Guild Wars 2

This has nothing to do with ColinJohanson just a great quote from a dev which any of them prolly would have said.
This is not a staff callout and does not require Anet’s reply.
This is to clear up the confusion that some players have about GW2’s promises
And this is a follow up on
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/pvp/pvp/JonPeters-6-unique-features-bi-montly-pics/first#post2788479

ColinJohanson.2394:

However, what’s not ok is saying stuff like we “promised in jan” we would have new rewards this year. In January, we said we would be doing custom arenas, leader boards, and spectator mode. We did all of those things.

PLEASE START HERE
Heres ColinJohanson’s promises “in the first half of the New Year.”
https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/colin-johanson-on-guild-wars-2-in-the-months-ahead/

1. “growing by leaps and bounds over the course of 2013”
2. “we’ll be evaluating our PvP reward systems and overhauling the way PvP operates to make it feel more rewarding and exciting and to give you reasons to log in and compete every day.”
3. “We’ll be adding systems that make it easier for players who are less competitive to get matched only against people with similar skill sets”

This is where it gets confusing.
Colin (if I may call him that) did promise at the very beginning of the news article they were “in the first half of the New Year.”
But under Hey, What About the PvP!? that the promises were meant “over the course of 2013”

1. Growing? skipping this
2. Rewards? Compete every day for PVP daily achievement for laurels?
3. adding system? MMR never happened correctly.

Colin later in the quote talked about in July they promises PAX, SoloQ, Legendaries, Reward system again?

Now I wont go on saying;
PAX+MLG both ended in a very fast unfair/not very competitive 3-0
SoloQ! Glaring unfair MMR/not very competitive (which is being worked on)
Legendaries! Ok lets see this.
2nd reward system revamp this year/next January! We need more details on this.

Just wondering what the community’s opinion on SPVP is right now? DISCUSS

@Bhawb

Oh trust me I wasn’t irresponsible or careless, great trolling tho.
You know the intent of the post.

“Quote this part next time you respond” Colin was blatantly avoiding the players inquiry about PvP rewards in his quote to Hooma saying he accomplished all 3 goals he set for himself; Spectator/LBs/CustomArenas and not saying a word about evaluating Pvp rewards for the past 10 months, which they said they were doing in the news article.

You and Colin both knew Hoomas concern and are picking at the word promise.

When you address the community in a news letter saying “Your going to do something” and signing it at the bottom, its the same as promising that or a contract.

The final result of this topic is as follows.
The 1% population of this game who PvPs is in the ghetto part of the city with a broken/leaking home.

We got 3 things fulfilled from January;

1. $20 Custom arenas; you need to pay real money or grind hours of Pve to obtain
2. Spectator mode; I think I heard was worse than GW1 in anycase is bad for shoutcasting.
3. LBS; Which is easier to obtain rank 1 if you don’t play for a month since every1s mmr is decreasing.
   I Felt more progression in Halo PvP rank than glory rank or any rewards GW2 has currently.
   All my friends are 20 ranks higher than me since I decided not to skyhammer farm with them.

Simply put we are missing progression from PvP. Its still more fun than Wow I guess, that ghostcrawler I tell ya…..

Full quote for anyone who wanted it.

hooma.9642:

hooma.9642:

the Problem is it was promised january to be released start of the second part of this year. and now u talk about basics at the end of the year or next january.

I think it’s totally reasonable to say you’d like to see progress faster, and no shocker so would we! We all play PvP all the time too, and want everything done as quickly as possible, folks are working very long hours to try and accomplish just that.

However, what’s not ok is saying stuff like we “promised in jan” we would have new rewards this year. In January, we said we would be doing custom arenas, leader boards, and spectator mode. We did all of those things.

In July, we said we’re going to do a tournament at PAX, have separate solo and team queues for PvP, add ways to get you progressing towards legendaries in PvP, and updating the reward systems for PvP. We’ve accomplished half of those goals already, and hope to have made some real progress towards rewards/legendaries before the end of the year, which still has 2 months to go. In working on rewards, we decided we wanted to do something that’s very work intensive and much cooler for PvP players, so not all of it will be done this year.

Anyway I just want to call this out that having expectations, and providing critical feedback is fantastic, it’s how we all grow and make a better game together. But if we’re going to take the time to try and communicate and, it’s only fair you take the time to properly represent what we’ve said when criticizing it.

Why the huge preamble; why not just ask "What is your opinion on SPvP" if your goal is not to call Colin out? lol.

@docMed
To clear up confusion for players who might have thought something else.
I fixed the full quote which might have been why you were confused.

So, I was going to go back and re-read all of the promises to try to point out all the empty promises, but I don’t have the patience anymore. I log in, I play the same game mode I’ve been playing for 14 months. I soloq in a broken matchmaking system and a disgusting leaderboard. I do all of this with empty hopes that it will get better before the other games that have my attention come out. I suggest you do the same. I don’t have the energy to carry on these battles with the devs anymore.

@felivear
This isnt at the devs this is for the players

Krayiss.4926:

@felivear
This isnt at the devs this is for the players

lol ok. then i don’t have the energy to battle with the players anymore. :P

Krayiss.4926:

@felivear
This isnt at the devs this is for the players

All 20 of them……

Or did another team leave since I last looked? Hard to keep up with everyone running for the door at the same time.

To actually answer the question being posed, I no longer see the purpose of SPvP. It isn’t rewarding. The balance is off so it isn’t fun. Oh, and the rank system has no value.

In short, PvP just doesn’t have anything to show for it. I can’t even win any backpiece covers in PvP to take them to show off in PvE (yet for some reason, I can show off my PvE backpiece skins, like meta rewards, in PvP).

So, I’m not making any leveling progress on my character, I’m not making any money on my character, and I’m not having fun on my character. The only thing I’m doing is winning aesthetic rewards that can only be seen by the few others that are playing PvP.

I might as well go back to Call of Duty (already max prestige). At least my hard work and rewards sparkle in that game (gold camo).

Ya the future of SPvP can look grim at times

@Jcvroe
Progress/Backpieces would be cool reward whenever they add some for Pvp

Right not their isn’t much of a purpose in SPvP. Until they add rewards of something. I mean PAX + MLG offered a huge money reward which may have sparked some players. But the low amount of views and the final matches ending in 3-0 was very saddening.

0 competition in this game. Just a 1 side slaughter.

about legendaries.

“Lets get some legendaries in sPvP”

the next part of the story is

“Lets get my legendary which i acquired in PvP be used in PvE.”

Win!

Down with the PvE kitteners!

1. “growing by leaps and bounds over the course of 2013”
-Sometime at the beginning of 2013 they promised a new reward system
-This PvP section of the forum was much more active back than:
-No further comments. The fact is there, ANet. It’s up to you to face it or not.

2. “we’ll be evaluating our PvP reward systems and overhauling the way PvP operates to make it feel more rewarding and exciting and to give you reasons to log in and compete every day.”

-2013 is almost at an end now. How goes your evaluation, developers?
-Overhauling? So why is the reward system still EXACTLY the same as Beta????
-I am only Rank 31, and I already have trouble seeing any reason to log in. What’s in it for me? More glory grind?

3. “We’ll be adding systems that make it easier for players who are less competitive to get matched only against people with similar skill sets”

-This is in no place to be achieved because RIGHT NOW you no longer have a playerbase that is even half as StarCraft II.
-League of Legends? Even their Dominion-mode playerbase is bigger than yours!
-Believe me, 9 months ago this could have been done. Instead, you the company chose to keep doing Living World. Why, it is such a good idea while players bought this game for your PvP
-You advertise too much and develop too little. You make all these MLG, PAX stuffs and waste too much resources on bragging. You have been killing yourselves

*So why am I, Ferik, still here?
Because I, like many others, still believe you can make it.
2013 now, there are still blind believers like us. If you continue this passive trend, in 2014 not many people would even care to post in this forum. Why, because by then the market would not even know what Guild Wars 2 is

1
2
3
Check!

They didn’t promise you kitten. They said that they were aiming for X, Y, and Z. And as anyone who has ever set a goal, or done anything that involved long-term work, kitten happens. You said you wanted to get As in all your classes, but then were hospitalized for a month and ended up with a C. Did you break a promise? No, something you couldn’t have anticipated happened.

These kinds of threads where you insinuate (whether you had good intentions or not) that everything the developers say has to happen exactly when and how they say it or they have failed us in some way slowly but surely torches any lines of communication that devs have with us. Want to know what is going on in the future? Then you have to realize that everything they say is just what they want, not what they promise, and put the torches and pitchforks away when it doesn’t quite happen how it was planned.

That’s how life works. I realize it sucks. I wanted them to get through a lot more as well, but you have to realize it just doesn’t work that way, and everything they say is just what they want, not what they guarantee.

@Bhawb

Did you even read Colin Johansons news article from Jan 15 under PvP section?

https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/colin-johanson-on-guild-wars-2-in-the-months-ahead/

The article is about what to expect in the 1st half of the new year. 4 months ago

X: Growing by leaps and bounds- We still have no progression apart from glory ranks
Y: PvP rewards system- They just started working on it 10 months after announcement?
Z: Skill system?- Majority of matches have been uneven since the day the game started.

Missing all 3 of these still

And the 3 things they did do are BROKEN!
Leaderboards: decay etc
Spectator mode: Terrible for Shoutcasters
Custom arenas" pvpers cant obtain unless going into PvE to farm gold or use money.

Colin Johanson said in the news article that they were going to add X, Y, Z not that they were going to try.

Bhawb tell me what Im still not seeing and you are?

Krayiss.4926:

Bhawb tell me what Im still not seeing and you are?

You are taking things said by a dev to be promises, factual statements. Dev says X happens on date Y, therefore it happens. That isn’t how life works with any kind of big goal (ask anyone who’s had to deal with long-term projects as part of their job), that isn’t how game development works. The devs wanted it to happen, they tried to get everything they said done, but something in the process happened and it didn’t work out. Maybe the programming turned out significantly harder, maybe a patch along the way caused some major bugs that screwed things up. I don’t know.

But the fact is that nothing the devs say about what they plan to get accomplished is law. kitten happens, and they can’t get it out on time, even bigger companies like Riot have this problem. But by making these big threads blaming the devs for not reaching it, the ONLY thing that happens, is you send the message to the devs “tell us anything, and you kitten better make it so”, which in dev talk translates to “never tell them anything until its 100% guaranteed to happen exactly how and when we want it to”.

Bhawb.7408:

They didn’t promise you kitten. They said that they were aiming for X, Y, and Z. And as anyone who has ever set a goal, or done anything that involved long-term work, kitten happens. You said you wanted to get As in all your classes, but then were hospitalized for a month and ended up with a C. Did you break a promise? No, something you couldn’t have anticipated happened.

These kinds of threads where you insinuate (whether you had good intentions or not) that everything the developers say has to happen exactly when and how they say it or they have failed us in some way slowly but surely torches any lines of communication that devs have with us. Want to know what is going on in the future? Then you have to realize that everything they say is just what they want, not what they promise, and put the torches and pitchforks away when it doesn’t quite happen how it was planned.

That’s how life works. I realize it sucks. I wanted them to get through a lot more as well, but you have to realize it just doesn’t work that way, and everything they say is just what they want, not what they guarantee.

Thank you for being reasonable. Couldn’t have said it better myself. The terms “lying” and “promise” should be used carefully. They can cause a lot of problems when they are used recklessly.

If we’re not careful, we’re going to start looking like the WvW forum. And that is a dark place, friends.

@bhawb
@NevirSayDie

Do you not see ColinJohansons quote?

ColinJohanson.2394:

However, what’s not ok is saying stuff like we “promised in jan” we would have new rewards this year. In January, we said we would be doing custom arenas, leader boards, and spectator mode. We did all of those things.

The thread is simply showing that in january what he said and hes telling players that no he didn’t say they would work on rewards in january when he did say it in the news article.

Its irrelevant whether or not its a promise or factual statement. He/GW2 gave their word and is now basically calling the players liars when we have proof in the News article he himself wrote.

I still have yet to call him a liar.
Your simply picking at the word ‘Promise’ Trying to troll I’m guessing. The main problem is he didn’t say it in some forums he said it in a GW2 News article.

P.S. In the real world you get fired or lose sales when you don’t deliver on your WORD. Its a vicious world.

Ill change the title promise to WORD if you want but should I add that they are lying also?
Since hes telling players that he said they would do custom arenas, leaderboards, spectator mode and is now leaving out rewards etc.
And you also understand they haven’t delivered 1 polished feature since January?
Spectator mode that are bad/Broken leaderboards that no1 uses and custom arenas that cost $20 you can’t obtain through PvP. Its all broken

So ya…..

Deleted comment?

Words are important, there is a reason promise and plan are different words; they mean different things. If you use the wrong word, especially when you start using language that hurts the entire community by shutting down possible dev interaction, you can and will be called out for it. Look at legal processes if you want to understand why words carry so much weight (for example the difference between killing 20 people and murdering 20 people is the difference between being a free man or spending the rest of your life in jail; just a single word difference changes your entire life).

You’re saying they promised to fully overhaul the system, that they gave their word it would be entirely done. That isn’t accurate, because it isn’t the language they used. They said they would evaluate the rewards system, not completely finish the new system by 2013’s end, which, btw, 2013 isn’t over.

Every single other thing they said in that post towards PvP has already been done:
Watch other competitors (spectator mode)
See major ranked matches (shoutcaster program)
Host your own custom arenas, set up your own rules, host your own team practices (custom arenas)
Easier to play against similar skill opponents (ranked queues)
See your ranking (leaderboards)

Literally the only thing they said in there that they didn’t actually put out was a new rewards system, and the language they used “evaluating our PvP rewards system” does not say they need to deliver that system this year.

So, according to the English language and the definitions of the words they used, they are completely free and clear of any blame from that news statement.

You could drive your debate of the english language into the ground huh?
wannabe english teacher or lawyer?

And in the end all the features are broken and PvP still has not progression so you must really love this game blindly to think its grown by leaps and bounds.

Ignorance is bliss as they say?

And its funny a moderator marked one of you posts as the answer lol

I think one of the biggest problems this game faces is that the pvp devs have guaranteed pay checks from pve. If their livelihood was based on balance, controlling exploits, releasing features in a timely fashion, etc., I think the game would be in a very different place.

They may “care,” but when they can simply take three months off, ignore everything the players say, turn a blind eye to an exploit destroying the only reward system that exists, and not have to worry about any repercussions whatsoever, there isn’t the kind of incentive there that a small studio faces.

I’m sure they justify it by telling themselves they are taking their time to do it right, but when everything they do is as buggy and incomplete as a tiny studio working paycheck to paycheck yet takes twice as long, well, there’s something not right.

Krayiss.4926:

You could drive your debate of the english language into the ground huh?

Don’t be irresponsible with the use of the English language then. If you want to carelessly use words, don’t do it where you’re going to screw over an entire game population. Otherwise, yeah I’m going to call you out when the way you speak is going to directly result in less dev posts, something we desperately don’t need right now.