Guild Wars 2

Short of asking my team for assistance, how do I deal with you on Kyhlo CT when you’re nuking me from a window/ledge and I’m fighting someone on point as a bunker guard?

doesnt matter, wait for nerf. let them enjoy it for a few more weeks.

nerva.7940:

doesnt matter, wait for nerf. let them enjoy it for a few more weeks.

Necros suck already, lay off. You act like wells actually do damage.

Only bads stay in them, and they last for 5 seconds (with an obscene CD) and hit for maybe 500~ a hit? This is a L2P.

A bunker guardian complaining about this? Are you serious? Only one of the most OP classes ATM has the audacity to QQ about the worst class in the game right now, well at least one of the worst.

oh ok only bads on point cant dodge the 10 AOE abilities that a scepter/dagger/staff/well spamming necro has at his disposal. maybe because theyre on point? and the aoe covers the entire circle? and it’s spammable? >.<

nerva.7940:

oh ok only bads on point cant dodge the 10 AOE abilities that a scepter/dagger/staff/well spamming necro has at his disposal. maybe because theyre on point? and the aoe covers the entire circle? and it’s spammable? >.<

Now you are complaining about two entirely different things. You are simply complaining about a class with some AOE abilities. The AOE nerf will not effect necros, they were talking about eles mostly.

This is about the only thing necros are currently good at, if you take this away from them, they will revolt like crazy, and you will need to revamp most of the class (although this already is in a dire need to be done)…

Necros role is to pressure people, notice he isn’t complaining about getting insta gibbed by necro, simply pressured in a 2v1, which dear lord I hope he is!

Divinity.8041:

nerva.7940:

doesnt matter, wait for nerf. let them enjoy it for a few more weeks.

Necros suck already, lay off. You act like wells actually do damage.

Only bads stay in them, and they last for 5 seconds (with an obscene CD) and hit for maybe 500~ a hit? This is a L2P.

A bunker guardian complaining about this? Are you serious? Only one of the most OP classes ATM has the audacity to QQ about the worst class in the game right now, well at least one of the worst.

Clearly we’ve hit a nerve…
You misunderstood my question. I am not QQing about necros or claiming anything of the sort. I am merely asking for advice on how do deal with the fact that I have to stand on point or risk getting decapped. But it becomes tricky when someone is dropping AoE on the point from a place I can’t access.

So, if you’d like to provide some insight, please do. Otherwise, please keep your unkind thoughts to yourself.

don’t stand in the well?

if you can’t leave the point then save your channeled block for the well? it only lasts 5 sec, you should be able to negate most if not all of it.

I don’t see much of anything wrong with Necro wells. I’m not a huge fan of that particularly tactic though. standing above everyone and spamming is boring and cheap (necro’s were not the first ones to invent this either and nerfing them just means someone else will be standing up there) I don’t see why the balcony (or whatever you want to call it) needs to be there. Why not just have it blow up the same time the wall is destroyed by the treb?

Wells are at best mediocre damage (only 2 wells actually do any damage I believe) on a minimum 45 second cooldown. And even when specced into marks the are mostly lackluster damage with the exception of staff #4 which may hit for like 1200 and is on a 25 second CD. I find it really odd that the op bunker class that can spam hammer #2 aoe knocking everyone 10 yards off point would be concerned with wells or marks keeping you off point.

nerva.7940:

oh ok only bads on point cant dodge the 10 AOE abilities that a scepter/dagger/staff/well spamming necro has at his disposal. maybe because theyre on point? and the aoe covers the entire circle? and it’s spammable? >.<

outside of the AA, there is nothing “spammable” about staff skills or wells. all of them besides staff #2 (5 sec CD) have CDs of 20 sec or longer.

I must be doing something terribly wrong in my gameplay.

Apparently, there is a way to avoid trebuche shots, thief clusters, mesmer shatters while also being able to dodge/block wells on clocktower.

I have absolutely no clue how I’ve been winning games vs all the top teams when I can’t do this, could anyone make a video showing how?

I must also be playing a completely different game than you guys because from what I can tell 9/10 teams run a necromancer despite them apparently being in a terrible spot.

nerva.7940:

doesnt matter, wait for nerf. let them enjoy it for a few more weeks.

omg cant you stop whining.They said they will tone down aoe not that they will destroy necros,eles,engies and whatever counters you or you hate and then ascend you into god
..My god this topic is stupid.
Tip:If you really think they will adjust aoe by just nerfing then you are mistaken.Many single target skills should be buffed or major weaponsets for many classes will became obsolete.Staff ele for the matter is already extinct in spvp..

Oni.5429:

I must be doing something terribly wrong in my gameplay.

Apparently, there is a way to avoid trebuche shots, thief clusters, mesmer shatters while also being able to dodge/block wells on clocktower.

I have absolutely no clue how I’ve been winning games vs all the top teams when I can’t do this, could anyone make a video showing how?

I must also be playing a completely different game than you guys because from what I can tell 9/10 teams run a necromancer despite them apparently being in a terrible spot.

I wasn’t aware necros had wells that summon shortbow thieves, shatter mesmers, and seige weapons… clearly necros need a nerf

wells last for 5s and they are on 45s cd……if you and your team are staying in them thats your fault man…..its like saying going against the wall that knock you down and then complain on forums you cant pass through that wall for 5s and its OP

BTW necros cant spam mesmers thieves trebuchets etc on you…..pitty it could be our new elite maybe ANET?

hackks.3687:

Oni.5429:

I must be doing something terribly wrong in my gameplay.

Apparently, there is a way to avoid trebuche shots, thief clusters, mesmer shatters while also being able to dodge/block wells on clocktower.

I have absolutely no clue how I’ve been winning games vs all the top teams when I can’t do this, could anyone make a video showing how?

I must also be playing a completely different game than you guys because from what I can tell 9/10 teams run a necromancer despite them apparently being in a terrible spot.

I wasn’t aware necros had wells that summon shortbow thieves, shatter mesmers, and seige weapons… clearly necros need a nerf

I’m describing the average scenario on Kyhlo. Your response of ‘’just dodge it’’ is extremely unrealistic since chances are that in a game with good players you can’t always ‘’just dodge it’’

nerva.7940:

doesnt matter, wait for nerf. let them enjoy it for a few more weeks.

Pretty tough to take anything you say seriously at this point when you have created a thread complaining about BS thief, created a thread complaining about condi/stealth thief, posted in the power well necro thread about how OP they are, posted in the d/d ele thread about how OP they are —- yet in all of these claimed that you never die to any of them… mmmk. Just sayin, starting to get a bit tired and annoying… imo of course.

I suppose the best way to deal with it would have to be getting the necromancer down from the higher ground, with help from another team member. It will probably force him into wasting plague form if you pull him into the middle of the fuss, so you’d have to deal with that after. He might still manage to lay down his wells, but he won’t be able to burst properly if he’s being pressured.

Also look out for/kill flesh wurms otherwise the necro can just quickly get back to his spot, even though he shouldn’t be using it if he’s running with wells.

Hop off point when he drops the wells. Doesn’t matter if it gets neuted. It should get neuted in a 2v1. If your teammates aren’t there fast enough it’s on them, or they’re off winning somewhere else where the battle is uneven for the opposing side.
Just pop your condi clear cds and stay alive for as long as you can while knocking the gaurd off point so that you yourself can get off point and LOS the necros scepter 1 spam. You can also try teleporting to the necro and knocking him clear off of CT if he’s in a bad position.
Hope this helps.

Davinci.8027:

Hop off point when he drops the wells. Doesn’t matter if it gets neuted. It should get neuted in a 2v1. If your teammates aren’t there fast enough it’s on them, or they’re off winning somewhere else where the battle is uneven for the opposing side.
Just pop your condi clear cds and stay alive for as long as you can while knocking the gaurd off point so that you yourself can get off point and LOS the necros scepter 1 spam. You can also try teleporting to the necro and knocking him clear off of CT if he’s in a bad position.
Hope this helps.

Thanks a lot!

Leadfoot.9071:

nerva.7940:

doesnt matter, wait for nerf. let them enjoy it for a few more weeks.

Pretty tough to take anything you say seriously at this point when you have created a thread complaining about BS thief, created a thread complaining about condi/stealth thief, posted in the power well necro thread about how OP they are, posted in the d/d ele thread about how OP they are —- yet in all of these claimed that you never die to any of them… mmmk. Just sayin, starting to get a bit tired and annoying… imo of course.

who’s complaining? im simply summarizing the way the community feels. and you will take me seriously when these nerfs occur, which they will.

aoe has been on the chopping block for a few months, and the only reason they havent nerfed the BS thief is because they havent had the time to open the box full of crap that is the thief, i.e. they havent had the chance to buff all its other builds before nerfing the only “viable” one.

Actual on topic advice for the Op.

If someones where you cant reach, you cant reach em, simple as that. theres only a few things u can try.

1. blcok can kite u a bit through wells.
2. sometimes the wells wont cover all the point stand in the area it doesnt.
3. its ok to step off point for a second or two then back on, especially if u can then knock off the person ur fighting on point.

and most importantly 4.

get a team that helps you by taking out the necro. 2on1, you cant hold a point by yourself assuming ur fighting equally skilled players, eventually they will get you.

I don’t get why people have to be rude and condescending, all this person asked for is help, so either try and provide it or just say nothing at all; this really represents what is wrong with this community right now, all to eager to get at each others throats.

Anyways OP, I don’t think there is much you can do in the situation apart than asking for help, you can use your dodge roll or get off the point provided that you won’t end up giving the point away for a neut; also you need to be careful about using your “Shelter” (provided that is the heal your running), since necro is probably the only class that can interrupt that heal using the fear mark, but that is really down to the skill level of the necro, you can probably get away with using the heal anyway.

Try and dodge around and use your condi clear before healing, just basically try and maximize the efficiency of when you use your condi clears etc.

Sorry not much of a bunker player myself, hopefully that was some what useful

I think the appropriate question is, can you usually 1v2 against other professions successfully? I think the point here is that you’re fighting a necro and one of his teammates. Plus, necros are mostly attrition-based, and attrition=death by a thousand pinpricks, i.e. you can’t aegis that.

I don’t usually see guardians winning 1v2 against any two professions (except those under rank 15 or so) and your chances are much smaller when one of them is an anti-bunker. The way I see it, if you’ve got a necro and somebody else attacking you, your teammates have about 15 seconds (if you’re a good guardian) to save your hide.

Thank you very much for all the help and tips, guys!

Xeph.4513:

I don’t get why people have to be rude and condescending, all this person asked for is help, so either try and provide it or just say nothing at all; this really represents what is wrong with this community right now, all to eager to get at each others throats.

^
This exactly. Thank you for bringing it up first. It’s nice to see one of the more dedicated players showing that you don’t have to be a jerk to compete in pvp.

It’s really tough. At least I can’t figure out a way to survive for a super long time.

The wells aren’t much of a problem. Most of the time you can find a spot on the point where they aren’t laid down. Also, if it means getting off the point for a little bit then get off the point.

The tough part is the sustained damage. And then watching for knockbacks from the other bunker at the same time. You’re going to die without help, and even with help you need the right kind of help. You need someone that can take care of the necro. Thief is probably the best option.

With that said, there’s no rule that says you have to fight on mid. You can go mid at the start alone, and if they have that necro/guardian in mid then leave and go for the outside points. Some teams we play just ignore mid completely. You can always go back and try to neutral the point with knockbacks later (if you bring them).

Believe me, I get ignored on mid a lot. No reason your team can’t either!

One thing I see a ton of guardians do that I love to see as a necro is pop one of there utilities that gives them a bunch of buffs when they see me. This is about the worst thing you can do going into a fight with a necro. We pop corrupt boon which converts all you boons into conditions. Its the closest thing we necros have to an insta gib as it usually drains a guardian down fast.

kailin.4905:

Wells are at best mediocre damage (only 2 wells actually do any damage I believe) on a minimum 45 second cooldown. And even when specced into marks the are mostly lackluster damage with the exception of staff #4 which may hit for like 1200 and is on a 25 second CD. I find it really odd that the op bunker class that can spam hammer #2 aoe knocking everyone 10 yards off point would be concerned with wells or marks keeping you off point.

You seem to be implying that hammer #2 does aoe knockback, I hope this isn’t the case.

Follidus.8027:

It’s really tough. At least I can’t figure out a way to survive for a super long time.

The wells aren’t much of a problem. Most of the time you can find a spot on the point where they aren’t laid down. Also, if it means getting off the point for a little bit then get off the point.

The tough part is the sustained damage. And then watching for knockbacks from the other bunker at the same time. You’re going to die without help, and even with help you need the right kind of help. You need someone that can take care of the necro. Thief is probably the best option.

With that said, there’s no rule that says you have to fight on mid. You can go mid at the start alone, and if they have that necro/guardian in mid then leave and go for the outside points. Some teams we play just ignore mid completely. You can always go back and try to neutral the point with knockbacks later (if you bring them).

Believe me, I get ignored on mid a lot. No reason your team can’t either!

Pretty much this ^^ . If i may add some little things…

First of all, realize you are fighting 1v2 on point and there isnt a lot of thing you can do about it but calling help. In my opinion, necro is one of the worst macht up for guardians in game. They can inflict poison and weakness, rip your boons AND you cant block their marks because of Greater Marks trait which is most of guardian’s defense coming from block.
Little tips;
If they are using flesh wurm, they cant rip your boons.
If they are not using flesh wurm, they dont have any stun breakers.
If they are copying Powerr’s well necro build, they are going with no defense other then death shroud and at the start of game they have nearly no life force. Put a thief behind the necro and watch them go paranoid. And your thief should practice 1v1 with a necro a lot.
Wells on 40 sec cd. Dont afraid of wells that much.
And I think the most important thing is signet of undeath, if someone goes down from other team, one of your teammeates should cc necro quick.

Sry for poor english..

Well…

Sometimes i use power or hybrid build with wells , yeah its very good for small points and team fight but:

- Wells are easy to escape
- Wells have big cd
- In this build Necro is a glass cannon so he is easy to kill
- On graveyard is hard to use wells on such a big point

We all know that condi build was the best for necro but now teams are using a lot of condi remuvals so its hard to kill smb using only condition. Necro has no mobility , in this build even DS wont gave in so much survi , thiefs can easly onecombo you and the dmg in that build it not so hight comparing to other class aoe.

And when u are fight against team who have such a necro , just focus him , if u have thief on team tell him that necro is his main target.

To all that complain about necro , dont lament about class witch is in my opinion one of the most balanced classes in the game

Flesh wurm on upper ct spot sitting there hitting you while you can’t go up and reach it while defending? Let’s talk about it…

at the time than teams go for 3 points necro is nothing compared with trap ranger …

I don’t understand what are is the op talking about. What’s your trouble? Wells do too much dmg to stay in or necros kill you from the windows?

I had read the thread and i think you are talking about a ranged class hitting you from the windows, so is not only necros, shortbow thief, ranger,… You haven’t got trouble with them hitting you from the window?

Airdrie.1706:

I had read the thread and i think you are talking about a ranged class hitting you from the windows, so is not only necros, shortbow thief, ranger,…

Flesh wurm hits you while the necro can do everything else everywhere else…it’s a bit different from someone shooting you with a bow or somethin from a window…it’s like a self teleport engi turret…on a necro..

Don’t you get it ? Everytime something is wrong about class designs and how it interacts with pvp map designs, there is absoultely, in fact, nothing wrong, all you have to do is use one of your 1689123 available dodge.

Mesmers ? Dodge it, kill it
Wells ? Dodge it, kill it
22222222 ? Dodge it, kill it
Bunker eles ? Dodge it, kill it
Homing pets and clones ? Dodge it, kill it
And so forth, dodge it kill it, dodge the entire map and kill it man, be for real !

LOL. The Saltiness in these forums Are high. Well bombing is a pretty niche build . When wells are on cd like 30 sec any class that sticks can kill power bombing necro unless they have full ds and the necro lands all ss and in a open space landscape.

I do love when people ignore necro bomber. it makes life so much easier. Everyone just dies on point. people srsly need to sthap ignoring the 50 ft tall green demon LOL.

Acandis.3250:

Short of asking my team for assistance, how do I deal with you on Kyhlo CT when you’re nuking me from a window/ledge and I’m fighting someone on point as a bunker guard?

is this a 1v1? if so, walk off the point, and if he tries to jump on it just man handle him away from it like you’d do if he’s on the point. If this is a 2v1 (bunkers get into these situations after all) then throw the other guy down the stairs and get off the point until you need to get back on… pretty simple stuff…

Even if a necro is dropping aoes on a point they still can’t take the point from you so the necro is basically wasting his time unless he has help. You can still hold the point until help arrives.

Well, one could say that you’re unlikely to go down instantly, as a bunker.
You’ll be taking a lot of damage that you can’t counter, but that’s where your team comes in.

Consider him a harasser that someone needs to peel.

Radahan.8649:

First of all, realize you are fighting 1v2 on point and there isnt a lot of thing you can do about it but calling help. In my opinion, necro is one of the worst macht up for guardians in game. They can inflict poison and weakness, rip your boons AND you cant block their marks because of Greater Marks trait which is most of guardian’s defense coming from block.
Little tips;
If they are using flesh wurm, they cant rip your boons.
If they are not using flesh wurm, they dont have any stun breakers.
If they are copying Powerr’s well necro build, they are going with no defense other then death shroud and at the start of game they have nearly no life force. Put a thief behind the necro and watch them go paranoid. And your thief should practice 1v1 with a necro a lot.
Wells on 40 sec cd. Dont afraid of wells that much.
And I think the most important thing is signet of undeath, if someone goes down from other team, one of your teammeates should cc necro quick.

Sry for poor english..

There’s a whole lot of useless flaming and pointless defensiveness in this thread. Ignore it all and listen to this guys instead. Coming from a necro player; those are some VERY good tips and very much worth listening to.

I’d also like to echo what others have said: If they’re 2v1ing you it means your team has an advantage somewhere else. Make use of that. You can not ever expect to actually win solo against two people of similar skill. But you can either make them waste a lot of time on you, or you can punish them for diverting more resources to the point than your team are.

Best wishes from your friendly neighborhood squirrel

I’d like to add to Radahan’s post that if he is running power (which makes the wells hit hard), then Guardian counters him pretty soundly. In this case he is up against the Guardian’s quite formidable toughness.

It is the bleed stacking, condi-necros you have to watch out for as they are up against the Guardian’s pretty pathetic life pool.

That said, here would be my tactic against a well on point. Use one of the Guardian’s knockdowns to try and push the attack on the point off of the point (as in off the ledge, even down the stairs with some luck). Then, step out of the well, wait the 5 seconds, then step back onto the point.

Again, if this is a condi-mancer you’ll likely still have problems 1v2 on the point (those conditions are going to catch up to you with or without the well).

Divinity.8041:

nerva.7940:

doesnt matter, wait for nerf. let them enjoy it for a few more weeks.

Necros suck already, lay off. You act like wells actually do damage.

Only bads stay in them, and they last for 5 seconds (with an obscene CD) and hit for maybe 500~ a hit? This is a L2P.

A bunker guardian complaining about this? Are you serious? Only one of the most OP classes ATM has the audacity to QQ about the worst class in the game right now, well at least one of the worst.

It’d be pretty wrong if you could hold a point against a necro laying out full aoe and his teammate — they’d be useless if they couldn’t force a single guardian off point. The suggestion is to have a teammate come help; all ti takes is a fellow ele to throw some healing on you and you’ll be fine. Or have a mesmer pull off the necro with Into The Void.

I know being a bunker guardian gives people the impression that they should be able to keep the point from God, but that’s really not how the game should play. It’s OK to hold a point against a single player, but not against many.

All maps have different strategies that are more effective than others.

A scepter necro using power wells won’t be specced for good dmg. Anywho a good general bet is running a 0/0/10/30/30 shout (soldier rune) guardian. Rune double shouts (like hold the line / save urselves + stability shout) for 4x cleanse removal. F2 will give u 3 condi removal aoe. If you spec for longer elite you get 5 secs of invincibility with ur elite. Combined with a 2 second block, 3 dodge rolls (sigil of energy), sword (so you can roll off point and get back on), and judge’s intervention (incase u get cc’d off) you shouldn’t ’have any problem 2 v 1ing until your team can respond.

The well that converts boons can conditions can be negated by the shouts.

If the necro is on the ledge you can que up 4 on hammer (the knockback) an djudge’s intervention to knock them off the ledge. Use your sword to get back to mid point.