Guild Wars 2

I would like something like this for structure PvP. With FPS genre moving into the 64 player PvP modes, and Star Wars Battlefront going even bigger than that

I would like to start seeing some larger scale structured PvP, that isn’t the same old king of the hill death match.

I would like something like a smaller scale version of WvW but with just two teams of 30 fighting against each other with siege weapons and all the mercenary units to hire to defend or attack the enemy team similar to the new HoT PvP mode, but with buildings to destroy and capture and keep lords to defend and kill.

This isn’t likely to happen. Reasons:

1. Hard enough to organize 5v5.

2. On average people prefer smaller fights.

3. GW2 is better balanced for smaller encounters.

4. The lag and spam would be crazy.

5. “Culling” or dampening effects would have to exist for it to run, similarly to wvw zergs. Invisible enemies arent good for “sPvP” type play.

I think it’d be a mess of zerging unless they designed it to REALLY a split people up, but at that point it just feels like either wvw or many mini-spvp matches in a single map. I just Don’t see it happening.

ronpierce.2760:

2. On average people prefer smaller fights.

I agree its not happening but you sure about this one? I don’t think so, in fact I think the opposite.

That sounds terrible! Plus the most esportz FPS (CSGO) is 5v5!

Wahoo! Bye frands!

it will probably take the whole pvp population to join in order to start a match

Simon.3794:

it will probably take the whole pvp population to join in order to start a match

^^

Yup. I agree, it sure will.

And lack of these and other features go a long way to make sure that population size stays that way.

Tongku.5326:

Simon.3794:

it will probably take the whole pvp population to join in order to start a match

^^

Yup. I agree, it sure will.

And lack of these and other features go a long way to make sure that population size stays that way.

Now this is interesting. Currently PvP is 5v5. And the population is small.

Yet people claim that more people prefer small matches. How is that?

You would think that if the existing PvP mode is small teams and that is what most people prefer then the PvP population would be large.

Johje Holan.4607:

Tongku.5326:

Simon.3794:

it will probably take the whole pvp population to join in order to start a match

^^

Yup. I agree, it sure will.

And lack of these and other features go a long way to make sure that population size stays that way.

Now this is interesting. Currently PvP is 5v5. And the population is small.

Yet people claim that more people prefer small matches. How is that?

You would think that if the existing PvP mode is small teams and that is what most people prefer then the PvP population would be large.

The small scale PvP community is the niche in MMOs. Large scale PvP has always been the more popular. Usually people try to debunk this by using the argument of Non-MMOs such as League of Legends, but in most MMOs the more populated form of PvP has always been the bigger battles.
In World of Warcraft for example, AV which is 40vs40 was always the most popular until the developers nerfed it to cores players into Arena 5v5,3v3, 2v2, which they later admitted was a terrible mistake that can’t be undone.

In GW2 the main selling point was WvW and not the 5v5 SPVP that was advertised.

That’s false. PvPers tend to enjoy smaller and more structured fights when competitively driven. The reason WvW and AV were popular wasnt because of PvPers directly, it’s that non-PvPers can hop in and not stick out, low stress load and typically ‘easy’ and collectible rewards versus achieved and attained rewards. It’s easy to follow a zerg and collect rather than struggle, required high communication and skill to overcome.

You could technically sell GW2 “structured” pvp short and turn it into a skill-less loot piñata, but it already wouldnt serve a purpose when both WvW and EtoM already exists and do just that. Both are low commitment without almost any personal responsibility for outcomes.

If you want to use WoW as an example, most PvPers hate the new Ashran which is fairly similar to old AV. But it’s easy loot for many farmers and most will openly admit to that. The most competitive and well known pvpers tend to be Arena players, and understandably so. PvP triggers competition and wanting to stand out. If successful, you will stand out more on a 3 man team than a 40 man team, typically speaking. Smaller teams tend to have a stronger bond and responsibility and that’s exciting to watch as a viewer (getting into e-sports a bit here).

Additionally, you just won’t get many people on board, especially existing PvPers by saying we’re upping the spam level when thats already a hot topic to begin with.

Knighthonor.4061:

Johje Holan.4607:

Tongku.5326:

Simon.3794:

it will probably take the whole pvp population to join in order to start a match

^^

Yup. I agree, it sure will.

And lack of these and other features go a long way to make sure that population size stays that way.

Now this is interesting. Currently PvP is 5v5. And the population is small.

Yet people claim that more people prefer small matches. How is that?

You would think that if the existing PvP mode is small teams and that is what most people prefer then the PvP population would be large.

The small scale PvP community is the niche in MMOs. Large scale PvP has always been the more popular. Usually people try to debunk this by using the argument of Non-MMOs such as League of Legends, but in most MMOs the more populated form of PvP has always been the bigger battles.
In World of Warcraft for example, AV which is 40vs40 was always the most popular until the developers nerfed it to cores players into Arena 5v5,3v3, 2v2, which they later admitted was a terrible mistake that can’t be undone.

In GW2 the main selling point was WvW and not the 5v5 SPVP that was advertised.

Exactly, low scale pvp been the only option is bad for the mmorpg. Balance almost everything around it is another problem. Sometimes it feels like the huge focus in 5v5 spvp in detriment of other areas like wvw/pve/guildis is like kitten hurting the game as a whole.

The game fails to develop its mmorpg pvp potential because there is always the ghost of wannabe ezport walking around dennying other pvp modes to exist.

I feel like everyone is forgetting WvW/EotM exists… Thats more “RPG” pvp than you will EVER get in sPVP. It even considers your stats… That’s almost intrinsic to “RPG”. It’s massive scale, you use your wits and stats to overcome larger armies, so on and so forth. And it’s less instance “feeling” as they’re open zones rather than standard 15 minute matches. If RPG pvp is what you want, they have it man, you just have to go do it…

Yeah, the first thing that everyone thinks of when they think of ways to make sPvP better is to add more special effects vomitting themselves over the screen, more mindless AoE spam, and less personal skill.

The only way I see it working is if they tried to do it like the few FPS games that have tried massive-scale combat, and that is by breaking people into smaller groups so that even if it is two teams of 30v30 you still generally only see a few people at a time, but there really isn’t a point to that in MMOs, whereas FPSs can somewhat support it.

If you want 30v30 do WvW.

That sounds like the player-created GvG. However GvG guilds don’t want to fight in PvP because they want access to their PvE gear/buffs.

Also ANET said only a few weeks ago that they don’t want to create, and have to support yet another game mode.

Lastly, GvG’ers can already do 10v10 in custom arenas. Guess what? No one does it…

Obsidian Sanctum that way —-——>

This could work for GvG. I’d say ANet should experiment with smaller large numbers (say 10v10) and see if that works before going for something like 30v30

Who would even play that? Zvzers want to “tune” their gear so they’re out of the equation.

rotten.9753:

Who would even play that? Zvzers want to “tune” their gear so they’re out of the equation.

I would, if it had good mechanics. Which is why I suggested it.
The most fun Instanced PvP I ever had was in Vanilla WoW’s Old AV. That was 40vs 40 not 30vs30 and it was always populated. So I don’t see where the argument that larger scale Instanced PvP can’t have a population.
What made it fun was how it was a combo of world PvP structure capture (WvW) but with balanced group numbers of (small scale Instanced PvP) and also featured interesting PvPvE gameplay with powerful NPC’s back then that could do big damage to a player.
I would gladly take a hybrid of WvW and SPVP for something like this, win siege weapons and keeps, and NPC, but all with a controlled population of 30 per team.

Screw 30 v 30, lets do and entire world versus an entire world. HAHA! That would be amazing. Will never happen though, anet is incompetent.

Knighthonor.4061:

I would like something like this for structure PvP. With FPS genre moving into the 64 player PvP modes, and Star Wars Battlefront going even bigger than that

I would like to start seeing some larger scale structured PvP, that isn’t the same old king of the hill death match.

I would like something like a smaller scale version of WvW but with just two teams of 30 fighting against each other with siege weapons and all the mercenary units to hire to defend or attack the enemy team similar to the new HoT PvP mode, but with buildings to destroy and capture and keep lords to defend and kill.

Everyone would move and stack as a blob,and it would be a blob vs blob fight without any tactics other than Stack,buff,veil and push.

Zergling section this way —>