Guild Wars 2

Doesn’t that just say something about this how much fun this game is to watch! So many people enjoy watching aswell as playing right!? this game is totally E-sports material.

While Lol an actual e-sports, pvp game has 177k viewers.

gw2 is still not an esport.
since 2 days ago community has restored a little faith in anet. now i think we can wait till end of february.

I don’t watch LoL so I assume that means it sucks since I don’t watch it.

Dota/LoL is boring as kitten to watch. The only reason it’s popular is because it has reached that e-sports echelon, and because it’s F2P. I personally find watching GW2 games more entertaining than most other games. The problem with GW2 is that it lacks all the features needed to make it go competitive.

Shukran.4851:

gw2 is still not an esport.
since 2 days ago community has restored a little faith in anet. now i think we can wait till end of february.

What happened 2 days ago?

Chi Malady.2015:

Dota/LoL is boring as kitten to watch. The only reason it’s popular is because it has reached that e-sports echelon, and because it’s F2P. I personally find watching GW2 games more entertaining than most other games. The problem with GW2 is that it lacks all the features needed to make it go competitive.

Well the majority and myself have deemed LOL and DOTA2 more entertaining to watch and better as an esports and the majority are what e-sports happen.

GW2 will probably never get off the ground in terms of competitive pvp. Little podcasts with developers who completely disregard the issues raised isn’t helping.

How many viewers were watching LoL 5 months after it launched?

less than 281. my guess is closer to zero.

Chi Malady.2015:

Shukran.4851:

gw2 is still not an esport.
since 2 days ago community has restored a little faith in anet. now i think we can wait till end of february.

What happened 2 days ago?

http://dulfy.net/2013/01/17/gw2-dev-livestream-jan-17-transcript/

Chi Malady.2015:

Shukran.4851:

gw2 is still not an esport.
since 2 days ago community has restored a little faith in anet. now i think we can wait till end of february.

What happened 2 days ago?

You know when a property scam happens, the target starts to smell something odd going on rings up the people who are scamming them, and they say “yeah Mr Smith, the Nigerian Prince is in a meeting but he is sorting out your 8 billion euros as we speak, your money should be in your account in a few days”. Kinda like that.

But seriously, just like that. No super serious, the developers did an interview type thing in which they said custom arenas are coming, and some ranking and matchmaking. You know, the things they said would be in release. All vague about it as well, no dates, no real info, nothing new. Much like the Nigerian scammers, they know that once people have invested they will eat any little tid bit of info as “its going to be awesome”.

basically all the features they promised for release, will be in the next expansion out later this year, once no one is playing PVP anymore.

@Dalilndica

People are playing Spvp, new people are playing spvp, I saw about 5-10 low ranked players yesterday while pugging.

When people watch a stream, i’m going to take a guess and say 80% of the time people are watching for the streamer, 20% for the actual game. It’s about time (For the game and the streamer) and getting your name out there, and it’s pretty clear that certain streamers are growing, relatively slowly, but growing nonetheless.

You could also look at something like Street Fighter 4, currently has almost 12k viewers for regional’s, 2nd top channel has 74 viewers…

One thing you’re right about is that the game isn’t Esports material, not yet at least, it needs things like spectator mode/ladder/custom arenas first

Kakeru.2873:

Chi Malady.2015:

Dota/LoL is boring as kitten to watch. The only reason it’s popular is because it has reached that e-sports echelon, and because it’s F2P. I personally find watching GW2 games more entertaining than most other games. The problem with GW2 is that it lacks all the features needed to make it go competitive.

Well the majority and myself have deemed LOL and DOTA2 more entertaining to watch and better as an esports and the majority are what e-sports happen.

GW2 will probably never get off the ground in terms of competitive pvp. Little podcasts with developers who completely disregard the issues raised isn’t helping.

GW2 has much more exciting gameplay than LoL. LoL is more popular by virtue of the fact that:

It is F2P
It came out 3 years ago
It has all the features needed for it to be an e-sport

You can bet that GW2 would be just as popular if it was F2P, was released 3 years ago, and had features like spectator mode and ladder. The lethargic click-to-move gameplay of MOBAs is far from exciting to watch.

You underestimate how popular something becomes when it’s free (just look at TF2).

I may correct, 600 views right now.

Chi Malady.2015:

Kakeru.2873:

Chi Malady.2015:

Dota/LoL is boring as kitten to watch. The only reason it’s popular is because it has reached that e-sports echelon, and because it’s F2P. I personally find watching GW2 games more entertaining than most other games. The problem with GW2 is that it lacks all the features needed to make it go competitive.

Well the majority and myself have deemed LOL and DOTA2 more entertaining to watch and better as an esports and the majority are what e-sports happen.

GW2 will probably never get off the ground in terms of competitive pvp. Little podcasts with developers who completely disregard the issues raised isn’t helping.

GW2 has much more exciting gameplay than LoL. LoL is more popular by virtue of the fact that:

It is F2P
It came out 3 years ago
It has all the features needed for it to be an e-sport

You can bet that GW2 would be just as popular if it was F2P, was released 3 years ago, and had features like spectator mode and ladder. The lethargic click-to-move gameplay of MOBAs is far from exciting to watch.

You underestimate how popular something becomes when it’s free (just look at TF2).

Or like me any every single friend i know that has played and now quit GW2 , LOL is funner. Just because you don’t find it fun doesn’t mean it isn’t it’s a great game.

Though that being subjective, statistics show that lol has a bigger fanbase and player base which isn’t subjective. You may not understand or find lol or dota find or interesting but the fact is they are.

@Dalindica, I’m pretty Anet flat out said these features wouldn’t be out at release but they’d try to put them in quickly afterwards… So yeah…

And watching LoL (and playing it) is kinda dull outside of the 4 seconds of team fighting which mostly consists of “Who has the stronger Ultis?!?!?” And then it goes back to watching them kill minions….

I’m curious why people feel their faith in ANet is restored after watching the recent twitch streams. I tuned in to watch, saw three dudes that looked like they just got out of bed on a saturday going on and on about the same old stuff they’ve been saying for months, and then promptly turned it off again. So what did I miss?

As someone who played 1000+ matches of LoL and has clocked at least 600h of GW2 I can say that comparing them is comparing apples to oranges.

@ Kakeru : still waiting for you to tell me how many viewers LoL streams had when there were no spectator mode/rankeds/championships.

Kakeru.2873:

Doesn’t that just say something about this how much fun this game is to watch! So many people enjoy watching aswell as playing right!? this game is totally E-sports material.

While Lol an actual e-sports, pvp game has 177k viewers.

League of Legends has 177k viewers. Well, grats. That’s whats saddening. A terrible game has a lot more viewers than a great game. How many viewers did it have before spectating clients and teen-fanboyism spread?

Viewer-count doesn’t equal fun to watch or good game. And especially not in comparison to other games. Twitch is a poor site to judge anything from.

But I’m absolutely amazed and on the verge of crying, that 177000 people actually watch League of Legends. What’s the world coming to..? That games like that is actually popular, and gems like Smite, SMNC, GW2 the likes remain in the dark.

But to be fair, there’s hardly any way for GW2 to be watched properly. A spectating client would work wonders. How could they even consider releasing the game without that, and without a ladder.

Whats the purpose of this topic.Do you feel good for quitting gw2 and focusing on lol when you look at these numbers and want us to bow before you for making the right choice??I dont get it!
Imo lol’s gameplay is boring and gw2 has more potential with fights going on all the time interesting turns and a lot of skill relatively to mobas..i dont care much why you disagree but nonetheless id like you to be more specific!
Why did you not only quit but also completely gave up hope of this becoming an esport ??

League of legends had a massive amount of views before spectator mode, what are you guys on about?

Dont tell me LoL had 150k viewers 5 month after launch.

Did I?

It did have far, far more viewers than gw2. I remember hotshotgg streaming with thousands of viewers a few months after release.

It also did not have the millions of sales gw2 had and the insane amount of viewers gw2 had at the start, search for ‘’guild wars 2 pvp’’ for when the game was in its early stage (~60k views) and now videos release on youtube get 2000

There’s a major league tournament going on today, which is why it has so many viewers. I’m not aware of any major GW2 tournaments happening today – if there were, you could bet there’d be a significant chunk of people watching.

Not sure what the point of this thread is, haha. I might as well point out that tomorrow, on championship Sunday, millions of people will be watching the NFL and almost no one will be watching baseball. Disregard the fact that the MLB is in its off season – it’s a condemnation of how far baseball has fallen!

: P

People aren’t watching because people aren’t playing. People aren’t playing because of a lack of things like a ranking system, custom arenas, spectator.

Bunkers are not a problem anymore. People are not running 2-3 of them every game. Having 1 bunker isn’t a bad thing, but yes they might be a little too powerful at the moment. However, there are builds that destroy bunkers. Maybe you should play those.

Can we please stop making threads and posts like these? They’re pointless.

LoL took a long time to become popular and get the kind of views it has.

GW2 can definitely get there. Right now, it has none of the features enabling twitch viewership, but they are coming and very soon.

Personally I prefer watching GW2 pvp videos – and I think many MMO players from all MMO games would prefer to watch GW2 rather than DOTA or LOL.

MOBA / FPS / RTS are the current esports formats.

GW2 is the only game that can add MMO to that list.

Wolfheart.1938:

How many viewers were watching LoL 5 months after it launched?

did lol have over 3 million accounts after 5 months?

You also have to realize that most of the streamers aren’t actually doing sPvP. Whenever I’ve tuned into a GW2 stream on twitch it’s usually some streamer either leveling, running fractals, or derping around in WvW.

If GW2 adopts an actual skill based ranking system I guarantee you’ll see an influx of sPvP players and possibly a jump in stream views. If it weren’t for MLG showcasing LoL on a massive scale and providing stipends and payouts for top teams, you wouldn’t even see streamers for LoL.

My point is, you need a consistent tournament setup in order for a game to grow and inherit high stream activity. You have to have paid professional players streaming consistently. Starcraft II succeeded the same way.

Essentially, give it some time fellas.

xiv.7136:

LoL took a long time to become popular and get the kind of views it has.

GW2 can definitely get there. Right now, it has none of the features enabling twitch viewership, but they are coming and very soon.

Personally I prefer watching GW2 pvp videos – and I think many MMO players from all MMO games would prefer to watch GW2 rather than DOTA or LOL.

MOBA / FPS / RTS are the current esports formats.

GW2 is the only game that can add MMO to that list.

You are thinking so short sighted.

1st) I was in the LoL closed beta. Yes, it started out small (as many games do) but the community and excitement CONTINUED to grow. Similar to WoW when it launched, it only grew, and grew, and grew. Just over two years later, LoL became the fastest growing game in the world. It is currently the most played game in Korea and has held that post for almost a year.

2) Can we honestly say that GW2 continues to grow? GW2 had over 6k viewers a day on twitch when it first launched. They would watch Sockersot and other people on team Paradigm along with the Alpha Collective crew, like Erho and Powerr. Since then, many of those streamers have quit and now gw2 never seems to get more then a few hundred streamers at peak times.

3) MMO players only like to watch THEIR MMO. MMO PvP is so niche, they won’t know wtf is going on unless they play that game and know the meta, or have a general idea of it. Even then, MMOs are not viewer friendly and are constantly being tweaked and evolving. Its the reason why WoW’s arena only flourished for 2 years on the E-sport tournament scene.

I predict GW2’s SPVP will improve greatly once the ranking and proper ladder system are implemented. But, GW2’s launch came and went. The online gaming community as a whole is very finicky and moves on from games fairly quickly. The market is too saturated for them to give games a second chance if their first impression wasn’t positive.

With how easy it is to revive in this game, it will never be considered a competitive e-sport.

With the boring Conquest + Bunker dynamic, it will never be fun to watch.

Dee Jay.2460:

With how easy it is to revive in this game, it will never be considered a competitive e-sport.

With the boring Conquest + Bunker dynamic, it will never be fun to watch.

And that’s a great opinion. I bet other games are boring to watch when you don’t understand the competitive scene in those games, either.

Dee Jay.2460:

With how easy it is to revive in this game, it will never be considered a competitive e-sport.

With the boring Conquest + Bunker dynamic, it will never be fun to watch.

The downed state system in this game is one of the most exciting mechanics. So much drama can occur around a downed player. Even with the bunker metagame, GW2 moves much faster than any MOBA.

Why is Guild Wars 2 being tried as an esport when its not even there. Anyone can tell you it’s not there yet. Anet is only developing it as one.

It will eventually make it. LoL was not instantly popular it took a year or so for it to make in to esports.

EDIT: LoL is having a tournament atm and it why it is having so many viewers atm on twitch IEM Katowice.

Follidus.8027:

Dee Jay.2460:

With how easy it is to revive in this game, it will never be considered a competitive e-sport.

With the boring Conquest + Bunker dynamic, it will never be fun to watch.

And that’s a great opinion. I bet other games are boring to watch when you don’t understand the competitive scene in those games, either.

theres nothing to figure out with 3 point conquest, just nobody watches it. close games are rare with snowballing, even number fights are rare and most of the match is about moving around, not fighting, more boringness.

Sprawl.3891:

Follidus.8027:

Dee Jay.2460:

With how easy it is to revive in this game, it will never be considered a competitive e-sport.

With the boring Conquest + Bunker dynamic, it will never be fun to watch.

And that’s a great opinion. I bet other games are boring to watch when you don’t understand the competitive scene in those games, either.

theres nothing to figure out with 3 point conquest, just nobody watches it. close games are rare with snowballing, even number fights are rare and most of the match is about moving around, not fighting, more boringness.

What are MOBAs about?

Instead of capturing and defending points, you’re attacking and defending buildings. Instead of moving manually, you’re clicking to move.

The objectives are the same. The only difference is that GW2 is a lot more fast-paced and exciting. The gameplay is much more dynamic with dodging and being able to use the environment much more. It takes 20 minutes for anything interesting to happen in a MOBA. The bulk of the game is players killing NPCs. Watching a MOBA is like watching an RTS, except every player only has one unit.

GW2 has the superior gameplay mechanics (I don’t see how this can be disputed). It just lacks the features and the F2P model.

Sprawl.3891:

Follidus.8027:

Dee Jay.2460:

With how easy it is to revive in this game, it will never be considered a competitive e-sport.

With the boring Conquest + Bunker dynamic, it will never be fun to watch.

And that’s a great opinion. I bet other games are boring to watch when you don’t understand the competitive scene in those games, either.

theres nothing to figure out with 3 point conquest, just nobody watches it. close games are rare with snowballing, even number fights are rare and most of the match is about moving around, not fighting, more boringness.

There’s nothing to figure out? This game has yet to be figured out. It’s just really easy for people to fall into the mindset of certain things being “required” to win, or they’re getting “hard countered” instead of playing better/thinking of something new.

This game just isn’t very interesting to watch. I’ve really tried, but there’s just nothing there. The effects are so flashy that it’s hard to see what’s going on and if you don’t know the game extremely well it’s impossible to have any understanding of whats important, most streamers can’t stream at high quality (presumably because of the system reqs), and it lacks virtually all of the intensity of other esports because a single death doesn’t have anywhere near as much weight as other games.

GW2 tpvp is equivalent to League of Legends Dominion, and how many people do you see watching that?

the same reasons why there are no twitch viewers are the same reason why me and many others are not playing til something happens.

1. gw2 has NO build diversity, thieves are backstab/pistol whip, warriors are 100b, mages are d/d, guardians are bunkers, necros are wells, egis are useless, rangers are trap, mesmers are shatter. also no team diversity most teams consist of the same classes. leading to watching and playing the SAME thing every time its boring and uninteresting.

2. most people that would watch gw2 streams are all playing trying to get their paids in because they only go on for a couple hours a night. LoL on the other hand goes 24/7 even during holidays.

3. gw2’s lack of updates has made the game boring unbalanced and easily exploitable. you can back anet up as much as you want (i did for a very long time) and think that a game 5months into release wont see many updates or changes right away but youres wrong. Anet is probably the worst company i have ever come across in a video game. i played league of legends during the 1st 5 months of release. a FREE TO PLAY company was pumping out balance patches almost every week during the 1st 5 months and “the most anticipated game of 2012” 60$ a player has done close to nothing.

in a nut shell: gw2 wont be an esport because anet doesnt care anymore and it will never have the diversity that these esport games have so even if it does it wont be a big title because its not fun to watch.

Kakeru.2873:

Well the majority and myself have deemed LOL and DOTA2 more entertaining to watch and better as an esports and the majority are what e-sports happen.

GW2 will probably never get off the ground in terms of competitive pvp. Little podcasts with developers who completely disregard the issues raised isn’t helping.

There is no majority that watch LOL, not even the majority of LOL players watch it, let alone when you consider the number of people who play computer games, it is dull as ditch water, really go get someone sit them down in front of LOL and see how excited they are after 15 mins of whack-a-mole and farming, two of the most boring concepts in video games.

But then that goes for video games in general, they are more fun to play than watch, for most Twitch streams the biggest factors are the size of the playerbase (LOL has 32 million active accounts each month, WoW PVE gets more views than most “competitve” games, etc) and how entertaining the person is, look at GW2, Teldo is the most watched guy when it comes to GW2, he plays probably the least played class, but people find him entertaining.

Sylosi.6503:

Kakeru.2873:

Well the majority and myself have deemed LOL and DOTA2 more entertaining to watch and better as an esports and the majority are what e-sports happen.

GW2 will probably never get off the ground in terms of competitive pvp. Little podcasts with developers who completely disregard the issues raised isn’t helping.

There is no majority that watch LOL, not even the majority of LOL players watch it, let alone when you consider the number of people who play computer games, it is dull as ditch water, really go get someone sit them down in front of LOL and see how excited they are after 15 mins of whack-a-mole and farming, two of the most boring concepts in video games.

But then that goes for video games in general, they are more fun to play than watch, for most Twitch streams the biggest factors are the size of the playerbase (LOL has 32 million active accounts each month, WoW PVE gets more views than most “competitve” games, etc) and how entertaining the person is, look at GW2, Teldo is the most watched guy when it comes to GW2, he plays probably the least played class, but people find him entertaining.

This guy again… : /. League is boring to watch, boring to play. Yet people go to watch it’s tournaments and watch it online. Please show me a link and give me evidence, and where you get this? Please.

Not sure what ur asking for eonx But league of legends has 10’s of thousands of viewers non stop on twitch tv.

@daydream Read the quote, the guy is a joke, and is saying eports is a joke because it’s not “popular”. I just want evidence on the numbers he is claiming, currently there is 200k people watching IEM Katawice for LoL, and probably even more actually there.

And he was saying most esports are boring to watch…

The fraction of the ppl who play it to watch it is really low, but in terms of absolute numbers, esports is quite popular.

EoNxBoNx.9213:

This guy again… : /. League is boring to watch, boring to play. Yet people go to watch it’s tournaments and watch it online. Please show me a link and give me evidence, and where you get this? Please.

This guy again :/, what are you on about, are you incapable of looking up that according to Riot they got about 8m viewers over the course of their finals and have about 32m active accounts each month, so at best only a 1/4 of their own playerbase bother to watch what is the equivalent of their Superbowl, which part of that is confusing you?

Viewing “Esports” is not popular, even amongst people that play the game, let alone people that don’t, and that is LoL, the most popular “esport”, the viewing figures for other “esports” are much lower, get over it.

Follidus.8027:

Sprawl.3891:

Follidus.8027:

Dee Jay.2460:

With how easy it is to revive in this game, it will never be considered a competitive e-sport.

With the boring Conquest + Bunker dynamic, it will never be fun to watch.

And that’s a great opinion. I bet other games are boring to watch when you don’t understand the competitive scene in those games, either.

theres nothing to figure out with 3 point conquest, just nobody watches it. close games are rare with snowballing, even number fights are rare and most of the match is about moving around, not fighting, more boringness.

There’s nothing to figure out? This game has yet to be figured out. It’s just really easy for people to fall into the mindset of certain things being “required” to win, or they’re getting “hard countered” instead of playing better/thinking of something new.

what im saying is to a casual all you need to know is blue team is bunkering two points and sending an extra person to eveery fight so they win and red team is only able to bunker 1 point. that’s 90% of matches. I know you’re on a team so you desperately want this game to take off but it never will its just not fun enough to play/watch. ooh powerr tried something new and ran two op eles, gaiz meta is so deep!

Shukran.4851:

Chi Malady.2015:

Shukran.4851:

gw2 is still not an esport.
since 2 days ago community has restored a little faith in anet. now i think we can wait till end of february.

What happened 2 days ago?

http://dulfy.net/2013/01/17/gw2-dev-livestream-jan-17-transcript/

This new tournament version will be on Temple of Silent Storm map (this map has a lot of tournament potential).

hahahaha

classic J-Sharp move

Sprawl.3891:

Follidus.8027:

Sprawl.3891:

Follidus.8027:

Dee Jay.2460:

With how easy it is to revive in this game, it will never be considered a competitive e-sport.

With the boring Conquest + Bunker dynamic, it will never be fun to watch.

And that’s a great opinion. I bet other games are boring to watch when you don’t understand the competitive scene in those games, either.

theres nothing to figure out with 3 point conquest, just nobody watches it. close games are rare with snowballing, even number fights are rare and most of the match is about moving around, not fighting, more boringness.

There’s nothing to figure out? This game has yet to be figured out. It’s just really easy for people to fall into the mindset of certain things being “required” to win, or they’re getting “hard countered” instead of playing better/thinking of something new.

what im saying is to a casual all you need to know is blue team is bunkering two points and sending an extra person to eveery fight so they win and red team is only able to bunker 1 point. that’s 90% of matches. I know you’re on a team so you desperately want this game to take off but it never will its just not fun enough to play/watch. ooh powerr tried something new and ran two op eles, gaiz meta is so deep!

Please explain to me how the concept of MOBAs is any different. I’m still waiting.

Sylosi.6503:

EoNxBoNx.9213:

This guy again… : /. League is boring to watch, boring to play. Yet people go to watch it’s tournaments and watch it online. Please show me a link and give me evidence, and where you get this? Please.

This guy again :/, what are you on about, are you incapable of looking up that according to Riot they got about 8m viewers over the course of their finals and have about 32m active accounts each month, so at best only a 1/4 of their own playerbase bother to watch what is the equivalent of their Superbowl, which part of that is confusing you?

Viewing “Esports” is not popular, even amongst people that play the game, let alone people that don’t, and that is LoL, the most popular “esport”, the viewing figures for other “esports” are much lower, get over it.

People watch games that they play (so that they can get better)
People play LoL because it’s free

I watch footage of a lot of games that I play, and it’s never because I enjoy watching other people play a video game. It’s because they are better than me at the game and I can learn something new from watching them.

Once again, I have to reiterate the importance of F2P in attracting a large population. GW2 would have 10x the PvP population if it was free, guaranteed. TF2 went from empty servers, to millions of players overnight after going F2P.

My – last – hopes: custom arenas allowing us to do deathmatches (gw1 arena basically) and remove the down state.

Semibrucelee.9415:

My – last – hopes: custom arenas allowing us to do deathmatches (gw1 arena basically) and remove the down state.

The downed state gives this game so much flavour. Why would you want to get rid of that?