POINT WITH INVULN

I quoted you multiple times yet you still ignore it, l2p issue or?

I call it selective reading or verbal regurgitation.

Staying in Precog for 3 sec can make you lose 70% of the cap, once you decapped the point from bunker mesmer then that mesmer lose its purpose in fighting you, as bunker mesmer can’t capture point even against zerker opponents.

And no, if mesmer is gone pro league will simply try to find another bunker build to counter other meta builds. Bunker build have always existed in capture the point, and it continues to be the staple of PvP meta, don’t tell me you don’t know we had 4 celestial ele stacking in the past.

Zoltreez.6435:

Shovel Face.4512:

Zoltreez.6435:

are you telling us that diamond skin is fine ? and a good design ?

I think so. From my experience, tempest protects and heals can be interrupted. Bunker mes however can’t because it is on all the time basically.

a single trait alone should NOT counter a whole build
even if it has counter play its still not ok.

It does not counter a whole build. And I say that as a condition reaper main.

In teamfights, it’s extremely easy to beat the threshhold and then condi nuke him and kitten him up, they have a pretty hard time dealing with condis once they’re applied.
Same kitten if you have another teammate with you on a 2v2.
Only time it hardcounters your whole build is if you’re 1v1ing him, but why the kitten would you be 1v1ing a bunker anyway ?

Random Weird Guy.3528:

RonDonJonVanDam.1289:

Power builds are dead because of the abundance of “block block immune evade block invulnerable block chill block”.

You do realise most of the stuff you just listed also affects condi builds right?

I think most people in this game think condis just apply randomly, and not via dodgeable attacks.

And to answer the topic as a whole, both bunkers are fine, biggest balance issue atm is rev and scrapper who have way too much survivability with a glasscanon amulet (while also having quite decent team support because why the kitten not ?).
The only thing that bugs me with those bunkers is that they’re actually quite mobile. Imo a bunker should be god awfull at rotating, like bunker guard used to be.

Zoltreez.6435:

are you telling us that diamond skin is fine ? and a good design ?

yeah indeed, at least now if a chrono bunker tries to invlun all the time he actually loose the cap point. DS eles, for a condi build, are just kitten annoying, especially because that’s combined with an insane regeneration and heal…

Jelzouki.4128:

It would be pretty interesting see how the pro league would actually be a lot more enjoyable to watch if chronobunker wasn’t a thing. You wouldn’t have two chronobunks on each point with a portal ensuring everyones survival. It’s just ridiculous, if you can’t see this problem then you’re part of the problem.

Where is the window of opportunity to kill this build????

bunkering with evades and invulnerability is just so broken.

take a look at bunker gaurd, its bunkering was based on small burst heals and blocks.

for christ sakes how can you not see this???? alacrity + invulnerabilities = cancer

Watch EU matches then, double chrono was never standard in EU. Double rev was everywhere though, hilariously the team that had 2 chronos in EU was usually the one that lost.

StickerHappy.8052:

Xanctus The Dragonslayer.2318:

Chronobunker is fine tough. It’s not completely unkillable like the new DS auramancer. 2 guys should be enough. sometimes the trick doesn’t lie in killing it rather in keeping them busy. It hits like a wet noodle. And can’t do anything else then support. even bunker tempest now can hit you for 3 to 4 burn stacks if you don’t watch out.

It can be focused down. When you are having a skirmish have a few of them keep the mesmer busy so that it cannot spam boons or well of precognition. It’s thier CC and wells that kitten you up. keep them busy and you are good imo.

Again with the unkillable DS auramancer, I have never seen of these.

Can you enlighten me?

Tempest can be focused down, are we even playing the same game?

I might have exagarated there. But figthing an DS auramancer on point is arguebly a tougher job then focusing down an bunker chronomancer. get your stunbreaks and stability ready and focus them down. they have no such things as DS or the heals like the elementalist. they have a few blocks and invulnerbalities but that’s really it. tanky, sure. but definately easier to kill then an auramancer.

U can argue chronobunker on point in a 1 v 1 is harder to kill

but in a teamfight on mid. aurmancer has the advantage and since they are both support u actually will have a harder time killing them in a skirmish.

dank.3680:

Random Weird Guy.3528:

RonDonJonVanDam.1289:

Power builds are dead because of the abundance of “block block immune evade block invulnerable block chill block”.

You do realise most of the stuff you just listed also affects condi builds right?

Not the same since power builds generally rely on big hitters and cc chains where condi builds can just spam constantly and don’t really rely much on damage cooldowns.

Thats.. not true at all. This is like saying power builds can spam constantly because of the existance of an auto-attack and complaining that i dont have aegis one a 1sec cd to block every auto.

Jelzouki.4128:

A diamond skin ele, ..(snip)…… are what bunker should be. There is counterplay.

OP Lost all credibility after writing this.

Jackalrat.5493:

I agree that chronobunkers are still a bit too strong vs most builds.

At the same time…Diamond Skin is NOT what bunkers should be. It’s blatantly overpowered.

But that’s the crazy part, more people were crying for Chronobunker to be nerfed than DS Ele, I guess those players all have an ele alt. It’s ok for ele to remain in meta, but not for mesmers. Pathetic community, I must say.

rchu.8945:

Jackalrat.5493:

I agree that chronobunkers are still a bit too strong vs most builds.

At the same time…Diamond Skin is NOT what bunkers should be. It’s blatantly overpowered.

But that’s the crazy part, more people were crying for Chronobunker to be nerfed than DS Ele, I guess those players all have an ele alt. It’s ok for ele to remain in meta, but not for mesmers. Pathetic community, I must say.

Oh please, like chronobunk is the only viable mesmer build that exists even right now. It’s probably the best in 5-man premades (although how much of that is due to lack of innovation and how much is build power is up for argument, given that it was available on release and yet still took over a month to become meta), but there’s other viable builds out there. Doubly so if the celebunker meta (which is a pre HoT problem but HoT exacerbated it) is pushed out of favour.

However, as has been said, chronobunk in its original form is bad at actually HOLDING points now. You can change well to something more oriented for offensive support, and lose the invuln chaining (oh noez, my mesmer actually needs endurance now), or you can lose the point. I think DF ele needs tuning down first, then reassess chronobunk performance.

However, on the topic of ele, at least nearly all the ele defense is actually active. Yes, it’s trait boosted, but it requires them to actually take actions. Hence why TUNING down is required, rather than blasting it with the Nerfhammer V2k.

rchu.8945:

Jackalrat.5493:

I agree that chronobunkers are still a bit too strong vs most builds.

At the same time…Diamond Skin is NOT what bunkers should be. It’s blatantly overpowered.

But that’s the crazy part, more people were crying for Chronobunker to be nerfed than DS Ele, I guess those players all have an ele alt. It’s ok for ele to remain in meta, but not for mesmers. Pathetic community, I must say.

It’s the same thing with Condi builds and Dragonhunter. DS and aura sharing are excellent counters and with these Ele’s pushed DH and all Condi builds except mallyx out of the meta, but if you take Ele out of the picture for just a few weeks it’s the end of the world.

StickerHappy.8052:

Jelzouki.4128:

It would be pretty interesting see how the pro league would actually be a lot more enjoyable to watch if chronobunker wasn’t a thing. You wouldn’t have two chronobunks on each point with a portal ensuring everyones survival. It’s just ridiculous, if you can’t see this problem then you’re part of the problem.

Where is the window of opportunity to kill this build????

bunkering with evades and invulnerability is just so broken.

take a look at bunker gaurd, its bunkering was based on small burst heals and blocks.

for christ sakes how can you not see this???? alacrity + invulnerabilities = cancer

YOU CANNOT BUNKER A POINT WITH INVULN

I quoted you multiple times yet you still ignore it, l2p issue or?

Please tell me how to l2p against a chronobunker lol.

So if the mesmer is unkillable in solo q does that make it OP? In my book, yes.

It doesn’t matter if the point is uncontested you are simply going to waste the time of others trying to kill you. I’m not saying I’m that person but it is surely going to lay waste to bad solo q’ers. What if you have 2 chronobunkers? Both with portal, what then? Tell me how to l2p against that lol. Jeez can you provide some truthful words? Because apparently in your book unkillable is not a bunker. With all the alacrity application the window of opportunity is so small. A bunker should die to bunker buster builds such as condi reapers.

how to kill a chronobunker?
just dont
if he alone contest a point he cant support his team. so take 1 ally to have eyes on him like rev or thief (class with good mobility) – fight 4v5 on other point if the mesmer leaves than fast decap/cap freely
also 1 person should pressure him even if he cant kill him it cant ruine his shatter or rotations. if he use wop great cant contest
if the point uncontested great for you as he cant bunker the point on his terms (but he can use more freely wop for his team)

my team does fast focus rotation. we pressure the support (ele or mesmer) than only 1 still focus them. the other focus the dmg dealer which usually leave his down or run away as the support class cant do kitten. if the support mamange to heal/clease or res we pressyre the bunker again and he will die as he used all his utilities/skills
if done fast and right you will win

also as bunker mes i was down 1v1 versus good shatter mesmer. he knew what i am going to use and manage to kill me. so i back to power shatter and its doable to kill bunker mesmer 1v1 if they trying to hold the point.

messiah.1908:

who to kill a chronobunker?
just dont
if he alone contest a point he cant support his team. so take 1 ally to have eyes on him like rev or thief (class with good mobility) – fight 4v5 on other point if the mesmer leaves than fast decap/cap freely
also 1 person should pressure him even if he cant kill him it cant ruine his shatter or rotations. if he use wop great cant contest
if the point uncontested great for you as he cant bunker the point on his terms (but he can use more freely wop for his team)

This gave me a good laugh. Bunker Mesmers take Portal in order to protect points while matching numbers across the map or to force the other team to effectively fight 4v5 across the map instead.

Good luck doing this to a good Bunker Mesmer when he has a skill with the sole purpose of doing it to you way easier and faster instead.

Velimere.7685:

messiah.1908:

who to kill a chronobunker?
just dont
if he alone contest a point he cant support his team. so take 1 ally to have eyes on him like rev or thief (class with good mobility) – fight 4v5 on other point if the mesmer leaves than fast decap/cap freely
also 1 person should pressure him even if he cant kill him it cant ruine his shatter or rotations. if he use wop great cant contest
if the point uncontested great for you as he cant bunker the point on his terms (but he can use more freely wop for his team)

This gave me a good laugh. Bunker Mesmers take Portal in order to protect points while matching numbers across the map or to force the other team to effectively fight 4v5 across the map instead.

Good luck doing this to a good Bunker Mesmer when he has a skill with the sole purpose of doing it to you way easier and faster instead.

than check your team dmg and sustain. as lets say thief try to decap and mesmer now fight you 4v5 mid. as long as your team burst is fast and good you will be manage to down in 3 sec anyone. now the mesmer need to think should i port back to contest or res.

as you see the problem is not with mesmer or portal. again 2/3 of bunker mesmer trait line was before HOT. only wells and chrono trait line with just alacrity came. if its make bunker mes op than it should make power mes op or condi mes op . and it doesnt!.
the problem ppl still dont learn how to rotate and focus fire fast.
when oyu had bunker guard sitting on point you just ignore it . you could see power mes with portal port him to other point and didnt complain.

all i am saying now the problem is not with mesmer. rather with other class who can do dmg and sustain and support like ele, engi and druid (little bit) while full dmg dealer cant handle them like thief, power mes, etc…
when you see more balance in the power/sustain creep you will see more diversity and less bunkering a point

Stop being funny like that or I’ll give you a red nose
Invulnerability making mesmer OP
OMG
while ele is fine
PLEASE I’M DYING STOP!

Nowadays, a bunker mesmer cannot do anything but bunk his point and rez allies.
He’s as hard as steel but he hits like a wet noodle…
But yeah, mesmer is still OP, because why not!

so your saying we should be all be auramancer Then right like that Anit op or thing.

Belial.9350:

Jelzouki.4128:

Bunkering shouldn’t be available through invulnerability, that includes evades.

There is no counterplay to invulnerability, especially with such abundant alacrity application.

I guess this makes s/d daredevil even more OP then, since they have even more evade uptime.

The well give you PERMA evasion as long as you stand in it. With perma i mean, no ‘vulnerable windows, while the well is up’.

Every thief evasion skill has a forcast and aftercast. Both of them make you vulnerable.

If a thief uses Vault in the elite well of mesmer (triple CC), he will 80% of times still get hit because of this, even if he keeps spamming it.

Counterplay to mesmer well? Noone. Counterplay to thief? Excellent timing of skills (I admit it’s not always easy). Second counter play: run them out of initiative (no more evade spam usually then).

Ele just need a melee class focussing him a little, then when he’s below tresshold (wich is really easy to reach) you ask on your team ‘condi burst this target plz’. Ele death.

I admit in some team comps with infinite party heals/evades/supports, that Ele can feel to strong. But I think bringing all the bunkers meta’s down a notch alone, would break the feeling Diamond skin is op. No support = Ele can’t keep up diamond = wet noodle against coordinated bursts.

medusashadow.3567:

so your saying we should be all be auramancer Then right like that Anit op or thing.

If we all the same class, then nothing is OP, right?

Phoebe Ascension.8437:

Belial.9350:

Jelzouki.4128:

Bunkering shouldn’t be available through invulnerability, that includes evades.

There is no counterplay to invulnerability, especially with such abundant alacrity application.

I guess this makes s/d daredevil even more OP then, since they have even more evade uptime.

The well give you PERMA evasion as long as you stand in it. With perma i mean, no ‘vulnerable windows, while the well is up’.

Every thief evasion skill has a forcast and aftercast. Both of them make you vulnerable.

If a thief uses Vault in the elite well of mesmer (triple CC), he will 80% of times still get hit because of this, even if he keeps spamming it.

Counterplay to mesmer well? Noone. Counterplay to thief? Excellent timing of skills (I admit it’s not always easy). Second counter play: run them out of initiative (no more evade spam usually then).

Ele just need a melee class focussing him a little, then when he’s below tresshold (wich is really easy to reach) you ask on your team ‘condi burst this target plz’. Ele death.

I admit in some team comps with infinite party heals/evades/supports, that Ele can feel to strong. But I think bringing all the bunkers meta’s down a notch alone, would break the feeling Diamond skin is op. No support = Ele can’t keep up diamond = wet noodle against coordinated bursts.

Where do you come from? two weeks ago?
The Well as been NERFED It’s now an INVULNERABILITY which means that any mesmer still using it on an owned point LOSE THE CAP
is that clear enough, now?
A bunker mesmer is currently much more in line than a Diamond Skin Ele…

messiah.1908:

Velimere.7685:

messiah.1908:

who to kill a chronobunker?
just dont
if he alone contest a point he cant support his team. so take 1 ally to have eyes on him like rev or thief (class with good mobility) – fight 4v5 on other point if the mesmer leaves than fast decap/cap freely
also 1 person should pressure him even if he cant kill him it cant ruine his shatter or rotations. if he use wop great cant contest
if the point uncontested great for you as he cant bunker the point on his terms (but he can use more freely wop for his team)

This gave me a good laugh. Bunker Mesmers take Portal in order to protect points while matching numbers across the map or to force the other team to effectively fight 4v5 across the map instead.

Good luck doing this to a good Bunker Mesmer when he has a skill with the sole purpose of doing it to you way easier and faster instead.

than check your team dmg and sustain. as lets say thief try to decap and mesmer now fight you 4v5 mid. as long as your team burst is fast and good you will be manage to down in 3 sec anyone. now the mesmer need to think should i port back to contest or res.

as you see the problem is not with mesmer or portal. again 2/3 of bunker mesmer trait line was before HOT. only wells and chrono trait line with just alacrity came. if its make bunker mes op than it should make power mes op or condi mes op . and it doesnt!.
the problem ppl still dont learn how to rotate and focus fire fast.
when oyu had bunker guard sitting on point you just ignore it . you could see power mes with portal port him to other point and didnt complain.

all i am saying now the problem is not with mesmer. rather with other class who can do dmg and sustain and support like ele, engi and druid (little bit) while full dmg dealer cant handle them like thief, power mes, etc…
when you see more balance in the power/sustain creep you will see more diversity and less bunkering a point

From what little I can understand of your post, I’m starting to think we’re not even playing at the same level here. In the first place, I don’t even run into Thieves at high MMR diamond division where I constantly end up facing ESL premades.

I did beat Caed back when I was in sapphire division, though. That was pretty easy.

Bunker mesmer is turret engi 3.0.. Its brainless and too OP for what’s supposed to do (bunker while it can dps/pressure teamfights too much)

Velimere.7685:

messiah.1908:

Velimere.7685:

messiah.1908:

who to kill a chronobunker?
just dont
if he alone contest a point he cant support his team. so take 1 ally to have eyes on him like rev or thief (class with good mobility) – fight 4v5 on other point if the mesmer leaves than fast decap/cap freely
also 1 person should pressure him even if he cant kill him it cant ruine his shatter or rotations. if he use wop great cant contest
if the point uncontested great for you as he cant bunker the point on his terms (but he can use more freely wop for his team)

This gave me a good laugh. Bunker Mesmers take Portal in order to protect points while matching numbers across the map or to force the other team to effectively fight 4v5 across the map instead.

Good luck doing this to a good Bunker Mesmer when he has a skill with the sole purpose of doing it to you way easier and faster instead.

than check your team dmg and sustain. as lets say thief try to decap and mesmer now fight you 4v5 mid. as long as your team burst is fast and good you will be manage to down in 3 sec anyone. now the mesmer need to think should i port back to contest or res.

as you see the problem is not with mesmer or portal. again 2/3 of bunker mesmer trait line was before HOT. only wells and chrono trait line with just alacrity came. if its make bunker mes op than it should make power mes op or condi mes op . and it doesnt!.
the problem ppl still dont learn how to rotate and focus fire fast.
when oyu had bunker guard sitting on point you just ignore it . you could see power mes with portal port him to other point and didnt complain.

all i am saying now the problem is not with mesmer. rather with other class who can do dmg and sustain and support like ele, engi and druid (little bit) while full dmg dealer cant handle them like thief, power mes, etc…
when you see more balance in the power/sustain creep you will see more diversity and less bunkering a point

From what little I can understand of your post, I’m starting to think we’re not even playing at the same level here. In the first place, I don’t even run into Thieves at high MMR diamond division where I constantly end up facing ESL premades.

I did beat Caed back when I was in sapphire division, though. That was pretty easy.

Eh, bit weird to say it was easy when you only got 10 points from a whole game. He might have farmed you the whole game and your team might’ve carried you..