Guild Wars 2

TL;DR post – Burn Guardian’s already gets hard countered by Necro’s and Eles. Not to mention that we can get outplayed by any class who has an ounce of cleanses and knows half of the Guardian’s mechanics. If a shave is needed, let it be burn duration or Balthazar runes.

People see condi guardian’s deal roughly 30k-50k burn dmg @ 12-16 ticks. Or similar dmg to tick ratio.
The thing is, to reach these high dmg to tick ratios they would have needed a constant 9+ burn stacks on them, at any one time. The higher the stacks, the more crazy the damage/tick ratio will be. People are posting all of these images calling burns OP when they’re allowing 9+ stacks on them to begin with. It can’t be helped if you or your team have 0 condi cleanses… or you keep re-entering Fire Field and self imploding. User error and improper synchronized teams is overpowered, not burn damage.

“Burn guard is countered hard by anyone with a few cleanses as they rely entirely on 1 condition for condi damage.” – The Source

We can out play other classes, but we can also get outplayed just as easily. If it wasn’t for Permeating Wrath, Guardian’s burns wouldn’t even be a thing in TPvP/Competitive play (not that they already are, I just think they could). The fact that we can potentially deliver huge bursts via cleaving is probably the only reason that burn guards can be team viable; compared to other dps classes, on the competitive level. Even then, people may rather depend on power or control builds as they’re more consistent in skirmish scenarios.

Don’t fall for the high dmg, low condi tick pictures. Players do not understand the mechanics of other classes; it was likely their own l2p mistakes that resulted in their demise.

Saiyan.1704:

TL;DR post – Burn Guardian’s already gets hard countered by Necro’s and Eles. Not to mention that we can get outplayed by any class who has an ounce of cleanses and knows half of the Guardian’s mechanics. If a shave is needed, let it be burn duration or Balthazar runes.

People see condi guardian’s deal roughly 30k-50k burn dmg @ 12-16 ticks. Or similar dmg to tick ratio.
The thing is, to reach these high dmg to tick ratios they would have needed a constant 9+ burn stacks on them, at any one time. The higher the stacks, the more crazy the damage/tick ratio will be. People are posting all of these images calling burns OP when they’re allowing 9+ stacks on them to begin with. It can’t be helped if you or your team have 0 condi cleanses… or you keep re-entering Fire Field and self imploding. User error and improper synchronized teams is overpowered, not burn damage.

“Burn guard is countered hard by anyone with a few cleanses as they rely entirely on 1 condition for condi damage.” – The Source

We can out play other classes, but we can also get outplayed just as easily. If it wasn’t for Permeating Wrath, Guardian’s burns wouldn’t even be a thing in TPvP/Competitive play (not that they already are, I just think they could). The fact that we can potentially deliver huge bursts via cleaving is probably the only reason that burn guards can be team viable; compared to other dps classes, on the competitive level. Even then, people may rather depend on power or control builds as they’re more consistent in skirmish scenarios.

Don’t fall for the high dmg, low condi tick pictures. Players do not understand the mechanics of other classes; it was likely their own l2p mistakes that resulted in their demise.

I main mesmer and warrior and while the burning damage can be brutal in tpvp, I don’t think it’s overpowered. Burn guards don’t have much mobility and can be walled by just a few condi cleanses. I feel like the burning damage for guards are very intense because unlike necros and mesmers, guardians do not have access to a variety of conditions. They have burning, and to make that one condition viable, it would have to hit hard.

DrDivine.5378:

Saiyan.1704:

TL;DR post – Burn Guardian’s already gets hard countered by Necro’s and Eles. Not to mention that we can get outplayed by any class who has an ounce of cleanses and knows half of the Guardian’s mechanics. If a shave is needed, let it be burn duration or Balthazar runes.

People see condi guardian’s deal roughly 30k-50k burn dmg @ 12-16 ticks. Or similar dmg to tick ratio.
The thing is, to reach these high dmg to tick ratios they would have needed a constant 9+ burn stacks on them, at any one time. The higher the stacks, the more crazy the damage/tick ratio will be. People are posting all of these images calling burns OP when they’re allowing 9+ stacks on them to begin with. It can’t be helped if you or your team have 0 condi cleanses… or you keep re-entering Fire Field and self imploding. User error and improper synchronized teams is overpowered, not burn damage.

“Burn guard is countered hard by anyone with a few cleanses as they rely entirely on 1 condition for condi damage.” – The Source

We can out play other classes, but we can also get outplayed just as easily. If it wasn’t for Permeating Wrath, Guardian’s burns wouldn’t even be a thing in TPvP/Competitive play (not that they already are, I just think they could). The fact that we can potentially deliver huge bursts via cleaving is probably the only reason that burn guards can be team viable; compared to other dps classes, on the competitive level. Even then, people may rather depend on power or control builds as they’re more consistent in skirmish scenarios.

Don’t fall for the high dmg, low condi tick pictures. Players do not understand the mechanics of other classes; it was likely their own l2p mistakes that resulted in their demise.

I main mesmer and warrior and while the burning damage can be brutal in tpvp, I don’t think it’s overpowered. Burn guards don’t have much mobility and can be walled by just a few condi cleanses. I feel like the burning damage for guards are very intense because unlike necros and mesmers, guardians do not have access to a variety of conditions. They have burning, and to make that one condition viable, it would have to hit hard.

This ^.

Guardian stacks burns well because they don’t have anything else to stack.

Bring a few cleanses or a cleanse on a short Cd and you can destroy a condi guards ability to do damage.

If they do end up nerfing burns I hope the guardian has the ways they apply burning, and the modifiers looked at and adjusted.

Or they could do something nice and give the guardian access to another condition.
Bleeding is fairly easy to balance, and torment would kind of fit as it punishes enemies that try to run away (where as the guardian isn’t very mobile)

Burn guardians are very strong in 1v1 against players that have zero condi cleanse or against mediocre players who take too long to realize they have a 6k burn tick on them.

Outside of these limited scenarios, I find them rather sub par.

Just my cents based on playing burn guard these passed few days in sPvP.

DrDivine.5378:

Saiyan.1704:

TL;DR post – Burn Guardian’s already gets hard countered by Necro’s and Eles. Not to mention that we can get outplayed by any class who has an ounce of cleanses and knows half of the Guardian’s mechanics. If a shave is needed, let it be burn duration or Balthazar runes.

People see condi guardian’s deal roughly 30k-50k burn dmg @ 12-16 ticks. Or similar dmg to tick ratio.
The thing is, to reach these high dmg to tick ratios they would have needed a constant 9+ burn stacks on them, at any one time. The higher the stacks, the more crazy the damage/tick ratio will be. People are posting all of these images calling burns OP when they’re allowing 9+ stacks on them to begin with. It can’t be helped if you or your team have 0 condi cleanses… or you keep re-entering Fire Field and self imploding. User error and improper synchronized teams is overpowered, not burn damage.

“Burn guard is countered hard by anyone with a few cleanses as they rely entirely on 1 condition for condi damage.” – The Source

We can out play other classes, but we can also get outplayed just as easily. If it wasn’t for Permeating Wrath, Guardian’s burns wouldn’t even be a thing in TPvP/Competitive play (not that they already are, I just think they could). The fact that we can potentially deliver huge bursts via cleaving is probably the only reason that burn guards can be team viable; compared to other dps classes, on the competitive level. Even then, people may rather depend on power or control builds as they’re more consistent in skirmish scenarios.

Don’t fall for the high dmg, low condi tick pictures. Players do not understand the mechanics of other classes; it was likely their own l2p mistakes that resulted in their demise.

I main mesmer and warrior and while the burning damage can be brutal in tpvp, I don’t think it’s overpowered. Burn guards don’t have much mobility and can be walled by just a few condi cleanses. I feel like the burning damage for guards are very intense because unlike necros and mesmers, guardians do not have access to a variety of conditions. They have burning, and to make that one condition viable, it would have to hit hard.

The problem isn’t really the condition itself.

It’s the ease of which it can be applied and it’s frequency.

It makes it nearly impossible to avoid, and it’s guaranteed damage that will always tick for it’s full amount.

At least with burst you can stack prot and toughness, and you can avoid most burst combo’s through sheer active play.
The same cannot be said about conditions, or guardian burning, since it can be applied from almost everything passively.

That is the thing that I think should be toned down.

But like I have said.
If they nerf damage for one aspect of the game, they need to nerf damage across the board.

Of course that wont happen because anet plays favorites with classes.

Decrease damage but increase the amount that can be applied and the duration. Condi was always about attrition. The condi burst in ten seconds shouldn’t match the direct burst in the same amount of time. While you guys are at it, make consecrations a little more viable for solo play and give condi built guards access to more active blocks/dodges. Hell, give em a reflect. God knows thatd be really welcome.

http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Amplified_Wrath

Or this could get buffed at the same time Burning gets nerfed, leaving burn Guardian untouched while reducing the truly problematic sources.

This is what Ive always said, condi guards are nothing or everything because of that only condition they have… if you nerf burning without some other compensation you will really hurt guardians. And either way the build is only viable against bad experienced players.

I’m not trying to seem like I’m not sympathic to guardian’s burn dilemma, but I can’t recall ever seeing a necro or any other class with access to a variety of damaging conditions getting them all to deal a combined total of 13k-16k per tick. Back when dhummfire was first introduced, when terror would tick for 1.5k and before necro’s bleed nerf, the average damage, with poison, was about 3.6k a tick. We all know what happened to necros after that. Can you honestly say that type of damage from conditions is ok?

And also RIP any sustain they ever had because of going full burn, some of you make it sound like guards can spam aegis, blind, blocks in every single build while also exaggerating in having always regeneration.

Drarnor Kunoram.5180:

http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Amplified_Wrath

Or this could get buffed at the same time Burning gets nerfed, leaving burn Guardian untouched while reducing the truly problematic sources.

What exactly are the truly problematic sources? Are you talking Elementalists?

I don’t have enough experience with Burn Guardians to really know how it feels to fight one, and I’ve always favored condition transfers against every class with my Necro. However, do we really need to race up the potential burn stacking damage for a class to try to squeeze it into viability, just because it only has a single condition to apply? Is that really a good, healthy design choice?

XxsdgxX.8109:

And also RIP any sustain they ever had because of going full burn, some of you make it sound like guards can spam aegis, blind, blocks in every single build while also exaggerating in having always regeneration.

Uhhh, every basic guardian build has shelter and a focus. Because most burn guards stat radiance, they also have that signature VoJ blind that, now, no other non-radiance guardian can get. Since your basic burn build is also traited into virtues, they get a healthy amount of boons on the side as well. Even if they drop smite condi for purging flames, they still have four meditation skills to heal off of and cleanse all of the conditions at a decent pace. As it stands, the only thing separating a burn guard from a d/d Ele is the difference in sustain, but the difference in damage is also the same.