Guild Wars 2

Condi Thief is OP. Source: I’m in top 10 NA using S/D condi thief. Of course im also ridiculously good at the game, but it’s broken. I’m not even good at thief, I main warrior, its just that warr is so nerfed that im forced to use kittened OP stuff like SD condi thief to climb.

congrats on top 10

Wow, nice job making top ten with something that isn’t your main. I’ve tried condition thief a few times and even though it’s strong I just play a lot worse on anything that isn’t ele or engi. :P Kudos!

I saw it played in the unity tournaments & it looks really solid. Much better than the d/d build that scrubs complain about.

===

The warrior nerfs were awful. All they needed to do was nerf arc divider radius, but no. They had to butcher both the power & condi builds. Great job anet. Thanks for banning me when i question your devs competence after you seriously overnerf my main. I would think nerfing a class out of meta was a sign of a team that doesnt know how to balance, but hey. Maybe there is something really intelligent going on that i’m just missing. Maybe you are just so smart, & i’m so stupid that i think you’re stupid. That’s it i bet. Im dumb. Not the anet devs. Ofc.

Anyhow, grats on the top 10 my dude. Pity it can’t be on the class you enjoy playing.

At least thieves have another build that is not the overused D/P .

Potato.2567:

Condi Thief is OP. Source: I’m in top 10 NA using S/D condi thief. Of course im also ridiculously good at the game, but it’s broken. I’m not even good at thief, I main warrior, its just that warr is so nerfed that im forced to use kittened OP stuff like SD condi thief to climb.

Yeah you were in that match in Coliseum yesterday where we came back. I knew you were on condi thief and wasn’t sure if you could pull it off XD.

Anyways how would you nerf it? I’d remove a condi from Lotus Training and just generally lower DPS, I wouldn’t want any changes that affect thief sustain in general.

How does s/d condi work? not sure I’ve run into one or if i have, i might have confused it for d/d.

If S/D were to be nerfed the 3 main things I would look at are Potent poison Grandmaster trait in Deadly arts for some reason Anet felt they needed to buff this by added an additional stack to any Deadly art traits that apply poison. That in turn affects Panic Strike which poisons foes for 2 stacks of poison now when you immobilize them. Couple that with Sword 2# infiltrator strike which immbolizes a foe on the first chain.

Then in turn the immobilize causes foes to have to sit in Uncatchable while also having damage increased by Lotus training. Then ofc which was nerfed somewhat but still plenty strong thieves dodging(whirl finisher) inside of Choking gas from Shortbow 4 which dazes/intterupts targets when they hit 5 poison stacks and if a thief wants to be even more crazy they can opt to remove Escapist Absolution and take Impacting disruption which pretty much equals free random pulmonary impacts near anyone thats caught in choking gas/dodge combo and it’s still nice damage since most run carrion amulet which has a healthy amount of power.

Funny enough almost everything in the last 3 I think patches led up to this S/d condi build in terms of it being a thing.

Ontop of all this they have pretty decent condi cover and all around general consistent condi upkeep. Is it better than D/P dash thief prob not but it’s very very very strong.

What you don’t think applying 5 unique condis just by dodge rolling is balanced?

Its actually not op, youre just coming across people who aren’t used to the build so they don’t know how to counter it

Because youre using s/d and not d/d or d/p, you easily manage to confuse tf out of people since they cant come remotely close on guessing youre next move

I’ve fought plenty of ppl even in unranked, who countered my thief with ease

Also just like any other build it has its strengths and weaknesses, mesmers can still wreck you, guardians can still wreck you, eles can still make it seem like your wasting your cds, engis can still counter you

You yourself is also open to condi attacks as well as to have a strong s/d build you have to sacrifice condi removal, you also can barely stealth at will (when I say that I mean you really cant) which leaves you vulnerable to perma stealth and sometimes experienced d/d thieves

Btw that Lotus training isn’t where the damage comes from, its more of a “booster” if anything…..its not the condi dodge that you have to be concerned about…trust me

I’ve been running s/d condi on my thief before it was popular because I hated d/p

Is it amazing yes, is it op, no…no where near as much everyone says it is.

You lose the mobility of a thief as well since all you really have left to flee fights are get away from getting focused is bow 5 and sword 2s return

Yet again I see people blowing something out of proportion

S/d only seems strong because ppl are too busy being followers using meta builds instead of thinking for their selves

My power rev can hit top damage every match….its not a meta build either

Same with my necros who have built for power rn as well

Your best advantage is not just the element of surprise, but also causing confusion amongst your enemy

If I seem really annoyed by this post its cause I am cause all I see are people listing its advantages, but no one said anything about the huge amount of disadvantages that come with it and how easy it can be and has been countered before

Stop saying something is “op” just cause its different

Going to have to agree with Velar. I have been running the s/p version of this since the update, and he is right. We get the movement off s#2, but no intrinsic speed bonus. A strong condi burst, but little to no stealth access, and limited access to clears (assuming PI), limited disengage, etc, etc

I will admit that sb4 was def too much at the beginning of the season, but I think the 4s nerf put it in a usable but manageable place.

Idk if its op or not. But its not fun to play against and i though the game was about all of us having fun.

zealex.9410:

Idk if its op or not. But its not fun to play against and i though the game was about all of us having fun.

It’s very funny to play against in my necromancer’s point of view!

Potato.2567:

Condi Thief is OP. Source: I’m in top 10 NA using S/D condi thief. Of course im also ridiculously good at the game, but it’s broken. I’m not even good at thief, I main warrior, its just that warr is so nerfed that im forced to use kittened OP stuff like SD condi thief to climb.

I just find it funny that people think condi takes skill to use. You can literally down someone by stealing to them and dodging away. Its sickening how braindead all condi builds are in this game

Condi has a pretty limited attack pattern though: Hit from stealth with an interrupt to prevent the defense then they are kinda done. So you either pre-block or eat the first hit and counter the second ( [Distortion].)

At that point most of the thieves I’ve seen running this go to auto attack or stealth. I load them with condi and they tend to fall. (Since most don’t seem to be traited to lose conditions on stealth. )

I’d like to see less jumping around, especially by heavy armor, ( I’m looking at you DH,) but I don’t think the current condi thief is OP. It’s annoying.

It counts as a cheeze build (which balanced or not at high levels) ruins the game for new players. They had pretty much rid the game of the worst cheeze builds, but for some reason brought back Mesmer and Thief cheeze.

If you run cheese, that’s fine, but you should be punished the same as a rifle warrior. Rifle warriors can cheeze new players, but they also can get owned by a player of almost any level. The amount of counterplay has to be equally proportional to the cheese.

You guys should look up the stats for burst burning scrapper if you think thief is bad.

duster.7013:

You guys should look up the stats for burst burning scrapper if you think thief is bad.

Yep…that’s a level of cheeze too…just like the full burn DH…however, with super mobile/stealth classes like thief and mesmer, there is an additional element of cheeze without enough counterplay at low levels. Nevertheless, the game would be better without those burn burst builds too.

Guys, you forgot another condi weapon set: p/d is not bad at all. You can go p/d + d/d or p/d + sb and the dmg part is great, survivability is decent too.
Funny thing, that all three condi weapons are viable in PvP …

I have a question, OP. Did you queue alone or with someone else?

Also, i don’t think that build is OP. Obnoxious? Yes. Hard to deal with if you don’t know how it works or don’t expect it? Yes. But as poster above me said, it was probably mostly because people didn’t expect it and because people you queued against weren’t as good (we all know how dead population is). I don’t think team of decent players would have issues dealing with the build.

Ithilwen.1529:

Condi has a pretty limited attack pattern though: Hit from stealth with an interrupt to prevent the defense then they are kinda done. So you either pre-block or eat the first hit and counter the second ( [Distortion].)

At that point most of the thieves I’ve seen running this go to auto attack or stealth. I load them with condi and they tend to fall. (Since most don’t seem to be traited to lose conditions on stealth. )

I’d like to see less jumping around, especially by heavy armor, ( I’m looking at you DH,) but I don’t think the current condi thief is OP. It’s annoying.

Nobody in their right mind would run SE which you are talking about because 1. there is no room for SA (which is where trait is located) 2. SA is heavily countered by revs, DHs, engis and about every single aoe in game. It is not that thieves don’t want to trait for it, they can’t.

Cynz.9437:

Also, i don’t think that build is OP. Obnoxious? Yes. Hard to deal with if you don’t know how it works or don’t expect it? Yes. But as poster above me said, it was probably mostly because people didn’t expect it and because people you queued against weren’t as good (we all know how dead population is). I don’t think team of decent players would have issues dealing with the build.

I have to agree. Most of us already faced that build once for sure, but if it comes down to solo que about 8 to 10 matches is about who has better stack of good players and who hits first that determines the whole outcome. I’ve had situations when 1v1 such thief wasn’t a problem (DarrgunHurrdurr, I know) but in 2v1 it is mostly a matter of time before I fall, especially when stability gets stolen/corrupted. But that ain’t a big deal, the worst situation is when I am busy fighting (dying) on one node while being 1v2/3 and the rest of the team either runs aimlessly or dies to such condi thief 2v1. Yes, it may sound silly but I had a team where condi thief got two players, a warrior and a reve if I am not mistaken, and that was all in platinum div. While I duo it is better, but my duo partners are not always online so sometimes I have to solo for max matches or not to get decay, and this is where stuff like that happens.

P.S.
Do some of you believe in some sort of account luck for better players in team while soloqueing? I know a DH (presumably non-meta build) who started pvp overall in this season, has more than 1k achievs and went to 89 rank once in few days only soloque’ing (from plat 2), and he claims to play pvp first time. He has some knowledge and knows his drill, but so do I and yet I keep on losing rank on overwhelmed matches on soloq.

op LOL `??? the condi thief is still viable , i play the hybrid build this season , high gold .. last season with a power build high gold … i am not a pro .. but i can play my builds (no meta) .
condi is the answer , i hade condis … love my power builds , ty anet for some nervs and now comes the payback .. cheese .. we need more cheese and wine ..

sry for my bad english ..

condi remove .. i see player with no condi remove = xD in gold…

Do you have the build ?

only condi thief? All thief builds are op.. anets new golden boys first one was warrior thieves are new generations vetsion 2.

slow cd 3 dodges, rapid dazes, dodge on almost every single attack, insane condi clean, insane dps, stealth, medium armor, huge health pool with amulets, block yup block funny but real, stoning enemies with share, no cd on attacks please dont tell initiative because there is a lot initiative gain-scale traits and signet.

but you should remember this is pve game and anet doesnt care pvp anymore. Because they are too much broke the game.

Every classes have op traits-skills now but thief standing on the top of list with mesmer restorative illusions trait. that trait like a joke, a zombie must have eaten your brain for creating that trait..

Just dont care anything.. Look at the leader board you can see a lot of farmers with 438W 414L or even worst like 203W 217L. Matchmaking like a joke.. Nothing is right in gw2 pvp

Ok since so many people want to hop on thieves with having little to no logic obviously on how it works

What about Trap DH’s and Condi Guards? 10k burning isn’t exactly fair either now is it

What about condi and bunker engis? Ive seen some of them last for ridiculously long times

What about bunker and 1 shot revs?

What about condi and bunker mesmers, condi mesmers are even worst than condi thief

What about condi and bunker ele?

What about zerg warriors?

Not so fun when ppl call out kitten on your class now is it?

Face it, you got kitten on by a condi thief and who knew what they were doing and you didn’t know how to react to it so you got rekt

kittening on the forums and crying that it gets nerfed is just low

I hate to be that guy, but for once, how about you learn how it works first before complaining about it

Cause until I start seeing topics about these other kitten builds for other professions, Idc to here it

primordus.1452:

only condi thief? All thief builds are op.. anets new golden boys first one was warrior thieves are new generations vetsion 2.

slow cd 3 dodges, rapid dazes, dodge on almost every single attack, insane condi clean, insane dps, stealth, medium armor, huge health pool with amulets, block yup block funny but real, stoning enemies with share, no cd on attacks please dont tell initiative because there is a lot initiative gain-scale traits and signet.

but you should remember this is pve game and anet doesnt care pvp anymore. Because they are too much broke the game.

Every classes have op traits-skills now but thief standing on the top of list with mesmer restorative illusions trait. that trait like a joke, a zombie must have eaten your brain for creating that trait..

Just dont care anything.. Look at the leader board you can see a lot of farmers with 438W 414L or even worst like 203W 217L. Matchmaking like a joke.. Nothing is right in gw2 pvp

Lulz so much lulz when Thieves have been Nerfed the last 3 patches straight so funny, and you list off traits and Utilities that Thievs don’t even use since hey are so so terribly bad… sorry but respectable Thief uses Infiltrators Signet and huge Health pool? Super lulz they are one the 3 classes with the Smallest Health Pool in game. Insane Condi clear? Where is that at? I can think of 4 classes with better Condi clear baked into their Meta builds alone. And initiative Gain traits no thief uses them besides the Two ini on Steal. You act like all other classes don’t take he CD reduction traits.

Ah this is too great.

And@ OP everytime I have played with you which has been a lot the last two weeks (almost every other match) you have been on Your Warrior and Duo Queued with Unholey. So yeah you didn’t make top 10 on the S/D Thief.

Sly.9518:

primordus.1452:

only condi thief? All thief builds are op.. anets new golden boys first one was warrior thieves are new generations vetsion 2.

slow cd 3 dodges, rapid dazes, dodge on almost every single attack, insane condi clean, insane dps, stealth, medium armor, huge health pool with amulets, block yup block funny but real, stoning enemies with share, no cd on attacks please dont tell initiative because there is a lot initiative gain-scale traits and signet.

but you should remember this is pve game and anet doesnt care pvp anymore. Because they are too much broke the game.

Every classes have op traits-skills now but thief standing on the top of list with mesmer restorative illusions trait. that trait like a joke, a zombie must have eaten your brain for creating that trait..

Just dont care anything.. Look at the leader board you can see a lot of farmers with 438W 414L or even worst like 203W 217L. Matchmaking like a joke.. Nothing is right in gw2 pvp

Lulz so much lulz when Thieves have been Nerfed the last 3 patches straight so funny, and you list off traits and Utilities that Thievs don’t even use since hey are so so terribly bad… sorry but respectable Thief uses Infiltrators Signet and huge Health pool? Super lulz they are one the 3 classes with the Smallest Health Pool in game. Insane Condi clear? Where is that at? I can think of 4 classes with better Condi clear baked into their Meta builds alone. And initiative Gain traits no thief uses them besides the Two ini on Steal. You act like all other classes don’t take he CD reduction traits.

Ah this is too great.

And@ OP everytime I have played with you which has been a lot the last two weeks (almost every other match) you have been on Your Warrior and Duo Queued with Unholey. So yeah you didn’t make top 10 on the S/D Thief.

i agree lol so much lol. Firstly we never played together i haven’t a warrior my main is engineer and playing with necro or revenant too.

You saying thieves nerfed 3 times but i didnt see any changes about thieves..

Let me tell you on meta builds;

Huge health pool : as you say thief should have smallest health pool in the game. It’s assassin class. Lets see meta build healths
– S/D Marauder : 2029 armor 17245 Health what da small health wow.
– Condi Carrion with traveler rune : 2065 armor 21005 health. this is really low even
lowest

And here is the condi cleans;

- Signet of Agility : Remove 3 conditions, 30sec cd, gain endurance
– You have 3 dodges, Dash : Remove chill cripple immobile also gain swift too
– Escapist’s Absolution : Remove condition whenever you evade
that means you can clean all your conditions only with dodges and weapon skill evades, you removing 3 more condis too with signet also getting endurance too, i dont wanna talk about stealing but you getting vigor and endurance from it, so it means your dodges never ends.. There is absolutely no way to killing a good or average thief with conditions..

About initiative, again from meta;

- Kleptomaniac : 2 initiatives from stealing (every 20secs)
– Preparadness : incrase initiative by 3
just imagine your weapon skills like any other classes. Engi hammer : 1 – 6 -12 – 20 – 24secs. You can spam your skills forever with those dodges

How about healing?
– Channeled Vigor : Gain %25 endurance and min 16060 or max 21940 heal
– Driven Fortitude : Gain 456 health when you evade attack. Calculate how many dodges and weapon evades do you have.
– Mug : gain 1980 health from stealing.
is this really assassin/thief class?

But kk everything is fine.. Thief needs buff

i almost forget. Most hateful things about thief for me all those endless daze, stun, stone hits and blind areas.. You can stay alive only with those annoying skills. Thief has the best offhand weapon skills.

primordus.1452:

Sly.9518:

primordus.1452:

snip

Lulz so much lulz when Thieves have been Nerfed the last 3 patches straight so funny, and you list off traits and Utilities that Thievs don’t even use since hey are so so terribly bad… sorry but respectable Thief uses Infiltrators Signet and huge Health pool? Super lulz they are one the 3 classes with the Smallest Health Pool in game. Insane Condi clear? Where is that at? I can think of 4 classes with better Condi clear baked into their Meta builds alone. And initiative Gain traits no thief uses them besides the Two ini on Steal. You act like all other classes don’t take he CD reduction traits.

Ah this is too great.

And@ OP everytime I have played with you which has been a lot the last two weeks (almost every other match) you have been on Your Warrior and Duo Queued with Unholey. So yeah you didn’t make top 10 on the S/D Thief.

i agree lol so much lol. Firstly we never played together i haven’t a warrior my main is engineer and playing with necro or revenant too.

You saying thieves nerfed 3 times but i didnt see any changes about thieves..

Let me tell you on meta builds;

Huge health pool : as you say thief should have smallest health pool in the game. It’s assassin class. Lets see meta build healths
– S/D Marauder : 2029 armor 17245 Health what da small health wow.
– Condi Carrion with traveler rune : 2065 armor 21005 health. this is really low even
lowest

And here is the condi cleans;

- Signet of Agility : Remove 3 conditions, 30sec cd, gain endurance
– You have 3 dodges, Dash : Remove chill cripple immobile also gain swift too
– Escapist’s Absolution : Remove condition whenever you evade
that means you can clean all your conditions only with dodges and weapon skill evades, you removing 3 more condis too with signet also getting endurance too, i dont wanna talk about stealing but you getting vigor and endurance from it, so it means your dodges never ends.. There is absolutely no way to killing a good or average thief with conditions..

About initiative, again from meta;

- Kleptomaniac : 2 initiatives from stealing (every 20secs)
– Preparadness : incrase initiative by 3
just imagine your weapon skills like any other classes. Engi hammer : 1 – 6 -12 – 20 – 24secs. You can spam your skills forever with those dodges

How about healing?
– Channeled Vigor : Gain %25 endurance and min 16060 or max 21940 heal
– Driven Fortitude : Gain 456 health when you evade attack. Calculate how many dodges and weapon evades do you have.
– Mug : gain 1980 health from stealing.
is this really assassin/thief class?

But kk everything is fine.. Thief needs buff

i almost forget. Most hateful things about thief for me all those endless daze, stun, stone hits and blind areas.. You can stay alive only with those annoying skills. Thief has the best offhand weapon skills.

First off you aren’t the OP you know common term for “Original Poster” aka Potato, (unless this is Potatos alt acct), so that second portion to the comment you are quoting wasn’t even in regards to you.

And let’s see last three patches that had anything balance wise:

• June 20th:
  Thief
  Choking Gas: The daze duration of this skill has been increased from 0.5 seconds to 1 second. Poison duration has been increased from 2 seconds to 3 seconds. Daze interval has been increased from 1 second to 4 seconds. All of these changes affect PvP only.

• May 16th:
  Pulmonary Impact: The damage of this effect has been reduced by 15% in PvP only.
  Channeled Vigor: Endurance per tick has been reduced from 20 to 15 in PvP only.
  Endurance Thief: Endurance gained has been reduced from 50 to 25 in PvP only.
  Vault: The initiative of this skill has been increased from 5 to 6 in PvP only.
  Bound (PvP Only): The damage of this ability has been reduced by 24% in PvP only.

• February 22nd:
  Signet of Agility: The endurance gain from this skill has been reduced from 100 to 50 in PvP only.
  Channeled Vigor: The endurance gain from this skill has been reduced from 25 to 20 per pulse in PvP only.
  Hard to Catch: The internal cooldown on this trait has been increased from 30 seconds to 45 seconds in PvP only.
  Upper Hand: The internal cooldown on this trait has been increased from 2 seconds to 3 seconds in PvP only.

But hey like you said Thief hasn’t received any Nerfs on any of the balance patches, especially to their Meta builds. Lulz

And again the Condi clears I can think of 4 classes with better clears that aren’t dependent on Enemy action to clear, and heals that don’t require enemy action to heal them.

It looks like those straws Evaded your grasp for a valid argument.

And where did I ever say Thief needed buffs? Hell you can stalk my post history I never said Thieves need buffs in any of them, I say every class needs to be nerfed more to reduce the spammyness of the game on all classes, go ahead stalk my posts.

But currently Thief isn’t anymore OP than any other class in the current game state.

Again great times thanks for providing me with Lulz

primordus.1452:

How about healing?
– Channeled Vigor : Gain %25 endurance and min 16060 or max 21940 heal

This isn’t how the heal work, same for multi hitting skills like Reaper’s Greatsword Death Spiral wich deals (base) 774 damage splitted in 6 hit and not 4644 damage.

Sly.9518:

But hey like you said Thief hasn’t received any Nerfs on any of the balance patches, especially to their Meta builds. Lulz

And every one of those balance patches included sweeping nerfs to every other class. Thief got slapped in the wrist in the previous balance patches, while at the same time everyone else got gutted. And lets not even go into how much thieves have profited from the introduction of sigil of absorption.

Every single balance patch in the past year has put thief in a stronger meta position. Thief has the highest leaderboard representation of any class, with only guards and scrapper even coming close, and those two classes only because they are the only two classes that can survive a thief. We are at a point where double thief is common in platinum.

primordus.1452:

Sly.9518:

primordus.1452:

only condi thief? All thief builds are op.. anets new golden boys first one was warrior thieves are new generations vetsion 2.

slow cd 3 dodges, rapid dazes, dodge on almost every single attack, insane condi clean, insane dps, stealth, medium armor, huge health pool with amulets, block yup block funny but real, stoning enemies with share, no cd on attacks please dont tell initiative because there is a lot initiative gain-scale traits and signet.

but you should remember this is pve game and anet doesnt care pvp anymore. Because they are too much broke the game.

Every classes have op traits-skills now but thief standing on the top of list with mesmer restorative illusions trait. that trait like a joke, a zombie must have eaten your brain for creating that trait..

Just dont care anything.. Look at the leader board you can see a lot of farmers with 438W 414L or even worst like 203W 217L. Matchmaking like a joke.. Nothing is right in gw2 pvp

Lulz so much lulz when Thieves have been Nerfed the last 3 patches straight so funny, and you list off traits and Utilities that Thievs don’t even use since hey are so so terribly bad… sorry but respectable Thief uses Infiltrators Signet and huge Health pool? Super lulz they are one the 3 classes with the Smallest Health Pool in game. Insane Condi clear? Where is that at? I can think of 4 classes with better Condi clear baked into their Meta builds alone. And initiative Gain traits no thief uses them besides the Two ini on Steal. You act like all other classes don’t take he CD reduction traits.

Ah this is too great.

And@ OP everytime I have played with you which has been a lot the last two weeks (almost every other match) you have been on Your Warrior and Duo Queued with Unholey. So yeah you didn’t make top 10 on the S/D Thief.

i agree lol so much lol. Firstly we never played together i haven’t a warrior my main is engineer and playing with necro or revenant too.

You saying thieves nerfed 3 times but i didnt see any changes about thieves..

Let me tell you on meta builds;

Huge health pool : as you say thief should have smallest health pool in the game. It’s assassin class. Lets see meta build healths
– S/D Marauder : 2029 armor 17245 Health what da small health wow.
– Condi Carrion with traveler rune : 2065 armor 21005 health. this is really low even
lowest

And here is the condi cleans;

- Signet of Agility : Remove 3 conditions, 30sec cd, gain endurance
– You have 3 dodges, Dash : Remove chill cripple immobile also gain swift too
– Escapist’s Absolution : Remove condition whenever you evade
that means you can clean all your conditions only with dodges and weapon skill evades, you removing 3 more condis too with signet also getting endurance too, i dont wanna talk about stealing but you getting vigor and endurance from it, so it means your dodges never ends.. There is absolutely no way to killing a good or average thief with conditions..

About initiative, again from meta;

- Kleptomaniac : 2 initiatives from stealing (every 20secs)
– Preparadness : incrase initiative by 3
just imagine your weapon skills like any other classes. Engi hammer : 1 – 6 -12 – 20 – 24secs. You can spam your skills forever with those dodges

How about healing?
– Channeled Vigor : Gain %25 endurance and min 16060 or max 21940 heal
– Driven Fortitude : Gain 456 health when you evade attack. Calculate how many dodges and weapon evades do you have.
– Mug : gain 1980 health from stealing.
is this really assassin/thief class?

But kk everything is fine.. Thief needs buff

i almost forget. Most hateful things about thief for me all those endless daze, stun, stone hits and blind areas.. You can stay alive only with those annoying skills. Thief has the best offhand weapon skills.

No condi thief uses any of that, if they do then their build isn’t a “condi” build since it would be less than effective

Signet of agility is more of a power crit thief than anything

Endless dazes aren’t really a thing tbh

We burn through initiative fast and if we don’t manage it we can get destroyed easily

Ive had people cut off my channeled vigor to keep me from completely healing more times than I can count

Even with dare devil, we cant dodge that much, I mean hell tbh we only have 1 more dodge than every other class and ours are more specialized…that’s it, once we use those three dodges without vigor we have to wait just like everyone else to dodge again so idk where the endless dodge ideas coming from

Yet again yeah we have medium armor, but do you have any idea how weak we still are? There is a reason why you rarely see a thief who knows what theyre doing trying to 1v1 a guardian, medium armor don’t mean anything due to high burst damage every class is capable of

So just like necros being able to have a high health pool, thief having a high health pool just means that we’re trying to buy ourselves a couple of extra seconds to get out of cc chains which needs to be fixed cause I think losing due to cc spam is kitten, but I digress

Lastly, I kitten on meta thieves all the time. I only ever face competition from other thieves when theyre not running meta

Hell the last time I ran into a meta thief they got completely trashed

If you cant counter meta thief that’s your fault cause you just sat there and listed everything that theyre capable of

That means that you should have a good idea on what theyre going to do next before they do

Evades and dodges are two different things and evades cost quite a bit of initiative so its not something we can just spam

Watch out a certain someone bias is showing. That witch hunt for the thief is still strong even when it keeps getting nerfed pretty big in Pvp. Lulz

Again the relative game state is balanced they just need to remove all the spam in the game from all classes then it would be a semi respectable game balance/combat wise.

no nerfs. bad idea. plenty of op builds or spam builds for all classes.

I think the standard D/P build is a lot better.

This condi build has a major flaw in that if you open on anyone with swiftness, who either isn’t or can’t be affected by cripple first, they will always avoid the 2 skill as long as they are moving. You have to hide behind cover and wait for them to stop, otherwise your only options are to open with steal and dodge, lb3, or waste shadowstep, which all defeat the purpose of cover or leave you vulnerable.

The 2 skill teleports you to their spot but it has a small delay and a range limit that causes a miss. Revs, dash thieves, eles, and engis are nearly impossible to deal with as long as they keep moving. It does seem to work alright against 25% speed buffs as long as they are in combat, but good damage pressure without a working 2 skill is nearly impossible. The whole build relies too heavily on that one move.

Also, it really needs pistol and PI over dagger for areas that don’t have LOS options. Pistol 5 and blinding powder also provide a higher skill ceiling than the extra dodge and block. If your 2 spam keeps failing, you will need the stealth to disengage.