Guild Wars 2

Why is this a thing? We all know immob stacking is the single worst change Anet made to this game! Worse than Skyhammer! Worse than courtyard! Worse than Dhuumfire! And yet, they take an immob stacking elite and put it on an extremely short cooldown! Anet plz!

Wahoo! Bye frands!

Entangle is really annoying. It is a I-win-button.

Sadly Rangers have it bad enough, so entangle is needed to carry their underpowered kit.

Hints for coping: stealthing while entangled stops entangle from pulsing on you, so you can walk out.

Yep, 5gauge is right. It is bad design but it is needed for ranger atm. We will see how it will be if port spots are removed (power ranger)

It’s bad and design, yeah. But so is slick shoes and hammer guard ring.

The difference between entangle, slick shoes and guard ring even though those are ALL EASY to land is that at least entangle doesn’t eat through evades and can be cleansed by others.

Where is the problem again?

Like Ranger as a class has been notorious for being stupidly easy to play but when you look at slick shoes and guard ring for a “kill set up” then entangle is the LEAST of your concern.

Wait til the OP complains about fear me though, the hypocrisy is real.

Entangle is underpowered.
In my opinion it should get it’s cd reduced to 45sec and duration increased to 8sec.
Then it’ll be a normal and good working Elite skill for rangers which in fact will be a good choice between Rampage and Entangle itself.

entangle actually doesn’t immob stack that much. with 30% condi duration aka the amount power rangers have, it does an extra 1/4th second per tick. it ticks 4 times so that’s an extra second in total. I agree, immob stacking is terrible but it isn’t as bad with entangle as you make it out to be. entangle has a 3/4th second cast time so it isn’t an unrealistic expectation to dodge it, even if you dodge a little late, it won’t matter because it immob has other wonderful bugs like people dodging while immobed. if they have that bug, your entangle is useless because they just moved out of it, EVEN THOUGH YOU LANDED IT!!! you can also kill the roots or Condi clear. long story short, entangle isn’t op as long as you’re aware that a ranger will do it and conservative the proper cooldowns

its one of the only true ways of dealing with an engineering as a ranger, which i’m sure is why the OP who mains an engi, is bringing this up, as engineers are exrtemely underpowered at the moment and need more buffs…

mulzi.8273:

its one of the only true ways of dealing with an engineering as a ranger, which i’m sure is why the OP who mains an engi, is bringing this up, as engineers are exrtemely underpowered at the moment and need more buffs…

Perhaps we shouldn’t tell him his Heal (built in cleanse) comes off cooldown thrice before one Entangle cooldown. Or he can just press Rifle5 and the roots will be destroyed. Maybe even kill the Ranger due to the sheer force from the Engi re-entering Tyria’s atmosphere.

The issue I have with Entangle is that it works out of LOS.

On Kyhlo, I’ve been under mid point and have gotten entangled when no ranger was in visible sight. So I either sit there & wait it out or waste a cooldown.

SlimChance.6593:

The issue I have with Entangle is that it works out of LOS.

On Kyhlo, I’ve been under mid point and have gotten entangled when no ranger was in visible sight. So I either sit there & wait it out or waste a cooldown.

Clocktower in Kyhlo is the most bugged structure in whole game.

But it’s okay.
They’ll fix it just like they fixed matchmaking.

people seem to evade my entangle most of the time in teamfights. although in 1v1s i wait until both dodges are used and it can really turn the tables.

SlimChance.6593:

The issue I have with Entangle is that it works out of LOS.

On Kyhlo, I’ve been under mid point and have gotten entangled when no ranger was in visible sight. So I either sit there & wait it out or waste a cooldown.

Many skills ignore LOS like this. Not just entangle though. Seems related to how the game handles PBAEs in general.

OP has slickshoes and needs to learn to play.

Ryan.9387:

OP has slickshoes and needs to learn to play.

OP has clearly stated MANY times that slickshoes needs a nerf too. Just b/c one thing is broken doesn’t mean something else should be too.

TBH, the problem with entangle is that it often ends up coming down to that 1 single skill completely killing you. Its kind of the same problem as crate, tbh, which is easy to land and will often single-handedly wreck you. For both skills, a longer cast time would be great. Big effects should have big tells.

Alternatively, make the ground vines able to be destroyed by ranged attacks. Iirc, attacks with a ranged weapon mostly just go on CD due to the vines hit-box being right on top of you.

Cast time is fine. A more apparent tell could probably be warranted. Give it the pin down treatment.

As to the stacking, would people honestly be happier with a 5 second immob on single application as opposed to the destructable root that you can walk out of with any immob reduction or kill to stop it from stacking?

Except for Necros of course who have no way to actually hit the things unless they have a dagger.

warrior presses warhorn 4 and everyone on the team walks out. similar to guardian pressing stab and everyone walks out of ring/slickies. so yeah not that OP considering everyone has a shoutbow.

(also immob is 90% the first to cleanse)

The entire ranger class is badly designed.

OP always make threads and complain about any skills that potentially or counters Engis. In the past it was always about Ele and blast finishers. A high skilled Short bow ranger with S/D or S/T with Entangled can beat Engi with ease. Op has mentioned in the past that there should be a sign that shows up if Ranger have Shared Anguish up. Yes Entangled has short cool down when traited. Let’s talk about about Slick shoes with the double knockdown, elite crates, and that Incendiary Powder. Check Ops past post. You will hardly ever see a Engi complaint go figure

Assassin O.9367:

OP always make threads and complain about any skills that potentially or counters Engis. In the past it was always about Ele and blast finishers. A high skilled Short bow ranger with S/D or S/T with Entangled can beat Engi with ease. Op has mentioned in the past that there should be a sign that shows up if Ranger have Shared Anguish up. Yes Entangled has short cool down when traited. Let’s talk about about Slick shoes with the double knockdown, elite crates, and that Incendiary Powder. Check Ops past post. You will hardly ever see a Engi complaint go figure

Condi ranger has way more cheap mechanics than Engie if you want to compare the two across the board.

I called for Incendiary Powder, Overcharge Shot, and Slick Shoes nerfs! I don’t think you read my past posts that thoroughly! Yes I also called for a little icon that shows Shared Anguish and also Reaper’s Protection, Mirror of Anguish, Incendiary Powder, and literally almost all passive skills because passive abilities are gross! Selective reading my frand! It’s bad for you!

Anyway my frands! Thx for replying and Entangle is gross!

Wahoo! Bye frands!

Nothing wrong with Entangle

Never really had a problem with entangle, unless the ranger using it was condi spec & throwing tons of other conditions on me to make it impossible to remove.

There are generally ways to counter it like elixer C, I love that skill.

The only 2 classes I think it would screw over hard is thief & mesmer, even then however there are ways to get out of it.

I really don’t see a problem with the skill. It’s strong enough to be an elite, but there’s still a ton of counterplay to it.

Unlike most classes, Rangers have two viable elites for PvP…well, 3 if you count spirit builds. Meanwhile with engis…

This is a troll thread right?

Entangle doesn’t bother me that much (although I’ll go to bat for VeeWee here and say that it does disproportionately shaft Engineers). What does grind my gears though is that rune set that dumps a bunch of AIDS on elite use. Rune of the Krait or something? That becomes a lot more frustrating because you end up with a set where the biggest threat is entirely from runes and sigils.

shimmerless.4560:

Entangle doesn’t bother me that much (although I’ll go to bat for VeeWee here and say that it does disproportionately shaft Engineers). What does grind my gears though is that rune set that dumps a bunch of AIDS on elite use. Rune of the Krait or something? That becomes a lot more frustrating because you end up with a set where the biggest threat is entirely from runes and sigils.

Condi ranger is one of my primary classes and I could agree that entangle + krait is an overpowered combination, especially against classes with difficulty against immob, and I understand where the engi is coming from. It’s frustrating to go against a counter like condi ranger is to engi, however it’s not NEARLY as severe as say a thief going up against a medi guard IMO. Every class has counters and I don’t honestly see anyone being wrecked by my entangle often, they most of the time are out of it within the first seconds I used it on them because they save their skills for when it comes like I do with lightning reflexes against other rangers.

This all being said, I could go for a fix on entangle + krait only when rangers get other things that push them into the meta. You can’t just nerf one of our best abilities when we are already struggling to fit in. And I hope the OP was complaining about entangle on condi rangers that have krait, b/c entangle on power rangers is completely fine.

veewee get outta here man. are you serious? you must be trolling cuz I thought ud have something more useful to complain about regarding our current meta.

there is absolutely nothing OP about the condi bunker. it’s one of the easiest specs to lock down and its only role is very situational – 1v1’s at home. out of all the sustain specs, it’s probably the weakest. entangle is super easy to counter and if anything, its CD to be reduced a little and muddy terrain reworked into something more useful.

Rektangle I guess is ok but Krait Runes need to stop activating late so if you dodge Entangle you still eat Krait.

I have heard that the krait rune proc is undodgeable regardless of which elite uses it

This has to be a complete joke. The skill is exclusively good against players with virtually no condi clense. The vast majority of the time even relatively new players know to save ONE clense. Try countering supply crate with one condi clense. See how that works.

Krait runes are way barely a problem on p/d thief. Not on condi ranger. They proc on cast not hit and I don’t believe they’re dodgable. That said for a 6 piece bonus they’re mediocre at best especially considering the rest of the set is terrible even on short bow which only sees damage gains to bleed in increments of 33% duration increase..

Hoping this was a troll…. doubting it though…

I think there’s enough counterplay to Entangle to warrant it not changing. Blinks, stealths, cleanses, and damaging the vines all work just fine. It’s annoying, yeah, but so are half the other elites in the game. They are elite, after all.

Rektangle /nuff said

-Demissa

Would this still be considered OP if any one of these happened?:

1. Cast time raised to 1s (from 3/4)
   1. I’m not afraid to admit I have trouble dodging this on purpose.
2. Recharge raised to 90s
   1. This means it won’t be available every fight.
3. Health of roots reduced by half
   1. Sometimes I find on classes that aren’t engi that it can be hard to kill the roots.
4. Line of sight requirement
   1. Someone mentioned getting people from below kylho, but it’s equally annoying when you are hit from behind a wall.
5. Blockable
   1. “B-b-but…I gear shielded that!” /cry

Again, only one of those. Not all.

The Gates Assassin.9827:

Would this still be considered OP if any one of these happened?:

1. Cast time raised to 1s (from 3/4)
   1. I’m not afraid to admit I have trouble dodging this on purpose.
2. Recharge raised to 90s
   1. This means it won’t be available every fight.
3. Health of roots reduced by half
   1. Sometimes I find on classes that aren’t engi that it can be hard to kill the roots.
4. Line of sight requirement
   1. Someone mentioned getting people from below kylho, but it’s equally annoying when you are hit from behind a wall.
5. Blockable
   1. “B-b-but…I gear shielded that!” /cry

Again, only one of those. Not all.

Uh… just make it not a survival skill…

The Gates Assassin.9827:

Would this still be considered OP if any one of these happened?:

1. Cast time raised to 1s (from 3/4)
   1. I’m not afraid to admit I have trouble dodging this on purpose.
2. Recharge raised to 90s
   1. This means it won’t be available every fight.
3. Health of roots reduced by half
   1. Sometimes I find on classes that aren’t engi that it can be hard to kill the roots.
4. Line of sight requirement
   1. Someone mentioned getting people from below kylho, but it’s equally annoying when you are hit from behind a wall.
5. Blockable
   1. “B-b-but…I gear shielded that!” /cry

Again, only one of those. Not all.

How about none, as an engy you can stealth yourself when it hits, overcharge shot out of it or just use leg mods + hoelbrak runes to simply walk out of entangles.

The Gates Assassin.9827:

Would this still be considered OP if any one of these happened?:

1. Cast time raised to 1s (from 3/4)
   1. I’m not afraid to admit I have trouble dodging this on purpose.
2. Recharge raised to 90s
   1. This means it won’t be available every fight.
3. Health of roots reduced by half
   1. Sometimes I find on classes that aren’t engi that it can be hard to kill the roots.
4. Line of sight requirement
   1. Someone mentioned getting people from below kylho, but it’s equally annoying when you are hit from behind a wall.
5. Blockable
   1. “B-b-but…I gear shielded that!” /cry

Again, only one of those. Not all.

I think all you really need to do is not have the immobilize stack as often as the bleed, something like 2 stacks for 2.5 seconds or 3 stacks of 1.75 seconds, rather than 5 1sec stacks.

As others might have mentioned, it is completely possible to cleanse the immobilize and dodge away from the vines before the next tick, and it’s something I’ve pulled off without using a immobilize cleanse and movement skill like the Thief’s Withdraw or Engineer’s Rocket Boots. A larger gap between the stacks would give more time to pull it off without having to pop an escape skill to do so.

Duka.5864:

Hmmmm think you only need to destroy wines,what is the problem…..?

The vines actually have pretty decent health; you usually have to pop a good amount of burst to get out of them in only a second or two in that manner. Plus they’re considered destructible objects, not enemies, which means immunity to crits and conditions.

Owned WeeWee. My favourite:) One of the reasons i chose to main a ranger in spvp and not engi was not having to see this guy in my profession forum all the time.

As for entangle it’s just fine. I had people evade or block mine all too often. It’s hardly op, and as for LoS? It’s an aoe, ofc LoS won’t matter.

Also engies underpowered? Am i reading this right? Those guys with:
20 second unstoppable turret megaheal?
Best blocking skill ingame? (gear shield)
Tons of condies of all sorts save torment?
Near unkillable turrets for anyone who is not packing serious power aoe?
2 skills for price of one as their job mechanic?
More cc then chinese militia during riots?
And maybe just one skill, but a reliable boon strip which rangers get none of?

riiiiight….

ZeftheWicked.3076:

Owned WeeWee. My favourite:) One of the reasons i chose to main a ranger in spvp and not engi was not having to see this guy in my profession forum all the time.

As for entangle it’s just fine. I had people evade or block mine all too often. It’s hardly op, and as for LoS? It’s an aoe, ofc LoS won’t matter.

Also engies underpowered? Am i reading this right? Those guys with:
20 second unstoppable turret megaheal?
Best blocking skill ingame? (gear shield)
Tons of condies of all sorts save torment?
Near unkillable turrets for anyone who is not packing serious power aoe?
2 skills for price of one as their job mechanic?
More cc then chinese militia during riots?
And maybe just one skill, but a reliable boon strip which rangers get none of?

riiiiight….

A Ranger complaining about turret engis? Can’t you just burst the engi from 1200 away with your longbow, safe from virtually anything their turrets can do?

I’ll admit, not fighting on the point is usually a big no-no, especially in a close match, but that also means the engineer’s only choices are try to sit there and take it until help arrives, or chase you down without his precious turrets and likely no kits or Toolbelt skills either. (unless thye blows all their turrets or had a kit with him; Not likely)

Also, boon strip? I won’t deny that it exists, but when’s the last time you’ve seen a 100 mines Engineer?

Thing is i’m a shortbow.

ellesee.8297:

Why is this a thing? We all know immob stacking is the single worst change Anet made to this game! Worse than Skyhammer! Worse than courtyard! Worse than Dhuumfire! And yet, they take an immob stacking elite and put it on an extremely short cooldown! Anet plz!

Wahoo! Bye frands!

I’m sure as the #1 NA Engineer you can handle 5 seconds of immobilize once per minute.

ZeftheWicked.3076:

Thing is i’m a shortbow.

Shortbow’s 900 range would still put you out of range of thumper, as well as net if it isn’t between you and the engi.

That of course assumes they picked Rifled Turret Barrels rather than Fortified Turrets, if they did the later, then you should still be able to outrange both of those. Though if they did do fortified, they shouldn’t have their turrets already out to begin with.

Also, you should try to make it a habit for you to send your pet to attack first, before getting close to the point and within range of any deployed turrets, rather than waiting for the pet AI to aggro. Turrets only attack the engineer’s target if it is within the turret’s range, otherwise they’ll attack the closest hostile, and they will waste overcharge attacks on pets if you aren’t in range when the engineer primes them, even if that engineer is targeting you at the time.

Hey, that’s actually pretty helpful tip, cheers mate:)

Entangle would be fine if immob wasn’t buggy as kitten.

ellesee.8297:

Why is this a thing? We all know immob stacking is the single worst change Anet made to this game! Worse than Skyhammer! Worse than courtyard! Worse than Dhuumfire! And yet, they take an immob stacking elite and put it on an extremely short cooldown! Anet plz!

Wahoo! Bye frands!

Pretty brave of you to make this thread and not expect to get torn apart since you constantly say that you don’t play this game anymore. Why are you even still here if you don’t play….that is beyond me my “frands”.

Ellesee… you have more than enough ways to get rid of immob as an Engie. Why are you complaining?

I don’t understand why people are attacking Vee Wee personally. Who cares what Engineers can or can’t do? That’s not the point, silly beans.

The Gates Assassin.9827:

Cast time raised to 1s (from 3/4)

Entangle has a pretty clear animation as it is—especially if you’re waiting for it—so I don’t think a higher cast time is necessary, but I wouldn’t be opposed to this change.

The Gates Assassin.9827:

Recharge raised to 90s

This is the one I like the most. Traited, it would still cleanse condis and grant fury, but it would be at a 72s cooldown instead 48s, and that feels a lot more balanced for such a strong elite.

The Gates Assassin.9827:

Health of roots reduced by half

Since ranged attacks can’t hit the roots at all, I’m not sure this change would significantly impact the balance.

The Gates Assassin.9827:

Line of sight requirement

This would ruin Entangle as a counterplay/locator tool for stealthed enemies, and I’d prefer that ArenaNet not encourage players to abuse LOS.

The Gates Assassin.9827:

Blockable

I think this would help Engis enormously, but there are classes without access to a reliable or practical block.

The Gates Assassin.9827:

Would this still be considered OP if any one of these happened?:

1. Cast time raised to 1s (from 3/4)
   1. I’m not afraid to admit I have trouble dodging this on purpose.
2. Recharge raised to 90s
   1. This means it won’t be available every fight.
3. Health of roots reduced by half
   1. Sometimes I find on classes that aren’t engi that it can be hard to kill the roots.
4. Line of sight requirement
   1. Someone mentioned getting people from below kylho, but it’s equally annoying when you are hit from behind a wall.
5. Blockable
   1. “B-b-but…I gear shielded that!” /cry

Again, only one of those. Not all.

None of the points are good.

Tao.5096:

The Gates Assassin.9827:

Would this still be considered OP if any one of these happened?:

1. Cast time raised to 1s (from 3/4)
   1. I’m not afraid to admit I have trouble dodging this on purpose.
2. Recharge raised to 90s
   1. This means it won’t be available every fight.
3. Health of roots reduced by half
   1. Sometimes I find on classes that aren’t engi that it can be hard to kill the roots.
4. Line of sight requirement
   1. Someone mentioned getting people from below kylho, but it’s equally annoying when you are hit from behind a wall.
5. Blockable
   1. “B-b-but…I gear shielded that!” /cry

Again, only one of those. Not all.

None of the points are good.

Why not?

Quadox.7834:

Why not?

1. Cast time raised to 1s (from 3/4)
   1. Makes no difference. You can cast it while running, and animation is the same as Signet of the Wild(or very similar to it). Sure, it increase the window for dodge, but what about it? Are we going to start new hype to glue eyes to screen and wait until someone will start casting it? Problem lies not in it’s cast time.
2. Recharge raised to 90s
   1. Anet did reduce cd to 60 second so it’ll be on pair with Rampage. I personally am happy to see that people do not stick to only one elite(Rampage) as they did previously.
3. Health of roots reduced by half
   1. They die after being hit twice, and if I remember correctly, you can crit them. No point really.
4. Line of sight requirement
   1. As using LoS is also part of skill and allows to outplay others while using your knowledge about environment around you, Ranger has way too many LoS required skills, so lack of LoS on Entangle is a good change of pace.
5. Blockable
   1. And what does it change? Few classes that have access to Block skills via weapons or Aegis Boon up the sleeve. What about the rest of the classes?

In my opinion and from my experience, the reason why Entangle is bit OP as too good CC is because you have to target it to destroy. That means you lose target on ranger.
After destroying roots, you have to retarget ranger again. With it’s pet nearby and that silly bug which swaps target to pet sometimes, retargeting ranger is time consuming.

In my opinion, let melees(I doubt ranged classes suffer from this in 1v1), without target lock hit root with auto attack.
Since those roots are around 2 shot, increase it’s hp/durability to be hit 3 times to not make this elite skill useless.

What does it change?
Entangle stays as CC skill which work well within all aspects – good cd, good duration, and possibility of not difficult removal, which gives a fair breather for melees.

With this, Rangers still have a very good Elite skill choices, one with long cd, 2nd with short one.