Guild Wars 2

I just don’t understand how it can take so long to make the warrior playable. I mean its been out ages now this game.

We need about 4/5 gap closers added to some of our weapons like hammer, increase range of shield 4 – stuff like that.

We also need some way to remove conditions. I mean come on. Give us something to work with. Otherwise we wont be viable.

Thats because to hold/cap points you have to stand in a defined circle which makes you an easy target for aoe conditions from necros and rangers or just aoe spam from eles.

There is loads more I could suggest such as:

-making warriors sprint a 20% buff to speed,
-giving us 3 weapons to swap between NOT just 2.
-Making endure pain 5 seconds and reduced cooldown.
-Reduce cooldown of fear me.
-Improve the base heal of mending or make it cure 3 conditions or reduce its cooldown.

Any 2/3 of these combined changes would still leave the warrior as the worst class in the game. So I dont see what the problem is.

If you have any more thoughts, suggestions, here’s a good place to post:

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/pvp/pvp/We-want-the-Warrior-to-have-a-sturdy-body/first

If warriors were given a 3 weapon set to swap to I would say remove your adrenaline mechanic and make your third weapon set your class “skill”.

Also 1h sword has a gap closer and greatsword has a gap closer. You can’t have one on every weapon.

I’ve had 2 warrior friends tell me they’re rerolling to dps gurd today

IMO:

3 weapon sets.

On weapon set change, depending on what weapon is equiped you get a buff of some sort.
(2handers are given 4 sec buffs, each 1hander is given a 2sec buff)

Example: Swapping to GS gave you 4 seconds of fury

Example 2: Swap to 1Hand sword + Shield, gain 2sec swiftness 2sec protection etc.

Example 3: Swap to Hammer, gain 4 seconds of blind immunity.

Also, some weapons should have their attack speed either increased, or their damage increased (such as Hammer, or even Mace).

Defensive traits need to be more accessible.

Lastly, the class should have a base, non changing F1 which itself is a gap closer. Thus removing the immediate need for gap closing / mobility weapons only.

Or maybe the class is fine & its a L2P ?

Akame.1073:

Or maybe the class is fine & its a L2P ?

I’ve been hoping that was just the case for 5 months.

Ummm… Warriors are the Only classes that I have seen able to solo dungeons… I think you guys need some buffs somewhere but I’d say if any class can solo dungeons they are doing alright.

Defektive.7283:

Akame.1073:

Or maybe the class is fine & its a L2P ?

I’ve been hoping that was just the case for 5 months.

Doesn’t change the fact that changes proposed by the OP seem much over the top.

I’ve been playing warrior in tournies lately and I must agree that it feels down in many ways.

What I think warriors need most at the moment is some work with traits (big mess there, too much %‘s for my taste) and more build diversity which can be achieved only if warriors can get some reliable defense against ranged (mostly condition) builds and CC. It’s already very hard to pull off plays with greatsword and it’s inherent mobility with an enemy necro nearby.

Things get even more complicated with other weapons which forces you to get your warrior a condition cleansing, diaper changing nanny.

Lol everyone complaining about warriors are kittenly OP in PvE and you want buffs in PvP to make them even more kitten in PvE. They are OP in PvE, and fine/a bit op in PvP

PvP and PvE skills / damage etc. are separated.

jportell.2197:

Ummm… Warriors are the Only classes that I have seen able to solo dungeons… I think you guys need some buffs somewhere but I’d say if any class can solo dungeons they are doing alright.

pve doesnt equal PVp.

Idk how warriors are doing in pve land, but they ARE CLEARLY underpowered in pvp tourny play.

To be quite honest, I think Warriors are designed quite well besides the simplicity/boringness of the profession mechanic. When I find a situation where I’m fighting another Warrior who knows what he’s doing, it’s an extremely fun fight. Reasonable time to react, reasonable counter-play involved.

However, when you compare a $150,000/year salary against someone making $1,000,000, it starts to look a little underwhelming.

I think the Warrior class isn’t receiving changes because a lot of the design issues really aren’t with the Warrior class. Of course, that’s all my opinion.

Lordrosicky.5813:

-giving us 3 weapons to swap between NOT just 2.

Mace stun
switch to 100b, 100% crit with trait
switch to axe and eviscerate, also 100% crit with sigil

no class gets 3 weapons
absolutely not

Also you get a signet that removes all conditions and rune of lyssa which cures all conditions, then shake it off. You got plenty of ways.

Warriors arent bad

I believe Anet’s goal was to use warrior as a kind of “base” to balance other professions around—if something is stronger than the warrior it needs a nerf, weaker needs buff?

Warriors are already so good in PvE/WvW that Anet needs to be careful about buffing them for PvP (I don’t really do fractals, but you don’t want people saying “can’t do fractal level XX without 3 warriors in your group.”) I think they need better condition removal traits and some more tempting utilities than the 4 (?) viable ones (I don’t play warrior but I don’t think I’ve ever seen more than 4-5 of their utility skills used).

Endure Pain used to be 5 seconds in the betas lol.

hharry.1967:

Lol everyone complaining about warriors are kittenly OP in PvE and you want buffs in PvP to make them even more kitten in PvE. They are OP in PvE, and fine/a bit op in PvP

Warriors are useless in PvP.

Akame.1073:

Or maybe the class is fine & its a L2P ?

Nope. I’ve been playing warrior since BWE3. I know it inside and out. The class simply lags behind other classes in every role.

The warrior was designed as a sort of jack of all trades but master of none.

Here are some changes I’d like to see to my favourite weapon, the rifle (some of these ideas were taken from other posters):

- Make the 4-skill daze instead of applying vulnerability (which is useless in PvP)
- Increase the damage of the auto-attack (155 damage is beyond pathetic). Make the damage equal to the ranger’s longbow except replace distance from target with endurance level
- Increase the damage on volley slightly
- Decrease the damage on killshot, but make it knock down the target

Chi Malady.2015:

Akame.1073:

Or maybe the class is fine & its a L2P ?

Nope. I’ve been playing warrior since BWE3. I know it inside and out. The class simply lags behind other classes in every role.

The warrior was designed as a sort of jack of all trades but master of none.

Here are some changes I’d like to see to my favourite weapon, the rifle (some of these ideas were taken from other posters):

- Make the 4-skill daze instead of applying vulnerability (which is useless in PvP)
- Increase the damage of the auto-attack (155 damage is beyond pathetic). Make the damage equal to the ranger’s longbow except replace distance from target with endurance level
- Increase the damage on volley slightly
- Decrease the damage on killshot, but make it knock down the target

Plz dont get offended by what im about to write but: time spent =/= player skill. And the game is designed in a way that every class has its vulnerability. On a side note due to the warr mechanic a daze or another knock down on a warr its incredibly powerful combined with the cc he alrdy has. Ranger bog = god mele not so , warr it is contrary. All in all i get you & i think a net will think about your sugestion, but keep in mind a net goal is e-sport & high pvp is a completlly different beast.

Akame.1073:

Chi Malady.2015:

Akame.1073:

Or maybe the class is fine & its a L2P ?

Nope. I’ve been playing warrior since BWE3. I know it inside and out. The class simply lags behind other classes in every role.

The warrior was designed as a sort of jack of all trades but master of none.

Here are some changes I’d like to see to my favourite weapon, the rifle (some of these ideas were taken from other posters):

- Make the 4-skill daze instead of applying vulnerability (which is useless in PvP)
- Increase the damage of the auto-attack (155 damage is beyond pathetic). Make the damage equal to the ranger’s longbow except replace distance from target with endurance level
- Increase the damage on volley slightly
- Decrease the damage on killshot, but make it knock down the target

Plz dont get offended by what im about to write but: time spent =/= player skill. And the game is designed in a way that every class has its vulnerability. On a side note due to the warr mechanic a daze or another knock down on a warr its incredibly powerful combined with the cc he alrdy has. Ranger bog = god mele not so , warr it is contrary. All in all i get you & i think a net will think about your sugestion, but keep in mind a net goal is e-sport & high pvp is a completlly different beast.

Tell me how many of the current “top teams” include warriors. Of those teams that do use warriors, how many are using a build other than 100B? Warrior currently has a very limited role (or no role at all) in all the “top teams”.

It’s mostly new players that think the warrior is fine. Most experienced players will tell you that it’s a pretty useless class in the current metagame.

Lordrosicky.5813:

I just don’t understand how it can take so long to make the warrior playable. I mean its been out ages now this game.

We need about 4/5 gap closers added to some of our weapons like hammer, increase range of shield 4 – stuff like that.

We also need some way to remove conditions. I mean come on. Give us something to work with. Otherwise we wont be viable.

Thats because to hold/cap points you have to stand in a defined circle which makes you an easy target for aoe conditions from necros and rangers or just aoe spam from eles.

There is loads more I could suggest such as:

-making warriors sprint a 20% buff to speed,
-giving us 3 weapons to swap between NOT just 2.
-Making endure pain 5 seconds and reduced cooldown.
-Reduce cooldown of fear me.
-Improve the base heal of mending or make it cure 3 conditions or reduce its cooldown.

Any 2/3 of these combined changes would still leave the warrior as the worst class in the game. So I dont see what the problem is.

This is not a constructive post…

As a long time warrior player I can tell you that most of this stuff is nowhere near the problem

Warrior Problems:
-Condition Removal is not good enough.
-We do not have access to protection.
-Endure Pain should make you immune to conditions for its duration.
There are other issues, but these are major offenders. Reducing cool downs for things like endure pain / fear me would just be horribly imbalanced as there is already a trait to reduce stance cd and shout cd by 20%

I won’t go into how to do these things because I and many others have stated how in several other posts.

on top of all this warrior is not the weakest class in the game, by far, they are just substantially less flashy. Warrior needs some buffs and tweaking, mostly in defensive traits and utilities (as well some utility overlap). Go play an engineer in PvP and tell me its better than a warrior, please.

Giving us 3 weapon swaps is just absurd.

JUST TO PROVE A POINT.
(Gap closers)

Trait(Leg Specialist i think): All cripples immobilize for 1 second (Substantially improves closing ability)
Sword: Savage Leap, Hamstring to stick.
Warhorn: Swiftness, Vigor buffs.
Longbow: Immobilize, soft gap closer
Axe: Cripple, Immob with trait. Adrenaline skill = Leap
Mace OH: Tremors / Knockdown, same principle as immbolize
Shield: #4, yeah the range could come up but it does its job
Rifle: Cripple, Immob with trait.
Bolas: Immobilize
Bull Rush: Charge
Hammer: Adrenaline skill = leap
All Banners: Swiftness / Charge on #4
Trait: increases movement speed while wielding a melee wep
GS: 2 closers with #3 and #5 AND a cripple.
ETC.

Mace mainhand and axe offhand do not help with closing distance, that i will grant to you…

So where are these weapons that dont let us close distance?

Rump Buffalo.2594:

on top of all this warrior is not the weakest class in the game

If you break things down into roles, you can see pretty clearly that the warrior doesn’t really excel at anything

Burst: Thief is clearly superior; better damage, mobility, and survivability
Bunker: Guardian and ele; no debate here
Condition damage: Necro and engineer; warrior conditions get cleansed too easily
Roamer: Ele

The only role the warrior excels in is providing single-target CC. That isn’t nearly useful enough to justify carrying one in your party.

“(Tell me how many of the current “top teams” include warriors. Of those teams that do use warriors, how many are using a build other than 100B? Warrior currently has a very limited role (or no role at all) in all the “top teams”.)"

It’s mostly new players that think the warrior is fine. Most experienced players will tell you that it’s a pretty useless class in the current metagame.
[/quote]

Tell my how many top teams run ranger or engi. Warrior is in a better place than either of those. The main issues they have come from a lack of protection and needing a little more condition removal

The warrior provides amazingly high consistent dmg while having the toughest baseline to kill (although without protection that doesnt matter that much) and gives the best damage support to his team (IE boosting their damage) in a support role.

Warrior fills a role, in PvP tho dag/dag thief, bunker ele/guards, and shatter mesmers just overshadow everything. However… i’ve run extremely effective bleed builds on my warrior

No class can stand to that right now. it is less a problem with the warrior (for the most part) and more a problem with other op builds.

I’m not saying the warrior doesnt have its problems, i’m saying many of the statements in THIS post are unfounded and sound a lot more like meta issues than warrior issues.

The only thing ill agree on so far is that we need more condition removal and we need the protection boon from something.

Defektive.7283:

IMO:

3 weapon sets.

On weapon set change, depending on what weapon is equiped you get a buff of some sort.
(2handers are given 4 sec buffs, each 1hander is given a 2sec buff)

Example: Swapping to GS gave you 4 seconds of fury

Example 2: Swap to 1Hand sword + Shield, gain 2sec swiftness 2sec protection etc.

Example 3: Swap to Hammer, gain 4 seconds of blind immunity.

Also, some weapons should have their attack speed either increased, or their damage increased (such as Hammer, or even Mace).

Defensive traits need to be more accessible.

Lastly, the class should have a base, non changing F1 which itself is a gap closer. Thus removing the immediate need for gap closing / mobility weapons only.

I love this idea and would cream my pants if it was implemented. Not op, very good, and makes sense with a warrior.

Only thing to say, we dont need three wep sets and that will never happen.

well, i think they should atleast fix the F1 skill from GS cos its bugged, or did anyone ever notice the 15 might stacks after the attack with 3 bars of Adrenaline?

It’s just a tooltip error. They admitted they were tinkering with the GS burst (hence the might), but no changes made it into live yet

@Chi
You clearly don’t know what Warrior does at full potential. Its like you’re asking for ANET to over-buff the class. Single target CC on an enemy target is god inaccurate and is from a simple-minded point of perspective. Nothing special here, just another guy who thinks he knows the class more than anyone and is going to contribute on future QQ on classes that get the same treatment as Ele’s.

To be fair, casuals will say Warriors are weak simply because slows such as chill is stupidly anti-fun and some characters got over-buffed while Warrior got nerfed/untouched during the patches. That doesn’t make the class a “single target burst CC DPS” though. Its more than that. Just that there are a few problems.

-Warriors can trade hits with condition DAMAGE realistically, but the real problem is the condition SLOWS. Why did you NOT consider Warriors in terms of conditions like slows ANET? We don’t have a blink so we get kited without needing to get slowed so why didn’t mobile strikes have a cleanse slow in the first place?
-People are convinced that Axe + GS is the only way to go. This is a problem because there are BETTER builds out there that puts more to the table in terms of team play. I’ll give you an example:
-Why choose Axe + GS when you can go Mace + GS? Mace can set up kills for yourself, it can set-up for your team mates mainly because you can bait out stun breaks reliably. And most of all it allows you to defend yourself much better than if you used Axe.
-People don’t understand this because these people who are “deemed top Warriors” are being bad examples by mindlessly stating that Axe + GS is the only way to go when there are other builds that are CLEARLY BETTER. Doesn’t matter how skilled you are, you will be better if you picked a better build than Axe + GS. (Sorry I really had to point this out). This is a community issue. Something that just needs to stop because its ruining the Warrior’s reputation as a profession.
-There is no infrastructure on the term “carry.” Simple-minded players like Chi or Braxxus can’t figure out what a Warrior does. Because guess what? This game is too complex for simple-minded people. I don’t blame ANET for this. I personally believe complexity is fun but when its too hard to understand the game for the majority then it simply must be fixed because not everyone has what it takes to understand.

Warrior simply needs a few tweaks, such as mobile strikes cleansing slows, attack of opportunity getting revamped, and minor traits in tactics. They don’t have to get over-buffed like Ele’s for example.

Warriors are perhaps the most (only?) Polished class. Also, gap closers make for bad game play, and warrior shouldnt have any. They can have sprints, but teleporty gap closers no. (Pretty much just guardian and maybe ele should.)

Teleport would be counter to slows. We really just need a counter to slows. Other than that I like where the class is as a whole. Just would like to see the necessity of the GS removed. I don’t think any war would disagree that gs is mandatory atm.

Hammer needs delay and attack speed tweaks.
Mace is fine.
Sword is fine. Off-hand needs burst options.
Axe needs its old Eviscerate back or buff its F1. Off-hand needs to be buffed by 300% damage or something.
Rifle needs to be more rewarding in terms of damage out-put.
GS F1 should only be buffed when every other weapon that needs attention gets attention.

Pretty good troll. Almost believed you until you said 3 weapon swaps.

Rump Buffalo.2594:

Tell my how many top teams run ranger or engi. Warrior is in a better place than either of those. The main issues they have come from a lack of protection and needing a little more condition removal

The warrior provides amazingly high consistent dmg while having the toughest baseline to kill (although without protection that doesnt matter that much) and gives the best damage support to his team (IE boosting their damage) in a support role.

Warrior fills a role, in PvP tho dag/dag thief, bunker ele/guards, and shatter mesmers just overshadow everything. However… i’ve run extremely effective bleed builds on my warrior

No class can stand to that right now. it is less a problem with the warrior (for the most part) and more a problem with other op builds.

I’m not saying the warrior doesnt have its problems, i’m saying many of the statements in THIS post are unfounded and sound a lot more like meta issues than warrior issues.

The only thing ill agree on so far is that we need more condition removal and we need the protection boon from something.

I agree that ranger and engi are in an ever worse position. However, even you admit that the warrior is overshadowed in PvP by other classes. That is the very definition of a useless class. If it can’t do something better than another class, it’s useless. The warrior does not have any outstanding unique abilities either (like mesmer) which allow it carve out its own nice.

Chi Malady.2015:

Rump Buffalo.2594:

on top of all this warrior is not the weakest class in the game

If you break things down into roles, you can see pretty clearly that the warrior doesn’t really excel at anything

Burst: Thief is clearly superior; better damage, mobility, and survivability
Bunker: Guardian and ele; no debate here
Condition damage: Necro and engineer; warrior conditions get cleansed too easily
Roamer: Ele

The only role the warrior excels in is providing single-target CC. That isn’t nearly useful enough to justify carrying one in your party.

Warrior single target burst is the highest in the game, their role is that, melt faces with a single button like they currently do.

Schwahrheit.4203:

@Chi
You clearly don’t know what Warrior does at full potential. Its like you’re asking for ANET to over-buff the class. Single target CC on an enemy target is god inaccurate and is from a simple-minded point of perspective. Nothing special here, just another guy who thinks he knows the class more than anyone and is going to contribute on future QQ on classes that get the same treatment as Ele’s.

To be fair, casuals will say Warriors are weak simply because slows such as chill is stupidly anti-fun and some characters got over-buffed while Warrior got nerfed/untouched during the patches. That doesn’t make the class a “single target burst CC DPS” though. Its more than that. Just that there are a few problems.

-Warriors can trade hits with condition DAMAGE realistically, but the real problem is the condition SLOWS. Why did you NOT consider Warriors in terms of conditions like slows ANET? We don’t have a blink so we get kited without needing to get slowed so why didn’t mobile strikes have a cleanse slow in the first place?
-People are convinced that Axe + GS is the only way to go. This is a problem because there are BETTER builds out there that puts more to the table in terms of team play. I’ll give you an example:
-Why choose Axe + GS when you can go Mace + GS? Mace can set up kills for yourself, it can set-up for your team mates mainly because you can bait out stun breaks reliably. And most of all it allows you to defend yourself much better than if you used Axe.
-People don’t understand this because these people who are “deemed top Warriors” are being bad examples by mindlessly stating that Axe + GS is the only way to go when there are other builds that are CLEARLY BETTER. Doesn’t matter how skilled you are, you will be better if you picked a better build than Axe + GS. (Sorry I really had to point this out). This is a community issue. Something that just needs to stop because its ruining the Warrior’s reputation as a profession.
-There is no infrastructure on the term “carry.” Simple-minded players like Chi or Braxxus can’t figure out what a Warrior does. Because guess what? This game is too complex for simple-minded people. I don’t blame ANET for this. I personally believe complexity is fun but when its too hard to understand the game for the majority then it simply must be fixed because not everyone has what it takes to understand.

Warrior simply needs a few tweaks, such as mobile strikes cleansing slows, attack of opportunity getting revamped, and minor traits in tactics. They don’t have to get over-buffed like Ele’s for example.

Hardly anyone runs warrior anymore in tPvP and there is a good reason for that. The term “carry” doesn’t apply to this game (it literally makes no sense in the context of GW2).

The warrior might have other solid builds, but they are not viable in conquest mode. The objective of conquest is to either be a bunker or a bunker buster. Methodical balanced builds are overshadowed by high burst/toughness. I hate GS+Axe but I’m forced to keep coming back to it because no other build is as effective in the current metagame.

hharry.1967:

Chi Malady.2015:

Rump Buffalo.2594:

on top of all this warrior is not the weakest class in the game

If you break things down into roles, you can see pretty clearly that the warrior doesn’t really excel at anything

Burst: Thief is clearly superior; better damage, mobility, and survivability
Bunker: Guardian and ele; no debate here
Condition damage: Necro and engineer; warrior conditions get cleansed too easily
Roamer: Ele

The only role the warrior excels in is providing single-target CC. That isn’t nearly useful enough to justify carrying one in your party.

Warrior single target burst is the highest in the game, their role is that, melt faces with a single button like they currently do.

Thief is far superior in that role. Thieves can output equal or higher damage. Thief damage is much harder to avoid due to teleports. Thieves have much higher survivability due to stealth. A melee warrior is ridiculously easy to shut down with stunlock/focus fire.

From what ive observed, the only spec thats high end play viable is 100blades, and it holds up ok. But warrior has no particular role diversity, and its questionable if he even fills this roll the best (thief ).
Rangers, used to be considered trouble, but recently rangers are seeing a decent amount of paid play and love.
especially on map 3 khylo.

no matter how you slice and dice it, warriors need some love, but at least they are not engies.

i Think as a warrior player, warriors don’t need gap closer or condition removal, what they need is some kind of mechanic making the invulnerable to criple/chill/imobilize, and a 25% speed buff as ranged classes and thief have. What makes warriors so bad is they just can’t do anything against ranged classes besides trying a frenzy/BR/100b combo cuz they are constantly under slow chill imobilize even an engi can kill a warrior farily easy, think only class warriors can deal with is melee thiefs.

Anyone who is saying the warrior is fine in pvp, is obviously wrong. The warrior is the absolute worst class I have played in PVP. Yes a good player can still do well with a warrior, but they can do far better with another class. Warriors are especially bad in hot join. I currently play a mesmer, which is a top 3 class. Playing my mesmer, or my warrior is like day and night. The warrior is downright frustrating to play as compared to the mesmer. From what I have seen the class balance looks something like this.

1. Thief (repeated stealths are game breaking)
2. Mesmer
3. Elementalist
4. Guardian
5. Necro
6. Ranger
7. Engineer
8. Warrior

Sabre.1275:

Anyone who is saying the warrior is fine in pvp, is obviously wrong. The warrior is the absolute worst class I have played in PVP. Yes a good player can still do well with a warrior, but they can do far better with another class. Warriors are especially bad in hot join. I currently play a mesmer, which is a top 3 class. Playing my mesmer, or my warrior is like day and night. The warrior is downright frustrating to play as compared to the mesmer. From what I have seen the class balance looks something like this.

1. Thief (repeated stealths are game breaking)
2. Mesmer
3. Elementalist
4. Guardian
5. Necro
6. Ranger
7. Engineer
8. Warrior

WRONG. Thiefs are NOT #1. It’s probably the case that eles are #1. Do you see thiefs on every paid team? No. You see nearly as mainy paid teams running double ele as you do teams running one thief. Even seen triple ele in paids.

People who think thiefs are the most powerful i just dont get it. It isnt bourne out by there performance in competitive matchs. They are a strong class, but strongest? Give me a break. An ele will 1on1 a thief any day of the week, has more manuverability, durability, team effects. And sees more representation in the highest level of play. And Many top players -ie the ones who actually understand balance- reckon eles to be the strongest.

The game devs have even commented on how powerful eles are.
Repeated stealths = a thief not capping points. This is conquest, not deathmatch. thiefs are not Op.
For goodness sakes, some of the best teams dont even USE a thief. I cant think of one top team that doesnt use a ele or guardian.
Seriously, forum crying about thiefs is just sad. I dont even main a thief, i just recognize they are not the strongest.

Thiefs may well be the strongest wvwvw class. Thats more debatable. BUT NOT IN SPVP.

For me it’s slightly different.. I think Ele/Guard needs to be brought down slightly, thief/war needs slight buffs (Not in Dps/Maneuver) Necro/Engi Could use a bit of extra love for their (Necro)maneuverability and (Engi)Dps.

Tiers;
Elementalist=Guardian TOP
Mesmer=Ranger HIGH
Thief=Warrior / Necro=Engineer MID

I would rate Ele/Guard strongest in all fields;
Maneuverability Support 1v1 Bunker DPS

Mesmer/ranger only slightly less strong in all Fields

Thief/War very strong but not quite as strong as Mesmer/Ranger
Quite strong in Maneuver/DPS . Not as much in 1v1 Bunker.

Necro/Engi Very Very Strong DPS/Bunker On Par with Warrior/thief in 1v1
Definitely Not even close to maneuverability/evasion of Thief/Warrior

If sPvP didn’t revolve around fighting inside kitchen-sized circles all day, then PvP balance might look a bit different. Only making maps full of narrow spaces is a terrible idea, just look at how fun the Snowball Mayhem map was in comparison.

It doesnt matter what your opinion of the strongest class is, or if you think the thief isnt the #1 class. Anyone who does Spvp knows the thief along with the elementalist, mesmer, and guardian are the four best classes in the game. And most people recognize warrior as the absolute worst class in the game. The notion that the game designers gave different skill floors and ceilings to different classes seems like extremely bad design, because all top players will then either quit or migrate to one of the classes with the higher skill ceiling. The classes, especially the weak ones, need an overhaul.

I agre with u sabre that warriors need some love, as it is only 100b is viabl.e

daydream.2938:

People who think thiefs are the most powerful i just dont get it. It isnt bourne out by there performance in competitive matchs.

Because the majority of players really could care less about the ‘competitive matches’ in tourney’s. For a few reasons, but one of the big ones:

This is conquest, not deathmatch.

The majority of players really just don’t seem to give a flying kitten about conquest as it’s a completely boring game mode. Player vs Circle FTL. So exciting to watch, that’s why stream viewer numbers are so high too.

Seriously, only the smallest group of players all sitting in a tiny circle running tourneys to farm pugs and face each other constantly in R3 give a poop about player vs circle while marveling at their own magnificence. It’s dull.

I’m actually not trying to be a jerk, it probably comes off that way I’m sure, I’m just trying to be blunt.

Thiefs may well be the strongest wvwvw class.

Well thief and d/d ele. Thief really just because invisibility is stupid, and because of culling issues far more stupid than it normally is with a good thief only appearing on-screen for the enemy 10% of the fight.