Guild Wars 2

Yes playing with friends is nice, but the ability to duo Q renders leaderboards meaningless. It represents the skill of 2 players, not 1.

Secondly it skews high end matchmaking. It’s already bad to get a top 25 player on the enemy, but when you get one, there is ALWAYS a second one on that team. Of course we like a challenge but this isn’t correctly reflected in pip gains/losses.

Agreed. And if Anet wont fix matchmaking system, duoQs can manipulate matches because of average mmr of 2 players.

Getting those legendary duos to be matched against gold players isnt educational, fun or rewarding.

I have duoQed too with my friends a lot, but I don’t think it’s a good idea for accurate ratings. Highly skilled friend could easily carry me and I could carry lower rating friends, so their or mine rating wouldnt be accurate.

So, please Anet, let’s try next season PURE SOLOQ, and if it doesn’t work, you can come back to duoQ or even teamQ.

Duo queue needs to stay. Having someone to play with and talk to between games just makes the experience so much more fun for me. Duo q this season has allowed me to make a lot of new friends in legendary division such as the guys from bowscoped/PaX who I never really played with before this season.

Yes, it does harm quality of games slightly, I accept that. But just because of the improvement to my enjoyment of pvp, duo q should be left as it is. Being sure of having one good person on your team helps your win rate too, but the main thing is that duo encourages new people to queue together and even make teams to compete with. If it was pure solo, there would be none of this.

If it were put to a poll duo would lose big. Everyone but the people that need it see it as an unfair advantage, which is why the guys that want it need it.

It should only be solo q or full party q, because anything inbetween just gets abused and ruins the season for everyone.

Sooloo.1364:

If it were put to a poll duo would lose big. Everyone but the people that need it see it as an unfair advantage, which is why the guys that want it need it.

I doubt it would lose big or maybe even lose at all. Removing duo queue will be a direct step backwards to bringing back team queue.

Think of how much harder it would be to form 5s from a bunch of solo players rather than starting from a base of two people, finding another two people and a single solo?

All Duo Queue needs is a disadvantage, such as inflated skill rating to push them against harder teams. They also need to ensure more duo queues are facing each other rather than those rare 2-2-1 Vs. 1-1-1-1-1.

DuoQ accounts for 60% of the fun I have playing PvP, since I can discuss and coordinate with a friend while playing. Forcing me to go solo on ranked? Wouldn’t even bother playing, game’s way too frustrating to be enjoyed anymore, with all the powercreep and the immature/toxic players lurking around.

Duo q needs to be gone only for legendary players. Like its a must! 2 top esports players queue together just breaks matchmaking and ruins for other solo legendary players. Specially when game tries to equalize teams with 1600 rating ppl.

Solo que or nothing. But I say bring old system back – this duo que hurts the community more than you can imagine.

Duo should stay – simply because there wouldn’t be sense to play ranked on some classes like rev ,ele or necro.

Edit: if there was at least one good 1v1 build on each class that can carry on it’s own then soloq only might be a good thing. But it’s impossible right now in this meta.

I’d like to see it go away, truly, just to see what you people would complain about when you can’t blame the loss on the duo queue, maybe then you’d focus on what’s actually wrong with the game, although i doubt it.

I say we keep the system as it is now with tweaks of course for next season but we create another queue for teams of 5 only…But whatever happens team queues will always be longer than duo/solo however

Duo queue needs to be removed

ReaverKane.7598:

I’d like to see it go away, truly, just to see what you people would complain about when you can’t blame the loss on the duo queue, maybe then you’d focus on what’s actually wrong with the game, although i doubt it.

they would blame it on class stacking, afkers, and pvers.

Disagree pretty strongly. Duo is there for a reason. Solo queue only would penalize classes that depend on friendlies to work.

Sooloo.1364:

If it were put to a poll duo would lose big. Everyone but the people that need it see it as an unfair advantage, which is why the guys that want it need it.

Pretty sure that they are putting it to a poll.

Elegie.3620:

DuoQ accounts for 60% of the fun I have playing PvP, since I can discuss and coordinate with a friend while playing. Forcing me to go solo on ranked? Wouldn’t even bother playing, game’s way too frustrating to be enjoyed anymore, with all the powercreep and the immature/toxic players lurking around.

I’m in the same boat.

Playing solo in pvp somehow causes too much stress for me. I’d never set a foot in pvp again without DuoQ.

At least in lower divisions I don’t really see a huge impact of duos. We’ve won as much as we lost against 2 duos. We also have lost matches with 1-2 duos on our side and 5 solo players on the other team.

Rhiannon.1726:

Playing solo in pvp somehow causes too much stress for me. I’d never set a foot in pvp again without DuoQ.

At least in lower divisions I don’t really see a huge impact of duos. We’ve won as much as we lost against 2 duos. We also have lost matches with 1-2 duos on our side and 5 solo players on the other team.

It works both ways though. When I don’t have any friends online, I don’t want to set foot in pvp because I know I’d perform much better with a friend. Why risk my rating?

I agree that the team with more duos isnt much stronger. However anet moved team Q and acknowledged it’s strength, by the same logic duo Q is also an advantage just not as much. And it contradicts the leaderboard, MMR is personal while match experience is shared with someone, always.

Another thing is that it is quite easy to abuse this system. Imagine 2 players with 1800 MMR. one of them hops on a smurf account that has 1000 MMR and duos up with his friends main. The algorithm takes the average so they count as 2 1400 MMR players. The guy on 1800 account gets an easier climb to legendary.

Being saying that since the beginning. There’s no place for duoQ on an INDIVIDUAL leaderboards system. And besides that, two players coordinating together against a team of full solo queuers have a HUGE advantage, no matter if its on legendary or bronze tier.

If ANet keeps duoQ, they should make it that DuoQ get less points from a victory against a team of solo queuers and lose more when defeated by a team of soloers.

It also makes win trading easier, the current leaderboards are all skewed from people win trading & throwing matches on alts for others mains, changing it to solo queue onlly makes more sense and will also make cheating harder.

I’d prefer they have a team queue and a separate solo queue. This is supposed to be a team game, so it would be stupid not to be able to play with friends.

Remember that time there were 2 options, one for solo q and one for team queue, with a separate leader board for each?

That was pretty cool….

One braindead fix that would improve things easily is to make it so that if there is a duo queue or two duo queues on one team, the other team has the same composition.

I don’t get how having a duo queue or multiple duo queues against a full solo team is ever considered a reasonable match-up. Why this isn’t already implemented astounds me; there is no way the current matchmaking algorithm can properly account for this as communication isn’t a measurable metric.

I would have no sympathy if people start crying about matchmaking times, if you want to duo queue you have to wait for another duo queue to play against.

MMORPG, can’t even play with 1 friend. kitten that.

Duo Queue must stay.

90% of players are soloq , they need to remove duoq. Cuz duoq Just make soloqs ragequit, everyone wanna play on ur own time, stop que witout explain why… Or make atleast a duoq take another duoq versus atleast BUT DO SOMETHING ABOUT THIS DUOQS THIS IS TOTAL UNBALANCED

Anyone who claims statistics about how many solo Q or duo Q doesn’t actually have those numbers and cannot back up the claims.

Please refrain from making such statements without something to back it up, it makes you look bad. Thanks!

I don’t see how it can’t be compromised to not being possible to queue with people outside a certain range.

I highly doubt that people will feel the game will be more balanced or fair just because the teams coming in are only consistent of random players. It will just mean people will have less to blame imbalance on. Next is core only players/ HoT only players and players who have both or just the next expansion or whatnot. And then obviously the MMR system again.

More restrictions can apply in TOP levels or something, but I don’t see how GW2 PvP will benefit from more and more restrictions.

Duo Q kills most of the games above 1800 MMR…or at least alot of them. As most games will have 1 team with 2 top 25 players. Whilst the other team is all 1800 solo players.

The result = everyone stops queuing and quits because losing 500-100 is not fun, in particular when a fair game could have easily been made with 1 top 25 person on EACH team IF duo queue didnt exist.

If duo queue isn’t removed then at least do Helseth’s suggestion and make it so that legend players cannot duo queue.

Duo Q should not be allowed. The advantage provided is just too great.

Especially when it’s two individuals playing classes that greatly synergize.

Duo Que should stay for fun, but there should be calculations in mmr that punish it a little for the combined ‘bonus’ mmr.

Phoebe Ascension.8437:

Duo Que should stay for fun, but there should be calculations in mmr that punish it a little for the combined ‘bonus’ mmr.

It wouldn’t matter at all. Even if you tried to give these duo queues harder matches it would never happen.

Here is the reality:

1, Very few people with high MMRs EVER solo queue.
2, As a result there are fewer high MMR people at all times so matches are worse
3, These duo queues get put into games with them 2 (mmr 2100 each) and 8 solo players with 1800. It is impossible to make a fair match out of these 10 players

Just like every thread since HOT.

Anet needs to balance out the classes effectively, (give/take build set ups)

They need to work on class diversity and finally for the 5th straight season. They need to work on match making.

We cant blame 5 man premades and demand a solo/duo que. Only to get solo/duo que and then blame duo que players when once again. ITS ANET MATCH MAKING THATS FAILING.

Quit blaming small things on why you didnt get to where you wanted or why things are unfair. Simply put Anet has had some of the worst match making since HOT came out.

Lets quit dancing around the issue.

completely gutting team play in a team play environment is not the way to go. yes duo can ruin matches, but its not always the case.

btw could you q for teamq back in the day and jump in hj? if not then that seems like a good thing to implement if we ever see a return of teamq. also disable hj spectator team switching.

Solo needs to stay, while i felt that most matches i lost where due to class imbalance and stacking i did not feel unfair team coordination was an issue this season.

If anything it should be solo/duo queue or 5 man teams queue.

Lordrosicky.5813:

Here is the reality:

1, Very few people with high MMRs EVER solo queue.

Let’s go with this being true for now.

Lordrosicky.5813:

2, As a result there are fewer high MMR people at all times so matches are worse

How does this make sense? Explain how you went from the majority of high MMR being duo queue, to making fewer high MMR people? I assume you must mean that there were fewer high MMR Solo Queuers, this is probably what you meant. Even if this were the case, duo queuers would still be queuing at high MMR…

Lordrosicky.5813:

3, These duo queues get put into games with them 2 (mmr 2100 each) and 8 solo players with 1800. It is impossible to make a fair match out of these 10 players

Or 4 sets of high MMR with a single low solo on both sides, doesn’t matter.

You know what the real issue is? SPvP population is extremely low, we are seeing bad matchmaking all around regardless of the solo and duo queue scenario because the pool is so low. The matchmaking wouldn’t have so many issues if it could pull more solo queuers at high MMR at all times, but since there are so few players it has to pick from Plats or even Golds (NA wise).

Which is why it’s smarter to give an artificial disadvantage like making the duo queuers earn less rating and lose more rating, face them against harder opponents without better gains, etc. Killing off Duo queue will make the matchmaking even WORSE thanks to the population issues.

Increasing the population across the board and developing SPvP player talents so that there is a naturally higher pool of good players at high MMR will most of the issues we see now. Converting some of the PvE players, of which there is an unimaginable amount by comparision to SPvP or WvW, helps. Creating a competitive environment for ESports-Twitch players in different games to try out GW2 can serve to improve our situation now.

kdaddy.5431:

Just like every thread since HOT.

Anet needs to balance out the classes effectively, (give/take build set ups)

They need to work on class diversity and finally for the 5th straight season. They need to work on match making.

We cant blame 5 man premades and demand a solo/duo que. Only to get solo/duo que and then blame duo que players when once again. ITS ANET MATCH MAKING THATS FAILING.

Quit blaming small things on why you didnt get to where you wanted or why things are unfair. Simply put Anet has had some of the worst match making since HOT came out.

Lets quit dancing around the issue.

no, the majority of player base demanded soloq whithout team q any sort of team(2,3,4,5), anet was the one who put duo in the equation. and people toke it as a lesser evil, and this season demostrates its not lesser
messing whith the matchmaking was only because a vocal minority said in S1 they had to carry a lot. S1 had a lot of problems(smurfed acounts draging an entire team to compete with lower ranks, unclear pip reward sistem where you can gain pips in a lost and lost pips in a win…) but not matchmaking problems so big for the mess they do in the others seasons

kdaddy.5431:

Just like every thread since HOT.

Anet needs to balance out the classes effectively, (give/take build set ups)

They need to work on class diversity and finally for the 5th straight season. They need to work on match making.

We cant blame 5 man premades and demand a solo/duo que. Only to get solo/duo que and then blame duo que players when once again. ITS ANET MATCH MAKING THATS FAILING.

Quit blaming small things on why you didnt get to where you wanted or why things are unfair. Simply put Anet has had some of the worst match making since HOT came out.

Lets quit dancing around the issue.

Don’t agree with some things KDaddy says, but he’s right. Duo Queue is not responsible for giving you the illusion you will do better in a Leaderboard without it.

All the Legends will still be Legends if it were removed, what’s going to happen instead is that there will be less legends because there will be LESS PLAYERS who quit GW2 SPvP because they couldn’t play competitive with a friend. When there’s less players overall, we are going to see higher ranges for 10 people to set up a game with, and longer queues. I hope you are ready for those 5 minute queue times in mid-gold, and getting matched up with a mix of 5 silvers, 3 plats and a Legend.

We’ve not even discussed how matchmaking continues to create profession stacked comps or even bad comps, that ties a bit into profession balance but overall I disagree with the notion that one team should be given something like Triple Thieves, Two Engineers while the other team was RNGed into a ESL comp, even if the Ratings are averaged to be even.

The SPvP community would be shooting itself in the foot if it got rid of Duo Queue. And the devs know it too, Duo queue is necessary which is why the poll they made did not make a third option for Solo only.

only a problem at the high end where matchmaking cant reasonably account for the extra strength gained from duoing.

the people whining that it needs to go are the people who are overinvested in watching their rating, to the point that theyll rage at anything within reach about mistakes and losses.

megilandil.7506:

kdaddy.5431:

Just like every thread since HOT.

Anet needs to balance out the classes effectively, (give/take build set ups)

They need to work on class diversity and finally for the 5th straight season. They need to work on match making.

We cant blame 5 man premades and demand a solo/duo que. Only to get solo/duo que and then blame duo que players when once again. ITS ANET MATCH MAKING THATS FAILING.

Quit blaming small things on why you didnt get to where you wanted or why things are unfair. Simply put Anet has had some of the worst match making since HOT came out.

Lets quit dancing around the issue.

no, the majority of player base demanded soloq whithout team q any sort of team(2,3,4,5), anet was the one who put duo in the equation. and people toke it as a lesser evil, and this season demostrates its not lesser
messing whith the matchmaking was only because a vocal minority said in S1 they had to carry a lot. S1 had a lot of problems(smurfed acounts draging an entire team to compete with lower ranks, unclear pip reward sistem where you can gain pips in a lost and lost pips in a win…) but not matchmaking problems so big for the mess they do in the others seasons

Someone could of made it a thread of “solo que only” and had the community jumped behind it Anet would of gave in.

Just like the leader board issue, Anet is actually watching the threads of the forums and check the comments.

But no one did that, alot of the solo que heros thought this was a great thing. Not realizing this isnt the real issue.

Also all 5 seasons have had issues. S5 had a bugged that occurred when a declined match happened. As well as the class stacking issues. I still dont get why 3 thieves will be on 1 side then 3 Dh on the other. Or like last night for me, i have 2 DH on my team and they get hard countered by the 2 engys and ranger on the other.

Anet has almost created a rock paper scissor system and they have not implemented there MMR rating based on class into the system as well as many other factors.

Also just to add Season 2 you were teamed up with people of same MMR. I walked S2 in legendary starting the season at like kitten . I commented then about it being a bad thing and here we are S5 with many many top level players with 80% win rates. Not a good thing.

S3 had big issues as well regarding the PiP system and match making just like S1-4.

I will not blame duo que when match making makes ranked games like this.

Just so we all know my team won that game because we had a better comp. And i lost 2 games because 1 player didnt belong in a game and in another game the other team had a far better comp.

None of this is a Duo que issue

Edit- When you create hard counters and when you get to a certain level of play. These counters are so effective. If you have 8-9 plat players who are on the leader board or fighting to get on and you have 1 player in gold 1-2/silver/bronze they will get out matched and the other team will notice it.

If everyone is of equal skill but you put X class on 1 team and put 2-3 of them over there and the other team has X class which is the counter and they have 2-3 of them. You get games like the ones i under lined. Thats all Anet and the Match Making.

How does duo queue give you an advantage apart from using teamspeak? I duo with friends because I know they are reliable allies in a fight

FrownyClown.8402:

How does duo queue give you an advantage apart from using teamspeak? I duo with friends because I know they are reliable allies in a fight

This is literally the advantage. In a broad sense, the duo queuers are in agreement with each other that they are playing with an equally capable player. You reduce the system giving you an unknown player of relative weaker/stronger skill than you.

Teamspeak is a non-factor, what matters most is that you and your duo-mate are securing a spot for each other where you can say “Alright I know I will have an excellent Ele/Warrior/DH/Whatever, I can play around that” before you even get into the match. That’s the sole and most important advantage Duo has over Solo.

So if you are guaranteeing that there is another player of your skill level in your team, then you can imagine how this season Duo queues were securing so many wins by comparison (ALTHOUGH I do have to mention the rating ‘abuses’ as well). The simplest fix to this issue is to ensure Duo Queues face other Duo queues, and to make them artificially face harder opponents who at high MMR naturally behave like actual teams would. All without giving the Duo Queues more rating for those wins.

Sykper.6583:

FrownyClown.8402:

How does duo queue give you an advantage apart from using teamspeak? I duo with friends because I know they are reliable allies in a fight

This is literally the advantage. In a broad sense, the duo queuers are in agreement with each other that they are playing with an equally capable player. You reduce the system giving you an unknown player of relative weaker/stronger skill than you.

Teamspeak is a non-factor, what matters most is that you and your duo-mate are securing a spot for each other where you can say “Alright I know I will have an excellent Ele/Warrior/DH/Whatever, I can play around that” before you even get into the match. That’s the sole and most important advantage Duo has over Solo.

So if you are guaranteeing that there is another player of your skill level in your team, then you can imagine how this season Duo queues were securing so many wins by comparison (ALTHOUGH I do have to mention the rating ‘abuses’ as well). The simplest fix to this issue is to ensure Duo Queues face other Duo queues, and to make them artificially face harder opponents who at high MMR naturally behave like actual teams would. All without giving the Duo Queues more rating for those wins.

this will be a solution of compromise but….
the season in that hapenn the forum will be full of threaths flaming about the kittenty duos of unskilled players that ruins your games.
if they want leagues of individual ranking they have to be only soloq or throw entirely the idea of ranking

Absolutely concur it has to go. People are smurfing with supremely-high rated players who are using other accounts to massively boost up their buds. Had TWO games in a row during placements where this occurred, with them openly admitting it.

SoloQ only and a separate 5 Q mode.

Reasons to remove duoq:

Prevents match manipulation.
Makes matches fairer.
People should be earning their position on the ladder.
Most people solo.
Nobody ever asked for a duoq, after the poll to get rid of teamq anet slipped this in.

Reasons to keep duoq:

I like playing with my friend.

Pretty much that.

I’m wondering how people actually practice for a tournament or just to get better as a team if there isn’t any team supported feature. isnt this supposed to be a game based around coordinated teams? what would a solo q only landscape look like?

Stand The Wall.6987:

I’m wondering how people actually practice for a tournament or just to get better as a team if there isn’t any team supported feature. isnt this supposed to be a game based around coordinated teams? what would a solo q only landscape look like?

a lot of the teams, in EU at least scrim in private arenas (5v5) & practice duels.

Sooloo.1364:

Reasons to remove duoq:

Prevents match manipulation.

You think people won’t continue to manipulate with just Solo Q?

That’s just cute.

Sooloo.1364:

Makes matches fairer.

Yes, because when we have less players for a time, coupled with the still broken profession balanced compositions so that one team inevitably gets badly stacked, we will be fairer.

Sooloo.1364:

People should be earning their position on the ladder.

Pretty sure they do now, unless you are implying those in Legend aren’t there because of personal skill? Seems like a lot of folks are a bit delusional.

Sooloo.1364:

Most people solo.

You do not know this at all.

Sooloo.1364:

Nobody ever asked for a duoq, after the poll to get rid of teamq anet slipped this in.

Pretty sure nobody asked otherwise either.

Sooloo.1364:

Reasons to keep duoq:

I like playing with my friend.
Easier to transition into Team Q when it come back.
Promotes social-competitive scene whereas Solo Q is more singular.

Adding some reasons for Duo Queue. Obvious reasons are obvious.

You just have to ask yourself this one question:

How many of the top 250 did it only by solo q, and of those how many are top 25, 50, or 100?

It’s a tell tale sign when pro players HAVE to duo q to even maintain a high MMR.

Azukas.1426:

You just have to ask yourself this one question:

How many of the top 250 did it only by solo q, and of those how many are top 25, 50, or 100?

It’s a tell tale sign when pro players HAVE to duo q to even maintain a high MMR.

you just have to ask yourself how much lower these. people would be without duoing and how much higher the solos would be with it, and maybe a few ranks might shuffle a bit but by and large the top 250 isn’t going to change a whole lot and it’s unfair to arbitrarly strip people of the effort they put into being a stronger team player in a team based game mode.