Guild Wars 2

Hai, Dragonfeu here.

I was wondering if GW2 PvP required skill, and if so, what kind of skills?

eg) LoL requires animation cancelling to optimize damage output
PvPing in MC, if you can strafe, you reduce damage taken as your opponent will have a hard time hitting you.

In GW2, bows lock-on to your target, and it seems to me that little skill is required in PvP except for mashing the (1) button and predicting enemy burst, and countering it with a dodge roll.

Thoughts?

I’m talking about Ranger PvP, although any ranged weapon seems to have the same dilemma. I’ve probably screwed up with my generalization, Sorry!

Projectiles estimate where your target is going to be and fires in that direction. If your target makes a sudden move, the projectile will miss. By dropping your target, you can also manually aim to make your own predictive shots. Only a few projectiles will actually follow the target.

I see no problem with rangers.

gw2 is semi-aim semi-target system based game.
If you expect rangers to have to aim, then it would have to be pointed to each class. Therefore the best system would be to implement aim system like in TERA.

And I’m telling you that system won’t work in gw2, since it would require reworking all skills, traits etc, to make it work.

Also, there is a dodge roll for a reason.

We’ll cut you a deal, you can get to dodge arrows fired from a bow like Neo on speed when anet buffs all ranged DPS to equal melee.

1 skill on 1 class gets buffed and suddenly one of the most ranged combat hostile games ever made has “broken” ranged combat…

Imo, dodge only provides a small window of counterplay, however, I have yet to see how effective it can be when mastered.

Thanks for the comments, have a good day!

How a move is executed is irrelevant. The skill in a competitive game is being able to use the right moves, not the ‘hardest’ moves. Being able to read your opponent and make judgments on the value of moves that aren’t directly comparable are the real signs of skill.

Dragonfeu.4356:

Imo, dodge only provides a small window of counterplay, however, I have yet to see how effective it can be when mastered.

Thanks for the comments, have a good day!

small window for inexperienced, lazy players or just bots.

Even with 0 access to Vigor, it can be a huge window for counter-play, or pure survival.
Thanks to dodge, you can simply avoid any kind of lethal attack that may decide of “kill or be killed”.
Timing is crucial and the more experience and knowledge one has, the more benefiting such a simple yet awesome ability as dodge roll becomes.

I saw s/d rangers and s/d thieves who were using evade skills along with dodge roll effectively, and despite their squishy builds, they tend to survive for a long time since they evade majority of attacks.
Obviously, there is no room for mistakes, but those people simply put their time into learning how to operate with such setups and what to pay attention to.

Some builds are called pusy types, some builds are effective against the other, but this game provides a set of skills and ability for players to create what would suit their taste and playstyle, to put everyone on the same ground.

of course that there are those people who qq constantly because, this and that is soo op and all, but I’m sure that none of them took their time to learn how to counter something like that and how to outplay it with their current setups.

Guild Wars 2 has no sub fee. It’s a game designed for casuals. There is some level of skill required to be a competent player but compared to other games of the same quality GW2 requires a very minimal amount of skill.

I play a LOT of GW2, I play a LOT of Ranger and I play a LOT of PvP. Time spent playing doesn’t necessarily mean skill earned but I have learned a lot about my own profession as well as others. What it really comes down to is; dodge what’s going to hurt, reflect what’s going to hurt, heal at the right times and manage your cooldowns. All of those things are pretty basic and no matter how much people want to complicate it, that’s really all there is to PvP in GW2.

I’d say it requires skill, anything in any game does require some kind of coordination or knowing what works in what order.
For instance some abilities in gw2 has synergy, i.e. a theif can heartseek through black powder to gain stealth. That same thief can then use signet leap aimed at enemy player’s backside, and right before you press backstack #1 so that it lands on the player once leap ended for max damage output.
As a squishy target you also want to avoid taking damage, something that is possible in most encounters since you can read animations carefully (most or some) and chose which 2 dodges you want to use.

SpellOfIniquity.1780:

Guild Wars 2 has no sub fee. It’s a game designed for casuals. There is some level of skill required to be a competent player but compared to other games of the same quality GW2 requires a very minimal amount of skill.

I recommend to go and play some other games, where majority of them create a huge gap between good gear and top gear, while involve huge rng in combat, like, who cc first, who crit more times, who proc this and that.

So far I assure you that combat in gw2 is more likely the most balanced from majority of mmo games and provide a good amount of skill and knowledge to outplay others.
Of course there will be weak players like no tomorrow, like in every game, but main factor is the ability to utilize your skills and outplay someone instead of feeding on mere RNG luck.

Dragonfeu.4356:

In GW2, bows lock-on to your target, and it seems to me that little skill is required in PvP except for mashing the (1) button and predicting enemy burst, and countering it with a dodge roll.

Thoughts?

Its no different from ranged champions in League who have click a target and automatically hit them with certain skills. I’d like more skill shots in the game but only a few skills are channeled to the point of “no skill” but they still require good timing to even execute.

Ranged dps is fine, LoS is a big counter to it.

I play PvP casually, maybe 300-400 games at this point. I definitely think PvP requires skill in this game. Not only from a team standpoint (tPvP, where proper point control is pretty much the name of the game), but even in hotjoin. Why do I think this? Well some games I join I can go up against an elementalist or a thief, or really any class, and own them. Then next game I could get completely owned by the same class. The difference? Typically just play-style/skill. A good player is easily distinguished from a bad player IMO.

I would love to go up against a Ranger that only mashed 1, and dodged when they thought I was going to do a damage burst. That would be a hilariously easy ranger kill (I play guardian).

GW2 takes skill in reacting actively to passive procs (or so a dev once stated).

Here’s one way of looking at it:

I entered the Tournament of Legends 2 playing as a ranger. I’d played PvE since launch and never found any of it especially difficult, but I never played PvP until after signing up.

I practised in the run-up to the qualifier and my team were able to win some hotjoin matches. I was usually able to defend a point, at least until someone could come and reinforce me.

First match of the tournament our opponents didn’t show up. Second match they did. And they absolutely demolished us. The match in total lasted about 2 minutes and for me it was a constant steam of running out from the spawn point, seeing an opponent, watching my health vanish in seconds and starting over.

We all had level 80 characters with equal equipment and access to all the same skills, both teams had the same objectives and the map is fairly balanced. So there are two possible explanations:

• They used hacks. In a tournament match with a judge watching that’s unlikely.
• The game is skill based and they were (far) better players.

Poor Dani. Did they at least give you a mini llama for being a good sport?

/hugs

The funny thing is with the buff to ranger LB#2 you can now completely dodge it. Before, with the slower fire rate, 1 dodge would not cover the duration of the skill. Now with the skill being so fast to complete it’s 100% dodged.

Using your brain requires no skill, it requires you to use your brain.

GOSU.9574:

Using your brain requires no skill, it requires you to use your brain.

Using your brain and using your brain effectively are two very different things.

Example:

Defending Point A. See red name. Red name = bad guy. When see bad guy, press one to shoot bow. Arrows do damage to red name. That person is using their brain. They associated red name with attacking. Very good.

Defending Point A. See red name. Notice red name is a Warrior. Realize distance will be important. Use appropriate skills to keep Warrior at distance, while simultaneously trying to keep them from capturing the point you are defending. Notice Warrior switch to LB. Use LOS in areas to avoid certain attacks. Time dodge or knockback when Warrior lines up big attack. See conditions building, properly use condition removal. Use pet to continue damage while LOSing Warrior.

Both players used their brains. One just does it more effectively, through practice, which helps to hone skills. Thus using your brain effectively in a given situation requires skill.

GW2 requires advanced knowledge of all classes and mental talent towards strategy & tactics, more than it does anything else.
Of course, skill & reflex “pertaining to how to hit, where to hit, when to hit, when to roll, when not to roll, when to save a skill, when to burn a skill” it all does play it’s role but it will only take you so far. The REAL skill involved in GW2, is mental awareness of what is happening everywhere around you and using that awareness to properly adjucate your next moves. It’s actually quite similar to chess, when looked at like this.

Technically, it requires great skill and is a well-designed from a game-play and balance perspective.

In reality though, the game is completely sabotaged in PvP by a failure to punish things that corrupt the game.

I’ve never seen a game so indifferent to proper matchmaking and fails who rage quit, afk, etc.

Everything that would make the great parts of the game and skill shine gets swamped by experiences that ruin it.

Just play one hour of hotjoins, sPvP, or even WvW. Notice how little skill even matters compared to the constant imbalances that trump it tenfold.

Your only bet is to play tPvP if you are interested in “skill”.

However, so many people have been turned off by PvP in this game that the pool of people playing tPvP could be characterized as “dead” – even in the few hours of the day when the most people are online.

You can strafe back and forth and dodge projectiles (unless ranger has Read the Wind) or you can LoS. The ranger requires skill cancelling on the pet in order to maximize efficiency. If you waste your wolf kds (45s) thats a guaranteed burst you just gave away. Instead, you can skill cancel the animation to trick enemies into wasting their dodges while saving your lock down skills. You can also do this with the wolf howls.

Because of the auto attack GW2 has a low skill floor, but it also has an extremely high skill ceiling.

Granted, there are things that are just easy and effective. Ele and engi to name a couple.

Whoa, so many answers. I’ve changed my mind about PvP, seems like it does require skill.

Thanks for taking your time to reply!

I’ve got another question :d

What are combos, can they enhance PvP? What kind of things do they bring? I have no idea on the matter.

/edit: enhance as in skill; can they enable you to outplay and do more dps? Like orb walking in LoL, or something like that?

Sorry if I’m confusing, I have no idea what combos are, except that they exist.

Dragonfeu.4356:

I’ve got another question :d

What are combos, can they enhance PvP? What kind of things do they bring? I have no idea on the matter.

/edit: enhance as in skill; can they enable you to outplay and do more dps? Like orb walking in LoL, or something like that?

Sorry if I’m confusing, I have no idea what combos are, except that they exist.

if you are referring to combo fields and finishers, a very basic example would be:

1. warrior uses long bow f1 combustive shot to create a fire field.
2. warrior uses long bow 3 arcing shot in the fire field to create a blast finisher.
3. creating a blast finisher in a field field creates area might effect
4. area might gives 20 seconds of 3 stacks of might to warrior and nearby allies
5. warrior switches to sword and axe weapon set
6. warrior uses sword 2 savage leap to create a leap finisher.
7. creating a leap finisher in a fire field creates a personal fire shield.
8. fire shield burns attackers and gives might when they attack you.
9. warrior then uses axe 5 whirling axe to create 15 whirl finishers.
10. creating 15 whirl finishers in a fire field will shoot 15 fire bolts.

and this is a very basic example of combo fields and finishers.
different combo fields and finishers give different effects.

more info here:
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Combo

I’m reading ranger mains making overviews on skill across gw2 pvp.

My advice: don’t play ranger

there you go

Melee offers a high-risk-high-reward experience. Use GS with your choice of sw/wh or sw/axe or sw/dgr.

There’s specific combos and builds that are very important. Most cases are self combos, but team combos can make a difference too. Here’s a couple examples:

Might stacking: Fire field + blast finisher. Ele, warrior, and engi can all self stack this with meta builds, and it’s very important.
Aoe heals: Water field + blast finisher (or leap for self heal). Ele, ranger, and engi can self combo for this. Having teammates blast ele or ranger water fields is good play.
Aoe stealth: Smoke field + blast finisher (or leaps for self stealth). Thief and engi are the field providers, anyone on the team could blast this for aoe stealth. Stealth plays can be a huge deal.

There’s others that are important, but I feel like those are the biggest.

Way more than ArcheAge that’s for sure. GW2’s PvP is dependent on teamwork and individual mechanics more than that game at least.

But GW2 now will not compare to how good release GW2 was. Release GW2 had so much high risk high reward stuff and it was just so fun then.

Deimos Tel Arin.7391:

Dragonfeu.4356:

I’ve got another question :d

What are combos, can they enhance PvP? What kind of things do they bring? I have no idea on the matter.

/edit: enhance as in skill; can they enable you to outplay and do more dps? Like orb walking in LoL, or something like that?

Sorry if I’m confusing, I have no idea what combos are, except that they exist.

if you are referring to combo fields and finishers, a very basic example would be:

1. warrior uses long bow f1 combustive shot to create a fire field.
2. warrior uses long bow 3 arcing shot in the fire field to create a blast finisher.
3. creating a blast finisher in a field field creates area might effect
4. area might gives 20 seconds of 3 stacks of might to warrior and nearby allies
5. warrior switches to sword and axe weapon set
6. warrior uses sword 2 savage leap to create a leap finisher.
7. creating a leap finisher in a fire field creates a personal fire shield.
8. fire shield burns attackers and gives might when they attack you.
9. warrior then uses axe 5 whirling axe to create 15 whirl finishers.
10. creating 15 whirl finishers in a fire field will shoot 15 fire bolts.

and this is a very basic example of combo fields and finishers.
different combo fields and finishers give different effects.

more info here:
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Combo

Thanks so much! Combo’s OP!

Brigg.6189:

There’s specific combos and builds that are very important. Most cases are self combos, but team combos can make a difference too. Here’s a couple examples:

Might stacking: Fire field + blast finisher. Ele, warrior, and engi can all self stack this with meta builds, and it’s very important.
Aoe heals: Water field + blast finisher (or leap for self heal). Ele, ranger, and engi can self combo for this. Having teammates blast ele or ranger water fields is good play.
Aoe stealth: Smoke field + blast finisher (or leaps for self stealth). Thief and engi are the field providers, anyone on the team could blast this for aoe stealth. Stealth plays can be a huge deal.

There’s others that are important, but I feel like those are the biggest.

Whoa, that’s pretty cool, it’ll take me some time to learn how to optimize my DPS. Thanks for the info :>

Razor.9872:

Melee offers a high-risk-high-reward experience. Use GS with your choice of sw/wh or sw/axe or sw/dgr.

What are your thoughts about Axes vs Sword? What are the pros, cons? I’ve always liked the sword, but many other players are recommending the Axe/Warhorn set-up.

Advice appreciated :d

Dragonfeu.4356:

Brigg.6189:

There’s specific combos and builds that are very important. Most cases are self combos, but team combos can make a difference too. Here’s a couple examples:

Might stacking: Fire field + blast finisher. Ele, warrior, and engi can all self stack this with meta builds, and it’s very important.
Aoe heals: Water field + blast finisher (or leap for self heal). Ele, ranger, and engi can self combo for this. Having teammates blast ele or ranger water fields is good play.
Aoe stealth: Smoke field + blast finisher (or leaps for self stealth). Thief and engi are the field providers, anyone on the team could blast this for aoe stealth. Stealth plays can be a huge deal.

There’s others that are important, but I feel like those are the biggest.

Whoa, that’s pretty cool, it’ll take me some time to learn how to optimize my DPS. Thanks for the info :>

Razor.9872:

Melee offers a high-risk-high-reward experience. Use GS with your choice of sw/wh or sw/axe or sw/dgr.

What are your thoughts about Axes vs Sword? What are the pros, cons? I’ve always liked the sword, but many other players are recommending the Axe/Warhorn set-up.

Advice appreciated :d

Sword has always been weaker on power builds, much as I wished it wasn’t. With the changes to burst mastery however Axe is mechanicaly much higher risk than it was (evisc is easy to evade if you got skillz).

As some of you may know I used to main warrior, but never enjoyed the soldiers playstyle that has been meta for the past year. Primarily this was due to reckless dodge being an important mechanic to my warrior playstyle (though I’ll happily pretend it was a risk reward issue )

With the changes to GS however I’ve found a build that complements this, and I have to recommend it over axe now anyway.

Hope this helps.

Most skill comes from map awareness. After that, it comes to boon/trait/stunbreak awareness. Skill usage requires some skill, but most of them are spammable so yeah.

Dragonfeu.4356:

I’ve got another question :d

What are combos, can they enhance PvP? What kind of things do they bring? I have no idea on the matter.

/edit: enhance as in skill; can they enable you to outplay and do more dps? Like orb walking in LoL, or something like that?

Sorry if I’m confusing, I have no idea what combos are, except that they exist.

Combos are very important. Both Hambow and D/D Elementalist (2 of the most popular builds) heavily rely on proper combo finishers to gain enough might stacks.
Combos are part of the things that distinguish a good player from a decent one.

Here’s an example: engineers are known for having few condition removal, thus an engineer who knows its class will use throw wrench (which is a 100% projectile finisher skill) through the lightfield provided by Elixir Gun, in order to get a condition cleansed (projectile finisher through a light field = 1 condition cleansed) and not randomically/through other fields.