Guild Wars 2

Hey fellow players!

This post is going to concentrate on a vision for Guild Wars 2. Something to strive for to make Guild Wars 2 a better game, with hopefully bigger success; especially competitively. However, with each suggestion I will try to keep in mind that we have two other games modes as well. The foundation for every change will be already existing skills and features, to limit the amount of extra work required to make this work. Hopefully, this direction will set the standard for future content and features. To keep the post as short as possible, I will only talk about very few specific skills, but the general way of thinking could be applied to other skills currently in the game.

So what do I want to change and how?
The title briefly hints and what I want to change in GW2, which is teamplay and coordination between players. And how is that going to be achieved? Well, that is in fact not that difficult, since I believe there is already a very nice existing foundation for it. Let’s have a look at some of the current viable elite skills:

Basilisk Venom:
Short cooldown skill. Extremely selfish and does not allow for any synergy with other players.
Fiery Greatsword:
Basically used as a movement-tool. Does not allow for any synergy or teamplay.
Renewed Focus:
Used on both support and DPS guardian. Extremely selfish, does not allow teamplay.
Signet Of Rage:
Grants basic buffs and nothing more. No synergy.
Supply Crate:
Mostly used as an “I win”-button for duels. Brings a little support, but nothing that adds synergy.

Okay. So as you can see, a lot of the current meta elites are very selfish and stale. They do not allow interesting gameplay – Let’s get to the point. I will take some of the currently non-viable elite skills, and change them in a way that showcases my vision.

Tornado:
This skill is currently unviable, since what it does it actually what you would want it NOT to do, it pushes players or mobs away. This is making it MORE difficult for your team/party to do anything, so it’s extremely selfish. I want Tornado to actually draw enemies closer to it’s center (much like a tornado actually does), the closer you are to the center the more damage you take and the slower you move. It should be static, so you would actually have to set it up properly before use. Now the skill could actually make a difference in teamfights, if you coordinate it well with your team. How to coordinate it and how to counter-play it, we’ll get to later. The skill already has a great animation and is well telegraphed (even the power-up), no extra work would be required on the animation-part.

Dagger Storm:
Another Elite Skill that is telegraphed extremely well, with a nicely done animation. Unfortunately it is not viable at the moment. I would change the skill to have a higher cooldown and remove the bleed-stacks. The cripple could stay, since it does not make any significant difference. I would increase the base damage, and additionally give the skill a life-leech which would also function as a damage boost. Nothing more really needs to be done. Why would I do this? I would do this to simply increase the damage, thus making the skill something with a significant role in teamfights. The life-leeching has two functions: Thieves are squishy and need some way to stay alive if they cannot stealth. With life-leech the thief would be much better suited to survive a teamfight should the enemy team use retaliation. Retaliation would otherwise simply be too easy a counter.

You can probably already imagine how a coordinated team could use these two new elites with great synergy. An elementalist uses Tornado and grabs 4 enemy players, thief instantly pops Dagger Storm. This may seem imba, like a “win-combo” with no counters. So let’s look at ways to actually react to this new combo.

CONTINUED

Tome of Courage:
Currently a very interesting skill. Allows the guardian to get 5 new skills which could potentially be a huge deal, but it isn’t. Why not? Because for the #5 skill to have any use, it would as a minimum take 5-1/4 seconds to get it off. 1 second to channel the tome itself, 4-1/4 to actually channel the heal. Nobody can think 5 seconds into the future and magically time a perfect heal, it’s simply not going to happen. Another factor is that, for some classes getting fully healed is really not a big deal. They could potentially be insta-gibbed the second after, especially because the tome is most likely used when already in a very difficult situation. Give the tome channel a ½ second cast-time and the heal approximately 2 seconds. Additionally grant every ally 1-2 second invulnerability. The invulnerability could also be the #3rd skill, which shoots out in a cone, making it slightly more difficult to use (which is good).
This new skill could function as a counter to the new combo that I just introduced before. The guardian could potentially save his whole team from wiping, by using a stunbreak or having stability and then go for the heal. Keep in mind that the heal can obviously still be interrupted without stability, if you’re fast enough; 2½ seconds should be enough time. Even existing skills that see little or limited play will probably get used even more often. If a warrior survived or joined the fight later, he could ress his whole team with Warbanner. A Mesmer could use Illusion Of Life with potentially HUGE outcome, Time Warp would become extremely interesting in this scenario and even the warrior healing ability “Defiant Stance” could get some play.

Think about how Entangle, Tome of Wrath and Plague Form could all be extremely exciting skills with very little effort. Instead they are now getting spammed and EASILY countered (Entangle), or function as selfish “I will survive this kitten”-skills (Plague Form).
The skills that I have changed would also benefit PvE, since Tornado could now be used on large groups of mobs for greater AoE-cleave instead of pushing them away making it more difficult. Tome Of Courage could (as in PvP) do extremely nice clutches and saves.

To keep the post from getting any longer, I won’t post any more specific suggestions. But keep in mind that these changes could potentially be totally different if Anet has other ideas. It’s the general concept behind the skills that I think would benefit the game – It’s a direction more than specific suggestions. Higher risk/reward and more coordination between teams. GW2 needs to be more about teamplay and less about winning duels by sustaining yourself.

If you actually read everything, then I salute you! Leaving a comment is the best you can do if you agree, and even if you disagree I’d really appreciate if you would leave a comment that argues why.

Basilisk Venom, Fiery Greatsword, Supply Crate, Renewed Focus, and Tornado all have team applications.

Basilisk Venom you call to setup a spike, just like any CC,

Fiery Greatsword you leave on the map for your allies to rotate more quickly.

Supply crate has so much team support I’m confused as to why it was brought up, you drop health kits for allies and stun for stomp situations, and applies loads of pressure.

Renewed Focus gives you your virtues back so you can pop them for team support, it’s also a useful LoS tool for your team vs projectiles.

Tornado is useful in down situations to knock the enemy off their ally, it’s also good in conquest for the same reasons.

But there is still very limited synergy and/or team-coordination.
Basilisk Venom is mainly used whenever it’s off cooldown, and simply as an extra stun for a better burst. There is no synergy with any skills. You can set up a burst with any other stun or immobilizing skill.

Fiery Greatsword can be dropped for your allies to pick, but that’s it. Doesn’t require any form of coordination, and still just used for mobility.

Renewed Focus is used simply as a panic-button, yes you get a few boons from your virtues, but you don’t need to set it up with your team. Do it whenever and it’s all good.

Supply Crate can be used to stun and interrupt which is nice. Aside from the stun the support is mainly just AI or packs you can pick up. No need to coordinate anything with your team.

Tornado. Let’s get realistic here, nobody uses it aside from a few people in skyhammer. Yes it can be used to interrupt stomps or resses, but still has no synergy and requires no teamwork to be useful.

You can reach the full potential of all these skills in a solo-situation, which is what I want to avoid. I want skills that become extremely powerful if they are coordinated well within the team, and may be lacking in a solo situation or without a proper setup.

KrisHQ.4719:

You can reach the full potential of all these skills in a solo-situation, which is what I want to avoid. I want skills that become extremely powerful if they are coordinated well within the team, and may be lacking in a solo situation or without a proper setup.

The full potential of the skills I listed is achieved when synchronizing them with your team. The results are simply more potent when used in team situations as I described, as opposed to when used individually.

Shockwave.1230:

KrisHQ.4719:

You can reach the full potential of all these skills in a solo-situation, which is what I want to avoid. I want skills that become extremely powerful if they are coordinated well within the team, and may be lacking in a solo situation or without a proper setup.

The full potential of the skills I listed is achieved when synchronizing them with your team. The results are simply more potent when used in team situations as I described, as opposed to when used individually.

So placing a Fiery Greatsword is synchonizing with your team? Renewed Focus reaching it’s full potential by coordinating its use? How would you do that?
Even so, skills like Supply Crate are even stronger the less players around, which means it actually loses potential if you’re with your team.
I’m sorry. I just don’t see the current coordination it takes.

Venom Share
Warrior Shouts
Banner
Wells (boon strip, protection on point, cleave)
Ele Attunement Buffs
Guardian Stand Your Ground and pretty much the whole class including kill set up
Spirit Ranger

Maybe the real problem is some selfish builds are better than support builds? Either way, some support builds like Venom Share are no joke though.

I can see guys didn’t quite understand the point KrisHQ was trying to make, so let me make it clear for you.

Targeting an ally != Teamwork

The examples both Amir and Shockwave gave, are simply skills which happens to target allies when used. Using a Warrior shout, or activating a Virtue, has nothing to do with teamwork between people, since they only require the action of 1 player to be effective.

You’re both right, that the listed skills are most effective when also hitting allies, but that’s far beside the point of the OP. Even though no allies are nearby, you’d still activate those skills for the selfish effects they give. As stated, there’s no teamwork involved in activating a skill, and then randomly hitting an ally.

Now, let me explain the concept of the OP, by drawing parallels to moba games like Dota 2:

The Enchantress have a skill called "Nature’s Attendants" in which "A cloud of wisps heals Enchantress and any friendly units nearby". This skill is similar to that of "Virtue of Resolve", since both skills heals the user and any allies within range. The Enchantress will never wait for a ’perfect opportunity’ to activate this skill, as the benefit to oneself is easily powerful enough to justify the use. Having it hit a teammate is ’just’ a bonus. All this is similar to Virtue of Resolve.

On the other end, we have a skill like "Black Hole" from the Enigma. This reads: "Summons a vortex that sucks in nearby enemy units. Enemies affected by Black Hole cannot move, attack, or cast spells. The closer units get to the center, the more damage is dealt." Using this skill when you’re on your own, is rarely a good idea. Spamming it, so it’s potentially on cooldown for a big fight, is extremely risky. The Enigma will almost never use this skill if he has no allies around, as the benefit is too low.
This would be similar to a skill such as "Time Warp" in GW2.

With this comparison, I hope I cleared up what KrisHQ was initially trying to say. We need more skills (Elites) like Enigma’s "Black Hole", where skills are able to interact with each other (and require multiple people for them to be considered effective), and fewer skills like "Nature’s Attendants", which are strong on its own, and simply slightly better if they hit a teammate.

Remember, for it to be considered teamwork, it has to require the action of multiple players. A Guardian using "Light of Deliverance" to clutch-heal a teammate, is excellent individual skill on the Guardians part. Not teamwork. A Mesmer using Time Warp, just after a Ranger popped Entangle - that’s effective teamwork.

Such possibilities are already in the game, but KrisHQ is suggesting skillchanges to unused (or selfish) elites, to facilitate even more of it. Hope that helped.

I think warbanner, time warp, Lich, and the tomes are the skills you’re looking for then.

These elites you’d save for a team fight and require coordinating with your team to be able to land these effectively.

Shockwave.1230:

I think warbanner, time warp, Lich, and the tomes are the skills you’re looking for then.

These elites you’d save for a team fight and require coordinating with your team to be able to land these effectively.

I think you’re absolutely right, and we’re merely suggesting changes to some of the lesser used (or very selfish) skills, since we would like more coordinated teamwork in the game.

the only way to “Bring teamwork” to this game, is to find someone willing to play with you.

In short, make friends, play together, enjoy the game together and finally, succeed together. It is the only way to get teamwork.

Well, there is a “shortcut”. It’s called “Teamspeak”. And even in pug groups, it goes a long way in improving even the worst of individual players.

Prysin.8542:

the only way to “Bring teamwork” to this game, is to find someone willing to play with you.

In short, make friends, play together, enjoy the game together and finally, succeed together. It is the only way to get teamwork.

Well, there is a “shortcut”. It’s called “Teamspeak”. And even in pug groups, it goes a long way in improving even the worst of individual players.

I rarely play alone, so I definitely have experience playing with a team.
However, there are still very few skills that actually require any real coordination.
One of the few skills that actually needs coordination is Portal, which is indeed a very interesting skill. This post is a suggestion to bring GW2 in a direction where such skills are not one out of ten. A good way to start would be with elites, since a lot of them are extremely egocentric, yet they all have a great foundation for such changes.

@Shockwave
Yes, you are right. Those skills are the ones that comes closest to requiring coordination. A skill such as Lich Form is merely used for straight up damage purposes though. It would be great if it actually had a few of the skills changed, that would allow it for even greater coordinated setups, and interesting plays.

Guardian is supposed to be THE support class. And yes it has some nice support function. But I have more effect on the game running Meditations. I have a much higher winning % with Meds than Bunker. This tells me that support is not as strong as it could be.

The game seems to lead itself toward cheesy and selfish builds by perhaps undermining support and overemphasising dps. Even with Guardian the 15 stacks of might off Empower seems much more beneficial to your team than the heal it delivers… so it seems to promote dps dps dps. Note I only comment on Guardian because it is The support class and I know it well… I will leave the other classes to those that play them.

I would like to see strong dps be more reliant on the support you are with. Ranger, Thief or Shatter Mesmer for example deliver incredible dps all on its own. It does not need support to annihilate people. I would love to see dps toned down a little and become more reliant on having the right buffs from your party at the right time.

Of course this means that more unselfish skills need to be improved across the board. Things like Shouts for example could be expanded dramatically.

Wait there wasn’t teamwork in this game? Ohh you mean hot join and poor solo ques where no one gives 2 craps and does what they want more or less.
Basi venom can be “team based” if you use venom share…lul. But seriously look at things like renewed focus and basi and the build/class that uses them. Thieves are meant to be selfish, they just roam and burst. Medi guard uses RF, it’s glassy, it needs to be selfish. SoR? How would you want to make this “team based”? Give give everyone the buffs? That’s a bit much. ….Supply Crate? Why the hell was this even mentioned? It’s one of if not the best elite in the game..amazing team support and it wins duels enough said.
PS Wakkey uses tornado, it’s hilarious but it works fine.

@SaintSnow
I dont want to change everything to be team-oriented. There has be solo/duel specs that are very selfish. This adds variety to the game, and allows people to solo roam in WvW and what not. It’s good.
However, there has to be ways for teams to really coordinate some great plays. This has been done very few times with for instance Portal, and even Mass Invisibility. I’m from the days where Illusion Of Life was meta, and there were actually some great plays with it. It really needs a good setup to be useful, else you’re just wasting a 130s CD.

As have already been explained, simply because a skill affects allies it does not necessarily promote teamwork (interaction between allies), and this the key point of this post. Shouts are great examples of such skills. They affects allies and grant support in form of boons and condition removal, but there is no way your allies can interact with them.

You mention Supply Crate, but I’ll still argue that it does not promote any teamwork or coordination. The skill is very strong; that’s true, but when you’ve played it, the support simply comes from AI standing on the ground. Neither your allies or opponents can react to it in any way.
It does grant support, but it does not promote coordination and teamwork.
Hope I made things clearer.

So what you’re saying is you would like to see more skills that allow other players to interact with? Things like portal and IoL for example get the most benefit with coordination, which seems you want more of. That only happens with communication which is non existent in hotjoin/solo que and even in team que if it’s just a PuG.
There has been talk of trying to implement a possible “wheel” with basic commands that one can easily navigate through and put in chat to notify your teamates of what your plan is. Kinda like what the current system in LoL is.

It would be very helpful if people read the post, instead of the just the title, before commenting.

@Prysin
Your comment is way off. Yes, playing with friends can promote teamwork in many different forms. Rotating correctly, spiking, CC’ing, Lord Rushing etc., but that’s not the point of the thread. Please read my previous, rather lengthy, comment for clarification. It’s not about teamwork in general, but about the interaction of skills between professions.

@SaintSnow
Again - you missed the point. Granting someone a buff is not teamwork. It’s assistance. Thus, your comment about making SoR give allies the same buffs, proves how you didn’t understand the point of the thread. Please clarify how I’m able to interact with a Venom Buff, other than simply activating it on a hit. Please tell me what skills I can use to interact with the Supply Crate, other than what I would normally use to kill someone.

Team support is not teamwork. Hence why they’re called two different things. Get it?

You have to understand, we want interaction between skills. I use skill X, you use skill Y, these two skills create an effective interaction. It’s really not that hard to understand.

EDIT:

SaintSnow.6593:

So what you’re saying is you would like to see more skills that allow other players to interact with? Things like portal and IoL for example get the most benefit with coordination, which seems you want more of. That only happens with communication which is non existent in hotjoin/solo que and even in team que if it’s just a PuG.

You are close, but not quite. Interacting with the skill itself is not a requirement, but a definite plus. If you’ve ever played Dota 2, then consider: Enigma’s "Black Hole" + Shadow Fiend’s "Requiem of Souls". Two skills interacting with each other to create the perfect combo. That is what we want more of in Guild Wars 2.

An example from LoL - Courtesy of a guildmate:
Amumu’s "Curse of the Sad Mummy" + Miss Fortune’s "Bullet Time"

So classes interacting to further the utility or damage of a skill. Like powerrangers all jumping into a large mech suit to destroy kitten. As good as this sounds on paper, it would be honestly too much and frankly too good.

SaintSnow.6593:

So classes interacting to further the utility or damage of a skill. Like powerrangers all jumping into a large mech suit to destroy kitten. As good as this sounds on paper, it would be honestly too much and frankly too good.

Yes, this could be one way to achieve it.
Another simple example to showcase what I mean could be:
Plague Form:
Become a virulent cloud that cripples enemies and amplify damage they take by 30% (number is irrelevant).
This skill would be extremely bad alone, which Plague Form now currently isn’t, since it lets you stay alive for an extra 20 seconds.
It would be a skill that depended on interaction with other skills, and if used correctly it could be devastating.
Imagine how it would combo with the reworked Dagger Storm or Tornado (see OP).