Dragon Hunter DPS
Honestly Dh trapper is basically the same as ranger trapper.
The only difference is its using physical damage instead of conditions.
They can both easily wreck someone if said person does not realize what is happening & dodge out ASAP.
Ranger traps dont have daze on every proc nor do they have mechanics to keep you on the trap.
Lord Ninth \\ Champion Magus
- Primordial Legend
Semi-active.
- Primordial Legend
Semi-active.
I am open to the possibility that I don’t know how to counterplay the DH yet, and I win about 30% of my 1v1’s vs DH (as a reaper) so it’s not always a total bust. However, I fought an especially competent one the other day and here’s how it went…
On Legacy of the Foefire, I’m capping waterfall. He approaches. His ranged DPS + regen is vastly superior to my range DPS + regen, so I hide under the edge of the point to avoid this (I would clearly have lost my staff vs his bow). I wait for him to come into melee range.
Right away, his damage is very high. Many stacks of burns. I let my passive spectral shroud pop, blow my heal to cleanse the fire, and dodge when I can. As my healthbar is rocketing down, he is blocking. Still blocking. Still blocking.
He blocks while he damages through my entire healthbar, and then through my entire deathshroud. During the entire fight I land a couple dagger autos, a few tics of locust swarm, a couple reaper shroud autos, and maybe one or two tics of soul spiral. This is a very small amount of damage, and he doesn’t fall below 80%.
But meanwhile, with me dodging and cleansing when possible, my health is absolutely getting torched. I can hardly believe that something that seems to be perpetually invulnerable is doing this much damage.
About 15 seconds into the fight I’ve exhausted every CD and am dead. He stomps me with fear immunity (either block or stab, wasn’t sure which) with 90% HP. When I’m dead, he’s done a very large amount of both burning an direct damage.
I struggle to see what that player’s weakness was. Excellent ranged damage. Crushed me in melee range. Top notch survivability. Some of the best (possibly the best) damage I’ve seen in the game.
Oh, and he definitely stunned me and knocked me down several times. I have about 8s of reliable stability in reaper shroud, but other than that he could slap me around easily.
Open to suggestions, but that was an unusually one-sided fight and I felt I had few options.
(edited by Jackalrat.5493)
Reaper has to run DPS specs to be able to beat the Dragon Hunter and you have to get very aggressive with your Reaper otherwise you won’t deal enough DPS quickly enough to out DPS his heal factor.
Use the shout: Rise
and detonate traps before engaging
You’ll have about 24s after each trap detonation to be aggressive
Stay close range, don’t let the DH use it’s bow to land free DPS when you can’t hit him
I use the name Barbie on all of my characters.
(edited by Trevor Boyer.6524)
I returned to my guardian just for DH. Barely played 2 rounds in HJ with it just to get a feel of it. Then I hopped into unranked. It was ridiculously easy to win with it, but hey, it must be my opponents (although it was a high mmr unranked match) who need to l2p right?
I didn’t even need to be a guardian expert to own with it. Please don’t nerf DH. I love low skill high reward classes. Need to farm more people ‘who needs to l2p’ with my DH for my sadistic enjoyment.
Lol you said you went into unranked and said it was ridiculously easy to win. In unranked? Lol dude you do know that unranked is wear most noobs and casual players at right? Try bringing your dh into a fear 1v1 dueling server, then come back and talk.
… you do know unranked has mmr too right? But sure, I welcome a duel anytime. Ill add you up for duels when im on.
Yeah it is but you still cant say its ridiculously easy to win as a dh in unranked because of how inconsistent it is.
And yeah we should def duel, do u play in eu or na? Ill get on my scrapperWhy not? I was pointing out how DH was so rewarding while being easy to play. It’s not OP per se, just disproportionate. I play on NA, but you do realise celestial scrapper is a direct counter to DH?
When did i say i was gonna use celestisl scrapper? And if you want too then ill duel you on reaper
I returned to my guardian just for DH. Barely played 2 rounds in HJ with it just to get a feel of it. Then I hopped into unranked. It was ridiculously easy to win with it, but hey, it must be my opponents (although it was a high mmr unranked match) who need to l2p right?
I didn’t even need to be a guardian expert to own with it. Please don’t nerf DH. I love low skill high reward classes. Need to farm more people ‘who needs to l2p’ with my DH for my sadistic enjoyment.
Lol you said you went into unranked and said it was ridiculously easy to win. In unranked? Lol dude you do know that unranked is wear most noobs and casual players at right? Try bringing your dh into a fear 1v1 dueling server, then come back and talk.
… you do know unranked has mmr too right? But sure, I welcome a duel anytime. Ill add you up for duels when im on.
It is also the only playable mode for almost two weeks now.
And also probably worth mentioning that GW2 combat is designed around 5vs5 and the only official competitive side of the game is conquest. Actually probably the first time I have seen someone try and claim balance based on a “fear 1vs1 duelling server”.
I would also like to point out coolguy has no relation to the guild FEAR whatsoever. Just before anyone misunderstands.
Yeab but this kid took a dh build into unranked and said it was easy to win with it, even though unranked is full of noobs and casuals. Yeah it may be the only mmr playable right now but you still cant say its op cause of that lol.
The funny thing is, Trevor’s build is so bad it makes me cringe. He isn’t running shelter, he isn’t running renewed focus, he isn’t running with an off hand focus. He has one 5s block every 60+s. He has sustain in the form of 4k (6k if you throw in smiters boon) HP. His trap heals gives an immediate 2k and the other 6k required the target to trigger it for you. In a ranged duel, he has access to 5s of block and an 8k heal. On paper, this sounds like alot unyil you realize how much every other class is packing. He’s running GS, but no JI meaning he’s absolutely reliant on either maw or hunters ward to trap his targets for the WW. Maw might hold the target long enough for them to eat the WW, but you should never be able to land a LB5 in a 1v1.
I honestly question the level of skill of the players you tested this build on because the amount of holes in it that can be exploited are wider than the grand canyon.
(edited by SlayerSixx.5763)
I returned to my guardian just for DH. Barely played 2 rounds in HJ with it just to get a feel of it. Then I hopped into unranked. It was ridiculously easy to win with it, but hey, it must be my opponents (although it was a high mmr unranked match) who need to l2p right?
I didn’t even need to be a guardian expert to own with it. Please don’t nerf DH. I love low skill high reward classes. Need to farm more people ‘who needs to l2p’ with my DH for my sadistic enjoyment.
Lol you said you went into unranked and said it was ridiculously easy to win. In unranked? Lol dude you do know that unranked is wear most noobs and casual players at right? Try bringing your dh into a fear 1v1 dueling server, then come back and talk.
… you do know unranked has mmr too right? But sure, I welcome a duel anytime. Ill add you up for duels when im on.
Yeah it is but you still cant say its ridiculously easy to win as a dh in unranked because of how inconsistent it is.
And yeah we should def duel, do u play in eu or na? Ill get on my scrapperWhy not? I was pointing out how DH was so rewarding while being easy to play. It’s not OP per se, just disproportionate. I play on NA, but you do realise celestial scrapper is a direct counter to DH?
When did i say i was gonna use celestisl scrapper? And if you want too then ill duel you on reaper
Lol you said you would bring your scrapper. But w/e, ill be on about 12 hours from now. We can duel then.
Lord Ninth \\ Champion Magus
- Primordial Legend
Semi-active.
- Primordial Legend
Semi-active.
I returned to my guardian just for DH. Barely played 2 rounds in HJ with it just to get a feel of it. Then I hopped into unranked. It was ridiculously easy to win with it, but hey, it must be my opponents (although it was a high mmr unranked match) who need to l2p right?
I didn’t even need to be a guardian expert to own with it. Please don’t nerf DH. I love low skill high reward classes. Need to farm more people ‘who needs to l2p’ with my DH for my sadistic enjoyment.
Lol you said you went into unranked and said it was ridiculously easy to win. In unranked? Lol dude you do know that unranked is wear most noobs and casual players at right? Try bringing your dh into a fear 1v1 dueling server, then come back and talk.
… you do know unranked has mmr too right? But sure, I welcome a duel anytime. Ill add you up for duels when im on.
It is also the only playable mode for almost two weeks now.
And also probably worth mentioning that GW2 combat is designed around 5vs5 and the only official competitive side of the game is conquest. Actually probably the first time I have seen someone try and claim balance based on a “fear 1vs1 duelling server”.
I would also like to point out coolguy has no relation to the guild FEAR whatsoever. Just before anyone misunderstands.
Yeab but this kid took a dh build into unranked and said it was easy to win with it, even though unranked is full of noobs and casuals. Yeah it may be the only mmr playable right now but you still cant say its op cause of that lol.
Lmao. Do you even bother reading? Go read what I said and then come back to delete your post.
Lord Ninth \\ Champion Magus
- Primordial Legend
Semi-active.
- Primordial Legend
Semi-active.
The funny thing is, Trevor’s build is so bad it makes me cringe. He isn’t running shelter, he isn’t running renewed focus, he isn’t running with an off hand focus. He has one 5s block every 60+s. He has sustain in the form of 4k (6k if you throw in smiters boon) HP. His trap heals gives an immediate 2k and the other 6k required the target to trigger it for you. In a ranged duel, he has access to 5s of block and an 8k heal. On paper, this sounds like alot unyil you realize how much every other class is packing. He’s running GS, but no JI meaning he’s absolutely reliant on either maw or hunters ward to trap his targets for the WW. Maw might hold the target long enough for them to eat the WW, but you should never be able to land a LB5 in a 1v1.
I honestly question the level of skill of the players you tested this build on because the amount of holes in it that can be exploited are wider than the grand canyon.
Please do elaborate
I use the name Barbie on all of my characters.
You quoted the elaboration. Guardian is known for his blocks. You try play to him like ranger, but he lacks the flexibility to move as well as ranger, so you’re a slower ranger with slightly better healing. There’s a reason why DPS guard was once meta for a while while DPS ranger never even got close enough to smell the blood of the comp battles.
I’ll elaborate further, if I must.
You’re using GS without JI. You can argue that you’ve got your virtue pull, but that works in two parts. You first have the spear, then the pull. If your target is at range (assuming they are which is why you’re using it) then them simply turning around and running will either break the tether or reduce the range of the pull, rendering it useless.
You can maybe rely on LB5, but hunters ward is generally a nonfactor in 1v1s.
All you have is dragons maw. One WW every 60s? Sounds legit.
Basically, your alternative weapon set is useless against a competent player.
Two utilities focused on condi cleansing. I’m assuming you took smite for the healing as well, but the issue is that the medi heals only kept medi guard standing because of the blocks of which you have none.
Test of faith can be dodged out of and then waited out. Now, you’re stuck relying on purification to keep you standing. The moment they escape your maw, the fight is over. If they’re ranged, you’re stuck relying on super telegraphed true shots while they most likely have faster abilities. I’ll give you a very entertaining example. P/P thief, for instance, without DD (DD would be overkill) would quite literally ride you like a rented mule. 1 headshot for every 1 true shot. 1 initiative per second meaning that they’d regen headshot every time you have true shot come off CD. So what are you stuck doing with your mediocre build? You use your only block, but the thief has now either LOSed you or dropped a black powder + SB barrage to blast stealth. Your shield is down, you’re out of defenses, your telegraphed attacks are all either dodged or interrupted and now you’re essentially sitting there eating unload after unload (which does nearly 10k damage assuming scholar and zerk amulet, but realistically, they’re hitting 8ks because marauder). You die in 3 unloads. They die in 3 true shots assuming air/fire proc. They’re more mobile than you are and are capable of interrupting everything you can throw out. Also, god help you if they catch you with basilisk venom and your stun breaks are out. Then it’s literally insta kill from there since you don’t have your virtues available a second time around because of no RF.
^this is without DD, may I remind you. With DD, you have 0 chance of landing any attack at all, even with the virtue chain.
^^also, a mesmer or reaper would most likely dump on this so hard once they realize where your gaps are.
The reason why ranger GS/LB works is because they’re far more flexible in terms of movement and far more diverse in terms of skill set.
If you’re feeling skeptical about all of this, I don’t blame you. Feel free to add me in game as I’ll more than gladly duel you.
Honestly Dh trapper is basically the same as ranger trapper.
The only difference is its using physical damage instead of conditions.
They can both easily wreck someone if said person does not realize what is happening & dodge out ASAP.
Its like a trapper ranger that also gets free daze on all traps, plus stability, blind, swiftness, revealed, protection, fury, slow, aegis, cripple, might depending on the trap, two instant cast traps, a heal trap that can be effectively “double cast” like normal traps, 60% uptime on stability from a trait that auto procs knockback on any bow skill once every 10 seconds and a 1200 unblockable pull, among other things.
So yeah, kind of like a trapper ranger that has been buffed up to near god status.
SlayerSixx, there is a lot you’re not understanding about DH play and one thing you’re not mentioning at all is the skill Binding Blades on Greatsword. Consider the pulling/pushing catch power between: Binding Blades, F1, Dragon’s Maw, Heavy Light. The Smite Condition is for damage bursting, frequent healing and fury.
The Sword/Focus version of DH is a worse build. The #5 focus blocking is besides the point and does little to help you in contrast to the large AoE pull from binding blades which interrupts foes as well as pull them in to traps. This is important to landing heal trigger and making sure that it lands, seeing as how you have F1 and Dragon’s Maw to make sure that it happens. The sword is also terrible DPS in comparison to Greatsword whirling with symbol. GS + traps = nuclear bursting. Also GS #3 Leap Of Faith is a blind alongside of the longbow blind. Oh and the let’s not forget how many attacks in the game that are actually unblockable currently.
Dragon Hunter is all about control. When you have superior ranged capability to any class in the game “and you do on Dragon Hunter currently” nothing can range you. Maybe it’s my experience playing as Ranger but I do not ever lose in ranged combat on the DH against any class. This forces players to disengage and leave or advance in to close range. G’Luck against the enormous heal factor, Nuclear DPS, 3 dazes and 3 pull interrupts when you get close range.
Judge’s Intervention is obsolete on DH and eventually the metabattle version will reflect this. Right now we have a lot of Guardian players trying to Trap Ranger on their Dragon Hunters. These are people who have ignored the Ranger class for almost 3 years now. Given time, they’ll realize that trap play is better done defensively with kiting/pulling, not with aggressive teleports in to other units with enormous DPS.
I think you’re stuck on the idea of face tanking with your DH. The only reason why Shelter/Renewed Focus was ever a thing is because older Guardian builds were entirely reliant on using Judge’s to advance in to the middle of a group immediately to land DPS. They actually needed those skills to soften the fall and stack might for the burst. DH does not need to position itself so unwisely, especially not now that it has the best ranged tact and DPS in the game.
You also spoke of mobility on the DH being bad. The run/walk speed is low yes but it’s ability to disengage is far far more powerful than older Guardian builds. Chasing a Dragon Hunter up the stairs from mid in Legacy “as example” is asking to be downed immediately in close quarters through a choke point. Especially if that DH has 2 DPS traps, 3 dazes with 1 trap heal and 3 pull interrupts and 1 knockback.
Consider what would happen 1v1 your DH vs. my DH:
- I would first lay Purification trap in an odd spot to begin allowing the heal to recharge while the initial cast was still on the ground waiting to be used. I would also lay down both Test Of Faith and Dragon’s Maw in odd spots to confuse you. If you would like to walk around and detonate the traps purposely to kill my heal trigger, g’luck figuring it out.
- Then I would begin to out DPS you at range with more frequent fury buffing due to Smite Condition, as well as superior heal factor. Smite Condition has a 16s recharge.
- You want to Judge’s Intervention me? I would pay close attention to make sure that your F3 aegis cast animation had not gone off first before you judge’s at me. If you had began casting it, I would immediately retaliate with casting mine, to make sure we both went in at each other with stability. This way if you came in at me with traps, I would dodge roll away. If you had simply tried to feint me with it, then you won’t be coming in at me with stability and I would kite you in to traps.
- What about your #5 focus skill for blocking? Unfortunately F1 pull is unblockable and so is #3 LB Deflecting shot. Oh and Test Of Faith is also unblockable.
- What about Shelter? Terrible heal factor, #3 LB is unblockable and so is everything else, read the previous statement.
- Sword vs. Greatsword DPS in close range? Dunno, you do the math.
- But what’s worse is that because I am the one doing the kiting with faster and productive heal skills and traps already planted and you are the aggressive offensive teleporter, I will out heal you in ranged, out DPS you, avoid your offensive “go to me” trap bursting and the very first time you land in any of precasted traps while trying to out kite me, I will have them ready to be recast again immediately. At that point I just get aggressive with you, knowing that my GS will out DPS your Sword, I will outheal you and I will out CC you.
Read and understand why kiting with traps is better than being aggressive. You’ll see that Shelter/Renewed Focus/Judge’s are actually hurting Dragon Hunter builds. Alongside of that, the Sword/Focus is not as strong of an option as the Greatsword, mostly due to Binding Blades which entirely compliments trap play. Not even in just 1v1 but for nuclear AoE trap pulling alongside of Dragon’s Maw. Your job as a Dragon Hunter is to point nuke the kitten out of a node, not stand on it and tank. Leave the tanking to the Scrappers and Reapers.
Also, I lol’d at your comment: D/D Thieves will ride you. If you’re being out ranged by D/D Thieves on your DH, you’re doing something very wrong my friend. DH is easily a hard counter to any Thief build. So much of a hard counter that you should be able to 1v2 them, especially in close quarters.
I use the name Barbie on all of my characters.
(edited by Trevor Boyer.6524)
I bought 5 transmute charges from gemstore so I could pimp up my Dragonhunter with Mistward, I’m ready for the world.
Power Ranger PvP
I used to be a power ranger, now not sure anymore
I used to be a power ranger, now not sure anymore
Honestly I think the issue with DH is less to do with DH and more to do with conquest.
It’s fairly easy to fight a DH if you’re free to pick your terrain, but conquest forces us to fight over these itsy bitsy nodes.
Signed,
A salty bunker guard that has the lovely job of having to hold point against all the HoT AoE.
Sanity is for the weak minded.
YouTube
YouTube
That same thing happened to me on an empty point yesterday, DH told me to L2P.
Yup that’s what happens if they run every trap possible and lay it all in one spot. Thus the .gif posted on page #1.
I use the name Barbie on all of my characters.
This is simple ridiculous hahaha and hilarious wtf
I am open to the possibility that I don’t know how to counterplay the DH yet, and I win about 30% of my 1v1’s vs DH (as a reaper) so it’s not always a total bust. However, I fought an especially competent one the other day and here’s how it went…
On Legacy of the Foefire, I’m capping waterfall. He approaches. His ranged DPS + regen is vastly superior to my range DPS + regen, so I hide under the edge of the point to avoid this (I would clearly have lost my staff vs his bow). I wait for him to come into melee range.
Right away, his damage is very high. Many stacks of burns. I let my passive spectral shroud pop, blow my heal to cleanse the fire, and dodge when I can. As my healthbar is rocketing down, he is blocking. Still blocking. Still blocking.
He blocks while he damages through my entire healthbar, and then through my entire deathshroud. During the entire fight I land a couple dagger autos, a few tics of locust swarm, a couple reaper shroud autos, and maybe one or two tics of soul spiral. This is a very small amount of damage, and he doesn’t fall below 80%.
But meanwhile, with me dodging and cleansing when possible, my health is absolutely getting torched. I can hardly believe that something that seems to be perpetually invulnerable is doing this much damage.
About 15 seconds into the fight I’ve exhausted every CD and am dead. He stomps me with fear immunity (either block or stab, wasn’t sure which) with 90% HP. When I’m dead, he’s done a very large amount of both burning an direct damage.
I struggle to see what that player’s weakness was. Excellent ranged damage. Crushed me in melee range. Top notch survivability. Some of the best (possibly the best) damage I’ve seen in the game.
Oh, and he definitely stunned me and knocked me down several times. I have about 8s of reliable stability in reaper shroud, but other than that he could slap me around easily.
Open to suggestions, but that was an unusually one-sided fight and I felt I had few options.
he’s running burn when he’s blocking. so stop attacking his blocks.
if you’re running soldiers reaper like a sensible fellow you have about ~50k HP and a lot of armour. you are the beefiest boy around and should not be dying to 15sec. what’s you build homes, maybe you need to grab one off Nos and watch his stream more.
. Engi & Warr . Beta > 2017 Death of PvP
currently a Boyfriend main :P
Waiting To ReRoll Mystic & Forget About Tyria
currently a Boyfriend main :P
Waiting To ReRoll Mystic & Forget About Tyria
(edited by choovanski.5462)
I am open to the possibility that I don’t know how to counterplay the DH yet, and I win about 30% of my 1v1’s vs DH (as a reaper) so it’s not always a total bust. However, I fought an especially competent one the other day and here’s how it went…
On Legacy of the Foefire, I’m capping waterfall. He approaches. His ranged DPS + regen is vastly superior to my range DPS + regen, so I hide under the edge of the point to avoid this (I would clearly have lost my staff vs his bow). I wait for him to come into melee range.
Right away, his damage is very high. Many stacks of burns. I let my passive spectral shroud pop, blow my heal to cleanse the fire, and dodge when I can. As my healthbar is rocketing down, he is blocking. Still blocking. Still blocking.
He blocks while he damages through my entire healthbar, and then through my entire deathshroud. During the entire fight I land a couple dagger autos, a few tics of locust swarm, a couple reaper shroud autos, and maybe one or two tics of soul spiral. This is a very small amount of damage, and he doesn’t fall below 80%.
But meanwhile, with me dodging and cleansing when possible, my health is absolutely getting torched. I can hardly believe that something that seems to be perpetually invulnerable is doing this much damage.
About 15 seconds into the fight I’ve exhausted every CD and am dead. He stomps me with fear immunity (either block or stab, wasn’t sure which) with 90% HP. When I’m dead, he’s done a very large amount of both burning an direct damage.
I struggle to see what that player’s weakness was. Excellent ranged damage. Crushed me in melee range. Top notch survivability. Some of the best (possibly the best) damage I’ve seen in the game.
Oh, and he definitely stunned me and knocked me down several times. I have about 8s of reliable stability in reaper shroud, but other than that he could slap me around easily.
Open to suggestions, but that was an unusually one-sided fight and I felt I had few options.
he’s running burn when he’s blocking. so stop attacking his blocks.
Isn’t really possible anymore when he can get 11 stacks of Aegis every 36 seconds, still surprised I’ve only seen one DH run Shattered Aegis.
I am open to the possibility that I don’t know how to counterplay the DH yet, and I win about 30% of my 1v1’s vs DH (as a reaper) so it’s not always a total bust. However, I fought an especially competent one the other day and here’s how it went…
On Legacy of the Foefire, I’m capping waterfall. He approaches. His ranged DPS + regen is vastly superior to my range DPS + regen, so I hide under the edge of the point to avoid this (I would clearly have lost my staff vs his bow). I wait for him to come into melee range.
Right away, his damage is very high. Many stacks of burns. I let my passive spectral shroud pop, blow my heal to cleanse the fire, and dodge when I can. As my healthbar is rocketing down, he is blocking. Still blocking. Still blocking.
He blocks while he damages through my entire healthbar, and then through my entire deathshroud. During the entire fight I land a couple dagger autos, a few tics of locust swarm, a couple reaper shroud autos, and maybe one or two tics of soul spiral. This is a very small amount of damage, and he doesn’t fall below 80%.
But meanwhile, with me dodging and cleansing when possible, my health is absolutely getting torched. I can hardly believe that something that seems to be perpetually invulnerable is doing this much damage.
About 15 seconds into the fight I’ve exhausted every CD and am dead. He stomps me with fear immunity (either block or stab, wasn’t sure which) with 90% HP. When I’m dead, he’s done a very large amount of both burning an direct damage.
I struggle to see what that player’s weakness was. Excellent ranged damage. Crushed me in melee range. Top notch survivability. Some of the best (possibly the best) damage I’ve seen in the game.
Oh, and he definitely stunned me and knocked me down several times. I have about 8s of reliable stability in reaper shroud, but other than that he could slap me around easily.
Open to suggestions, but that was an unusually one-sided fight and I felt I had few options.
he’s running burn when he’s blocking. so stop attacking his blocks.
Isn’t really possible anymore when he can get 11 stacks of Aegis every 36 seconds, still surprised I’ve only seen one DH run Shattered Aegis.
aegis doesn’t stack, and he has to run round collecting them. the pretty hard when he’s thunderclaped. each aegis is one short duration burn on a build that will have no condi damage, it’s no big deal. attacking into shelter or RF will stack a lot more burns, its that you need to worry about not the aegis.
regardless, you should be losing vs dragon hunter because your build is so poor.
. Engi & Warr . Beta > 2017 Death of PvP
currently a Boyfriend main :P
Waiting To ReRoll Mystic & Forget About Tyria
currently a Boyfriend main :P
Waiting To ReRoll Mystic & Forget About Tyria
I am open to the possibility that I don’t know how to counterplay the DH yet, and I win about 30% of my 1v1’s vs DH (as a reaper) so it’s not always a total bust. However, I fought an especially competent one the other day and here’s how it went…
On Legacy of the Foefire, I’m capping waterfall. He approaches. His ranged DPS + regen is vastly superior to my range DPS + regen, so I hide under the edge of the point to avoid this (I would clearly have lost my staff vs his bow). I wait for him to come into melee range.
Right away, his damage is very high. Many stacks of burns. I let my passive spectral shroud pop, blow my heal to cleanse the fire, and dodge when I can. As my healthbar is rocketing down, he is blocking. Still blocking. Still blocking.
He blocks while he damages through my entire healthbar, and then through my entire deathshroud. During the entire fight I land a couple dagger autos, a few tics of locust swarm, a couple reaper shroud autos, and maybe one or two tics of soul spiral. This is a very small amount of damage, and he doesn’t fall below 80%.
But meanwhile, with me dodging and cleansing when possible, my health is absolutely getting torched. I can hardly believe that something that seems to be perpetually invulnerable is doing this much damage.
About 15 seconds into the fight I’ve exhausted every CD and am dead. He stomps me with fear immunity (either block or stab, wasn’t sure which) with 90% HP. When I’m dead, he’s done a very large amount of both burning an direct damage.
I struggle to see what that player’s weakness was. Excellent ranged damage. Crushed me in melee range. Top notch survivability. Some of the best (possibly the best) damage I’ve seen in the game.
Oh, and he definitely stunned me and knocked me down several times. I have about 8s of reliable stability in reaper shroud, but other than that he could slap me around easily.
Open to suggestions, but that was an unusually one-sided fight and I felt I had few options.
he’s running burn when he’s blocking. so stop attacking his blocks.
Isn’t really possible anymore when he can get 11 stacks of Aegis every 36 seconds, still surprised I’ve only seen one DH run Shattered Aegis.
aegis doesn’t stack, and he has to run round collecting them. the pretty hard when he’s thunderclaped. each aegis is one short duration burn on a build that will have no condi damage, it’s no big deal. attacking into shelter or RF will stack a lot more burns, its that you need to worry about not the aegis.
regardless, you should be losing vs dragon hunter because your build is so poor.
11-22 stacks of burning just from hitting him and why would he not have condition damage if he takes either burn on block or 600-1.2kx11 AoE physical per hit while he is hitting you with LB/GS is nothing to worry about. Thunderclap is 1.25 second stun and the fragments last 8 seconds, not mention that it stun breaksx2.
second dodge when you saw trap animation coming?…Its your fault. I can just quote that DH : “l2p or l2dodge”
second dodge when you saw trap animation coming?…Its your fault. I can just quote that DH : “l2p or l2dodge”
He would probably be inside the Maw at that point and his dodge would be interrupted if he wasn’t already being pulled.
second dodge when you saw trap animation coming?…Its your fault. I can just quote that DH : “l2p or l2dodge”
He would probably be inside the Maw at that point and his dodge would be interrupted if he wasn’t already being pulled.
Nah, he just got owned. DH is not to blame, he had 1 dodge left, could use it but he didn’t. Simple as that. No dodge = you die. Stop complaining and learn to play.
second dodge when you saw trap animation coming?…Its your fault. I can just quote that DH : “l2p or l2dodge”
He would probably be inside the Maw at that point and his dodge would be interrupted if he wasn’t already being pulled.
Nah, he just got owned. DH is not to blame, he had 1 dodge left, could use it but he didn’t. Simple as that. No dodge = you die. Stop complaining and learn to play.
Please learn your class, you can’t dodge while trapped inside a barrier because it gets interrupted. If he is already being pulled at the end of the dodge then he would have to stun break and then dodge with an inhuman reaction time but he still might be already hitting the barrier wall at that point since he dodged into the middle of the Maw.
He hit you with three traps + his own LB DPS. If, for any reason, you managed to get out of the trap burst or have an ally there, he would’ve melted just as quickly as you did. DPS guardian builds (burn or power) always frontloaded their entire burst always. I’ll agree that burn/medi power isn’t the same as the traps that you can’t see, but the mindset is similar. I’d honestly consider traps to be UP if using 3 didn’t create a dangerous situation for the trapped guy.
Also, I notice you weren’t running elixir S. That gyro skill makes very little sense in comparison to elixir S imo.
@Trevor
Over 500 hours playing medi guard. GS5 is a terrible skill vs competent players and only works in WvWvW where everything is a mess anyways.
SW/F is hardly worse. The bow and traps provide all the aoe you could ever want. SW2 is far more effective than GS3 since teleports actually bypass alot of things without a problem (test of faith, dragon’s maw, wells, walls, etc). SW3 is ranged and destroys projectiles. Focus provides 2 blinds + 3 blocks. That’s essentially 5 attacks blocked with one weapon. SW auto chain also always procs justice (doesn’t mean much on a power build, but still). Never mention symbols with a serious face, please. GS+Traps = nuclear bursting on golems/afk player. It doesn’t matter how many attacks are unblockable since, like all of the reveal theives are crying about, taking too many of them isn’t viable.
DH IS about control and I’ll definintely agree with you on that point, but your build is terrible and can’t accomplish much of that vs a compentent player. My build, for instance, packs 10.5s of immobilize, 2 knockdowns, 2 knock backs, 2 pulls and the LB ward ALL at 1200 range. THAT is control with very little counter play (impossible to lose 1v1 with this). Your build is based on a situational heal, 1 super telegraphed pull and an offhand that can only burst reliably every 60s. Most of your time will be spent on LB, but true shot is so easy to punish that it isn’t funny.
Metabattle is a site that takes competitive builds off of competitive players. Competitive players won’t run such an immobile build. BUNKERS don’t even sit on point all day, so how could you justify a DPSer chilling in place waiting for targets? JI is the BASELINE utility on practically every non-bunker guardian build. Its been this way since launch. Lets not argue on this, please.
Guardian is guardian. Guardian is designed to take hits and mitigate the damage. Playing guardian like ranger is like forcibly ramming the square into the circle slot. You can enjoy superior range AND facetank damage if need be. Why just fall back on the range only? If you’re hellbent on GS, JI must naturally occupy a slot on your bar in place of smite. Do your range pew pew and then, when the moment is right, teleport in and do even more damage.
Peel =/= mobility. You can peel well, but then what? Person leaps in and then back out of your traps and will probably have enough mobility left to catch up and melt you now that you’ve sacrificed a majority of your defense and are now helpless.
Hold on, let me edit your scenario of your DH vs my DH:
We bow. I CC you once, your trait stunbreaks you. I CC you again, you stunbreak with CoP. I CC you AGAIN and now you’re out of stunbreaks and blocks. You then die an easy death. If, for whatever reason, you manage to virtue block, my focus + shelter will be enough to outlast it with a block or two to spare while I STILL have my virtue block to keep me ahead, my own CoP and passive trait still haven’t been burned for the stunbreak. I have more HP, more damage, enough immob to keep you in place even AFTER you cleanse my own maw to punish your GS usage, stronger symbols (not that this matters much), higher run speed even while in combat and a minion to trigger your traps. I brought up P/P thief earlier to show you what a non-DH could do to your DH. A properly built DH will completely annihilate you.
I have much higher access to fury, mind you. 8s of fury every 10s to be exact. If we’re both dueling, shelter beats purification everytime since most of our fighting will be ranged. SW dps is far greater than GS since, again, simply walking out of the symbol is GG (also, I don’t use SW on this either :P).
By the way, I never once said I used JI on my DH. I just said JI and GS go together like peanut butter and jam. Maybe if you play DH like its a guardian subclass and not a super ranger, you’ll find out what really makes it OP instead of making this……..abomination.
DD =/= D/D. Daredevil not, dagger/dagger.
Thieves get hardcountered by a proper guard build. DD will ride your terrible build 24/7.
(edited by SlayerSixx.5763)
He hit you with three traps + his own LB DPS. If, for any reason, you managed to get out of the trap burst or have an ally there, he would’ve melted just as quickly as you did. DPS guardian builds (burn or power) always frontloaded their entire burst always. I’ll agree that burn/medi power isn’t the same as the traps that you can’t see, but the mindset is similar. I’d honestly consider traps to be UP if using 3 didn’t create a dangerous situation for the trapped guy.
Also, I notice you weren’t running elixir S. That gyro skill makes very little sense in comparison to elixir S imo.
Uhh no watch the video again and see it was only the traps that killed him, only damage the DH did himself was hit him with the unblockable F1 chain which killed his low health through Gear Shield. Also GS 5 is amazing, it forces them to use a dodge or be pulled, combined with F1 pull they just lost both dodges.
Just lost both dodges and he just lost both pulls. Now, assuming LB/GS, he has LB5 and maw. Assuming you aren’t built as badly as the engi in that video, you should have another 1-2+ defenses/ mobility skills of your own. LB5 is a nonfactor in 1v1s, so he realistically has maw. If the engi had JUST elixir S, that fight would’ve been insta GG for him.
Just lost both dodges and he just lost both pulls. Now, assuming LB/GS, he has LB5 and maw. Assuming you aren’t built as badly as the engi in that video, you should have another 1-2+ defenses/ mobility skills of your own. LB5 is a nonfactor in 1v1s, so he realistically has maw. If the engi had JUST elixir S, that fight would’ve been insta GG for him.
If he has S he would have 25% health left either way so not “GG”, you can see the DH placing more while he is being hit. DH has 2 unblockable skills left after the pull spam so blocks don’t work, only other thing you got is invulnerability, stability or teleports against Maw that is going to hit if he walks up to you and places it or LB5 still can hit at the cost of a unblockable if he gets in 360 range and hits with any skill into a LB5 cause you aren’t walking out of it and you aren’t CCing him since he has stability. LB5 if he uses invulnerability through Maw.
Did the DH in that vid set those traps up behind the Engi, anticipating a dodge roll back into them? If so, that’s a good read. Sure, the damage might be too high, but isn’t that also all of that DH’s utilities?
Just seems like a burst cheese build. Those usually blow up in fads, then dissipate when people get bored. They probably do a bit too much damage at the moment, though.
Alduin Nightsong, 80 Human Necro
“He’s like a man with a fork in a world of soup.”
“He’s like a man with a fork in a world of soup.”
If he’s nearly dead after the invuln, toss S for stealth and disengage. He has a revenant, a mesmer and a ranger on his team. Any of those 3 could’ve dealt with the DH in a timely fashion (especially the mesmer). If the mesmer isn’t an idiot and our friend here kept filming, you would’ve gotten to watch the DH die miserably.
If he’s nearly dead after the invuln, toss S for stealth and disengage. He has a revenant, a mesmer and a ranger on his team. Any of those 3 could’ve dealt with the DH in a timely fashion (especially the mesmer). If the mesmer isn’t an idiot and our friend here kept filming, you would’ve gotten to watch the DH die miserably.
Yes watch him die to 4 vs 1.
Did the DH in that vid set those traps up behind the Engi, anticipating a dodge roll back into them? If so, that’s a good read. Sure, the damage might be too high, but isn’t that also all of that DH’s utilities?
Just seems like a burst cheese build. Those usually blow up in fads, then dissipate when people get bored. They probably do a bit too much damage at the moment, though.
DH probably just placed them to kill anyone coming the point since they last 5 minutes and have a low cooldown.
Just lost both dodges and he just lost both pulls. Now, assuming LB/GS, he has LB5 and maw. Assuming you aren’t built as badly as the engi in that video, you should have another 1-2+ defenses/ mobility skills of your own. LB5 is a nonfactor in 1v1s, so he realistically has maw. If the engi had JUST elixir S, that fight would’ve been insta GG for him.
If he had prelaid his traps, then he would have a full set of new traps to relay if the engi survived (not counting dragon’s maw). And a | true shot > JI + Heavy Light > GS or relay traps | after the elixir S ended would be very hard to counter. Especially if the engi is out of dodges and the DH has daze on traps.
(edited by Indure.5410)
Just lost both dodges and he just lost both pulls. Now, assuming LB/GS, he has LB5 and maw. Assuming you aren’t built as badly as the engi in that video, you should have another 1-2+ defenses/ mobility skills of your own. LB5 is a nonfactor in 1v1s, so he realistically has maw. If the engi had JUST elixir S, that fight would’ve been insta GG for him.
If he had prelaid his traps, then he would have a full set of new traps to relay if the engi survived (not counting dragon’s maw). And a | true shot + JI + Heavy Light + GS or relay traps | after the elixir S ended would be very hard to counter. Especially if the engi is out of dodges and the DH has daze on traps.
That sounds like questionable design. I’d think the traps should start their cooldown upon being activated. You can always make a secondary ability of the trap activate it manually if you need to trigger your cooldown.
You could also force manual activation of traps with a slight cast time, even just a half-second, so they don’t all pop at once like that.
Alduin Nightsong, 80 Human Necro
“He’s like a man with a fork in a world of soup.”
“He’s like a man with a fork in a world of soup.”
He hit you with three traps + his own LB DPS. If, for any reason, you managed to get out of the trap burst or have an ally there, he would’ve melted just as quickly as you did. DPS guardian builds (burn or power) always frontloaded their entire burst always. I’ll agree that burn/medi power isn’t the same as the traps that you can’t see, but the mindset is similar. I’d honestly consider traps to be UP if using 3 didn’t create a dangerous situation for the trapped guy.
Also, I notice you weren’t running elixir S. That gyro skill makes very little sense in comparison to elixir S imo.
Uhh no watch the video again and see it was only the traps that killed him, only damage the DH did himself was hit him with the unblockable F1 chain which killed his low health through Gear Shield. Also GS 5 is amazing, it forces them to use a dodge or be pulled, combined with F1 pull they just lost both dodges.
think u need to watch again, the dh there clearly bends down to charge up tru shot, if it crit that could’ve knocked out most of that health
@Cogbyrn: It may be questionable design but that is how it is currently is.
He hit you with three traps + his own LB DPS. If, for any reason, you managed to get out of the trap burst or have an ally there, he would’ve melted just as quickly as you did. DPS guardian builds (burn or power) always frontloaded their entire burst always. I’ll agree that burn/medi power isn’t the same as the traps that you can’t see, but the mindset is similar. I’d honestly consider traps to be UP if using 3 didn’t create a dangerous situation for the trapped guy.
Also, I notice you weren’t running elixir S. That gyro skill makes very little sense in comparison to elixir S imo.
Uhh no watch the video again and see it was only the traps that killed him, only damage the DH did himself was hit him with the unblockable F1 chain which killed his low health through Gear Shield. Also GS 5 is amazing, it forces them to use a dodge or be pulled, combined with F1 pull they just lost both dodges.
think u need to watch again, the dh there clearly bends down to charge up tru shot, if it crit that could’ve knocked out most of that health
Yes I assumed he dodged it but he probably did hit it, still if the DH just pulled him out of the block with the F1 he would have died to Test of Faith anyways.
@Cogbyrn: It may be questionable design but that is how it is currently is.
Haha, I believe you. I just think that’s probably a bigger issue than the raw damage number. At least in my opinion.
Alduin Nightsong, 80 Human Necro
“He’s like a man with a fork in a world of soup.”
“He’s like a man with a fork in a world of soup.”
If he’s nearly dead after the invuln, toss S for stealth and disengage. He has a revenant, a mesmer and a ranger on his team. Any of those 3 could’ve dealt with the DH in a timely fashion (especially the mesmer). If the mesmer isn’t an idiot and our friend here kept filming, you would’ve gotten to watch the DH die miserably.
Yes watch him die to 4 vs 1.
ANY of them. Read carefully, friend.
I also agree that having the traps already start ticking away at their CDs the moment they’re placed is weird. There are many utilities that’d work amazingly well if their CD started ticking the moment they were used. Perhaps this is the nerf that could finally fix DH without breaking them.
Guardians specialize in protective and defensive magic.
Straight out of the wiki.
Non idiot shatter mesmer would loose to non idiot DH unless moa’ed last in most cases (in conquest setting). Imho.
Guardians specialize in protective and defensive magic.
Straight out of the wiki.
I think that line was what they used on the initial description of the class 4 years ago on the website. At the time, that’s what Guardians were.
In 3 – 4 years, the class has developed as the game has developed, both mechanically and in the lore.
People will dig up literally anything from any amount of time ago to try to prove a point.
Alduin Nightsong, 80 Human Necro
“He’s like a man with a fork in a world of soup.”
“He’s like a man with a fork in a world of soup.”
Non idiot shatter mesmer would loose to non idiot DH unless moa’ed last in most cases (in conquest setting). Imho.
Send in iZerker > trigger traps > ….. > profit
Send in iZerker > trigger traps > he lays down second set of traps > iZerker triggers them again if it isn’t killed, in which case, send another clone/illusion/phantasm > ….. profit
While you’re waiting for the traps to get triggered, you either outstealth his blocks or simply outblock/well evade with chrono.
Non idiot shatter mesmer would loose to non idiot DH unless moa’ed last in most cases (in conquest setting). Imho.
Send in iZerker > trigger traps > ….. > profit
Send in iZerker > trigger traps > he lays down second set of traps > iZerker triggers them again if it isn’t killed, in which case, send another clone/illusion/phantasm > ….. profit
While you’re waiting for the traps to get triggered, you either outstealth his blocks or simply outblock/well evade with chrono.
That only works if he is standing on preplaced traps.
iZerker sweeps. Assuming we’re talking about every point that isn’t foefire mid, it would usually cut a clean swathe across the point, essentially telling you its safe for you to advance. If his traps are off point and he runs away to pull you into them, the moment you’re pulled in, you can either distort, blink, or well evade assuming you’re trapped by maw and can’t simply dodge roll out of them. If the clones don’t automatically trigger the traps by following him for the shatter, he’ll continuously eat some of the highest burst in the game while trying to hit his ridiculously telegraphed true shots vs a class that can now easily match his levels of damage mitigation (if not more, what with the double block on shield, evade on sword and well, etc). If you’re still trying to test the point for traps, mirror blade spawns clones even on evade which will let you spawn even more fodder for the trap clearing.
These are all solutions and I have <10 hours on mesmer. All of these counters to damage with no cost to burst and I don’t see people saying anything about chrono (not calling it OP, mind you). People want to cry about the loudest, most noticeable stuff.
iZerker sweeps. Assuming we’re talking about every point that isn’t foefire mid, it would usually cut a clean swathe across the point, essentially telling you its safe for you to advance. If his traps are off point and he runs away to pull you into them, the moment you’re pulled in, you can either distort, blink, or well evade assuming you’re trapped by maw and can’t simply dodge roll out of them. If the clones don’t automatically trigger the traps by following him for the shatter, he’ll continuously eat some of the highest burst in the game while trying to hit his ridiculously telegraphed true shots vs a class that can now easily match his levels of damage mitigation (if not more, what with the double block on shield, evade on sword and well, etc). If you’re still trying to test the point for traps, mirror blade spawns clones even on evade which will let you spawn even more fodder for the trap clearing.
These are all solutions and I have <10 hours on mesmer. All of these counters to damage with no cost to burst and I don’t see people saying anything about chrono (not calling it OP, mind you). People want to cry about the loudest, most noticeable stuff.
But this is again only if there are preplaced traps and you know where they are. Most DH won’t preplace them and they activate instantly if they place them near you and you weren’t even moving.
They aren’t pre-placed meaning that you’re free to engage him. Once you see them go down, doesn’t change the fact that mesmer has a 101 ways to escape something static.
I haven’t seen a single self respecting mesmer die to traps.