Guild Wars 2

Hello world,

I’m Cyn you maybe don’t know me, I was the leader of Otist Team that came at the 8st places of the 1st eu ToL. I’m here to help you to find a proper gameplay to a probable gvg that a lot of players are waiting for.
It is really interessting because it would create a real dynamism that it has actually never been in this pvp for the moment.

Gw2 is a continuation of the first game, why not take the general idea of gvg this game to a new game mode? Players do not consider it as plagiarism or lack of imagination, but rather as a reference to a gameplay that has worked for over 8 years, with a mechanical tournament much more structured and interesting.

What I propose is very simple, similar gameplay gvg GW, ie:

- A base:
Each team will have one, a bit like Foefire. In contrast to this map in the gvg map, bases will be opened and the different ways to enter will be two to three depending on the maps.
On this base, there will be a Guild Lord he must kill to win the game, not lord will obviously like cardboard on Foefire that can soloing in necro and probably with other professions.
The base is composed of archers, knights and a Bodyguard it will eventually kill before the enemy Guild Lord for his life decreases faster.

- A pole for the flag:
Each team has a flag and putting his flag on the flagpole every 2 mins (for example) they will have a bonus such as the skills recharge instantly (again it is just an example).

- Mechanical different maps depending gvg:
On an island of fire, for example, to burn alteration represented by an extensive lava on the way the flag or on the way to split the enemy base
On an island of ice, to the alteration of the ice when the players are on a frosted surface (increase in the burst strat / bump / imo on target as frost)
On an island warrior, put a trebuchet with which it must bring together different components to build the treb and allow to overthrow the teamfight.
On an island X, capture a point to offer a bonus team.

- A composition not exceeding 8 players:
Unlike gvg on gw, we could easily reach 8 players but I think on gw2, we will not reach that number, maybe 6-7 players max would be more appropriate.
The team fights generally do not exceed the number of 5 players if ever there strategies to split the enemy base, it will probably 2-3 players.

- An automated tournament ?
For those who were not on gw, there were automated tournaments (aT) and monthly automated tournaments (MAT) during which many guilds competed, there were more than 20 guilds 8 players who participated in the monthly tournaments even if guilds eu / na were grouped, there were about a dozen European guild which is really not bad.
An automatic daily tournament during which the guilds play against and players can earn “Reward Points” (or gold in our case because the gold is the universal currency), they exchange against weapons / armor / back etc.
Winning MAT means a HUGE reward for the players that composed the team, like their names on that weird wall in the mistheart like:
MAT September 2014: Otist Team [To] Cyn Drazeh Farror Windu etc.
+ A finisher proper to the 1st guild of the month (always same finisher but still one finisher for one guild per month)

- A reward system up to the tournament:
If we exclude the gems there were during tournaments three rounds in October 2012, we can have any specific pvp currency with which one can get EVERYTHING a player wishes to acquire in the game
Obviously, if he wishes to have the item is very difficult to access as a legendary example, while the number of reward point to bring will be proportional to the rarity of the item.
Ability to unlock skins ascended weapons / armor / back.
Opportunity to exchange reward points against T6 bags, etc. Custom arena kit.

- A rating system at the Guild:
Besides the influence of the number of guild could possibly put a rating to see the position of the guild europeen region to launch a gvg and fall against a guild that has approximately the same rating as your guild.
This involves: Possibility to launch a gvg not necessarily participate in automated tournaments.

- GvG with Guild Rating > X
If your guild rating is high, because it increases when you win a gvg.
For example, every guilds start at 1k rating. When you reach to 2k rating and you win some gvg at this rating, you will get a title as long and continuous as that of Gladiator / Mercenary etc.
A displayable title with different levels showing your involvement in gvg
Gw Example:
1: 25 wins Grating > 1200 – Champion
2: 50 wins Grating > 1200 – Fierce Champion
3: 100 wins Grating > 1200 – Mighty Champion
etc

Here I think I said everything, I’m sure if you inhale something like this to create a new mode excluding the capture point, the mechanics of 500 points = win then the cycle pvp will restart.
I simply lists everything that was in the gvg GW, that is to say something without necessarily concise anet that the team is involved in organizing official tournaments as monthly tournaments were considered, I think, as official tournaments that motivated everyone.
The rewards were the emissaries weapons that were available were very expensive with rewards points, like for elite armor.

This game has great potential, it may even surpass gw if properly redesigned because at the moment it lacks a lot of things, I went on Wildstar and when I see the updates made on the pvp, where we see that you change the description of the moamorph skills, I think maybe you want ideas, so here is what I propose.

I hope I have been understood and sorry my english is not great, thank you for forgiving
And sorry again if that’s the 10000th topic talking about that but I had to give my ideas in a clean topic that Ive made

Friendly, From Cyn with Love

External links:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KisQjbLGwAM (awsm gvg’s)
GvG’s maps :
http://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Frozen_Isle
http://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Burning_Isle
http://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Isle_of_the_Dead
http://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Isle_of_Solitude
http://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Imperial_Isle

EDIT: sorry my post was 1050 words and I could only write 500 so I made it in 2 parts !

I’d love a GvG map that functioned similar to what you said, but added different elements. Say for example that each teams keep had an indestructible door, and to open it the opposing team had to collect a “flag” that spawns in the centre and bring it to the gate. Once the Gate is open that team has 30 seconds to do what they want, before everyone is ported out and the gate and “flags” respawn.

So basically you want GW1 back.

You are asking too much, they don’t want to use tested and true game modes, they want “new” and “innovative” /sigh

Anet have said they welcome player opinions and intend to add more options for PvP, so instead of the usual pessimism of commenting ‘ANet would never do that’ etc, show them why it’s a good idea.
This has my support. This is the type of PvP I was after when getting the game. This is the type of game mode that would keep me playing.

The Gates Assassin.9827:

So basically you want GW1 back.

I’m not asking for gw back, I’m just giving to them what a gvg mode, not only the gamplay but also the rewards/tittle/tournaments, was on gw maybe that’s a completely new dev team and they don’t know it ? x)

Zietlogik.6208:

You are asking too much, they don’t want to use tested and true game modes, they want “new” and “innovative” /sigh

They can innovate with new mechanics in differents new maps according to gw2 background like an asura gvg map or a Sylvari gvg map I don’t know this game has so many possibilities just about the background of gw2
In differents maps you can add differents mechanics that can be so interessting, maybe more interessting than some gvg map in gw.

Once again I’m taking gw gvg as an example, but which includes this game mode should be similar to the addition of any new game mode on gw2.
Imo gw2 pvp would be way better, more “esport” and more players, for sure if something like that happens I would come back, do a team and play gvg again and again.
I used to do that for like 7 years on gw and I’ve never tired.

Just about the rewards/aT/bases has to be the same imo, if they want to change the maps and what is composing those It’s fine they can innovate on it, but with that mechanic, that game mode would be like a renewal for gw2 pvp

EDIT: And yea I forgot to say that this pvp really needs something that shows there’s competitiveness and that “esport” thing, I think that this kind of game mode (which include automatics tournaments mechanic + rewards) is more important that a game mode like Jade Quarry or Alliance Battle from gw

To bring back the same style of game in GW1 will require much more than a map.
GW1 did not have one of the greatest pvps of any game simply because of the gamemode, it was the intricacies and skill cap that evolved out of the gameplay. It seems like these devs are receptive to communication, much more so than in the past.. But even with that, the change it would require to make a competitive game is significant.

They’ve worked hard to make everything as basic and simple as possible to reduce the learning curve and appeal to a general audience. However, if they want a great game, they need to start changing the balance and mentality of how a game should be played. It should not be focused on this idea of separation and individuals, but rather focused on cooperative teamplay. Last time I checked, GW2 was an RPG not a MOBA. Why would they try to appeal to the MOBA audience when they should be looking to recapture the initial audience they had in GW1? (ADDED: What I mean is they need to be clear and not try to appeal to other audiences which are not the RPG base they need.)

The first thing Anet would need to do before ever making a gamemode is to sit back and ask honestly, who is our audience? Who are we making this game for? Right now, they are trying to make it for ‘everyone’ which is the worst audience to choose. Making it for everyone prevents many choices you could otherwise make to appeal to YOUR audience.

In any case, I am saying far more than I intended. Anet needs to not be asking about the game mode though. That won’t solve anything.. not until they begin to ask and dive into more important and deeper questions about their overall gameplay.

Never played gw1 but I hear good things of this gvg system. If they can port it into gw2 with possibly new maps or whatever, I’m game. I suggest to keep the player amount in the game mode an odd number so as to promote rotations and outnumbered situations like it is currently. Since this mode would seem to have larger maps than the current 5 man conquest, I suggest 7 players would suffice. As for the automated tourneys both (what I would assume) weekly and monthly, it seems like a more controlled version of the old gw2 pvp system with paid and free tourneys. I would like to see something like this in the future on top of the current weeklies held by mistpedia.

no game should have more than 5 players. It starts becoming a “zerg” which most of spvpers including me don’t like.

Im not sure about the flag though. Its just encourage Bunkers like in Wildstar.

I hope GW3 will be GW1 with better graphics. Because this game doesn’t allow any depth without a 180° turnaround.

I honestly bought GW2 because I thought it would be improved version of the original.

Sadly, it only left me dissapointed and after almost 2 years I have lost any hope in this game.
If they decide the revive GvG I may get my hope back and start playing again.

+1

Love the idea specially with it being “guildwars” i too bough the game expecting varied game modes for pvp. I love conquest dont get me wrong but not conquest all the time. Iv been seeing some really good suggestions in these forums lately for different modes that are really well thought out. Id love to see this implemented.

To resume: please give has the GvG we have saw in GW1.

And you are right man. That was amazing…anyway, with this gameplay style, this is impossible.

Of course it’s possible, we don’t need exactly the same gameplay as gw, teamfights would be similar of what we got on tournies atm with a lot of place where we can kite
The only one mechanic that would be a bit different is the split strategy in ennemy base but I really don’t see where the gameplay is a pb

GvG from GW1 has already been recreated in GW2 by Bloodytech:

A lot of us have been asking for GvG since release, and it’s good to see high-ranked players like Cyn joining in with our request because it increases the chance that ANet will listen! It was a brilliant game mode: balanced, symmetrical, with multiple routes to victory to suit different kinds of team comps, just short enough to not be draining but just long enough to feel epic. And it had enough flexibility to allow brilliant plays to pull victory out of the jaws of defeat. I still maintain to this day that LUM vs WM game 2 (Burning Isle), from the first championship, was the most exciting half hour of competition I’ve ever watched.

However, I want to discuss one aspect of GW1 GvG which I don’t know how to implement in GW2: the flag stand.

(Note: experienced GW1 GvGers can skip the italicised part)
For those who didn’t play the original, holding the flag stand for 2 minutes got you a morale boost. This did 2 things: it recharged your res signet, and it removed 10% death penalty. Death Penalty was a big deal in GvG: if you got to -60%, you didn’t respawn automatically, you could only be brought back with a res signet – and res signets could only be used once, and didn’t recharge unless you got a morale boost! So if you forced the enemy to use up all their res signets then you could wipe them, cause they wouldn’t be able to bring their dead back up right away and they’d be fighting outnumbered, and then you can start getting them down to -60% so they don’t respawn at all and they’ll be outnumbered. And if you’ve taken deaths and are behind, you just need to steal a morale boost and you can turn the game around! I’ve seen a lot of GvGs turn around cause the lone survivor from your team managed to sneak a flag out, causing everyone to respawn simultaneously and wiping the enemy team while they were fighting the NPCs in your base.

This makes the flag stand a very big deal, and forces teams to fight there. That’s a genius bit of game design, because remember: the game is actually won and lost not in the middle, but in each other’s bases!, but the power of the morale boost FORCES both teams to contest the middle instead! Without it, the game would become a race to gank each other’s lord the fastest.

This wouldn’t work if directly translated in GW2: we don’t need a skill to bring back dead teammates: anyone can revive, not just from downed but from completely defeated. So you don’t need the morale boost. Sure, you can make it give powerful combat buffs instead, like Cyn’s idea of having it recharge all your skills. But a combat buff isn’t gonna turn a game around for the team that suffered the first wipe. What if, for instance, the team still hasn’t respawned when the morale boost comes around? The buff you get gets wasted then!

I don’t pretend to know the best way to implement morale boosts either, but I think they should be linked to the respawning mechanism, like they were in GW1. I don’t think the specifics should be the same as in GW1 of course (2’ respawn counter is MASSIVE for instance, and the morale boost doesn’t need to come from a flag stand – it could be a buff you commune with like in Temple, or a Conquest-style point you need to cap), but we should come up with something analogous that takes account of GW2’s faster-paced gameplay, greater self-sufficiency of each team member, and overall higher damage.

One idea could be to tweak the way Downed Penalty works, and to link it to respawn timer. Have Downed Penalty not expire after 60" like it normally does, but accumulate until you remove it, and make you respawn from defeated slower for each point of Downed Penalty (maybe 30" for 2, 60" for 3, and not respawning automatically for 3?). Each morale boost would remove 1 point, or give a buff to people with no DP. Possibly also allow killing enemy players to remove a point, though in that case you’d need to put a time limit on how credit is assigned, cause currently if you tag an enemy they’re tagged practically forever.

I really don’t know, this is just one idea that ensures we get back the fundamentals, and actually implementing it and balancing it just right won’t be trivial. The tl;dr is: YES to GvG, but with a morale boost system that is game-changing enough to force the teams to contest the centre, as in the original, or it won’t work.

What we did for the Bloodytech GvG tourney is rework the entire GvG system with Capture points

The rules are simple:

- Killing the Guild Lord wins you the match BUT

- You must capture the middle node once, before you can kill the Lord. If you do not capture the middle node before attacking the Lord, your team will be disqualified.

- You only need to Capture the Middle NODE ONCE.

- Even if the middle node is neutralized away from your favour, you are still allowed to kill the Lord as long as you’ve captured it before it was neutralized.

- You can only capture the middle node, capturing the side nodes will see your team disqualified.

- The match is set to run for 15 minutes. If by the end of those 15 minutes, no team kills the Guild Lord, the team with the highest score from holding the middle node wins the match.

Note that this entire idea is based on Legacy of the Foefire and if we were to introduce the Flag mechanic, this is how I think it should be implemented IF our take on GW2’s GvG is taken up;

- The Flag spawns 2 minutes into the match at the location of the Keep Lord.

- Grabbing the Flag makes you move 40% slower similar to the orb in spirit watch but you still have access to your skills, swiftness and vigor. Though teleporting with the flag drops it.

- Getting the Flag Successfully into the centre of the point will see the point decapped and slowly capped in your favour. This auto-cap will take 2 minutes to finish and will go on even if the enemy team is sitting on the node. It also requires that you have at least 1 person on the node to keep the auto-cap going. If your whole team stays off the Node for more than 5 seconds, the auto-cap switches off and your flag will be reset.

- The enemy team can counter the Flag Runner by killing or keeping him off the node or making him drop the flag and then sending the Flag Back. Or instead they could grab their own flag and counter the auto-cap with their own.

- If there is a flag already placed in the centre, the team with the flag in the centre, does not have a new flag until the flag in the centre has been removed by the other team.

Personally I’ve played this gvg gameplay in 6v6, there were some tournaments running about it.
That’s great but imo, if you want to play a real gvg, you can’t play on a map like foefire.
It’s like the “pseudo gvg” in wvsw, that’s not what we can qualify as a real gvg mode.

There’s only the half of what a gvg gameplay would have to be and when we are all asking for a gvg, I think that we are not asking only for a new gameplay without points, we are all asking for a new mode with differents mechanismes like automated tournaments, monthly tournies, rpoints that can be exchanged against every skin in the game, esport, rating, tittles.

The actual teamq ladder is a kind of guild rating imo but it is not explained really well they should work on it about a real guild rating, but that’s cool because they already got a base, teamqladder.

This gvg gameplay on foefire is cool, but I think it’s just like a beta gvg gameplay that we play awating for the real gvg

Up, please Anet have a look !
Again, this topic is not only about the gw gvg but also about rating system and automated tournament system concerning a possible future gvg game mode

Friendly, Cyn