Guild Wars 2

Why can you get queued with people that are on their 10 games for placing when you are already in platinum?
Got 2 people on my team that played their first or second game – I already played 15. They shouldn’t end up in the plat queue

Supreme.3164:

We don’t need 500 games to see how the system once again is flawed/rigged .

I sit at 1400+ rating and the following match I get teammates who are not even 600 rating, it’s the same system like previous seasons …a luck based system, you either get decent players and climb the leaderboard..or you’re unlucky and get waste of space teammates who create a blowout match.

This is not a skill based system for the 5th time, you still get players in your team who are far far far below you actual skill level, like I have 8k hours in this game with over 12k matches…and I get these guys who barely have 600 hours and with not enough rating to be even visible on the leaderboard past 250.

And once again you have whiteknights defending a flawed system because they enjoy doing so.

Other than ending up the game with 300k+ healing done to teammates or 400k dmg+ done to enemies, ressing people under heavy fire, rushing to help every numbskull that can’t win an easy 1vs1, try to hold as many people as possible , capping or defending…..I can’t do kitten more than that as I’m not god and I can’t win the whole game by myself.

I can’t even blame the devs anymore at this point, pvp is definitely not for everyone like raids is not for every pver out there

Luck irons out in the long run. Yes, having a wide skill spread within a team will introduce volatility to outcomes. Yes, it will take that kind of a system longer to zero in on individual ratings. Yes, it’s working as Anet intended.

A totally different discussion is how good of a customer experience this is – how subjectively fun it is to slog through hundreds of games just to arrive at your “true” rating, i.e. 50/50 outcomes. Ultimately the pain of a lot of people here is caused by playing a team-based and class-based game solo. You are going to have to endure a lot of subjectively poor matches in such a scenario, because you have very limited control over outcomes. Again, working as intended.

Matches seem fine so far. You are going to get on win streaks and loss streaks. I think too many people want the most efficient way to farm rating and get frustrated because of it.

I think people here genuinely aren’t used to having their skill level represented as something tangible and when they find it doesn’t match their own perception of how skilled they are, they get angry.

Aereniel.7356:

Supreme.3164:

We don’t need 500 games to see how the system once again is flawed/rigged .

I sit at 1400+ rating and the following match I get teammates who are not even 600 rating, it’s the same system like previous seasons …a luck based system, you either get decent players and climb the leaderboard..or you’re unlucky and get waste of space teammates who create a blowout match.

This is not a skill based system for the 5th time, you still get players in your team who are far far far below you actual skill level, like I have 8k hours in this game with over 12k matches…and I get these guys who barely have 600 hours and with not enough rating to be even visible on the leaderboard past 250.

And once again you have whiteknights defending a flawed system because they enjoy doing so.

Other than ending up the game with 300k+ healing done to teammates or 400k dmg+ done to enemies, ressing people under heavy fire, rushing to help every numbskull that can’t win an easy 1vs1, try to hold as many people as possible , capping or defending…..I can’t do kitten more than that as I’m not god and I can’t win the whole game by myself.

I can’t even blame the devs anymore at this point, pvp is definitely not for everyone like raids is not for every pver out there

Luck irons out in the long run. Yes, having a wide skill spread within a team will introduce volatility to outcomes. Yes, it will take that kind of a system longer to zero in on individual ratings. Yes, it’s working as Anet intended.

A totally different discussion is how good of a customer experience this is – how subjectively fun it is to slog through hundreds of games just to arrive at your “true” rating, i.e. 50/50 outcomes. Ultimately the pain of a lot of people here is caused by playing a team-based and class-based game solo. You are going to have to endure a lot of subjectively poor matches in such a scenario, because you have very limited control over outcomes. Again, working as intended.

well said, end of the day no matter how good you are it depends on your team.

I know I have or had a high mmr before the start of this season because people i faced carried the legendary title.

But I had a few bad games put me 7 loss and 3 wins and now im in bronze. “Ok no worries i will climb myway out” nope, I know im in low ranks now as my team mates cant win 3v1 or 2v1 battles cant rely on them to hold a point, go down within 10 seconds of a fight,

I kill the enemy over and over but help out in 2v1 win 1v1 but im just one guy in the end,

the rank system feels just like overwatch old rank system, if it is based on wins and loss you will never climb out.

this is a team game and no matter how good you are if your team is bad you cant win.

Aereniel.7356:

Supreme.3164:

We don’t need 500 games to see how the system once again is flawed/rigged .

I sit at 1400+ rating and the following match I get teammates who are not even 600 rating, it’s the same system like previous seasons …a luck based system, you either get decent players and climb the leaderboard..or you’re unlucky and get waste of space teammates who create a blowout match.

This is not a skill based system for the 5th time, you still get players in your team who are far far far below you actual skill level, like I have 8k hours in this game with over 12k matches…and I get these guys who barely have 600 hours and with not enough rating to be even visible on the leaderboard past 250.

And once again you have whiteknights defending a flawed system because they enjoy doing so.

Other than ending up the game with 300k+ healing done to teammates or 400k dmg+ done to enemies, ressing people under heavy fire, rushing to help every numbskull that can’t win an easy 1vs1, try to hold as many people as possible , capping or defending…..I can’t do kitten more than that as I’m not god and I can’t win the whole game by myself.

I can’t even blame the devs anymore at this point, pvp is definitely not for everyone like raids is not for every pver out there

Luck irons out in the long run. Yes, having a wide skill spread within a team will introduce volatility to outcomes. Yes, it will take that kind of a system longer to zero in on individual ratings. Yes, it’s working as Anet intended.

A totally different discussion is how good of a customer experience this is – how subjectively fun it is to slog through hundreds of games just to arrive at your “true” rating, i.e. 50/50 outcomes. Ultimately the pain of a lot of people here is caused by playing a team-based and class-based game solo. You are going to have to endure a lot of subjectively poor matches in such a scenario, because you have very limited control over outcomes. Again, working as intended.

Yes yes…But kittening why?

Forgive me pls as I’m not mad at you rather ty for understanding my frustration , it’s hard to be heard with so many whiteknights around.

The system is definitely really bad for me or few others who got stuck with the usual bad luck, it was the same freaking bullcrap last season; …win one..next match you get complete numbskulls who play absurd builds and have 0 knowledge of the game.

I heard the same story for the last 4 seasons :" you need to play like 100+ matches"…no..nothing change as you start so you finish, you can even play 10k games..the system will still give you bullcrap for teammates and I can’t understand why.

I can’t stop somebody from playing a staff ele spamming fireball and neither can stop a couple of dh dieing in flat 2s from start and just feeding the enemy team.

I can’t do more than I already do, I can invite any whiteknight here to videorecord me, I can give you my screenshots, you can duo, you can do whatever you want : let me show you are rigged is this system

In the past I read stuff like : “my account is rigged for loss”, that was something which honestly I laughed at with others but now it’s something that doesn’t seem to be so far from the truth, no matter how stupid it sounds.

I’m not an esl player, I’m not a god of pvp, I’m average at best and at very least I can rotate with a decent understanding of the map main mechanics so why…why at 1400 rating I get a staff ele that rush solo the enemy lord when the match starts?

What these whiteknights don’t get is that nobody here is expecting to win every single match out there and yes we know that blow outs are to be expected but…at very least give us some consistency in the quality of our games

What did I play for all this time?

P.S @Kuya so…at gold rating I get a staff ele in my team that rush enemy lord at start and just use staff1 on the enemy after that or…I get gs/axe war who spam gs1 to build adrenaline then eviscerate into a RS or…I get 2 dh that insta die to a single engi on a point…..all this is my personal perception of skill level that’s why I’m getting angry…-_-

First 8 matches played and got 50:50. Three losses were good starts that ended in chaos..
Last one i got a thief on my side that constantly ran far and when seeing his movement i kew he did´t know the map well …. On thte other side most people i got paired with kew what they are doing. Unfortunately one bad player can cost you the match. There should be some threshold like 1k rating that splits the matchmaker in two sections. up to 1k and the second for above or the entrance for rankes is higher with 100+ or even 500+ matches … when someone enters rankes i expect her/him to know what to do, handle his class and know the map. Till then train unranked.
And another loss totaly astounded me …
I play ele. I had over 200k healing … A guardian had more and i had 30% of the teams damage dealt being the top damage dealer … O_o

hypehype.9047:

this is a team game and no matter how good you are if your team is bad you cant win.

Yes, absolutely. In 5v5 conquest, a single player, no matter how talented, can only win a single node at a time. If your team mates keep consistently losing the other two, you’re going to lose no matter what. Soloing in a team game only compounds this problem, because you have zero control over your team mates.

Streaks, both loss and win streaks, are going to happen. For morale, it often helps to adopt a very long-term view. If you play consistently better than other players in your current skill bracket, you will eventually climb. How long this “eventually” turns out to be is in no small amount a factor of luck. You will get bad team comps, AFK players and griefers. But so will the other team, and over enough samples the probabilities will settle.

The reward for eventually finding your skill bracket is 50/50 matches. Many people find this demotivational, but it’s the desired end-state of the Glicko2 skill rating system. After all that hard climb, you discover that you win less often than before. Fun, no?

I love getting top stats (and I mean kills, dmg, defender, revives etc.) for 8 matches in a row, yet losing all of them and getting kicked all the way down silver to bronze. And what is with the losing by 10 points in a match and going down the same as losing by 400 and vise-vera for winning? If a match is close wouldn’t you just stay pretty even?

Evan Lesh.3295:

Everyone got a rating reset, at least wait until you place.

So how come queued right at the start ESL players got matched with each other, and me, for instance, not? Past MMR was still used I guess, I cannot see the random event that put ton of progamers together instantly despite hundreds of other ppl queueing simultaneously.

It’s a soft reset, you’ll face roughly the same level of opponents you did before but the rating volatility is high so it changes much quicker depending on how your placement matches go.

Supreme.3164:

What these whiteknights don’t get is that nobody here is expecting to win every single match out there and yes we know that blow outs are to be expected but…at very least give us some consistency in the quality of our games

Please stop with the whiteknight labels. Look at my post history, I’m about the most cynical Anet critic who still has forum access. This is not about defending Anet, it’s about clearing up misinformation and misunderstanding regarding how skill rating systems work.

You’re asking for consistency of outcomes, and I’ve explained in a couple of posts already why that’s not going to happen without a lot of samples, if at all. No matter how tight you make the rating spread, there’s always going to be a strong element of volatility when you play a 5v5 team game with less than a full party. At this point in the season, the system has very low confidence on individual ratings, which makes the situation much worse. Matches will align on the curve better as the season progresses, if that’s any consolation, but I’m starting to think that you’re looking for a level of confidence that is, quite frankly, never going to happen.

MacLeod.5386:

Has anybody mentioned the worst class matchmaking I’ve ever seen in a MMO?

I mean I have been in matches that have 2, 3, or more heavies on one side and none on the other most of the time. I will switch out to something else, but honestly, what is the kitten point of it if nobody else does?

That was one of the main outliers when trying to pin-point a person’s mmr and improve matchmaking.

• Builds are so diverse, do we calculate certain build’s effectiveness and treat them as an additional mmr variables?
• Not everyone can multiclass and swap on the dime, but do we make static mmr for each class on an account?

Anet left these alone, probably because it was too intricate and risky.

Matchmaking is far from balanced, if i am lucky i get a proper team that knows how to communicate in team chat and we win easy, but most of the time its the other way around, I get plebs that should be the same “skill” rank as me, but insted they don’t know what to do, dunno if that will change in time but i rly don’t feel like it will, since if i stop playing for one week my rank willl drop and i will be with bad players. So what can someone do about it? I just wish people would read the team chat and look at the mini map that is all. We don’t need PvE players in PvP ranked matches. Pre-HoT PvP was the best!

hypehype.9047:

well said, end of the day no matter how good you are it depends on your team.

I know I have or had a high mmr before the start of this season because people i faced carried the legendary title.

But I had a few bad games put me 7 loss and 3 wins and now im in bronze. “Ok no worries i will climb myway out” nope, I know im in low ranks now as my team mates cant win 3v1 or 2v1 battles cant rely on them to hold a point, go down within 10 seconds of a fight,

I kill the enemy over and over but help out in 2v1 win 1v1 but im just one guy in the end,

the rank system feels just like overwatch old rank system, if it is based on wins and loss you will never climb out.

this is a team game and no matter how good you are if your team is bad you cant win.

Had a similar experience, except I got 5/5, but lost the first 3 in blowout games got me placed right at the bottom, now the games are even worse, I seriously considering just trolling in games now to see how low it can go, that seems like the only fun left … Doesnt seem to make a difference since every game there is either an afk-er or a dc-er anyway.

Supreme.3164:

I’m not an esl player, I’m not a god of pvp, I’m average at best and at very least I can rotate with a decent understanding of the map main mechanics so why…why at 1400 rating

When considerng that 1200 rating is the average – what’s wrong with your – above average – rating of 1400?

I agree that the difference between player quality in a match is too big – but is has been like this since forever. SoloQ, TeamQ, Ranked, Unranked, Season 1,2,3,4 – it has always been an issue. It doesn’t has much to do with the ranking/league system – which is imo by far the best this season – it is more an issue of too small playerbase. “Fixing” it would lead to much higher queue times – not sure if that’s worth it.

One problem is that two above average are stronger than one god + one rooky. Teh rooky will blow rotation and die on cleave and the god won´t win 1:2 on two decent players.

UmbraNoctis.1907:

Supreme.3164:

I’m not an esl player, I’m not a god of pvp, I’m average at best and at very least I can rotate with a decent understanding of the map main mechanics so why…why at 1400 rating

When considerng that 1200 rating is the average – what’s wrong with your – above average – rating of 1400?

I agree that the difference between player quality in a match is too big – but is has been like this since forever. SoloQ, TeamQ, Ranked, Unranked, Season 1,2,3,4 – it has always been an issue. It doesn’t has much to do with the ranking/league system – which is imo by far the best this season – it is more an issue of too small playerbase. “Fixing” it would lead to much higher queue times – not sure if that’s worth it.

Exactly.
Then again if ANet wants to bring more ESL or serious PvPers into the game, they should make a “lite” PvP client that doesn’t need to download all the PvE stuff and has a clean PvP only interface (that would replace the mists area). But this patch is a start. This patch brings in the very standard.

UmbraNoctis.1907:

Supreme.3164:

I’m not an esl player, I’m not a god of pvp, I’m average at best and at very least I can rotate with a decent understanding of the map main mechanics so why…why at 1400 rating

When considerng that 1200 rating is the average – what’s wrong with your – above average – rating of 1400?

I agree that the difference between player quality in a match is too big – but is has been like this since forever. SoloQ, TeamQ, Ranked, Unranked, Season 1,2,3,4 – it has always been an issue. It doesn’t has much to do with the ranking/league system – which is imo by far the best this season – it is more an issue of too small playerbase. “Fixing” it would lead to much higher queue times – not sure if that’s worth it.

I agree longer queues would be a pain, but, when you win a game easy or get hammered hard it’s not fun. I can see the skill gap in my matches, and lets not even start with bad comp matches. I’ve had one match with a balanced team comp on both sides. The team I was on lost, but that was because of a few things.
1) Some of the players on my team didn’t know how the secondary objectives worked, they didn’t know that the Sky hammer de-capped capped points.
2)They didn’t know how important it was to call or focus called targets.
3) Fighting on point. If one low health player disengaged from the fight, 2-3 of them would run off the point to chase after them.
4)The other team was just better. I can admit that, they where. Every single one of them knew what they where doing. Where they needed to be.

Now how can 2 teams be so vastly different? How can one team know what they are doing and the other be a total shambles? It’s simple. There is no real tutorial for people to learn how to play PvP. Yes it’s gear that people are playing. But to just throw them in and expect them to know how to swim is crazy, and we all know no one reads the map blurb at the start of a match.

I’m not saying Match making is easy to fix so most people are happy, but at the moment the skill gap between teams is visible just by playing the game.

Aereniel.7356:

Supreme.3164:

What these whiteknights don’t get is that nobody here is expecting to win every single match out there and yes we know that blow outs are to be expected but…at very least give us some consistency in the quality of our games

Please stop with the whiteknight labels. Look at my post history, I’m about the most cynical Anet critic who still has forum access. This is not about defending Anet, it’s about clearing up misinformation and misunderstanding regarding how skill rating systems work.

You’re asking for consistency of outcomes, and I’ve explained in a couple of posts already why that’s not going to happen without a lot of samples, if at all. No matter how tight you make the rating spread, there’s always going to be a strong element of volatility when you play a 5v5 team game with less than a full party. At this point in the season, the system has very low confidence on individual ratings, which makes the situation much worse. Matches will align on the curve better as the season progresses, if that’s any consolation, but I’m starting to think that you’re looking for a level of confidence that is, quite frankly, never going to happen.

I don’t think you fully understand….

Some people here as they win will get better teammates consistently…..for others as they win…their teammates will get worst:

1st victory :

you : 7-4-4-4-5
enemy 6 -4 -4 -4 -4

2st victory

you : 8-4-4-4-3
enemy 7 -4 -kitten

3rd Blow out defeat

you : 9-3-3-3-2
enemy 8 -5 5-5-6

The enemy gets better as you climb up the ladder as it should…but your team get gradually worst, anet idea of 50/50 system as you try to overcome this ratio..the system will give you worst and worst teammates so that you can’t escape the 50/50 division

It’s simply not a matter of luck, it’s a rigged system, you’re a 3x legend with 19k games on your back and for 3-4 matches you get teammates that share your same titles and closely related experience..you win games easily.

After that you start getting : kegbrawler, light in the darkness bunch of pvers….why?

Season 2 was the closest thing to perfect matchmaking that I ever experienced in this game, as I started climbing the ladder, my foes were getting much stronger…but the quality of the teams I was getting was indeed consistent, , I wasn’t getting kegbrawlers or similar, my games from s2 were mostly 500 to 400, 350 to 500 and so on.

After that season, everything got changed…500 to 20 or 50 to 500 kind of games, season 5 it’s not much different …still the same blowout matches.

The question is why is so difficult to create a system where a 5vs5 only happen between players with a 100-200 rating difference between them, that’s how it should but it’s not!

One team will be fully 1400 rating…other team will have a 1500 rating player with the rest of his team not even having 600 rating…an artificially created result…god knows the reason why.

P.S one possible reason..that defies any kind of possible logic is that anet has decided to place new players at 1200 rating and that’s completely illogical, when new players should start at 0 and climb their way up; it’s completely irrational.

New players starting at 1200 rating may well be the whole reason for the poor quality of the games, so this is a matter of bad management and got nothing to do with the limitations of the system

Madman.6912:

Evan Lesh.3295:

Everyone got a rating reset, at least wait until you place.

That’s a great idea, so basically it is up to total luck during your placement games, whether rng will be on your side and not the other team’s to determine your placement.
The problem with soul destroying games is that they are … soul destroying… a few like that in a supposedly improved system will quickly make me not caring and just tag along not even trying… because.. you know, what’s the point? I actually wanted to have some games before the new horizon stream but I just finished the 2nd game and it wasnt any better… already in a bad mood….

No.1: You care too much about winning in a game that doesn’t affect your real life in any meaningful way

No.2: You are complaining about a system that is pretty much a dice roll which you knew it was before pressing the queue button.

My conclusion is, if you don’t like soloq and you find it frustrating, don’t play soloq.

You say ratings are not balanced out? I thought the matchmaker tries to generate even matches. Just the better you get the more worse you teammates might get to compensate your skill. With the drawback that very low players can´t be carried even by pvp god´s… You have a cance to climb if you play above your MMR but int´s just a chance due to being dependent on the team.

Placements were pretty awful for me, got matched with the same people over and over the last few games in which half the team didn’t understand basic rotations. Some friends of equal skill got placed in top100, the randomness is real. I don’t feel like grinding for a month waiting for the miraculous perfect player spread, will probably play a game every three days just to not hit decay. You implemented placements forgetting how actually important they are, thinking that players will have the time and will to grind 100 games to get to where they belong. I’m done with five seasons of the same and don’t feel like alpha testing again. /peace

Let the kitten placements set bruh… :/

Honestly, judging a fledgling rating system is pretty unwise, especially if you judge it by the first 10 matches that are supposed to determine your actual skill.

The matchmaking started just yesterday yet some of you hate even if the system had no chance to stabilize.
Second thing is that yesterday played all gw2 pro players which made playing for normal players a lot harder. Third the system works quite well because already the best players were meeting each other and are on the top of the leaderboards. For example Helseth out something like 15 battle played 4 vs sind.

My first 10 matches were interesting, ended up 4-6. I figured in some of those cases I was playing out of my league and was looking forward to getting my ‘lower’ rating to have more competitive matches.

However.. after I got my rating I went on to lose 5 straight which was depressing At this point I was really questioning how this whole thing worked. I did go 4-2 after that before calling it a night and felt a little better about it.

Still way too early to judge this but hopefully when I play again I can run closer to a break even w/l and continue to learn and improve.

I like the fact we can still earn the tickets/shards for the cool stuff regardless of how much we (I) suck. I think this is good for the game mode in the long run because it will keep more people playing. More people is always good for any game mode.

Supreme.3164:

The question is why is so difficult to create a system where a 5vs5 only happen between players with a 100-200 rating difference between them, that’s how it should but it’s not!

One team will be fully 1400 rating…other team will have a 1500 rating player with the rest of his team not even having 600 rating…an artificially created result…god knows the reason why.

P.S one possible reason..that defies any kind of possible logic is that anet has decided to place new players at 1200 rating and that’s completely illogical, when new players should start at 0 and climb their way up; it’s completely irrational.

On paper, what you are proposing is not difficult at all. In practice, in the current state of low-population PvP, you would end up with unbearably long queue times. Narrow the rating spread and you end up waiting longer for queue pops, as the pool of acceptable pairings is smaller. If the rating cut-off is strict, at certain points of the day you’d get no games at all.

The current match maker adjusts the acceptable spread after 4 minutes, and after 8 minutes all bets are off. Even so, queue times are a problem at the extreme ends of rating, both high and low. It’s a trade-off between likely match quality and wait time.
As for new players starting at the middle of the distribution curve, believe it or not, the goal is to help them find their true rating quicker and thus mitigate suffering for them as well as for you. If you’re interested in a (math-heavy) explanation as to why, hit me up in PMs and I’ll shoot some literature your way.

ValusArtex.1425:

Literally the worst season lol.

No its isn’t

Also no. I expect this will be one of the best seasons. My concern is that some matches will be heavily influenced by low skill players that should practice 50+ more matches outside ranked. (be it new players or playing other classes they suck but are ranked to their main). I know adding a barrier of more matches before going ranked migh be discouraging for new players but it´s ranked and not new player/build training ground.

Dirame.8521:

Madman.6912:

Evan Lesh.3295:

Everyone got a rating reset, at least wait until you place.

That’s a great idea, so basically it is up to total luck during your placement games, whether rng will be on your side and not the other team’s to determine your placement.
The problem with soul destroying games is that they are … soul destroying… a few like that in a supposedly improved system will quickly make me not caring and just tag along not even trying… because.. you know, what’s the point? I actually wanted to have some games before the new horizon stream but I just finished the 2nd game and it wasnt any better… already in a bad mood….

No.1: You care too much about winning in a game that doesn’t affect your real life in any meaningful way

No.2: You are complaining about a system that is pretty much a dice roll which you knew it was before pressing the queue button.

My conclusion is, if you don’t like soloq and you find it frustrating, don’t play soloq.

Where did I mention winning or losing in that comment exactly? I have re-read it 5 times now and all I can see is complains about blowout games. I don’t mind losing 450-500, I DO mind losing 100-500, but than again I DO mind winning 500-100 as well, because it is not an enjoyable game

Sznurek.8791:

The matchmaking started just yesterday yet some of you hate even if the system had no chance to stabilize.
Second thing is that yesterday played all gw2 pro players which made playing for normal players a lot harder. Third the system works quite well because already the best players were meeting each other and are on the top of the leaderboards. For example Helseth out something like 15 battle played 4 vs sind.

So you are basically saying that how seasons should “start” is that nobody should play a game because it is pro-player time to play first, then the rest can come after?

Because I do know that you are right of course, this happened last season as well , first few days was nearly impossible to play properly, but guess what, last season we had the pip safeties so us “normal” player (not pro-s if you will) could maybe still enjoy or at least try playing a game we like, but now you are essentially saying that lots of us got screwed because we started playing when the season actually started?

Just to make it clear, I am not bashing the system here, I aplogize if it sounded that way, I have a problem with the execution of it in conjunction with the MMR soft reset. The system might become something good, I am only saying that there should have been a pre-season for a week let’s say, when you can play with the MMR reset to get a base for your MMR in this new system and THEN the placements should have had a basis to create matches for players that aren’t random.

Then you get absolute trash like this.

Like seriously, MMR is only part of the issue

You might as well have handed them the pips in advance

I just won a game with 3 thieves on my team. I would have been upset, if the enemy team would get the win in advance …

UmbraNoctis.1907:

I just won a game with 3 thieves on my team. I would have been upset, if the enemy team would get the win in advance …

That’s not the point and you know it. 2 thieves with PVE titles on a three thief team against 2 DHs and 2 Warriors and a bunker Necro. Balancing could’ve put a DH and a War on each team. Instead it simply let one team bunker trap 2 points the whole game straight up, while the other 3 rotated between the two. We were fighting the matchmaking.

I hate this entire system… I get put into games with 3 power warrs or 2 power necros and the like, the class stacking is insane. Not only that, but I also get put in teams with people that will happily go 4 at a time to rush C with no one there.

So now this system has decided that I suck and I get to play with other people that suck until the end of the season. So fun. Much wow.

Madman.6912:

Sznurek.8791:

The matchmaking started just yesterday yet some of you hate even if the system had no chance to stabilize.
Second thing is that yesterday played all gw2 pro players which made playing for normal players a lot harder. Third the system works quite well because already the best players were meeting each other and are on the top of the leaderboards. For example Helseth out something like 15 battle played 4 vs sind.

So you are basically saying that how seasons should “start” is that nobody should play a game because it is pro-player time to play first, then the rest can come after?

Because I do know that you are right of course, this happened last season as well , first few days was nearly impossible to play properly, but guess what, last season we had the pip safeties so us “normal” player (not pro-s if you will) could maybe still enjoy or at least try playing a game we like, but now you are essentially saying that lots of us got screwed because we started playing when the season actually started?

Just to make it clear, I am not bashing the system here, I aplogize if it sounded that way, I have a problem with the execution of it in conjunction with the MMR soft reset. The system might become something good, I am only saying that there should have been a pre-season for a week let’s say, when you can play with the MMR reset to get a base for your MMR in this new system and THEN the placements should have had a basis to create matches for players that aren’t random.

Anet’s pvp staff are basically caught in a catch-22 situation: we all want matches that are exactly equal right (actually not everyone does but let’s pretend they do)? The way to make matches equal is by creating a metric, such as your MMR, and then match people whose metric values are closest to one another’s. Problem is this: Anet decided that their old way of evaluating people’s skill was bad, so they reset our MMR. That leads to an inability to actually balance people based on MMR, hence the 10 placements matches to get an approximate MMR. From there they hope you’ll keep playing, and throughout this very long season you’ll get closer and closer to an accurate MMR.

I know you probably understood all of that before I explained it, but what you’re proposing isn’t really any different; if we played for a week after the soft reset, we’d still be playing unbalanced blowout matches while the system tried to correctly sort us into the correct division. The only difference would be that these initial placement matches wouldn’t show up in your total win/losses, which seems to be what you care about. Obviously it would still affect your MMR/ranking, because those two things are the same. So if you’re worried about having a few more wins or losses than you think you should have then I understand, placement matches shouldn’t count towards those totals. But your proposed solution wouldn’t affect your MMR any differently.

Evan Lesh.3295:

Everyone got a rating reset, at least wait until you place.

WAIT! So 7 wins 3 losses making 1350 rating, while 9 wins 1 loss makes 2050 rating??? makes sense Evan… and no, it’s not rating reset if your previous MMR affects your rating with this new system. Good job. You got another player moving to WvW from PvP.

Mutaatti.2789:

Evan Lesh.3295:

Everyone got a rating reset, at least wait until you place.

WAIT! So 7 wins 3 losses making 1350 rating, while 9 wins 1 loss makes 2050 rating??? makes sense Evan… and no, it’s not rating reset if your previous MMR affects your rating with this new system. Good job. You got another player moving to WvW from PvP.

Hmm. 7 wins 3 losses isn’t bad. My question to you is, are you enjoying PvP? If so, keep at it!

Well, done with the season, i gave it time through the placement matches, did a few matches after…i can say, since release i never had such a bad time playing pvp. The matches been absolute garbage.

Mutaatti.2789:

Evan Lesh.3295:

Everyone got a rating reset, at least wait until you place.

WAIT! So 7 wins 3 losses making 1350 rating, while 9 wins 1 loss makes 2050 rating??? makes sense Evan… and no, it’s not rating reset if your previous MMR affects your rating with this new system. Good job. You got another player moving to WvW from PvP.

Huehuehue. Don’t expect WvW to be any more fair than PvP. Arguably it is worse.

So for initial placement matches people are interested in playing as relaxed as possible, because it results in more “easy wins” afterwards? Especially if initial matches can have widely different player skills? Should we just wait for all PvP pros to be washed out of lower tiers in a few days or…?

Bugabuga.9721:

So for initial placement matches people are interested in playing as relaxed as possible, because it results in more “easy wins” afterwards? Especially if initial matches can have widely different player skills? Should we just wait for all PvP pros to be washed out of lower tiers in a few days or…?

I thought the whole point of the placement matches was so the “pro” players where we’ll out of the lower divisions. If this is not true, then I call the whole thing a fail already.

I know the folks in Anet have the best of the intentions, but all they do in pvp start from a flawed premisse: Everyone playing pvp is playing to win.

The old system allowed some “unworthy” people to rise up, but compared to what it is now, it was golden.

This new system is a bad idea badly done. So you have a “start test”, so you have a marvelous “matchmaking” for speed queues. It is predicated in that flawed assumption and forces people to be judged by the team they are in.

No matter how much effort and skill you put on playing, if you get 5 teams composed of people who are there just for loot and park in the middle of the map fighting all matches, you will be judged as bad as they are.

There is no single reason for people to make an effort to play skillfully if they get a bad team of bad people who are intentionally bad.

The changes just made it worse. Now you are stuck with the luck (or lack of) that you have in the first fights, because you forever matched with that you were before.

Still, it avoids nothing you said it does, because people can just play in certain times of the day, make 2 teams of 2 and be very often matched one with another, and if they dont, they know who they are playing against, and make just a compadre match.

In the end, you just did what often people do when they dont understand their crowd and just their system: you punished the ones doing right along with those doing wrong.

The end of the story is. This is a amazing casual social MMO with tiny PvP support with balances happening only every 3 or 4 months. Not a Competitive skill based dedicated PvP game, where the balance teams balances 60 plus characters, hundreds of skills, and even more items, have more then just 1 Ranked PvP game mode, many other Unranked mode, every two weeks some times shorter if something is too brokenly overpowered.

Yes in GW2 because of it’s one pvp mode conquest 3 point mechanics. One personal can “NEVER” carry a match no matter how good they are if they get team mates that just have no clue in Ranked. Other dedicated PvP games make getting to Ranked a journey in it’s own. Hundreds of hours of game play require, plus other prerequisites. In GW2 getting to be able to play and troll Rank is just too trivial in my honest opinion.

Then the RNG matches in GW2’s Ranked matches at a consistent rate. My First Opinion of Season 5 is that it’s going to be the same as the other seasons with super poor match making quality from start to end for most of the PvPers. The main reasons of this is Class Stacking, Not being able to counter your enemies team comp mid match, and people with so little pvp experience that they are useless to the poor players who actually get them on their teams, balance patches only every 3 to 4 months. Till those are at least addressed and sorted, in my opinion GW2’s Ranked PvP leagues will never be about skill, but about how many matches you can spam, and how much MM favors you vs others you play against.

Now if I can come back to these forums next week. See that there is actually a different tune being hummed then I will be pleasantly surprised and will gladly with open arms take back all I’ve said in this post. Again I don’t hold my breath, being this is a PvE MMO and not a Dedicated PvP game.

The matchmaking system changes but the only thing that doesn’t change is the complaints. Some of you need to give it a rest and let the rating solid up some. Some of you are just bad and still in denial since you had the groups banned your looking for another excuse why your still failing.

In the end regardless if enough players are available you have to make a limit how much the highes and lowers rating in a team is apart. Say 500 points. So if the higest player is at 1500 the lowest cant be below 1000. Or you make a barrier like you can only play a CLASS in ranked PvP after 50 victories in unranked …

Drussthelegend.2630:

The matchmaking system changes but the only thing that doesn’t change is the complaints. Some of you need to give it a rest and let the rating solid up some. Some of you are just bad and still in denial since you had the groups banned your looking for another excuse why your still failing.

I think it’s sad people still use this arguement. You can be subject of bad composition, bad players and class stacking yet no matter how insanely good you play a lost match is a loss of MMR. For a pug system that just isn’t good enough.

So I’d been gone from the game since Spring of 2015 (pre-HoT) and based on the forums and general chat I’d assumed PvP was completely awful. I’m still working on my initial 10 matches (I was short on time yesterday) but in the 6 I’ve played so far, 5 were really good games overall (good fights, good rotations, not a total blow out on either side) and I’m 6-0 so far.

So many people in this thread are acting like getting randomly placed on a few bad teams will ruin your rating during the initial 10 – I find that unlikely. However, if you’ve had 5 bad matches in a row and you’re blaming your team each time maybe it’s time to rethink why you’re losing so many matches. Sure it could be bad luck and you’re a great PvPer who happens to get matched with scrubs for 5 matches in a row…or it could be that you’re contributing to losing the match :p

Lost my first 5 placement matches.

I decided to go Ele this season, problem is, there doesn’t ever seem to be enough dps on my team. I even got top damage in a match… as a support ele… with a necro and rev on my team WTF!

I guess i’ll be back on DH this season XD