Guild Wars 2

Just try running:

-Celestial Signet Necro (if you are facing all condi teams, then run offhand dagger as well)
-Shadow Arts Thief
-Shoutbow Warrior
-D/D Ele (Diamond Skin, or auto Cleansing Fire + remove burn on Dodge)
-Mantra Mesmer (with mantra heal and power cleanse)

Thank me later.

EDIT: To clarify, we are not in a condi meta. In fact, this is the farthest we’ve ever been from a condition based meta with only 1 class out of 8 running a condi based amulet (and not even being seen much at the top). Yes, there are some celestial classes, but these are hybrids, and the bulk of their damage comes from power based attacks.

No Guard? k …

Mantra mesmer ? That’s not a real option, that cleanse only one condi you can cleanse maximum 3 condis that way. Mesmer has MUCH better options to cleanse or even send back conditions, and using blindness-shatter trait is a good way to prevent condi spam to. Better avoiding to get condi than looking for a way to cure it in my opinion.

Run boring as kitten meta support builds. Thanking you now.

Sombrero.9204:

Mantra mesmer ? That’s not a real option, that cleanse only one condi you can cleanse maximum 3 condis that way. Mesmer has MUCH better options to cleanse or even send back conditions, and using blindness-shatter trait is a good way to prevent condi spam to. Better avoiding to get condi than looking for a way to cure it in my opinion.

Mantra can actually remove 12 guaranteed pre battle if you the 5 point minor and the 3 uses trait, with healing and utility cleanse of course.

Sombrero.9204:

Mantra mesmer ? That’s not a real option, that cleanse only one condi you can cleanse maximum 3 condis that way. Mesmer has MUCH better options to cleanse or even send back conditions, and using blindness-shatter trait is a good way to prevent condi spam to. Better avoiding to get condi than looking for a way to cure it in my opinion.

Do you even mesmer? With mantra mesmer you remove 2 condis AoE every time you use a heal charge (so 6 condis AoE with heal) and you remove a condi every time you shatter.

infantrydiv.1620:

Just try running:

-Celestial Signet Necro (if you are facing all condi teams, then run offhand dagger as well)
-Shadow Arts Thief
-Shoutbow Warrior
-D/D Ele (Diamond Skin, or auto Cleansing Fire + remove burn on Dodge)
-Mantra Mesmer (with mantra heal and power cleanse)

Thank me later

Oh, SHADOW ARTS – I never knew! If I had then conditions would never have been a problem.

Yes, that’s sarcasm. If you need it breaking down for you as to why it’s sarcastic then… well, i doubt you have played thief.

Chips.7968:

infantrydiv.1620:

Just try running:

-Celestial Signet Necro (if you are facing all condi teams, then run offhand dagger as well)
-Shadow Arts Thief
-Shoutbow Warrior
-D/D Ele (Diamond Skin, or auto Cleansing Fire + remove burn on Dodge)
-Mantra Mesmer (with mantra heal and power cleanse)

Thank me later

Oh, SHADOW ARTS – I never knew! If I had then conditions would never have been a problem.

Yes, that’s sarcasm. If you need it breaking down for you as to why it’s sarcastic then… well, i doubt you have played thief.

Magic Toker died about once in WTS playing Shadow Arts thief vs some of the best players in the world on such builds as Burn Guardian and D/D Fire Ele before the nerf… I think that attests the survivability SA thief both vs condis and burst.

glaphen.5230:

Sombrero.9204:

Mantra mesmer ? That’s not a real option, that cleanse only one condi you can cleanse maximum 3 condis that way. Mesmer has MUCH better options to cleanse or even send back conditions, and using blindness-shatter trait is a good way to prevent condi spam to. Better avoiding to get condi than looking for a way to cure it in my opinion.

Mantra can actually remove 12 guaranteed pre battle if you the 5 point minor and the 3 uses trait, with healing and utility cleanse of course.

^

OP’s list is good. I gotta add Support Guard as a powerful candidate if going against condi heavy teams.

Other builds with good access to cleansing include shout ranger, survival ranger, HGH inventions engie w/ mortar elite

Soldier
Hoelbrak
Lyssa

Generosity
Purity if you’re really that desperate

Trying to remember the last time we were in a condi meta. Hmm I think its the one w/ ranger spirits and necro (only briefly) right after Mesmer and eles got nerfed. I forgot, it was all a blur.

infantrydiv.1620:

Magic Toker died about once in WTS playing Shadow Arts thief vs some of the best players in the world on such builds as Burn Guardian and D/D Fire Ele before the nerf… I think that attests the survivability SA thief both vs condis and burst.

Firstly an individual example does not prove your statement to be true; do you even play thief or just going on a “top top player I hear of”? Could it not be his skill level and knowledge of their classes/attacks that allowed him to survive (I assume win, but…). Are you saying the only reason he survived or won was because he took shadow arts?

Shadow arts provides the ability to regen in stealth, heal in stealth, and to cleanse one of five conditions every 3 seconds – with the first removed after 3 seconds of stealth. Obviously there are other, less condition/survivability related alternatives in that line.

It doesn’t turn you into Mr Invincible, nor make you laugh in the face of condi’s. It will help you survive in the +1 / back capper roll as you simply disengage and move elsewhere without burning all skills to clear condi’s that may be helpful in other scenarios; so that’s very true.

But it doesn’t mean conditions don’t present a risk and/or a significant threat.

Now add in the fact more classes will have reveals, and that shadow arts line may be entirely negated…

This post hurt my brain…

I see 4 condition heavy meta build, this is the closest its been to a condition meta ever…

Anyway. Shadow arts thief does not have as much ckear as you seem to think.

Lets all run cele necro then i guess.

In all seriousness burn guard defence and pasice counterpressure needa toning down, engineer condition spam needa to promote more skillful play instead of the way it is now, other than that condition specs are fine.

infantrydiv.1620:

For the people complaining about condis…

Just run this list of hard counters.

Guild Wars 2 skill ceiling cap in a nutshell.

Up down left right conditions are flying everywhere.. Not condi meta yeah right, if this is the furthest from a condi meta than pls tell me when was the closest lol. Do you know why condi meta breaks pvp and is worst than power meta? Because to counter condis you need to change traits and utilities to counter em, but to counter power you can keep whatever traits or utilities you’re using and just change your amulet depending on how much survivability you want. That’s why pvp is so broken now, yeah it’s easy to counter condis if you are using those builds but not everyone wants to run them. I’d rather power meta over condi meta any day that way I can run whatever class with whatever build I like.

Infantrydiv:
You list a lot of cleanse skills but you do not list how many conditions they cleanse and in what timeframe.

Let us take Shadow’S Embrace:
The first consition is cleansed after three seconds, then after every three seconds one more.

In combat this means you have at a maximum one condition cleansed and which one is randomly decided by the program.

If you want more you have to resealth giving the enemy an easy way to find your position and aoe you to death.

Another thing:
Toker seldom died because he chose to do the cap thing and had a coordinated team communicating via teamspeak/ventrilo/we.

I agree with you that there ARE classes with powerful condi cleanse. Heal guard being one of those and naturally necros if correctly traited but placating all the condi cleanse skills onto the wall is not a very good argument in my opinion.

If however you would take the time and try to check out condi application potential against condi cleanse potential, then you would perhaps see that they are not balanced at all if you do not have a dedicated team.

Also, I propose to reduce the sigil of generosity sigil internal cooldown to 3 seconds.

If what the people playing condi saying is true, they should have absolutely no problem to manage the conditions coming back to them.

I joke obviously but I would be intrigued to see what happens.

Eleandra.4859:

Also, I propose to reduce the sigil of generosity sigil internal cooldown to 3 seconds.

If what the people playing condi saying is true, they should have absolutely no problem to manage the conditions coming back to them.

I joke obviously but I would be intrigued to see what happens.

Then zerker builds could hardcounter every condi build, because the condi builds don’t have to deal only with their own conditions, but with the high direct dmg from the zerker too, who can be nearly immune to the condi dmg, thanks to the frequent transfer on top of other condi remove options.

1) Eleandra is joking, but would love to see how condi builds would suddenly think maybe condi’s are OP.
2) It’d transfer 1 every 3 seconds… high damage per tick / low duration condi’s wouldn’t likely get transferred as they’d “tick out” before it procs.
3) It’s a L2P issue – since they’d only get transferred on an attack you can easily evade and dodge those attacks after the condi bomb to make this a non problem… I mean hell – you can see the condi’s they’ve got loaded AND the attack incoming! So L2P AMIRITE? :P

Yes, (3) is a leg pulling exercise. We’re constantly told condi is a L2P issue… evade, dodge, cleanse.

My (fun answer) would be : “Just cleanse it.”

And as condi players like to tell all power players to “just cleanse it”; use all the other invulnarabilites to counter the burst You have tem so stop slotting you condi utilities and get defensive.

That is what condi players do.

You are right UmbraNoctis though. It would be unfair.

The problem stays that condi builds are very strong against power builds and those are very weak against condi builds in return because condi builds have a LOT of sustain usually and since 26.6. also a LOT of damage.

I have played condi and find it very unskillful and boring but if I do not want to only play in coordinated groups which are completely built to counter condi, I have also to play condi in order to be able to help my team.

Condi or power should be a choice made by preference, both should be valid. Outside of coordinated teams many classes have no valid way to beat condi classes and that should be corrected.

Condi players are correct insofar though as that many solo cue players seem to not pack any condi cleanse at all and that is also stupid.

infantrydiv.1620:

Just try running:

-Celestial Signet Necro (if you are facing all condi teams, then run offhand dagger as well)
-Shadow Arts Thief
-Shoutbow Warrior
-D/D Ele (Diamond Skin, or auto Cleansing Fire + remove burn on Dodge)
-Mantra Mesmer (with mantra heal and power cleanse)

Thank me later.

EDIT: To clarify, we are not in a condi meta. In fact, this is the farthest we’ve ever been from a condition based meta with only 1 class out of 8 running a condi based amulet (and not even being seen much at the top). Yes, there are some celestial classes, but these are hybrids, and the bulk of their damage comes from power based attacks.

because screw playing the professions people prefer amirite ?
the fact you point out the way to counter condi spammers is with specific classes only highlights how wrong you and the other defenders are

Eleandra.4859:

The problem stays that condi builds are very strong against power builds and those are very weak against condi builds in return because condi builds have a LOT of sustain usually and since 26.6. also a LOT of damage.

This is not true in general. Some power builds are weak against condis, but others are strong against them. Some condi builds are weak vs condis, some are weak vs (certain) power builds (for example condi trap ranger is weak vs power lb ranger), others are not. It depends on the specific builds, not whether it is condi or power.