Guild Wars 2

Yes another one of these threads. First off I main a warrior but I also have other characters I like to play to spice things up. The facts 1) healing singet plus adrenal heal which most warrior builds have gives you a lil over 500hp per second. 2) This healing singet heal works every single second the warrior takes dmg adrenal every 3 so it is used to its absolute best efficancy all the time. 3) this combo works regardless of armor setup so even zerker gets 500hp per second.

Now this is what gets to me. When I play my other classes unless I go with zerker trinket in spvp I only put out around 500-700 dmg per second and have cooldowns. So unless I play say my zerker Mesmer shatter build my best hope is to tick away 100-200 hp off the warriors 25ish k health per second. When you add this good passive regen on top of the fact that warriors have probably the best condition clearing great stability upkeep and best mobility it just seems pretty clear to me there is a problem.

I am fine with a warrior being able to get over 500hp per second passive regen if they gave up something in return like for instance had to be wearing cleric gear to get it. Right now though there isn’t a reason to play anything other than zerker warrior. They still have high armor high health high passive regen high mobility high stability high condi clearing. If healing singet isn’t op like some warriors claim why can’t I have it on my other classes. I would give up the new crappy aed on my engi any day for healing singet as an example. But healing singet would be op on any other class right? But its not op on a warrior?

500-700 dps seems terribly low. Your auto attacks do more than that, without even using your other skills/utilities.

I would give up the new crappy aed on my engi any day for healing singet as an example. But healing singet would be op on any other class right? But its not op on a warrior?

Engi’s can bunker down better than a warrior because of their near-perma protection. Give healing Signet to a class that doesn’t have that and it’s not going to do much for them. Mesmers signet is just as good. The base healing is slightly worse with three illusions active but it has a stronger active heal AND restores all Phantasm skills.

And most othr classes can avoid damage using various utilities. Thief can cloak constantly or evade spam, guardians have blocks and reflects and multiple other utilities that mitigate damage, Mesmers have illusion spam making it hard to target them. Minionmancers are a real joy to play against…Engi’s can bunker down better than just about anyone, and their mine spamming is nigh insufferably when you’re trying to stay on a point. A real pain for any melee class to deal with. Ranger also has minions as well as plenty of evades to spam. So yes, every class has their perks. A warrior is meant to take it all to the face, they need a lot of survivability.

This is just another whine thread that blows everything out of proportion with no significance to anything. Especially since the topic has been beaten half to death already. Moving along.

PS Zerker warrior isn’t anywhere near the best warrior build. And their surviveability sucks.

Now imagine if he had regen and soothing mist AND battle presence up that would be like over 1000 hp/sec so OP nerf pls

Yeah, I have noticed that when I resort to Shortbow on my Thief, I do effectively no damage against a Warrior with Healing Signet.

Auto-attacks hit for roughly 700 on average, even on a Power-build, and occur slightly less frequently than 1/second. Maybe once every 1.3 seconds.

Anyway, this effectively makes Warriors impervious to the Shortbow auto-attack and many other attrition builds. I guess that’s another reason why even the condition builds burst nowadays.

Well looking at healing signet alone is wrong. Together with the traits in the defense tree (mainly cleansing ire and adrenal health) and the high armor, warriors gets his really good surviviability from.
Maybe switching/changing some traits would be better than nerfing hs.

Muchacho.2390:

Well looking at healing signet alone is wrong. Together with the traits in the defense tree (mainly cleansing ire and adrenal health) and the high armor, warriors gets his really good surviviability from.
Maybe switching/changing some traits would be better than nerfing hs.

oh it is all fine actually.
warriors who trait defensively should be harder to take down.

those people are complaining because they cannot kill warriors fast enough.

good burst damage + conditions overload plus good team mates, the warrior will go down fast.

You can move it all you like, but Healing Signet is definitely over-powered.

You can compare it to other, more reasonable passive heals like Signet of Malice. That Signet heals significantly less in almost all situations (albeit some exceptions) and requires the Thief to constantly attack and deal damage.

On the other hand, every time the Warrior stuns, every time he uses an Immunity, he is effectively healing himself. 4 seconds immunity don’t just means 4 seconds of taking no damage, it means 2000 HP healed as well.

Every stun is not only a CC, it is also 1000 HP healed.

This effect is most noticeable when the Warrior chooses to disengage. Even with 10% HP left the Warrior will easily survive because of how difficult it is to out-DPS Healing Signet while the Warrior is running.

I think better than nerf it straight-up, I’d prefer to see it attached to some sort of conditional effect like Signet of Malice. For example what if Healing Signet only “ticked” while you’re attacked?

Or what if, like Adrenal Healing, it scaled with your Adrenaline levels from 200-400 passive healing.

Or make it so it ticks stronger, the more conditions you have applied to you.

You know, something like that that grants more opportunities for counter-play is what it really needs.

Deimos Tel Arin.7391:

Muchacho.2390:

Well looking at healing signet alone is wrong. Together with the traits in the defense tree (mainly cleansing ire and adrenal health) and the high armor, warriors gets his really good surviviability from.
Maybe switching/changing some traits would be better than nerfing hs.

oh it is all fine actually.
warriors who trait defensively should be harder to take down.

those people are complaining because they cannot kill warriors fast enough.

good burst damage + conditions overload plus good team mates, the warrior will go down fast.

Yes and no. If you look at the Hambow build you see it has cc, damage and surivivability all in one build (the other “op” builds/classes have the same).
So at one point Anet has to nerf something and buff something else in order to make those build weaker without weakening the weaker builds…

Dee Jay.2460:

This effect is most noticeable when the Warrior chooses to disengage.

if the warrior leaves then you have already won the fight.

now go and capture that point!

Muchacho.2390:

Yes and no. If you look at the Hambow build you see it has cc, damage and surivivability all in one build (the other “op” builds/classes have the same).
So at one point Anet has to nerf something and buff something else in order to make those build weaker without weakening the weaker builds…

well i thought the hammer damage was severely nerfed with the 10 dec 2013 patch?

long bow combustion shot damage was reduced by 15% overall as well.
only pulses 4 times now.

The problem with healing signet is that by itself it is way better than anyone else’s passive heal in this game. Let’s compare shall we (straight from the wiki):
warriors:
healing signet: 392 health a second and a 3,275 active.

gaurdians:
don’t have a passive heal skill (as in slot 6)

engineers:
don’t have a traditional passive heal.

ranger:
water spirit isn’t a traditional passive heal and it’s rng anyway.

thief:
signet of malice: heals 133 on attack and 3,275 active healing. No way can you attack 4 times in one second to get more healing per second than a warrior unless you are using dagger storm, but that’s a small outlying case.

mesmer:
signet of ether: gain health every few seconds based on the number of active illusions you control. passive for 3 illusions is 980 health every 3 seconds which is 337 health a second and active is 5,560. The problem with this is you need 3 illusions up at each interval. The warrior gets better healing without trying. Although the scaling on this skill is better. They might need to consider bumping this down it seems very strong.

necromancer:
signet of vampirism: passive is to heal 325 when struck by a foe with an icd of 1 second. active is to mark a foe and allied players will siphon life from that enemy. They siphon 392 health and deal 200 damage. The active also heals the necromancer for 3,960. I won’t talk too much about how bad this skill is, but it is impossible for the necromancer to heal more than the warrior per second because of the icd.

Elementalist:
signet of restoration: grants 168 health everytime you cast a spell(in pvp). and heals 3,275 on active. Some might say they can cast 2 skills a second on average to get to 336 a second, but their is an after cast time on almost every skill that makes the total time of each skill about one second. A good ele might also get 3 instants off in one second for a whopping 504 health, but they can’t maintain that at all. Most of the time they will be getting 168 health a second which isn’t anywhere close to healing signet.

I didn’t consider healing power because the point is to show a zerker warrior with this signet will outheal all other passive 6 skills in the game easily. When you start considering healing power you lose your investment in damage meaning you should get more healing, which is not what most warriors do. Also I didn’t even consider that many of these heals require you to do something to get them unlike the warriors. As you can see healing signet alone is super imbalanced and needs to be adjusted. Something around 200-250 health a second would be about what other classes have. Then they could buff the active to be useful and it would still be a good skill.

zapv.8051:

Something around 200-250 health a second would be about what other classes have. Then they could buff the active to be useful and it would still be a good skill.

no thanks. healing signet was originally around 200 health per second.

warriors drop like flies back then.
everyone focus down the warrior first in team fights because they were free kills.
now, people are mad because they cannot take down warriors as fast as before.

you forgot that warriors do not have illusions, death shroud, stealth, pets, minions etc.

the healing signet is a personal health regeneration skill that protects the warrior from puny damage. focused heavy burst damage plus extreme condition overload will still drop warriors very quickly.

however, in 1 vs 1 situation against professions doing puny non condition damage (most players) the warrior does appear to be quite powerful.

in team fights they still drop quickly provided enough burst and conditions is applied.

Deimos Tel Arin.7391:

zapv.8051:

Something around 200-250 health a second would be about what other classes have. Then they could buff the active to be useful and it would still be a good skill.

no thanks. healing signet was originally around 200 health per second.

warriors drop like flies back then.
everyone focus down the warrior first in team fights because they were free kills.
now, people are mad because they cannot take down warriors as fast as before.

you forgot that warriors do not have illusions, death shroud, stealth, pets, minions etc.

the healing signet is a personal health regeneration skill that protects the warrior from puny damage. focused heavy burst damage plus extreme condition overload will still drop warriors very quickly.

however, in 1 vs 1 situation against professions doing puny non condition damage (most players) the warrior does appear to be quite powerful.

in team fights they still drop quickly provided enough burst and conditions is applied.

They have heavy armor and high base health, they have other healing traits, and other healing skills. No one should get 392 health a second off of one healing skill. I understand that no one took it before because it was bad, but that in no way justifies how much stronger it is than any other passive healing skill. I understand that you don’t want the skill to be useless, but that’s why you buff the active so that it requires skill to use. There is no justification for how overpowered this skill is currently.

zapv.8051:

Deimos Tel Arin.7391:

zapv.8051:

Something around 200-250 health a second would be about what other classes have. Then they could buff the active to be useful and it would still be a good skill.

no thanks. healing signet was originally around 200 health per second.

warriors drop like flies back then.
everyone focus down the warrior first in team fights because they were free kills.
now, people are mad because they cannot take down warriors as fast as before.

you forgot that warriors do not have illusions, death shroud, stealth, pets, minions etc.

the healing signet is a personal health regeneration skill that protects the warrior from puny damage. focused heavy burst damage plus extreme condition overload will still drop warriors very quickly.

however, in 1 vs 1 situation against professions doing puny non condition damage (most players) the warrior does appear to be quite powerful.

in team fights they still drop quickly provided enough burst and conditions is applied.

They have heavy armor and high base health, they have other healing traits, and other healing skills. No one should get 392 health a second off of one healing skill. I understand that no one took it before because it was bad, but that in no way justifies how much stronger it is than any other passive healing skill. I understand that you don’t want the skill to be useless, but that’s why you buff the active so that it requires skill to use. There is no justification for how overpowered this skill is currently.

oh there is justification.

i’ll say it again.
warriors do not have illusions, death shroud, stealth, pets, minions etc.
they eat everything thrown at them unlike other professions.

Deimos Tel Arin.7391:

zapv.8051:

Something around 200-250 health a second would be about what other classes have. Then they could buff the active to be useful and it would still be a good skill.

no thanks. healing signet was originally around 200 health per second.

warriors drop like flies back then.
everyone focus down the warrior first in team fights because they were free kills.
now, people are mad because they cannot take down warriors as fast as before.

you forgot that warriors do not have illusions, death shroud, stealth, pets, minions etc.

the healing signet is a personal health regeneration skill that protects the warrior from puny damage. focused heavy burst damage plus extreme condition overload will still drop warriors very quickly.

however, in 1 vs 1 situation against professions doing puny non condition damage (most players) the warrior does appear to be quite powerful.

in team fights they still drop quickly provided enough burst and conditions is applied.

So your answer is to have a team help you take down the 1 warrior lol. Or use burst which as I said requires u to use a zerker trinket and become complete glass meanwhile a zerker warrior is not glass at all.

Chuck Zitto.2367:

zerker warrior is not glass at all.

perhaps there should be some kind of adjustments such that zerker warriors are made more glassier.

after all, if they are spec to do more damage, their defense and sustain should suffer.

Deimos Tel Arin.7391:

zapv.8051:

Deimos Tel Arin.7391:

zapv.8051:

Something around 200-250 health a second would be about what other classes have. Then they could buff the active to be useful and it would still be a good skill.

no thanks. healing signet was originally around 200 health per second.

warriors drop like flies back then.
everyone focus down the warrior first in team fights because they were free kills.
now, people are mad because they cannot take down warriors as fast as before.

you forgot that warriors do not have illusions, death shroud, stealth, pets, minions etc.

the healing signet is a personal health regeneration skill that protects the warrior from puny damage. focused heavy burst damage plus extreme condition overload will still drop warriors very quickly.

however, in 1 vs 1 situation against professions doing puny non condition damage (most players) the warrior does appear to be quite powerful.

in team fights they still drop quickly provided enough burst and conditions is applied.

They have heavy armor and high base health, they have other healing traits, and other healing skills. No one should get 392 health a second off of one healing skill. I understand that no one took it before because it was bad, but that in no way justifies how much stronger it is than any other passive healing skill. I understand that you don’t want the skill to be useless, but that’s why you buff the active so that it requires skill to use. There is no justification for how overpowered this skill is currently.

oh there is justification.

i’ll say it again.
warriors do not have illusions, death shroud, stealth, pets, minions etc.
they eat everything thrown at them unlike other professions.

No they only have endure pain zerker stance fear stomp balanced stance banner regen and great mobility with a gs or sword and bull rush to disengage from a fight to heal up while they running away

Deimos Tel Arin.7391:

zapv.8051:

Deimos Tel Arin.7391:

zapv.8051:

Something around 200-250 health a second would be about what other classes have. Then they could buff the active to be useful and it would still be a good skill.

no thanks. healing signet was originally around 200 health per second.

warriors drop like flies back then.
everyone focus down the warrior first in team fights because they were free kills.
now, people are mad because they cannot take down warriors as fast as before.

you forgot that warriors do not have illusions, death shroud, stealth, pets, minions etc.

the healing signet is a personal health regeneration skill that protects the warrior from puny damage. focused heavy burst damage plus extreme condition overload will still drop warriors very quickly.

however, in 1 vs 1 situation against professions doing puny non condition damage (most players) the warrior does appear to be quite powerful.

in team fights they still drop quickly provided enough burst and conditions is applied.

They have heavy armor and high base health, they have other healing traits, and other healing skills. No one should get 392 health a second off of one healing skill. I understand that no one took it before because it was bad, but that in no way justifies how much stronger it is than any other passive healing skill. I understand that you don’t want the skill to be useless, but that’s why you buff the active so that it requires skill to use. There is no justification for how overpowered this skill is currently.

they eat everything thrown at them unlike other professions.

This is the first time I can say someone is blatantly wrong on this forum. Other times I have disagreed with others, but your blatantly wrong. Your saying warriors don’t have blocks, or invulns or a skill that makes them immune to conditions for a period of time. Other classes you reference would love to have endure pain, or zerker stance, or a shield. Other classes would also love to have a zerker build that has insane survivability, cc, and damage, but they don’t because those classes are more balanced.

Deimos Tel Arin.7391:

Dee Jay.2460:

This effect is most noticeable when the Warrior chooses to disengage.

if the warrior leaves then you have already won the fight.

now go and capture that point!

Muchacho.2390:

Yes and no. If you look at the Hambow build you see it has cc, damage and surivivability all in one build (the other “op” builds/classes have the same).
So at one point Anet has to nerf something and buff something else in order to make those build weaker without weakening the weaker builds…

well i thought the hammer damage was severely nerfed with the 10 dec 2013 patch?

long bow combustion shot damage was reduced by 15% overall as well.
only pulses 4 times now.

Thats true, but i think pin down still need a longer casttime…

zapv.8051:

warriors don’t have blocks, or invulns or a skill that makes them immune to conditions for a period of time. Other classes you reference would love to have endure pain, or zerker stance, or a shield. Other classes would also love to have a zerker build that has insane survivability, cc, and damage, but they don’t because those classes are more balanced.

Chuck Zitto.2367:

No they only have endure pain zerker stance fear stomp balanced stance banner regen and great mobility with a gs or sword and bull rush to disengage from a fight to heal up while they running away

only if they choose to equip those utility skills. again, working as intended.
endure pain? 4 seconds. cripple, immobillze, stun, launch, knockdown works
60 seconds recharge

zerker stance? 8 seconds. burst damage or cc.

stability? only if they choose lyssa runes, or balanced stance or dolyak signet or rampage. all have long recharge times.

shield? only if they equip a shield as offhand. working as intended since shield is a defensive weapon.

stomp? cc skill. working as intended. 45 seconds recharge btw.

banner regen? only if they trait for banners and equip banners utility, again, working as intended.

mobility? only for long sword, greatsword. working as intended since those are melee weapons and gap closers are required.

bull rush is an utility skill with 20 seconds recharge.

do you remember that we can only choose 3 utility skills?
all your arguments are invalid.

do you guys even play warrior at all?

until you can play your warrior to be a god like status, other wise you all just want warriors to be free kills again.

Healing signet does kind of go against the stated goal of wanting heals to be a valuable resource. At least I believe that was a stated goal at some point. Anyway, yeah, passive survivability in this form is extremely bad for the health of the game.

Question do warriors even use other healing skills? It has been ages since i seen a warrior using a different heal. And its not like that warriors have only one allround heal skill (like necros).

I dont think hs is op but i think its a bad skill for the game (like many others) as it doesnt have a real counter play apart from poison. But poison is the bane of all healing skills, so…

Muchacho.2390:

Question do warriors even use other healing skills? It has been ages since i seen a warrior using a different heal. And its not like that warriors have only one allround heal skill (like necros).

I dont think hs is op but i think its a bad skill for the game (like many others) as it doesnt have a real counter play apart from poison. But poison is the bane of all healing skills, so…

This, other heals are not a consideration for warriors. Healing sig with adrenal health and easy access to regen give the warrior ridiculous heals per tick. Coupled with fantastic condi removal, there is no point in running other heals. That’s three stackable healing attributes, with BIG healing numbers.

No build needs more adrenaline gain from healing surge. And mending wounds has never been a good heal, while the new stance heal is only really viable in WvW Zerg play.

“mesmer:
signet of ether: gain health every few seconds based on the number of active illusions you control. passive for 3 illusions is 980 health every 3 seconds which is 337 health a second and active is 5,560. The problem with this is you need 3 illusions up at each interval. The warrior gets better healing without trying. Although the scaling on this skill is better. They might need to consider bumping this down it seems very strong.”

The solution its very simple:

Healing signet: heals based on the adrenaline you have. The same values that signet of mesmer have. (Lower passive and better active plus / recharge some utilities/stances/signets/Banners) and its problem solved.
A warrior use a burst and looses healing. It get adrenaline back it heals better.

Fomby.4295:

Muchacho.2390:

Question do warriors even use other healing skills? It has been ages since i seen a warrior using a different heal. And its not like that warriors have only one allround heal skill (like necros).

I dont think hs is op but i think its a bad skill for the game (like many others) as it doesnt have a real counter play apart from poison. But poison is the bane of all healing skills, so…

This, other heals are not a consideration for warriors. Healing sig with adrenal health and easy access to regen give the warrior ridiculous heals per tick. Coupled with fantastic condi removal, there is no point in running other heals. That’s three stackable healing attributes, with BIG healing numbers.

No build needs more adrenaline gain from healing surge. And mending wounds has never been a good heal, while the new stance heal is only really viable in WvW Zerg play.

There’s also another problem: glass cannons have always been pushed away from the meta thanks to conditions.

Burst heals are superior to healing signet IF the fight is very short.

Example: if the fight lasts 15 seconds and you use your Healing Surge once, you’d heal for over 600 hps. Healing Signet always heals for 392.

Too bad you will never have such short fights anymore. No matter how glassy you build.

Other problem: Merciless Hammer. One of the reason hammer builds are so strong is because you have defense, CC and damage on the same traitline. Put it somewhere else and things will change.

Deimos Tel Arin.7391:

zapv.8051:

warriors don’t have blocks, or invulns or a skill that makes them immune to conditions for a period of time. Other classes you reference would love to have endure pain, or zerker stance, or a shield. Other classes would also love to have a zerker build that has insane survivability, cc, and damage, but they don’t because those classes are more balanced.

Chuck Zitto.2367:

No they only have endure pain zerker stance fear stomp balanced stance banner regen and great mobility with a gs or sword and bull rush to disengage from a fight to heal up while they running away

only if they choose to equip those utility skills. again, working as intended.
endure pain? 4 seconds. cripple, immobillze, stun, launch, knockdown works
60 seconds recharge

stability? only if they choose lyssa runes, or balanced stance or dolyak signet or rampage. all have long recharge times.

shield? only if they equip a shield as offhand. working as intended since shield is a

banner regen? only if they trait for banners and equip banners utility, again, working as intended.

mobility? only for long sword, greatsword. working as intended since those are melee weapons and gap closers

do you guys even play warrior at all?

until you can play your warrior to be a god like status, other wise you all just want warriors to be free kills again.

^ this
Warrior has nothing if no equip these skill/traits. A barehanded warrior can absolutely do nothing. Even if they have endure pain/blocking/zerker stance they need to click it to be useful. If I choose not to click em it equals I don’t have em.
For the same reason, If warrior don’t equip HS they will not have the hps, hence hs is not op at all.

Muchacho.2390:

Well looking at healing signet alone is wrong. Together with the traits in the defense tree (mainly cleansing ire and adrenal health) and the high armor, warriors gets his really good surviviability from.
Maybe switching/changing some traits would be better than nerfing hs.

the same i tell the whole time.. cleansing ire should get either a icd for condiremove, a move to strength trait or a remove of the adrenalin gain fact.. or if it needs to stay then it should be grandmaster.

silentnight warrior.2714:

“mesmer:
signet of ether: gain health every few seconds based on the number of active illusions you control. passive for 3 illusions is 980 health every 3 seconds which is 337 health a second and active is 5,560. The problem with this is you need 3 illusions up at each interval. The warrior gets better healing without trying. Although the scaling on this skill is better. They might need to consider bumping this down it seems very strong.”

The solution its very simple:

Healing signet: heals based on the adrenaline you have. The same values that signet of mesmer have. (Lower passive and better active plus / recharge some utilities/stances/signets/Banners) and its problem solved.
A warrior use a burst and looses healing. It get adrenaline back it heals better.

lol… how long it takes do u think for a cleansing ire/ zerker stance using war to get full adrenalin back?

no, cleansing ire is fine now. no further changes necessary.

Oh good God, another thread dominated by Deimos clutching at straws to defend Godmode warrior skills, is it that time of the day already?

The signet has zero active play, zero reliance on gear stats, zero universal counter, zero differentiation by skill, zero casting time. And to you this is fine because, shockingly, you are riding this wave for all it’s worth in hotjoins.

I thank the stars that you are nowhere near the balance team, it gives me at least some hope that there could be a future for engaging skills being added rather than just slapping on massive regen to take away the bad feels.

azuzephyr.7280:

Oh good God, another thread dominated by Deimos clutching at straws to defend Godmode warrior skills, is it that time of the day already?

The signet has zero active play, zero reliance on gear stats, zero universal counter, zero differentiation by skill, zero casting time. And to you this is fine because, shockingly, you are riding this wave for all it’s worth in hotjoins.

I thank the stars that you are nowhere near the balance team, it gives me at least some hope that there could be a future for engaging skills being added rather than just slapping on massive regen to take away the bad feels.

He is trolling almost every thread in this subforum. Just stop responding to his posts and he will get bored and go away

listen up, if warriors are overpowered, we will only see warriors playing in sPvP and not other places.

is it really the case? no.

because warriors are not overpowered.
all your claims are invalid.

you all just want warriors to be free kills again.
that is not going to happen.

anet will not give in to the likes of you all.

Sepreh.5924:

He is trolling almost every thread in this subforum. Just stop responding to his posts and he will get bored and go away

i am not trolling but voicing out my opinions as a casual warrior player.

i have been playing the game since launch and will continue to play though casually.

the forums is a good place to voice out my opinions so that my warrior will not be rendered useless in all part of the game, PvE / WvW / sPvP.

thank you.

by the way, if you want me off the forums, you need to provoke me until i post something that will cost me to be given infraction points, multiple times. good luck.

hooma.9642:

lol… how long it takes do u think for a cleansing ire/ zerker stance using war to get full adrenalin back?

Cleansing Ire adrenaline = you under heavy pressure. Zerker stance adrenaline – lol, good luck with wasting 1 min defensive CD just for adrenaline. Btw, mesmer in most popular builds can just dodge twice and press one weapon button to get 3 illusions up.

Rednik.3809:

hooma.9642:

lol… how long it takes do u think for a cleansing ire/ zerker stance using war to get full adrenalin back?

Cleansing Ire adrenaline = you under heavy pressure. Zerker stance adrenaline – lol, good luck with wasting 1 min defensive CD just for adrenaline. Btw, mesmer in most popular builds can just dodge twice and press one weapon button to get 3 illusions up.

1. first i wasnt saying that zerker was/should only used for adrenalin
2. a mesmer dodging twice + 1 skill for 3 illusions has blown his defense
3. even if he has still endurance, the illusion unless want last that long unless specced for it and in 1vs1 and got ignored or no aoe
4. heavy pressure? i hope u realize the war gets 1 adrenalin for every hit, doesnt matter how much dmg they do.
5. considering how tanky a war is atm several hits per seconds doesnt mean heavy pressure.
6. what does mesmer matter if cleansing ire is op?
7. your compare doesnt fit, cause mesmer has no 90% 3 illusions up. where adrenalin is full really fast

hooma.9642:

1. first i wasnt saying that zerker was/should only used for adrenalin

So you cannot rely zerker this as adrenaline source, because adrenaline is only secondary effect.

2. a mesmer dodging twice + 1 skill for 3 illusions has blown his defense

And wasted 1 min defensive CD is not? What will be ready again faster, 2 dodges and weapon skill or 1 min utility? Btw you still have mesmer utilities/heal/other weapon skills not even touched.

3. even if he has still endurance, the illusion unless want last that long unless specced for it and in 1vs1 and got ignored or no aoe

Circumstances, circumstances. I can say same about ire – hard physical hits, CC, hard CC+condi pressure – oh no, we dying and still cannot get enough adrenaline for proper cleansing.

4. heavy pressure? i hope u realize the war gets 1 adrenalin for every hit, doesnt matter how much dmg they do.
5. considering how tanky a war is atm several hits per seconds doesnt mean heavy pressure.

So everyone around you hitting you with a wet noodles. If you are only considering fights with pure bunkers, then adrenaline doesn’t matter at all.

6. what does mesmer matter if cleansing ire is op?
7. your compare doesnt fit, cause mesmer has no 90% 3 illusions up. where adrenalin is full really fast

So mesmer have smart opponents who know how to deal with illusions, and warrior have stupid ones who don’t have a slightest idea how combination “adrenaline gain – finisher” works. Riiight.

Rednik.3809:

hooma.9642:

1. first i wasnt saying that zerker was/should only used for adrenalin

So you cannot rely zerker this as adrenaline source, because adrenaline is only secondary effect.

2. a mesmer dodging twice + 1 skill for 3 illusions has blown his defense

And wasted 1 min defensive CD is not? What will be ready again faster, 2 dodges and weapon skill or 1 min utility? Btw you still have mesmer utilities/heal/other weapon skills not even touched.

3. even if he has still endurance, the illusion unless want last that long unless specced for it and in 1vs1 and got ignored or no aoe

Circumstances, circumstances. I can say same about ire – hard physical hits, CC, hard CC+condi pressure – oh no, we dying and still cannot get enough adrenaline for proper cleansing.

4. heavy pressure? i hope u realize the war gets 1 adrenalin for every hit, doesnt matter how much dmg they do.
5. considering how tanky a war is atm several hits per seconds doesnt mean heavy pressure.

So everyone around you hitting you with a wet noodles. If you are only considering fights with pure bunkers, then adrenaline doesn’t matter at all.

6. what does mesmer matter if cleansing ire is op?
7. your compare doesnt fit, cause mesmer has no 90% 3 illusions up. where adrenalin is full really fast

So mesmer have smart opponents who know how to deal with illusions, and warrior have stupid ones who don’t have a slightest idea how combination “adrenaline gain – finisher” works. Riiight.

no illusions die not by smart opp. they die cause they cant hold a breath. longbow f1 makes all attempt to pop illusion useless. and its spammable.

the rest of your argumentation is out of context. zerkerstance is used to prevent condition and as good side effect the warrior gets plenty adrenalin to spam.

circumstances? u realize they are the only circumstance the mesmerheal would heal the full amount.. so its only under very rare! circumstances for short duration?

wet noodles? seems u should hop from your warrior to some other professions if u think the dmg is hard. adrenalin doesnt matter against bunkers? lol
and btw u STUNBREAKERS?

so tell me how u counter the adrenalin gain by hit from cleansing ire and kill the warrior if u are such smart person.

even the adrenalingain ignored a 3 condiremove on a 7-10 second cooldown is to strong. it shuts down every condi-class and with the add. toughness its provides a lot of dmg mitigation against raw power classes, that are only played here and there, cause they sacrifise to much in comparision with a warrior with cleansing ire.

i get the feeling talking to a wall. so i will stop here. have fun qq and cry about healing signet, some hammer traits or what else u think is the reason warrior is overperforming, until u see the source of all is cleansing ire at his current position and current form.

hooma.9642:

no illusions die not by smart opp. they die cause they cant hold a breath. longbow f1 makes all attempt to pop illusion useless. and its spammable.

the rest of your argumentation is out of context. zerkerstance is used to prevent condition and as good side effect the warrior gets plenty adrenalin to spam.

circumstances? u realize they are the only circumstance the mesmerheal would heal the full amount.. so its only under very rare! circumstances for short duration?

wet noodles? seems u should hop from your warrior to some other professions if u think the dmg is hard. adrenalin doesnt matter against bunkers? lol
and btw u STUNBREAKERS?

so tell me how u counter the adrenalin gain by hit from cleansing ire and kill the warrior if u are such smart person.

even the adrenalingain ignored a 3 condiremove on a 7-10 second cooldown is to strong. it shuts down every condi-class and with the add. toughness its provides a lot of dmg mitigation against raw power classes, that are only played here and there, cause they sacrifise to much in comparision with a warrior with cleansing ire.

i get the feeling talking to a wall. so i will stop here. have fun qq and cry about healing signet, some hammer traits or what else u think is the reason warrior is overperforming, until u see the source of all is cleansing ire at his current position and current form.

You can stop playing cheese like bunkers and condispammers? Oh wait, you whining about condi cleanse, so you can’t stop it. I’m so sorry, anet must give all condispammers IWIN button already, facerolling is too hard and can damage your face.

hooma.9642:

Rednik.3809:

hooma.9642:

lol… how long it takes do u think for a cleansing ire/ zerker stance using war to get full adrenalin back?

Cleansing Ire adrenaline = you under heavy pressure. Zerker stance adrenaline – lol, good luck with wasting 1 min defensive CD just for adrenaline. Btw, mesmer in most popular builds can just dodge twice and press one weapon button to get 3 illusions up.

1. first i wasnt saying that zerker was/should only used for adrenalin
2. a mesmer dodging twice + 1 skill for 3 illusions has blown his defense
3. even if he has still endurance, the illusion unless want last that long unless specced for it and in 1vs1 and got ignored or no aoe
4. heavy pressure? i hope u realize the war gets 1 adrenalin for every hit, doesnt matter how much dmg they do.
5. considering how tanky a war is atm several hits per seconds doesnt mean heavy pressure.
6. what does mesmer matter if cleansing ire is op?
7. your compare doesnt fit, cause mesmer has no 90% 3 illusions up. where adrenalin is full really fast

1 – no comments;
2 – Realy? a mesmer after that has no defences? no ports, invul, stealth, nothing?
3 – not understant your point there.
4 – True. It could be heavy damage or not. The other player should have some skill when fighting dont you think? Or the other player is just spaming skills and dont even bother with the warrior mechanics. = Bad player.
5 – That could be a problem with bunker/banner warriors, not all warriors builds so the trait is good overal, but HS needs a slight nerf.
6 – no comments;
7 – Warrior dont have also 90% of the time adrenaline on the 3rd bar. They use burst skills that empty them and after that if they are always getting adrenaline up fast, then the other player is doing something bad = bad player.
And its easy for mesmer to have at least 2 ilusions / phantasm always up.

silentnight warrior.2714:

….They use burst skills that empty them and after that if they are always getting adrenaline up fast, then the other player is doing something bad = bad player….

muaha attacking the warrior is bad?

hooma.9642:

silentnight warrior.2714:

….They use burst skills that empty them and after that if they are always getting adrenaline up fast, then the other player is doing something bad = bad player….

muaha attacking the warrior is bad?

Spamming skills is. And there are classes that spam a lot more than warriors. Headless Spamming is not equal to play well. Hope you understand this way.

noobftw.9654:

Deimos Tel Arin.7391:

zapv.8051:

warriors don’t have blocks, or invulns or a skill that makes them immune to conditions for a period of time. Other classes you reference would love to have endure pain, or zerker stance, or a shield. Other classes would also love to have a zerker build that has insane survivability, cc, and damage, but they don’t because those classes are more balanced.

Chuck Zitto.2367:

No they only have endure pain zerker stance fear stomp balanced stance banner regen and great mobility with a gs or sword and bull rush to disengage from a fight to heal up while they running away

only if they choose to equip those utility skills. again, working as intended.
endure pain? 4 seconds. cripple, immobillze, stun, launch, knockdown works
60 seconds recharge

stability? only if they choose lyssa runes, or balanced stance or dolyak signet or rampage. all have long recharge times.

shield? only if they equip a shield as offhand. working as intended since shield is a

banner regen? only if they trait for banners and equip banners utility, again, working as intended.

mobility? only for long sword, greatsword. working as intended since those are melee weapons and gap closers

do you guys even play warrior at all?

until you can play your warrior to be a god like status, other wise you all just want warriors to be free kills again.

^ this
Warrior has nothing if no equip these skill/traits. A barehanded warrior can absolutely do nothing. Even if they have endure pain/blocking/zerker stance they need to click it to be useful. If I choose not to click em it equals I don’t have em.
For the same reason, If warrior don’t equip HS they will not have the hps, hence hs is not op at all.

You ARE joking richt? Just checking

I like what you’ve done here. First you made an embarrassing build that can’t execute a base 5K damage over 11 seconds. You then came on to forums to let everyone know that you can’t do a base 5K over 11 seconds and embarrassed yourself further. Yet even though you haven’t figured out how to do a base damage of 5k over 11 seconds, you believe you’re qualified to balance others healing skills and have embarrassed yourself again citing interrupts that take .75 seconds to cast and/or have a flight time to stop healing skills that are all 90% set to .75 cast time..meaning you need a point blank reaction time of 0.12 seconds to interrupt said healing skills in a perfect situation, which is embarrassing to you again that you think this is even possible…hence in gw1 the skill lined called, “fast casting” which is where you found all the interrupt skills that took .25 seconds to cast in the first place, all of which are absent from gw2. You may as well just posted a video of someone doing a 32 point parallel park instead.

CntrlAltDefeat.1465:

hence in gw1 the skill lined called, “fast casting” which is where you found all the interrupt skills that took .25 seconds to cast in the first place, all of which are absent from gw2. You may as well just posted a video of someone doing a 32 point parallel park instead.

Actually most of the interrupts on gw1 mesmers were in Domination, though the Fast Casting attribute line did shorten their cast times.

Much of the issue with Healing Signet’s high passive healing isn’t that it’s hard (okay, impossible) to interrupt, while other heals can be rupted – it’s that it’s always there, working away, and takes no skill to use, no sense of timing or awareness of situation. If a mesmer wastes their heal too early on (maybe anticipating a burst?), they’re going to be unable to top their HP up when they actually need to. If a necro stays in death shroud too long, they’ve wasted a good chunk of their sustain and will have a harder time holding out against the next foe who turns up.

With warriors never ever needing to activate their healing skill, they’re getting the powerful sustain that it gives without having to consider when to use it, thereby lowering the skill required to keep themselves alive compared to other, less naturally tanky, classes. Yes the war also has other skills that they need to use to play well, but that doesn’t excuse that they get to ignore the ‘when should I heal?’ aspect of play altogether.

News flash…No healing skill in game requires skill to use. You simply press it. I have never heard, or ever will hear in my life, “OMG-that was the most awesome, last second;perfectly timed, superior skill use, ultimo heal of all time…you totally owned me when you self healed then..props to you master heal button presser sensei.”" I have heard though..“lucky heal.”

If you have any experience as a monk in any MMo, then you know don’t waste heals/energy on people still over 60%. Don’t waste time/heals/energy on condition/hexes that aren’t disturbing the player too much. Always use the last heal on your team mate, not yourself..a healer can’t heal the enemy to death, it can only heal the dmg dealer..who then dmg’s the enemy to death. Healing is not some enigma of pure skill and timing. It is just a button, just like the other 9 in the skill bar. So what even if u do interrupt it on the off chance in gw2. It is not going to put it on full cool down, it is only going to temporarily disable. There is no hard reset on interrupts in this game. I stand by my original comment. If you can’t do a base dmg of 5k over 11 seconds, the issue is with you..not a passive heal. My guardian with no points in power or precision and cleric’s amulet for goodness sake can do 5k base dmg in 2 weapon skill uses. Every profession in game can do 5k base dmg over 10 seconds. The only thing that stops that from being enough to drop a healing sig warrior is that the warrior is moving, dodging, blocking and using short immunities..that means they ain’t gonna make it easy for you do straight out of the gate, but even these are one trick ponies. Once those cards are played and the vigor is gone, the immunities used..where are they now?..running, because they know their dead if they try to go toe to toe from here on. Why are they running?..because they have no active heal and 420ish every second ain’t gonna be enough to save them.

CntrlAltDefeat.1465:

News flash…No healing skill in game requires skill to use. You simply press it. I have never heard, or ever will hear in my life, “OMG-that was the most awesome, last second;perfectly timed, superior skill use, ultimo heal of all time…you totally owned me when you self healed then..props to you master heal button presser sensei.”" I have heard though..“lucky heal.”

If you have any experience as a monk in any MMo, then you know don’t waste heals/energy on people still over 60%. Don’t waste time/heals/energy on condition/hexes that aren’t disturbing the player too much. Always use the last heal on your team mate, not yourself..a healer can’t heal the enemy to death, it can only heal the dmg dealer..who then dmg’s the enemy to death. Healing is not some enigma of pure skill and timing. It is just a button, just like the other 9 in the skill bar. So what even if u do interrupt it on the off chance in gw2. It is not going to put it on full cool down, it is only going to temporarily disable. There is no hard reset on interrupts in this game. I stand by my original comment. If you can’t do a base dmg of 5k over 11 seconds, the issue is with you..not a passive heal. My guardian with no points in power or precision and cleric’s amulet for goodness sake can do 5k base dmg in 2 weapon skill uses. Every profession in game can do 5k base dmg over 10 seconds. The only thing that stops that from being enough to drop a healing sig warrior is that the warrior is moving, dodging, blocking and using short immunities..that means they ain’t gonna make it easy for you do straight out of the gate, but even these are one trick ponies. Once those cards are played and the vigor is gone, the immunities used..where are they now?..running, because they know their dead if they try to go toe to toe from here on. Why are they running?..because they have no active heal and 420ish every second ain’t gonna be enough to save them.

This. I simply don’t understand the “mad skill” about pressing one single buttom which everyone crying about.

CntrlAltDefeat, you’re really arguing about entirely different points to those I’m saying:

- interrupts of heals aren’t my problem. That warriors never have their heal on cooldown is the problem.

- healing generally isn’t just pressing the button whenever a) your skill is off cooldown, and b) you have less than x% health. There are very few instant-cast heals, none of which occupy slot 6.

A couple of (somewhat oversimplified, and possibly unlikely with current meta builds, but still hopefully accurate) examples of why use of a heal requires non-zero amounts of skill:

Example one: Player A uses their heal skill when they’re at 40% health. Player B, however, was almost dead, and Player A had skills they could’ve used to win the fight. Player B gets a pretty great chance to escape or heal up themselves now, and Player A has their heal on cooldown. Player A made a choice, that while definitely very basic, was still not zero-skill and required some awareness of their environment.

Example two: Player C is a ranger, with Healing Spring, a warhorn offhand, and a longbow that they can swap to. Player C’s ally, Player D, is in combat in a point - and not doing too well.
Player C could run in, place their water field, and blast it - heal up Player D enough that they can continue fighting instead of risking stopping to heal, but now Player C’s heal is on cooldown
Player C could instead swap to their longbow and try to knock back one of Player D’s attackers - safer for Player C, and buys Player D a bit of breathing room, but the attacker may notice this and dodge, or pop stability, then get right back to killing Player D - and Player C can’t swap back to their /Warhorn for another 10s.

Example three: Player E is a mesmer running Ether Feast. They have no illusions out, and their health is at 50%. They could heal now, gaining a small benefit but not healing by much, or they could try to set up a couple of clones or phantasms before healing.
If they use it without illusions, and stay under pressure, they no longer have a heal skill and they haven’t been throwing phantasm damage at their foes.
If they try to cast some illusions first, they may get burst down before able to use their healing skill.

There isn’t "mad skill" required to use a heal, but there is any skill at all. The new heals, especially, require awareness of environment and have the potential for counterplay - but healing signet’s passive is good enough that I’ve still not seen any warriors even trying the stance out in PvP.

Even after all the warrior damage nerfs, you guys will never be satisfied.
Keep going on your crusade.
Maybe someday you’ll realize that maybe, just maybe its you and not the warrior?

Also, how can a mesmer or a thief especially have trouble with healing signet I can not for the life of me understand.

DuranArgith.1354:

Also, how can a mesmer or a thief especially have trouble with healing signet I can not for the life of me understand.

well i made a thief to survive, so she had little damage. she can play hide and seek all right but she can’t put down any warrior.

i was training 1 vs 1 with a fellow guild member (soup) in some custom arena though.

as for mesmer, well, my mesmer sends soup’s warrior running. cos soup’s warrior will eventually die from the random burning, bleeding and confusion if his warrior does not flee from my mesmer.

also my mesmer can’t put down soup’s warrior since errr my mesmer is not designed to lock down people with snares or immobilze or cripple etc. i.e. soup’s warrior ran away before my mesmer could put down the warrior.

HS is good for prolonged battles. If you have shield/Defy pain/Endure pain, it really is quite good.
But it is circumstancial(requires you to equip those skills and the shield).

If you get poisoned though, it greatly reduced(poison deals roughly the same damage as the number healed). Other heals are ofc also reduced, but atleast they still heal something.
But it is still circumstancial.

If the warrior gets heavy bursted or heavy conditioned, he will have to use one or more of his utilities(long CD), as his passive heal is not enough to keep him alive.
But once more it is circumstancial.

My point is, that it is situational. If you dont have the right tools to fight passive healing(poison, Burst, Boon removal, CC), you will have a hard time.
Same if I waste all my initiative on heartseeker while a warrior is using Shield stance or defy pain.

Since the discussion has turned unconducive for constructive feedback, this thread has been closed. Thank you for understanding.