Guild Wars 2

PREFACE
- The design of the Elementalist is the very first one made by Anet Devs, in it you can find all the original concepts the Devs wanted to initially implement in the game, to obtain the most optimal balance.

-Taking in consideration the lack of cast bars the Devs wanted to make sure the player had enough visual clues for the next move of his opponent, so that active dodging could be used.

- As direct successor of GW1, the idea of team play had to be somehow integrated into GW2 with its new mechanics like : combo fields and conquest game mode

…..Evolution of GW2 since beta

The initial complexity of the game has been greatly reduced in favour of mindless spamm and auto-attack winning “strategies”, I have no doubts that this was done to make sure GW2 would remain true to what advertised prior to launch : " a simplified and still rewarding pvp system, more accessible compared to GW1"…..and this is why the game currently lack the appeal of GW1 in general, even the post launch version of GW1 was still more balanced and enjoyable compared to its successor, but better to leave this to another thread.

The problem now is the ele , its core design is greatly outdated or rather it’s completely incongruent with the current state of the game where everything has been reduced to a fire and forget mega brawl where the more “advanced” player ( faster on the keyboard ) win the aoe spamm war.

Concepts like : teamplay – timed use of combo fields – team strategies, have all been discarded in favour of godlike builds capable of everything on their own : capping-decapping- duellist-support- selfress and more, this is how I see GW2 today:

[img]http://i.imgur.com/39xBgWV.png[/img]

How ele can be fixed

By trying to “update” the old concept and make it viable for the current version of the game..and the direction is going.
But this should be done while making sure not to add more fuel to the fire, for instance some current broken skills should scaled down accordingly :

1) Signet of spite
2) Berserker’s stance
3) Spirit of nature renewal
4) Larceneous strike

Then we can modify the current base attunement recharge and base HP , why the ele must be the only profession that get taxed twice for using its own main mechanic?

Arcana
The main mechanic is what define the profession and should be given to the players irrespectively of the build used, if ele is supposed to be played only by switching attunements how is it possible that we get punished if we don’t invest 40% of our traits pts to actually be able to switch attunement?

The devs initially advertised the ele as a class able to switch to the right attunement at the right time and situation, meaning an ele could have chosen to use only 2 elements out of 4, we have the water attunement clearly intended for survival, so we should have been able to comfortably sit in one attunement and switch to water only if the situation would require so..but this is no the case

Even the disposition of the trait lines can be used to certify the truthfulness of my statements, it’s possible to notice how each trait line for the ele favour the player to stick to one attunement at time instead of rapid switching between them

Maybe it’s time for the devs to realize how unviable is the this attunement mechanic….

How to fix the Ele:
Nerf all the stupid bullkitten builds people are playing right now. Looking at you, spirit rangers, necros, and s/d thieves.

Though I agree, requiring 30 points in Arcana makes for very limited builds. The ele forums have been (rightfully) complaining about this for a long time. Hopefully the devs are creative enough to figure out a change. Possibly incorporate an elite that reduces attunement recharge (Signet of Arcana?) that would allow people to invest less points in the trait tree? God knows Eles have awful elites for most situations.

Base HP

Another double tax for the ele, being forced in having the lowest HP and base armor in the game is somewhat justified by these unrequested water heals..but to access these heals the ele is forced in investing again 30-40% of its trait pts in a specific trait line.

Where is it the so called versatility of the ele? I’m forced in investing in two specific trait lines to even play the profession..let alone make my own build.

The base HP should be increased by 5K and the ele should not more depend so much on healing, this can be achieved by halving the base healing of water skills, add a secondary effect like an evasion maneuver and so on.

Epilogue
Tried to be as much coincise as possible , in general my experience with the ele in GW2 is not nearly as enjoyable as it was in GW1, the profession has lost most of its original appeal and the whole “jack of all trades and master of none” design concept really doesn’t suit well with the actual implementation

I am o.k. with having strong burst-healing if that is considered inherent to our class, but it should be MUCH easier to get. I would just get rid of evasive arcana and place that effect on the 5-point minor (for each attunement). Make the current 5-point minors into a trait in the arcane tree (arcane level 15, as that trait is bugged anyway). Reduce the base recharge rate to 12 and make arcana 1/2 as effective. Finally, improve our auto-attacks so that attunement dancing isn’t the only viable way to stay in the ball-park of other class’s damage.

BlackBeard.2873:

I am o.k. with having strong burst-healing if that is considered inherent to our class, but it should be MUCH easier to get. I would just get rid of evasive arcana and place that effect on the 5-point minor (for each attunement). Make the current 5-point minors into a trait in the arcane tree (arcane level 15, as that trait is bugged anyway). Reduce the base recharge rate to 12 and make arcana 1/2 as effective. Finally, improve our auto-attacks so that attunement dancing isn’t the only viable way to stay in the ball-park of other class’s damage.

The funny thing is there is no real problem with having strong auto-attack skills, after all you can only use one attunement at time am I right? So why the devs have given the ele such awful auto-attacks..is behind me, they’ve got no excuse whatsoever..even an elementary kid could see the mistake.

If our auto-attacks would deal sufficient dmg, the ele would not feel forced in rapidly witching attunement to maximise dmg, using all it’s mid tier skills ( 2 to 4) in some complicate combo

rsq.3581:

How to fix the Ele:
Nerf all the stupid bullkitten builds people are playing right now. Looking at you, spirit rangers, necros, and s/d thieves.

Though I agree, requiring 30 points in Arcana makes for very limited builds. The ele forums have been (rightfully) complaining about this for a long time. Hopefully the devs are creative enough to figure out a change. Possibly incorporate an elite that reduces attunement recharge (Signet of Arcana?) that would allow people to invest less points in the trait tree? God knows Eles have awful elites for most situations.

No, we don’t solve a problem by introducing another.
If we had a signet elite that reduce attunement recharge we would not only make the 30 Arcana ele really OP but also we would force another “must have” skill on the ele…the cantrips and SoR are already enough in my opinion and that also must change

I think there may be multiple ways to go about solving some of the problems. Perhaps the Arcane trait tree can be largely left alone IF each attunement was a bit more stand alone in each weapon set. I don’t mean changing any of the skills drastically, but boosting certain aspects or adding another aspect … like an evade on fire dagger 3, a heal/water field on water focus 4 or 5, longer duration on auras, etc. Not to mention, as was stated previously, a proper damage increase to autoattacks.

If evasive arcana were incorporated into each trait line, an alternative 30 point arcane talent could easily be a passive bonus to stats based on your current attunement in sort of the same vein as the 10 point arcane boon trait, or vice versa. Currently the 5 point traits don’t seem to play all that much of a factor except for water and arcane.

Additionally, other professions get a single trait for reducing 50% of their weapon cooldowns (usually with an additional effect) while an ele requires a single trait for 25% of their weapon cooldowns (with no additional effect).

Personally, I like the burst healing aspect of the ele and I don’t think base health should change. Healing can be increased by boosting the heals we already have available (our signet is stupidily sad compared to warriors, but that is a different story). Also, water skill heals can have their base heal boosted and healing trait scaling reduced to compensate.

Allarius.5670:

I think there may be multiple ways to go about solving some of the problems. Perhaps the Arcane trait tree can be largely left alone IF each attunement was a bit more stand alone in each weapon set. I don’t mean changing any of the skills drastically, but boosting certain aspects or adding another aspect … like an evade on fire dagger 3, a heal/water field on water focus 4 or 5, longer duration on auras, etc. Not to mention, as was stated previously, a proper damage increase to autoattacks.

If evasive arcana were incorporated into each trait line, an alternative 30 point arcane talent could easily be a passive bonus to stats based on your current attunement in sort of the same vein as the 10 point arcane boon trait, or vice versa. Currently the 5 point traits don’t seem to play all that much of a factor except for water and arcane.

Additionally, other professions get a single trait for reducing 50% of their weapon cooldowns (usually with an additional effect) while an ele requires a single trait for 25% of their weapon cooldowns (with no additional effect).

Personally, I like the burst healing aspect of the ele and I don’t think base health should change. Healing can be increased by boosting the heals we already have available (our signet is stupidily sad compared to warriors, but that is a different story). Also, water skill heals can have their base heal boosted and healing trait scaling reduced to compensate.

The ele has after all 20 skills akittens disposal so it’s logical to have an attunement recharge reduction trait in each attunement, what we need now is an additional effect to each one of them

Arheundel.6451:

The ele has after all 20 skills akittens disposal so it’s logical to have an attunement recharge reduction trait in each attunement, what we need now is an additional effect to each one of them

You are absolutely correct. I think I got caught up in the moment.

Would it be better to improve every other class animations, it might be more work and probably unrealistic, but it will make guild wars 2 combat better and less spammy. They claim animation is important but it only seems to apply to elementalist.

For your the record your suggestion is probably way better and more realistic and cheaper.

Arheundel.6451:

No, we don’t solve a problem by introducing another.
If we had a signet elite that reduce attunement recharge we would not only make the 30 Arcana ele really OP but also we would force another “must have” skill on the ele…the cantrips and SoR are already enough in my opinion and that also must change

Clearly, you’d cap the attunement recharge at 10s if this were added. Assuming the signet gave 2s off of recharge and had an extremely situational active, people would choose between evasive arcana and our current elites or this signet and 20 points in arc (no EA). Would open up a little bit of build variety without messing up current builds.
It was just an idea.

Look, simple and plain the attunement concept is going to stay. And it should – a single element elementalist would be pretty dumb. The way that we dance through the attunements – while flawed – is incredibly fun. We shouldn’t want Anet to make the ele like all of the other classes. They’ve made an exceptionally unique caster and I would hate to see it dumbed down to the level of some of the other professions (no offense, other profession fanbois). I really believe that the ele is well balanced right now and is in a good place. It’s just that some other professions offer too much for too little. Seriously — nerf the spirit ranger (spirits start their cooldown when killed, like for real already), nerf the necro, and nerf the s/d thief’s mindless evades and you will have an ele (not to mention a slew of other classes) in a really great spot. Not perfect, mind you, but certainly not bottom-tier as they are now.

As for the attunement recharge problem. Yes, it is certainly a problem. No one is arguing with you on that point. However, I think we’re too far along in the game to implement anything really ground shattering (I would only expect something like that from an expansion). So we’ve got to work with what we have for the moment. I can really only see a couple of ways the devs can work around Arcana with its current state — some sort of utility that would allow us to bypass attunement recharge (in some capacity, I don’t know how. That’s why I suggested the elite signet that would allow us to put only 20 points into the tree) OR they need to make traits in other trees much more desirable. Why would I go 30 into fire for fury when I can already have it on attunement swap, when I need it for burst? Why isn’t there a 30 fire trait that can complement Fresh Air for mega damage? You’d sacrifice a lot of survivability for better burst on a longer cooldown. Or an Earth/Water trait combo that would help us become midpoint bunkers?

I’m kind of rambling at this point… Long story short, Eles will always choose Arcana and shorter cooldowns until there are traits outside of the tree that are more desirable or utilities that can bypass attunement recharge (Fresh Air was a great step for both of these). But for real, the first step is to nerf the OP classes. Can’t wait for the next balance patch – there are a lot of people expecting major (and solid) change.

@rsq

Make this possible signet elite a 45-60s CD ( for 25s duration if kitten CD elite and 40s duration if 60s CD..and yes I did think about the use of signet mastery trait ) and we have a deal, maybe make so that this elite signet gives a flat 10s CD regardless of the original attunement investment in this way, a player may chose to go arcana to have a specific trait rather than out of necessity .

Now let’s make signet traits a bit more useful and give signet of fire another passive effect ( the crit chance passive it’s rather useless )

Arheundel.6451:

How ele can be fixed
Then we can modify the current base attunement recharge and base HP , why the ele must be the only profession that get taxed twice for using its own main mechanic?

Add impossibility to weapon swap, very low damage from normal attacks, and huge mobility nerf to the taxes.

All of this because we can attunement dance, and heal (but only if heavily spec’d for it).

For eles to be what you described, having high versatility and able to focus on a single attunement would require a global resource system. Right now with the resource only being cooldowns, it is not shared between attunements, thus the best way to play is to rapidly cycle to maximize the resources available.

Thief is too extreme with no cooldowns but having lower cooldowns in favor a an energy resource would allow each set to stand on their own better and allow more choice over which skills to focus on.

I don’t think anet should buff ANYTHING until they nerf the clearly op specs. There has been a massive power creep over the last couple of months. It’s now almost a matter of paper rock scissors and matches that are determined by comp before the game even begins and it’s because most classes do what they too way too well.

Batmang.5421:

I don’t think anet should buff ANYTHING until they nerf the clearly op specs. There has been a massive power creep over the last couple of months. It’s now almost a matter of paper rock scissors and matches that are determined by comp before the game even begins and it’s because most classes do what they too way too well.

^^ What that guy said.

I think that altering all of the weapon skills with built in evades and finding a creative way to make cleansing more capable of dealing with the problematic builds is probably the best solution (rather than nerfing all of them to death).

If you think about it a lot of the problems caused by condi overload comps stemmed from introducing new conditions without introducing more/stronger cleanses. Prior to the 6/13 patch there was just enough cleansing to keep up with conditions, but it has been a lost cause ever since. I’m not advocating buffing anything necessarily, but perhaps making cleanses more specific to stripping DoTs (by changing the priority system) and altering field/finisher interaction to provide more cleansing.

The evade on weapon skills is a bit harder one to deal with. Perhaps if you make immobilize prevent teleportation and dodging that would be enough to put these skills back in the relative value ballpark of the other skills in the game. Currently the ability to have 40% or more evade up time is just way over the top.

Batmang.5421:

I don’t think anet should buff ANYTHING until they nerf the clearly op specs. There has been a massive power creep over the last couple of months. It’s now almost a matter of paper rock scissors and matches that are determined by comp before the game even begins and it’s because most classes do what they too way too well.

Well I was suggesting mechanic changes rather than straight buffs to skills, having a lower base CD on attunement would promote build diversity but using the skills and numbers of now and higher base HP would eliminate the need to use water trait line in almost every build

Well, the ele is one of the classes that actually have a “decent” skillfloor. A class that needs to be played intelligent. Ele has (besides of the Air-attunement and the arcane-utilities) pretty good animations, which can be, just by looking at which attunement the ele is on, predicted. This actually gives some room of counter-play. For an example, dodging updraftes / spikes or start to burst after he switched off from water-att. and so on. Also the ele has some sort of combos he rolls. It’s not only spamming buttons on cd. Burst-eles were a good mix of risk-reward play and needed besides timing a good awareness of the combat-situation.

All these things make the elementalist a class that is well fitted. The reason why many ppl have the impression this class needs a “fix” or an “update” is, that the meta nowadays is just a complete mess (described by you) and shows on how many areas this game has big issues (AoE, instant casts, animationproblems, AI, spam in general, passive traits/abilites and so on…).

However, the right way to fix is not to adapt a class to the rest of them, but to look at the game overall and see the problems on the core-mechanics. PPl need to get that!