Guild Wars 2

destroys all minions.

Why does a skill put my heal, all my utilities and my elite on cool down.

its a risk you took when you decided to play such an awful build

Because Moa is a bird, not Minionmancer.

Why does a skill with a nearly 2 minute cooldown that’s only available to two classes in the game counter your build? Is this what the forums are resorting to now?

because it is working as intended.

nothing wrong there.

move along.

feel 0 sympathy for you, don’t play trash can AI builds. You’re the guy who complaigns when brain dead turret engi gets nerfed because you liked winning 1 v 3’s by just face rolling on your keyboard as the game played for you.

so in your opinion having a long cooldown justifies the fact that a skill which is only supposed to transform you for a few moments suddendly also completely destroys another class utilities?

it’s like, hey, plague has a long cooldown so it’s fine if when you use it thieves lose all initiative, or mesmer gets all shatters on cd or whatever other silly thing you can come up with?

you can dislike minion spec and that’s fine but there’s literally 0 reason this should happen.

Same argument people use to justify their wanting DS to get nerfed. Same argument people use when the complain about guardians blocking like crap while they roll their faces on their keyboard expecting to win. Same argument people use when the cry about conditions reking their cleanse less builds. Same argument people use when they cry about them refusing to take mobility and then getting kited by half the classes in the game.

Point is, some things deserve nerfs -cough-immortald/d-cough-, but moa countering ONE build is not one of them.

it wouldnt be a nerf, it would be a fix. its not an intented functionality of the skill or it should do so to every other minion spec in the game.

So you’re going to go ahead and assume anet’s intentions? Thing is, minionmancer’s minions behave differently, therefore they respond differently.

On that note, I don’t remember a time when moa DIDNT affect necro minions.

that’s just being salty you know, is there any good reason why the “it should work on everyone or on no one” approach is invalid when it comes to necro?

look, think, very carefully now.

when the necromancer gets transformed into a moa, against the necromancer’s own will.

it is very natural for the necromancer to lose all access to all necromancer abilities for the duration of being forcefully transformed into a moa.

when the necromancer loses all access to all necromancer abilities, it is only very natural that the necromancer cannot use the necromancer healing ability or utilities or elite.

so yes, this means losing control of all summoned minions as well.

this is working as intended.

do you understand?

i understand how it works ty, it doesnt make it any less unfair to one specific class

it’s not like i even care about minions i havent played that in maybe 2 years, it’s still a pretty stupid interaction between skills when it only applies to one opponent.

The only reason it hoses all of your utilities is that you went all minions with your utilities. That’s sorta the risk you take. Like a turret engie going all turrets and not having a stun break.

adozu.6398:

that’s just being salty you know, is there any good reason why the “it should work on everyone or on no one” approach is invalid when it comes to necro?

That logic, in and of itself is flawed. I suppose mesmers should throw up a thread on why power block doesnt do over half of its tooltip on theives. You know why mesmers don’t make a thread like that anymore? Because the answer from every person would more or less be “because theives work differently”. I’m sure if you want to apply that logic, you should out fighting to make sure theives finally suffer a CD increase on their weapon skills when interrupted by a power blocker now.

Login.5102:

destroys all minions.

Why does a skill put my heal, all my utilities and my elite on cool down.

Because of terrible design.

SlayerSixx.5763:

adozu.6398:

that’s just being salty you know, is there any good reason why the “it should work on everyone or on no one” approach is invalid when it comes to necro?

That logic, in and of itself is flawed. I suppose mesmers should throw up a thread on why power block doesnt do over half of its tooltip on theives. You know why mesmers don’t make a thread like that anymore? Because the answer from every person would more or less be “because theives work differently”. I’m sure if you want to apply that logic, you should out fighting to make sure theives finally suffer a CD increase on their weapon skills when interrupted by a power blocker now.

Actually, those threads totally happened.

The reason folks dropped it is because Power Block got merged with Halting Strike and had Weakness added to it. Giving you some value against everyone (burst damage and Weakness are both great against thieves). That and what interrupt builds really needed to play well against thieves was Illusionary Persona, which they now have.

Someone posted a long time ago on the forums that moa removes minions due to a problem with the code (not confirmed).

Anet doesn’t seem to care enough to try to fix/change it. Too many players QQing about MM necro, which is an underpowered build with no mobility. It is in the same place as longbow rangers, not OP, but people like to QQ without reason.

I would like to see how the community would react if the skill getting 100% hardcountered and entering on full cooldown was other. Imagine if it was cantrip, deception, stances or clones. Probably would explode in rage. But because it is just minions, no one likes minions, it is just ok.

Deimos Tel Arin.7391:

look, think, very carefully now.

when the necromancer gets transformed into a moa, against the necromancer’s own will.

it is very natural for the necromancer to lose all access to all necromancer abilities for the duration of being forcefully transformed into a moa.

when the necromancer loses all access to all necromancer abilities, it is only very natural that the necromancer cannot use the necromancer healing ability or utilities or elite.

so yes, this means losing control of all summoned minions as well.

this is working as intended.

do you understand?

That is very strange since banners don’t dissapear nor ranger spirits or ele elementals when moa’d. So we can assume this is not working as intended.

It’s not working as it should. People are just being salty because of an anti-AI stigma. Fact of the matter is, it’s a poor design/coding issue and has been for a very long time.

Moa doesn’t kill:
Turrets
Spirit Weapons
Spirits
Ranger Pets
Clones/Phantasms
Banners
Elementals
Spawned Allied (Rock Dog, Bird)
Ventari Tablet

Things it does kill:
Minions

Stop being biased children and let a kitten bug/hard counter get fixed. It won’t even affect most of you.

ronpierce.2760:

It’s not working as it should. People are just being salty because of an anti-AI stigma. Fact of the matter is, it’s a poor design/coding issue and has been for a very long time.

Moa doesn’t kill:
Turrets
Spirit Weapons
Spirits
Ranger Pets
Clones/Phantasms
Banners
Elementals
Spawned Allied (Rock Dog, Bird)
Ventari Tablet

Things it does kill:
Minions

Stop being biased children and let a kitten bug/hard counter get fixed. It won’t even affect most of you.

I agree with this. And complained in the past, but moa was never fixed. I doubt they will.

So you want your minions to reappear after the transformation is over? You want them to be completely immune to damage for 10 seconds? You want them to continue to attack while you have been completely disabled? Not sure how any of these issues could get solved without setting your minions on cooldown. Possibly they could start recharging when you get moa’d (maybe they already do?) or be back up for you to summon immediately. That’s a lot of casting to resummon them though >.< I’d be fine with that though.

Pazu.8320:

So you want your minions to reappear after the transformation is over? You want them to be completely immune to damage for 10 seconds? You want them to continue to attack while you have been completely disabled? Not sure how any of these issues could get solved without setting your minions on cooldown. Possibly they could start recharging when you get moa’d (maybe they already do?) or be back up for you to summon immediately. That’s a lot of casting to resummon them though >.< I’d be fine with that though.

Just don’t let it destroy minions.

Pazu.8320:

So you want your minions to reappear after the transformation is over? You want them to be completely immune to damage for 10 seconds? You want them to continue to attack while you have been completely disabled? Not sure how any of these issues could get solved without setting your minions on cooldown. Possibly they could start recharging when you get moa’d (maybe they already do?) or be back up for you to summon immediately. That’s a lot of casting to resummon them though >.< I’d be fine with that though.

Uh they don’t destroy minions… See the list? It’d work like EVERY OTHER spawned ally in the game rofl… You’re acting like this is some weird issue. Spirit weapons and Turrets and other pets still remain regardless of Moa. Minions are the only ones singled out by this.

Login.5102:

destroys all minions.

Why does a skill put my heal, all my utilities and my elite on cool down.

Heh, I wouldnt worry too much, elixir H we engis run sometimes mostly for novelty and pure funnies. Then we go back to either supply crate or mortar for fields + blast.

Mes Moa ? Some mesmer builds do run this as their main elite, but Mass Invis is far better choice nowadays for most builds, so it may be a novelty factor for them as well.

choovanski.5462:

its a risk you took when you decided to play such an awful build

Quoted for biblical accuracy.

ronpierce.2760:

It’s not working as it should. People are just being salty because of an anti-AI stigma. Fact of the matter is, it’s a poor design/coding issue and has been for a very long time.

Moa doesn’t kill:
Turrets
Spirit Weapons
Spirits
Ranger Pets
Clones/Phantasms
Banners
Elementals
Spawned Allied (Rock Dog, Bird)
Ventari Tablet

Things it does kill:
Minions

Stop being biased children and let a kitten bug/hard counter get fixed. It won’t even affect most of you.

No one has a valid response to this.

Some pretty ignorant comments in this thread.

Turrets dont move. Spirit weapons expire. Ranger spirits dont move. Ranger pets are a class mechanic (and they’re still weak). Clones do nearly no damage and are basically body block fodder until the mesmer decides to shatter because of the removal of on death traits. Phantasms literally attack one every 5 or so seconds. Both clones and phantasms are ez kill too. Banners don’t move and only apply buffs. Elementals expire. Rock dog and bird are rune bonuses, take them on your minion mancer too if you want. Idk much about the tablet, so I won’t comment.

List of things that necro minions do. Like spirit weapons and turrets, they have secondary functions (a command skill). They’re also mobile, which automatically makes them better than banners, turrets, and ranger spirits. Unlike clones and phantasms, you don’t need to kill your minions as your primary source of damage. If you want to talk about ranger PETs, let’s talk about how death shroud is 10x better than their garbage pets.