Guild Wars 2

Manuhell.2759:

Lordrosicky.5813:

Fair enough to give it the stun breaker and then a 3 second cast on the actual res. Then yeh, I would be happy with the engi. The self res is ridiculous. Resses got nerfed but they forgot to nerf toss elixr r

They already nerfed it long ago, by increasing its cooldown.
And putting 3s cast would make it useless. It already requires whoever must be ressed to stay inside that little area for enough time – it isn’t instant, it gives 20% downed hp per second. You can already use CC before the engineer gets downed to sweep it away from that area. You can use launches after that or poison him and dps him down.
The other ress skills have got a cast time and an instant effect. Here there is an instant cast and an effect that requires some time. And that’s why it is balanced.
Just learn to play.

Ress elixir has a few downsides but its still hands down the best rezz in the game.

The main issue is that most engi utility skills are plain bullkitten + no weapons swap so theres really no reason to bring anything else.

Also for the record: D/D burst ELE spamming his lightning (1) deals enough dps to out dps elixir R rezz without the need for poison

Btw it does help being power specced to counter the self rez(and possibly have poison >_>)

Oh yeah while we are QQing about stuff, nerf the living kitten out of chill vs mobility skills.

Velron.3729:

Godofallu.2935:

LeGi.3921:

burst would be d/p?

any decent pvp player can dodge basivenom/backstab in a 1on1 and when you need to 2on1 the engi we are in a bad spot (3vs4) on the rest of the map and will probably lose the teamfight there.

on top of that d/p needs to land that backstab and the engi got a blind bomb, a 7sec blind on FT#5 (instacast), this shield stun and so much area denial that it is pretty hard to be melee with him.

i say it again, to be great with the engi and pull all that stuff off it really takes practise and skill, much more than for example a s/d thief, but when you know your kittens then your are a freaking monster.

but like i said above, as Arenanet is not going to change anything soon, i guess i just roll engi myself and hope that i get good with this class before everyone else realises how OP this class is -.-, (omg he said it!)

First of all I want to say that I agree with basically everything you have said in this thread and I salute you for putting up with that much obvious bullkitten from Nakoda. He clearly doesn’t understand matchups or counterplay and his inflammatory and pompous attitude is clearly derailing this thread.

I’ve fought probably a thousand+ duels and 1v1’s against some of the best players the NA scene has to offer as an engie and I will say that I don’t auto loose to a great thief. Hell if I have supply turret up or know they are coming I would say I am favored in the fights.

Other engineers can’t beat me (usually). Thiefs need to get that basilisk venom or some sort of great backstab to have a chance which is 50/50 ish shot at having a chance. Mesmers had better shatter combo me twice in very rapid succession or I will melt them which doesn’t happen often. Warriors will melt/die before they get to me and I will blind/push them back over and over. Guardians will melt to me if they want to stand on point and can’t actually dps me down because sword and greatsword are way too telegraphed and obvious. Rangers that play well are pretty annoying and even if I do manage to win the fight it’s a long and uphill battle against the best of them. Elementalists had better be running fresh air or some sort of super burst comp and they better land that gust -> lightning flast -> Firegrab/Pheonix combo or they won’t have the damage to beat me before melting. I do eat the gust against great players more than I would like but I am working on improving that. Necromancers when played well will slaughter a condition based engie. Especially since they don’t stand on point which makes bombs ineffective and they have great condi transfers and removal.

In general engie is good at what it does which is pushing far point and going for 1v1’s + decaps. That said having a spirit ranger push far or a great thief push far are two other effective options that see play in top tier teams. Of those 2 the spirit ranger has more utility than the engie in larger than 1v1 fights and more survivability in 1v2 situations. The thief can gank players off point far faster and can do work stealing bosses on niffel or getting around the map better on Khylo.

I would wager plenty of engineers will get pawned by good theifs/mesmers/eles and even the great ones will struggle to takeout rangers and auto loose to good necromancers.

I just don’t think engineers are OP at the moment because they have to work so hard just to get a favorable roll of the dice. IE not being screwed based on opposing players profession when entering into a 1v1. Plus they have to give up stun breakers and precious utility slots for kits which arn’t always super useful.

This is a very excellent summary right here. I’ve been Engi since BWE2 now and this matches pretty much exactly how I feel.

(hint – our opinion matters more than you who have never even played it or done nothing but stomp hotjoin)

O the old, “you suck, I am the greatest, therefore everything I say is fact and everything you say is wrong” argument. Cant beat it :P

Lordrosicky.5813:

Velron.3729:

Godofallu.2935:

LeGi.3921:

burst would be d/p?

any decent pvp player can dodge basivenom/backstab in a 1on1 and when you need to 2on1 the engi we are in a bad spot (3vs4) on the rest of the map and will probably lose the teamfight there.

on top of that d/p needs to land that backstab and the engi got a blind bomb, a 7sec blind on FT#5 (instacast), this shield stun and so much area denial that it is pretty hard to be melee with him.

i say it again, to be great with the engi and pull all that stuff off it really takes practise and skill, much more than for example a s/d thief, but when you know your kittens then your are a freaking monster.

but like i said above, as Arenanet is not going to change anything soon, i guess i just roll engi myself and hope that i get good with this class before everyone else realises how OP this class is -.-, (omg he said it!)

First of all I want to say that I agree with basically everything you have said in this thread and I salute you for putting up with that much obvious bullkitten from Nakoda. He clearly doesn’t understand matchups or counterplay and his inflammatory and pompous attitude is clearly derailing this thread.

I’ve fought probably a thousand+ duels and 1v1’s against some of the best players the NA scene has to offer as an engie and I will say that I don’t auto loose to a great thief. Hell if I have supply turret up or know they are coming I would say I am favored in the fights.

Other engineers can’t beat me (usually). Thiefs need to get that basilisk venom or some sort of great backstab to have a chance which is 50/50 ish shot at having a chance. Mesmers had better shatter combo me twice in very rapid succession or I will melt them which doesn’t happen often. Warriors will melt/die before they get to me and I will blind/push them back over and over. Guardians will melt to me if they want to stand on point and can’t actually dps me down because sword and greatsword are way too telegraphed and obvious. Rangers that play well are pretty annoying and even if I do manage to win the fight it’s a long and uphill battle against the best of them. Elementalists had better be running fresh air or some sort of super burst comp and they better land that gust -> lightning flast -> Firegrab/Pheonix combo or they won’t have the damage to beat me before melting. I do eat the gust against great players more than I would like but I am working on improving that. Necromancers when played well will slaughter a condition based engie. Especially since they don’t stand on point which makes bombs ineffective and they have great condi transfers and removal.

In general engie is good at what it does which is pushing far point and going for 1v1’s + decaps. That said having a spirit ranger push far or a great thief push far are two other effective options that see play in top tier teams. Of those 2 the spirit ranger has more utility than the engie in larger than 1v1 fights and more survivability in 1v2 situations. The thief can gank players off point far faster and can do work stealing bosses on niffel or getting around the map better on Khylo.

I would wager plenty of engineers will get pawned by good theifs/mesmers/eles and even the great ones will struggle to takeout rangers and auto loose to good necromancers.

I just don’t think engineers are OP at the moment because they have to work so hard just to get a favorable roll of the dice. IE not being screwed based on opposing players profession when entering into a 1v1. Plus they have to give up stun breakers and precious utility slots for kits which arn’t always super useful.

This is a very excellent summary right here. I’ve been Engi since BWE2 now and this matches pretty much exactly how I feel.

(hint – our opinion matters more than you who have never even played it or done nothing but stomp hotjoin)

O the old, “you suck, I am the greatest, therefore everything I say is fact and everything you say is wrong” argument. Cant beat it :P

No, not what I said. Nice twisting of the words.

What I have gathered from this thread (among other engi balance threads):

Elixir R and its utility skill in its current state are still OP.

Engis with no stunbreak are OP.

You cannot kill an Engi with automated response (even burst classes have a hard time downing the engi becuase they cannot CC him)

HGH engis are still running around rampant.

Healing turret has some of the best condi removal in the game currently.

Engineers actually have 4-5 utility slots.

Every class should be able to counter the engineer no matter what build the engineer has specialized for.

HGH engis are too tanky.

Engineers were not nerfed in the slightest last balance patch.

100% condition duration reduction from automated response is still impunity even with a condition duration of 110%.

Every Engineer is currently running automated response.

Engineers can use two grandmaster traits in one trait line (HGH with automated response is OP).

Engineers make for the best bunker in the game.

Engineers have the best utilites in the game.

Engineers are the best 1v1 class in the game (no matter the build).

Toss Elixir R is a guarunteed instant ress.

The current meta revolves around 5 man engi teams.

Everyone at A-Net plays Engi.

Elixir X on Engineers is too strong.

Bomb engi counters ranged classes.

Engis have too much access to stealth.

Engis have good acess to stability.

Engineers have some of the best condition removal in the game.

Supply crate is hands down the best elite in the game.

Engineers have the best elites in the game.

etc.

Benji.9203:

What I have gathered from this thread (among other engi balance threads):

Elixir R and its utility skill in its current state are still OP.

Engis with no stunbreak are OP.

You cannot kill an Engi with automated response (even burst classes have a hard time downing the engi becuase they cannot CC him)

HGH engis are still running around rampant.

Healing turret has some of the best condi removal in the game currently.

Engineers actually have 4-5 utility slots.

Every class should be able to counter the engineer no matter what build the engineer has specialized for.

HGH engis are too tanky.

Engineers were not nerfed in the slightest last balance patch.

100% condition duration reduction from automated response is still impunity even with a condition duration of 110%.

Every Engineer is currently running automated response.

Engineers can use two grandmaster traits in one trait line (HGH with automated response is OP).

Engineers make for the best bunker in the game.

Engineers have the best utilites in the game.

Engineers are the best 1v1 class in the game (no matter the build).

Toss Elixir R is a guarunteed instant ress.

The current meta revolves around 5 man engi teams.

Everyone at A-Net plays Engi.

Elixir X on Engineers is too strong.

Bomb engi counters ranged classes.

Engis have too much access to stealth.

Engis have good acess to stability.

Engineers have some of the best condition removal in the game.

Supply crate is hands down the best elite in the game.

Engineers have the best elites in the game.

etc.

You forgot that Mortar can instant kill a whole team

Benji.9203:

What I have gathered from this thread (among other engi balance threads):

^ Everything about engie has to be nerfed. Cause you know…we should only play with turrets.

Benji.9203:

What I have gathered from this thread:

What I’ve gathered from this thread (and others) is that the game is actually fairly well balanced.

- Necros are complaining about engineers.

- Engineers are complaining about Necros.

- You still need Guardians, Mesmers, and Eles in tPvP.

- CC warriors can lock down Necros and Engineers.

- Thieves still have the best mobility and burst, which are critical roles PvP.

- Spirit rangers are great bunker options now with very powerful 1v1 potential.

Here’s a newsflash for you clowns. Some professions/builds have more ideal roles and matchups than others.

Heaven forbid you die to someone trying to do something not suited to your build or against an opponent who has counter abilities.

Since the recent patch, almost any profession can find a place on a tPvP team now, which is a good thing and should be applauded more than all the whining.

Certain combinations of condition skills are a bit over the top….but so are a few burst combos too.

Stop using hyberbole to exaggerate things though…it just makes you look foolish and less skilled than you think you are.

Lately I’ve been having more fun playing my newly made Warrior than my Engineer I’ve played since pre-release, therefore Warrior is OP.

Choops.3710:

Lately I’ve been having more fun playing my newly made Warrior than my Engineer I’ve played since pre-release, therefore Warrior is OP.

especially with defy pain and endure pain.

;)

SPESHAL.9106:

Benji.9203:

What I have gathered from this thread:

- You still need Guardians, Mesmers, and Eles in tPvP.

Mesmer in current meta? Helseth rerolled necro. CC never had a mesmer. Xeph plays thief. Actually I would say guard, necro and engi and maybe to a lesser extend ele are “must have” atm. But mesmer???

tarcheg.4872:

SPESHAL.9106:

Benji.9203:

What I have gathered from this thread:

- You still need Guardians, Mesmers, and Eles in tPvP.

Mesmer in current meta? Helseth rerolled necro. CC never had a mesmer. Xeph plays thief. Actually I would say guard, necro and engi and maybe to a lesser extend ele are “must have” atm. But mesmer???

My mesmer is kinda shelved atm

Benji.9203:

What I have gathered from this thread (among other engi balance threads):

Elixir R and its utility skill in its current state are still OP.

Engis with no stunbreak are OP.

You cannot kill an Engi with automated response (even burst classes have a hard time downing the engi becuase they cannot CC him)

HGH engis are still running around rampant.

Healing turret has some of the best condi removal in the game currently.

Engineers actually have 4-5 utility slots.

Every class should be able to counter the engineer no matter what build the engineer has specialized for.

HGH engis are too tanky.

Engineers were not nerfed in the slightest last balance patch.

100% condition duration reduction from automated response is still impunity even with a condition duration of 110%.

Every Engineer is currently running automated response.

Engineers can use two grandmaster traits in one trait line (HGH with automated response is OP).

Engineers make for the best bunker in the game.

Engineers have the best utilites in the game.

Engineers are the best 1v1 class in the game (no matter the build).

Toss Elixir R is a guarunteed instant ress.

The current meta revolves around 5 man engi teams.

Everyone at A-Net plays Engi.

Elixir X on Engineers is too strong.

Bomb engi counters ranged classes.

Engis have too much access to stealth.

Engis have good acess to stability.

Engineers have some of the best condition removal in the game.

Supply crate is hands down the best elite in the game.

Engineers have the best elites in the game.

etc.

Man, I gotta say I like you. Ty for the laugh, I was going pretty good by halfway through the list.

nakoda.4213:

Choops.3710:

Lately I’ve been having more fun playing my newly made Warrior than my Engineer I’ve played since pre-release, therefore Warrior is OP.

especially with defy pain and endure pain.

;)

Is it some weird coincidence that I have been enjoying my Warrior more lately too?

I’ve loved Engi since I first tried it in BWE2 and its been my main ever since…but lately I have been loving my heavy CC warrior with great condition removal and stability.

Too many Necros running around everywhere ruining my fun, so now I have fun ruining their fun! What a cycle!

(Oh and yes, the Necros definitely QQ about my Warrior….their tears give me strength)

Velron.3729:

nakoda.4213:

Choops.3710:

Lately I’ve been having more fun playing my newly made Warrior than my Engineer I’ve played since pre-release, therefore Warrior is OP.

especially with defy pain and endure pain.

;)

Is it some weird coincidence that I have been enjoying my Warrior more lately too?

I’ve loved Engi since I first tried it in BWE2 and its been my main ever since…but lately I have been loving my heavy CC warrior with great condition removal and stability.

Too many Necros running around everywhere ruining my fun, so now I have fun ruining their fun! What a cycle!

(Oh and yes, the Necros definitely QQ about my Warrior….their tears give me strength)

I’ve also went from engi to warrior, mainly cause people actully allow me to play warrior now though.. <3

Velron.3729:

Lordrosicky.5813:

Velron.3729:

Godofallu.2935:

LeGi.3921:

burst would be d/p?

any decent pvp player can dodge basivenom/backstab in a 1on1 and when you need to 2on1 the engi we are in a bad spot (3vs4) on the rest of the map and will probably lose the teamfight there.

on top of that d/p needs to land that backstab and the engi got a blind bomb, a 7sec blind on FT#5 (instacast), this shield stun and so much area denial that it is pretty hard to be melee with him.

i say it again, to be great with the engi and pull all that stuff off it really takes practise and skill, much more than for example a s/d thief, but when you know your kittens then your are a freaking monster.

but like i said above, as Arenanet is not going to change anything soon, i guess i just roll engi myself and hope that i get good with this class before everyone else realises how OP this class is -.-, (omg he said it!)

First of all I want to say that I agree with basically everything you have said in this thread and I salute you for putting up with that much obvious bullkitten from Nakoda. He clearly doesn’t understand matchups or counterplay and his inflammatory and pompous attitude is clearly derailing this thread.

I’ve fought probably a thousand+ duels and 1v1’s against some of the best players the NA scene has to offer as an engie and I will say that I don’t auto loose to a great thief. Hell if I have supply turret up or know they are coming I would say I am favored in the fights.

Other engineers can’t beat me (usually). Thiefs need to get that basilisk venom or some sort of great backstab to have a chance which is 50/50 ish shot at having a chance. Mesmers had better shatter combo me twice in very rapid succession or I will melt them which doesn’t happen often. Warriors will melt/die before they get to me and I will blind/push them back over and over. Guardians will melt to me if they want to stand on point and can’t actually dps me down because sword and greatsword are way too telegraphed and obvious. Rangers that play well are pretty annoying and even if I do manage to win the fight it’s a long and uphill battle against the best of them. Elementalists had better be running fresh air or some sort of super burst comp and they better land that gust -> lightning flast -> Firegrab/Pheonix combo or they won’t have the damage to beat me before melting. I do eat the gust against great players more than I would like but I am working on improving that. Necromancers when played well will slaughter a condition based engie. Especially since they don’t stand on point which makes bombs ineffective and they have great condi transfers and removal.

In general engie is good at what it does which is pushing far point and going for 1v1’s + decaps. That said having a spirit ranger push far or a great thief push far are two other effective options that see play in top tier teams. Of those 2 the spirit ranger has more utility than the engie in larger than 1v1 fights and more survivability in 1v2 situations. The thief can gank players off point far faster and can do work stealing bosses on niffel or getting around the map better on Khylo.

I would wager plenty of engineers will get pawned by good theifs/mesmers/eles and even the great ones will struggle to takeout rangers and auto loose to good necromancers.

I just don’t think engineers are OP at the moment because they have to work so hard just to get a favorable roll of the dice. IE not being screwed based on opposing players profession when entering into a 1v1. Plus they have to give up stun breakers and precious utility slots for kits which arn’t always super useful.

This is a very excellent summary right here. I’ve been Engi since BWE2 now and this matches pretty much exactly how I feel.

(hint – our opinion matters more than you who have never even played it or done nothing but stomp hotjoin)

O the old, “you suck, I am the greatest, therefore everything I say is fact and everything you say is wrong” argument. Cant beat it :P

No, not what I said. Nice twisting of the words.

Yeh but it pretty much is what you said. You said your opinion matters and mine is invalid. Which is a ridiculous thing to say

Well,

i stated my opinion here several times and to get a closure here i just say this:

funny how many engis that are not even ranked say that they beat most of the classes but in the same sentence say that they arent overpowered but its all skill.

i dont wanna say rank matters, but when you have not been playing vs well organized teams i think you lack experience to actually comprehend the problem here.

the other thing is, how can you say that engi is totally fine when you beat anyone 1on1?

just think about what you posted in an objective way and maybe read my posts again.

but nvm me, im outta here.

the potential to defeat any class 1v1 and having the skill to do so are different things, LeGi.

There are two levels of balance in this game type. 1v1 and group fights.

Every class must be equipped with the ability to handle any other class in a 1v1 situation. This is where diversity of builds comes in and we see the rock>paper>scissors game.

For engies, this amounts to: AR vs Condi; Healing Bombs/Stealth vs melee; knockbacks/cc node defense; hgh-condi vs bunkers.

Every other class also has several builds with specific roles that are designed to perform some function within the domination macrocosm. (now, the argument about whether anet has these builds working or not is another discussion, can we agree on that?)

On top of this layer of individual interactivity is the team, where the value of building a team composition that compensates for any individual weakness in a single player (like needed dps on a team instead of all bunkers, yes, I am being very basic here).

This is where having roamers comes in handy, because they can tip the balance of a 1v1 – especially so when spec A comes across its counter, spec B because now the second team member evens things out, helping out spec B or (conversely) hammering spec B because her ally is countering B with spec A. (just one example).

The point is that yes, engies are good at area denial. that is and has always been what anet has wanted out of them. only recently has this been starting to shine as the lustre of hgh-condi starts to fade under the wing of conditionmancers.

furthermore, just because I am not ranked does not mean I am oblivious to how the game works or unintelligent enough to watch tournaments and smaller scrims and develop a sense of how things work. for me, i simply cannot commit enough time and would be a liability to a team, so I bow out.

If I lived at home or had no job, I would walk all over you. Because i am a better gamer. Not because I play an engie.

Quoting is messed up on this post now.

“Yeh but it pretty much is what you said. You said your opinion matters and mine is invalid. Which is a ridiculous thing to say”

If you have never played the profession or maybe only done a little hotjoin stomping…then NO your opinion on the Engineer does not matter. I stand by that.

That is reality, I’m sorry it makes you sad.

nakoda.4213:

There are two levels of balance in this game type. 1v1 and group fights.

What about necro? He is a monstah in 1v1 and teamfights. Smell the ironic of balance in here?

nakoda.4213:

Every class must be equipped with the ability to handle any other class in a 1v1 situation. This is where diversity of builds comes in and we see the rock>paper>scissors game.

You speak about build-diversity? Srsly?
-Shatter-Mesmer
-Kit-Engineer
-30/30/10 necro
-Spirit ranger
-Burst ele
-Shout-Guard
-S/D thief

This build-diversity is killing me. So much builds to choose, feel like a lil child in the candy-shop. I mean, we can edit many builds like phantasm or dps-guard, but tbh: they’re not viable in the current state.

Can any spec choose utilities? Not really. . . there are locked utilities you have to bring in every game. It’s just an illusion to think you are free to pick the utilities you want to.

Empathetic Fighter.2065:

nakoda.4213:

There are two levels of balance in this game type. 1v1 and group fights.

What about necro? He is a monstah in 1v1 and teamfights. Smell the ironic of balance in here?

nakoda.4213:

Every class must be equipped with the ability to handle any other class in a 1v1 situation. This is where diversity of builds comes in and we see the rock>paper>scissors game.

You speak about build-diversity? Srsly?
-Shatter-Mesmer
-Kit-Engineer
-30/30/10 necro
-Spirit ranger
-Burst ele
-Shout-Guard
-S/D thief

This build-diversity is killing me. So much builds to choose, feel like a lil child in the candy-shop. I mean, we can edit many builds like phantasm or dps-guard, but tbh: they’re not viable in the current state.

thanks, EF, for completely ignoring my caveat that whether or not anet has achieved this is outside the point.

also, re: necro: no mittens, kitten. why do you think everyone and their mom’s dog is crying that necro are OP right now? go stomp your feet in a corner somewhere else, your tantrums aren’t necessary here.

re: kit engineer: unless they are p/p hgh or 4 turrets with no kits, EVERY engineer is a kit engineer. would you like our entire profession deleted?

your list sums up WHY the current “meta” is broken. it doesn’t address any of the points I made.

but thanks for calling in to the show today.

nakoda.4213:

Empathetic Fighter.2065:

nakoda.4213:

There are two levels of balance in this game type. 1v1 and group fights.

What about necro? He is a monstah in 1v1 and teamfights. Smell the ironic of balance in here?

nakoda.4213:

Every class must be equipped with the ability to handle any other class in a 1v1 situation. This is where diversity of builds comes in and we see the rock>paper>scissors game.

You speak about build-diversity? Srsly?
-Shatter-Mesmer
-Kit-Engineer
-30/30/10 necro
-Spirit ranger
-Burst ele
-Shout-Guard
-S/D thief

This build-diversity is killing me. So much builds to choose, feel like a lil child in the candy-shop. I mean, we can edit many builds like phantasm or dps-guard, but tbh: they’re not viable in the current state.

thanks, EF, for completely ignoring my caveat that whether or not anet has achieved this is outside the point.

also, re: necro: no mittens, kitten. why do you think everyone and their mom’s dog is crying that necro are OP right now? go stomp your feet in a corner somewhere else, your tantrums aren’t necessary here.

re: kit engineer: unless they are p/p hgh or 4 turrets with no kits, EVERY engineer is a kit engineer. would you like our entire profession deleted?

your list sums up WHY the current “meta” is broken. it doesn’t address any of the points I made.

but thanks for calling in to the show today.

Sorry for bothering you, but I actually refer to build-diversity from tournaments and not from Hotjoin. Mabye because of that you are a little confused. But please show me some vids of a competitive turret-engineer or an hgh that is after patch still playing.

I quoted you so addressed things of your post. Or did you not write these things down I quoted? probably you should reread your own post, before quoting mine.

newsflash: i don’t hotjoin either. i am not in your precious meaningless broken leaderboard because i soloq.

you didn’t address a thing my post talked about.