Guild Wars 2

I absolutely love playing on skyhammer most of the time. Sure, sometimes I want to try out a build for tPvP that isn’t designed for that map, but I have no issue playing it.

It seems like every time someone complains about that map, I see them running something I’d see on Khylo. Why? If you aren’t running a build designed to kick kitten on a map, you can’t be surprised when I win. I switch to mesmer on khylo. Know why? Because mesmers are beast on khylo. If you run zero moving CCs, of course I’m going to win. It’s a different game. It’s no longer a duel, it’s a game of human golf. You can’t be surprised if you can’t hit the golf ball as far as me using a sword.

It’s not even like all classes don’t have a good way of knocking people on that map:

1. Necromancer – Fears, Grasp
2. Engineers – Not enough characters to fit this.
3. Warriors – Hammer, Stomp, Kick, Fear Me
4. Thieves – Stealth Pulls, Stealing From Necromancers, Traps on glass
5. Mesmer – Focus, Greatsword, Reflecting certain pulls
6. Ranger – Longbow (SO STRONG!), counter attack, path of scars
7. Guardians – Not enough characters to fit this.
8. Elementalist – Gale, Immobilizing on glass, Updraft, TORNADO!

If you don’t switch up to incorporate those, it’s really your own fault. Skyhammer is about changing the way you think about the game. If you don’t, you’re going to have a bad time.

I’m interested, really. I have three questions:

1. When you play skyhammer, do you run a new build specifically for that map?
2. Do you change from your main profession to one that you believe suits the map more, even if you don’t like that class?
3. Do you enjoy skyhammer?

My answers: Yes, Nope, Yes.

1. no. i have “fear me!” equipped always.
2. no. i play warriors only.
3. hmmm. i’m a casual player. i’ll say i enjoy all maps equally casually.

those people rage because they refuse to adapt.

Deimos Tel Arin.7391:

1. no. i have “fear me!” equipped always.
2. no. i play warriors only.
3. hmmm. i’m a casual player. i’ll say i enjoy all maps equally casually.

*those people rage because they refuse to adapt. *

because hitting 1 button that fears people off the ledge makes you soooo skillful.

Bsgapollo.5364:

Deimos Tel Arin.7391:

1. no. i have “fear me!” equipped always.
2. no. i play warriors only.
3. hmmm. i’m a casual player. i’ll say i enjoy all maps equally casually.

*those people rage because they refuse to adapt. *

because hitting 1 button that fears people off the ledge makes you soooo skillful.

does it?
i dunno about that.
sorry!.

i do keep it for other scenarios as well.

by the way, though it may be “unblockable” i believe blind condition will counter it, and stability perhaps?

a stun breaker may cancel it off i think.

The problem is that some classes are just much better on skyham. When I fight an engi in skyhammer he can knockback/pull me like 5 times in 20s. me? scorp wire so about once in the same time. And while having all this cc engis can build very bunkerish so you cant take them down “the normal way”. That means that you have to be 5 times more skillfull (dodging all cc and hit your only cc well) just because you play another class. And when you make 1 mistake you’re dead, while other classes just throw a stability (looking at you waris). This map brings a huge imbalance between classey and therefore it sucks.

Most ppl hate this map because certain profession have a huge advantage over the others.

profession like necro, guardian, engi, mesmer have the possibility to dispatch of MULTIPLE enemies with little effort. Although I believe that for them that might be really fun, to every one else is simply frustrating.

also the cannon deals way to much dmg. Professions with a low base hp pool get 1 shoted by it.

overall the map looks good but is very frustrating.

The Gates Assassin.9827:

It’s not even like all classes don’t have a good way of knocking people on that map:

1. Necromancer – Fears, Grasp
2. Engineers – Not enough characters to fit this.
3. Warriors – Hammer, Stomp, Kick, Fear Me
4. Thieves – Stealth Pulls, Stealing From Necromancers, Traps on glass
5. Mesmer – Focus, Greatsword, Reflecting certain pulls
6. Ranger – Longbow (SO STRONG!), counter attack, path of scars
7. Guardians – Not enough characters to fit this.
8. Elementalist – Gale, Immobilizing on glass, Updraft, TORNADO!

Great! Now make the same list with the access to stability plz.
Then, make one with AoEs, as they are extremly strong, especially, when fighting on the canon.
Furthermore, plz make a list about the stuff you can place right on the exit of the portal on canon to immediatly dmg attackers, like marks and turrets.

In addition, you also dont cover stuff like bad distribution of bunkers via the MM system.

Every map in sPvP, even Capricorn is “balanced” if you have to preset teams, knowing, which map they will play, so that they can base their team setup up on the requirements of the map.
But throwing 10 random players on a map for which it is essential to alter your build or even to change your profession, is a realy bad idea.

Some classes lack the ability to stop getting feared off the edge while others have a hundred ways.
Sometimes it’s just not possible without ruining your entire spec, really.

Its a badly designed map in many ways. The endless knocking people off (or fearing them etc) that really promotes cheese play.

Oh and lets talk about that cannon shall we? lets talk about that thing you cannot dodge. You can dodge trebs, but oh no, not the cannon, nothing will stop the kittening cannon ever. Oh and whilst you were busy trying to avoid that, you got perma feared and whacked off the edge, oh giggle. Whats that, some glass just broke, giggle, I hope you were not waiting for a PVP match before this babybel cheese-a-rama starts.

This is ANet perfect, cannot fix the broken and dying parts of pvp, instead they just add new stupid map mechanics that seek to again remove the PVP from PVP. Why is the current trend among PVP to not PVP? We just want to fight on a somewhat equal footing, not play fear off the canon platform, knock off most of the of side walks, 4thiefs vs 5 warriors, afk afk afk afk afk afk afk afk afk afk afk afk afk.

I will stake my house and hat on the fact that is the same level of problems and decay were effecting the PVE and more importantly the Black Lion Trading Post, oh boy would we see the insta patches rolling out. Typical MMO short sightedness, keep going for the easy access to the wallet as opposed to building and maintaining a solid playerbase on a game that at least appears close to fair. Warhammer online basically dying over Christmas, yeah, look on ANet and take a long hard look at what happens when you do so little to address issues that have been a problem SINCE BETA!

>But throwing 10 random players on a map for which it is essential to alter your build >or even to change your profession, is a realy bad idea.

^^ This very much.

I don’t understand why team queue can skip this map but less coordinated solo-queue must go through guessing game what class composition will be.

I used to cry myself to sleep over this map with my grenades engi. Then i switched to bombs, shield and flamethrower and took my rightful place as the god of skyhammer! How dare mere mortals reach my seat of power? How dare you complain after you got struck by my bolts of awesomeness?

[Seriously, this map is kitten. I’d rather bunker the ruins on capricorn than play this.]

it has almost everything i don’t want in a map..

a big cannon for noobs to use to kill someone on the other side of the map? CHECK.
lots of a(w)kward and unnecessary jumping? CHECK.
fall damage galore? CHECK.
death holes for troll knockback/pull spam builds to abuse? CHECK.

seriously, they should just throw some “water combat” in there too,
why hold back on the FAIL-o-meter when its so close to an absolute failure.

side note: why the hell is the word a(w)kward censored?!

Simple example

1) Bad players normaly win 20% , good players win 80%.

2) Skyhammer is map, where skill doesnt matter. It is all a random clusterfffk , just like flipping a coin.

given that 50/50 rule, the result is:

3) On skyhamer, bad player win 50% , good player win 50%.

BEST MAP, SUCH FAIR !

As a real pvper you’d prefer to play to win or lose in a skillfull way….and not in a cheesy one shot way.

On my engineers skyhammer build i have tons of ways to guarantee 100% knockoffs, with stealth etc. I had games with 18-20 knock of pull offs….yet i still despise this map. Its not about winning it, its about the way i lost or won.

join skyhammer as an ele and watch the kittenstorm before the game starts

Bsgapollo.5364:

Deimos Tel Arin.7391:

1. no. i have “fear me!” equipped always.
2. no. i play warriors only.
3. hmmm. i’m a casual player. i’ll say i enjoy all maps equally casually.

*those people rage because they refuse to adapt. *

because hitting 1 button that fears people off the ledge makes you soooo skillful.

Facing the portal usually fixes that problem. Don’t face a ledge and use your stun breakers to get out of CC. It’s easy to counter. As a thief i don’t have much CC that fears, knock back etc so the only chance i have is to use Steal on a necro and fear or i try to not face a ledge so they can’t fear, knock me back off the ledge.

It’s not that hard.

so you are telling me that if i switch to those skills i will not insta die when i try to cap home or far when some random mesmer/engy/theif come cloaked and just pull me out of nowhere to my death?.
gtfo its a bad map.
in some anet stream my guildies and I asked if skyhammer is that good why dont u guys implement it in team q? they were like durrrr durrrr arrrr

inc “ur bad l2 dodge”

Zoid.2568:

Bsgapollo.5364:

Deimos Tel Arin.7391:

1. no. i have “fear me!” equipped always.
2. no. i play warriors only.
3. hmmm. i’m a casual player. i’ll say i enjoy all maps equally casually.

*those people rage because they refuse to adapt. *

because hitting 1 button that fears people off the ledge makes you soooo skillful.

Facing the portal usually fixes that problem. Don’t face a ledge and use your stun breakers to get out of CC. It’s easy to counter. As a thief i don’t have much CC that fears, knock back etc so the only chance i have is to use Steal on a necro and fear or i try to not face a ledge so they can’t fear, knock me back off the ledge.

It’s not that hard.

Actually that was just one of the many problems with this map. There are certain advantages that are ridiculous, 1 is placing marks infront of the portal, you can’t dodge when you enter the portal so you take a kitten ton of condi’s, and your opponent can use them again because they are off cooldown. second thing is skyhammer itself. It’s undodgeable which makes other classes have greater advantages over others. For example a warrior can activate endure pain while still holding the point, an ele/mesmer can only use invulnerability to avoid the damage but they would start losing the point in the meantime. 3thly the cannons damage is based on how much toughness you have, making heavy armor classes or professions that stack toughness better over others since they are able to tank more. And the list goes on..
There’s a reason why most people dislike this map. It’s usually filled by cheese builds and depends on pure luck/what profession you’re playing in order to win.

there is no counterplay to stealth CC (pull or knockback)

stealth CC always wins

stealth is the issue imo – just like 4 man stealth to pop 1 enemy at the start of the game

no counterplay/skill involved

EverythingEnds.4261:

Great! Now make the same list with the access to stability plz.

But throwing 10 random players on a map for which it is essential to alter your build or even to change your profession, is a realy bad idea.

No only does my engineer not run stability in any way, but she also doesn’t run a stun breaker. And I still kick kitten . It’s all about positioning.

It’s also as simple as having another character that you switch to OR switching out one or two utilities for ones that push people off cliffs.

DaliIndica.9041:

This is ANet perfect, cannot fix the broken and dying parts of pvp, instead they just add new stupid map mechanics that seek to again remove the PVP from PVP. Why is the current trend among PVP to not PVP? We just want to fight on a somewhat equal footing, not play fear off the canon platform, knock off most of the of side walks, 4thiefs vs 5 warriors, afk afk afk afk afk afk afk afk afk afk afk afk afk.

See? This is exactly what I’m talking about. People think this isn’t PvP. It’s a different style of PvP. It’s not cheesy, it’s different. People tend to think any style of gameplay that isn’t 2 bunkers and 3 DPS rotating is “cheesy”. God forbid a map encourage something else. “HEY! THEY HAVE 2 MESMER and 2 THIEVES AND ARE ROTATING BETWEEN POINTS SUPER FAST! NERF CHEESE!” “HEY THEY HAVE 4 BUNKERS AND 1 DPS! NERF CHEESE!” “HEY! THEY’RE ALL RUNNING MMS! GET RID OF THIS JACK CHEDDAR BULL kitten!”

Instead of…oh hey these comps have weaknesses…Look at that…Sure this bunker is really tough to kill the normal way, but you can pull them down just as easily. Stability? Bring boon removal or move to another point.

Flumek.9043:

1) Bad players normaly win 20% , good players win 80%.

2) Skyhammer is map, where skill doesnt matter. It is all a random clusterfffk , just like flipping a coin.

given that 50/50 rule, the result is:

3) On skyhamer, bad player win 50% , good player win 50%.

BEST MAP, SUCH FAIR !

Those are complete bull numbers and you know it. If you attack the cannon and take it for yourself, all of a sudden the cannon isn’t an issue anymore! if the cannon fires more than once on you in a short period of time, you’re team is doing it very wrong. Skill is extremely important on this map. You have to line up your CCs well. You have to position youself in a good way to make sure that any CCs they might have will not knock you off. You have to make sure you’re ready to stun break out of a CC if you get pushed. There’s a TON of skill to this map.

Locuz.2651:

On my engineers skyhammer build i have tons of ways to guarantee 100% knockoffs, with stealth etc. I had games with 18-20 knock of pull offs….yet i still despise this map. Its not about winning it, its about the way i lost or won.

There is no guaranteed way to kill someone on this map. A thief tried to do the “guarenteed kill” where you stealth into cannon, break a glass and pull them off. I dodged it because I heard the glass starting to break. Pay attention and you won’t die to “cheese”.

I have three accounts lol.3859:

stealth CC always wins

stealth is the issue imo – just like 4 man stealth to pop 1 enemy at the start of the game

Totally false. First off, if the entire team goes stealth, you can take a quick look around, notice that NO one exists and try to stealth your own team or tell them to go defensive. It’s a legitimate strategy that you have to watch out for. If you are being stealth CCed, listen for the glass break. The MOMENT you hear it, dodge. Get your stun breaker ready.

Bsgapollo.5364:

Actually that was just one of the many problems with this map. There are certain advantages that are ridiculous, 1 is placing marks infront of the portal, you can’t dodge when you enter the portal so you take a kitten ton of condi’s, and your opponent can use them again because they are off cooldown. second thing is skyhammer itself. It’s undodgeable which makes other classes have greater advantages over others. For example a warrior can activate endure pain while still holding the point, an ele/mesmer can only use invulnerability to avoid the damage but they would start losing the point in the meantime. 3thly the cannons damage is based on how much toughness you have, making heavy armor classes or professions that stack toughness better over others since they are able to tank more. And the list goes on..

These are the fairest points I’ve heard so far. The cannon being undodgable is a weird decision to me, but I still believe that just means you need to be more aggressive in taking it. With marks on the portal, you can dodge in I’m pretty sure. I think I’ve done that before. Also the treb is based on toughness too…So really that’s one point said to different ways xD. Make cannon dodgable.

The Gates Assassin.9827:

These are the fairest points I’ve heard so far. The cannon being undodgable is a weird decision to me, but I still believe that just means you need to be more aggressive in taking it. With marks on the portal, you can dodge in I’m pretty sure. I think I’ve done that before. Also the treb is based on toughness too…So really that’s one point said to different ways xD. Make cannon dodgable.

Treb can be destroyed and is dodgeable. Also has a way smaller radius then skyhammer.

The Gates Assassin.9827:

See? This is exactly what I’m talking about. People think this isn’t PvP. It’s a different style of PvP.

Snowball mayhem is “pvp” too and dragonball ofc. Just a different style of pvp, right? Why arent these in the soloqueue rotation?

A pvp map designed around 1 shots is just a bad idea period. It doesnt give the same satisfaction when killing and its annoying when you die. Its pure annoyance, troll or get trolled.

You know what happened when i showed this map to some of my multiglad (wow) & masterleague (SC2) friends. They laughed really hard and stated “no wonder GW2s pvp flopped hard, with gimicky crap like this”.

Mind that isnt even my own statement. But they are right…we dont need gimicky stuff like this. We need solid gamemodes and maps that encourage quality small scale skirmishes. Untill that happens GW2s pvp will remain the laughing stock of online pvp gaming.

Locuz.2651:

The Gates Assassin.9827:

See? This is exactly what I’m talking about. People think this isn’t PvP. It’s a different style of PvP.

Snowball mayhem is “pvp” too and dragonball ofc. Just a different style of pvp, right? Why arent these in the soloqueue rotation?

A pvp map designed around 1 shots is just a bad idea period. It doesnt give the same satisfaction when killing and its annoying when you die. Its pure annoyance, troll or get trolled.

You know what happened when i showed this map to some of my multiglad (wow) & masterleague (SC2) friends. They laughed really hard and stated “no wonder GW2s pvp flopped hard, with gimicky crap like this”.

Mind that isnt even my own statement. But they are right…we dont need gimicky stuff like this. We need solid gamemodes and maps that encourage quality small scale skirmishes. Untill that happens GW2s pvp will remain the laughing stock of online pvp gaming.

“Hey guys. I’m right, know why? These two other dudes I know totally said what I was saying. Thus, the vast majority MUST agree with me. Anything that I don’t like is cheesy, and here we see proof.”

People said gameplay designed around one shots was bad with Liadri the Concealing Darkness, but that was loved by a lot of people too. I get plenty of satisfaction from defeating someone who is a tough push off.

Well, you don’t actually need to push people down.

Just spam your AoE on the ground and cleaves and watch everyone die because they can’t get away. Just stay out of the ledges, and even if you die it’s not a big deal.
Problem is the enemy will do the same to you. Ain’t not like you can avoid anything.

Just outspam your opponent.

Sure, it’s another form of pvp, but I’ve seen better pvp in Dragon Age (see what I did here?)XD

The Gates Assassin.9827:

People said gameplay designed around one shots was bad with Liadri the Concealing Darkness, but that was loved by a lot of people too. I get plenty of satisfaction from defeating someone who is a tough push off.

That was pve. This is pvp.

It’s like griefers in Dark Souls, that say “Blll Blll, the game is hard, prepare to die Blll Blll” when they gank you in a merry 2v1. Or when you are facing multiple mobs.

Too bad what they did was for them as hard as killing Pinwheel with 5 white phantoms.

Bosses that can one-shot you might be fun. Players that can one-shot each other not that much, especially if it’s unpredictable.

I don’t like the map for a couple main reasons:

- The Direct Lightning skill from the skyhammer is too good. Just comparing it to the trebs on Kyhlo the hammer seems to hit for a little more, has a larger impact radius, way easier to target (why?), you can’t dodge/block it, and it’s a knockdown. Also, fighting up there is just a chore for some classes against other certain classes.

- Too many areas around the map (especially the side points) where you can be CC’d off the map. You end up severely limiting where you can position yourself if you don’t have stability readily available. It wouldn’t be so bad if it was a couple areas, but it’s everywhere!. I don’t understand the need for the glass to break so easily by just walking over it – you should need to use a blast finisher or projectile or something. Also, the side points to me are just too small… why do so many capture points not only have a small cap circle, but they are “walled in” so close to the circle as well (that is an annoyance for the conquest design in this game in general, and why Foefire/Kyhlo are the only two maps I really enjoy).

- It is the only Spvp map where I get some type of rubberbanding every so often. I don’t know if it’s the jumpads or what.

- As others have said some classes just have an inherent advantage with the way they are designed.

Would be great to get a blacklist option for 1 map or something in Solo Queue. Then I would just have to put up with Spirit Watch where some classes still have skills unaffected by carrying the orb for whatever reason.

The Gates Assassin.9827:

Flumek.9043:

1) Bad players normaly win 20% , good players win 80%.

2) Skyhammer is map, where skill doesnt matter. It is all a random clusterfffk , just like flipping a coin.

given that 50/50 rule, the result is:

3) On skyhamer, bad player win 50% , good player win 50%.

BEST MAP, SUCH FAIR !

Those are complete bull numbers and you know it. If you attack the cannon and take it for yourself, all of a sudden the cannon isn’t an issue anymore! if the cannon fires more than once on you in a short period of time, you’re team is doing it very wrong. Skill is extremely important on this map. You have to line up your CCs well. You have to position youself in a good way to make sure that any CCs they might have will not knock you off. You have to make sure you’re ready to stun break out of a CC if you get pushed. There’s a TON of skill to this map.

Youve just exposed in which group you belong , thus losing the right to be taken seriously.
Please write your positioning tips on the Int. Ping-pong forums , the topic here is to improve another game, GuildWars 2.

Now for the necessary construcitve part:
-There is no viable non-hammer strategy
-hammer to big, easy to land, fire rate
- 1-hit K.O. too easy to land , in comparison to all the weapon, utility, heal, hp, point control skills, that u must manage in an avarage “fair” fight