Guild Wars 2

I am, of course, referring to the trebuchet on Khylo. No, this isn’t a QQ thread about the treb.

So many team compositions are revolving around either destroying the trebuchets fast and safely (like Ele’s AOE’s) or using Mesmers Portals to insta repair (pointless putting it on opposite sides of map).

Sure, it is fun to use it in Zerg mode (aka 8 v, but on the tPvP side, it is a major distraction, and at times, fruitless effort to take away a major weapon from the other team (via insta repair).

For a Capture the Point gametype final tPvP match, let’s say you have a treb user and a treb destroyer. That leaves 3 of your teammates to capture and hold 2 major points (safe to assume 1 of them is at least a Bunker build), which leaves 2 roamers, if that. Your team, of course, can be made of a different comp and can choose to ignore the treb completely, but that leaves you at a significant disadvantage against the team who does use it.

So, now what happens? It is literally a race to who can destroy the treb the fastest and most efficient and at the same time have the ability to hold down 2 major points. This kind of forced environment will filter out the bad team compositions against the good ones, thus basically seeing mirror matches later down the line.

Now, was it the point to design a final round competitive match around a WMD that takes almost as much time and attention as does capturing the points themselves? I don’t know, it feels wrong for some reason.

I don’t see any issues with this. It’s all strategy and I can assure you there are very few “mirror matches” on round3.

The knockback is fine, the amount of damage they do needs to be toned down. Dedicating a person to help win a point or control a point with knockbacks makes senese. Doing 9-10k damage, is a bit much.

Before they try to balance the trebs they need to make it so repair kits cannot be taken through portals because that is the root of the problem.

That’s not the root of the problem, the root of the problem is the Treb does too much damage.

You do realize how easy it is to avoid treb damage right? There’s literally no excuse unless you’re out of endurance (in which case you should trait for vigor or sigil for endurance). Every time they fire you get a verbal warning telling you. Save your dodges for the trebs and you’re fine. really.

Sezu.8564:

There’s literally no excuse unless you’re out of endurance (in which case you should trait for vigor or sigil for endurance).

I… I… I…. (hangs warrior head in shame) can’t. I would love to trait for it, but I have to bring a warhorn instead

The repair kit shouldn’t spawn as soon as the treb is destroyed. There needs to be some down time. I’ve noticed that the person on treb will leave as soon as they see some one coming to destroy it and be at the repair kit when the treb goes down. So its almost a waste of time besides the fact that your occupying the trebers time. Or the repair kit should have a cast time when repairing.

[qoute]You do realize how easy it is to avoid treb damage right? There’s literally no excuse unless you’re out of endurance (in which case you should trait for vigor or sigil for endurance). Every time they fire you get a verbal warning telling you. Save your dodges for the trebs and you’re fine. really. [/quote]

^theory pvp^

yup im holding the point keeping 2 or others from taking it hoping to hold out until backup arrives. I am attacking,watching their attacks and dodging their attack Plus i only need to pay attention to the sky after the verbal warning in the mids of this so can dodge meteors aswell IF i can still dodge. Not only that but all i need to do is respec for this map to do so…..

Theory pvp maybe fun and it may make you feel like you are interesting but tbh,ingame during pvp….it rarely works.

Sezu.8564:

You do realize how easy it is to avoid treb damage right? There’s literally no excuse unless you’re out of endurance (in which case you should trait for vigor or sigil for endurance). Every time they fire you get a verbal warning telling you. Save your dodges for the trebs and you’re fine. really.

I would like to see you dodge constant trebs during a fight where your opponent will be ccing you.

actually he’s right … with good build u can hold CP even under treb fire for some time … ofc not infinitelly but I’m sure he didn’t ment that too

only problem is the mesmer’s portal but even with this u can work … u can catch him on the way for RK

khilo is the only map which requires to take care of 4(5)(3 cap points, opponent treb, your treb) points instead of the usual 3 cap points.
i don’t like the strong aoe damage, don’t like the mesmer’s portal, but the map is really fine.

I dont like being able hold the repair kit through my portal, it should drop on the ground as you enter it. I hope they fix it soon.
It is just bypassing the point of having to repair and opposing team can not “intercept” the kit.

Anyway, to counter this issue you can :

1/ When the mesmer runs away, look around for his portal at or down the treb and keep an eye on it while destroying the treb .. when the portal starts to glow pink that means the mesmer is going to port back in next few seconds (activated portal lasts 20s but usually u drop other portal entrance at repair kit, pick the kit and port back). So destroy treb, camp his portal and gank him when he shows up.

2/ When the mesmer runs away, put the treb to 5% life then just wait at his portal (unused portal lasts 60s). Bascially the mesmer runs to repair kit for nothing, then he has to port back (portal glows pink) to his treb since his portal is already wasted. … Now you can destroy the treb.

And I agree Treb is doing way too much dmg, it should be halved maybe : knockback + some dmg would be good enough. Also in some situations, I can chain treb people : they barely have time to stand up before getting another shot. Some are gonna argue that stability helps a lot and thats true

^^ Smackjack.

If you are bunkering a point against 3 people (2 players + 1 treb) you shouldn’t expect to hold it for too long, wherein underlies a big problem that currently bunker builds (guardian especially) are too powerful, and as such when you get rooted and killed by a treb shot, you moan that 3 people killed you.

If you cannot count to 3, then dodge, then I’m not sure how far you are going to get in pvp. As a bunker guard myself, I would rather fight two good players and a treb, rather than 3 good players. Energy symbol on weapon swap and you can dodge indefinitely, two stun breakers incase they cc me on treb land, and an elite skill that lets me eat one treb without taking damage.

Treb is fine, and to be honest, almost overated. Only useful against a good team if you have good cooridination and timing.

Hm, whats this trash about destroying the treb? U just send someone to harass opperator during key strategic times. Destroying treb its self is a secondary objective most of the time. Its not so easy to dodge that its not worth using, lets be clear, but yea i dodge it pretty often. It adds pressure to a fight but not an unbearable amount.

I think it and mesmers are both fine. Mobile classes have no trouble harassing treb then moving to ct when the enemy runs for the kit.

I actually like Khylo because there is a treb mechanic. In my point of view its the most ballanced out of 3 tournaments map.
1) it gives you lot of options. Lot of strategies. There is more than one actually.. and also it highly promote timing and communication (when to dogde, when to attack middle point, when do avoid middle point)

2) others maps in compare are brainless. For example Foefier. Why there is even guild lord? at 350 mark you just rush it, ignore all the other NPC and just put mesmer quicknes. lord is deadth in 5 seconds = gg

if we go to forest, who cares? just send one burst charr to steal, if you manage it then you probably win 80% of games on forest. = gg.

no no .. Khylo is definitelly best map and best secondary mechanic, even i hate elementalist on treb i still consider it as “change strategy and learn to play issue”

I’ve been saying since day 1 treb damage is a touch much. The knockback is plenty good and can decide fights all on its own for your teammates. The fact it has so much damage and knockback is why it’s such a focused necessity for teams right now.

If it had high damage, or knockback, not both, teams would have more freedom in deciding whether to ignore or utilize the treb in their strats.

It’s all fine. They just need to make players unable to go through portal with repair kit.

BigTeeHunter.4913:

^^ Smackjack.

If you are bunkering a point against 3 people (2 players + 1 treb) you shouldn’t expect to hold it for too long, wherein underlies a big problem that currently bunker builds (guardian especially) are too powerful, and as such when you get rooted and killed by a treb shot, you moan that 3 people killed you.

If you cannot count to 3, then dodge, then I’m not sure how far you are going to get in pvp. As a bunker guard myself, I would rather fight two good players and a treb, rather than 3 good players. Energy symbol on weapon swap and you can dodge indefinitely, two stun breakers incase they cc me on treb land, and an elite skill that lets me eat one treb without taking damage.

Treb is fine, and to be honest, almost overated. Only useful against a good team if you have good cooridination and timing.

If you noticed i did not complain about the treb once or on how long i can hold up against 2 or 3 players. What i was pointing out was the *theory pvp’ing8 going on. People always jump into these threads and throw optimal builds and actions around saying SEE , ITS EASY……Real situations always disagree with their solutions.

when it comes to the treb itself i do agree that the dmg next to the knockback is a bit much . Other then that i think it makes the map interesting to play , imo it is the best map out there even.

But is everybody alright with the fact that this type of forced environment basically decides half your team composition to have the best advantage?

If 1 team did not have a Mesmer with Portal, they are instantly at a disadvantage for the rest of the match. Sure, you can camp the other teams’ portal, or not even destroy the treb fully, but that feels like a waste of manpower and time.

And AOE Ele’s are the most efficient and safest builds to destroy the treb and get away safely. I think Necros can do it very good as well. Then there’s also that random Thief who camps your treb in Stealth mode as soon as he sees you approaching with a repair kit.

Some of you call it strategy, but to me, it feels forced upon the teams to have a Mesmer and a good Ele or Necro just to keep up and have an even playing field. Not to mention a bunker vs bunker Guardian or Engineer.

BigTeeHunter.4913:

^^ Smackjack.

If you are bunkering a point against 3 people (2 players + 1 treb) you shouldn’t expect to hold it for too long, wherein underlies a big problem that currently bunker builds (guardian especially) are too powerful, and as such when you get rooted and killed by a treb shot, you moan that 3 people killed you.

If you cannot count to 3, then dodge, then I’m not sure how far you are going to get in pvp. As a bunker guard myself, I would rather fight two good players and a treb, rather than 3 good players. Energy symbol on weapon swap and you can dodge indefinitely, two stun breakers incase they cc me on treb land, and an elite skill that lets me eat one treb without taking damage.

Treb is fine, and to be honest, almost overated. Only useful against a good team if you have good cooridination and timing.

So because a bunker Guardian can take treb hits and spec to avoid it its fine?
There is no flaw in your logic at all.

Merciless.5349:

But is everybody alright with the fact that this type of forced environment basically decides half your team composition to have the best advantage?

If 1 team did not have a Mesmer with Portal, they are instantly at a disadvantage for the rest of the match. Sure, you can camp the other teams’ portal, or not even destroy the treb fully, but that feels like a waste of manpower and time.

And AOE Ele’s are the most efficient and safest builds to destroy the treb and get away safely. I think Necros can do it very good as well. Then there’s also that random Thief who camps your treb in Stealth mode as soon as he sees you approaching with a repair kit.

Some of you call it strategy, but to me, it feels forced upon the teams to have a Mesmer and a good Ele or Necro just to keep up and have an even playing field. Not to mention a bunker vs bunker Guardian or Engineer.

I agree 100%, if you dont have a mesmer and the other team does, 9 times out of 10 you will lose. There might be a exception for bad mesmers, but thats about it.

Guildsource has a youtube of tl vs tp where tp

A) has no thief
B) has no elementalist
C) doesnt use mesmer as treb opperator most of the game

And tp wins.

… ill be honest im still not sure how they do this, but they do.

In fact they come from behind after they stop using mesmer as trebusitter.

“You do realize how easy it is to avoid treb damage right? There’s literally no excuse unless you’re out of endurance (in which case you should trait for vigor or sigil for endurance). Every time they fire you get a verbal warning telling you. Save your dodges for the trebs and you’re fine. really.”

Why do people seem to think we have unlimited dodges? I’m expected to dodge 100b, pistol whip, HS, BS, Dragon’s Tooth, etc. and the trebuchet? People have to stop pointing to “its balanced bcuz u can dudge”.

I’m not expecting you to have infinite dodges, but if their treb is getting more than 3 shots off you’re having some serious team miscommunications anyway. This is a lot different than dodging player abilities, which most of the time you have a very limited time to react to.

You can see a huge fireball going to hit you literally 8 seconds before it even does. If you have any awareness at all you should be able to pan your camera slightly up when you hear the shout. This is not difficult. This does not even take skill.

People need to stop thinking mechanics are broken when in actuality the game is still very fresh and things that seem difficult now will become second nature in no time.

both the treb and cannon have no place in spvp, you have fantastic core gameplay, why on earth would you tarnish it with a dam catapult

the biggest issue with it is it encourages dedicated class roles, something anet claims to be against