Diamon Skin, a condi users worst enemy.
Not sure if you entirely want this. If you can break the 90% barrier right now and load up any conditions, at least when the Ele heals, they’ll still have some conditions on them ticking for damage. The way you want it, as soon as the Ele reaches 90% health, it may as well remove all the conditions too.
Also, you’re giving them time to reach the 90% barrier again in the three seconds for Resistance to wear off. You’re also giving them an extra boon to play around with.
Not sure if that will be the best choice for you. Seems to just be a buff to me.
I do find it strange that Resistance have been added to the base game, yet so little skills actually grant the buff. I believe only 3/9 professions, Warrior, Mesmer and Revenant, have access to it (None of the currently revealed elite spec has it either). Mesmer’s need to be traited and using Glamour skills. While Warriors is from their Healing Signet isn’t even used for its active in most situations.
Currently there’s no counterplay to it.. at all!
I rather it worked like Stone Heart. The trait only takes effect if the Ele is in Earth or Water Attunement so that condi players can offer counterplay, rather than being completely countered by a single trait.
This actually works out nicely, considering Water has always been about AoE condi cleanses around the Ele. The Ele can go more selfish by going Earth and gain greater protection from either Condi or Power builds.
Rank: Top 250 since Season 2
#5 best gerdien in wurld
(edited by Saiyan.1704)
My suggestion:
Diamond Skin grants immunity to conditions when in combat. Diamond Skin breaks when health drops below 80% or when it absorbs 10 conditions. 30s ICD.
It should also produce a buff icon that can be seen like Stoneheart does.
(edited by roamzero.9486)
diamond skin is fine, balanced and working as intended.
counter play is control skills plus direct burst damage.
no, i dun play an elementalist.
diamond skin is fine, balanced and working as intended.
counter play is control skills plus direct burst damage.no, i dun play an elementalist.
Yeah…
The problem is that a flat condi build doesn’t have the direct burst damage to overcome Diamond Skin. Therefor the condition application and damage of the condi build never comes into effect. The ele can easily outheal any direct damage the condi user might apply.
diamond skin is fine, balanced and working as intended.
counter play is control skills plus direct burst damage.no, i dun play an elementalist.
I always see you commenting how some broken thing is totally fine.
Come on, even most elementalists admit that Diamon skin is just a horrible design and want it to get reworked.
I’ll agree that having diamond skin work while attuned to earth, like stone heart, would be a better suggestions. They’re both incredibly powerful traits that, alone, shut out a ton of builds, but one requires camping an attunement (which is a fair sacrifice, considering eles are constantly swapping atunements), while the other one just works as long as you’re playing as you should be playing (dodging, blocking, etc).
If I remember correctly… Dimond Skin came after Anet nerfed Engineers trait to resist conditions made to them when HP was lower than 20% something like that.
Already when they introduces Dimond Skin I started to wonder why they nerfed engineers and gave elementalist the same buff that engis had before. People complained about Engineers trait then and well for me Dimond Skin has been a bother for a long time. For Engineers now that Specialization has totaly vanished I think but I think that after the nerf the trait was like when HP is below treshold all conditions durations on you are reduced with 50%. So why not do this for Eles to? When HP is above treshold condition duration on you are reduced with 50%?
Guild Leader of Alpha Sgc [ASGC]
I’ll agree that having diamond skin work while attuned to earth, like stone heart, would be a better suggestions. They’re both incredibly powerful traits that, alone, shut out a ton of builds, but one requires camping an attunement (which is a fair sacrifice, considering eles are constantly swapping atunements), while the other one just works as long as you’re playing as you should be playing (dodging, blocking, etc).
That would make diamond skin useless. The whole point of stone heart is to prevent burst while quickly healing up and getting out of earth attunement as soon as possible.
Diamond Skin however would be useless as it would provide no protection when you switch to earth as you likely already have conditions on you, and the ele can’t camp earth to preempt condition applications because then his damage drops to garbage.
There’s a reason eles don’t use earth and water attunement for long, and that reason is the terrible autoattack damage of those attunements, the ele might as well be hitting you with wet toilet paper while in those attunements so the ele just switches to them, uses a few skills and immediately exists it.
Until they balance autoattack damage across all attunements and weapons, this will keep happening.
If you can predict a direct burst, why can’t you predict a condi burst? You don’t even have to dodge it. Just flip on earth as soon as you see the animation (guard torch toss, pin down, etc) and presto, resistance. You’re completely immune to a whole form of damage and you expect there to be little downside? Earth, on its own, provides protection (toughness boost, damage reduction, etc) and if you’re running arcana, you just grabbed some prot to boot, so you can’t say that earth can’t be used for defense without stone heart. When guardians use shelter or renewed focus, they have 0 DPS. Do you see them complaining? When the stealth classes spam stealth, their DPS is 0. Do you see them complaining. There is literally nothing in the game that even comes close to the type of defense diamond skin provides and when coupled with cele d/d, you’re practically a god.
diamond skin is fine, balanced and working as intended.
counter play is control skills plus direct burst damage.no, i dun play an elementalist.
Yeah…
The problem is that a flat condi build doesn’t have the direct burst damage to overcome Diamond Skin. Therefor the condition application and damage of the condi build never comes into effect. The ele can easily outheal any direct damage the condi user might apply.
guild wars 2 sPvP is a team game, not 1 vs 1.
get another team mate who specializes in burst damage to drop the ele to below 90% then unload your conditions.
diamond skin is fine, balanced and working as intended.
counter play is control skills plus direct burst damage.no, i dun play an elementalist.
I always see you commenting how some broken thing is totally fine.
Come on, even most elementalists admit that Diamon skin is just a horrible design and want it to get reworked.
because diamond skin is not broken.
if it is not broken, do not fix it.
it is working as intended.
you want to complain about useless traits?
see how useful thick skin is.
I agree, same logic with changing Berserker Stance. I dont c why you need two different mechanics for the same purpose.
diamond skin is fine, balanced and working as intended.
counter play is control skills plus direct burst damage.no, i dun play an elementalist.
I always see you commenting how some broken thing is totally fine.
Come on, even most elementalists admit that Diamon skin is just a horrible design and want it to get reworked.
because diamond skin is not broken.
if it is not broken, do not fix it.it is working as intended.
you want to complain about useless traits?
see how useful thick skin is.
Did I say it’s useless? No, I said it’s badly designed. It completely counters several builds and no trait in game should do that. There shouldn’t be things that have no counterplay in game. I don’t care if it’s a team game, sometimes you need to 1v1, too. It can be reworked that it still stays a decent trait, but with added counterplay, I’m not sure why anyone would be against that.
Outside of that 1 hotjoin famous troll in this topic…if some people defending diamond skin then i dont have nothing else to say. People that are defending it are the ones that rely upon broken mechanic otherwise …. just like the old famous turret engis.
I like the idea of Sayian and totally support it. Lets end the faceroll and make it more skillful to use. If you see an incoming burst of direct damage you swap to earth, if you see an incoming burst of condi you swap to water. Inst that simple?
To post down;
Its obvious that this trait will have to be placed in water tree. It would make no sense to keep it in earth.
(edited by skowcia.8257)
I don’t agree with the swapping to Water part. It’s in the Earth Tree. It should be something to do with Earth or moved to the Water tree. Also, if you swap to water, you lose out on any a lot of condition removal once you leave Water and are locked out, allowing the other person to just unload all their conditions and you have a lot less to work with to get rid of them.
I’ll agree that having diamond skin work while attuned to earth, like stone heart, would be a better suggestions. They’re both incredibly powerful traits that, alone, shut out a ton of builds, but one requires camping an attunement (which is a fair sacrifice, considering eles are constantly swapping atunements), while the other one just works as long as you’re playing as you should be playing (dodging, blocking, etc).
That would make diamond skin useless. The whole point of stone heart is to prevent burst while quickly healing up and getting out of earth attunement as soon as possible.
Diamond Skin however would be useless as it would provide no protection when you switch to earth as you likely already have conditions on you, and the ele can’t camp earth to preempt condition applications because then his damage drops to garbage.There’s a reason eles don’t use earth and water attunement for long, and that reason is the terrible autoattack damage of those attunements, the ele might as well be hitting you with wet toilet paper while in those attunements so the ele just switches to them, uses a few skills and immediately exists it.
Until they balance autoattack damage across all attunements and weapons, this will keep happening.
You’re not keeping up with the conversation.
We suggested it be Resistance for Diamond Skin so that any conditions that’s on the Ele previously won’t deal damage. This makes for counter play for the ele who receives a spike condi stack, as well as counter play for condi users for when those 3 seconds of resistance is up.
Currently, no condition build has enough power to counterplay the Diamond Skin Elementalists. It just makes for frustrating engagements.
Rank: Top 250 since Season 2
#5 best gerdien in wurld
Currently, no condition build has enough power to counterplay the Diamond Skin Elementalists. It just makes for frustrating engagements.
Any build with Carrion amulet should be able to break through Diamond skin.
(edited by Shadow of Azrael.1205)
this is a team game, 10% of an eles health is what? 1.6k?
thats less than one auto attack from a power build.
call your buddy over to help!
I love playing condi char. As you say diamond skin is a little bit problematic but it is neither bugged nor op. This is a team pvp thing. There will be different counters for different builds. So if you suffer from that trait, either use carrion amulet to fight alone or call your team, reposition yourself, disengage or stay alive until your team mate comes. At least I do that. I plan ahead when I see an ele in opponent team. I talk with my team before start. I know it is not possible every time but it was meant to be a team pvp thing. So for my taste diamond skin is the least problematic one when it comes to ele. There are far worse problems…
Yeah, I agree it should be changed to resistance (Along with zerker stance) perhaps not pulsing however.
Gain 10sec resistance when hit with a condi above 90% health, 10-15sec icd?
This is still really strong against the majority of classes. Gives an extra boon for you to rip off amongst the others.
I’m not great with numbers but making it resistance is definatly the way forward. Having resistance in the game and things functioning almost the same as it (Only unable to be corrupted or removed) seems silly.
Smallscale <3 Vabbi
The Original Dudes [to]
diamond skin is fine, balanced and working as intended.
counter play is control skills plus direct burst damage.no, i dun play an elementalist.
Yeah…
The problem is that a flat condi build doesn’t have the direct burst damage to overcome Diamond Skin. Therefor the condition application and damage of the condi build never comes into effect. The ele can easily outheal any direct damage the condi user might apply.
Not sure how you going full condi and having absolutely no power in your build is an Eles issue, but okay. Hybrid builds are used for a reason.
Elementalist: Sheva Alamarr
Guardian: Stella Alamarr
diamond skin is fine, balanced and working as intended.
counter play is control skills plus direct burst damage.no, i dun play an elementalist.
Yeah…
The problem is that a flat condi build doesn’t have the direct burst damage to overcome Diamond Skin. Therefor the condition application and damage of the condi build never comes into effect. The ele can easily outheal any direct damage the condi user might apply.
Not sure how you going full condi and having absolutely no power in your build is an Eles issue, but okay. Hybrid builds are used for a reason.
The issue is the fact ele has a trait that can counter such builds. You will have a hard time dealing with a diamond skin ele if you play both Carrion or Rabid necro. Eles have so much sustain that any damage you do will be instantly healed anyway and you just don’t have enough pressure to be able to get through the 10% hp without being killed by the ele first.
diamond skin is simply dumb and has to be reworked completely…. My suggestion is tying a DMG/duration-reduction to certain conditions depending on your attunement:
Diamond-Skin Conditions applied to you have reduced duration depending on your attunement:
Fire: Burning-duration decreased by 33%
Earth: Bleeding-duration decreased by 33%
Water: Weakness/vulnerability/blind-duration decreased by 33% (debilitating conditions)
Air: Chilled/cripple/immobilize-duration decreased by 33% (movement-impairing conditions)
Could be pretty cool to use and involve lots of skill to know which condition will land on you next and the opponent has to know what conditions to apply when, depending on the CD’s of attunement-switch.
diamond skin is simply dumb and has to be reworked completely…. My suggestion is tying a DMG/duration-reduction to certain conditions depending on your attunement:
Diamond-Skin Conditions applied to you have reduced duration depending on your attunement:
Fire: Burning-duration decreased by 33%
Earth: Bleeding-duration decreased by 33%
Water: Weakness/vulnerability/blind-duration decreased by 33% (debilitating conditions)
Air: Chilled/cripple/immobilize-duration decreased by 33% (movement-impairing conditions)Could be pretty cool to use and involve lots of skill to know which condition will land on you next and the opponent has to know what conditions to apply when, depending on the CD’s of attunement-switch.
I like this one . The numbers even may have to go (a little bit) up. Also where would torment, confusion , slow and poison belong?
diamond skin is fine, balanced and working as intended.
counter play is control skills plus direct burst damage.no, i dun play an elementalist.
Yeah…
The problem is that a flat condi build doesn’t have the direct burst damage to overcome Diamond Skin. Therefor the condition application and damage of the condi build never comes into effect. The ele can easily outheal any direct damage the condi user might apply.
Not sure how you going full condi and having absolutely no power in your build is an Eles issue, but okay. Hybrid builds are used for a reason.
The issue is the fact ele has a trait that can counter such builds. You will have a hard time dealing with a diamond skin ele if you play both Carrion or Rabid necro. Eles have so much sustain that any damage you do will be instantly healed anyway and you just don’t have enough pressure to be able to get through the 10% hp without being killed by the ele first.
Only issue is you running a build that is easily countered. Condi builds not having enough power to get past 10% is just not true. I’ve seen it happen all the time, and the moment it does the ele is as good as dead. If you haven’t altered your build to deal with it you have no right to be complaining about it honestly. I’m not saying that DS is not a weird trait but honestly… stop complaining and make an adjustment to your build. If your consistently being countered when running a certain build, the issue is you and your build. That’s why theory crafting is a thing.
Elementalist: Sheva Alamarr
Guardian: Stella Alamarr
diamond skin is simply dumb and has to be reworked completely…. My suggestion is tying a DMG/duration-reduction to certain conditions depending on your attunement:
Diamond-Skin Conditions applied to you have reduced duration depending on your attunement:
Fire: Burning-duration decreased by 33%
Earth: Bleeding-duration decreased by 33%
Water: Weakness/vulnerability/blind-duration decreased by 33% (debilitating conditions)
Air: Chilled/cripple/immobilize-duration decreased by 33% (movement-impairing conditions)Could be pretty cool to use and involve lots of skill to know which condition will land on you next and the opponent has to know what conditions to apply when, depending on the CD’s of attunement-switch.
This trait is barely not even worth a first tier minor trait slot XD
It should work like stone heart.
Currently, no condition build has enough power to counterplay the Diamond Skin Elementalists. It just makes for frustrating engagements.
Any build with Carrion amulet should be able to break through Diamond skin.
It doesn’t.
Only way a Guardian can break through a Diamond Skin Cele Ele is if Zealots Flame hits/Crits and I land a Full Whirling Wrath to not just break the threshhold, but also to cause enough burning to counter the Ele’s regen and instant heals.. regardless, the Ele will simply run away and return with full health while i’m suddenly at 3/4 health with cds lost.
Zealots never hit and I never land full whirling wraths on an Ele who knows what he’s doing.
Rank: Top 250 since Season 2
#5 best gerdien in wurld
3 sec of resistance upon entering and exiting earth.
The Dhuumfire thread
diamond skin is fine, balanced and working as intended.
counter play is control skills plus direct burst damage.no, i dun play an elementalist.
Yeah…
The problem is that a flat condi build doesn’t have the direct burst damage to overcome Diamond Skin. Therefor the condition application and damage of the condi build never comes into effect. The ele can easily outheal any direct damage the condi user might apply.
Not sure how you going full condi and having absolutely no power in your build is an Eles issue, but okay. Hybrid builds are used for a reason.
The issue is the fact ele has a trait that can counter such builds. You will have a hard time dealing with a diamond skin ele if you play both Carrion or Rabid necro. Eles have so much sustain that any damage you do will be instantly healed anyway and you just don’t have enough pressure to be able to get through the 10% hp without being killed by the ele first.
Only issue is you running a build that is easily countered. Condi builds not having enough power to get past 10% is just not true. I’ve seen it happen all the time, and the moment it does the ele is as good as dead. If you haven’t altered your build to deal with it you have no right to be complaining about it honestly. I’m not saying that DS is not a weird trait but honestly… stop complaining and make an adjustment to your build. If your consistently being countered when running a certain build, the issue is you and your build. That’s why theory crafting is a thing.
One. Trait. Should. Not. Completely. Counter. Certain. Builds.
Is that clear? Or still not? I never said it’s impossible, I said you will have a hard time doing so, which is true, go test it. I actually main ele, I don’t play necromancer much, but I actually did go and test it to see how carrion/rabid necro will deal with it and it’s not really easy at all. A build shouldn’t be forced to make adjustements just because of one trait.
diamond skin is simply dumb and has to be reworked completely…. My suggestion is tying a DMG/duration-reduction to certain conditions depending on your attunement:
Diamond-Skin Conditions applied to you have reduced duration depending on your attunement:
Fire: Burning-duration decreased by 33%
Earth: Bleeding-duration decreased by 33%
Water: Weakness/vulnerability/blind-duration decreased by 33% (debilitating conditions)
Air: Chilled/cripple/immobilize-duration decreased by 33% (movement-impairing conditions)Could be pretty cool to use and involve lots of skill to know which condition will land on you next and the opponent has to know what conditions to apply when, depending on the CD’s of attunement-switch.
This trait is barely not even worth a first tier minor trait slot XD
I don’t think so, but tweaking the numbers is never a problem. If it is too bad, just make it 50% or sth….
diamond skin is fine, balanced and working as intended.
counter play is control skills plus direct burst damage.no, i dun play an elementalist.
Yeah…
The problem is that a flat condi build doesn’t have the direct burst damage to overcome Diamond Skin. Therefor the condition application and damage of the condi build never comes into effect. The ele can easily outheal any direct damage the condi user might apply.
Not sure how you going full condi and having absolutely no power in your build is an Eles issue, but okay. Hybrid builds are used for a reason.
The issue is the fact ele has a trait that can counter such builds. You will have a hard time dealing with a diamond skin ele if you play both Carrion or Rabid necro. Eles have so much sustain that any damage you do will be instantly healed anyway and you just don’t have enough pressure to be able to get through the 10% hp without being killed by the ele first.
Only issue is you running a build that is easily countered. Condi builds not having enough power to get past 10% is just not true. I’ve seen it happen all the time, and the moment it does the ele is as good as dead. If you haven’t altered your build to deal with it you have no right to be complaining about it honestly. I’m not saying that DS is not a weird trait but honestly… stop complaining and make an adjustment to your build. If your consistently being countered when running a certain build, the issue is you and your build. That’s why theory crafting is a thing.
One. Trait. Should. Not. Completely. Counter. Certain. Builds.
Is that clear? Or still not? I never said it’s impossible, I said you will have a hard time doing so, which is true, go test it. I actually main ele, I don’t play necromancer much, but I actually did go and test it to see how carrion/rabid necro will deal with it and it’s not really easy at all. A build shouldn’t be forced to make adjustements just because of one trait.
You’re not being countered by just ‘One’ trait. A build that goes into all defensive/survival lines taking all survival oriented traits shouldn’t be tanky?
Earth, water and arcana?
yeah… you’re being countered by one trait alone, his build definitely isn’t completely and utterly centered on survivability at all.
You tested? What’d you do? Make a necro then spam all your skills with X build the moment you saw a D/D ele? That’s not testing, cuz I’m pretty sure that’s more than likely what you did. Sorry, but ‘maining’ a class doesn’t make you good nor particularly knowledgeable either. Just means you play it more than others. And if your attitude is always going to be I shouldn’t have to make adjustments to my build there is no hope for you what so ever. I’m done here. This is ridiculous.
Elementalist: Sheva Alamarr
Guardian: Stella Alamarr
diamond skin is fine, balanced and working as intended.
counter play is control skills plus direct burst damage.no, i dun play an elementalist.
Yeah…
The problem is that a flat condi build doesn’t have the direct burst damage to overcome Diamond Skin. Therefor the condition application and damage of the condi build never comes into effect. The ele can easily outheal any direct damage the condi user might apply.
Not sure how you going full condi and having absolutely no power in your build is an Eles issue, but okay. Hybrid builds are used for a reason.
The issue is the fact ele has a trait that can counter such builds. You will have a hard time dealing with a diamond skin ele if you play both Carrion or Rabid necro. Eles have so much sustain that any damage you do will be instantly healed anyway and you just don’t have enough pressure to be able to get through the 10% hp without being killed by the ele first.
Only issue is you running a build that is easily countered. Condi builds not having enough power to get past 10% is just not true. I’ve seen it happen all the time, and the moment it does the ele is as good as dead. If you haven’t altered your build to deal with it you have no right to be complaining about it honestly. I’m not saying that DS is not a weird trait but honestly… stop complaining and make an adjustment to your build. If your consistently being countered when running a certain build, the issue is you and your build. That’s why theory crafting is a thing.
One. Trait. Should. Not. Completely. Counter. Certain. Builds.
Is that clear? Or still not? I never said it’s impossible, I said you will have a hard time doing so, which is true, go test it. I actually main ele, I don’t play necromancer much, but I actually did go and test it to see how carrion/rabid necro will deal with it and it’s not really easy at all. A build shouldn’t be forced to make adjustements just because of one trait.
You’re not being countered by just ‘One’ trait. A build that goes into all defensive/survival lines taking all survival oriented traits shouldn’t be tanky?
Earth, water and arcana?yeah… you’re being countered by one trait alone, his build definitely isn’t completely and utterly centered on survivability at all.
You tested? What’d you do? Make a necro then spam all your skills with X build the moment you saw a D/D ele? That’s not testing, cuz I’m pretty sure that’s more than likely what you did. Sorry, but ‘maining’ a class doesn’t make you good nor particularly knowledgeable either. Just means you play it more than others. And if your attitude is always going to be I shouldn’t have to make adjustments to my build there is no hope for you what so ever. I’m done here. This is ridiculous.
What did I do? I went on ele and used a Diamon Skin build, then have a friend who is experienced on necro to try and bring my down under 90% hp. It’s funny you talk about attitude here while you assume things like you did in your post.
If a build is centered around condition application and one single trait prevents that, then yes it is being countered by one trait. There is a difference between a tanky build and a build that completely shuts down some type of specs and that just shouldn’t happen for the sake of balance.
No, no one should be forced to make changes to their build just because of one trait. Stop saying ’’you’’ and ‘’your build’’ all the time.
Okay, your friend may be an experienced necro but how well does he know ele? Does he even know when he should be trying to get your HP down? Is he trying to get your HP down while you have protection? Is he paying attention to whether or not he has weakness on himself? lol Doesn’t seem like I assumed anything. Sounds like I was dead on. Yeah, a ‘test’ against an Ele whose only focus is to survive and keep his HP above 90%. Such testing skills. Like a real fight doesn’t involve multiple people with an infinite amount of unknown variables. If there isn’t a single person on a team that isn’t running a power build… really? Even if there is no Ele running DS… condition cleansing? hello? Such is the standard for nearly any build to have? lol
Once again, it’s not just one trait. Main thing I hear is “I can’t get his HP below 90% because of his heals and regen.” Not those words specifically but that’s the gist of what people are saying. Where do you think these heals are coming from? Where do you think the regen is coming from? They are all traited, are they not? From heals on dodge to boons on weapon swap, boons upon being hit, -33% condi duration for movement impairing condis(Not to mention hoelbrak), protection from auras, auras on being crit, vigor on crit. Applying weakness wih air #2 (weakness + protection = instant -83% damage) See the pattern here? ALL of it is traited… for survival.
Diamond skin on it’s own is garbage. That’s why it requires an ele to go completely into survivability for it to even work well. Elementalists say it’s a bad trait because it’s useless without focusing on complete survival. Sorry, but your not being countered by a single trait. If that ele wasn’t in water or arcane he would get demolished. If you honestly think that you’re being countered by one single trait on it’s own then you obviously DON’T know ele.
You’re trying to single out a single trait in a build that has complete synergy in everything it does to survive(theory crafting at it’s finest).
TL;DR: Honestly… ppl want to be effective against EVERYTHING without sacrificing ANYTHING? okay…
Elementalist: Sheva Alamarr
Guardian: Stella Alamarr
I have the suspicion, that some people are defending Diamond Skin in its current state, because of a general dislike for conditions. Imagine if there was a trait to give immunity to hard CC and physical damage when your health is above 90%. Would that be an okay thing?
Also, currently it is no issue to design a 5man power damage team. Imagine a 5 man condi damage team. It would already be disadvantageous in the current meta, but would be utter useless against one ele with diamond skin.
Personally I’d like to see gradual change. On high HP diamond skin would offer a high condition duration reduction (100% reduction for instance, so that it can only be overcome by condition duration bonus traits/gear) and the lower the ele’s HP are, the less this duration reduction would be. But it would be gradual. Like 20% lower reduction each 10% of HP, starting with 100% condi reduction on 100% HP and dropping to 80% condi reduction at 90%HP and so on. (maybe the numbers need tweaking^^)
Chronomancy works, I am proof of it. Now stop asking me questions. Time must be preserved!
If you can’t remove 10% of the squishiest class then you’ve placed all your eggs in the same basket and are honestly just being outplayed by a counter build. Of course diamond skin will be a good trait to counter you if you rely 100% on condi.
But diamond skin in terms of GM traits, is probably the most balanced of them all because it’s super easy to break the barrier to disable it, yet at the same time it is extremely effective when functioning and a good condi meta counter.
The elementalist will get 1-shot all over the place without these defensive traits. We rely on them to survive. It’s not any surprise that the new d/d ele meta is full bunker traits/celestial, because it’s all we can run when classes with nearly twice more hp can afford to use berserker amulet.
(edited by Xillllix.3485)
Diamond Skin: You gain 5 seconds of Resistance every 5 seconds while in earth attunement and above 75% health.
That’s how I feel it should work.
- This way you could activate it in earth attunement and attunement swap, but then you risk not getting the resistance again due to attunement cooldowns or what-have-you.
- This also enables the boon to be removed and you to be burst down under 75% so it can’t happen again.
- This also allows it to work with boon duration.
- This also allows conditions to be built up on the Elementalist if the Elementalist then lets it run out.
- Because of a number of the changes making it worse as a trait, it needs to be bumped up in availability, lowering the percent health requirement from 90% to 75%.
If you can’t remove 10% of the squishiest class then you’ve placed all your eggs in the same basket and are honestly just being outplayed by a counter build. Of course diamond skin will be a good trait to counter you if you rely 100% on condi.
Outplayed just by your opponent picking up a trait and letting it passively carry for him?
3-4 seconds of resistance on entering earth(30-50% uptime). On enter and exit would be too strong because with a little boon duration you could get 100% uptime, which would be op. Also, this trait hard counters most condi builds. All you people saying, why don’t you have power are missing the point. Players should be able to play rabid or settlers if they want and not have 0% chance of winning. Also, many carrion builds still won’t get the ele below 90%, eles have plenty of healing, vigor, and prot to make sure of that.
extra dodges, real stability, mobility skills,
burst skills, sustain, or good support. GG ANET.
3-4 seconds of resistance on entering earth(30-50% uptime). On enter and exit would be too strong because with a little boon duration you could get 100% uptime, which would be op. Also, this trait hard counters most condi builds. All you people saying, why don’t you have power are missing the point. Players should be able to play rabid or settlers if they want. Also, many carrion builds still won’t get the ele below 90%, eles have plenty of healing, vigor, and protected to make sure of that.
This is also a really good idea.
Diamond Skin: Gain 5 seconds of Resistance when you enter Earth Attunement.
If you can predict a direct burst, why can’t you predict a condi burst? You don’t even have to dodge it. Just flip on earth as soon as you see the animation (guard torch toss, pin down, etc) and presto, resistance. You’re completely immune to a whole form of damage and you expect there to be little downside? Earth, on its own, provides protection (toughness boost, damage reduction, etc) and if you’re running arcana, you just grabbed some prot to boot, so you can’t say that earth can’t be used for defense without stone heart. When guardians use shelter or renewed focus, they have 0 DPS. Do you see them complaining? When the stealth classes spam stealth, their DPS is 0. Do you see them complaining. There is literally nothing in the game that even comes close to the type of defense diamond skin provides and when coupled with cele d/d, you’re practically a god.
Condi specs don’t just burst conditions, they apply them steadily.Necro scepter, most pisto/shield engineers apply many conditions just by autoattacking. It’s not something you predict.
The comparison to shelter is just stupid. Shelter is a heal. Renewed Focus is an elite that renews their offensive and defensive utilities.
And stealth classes spamming stealth do 0 DPS? That’s news to me, when mesmer phantasms and clones are pelting me or when a thief crits you for a 10k backstab by way of using steal teleport+stealth on steal trait immediately.
Warrior with berk stance and cleansing ire takes a virtual crap on any condi necromancer. He’s virtually immune to all condition damage and that immunity doesn’t go away by taking cleave damage from some random AoE on point.
So let’s be honest here, people whining about Diamond skin are complaining from a 1v1 perspective, as is usually the case in the pvp format.
This game is never gonna get out of the gutter into esports territory. All its calls for balance decisions are usually colored by 1v1 heroes and hotjoin QQ instead of evaluating how classes, traits, and builds function in team fights.
(edited by Zenith.7301)
If you can’t remove 10% of the squishiest class then you’ve placed all your eggs in the same basket and are honestly just being outplayed by a counter build. Of course diamond skin will be a good trait to counter you if you rely 100% on condi.
Outplayed just by your opponent picking up a trait and letting it passively carry for him?
If you can’t even remove 10% of an ele’s hp then maybe you’re playing the wrong way.
I have the suspicion, that some people are defending Diamond Skin in its current state, because of a general dislike for conditions. Imagine if there was a trait to give immunity to hard CC and physical damage when your health is above 90%. Would that be an okay thing?
Also, currently it is no issue to design a 5man power damage team. Imagine a 5 man condi damage team. It would already be disadvantageous in the current meta, but would be utter useless against one ele with diamond skin.
Imagine a 5-bunker team. Is it a problem that there are totally specs that a 5-bunker team just couldn’t kill?
Imagine a PVT warrior without a source of Poison hitting like a wet noodle and thus being unable to out-DPS a cele ele’s basic rotation no matter how hard he CCs or concentrates his “burst.”
Folks act like “conditions” and “direct damage” are supposed to be two sides of the same coin, but they forget that condition builds aren’t going all-in on damage. They’re typically really tanky and hard to bring down, while still being able to do good damage and even “burst,” to a degree. The price of that is cleansing, which is an all-or-nothing removal mechanic. Diamond Skin is just uber-cleansing that you can’t overload by bringing a second teammate with a trivial understanding of timing.
3-4 seconds of resistance on entering earth(30-50% uptime). On enter and exit would be too strong because with a little boon duration you could get 100% uptime, which would be op. Also, this trait hard counters most condi builds. All you people saying, why don’t you have power are missing the point. Players should be able to play rabid or settlers if they want and not have 0% chance of winning. Also, many carrion builds still won’t get the ele below 90%, eles have plenty of healing, vigor, and prot to make sure of that.
Because they are only countering 1 person? This is a team game after all. If you’re a complete condi DPS then either:
1. Call for help
2. Don’t engage till you get help.
3. Do something ELSE important for your team.
This whole thing that 1 build (and yes, it’s a build because the entire spec has to revolve around survivability) shouldn’t counter another is just the death of any interesting PvP. There is already tons of games out there that have hard counters. Look at MOBA’s, champions are released all the time that counter X or Y. Best example I can give is in League of Legends a champion named Galio who counters literally every single Ability Power (read: magic based) champion in the game because his passive effect is the more magic resist he has the more damage he does. That’s what he does, and it makes it so that if you’re that mage, you need to play better, watch your butt when he’s around and find your kills on someone else. How does a mage fight him? They dont, what they do is:
1. Play passively
2. Ask for help from a team mate (jungler who in GW2 is your point harasser/rotating DPS) to shut him down and deny farm/kill him
3. Go somewhere else on the map and kill other people in other lanes.
It’s not fun to be countered for sure, but this is a team game. Get help, swap objectives, react to the presence.
Co-Guild Leader of Prime Defense on Sanctum of Rall – www.Primedefense.net
3-4 seconds of resistance on entering earth(30-50% uptime). On enter and exit would be too strong because with a little boon duration you could get 100% uptime, which would be op. Also, this trait hard counters most condi builds. All you people saying, why don’t you have power are missing the point. Players should be able to play rabid or settlers if they want and not have 0% chance of winning. Also, many carrion builds still won’t get the ele below 90%, eles have plenty of healing, vigor, and prot to make sure of that.
Because they are only countering 1 person? This is a team game after all. If you’re a complete condi DPS then either:
1. Call for help
2. Don’t engage till you get help.
3. Do something ELSE important for your team.This whole thing that 1 build (and yes, it’s a build because the entire spec has to revolve around survivability) shouldn’t counter another is just the death of any interesting PvP. There is already tons of games out there that have hard counters. Look at MOBA’s, champions are released all the time that counter X or Y. Best example I can give is in League of Legends a champion named Galio who counters literally every single Ability Power (read: magic based) champion in the game because his passive effect is the more magic resist he has the more damage he does. That’s what he does, and it makes it so that if you’re that mage, you need to play better, watch your butt when he’s around and find your kills on someone else. How does a mage fight him? They dont, what they do is:
1. Play passively
2. Ask for help from a team mate (jungler who in GW2 is your point harasser/rotating DPS) to shut him down and deny farm/kill him
3. Go somewhere else on the map and kill other people in other lanes.It’s not fun to be countered for sure, but this is a team game. Get help, swap objectives, react to the presence.
What he said.
And give us stealth, we’ll give you diamond skin without hesitation.
I would like diamond skin to give -33 or -50% flat condition reduction. That way it is effective against condis but it is not a severe hard counter.
I will state that Carrion Necros still cannot get past Diamond Skin in actual gameplay. Pre-specializations patch, an Ele needed only 2 points in Water Magic and no other healing power to nearly out-heal a Carrion Necro’s hardest hitting attack (Life Blast within 600 range) by doing nothing but auto-attacking in water attunement.
Not moving, not casting anything but autos, just standing there pressing “1.”
In that situation, it would take a Carrion Necro 7 Life Blasts to get an ele below 90% health and be able to apply any conditions at all. That is 10 seconds of time where the Ele is literally afk. If the ele actually touches his keyboard at all? You’re never breaking it.
As someone once said here before….
Dear Anet,
Please nerf Paper, Scissors is okay though.
Sincerely Rock