Guild Wars 2

First, let me say that I think the balance in this game is great for an mmo.

However, I rolled a stun lock warrior with healing sig/zerk stance/balanced stance/rage (hammer/mace-shield) for the first time the other day, and I have difficulty understanding the mechanic and how it fits in with the other classes.

I think the biggest thing I found hard to get my head around was that I was able to aoe stun with earthshaker every 8 secs or so with full adrenaline most of the time (and had access to a few other stuns/knockbacks as well).

Also, if my enemies dodged/(blocked?) my adrenaline did not deplete and the CD was only 3 or 4 secs? I could even use it as a short cd movement skill in a pinch.

I was also tanky, healed well, had swiftness/ fury/might most of the time, lots of armor, lots of hp and I didn’t need to learn any complicated combos to do well.

Sorry I just don’t get it can someone help me understand this? What’s the downside? Even the armor looks cool!

Note, I have tried other warrior builds and I found them hard, but this was just weird button mashing pawnage- like playing dynasty warriors or something.

The downside is that people hate you.

But srs bznz talk, there is none if the warrior knows how to play competently.

Troll post detected..

People are going to accuse you of being a Troll but in average level play you can just laddle on the stuns as a Warrior and its easy as pie to do it. I’ve done it plenty of times myself. Eventually if the fight goes on more then about 30 seconds you can catch some poor fool with the some combination of shield stun, mace stun, and skull cracker all in a row and it is not necessarily a reflection of poor skill on the guy you caught because fights greater then 1v1 are hectic and no one has unlimited stun breaks and dodges. I don’t undersand hard crowdcontrol that lasts more then 1 second in a game with no immunities or diminshing returns or way to decrease crowd control duration outside of a lame -15% duration rune.

First of all I don’t consider the warrior OP, but I consider the Hammer – Mace\Shield spec the more OP build of the game if played properly.
The fact is that it doesn’t require so much knowledge of the class to be played correctly.
That spec at the moment has high reward and 0 downside just because you can miss a lot of attacks and still have you skills ready a few seconds later.
But the warrior cannot realy disengage if focused by at least 2 ppl at once, and it’s not so “tanky” while focused down with a real combined burst, even with shield block and endure pain up. Of course every class will die in seconds if focused hard by 2 o 3 dpsser at once so it’s not only a warrior problem, but certainly there are other classes that are more evasive than warrior and can manage to survive better to a combined bust.

So I don’t know what realy needs to be changed for the class to be in line with the others.
If you nerf healing signet to the ground the warrior will certainly disappear from the meta like it was before the buff, but of course it cannot stay like it is at the moment because in a 1v1 situation this class has realy few counters.
There has been a lot a very good suggestions and A-Net should only choose one and test it if it works, but A-Net has to choose carefully what to change and what not because it’s a short step from being OP to useless for this class.

Yes interesting comments.

I think the key points that I found difficult to grasp, were how the f1 skill differed from other classes.

For example a 2 sec aoe semi-ranged stun on an 8 sec cd might be ok, but it baffles my mind that my adrenaline stays full even if I miss or my opponents skilfully dodge/block the attack, and that the skill only goes on a 3-4 sec cd. That is different to how the f1 works for other classes I have played, and it was the thing that really surprised me.

For example if I miss with the f1 ability of thief, ranger, or Mesmer the ability goes on normal cd (and it is much longer than 8 secs!). I can understand to a degree a short cd for firing off an f1 if the enemy is out of range, but my opponent should be rewarded with a normal cd (and in warrior’s case a depleted adrenaline bar) if they are good enough to avoid my attack.

This issue is compounded by healing sig+adrenal health and cleansing ire. I found that I would spam away my aoe stun every 8 secs, and even if I missed/ opponents evaded the only penalty I got was a 3-4sec cd- I still had full regen, on demand condi-cleanse, and 2 sec aoe stun coming up in a few secs; meanwhile my opponents had either lost energy (evade), or blown a cd (dodge/invun/etc).

In other words my blind spamming cost me nothing, while every successful counter play to my aoe stun spam weakened my opponent.

So in conclusion, I have seen several complaints about that warrior build being OP etc, but to me the main issue is that the way f1 works, in combination with a few mid tier traits gives a killer build with little reward for anyone that plays intelligently against me.

It honestly just surprised me that this is actually in the game, and that no one seems to think it is unusual. The stun sigil issue seemed relatively mild in comparison imo.

Yasha.5963:

Yes interesting comments.

I think the key points that I found difficult to grasp, were how the f1 skill differed from other classes.

For example a 2 sec aoe semi-ranged stun on an 8 sec cd might be ok, but it baffles my mind that my adrenaline stays full even if I miss or my opponents skilfully dodge/block the attack, and that the skill only goes on a 3-4 sec cd. That is different to how the f1 works for other classes I have played, and it was the thing that really surprised me.

For example if I miss with the f1 ability of thief, ranger, or Mesmer the ability goes on normal cd (and it is much longer than 8 secs!). I can understand to a degree a short cd for firing off an f1 if the enemy is out of range, but my opponent should be rewarded with a normal cd (and in warrior’s case a depleted adrenaline bar) if they are good enough to avoid my attack.

This issue is compounded by healing sig+adrenal health and cleansing ire. I found that I would spam away my aoe stun every 8 secs, and even if I missed/ opponents evaded the only penalty I got was a 3-4sec cd- I still had full regen, on demand condi-cleanse, and 2 sec aoe stun coming up in a few secs; meanwhile my opponents had either lost energy (evade), or blown a cd (dodge/invun/etc).

In other words my blind spamming cost me nothing, while every successful counter play to my aoe stun spam weakened my opponent.

So in conclusion, I have seen several complaints about that warrior build being OP etc, but to me the main issue is that the way f1 works, in combination with a few mid tier traits gives a killer build with little reward for anyone that plays intelligently against me.

It honestly just surprised me that this is actually in the game, and that no one seems to think it is unusual. The stun sigil issue seemed relatively mild in comparison imo.

There has been probably around 10.000 posts about this stun warrior issue in the past 3 months.
Devs just aren’t taking the issue seriously, or dont see how bad the problem really is.

And after months of trying to explain it to anet , and the resent patch not doing anything about the stun issue ( other then a bug fix to a sigil ). People just stop posting cause it clearly gets ignored.

In other words:

The ship is sinking , and instead of plugging the holes . They are adding holes. ( sinking it faster )

Kinda makes me feel sad, cause every1 saw what gw2 pvp had as potential. And that is probebly a reason why it gets people so angry.

Void.4239:

There has been probably around 10.000 posts about this stun warrior issue in the past 3 months.
Devs just aren’t taking the issue seriously, or dont see how bad the problem really is.

And after months of trying to explain it to anet , and the resent patch not doing anything about the stun issue ( other then a bug fix to a sigil ). People just stop posting cause it clearly gets ignored.

In other words:

The ship is sinking , and instead of plugging the holes . They are adding holes. ( sinking it faster )

Kinda makes me feel sad, cause every1 saw what gw2 pvp had as potential. And that is probebly a reason why it gets people so angry.

So, just to confirm, have people pointed out how the f1 ability does not go on full cd and adrenaline bar doesn’t get depleted if the opponent player evades/invuns etc?

That’s probably the crux of what I find difficult to understand since it is inconsistent with how other classes f1 abilities work; I don’t see the logic or rationale behind it.

I was away from gw2 for a few months so probably only caught the tailend of the complaints about warriors and I didn’t see anyone mention this since I have been back.

I think you just found the way to fix the OP-Ness of the warrior hammer. In my opinion using F1 has to make it go on full CD always, also when evaded/blocked or when cast into the void.
This will probably fix the OP warrior really because as you say there is no real counterplay. If someone is skillful enouhg to avoid it the F1 can be used again 3-4 sec later and you keep the full adrenalin.
I hope they fix this and the hammerstun meta might be one way closer to being fine.

Yasha.5963:

Void.4239:

There has been probably around 10.000 posts about this stun warrior issue in the past 3 months.
Devs just aren’t taking the issue seriously, or dont see how bad the problem really is.

And after months of trying to explain it to anet , and the resent patch not doing anything about the stun issue ( other then a bug fix to a sigil ). People just stop posting cause it clearly gets ignored.

In other words:

The ship is sinking , and instead of plugging the holes . They are adding holes. ( sinking it faster )

Kinda makes me feel sad, cause every1 saw what gw2 pvp had as potential. And that is probebly a reason why it gets people so angry.

So, just to confirm, have people pointed out how the f1 ability does not go on full cd and adrenaline bar doesn’t get depleted if the opponent player evades/invuns etc?

That’s probably the crux of what I find difficult to understand since it is inconsistent with how other classes f1 abilities work; I don’t see the logic or rationale behind it.

I was away from gw2 for a few months so probably only caught the tailend of the complaints about warriors and I didn’t see anyone mention this since I have been back.

In short: Yes they have … I am almost certain that it has been brought up even numerous times. But hammer-stun is AoE anyway, so … .
On top: Asuras Skull Crack is the same animation as an auto-attack. So such a crucial effect can’t even be dodged on purpose unless you have supernatural mind-reading-skills.

Yasha.5963:

Void.4239:

There has been probably around 10.000 posts about this stun warrior issue in the past 3 months.
Devs just aren’t taking the issue seriously, or dont see how bad the problem really is.

And after months of trying to explain it to anet , and the resent patch not doing anything about the stun issue ( other then a bug fix to a sigil ). People just stop posting cause it clearly gets ignored.

In other words:

The ship is sinking , and instead of plugging the holes . They are adding holes. ( sinking it faster )

Kinda makes me feel sad, cause every1 saw what gw2 pvp had as potential. And that is probebly a reason why it gets people so angry.

So, just to confirm, have people pointed out how the f1 ability does not go on full cd and adrenaline bar doesn’t get depleted if the opponent player evades/invuns etc?

That’s probably the crux of what I find difficult to understand since it is inconsistent with how other classes f1 abilities work; I don’t see the logic or rationale behind it.

I was away from gw2 for a few months so probably only caught the tailend of the complaints about warriors and I didn’t see anyone mention this since I have been back.

Welcome back

But sadly, yes it has been mentioned in the past that evading the attack didn’t deplete adrenaline.
There should be a topic on warrior forum, where most topics about the stun/healing issue got merged with. It has around 700 reply’s in it i think. I read about the dodge issue there.

what they have to do is to put f1 skill into cooldown if misses , dodge or evaded and consume all the adrenaline i’ve been thinking about this too since i started playing this game. About healing signet i dunno because i do have 3.2k armor and 25k hp but whenever i fight against burst build healing signet can’t recover as quickly as possible my health bar all i have to do is reset the fight that make it look healing signet is OP but if i stay face to face that 400 hp/sec cant save me + adrenal health since i use my burst skill if possible. The only thing that make us looks OP is because of the cooldown of burst hammer and mace but if anet just change the way our burst work like what i said above i think this will fix all the QQ about hammer and mace build

jayson.6512:

what they have to do is to put f1 skill into cooldown if misses , dodge or evaded and consume all the adrenaline i’ve been thinking about this too since i started playing this game. About healing signet i dunno because i do have 3.2k armor and 25k hp but whenever i fight against burst build healing signet can’t recover as quickly as possible my health bar all i have to do is reset the fight that make it look healing signet is OP but if i stay face to face that 400 hp/sec cant save me + adrenal health since i use my burst skill if possible. The only thing that make us looks OP is because of the cooldown of burst hammer and mace but if anet just change the way our burst work like what i said above i think this will fix all the QQ about hammer and mace build

Passive healing should have a downside compared to other healing skills. you dont have to press a button to use it , it has no cooldown, it cant be interrupted. the only downside is if the warrior gets poisoned , but then again they made sure that wouldn’t be a problem for warriors. ( bezerker stance / condi clear on adrenaline )
They have blocks / invul./ great mobility, to help the passieve heals against burst classes.

Ow and dont forget , atm it heals more over time then any other healing skill on most other classes.

maybe add something to the healing signet active that will temp warriors to use activate it or make it 350hp /sec and increase it while adrenaline bar is full to 400hp/sec

Its hard for me to say whether healing sig is too strong because its really a synergy of several factors that likely creates a feeling that healing might be too strong. I also remember that warriors were seen as somewhat weak at the start of the game, so increased survivability s not a bad thing.

However, the f1 ability having no downside if u miss is something that sticks out like a sore thumb imo. When I played that build, frankly, I just had a big grin on my face thinking “wtf this is totally OP” (the f1 issue I am talking about). If u mess up your f1 on other classes its kind of a big deal, whereas here you have one of the strongest ccs in the game (and pretty good damage) and a free ticket to virtually spam it with no downside.

I don’t remember my adrenaline recharging so quickly in the past either (I played up until around the big ele nerf) so that kind of compounds the issue.

Don’t worry. The devs don’t understand it either.

I think that Healing SIgnet should heal based on how many team mates the warrior has nearby.
Let me explain: I think that the healing provided by this signet is too strong in a 1v1 fight but still balanced in a teamfight (I mean 4v4 since we are in the structured pvp forum), the best way to deal with those warriors is to burst them down with heavy and coordinated dps, and even if they are annoying in a team fight with all their stuns I don’t find warriors too OP in that situation. The problem is that in the current state they are the best 1v1 class using that signet for the reason already stated: that healing cannot be interrupted by a skilled player and perma poison is almost impossible for a single class.
I think that if healing signet would heal less if the warrior is solo and more if he’s in a team fight maybe it could balance the signet without making the skill useless again.
That’s just my opinion but a lot of good suggestions have already been made.

dont forget hammer/longbow.

on longbow he has always a cleansing even if hes blinded. he can always put down his firefield to dmg and cleanse conditions, no matter if he is blinded or under any circumstance that would lead to a fail attack normaly.

The way this is written clearly indicates a troll but w/e.

The adrenaline not depleting is actually bad for the warrior as it would otherwise trigger cleansing ire, removing 3 conditions without the need to actually hit anything.
Adrenaline builds up so fast that you easily have enough after the short induced CD from missing a burst to use the skill again.

Now think again if depleting the adrenaline is a good idea

edit: i wouldn’t mind setting burst to a full cd after dodge/block but then make earthshaker 100% faster and much less telegraphed. The way it is now even a trained monkey could evade that big, slow, flashy sign saying:please dodge!

Some months ago people said that Earthshaker was too easy, and that avoiding it didn’t require skill.

IMHO when it whiffs it should deplete adrenaline but proc cleansing Ire (but it should proc after the damage). Playing a condi engi in wvwvw, sometimes I can just always avoid a warrior by cricle strafing and spamming Static Discharge.

Not that skillful of a gameplay, but if he gets to me, I might be dead.

I think it wouldnt’ be bad if warrior could get rid of conditions more, and I didn’t have to fear being touched by it. Like… a more balanced fight, instead of a “I can stop you indefinetely, but if you touch me, I’m dead”. But that’s just my opinion.

But then who cares, I use GS/LB. It’s hard to make a combo field whiff.XD

Crovax.7854:

The way this is written clearly indicates a troll but w/e.

The adrenaline not depleting is actually bad for the warrior as it would otherwise trigger cleansing ire, removing 3 conditions without the need to actually hit anything.
Adrenaline builds up so fast that you easily have enough after the short induced CD from missing a burst to use the skill again.

Now think again if depleting the adrenaline is a good idea

edit: i wouldn’t mind setting burst to a full cd after dodge/block but then make earthshaker 100% faster and much less telegraphed. The way it is now even a trained monkey could evade that big, slow, flashy sign saying:please dodge!

In that case perhaps adrenaline builds up too fast with certain traits, and/or the cd is too low on the f1 skill. It would be ok if you depleted your adrenaline and removed the three conditions, if the cd was say 16 secs. It is one of the most powerful abilities in the game yet has a shorter cd than a relatively weak skill.

In terms of its animation, I think it is one of the more well designed abilities, very powerful but telegraphed so you can react to it. Skull crack on the other hand is not so well designed (especially on the small race) because it has a strong effect but is very difficult to read (and has a very short cd).

At any rate, I was mainly surprised that the way f1 worked was inconsistent with how other classes f1 worked. Surely that should be brought into line first, and then cds etc tweaked.

I was further surprised by the recent patch because people have told me- and also as seen in this thread- that the warrior issue has been ongoing for some months, apparently with a load of feedback on the issue, and yet the mechanic at the root of the problem was untouched.

I know what you mean. My Guardian feels like a weakling compared to my mace/mace hammer warrior. Its a mindless faceroll with zero downside. Not to mention tons of stability and amazing condition removal.

Relentliss.2170:

I know what you mean. My Guardian feels like a weakling compared to my mace/mace hammer warrior. Its a mindless faceroll with zero downside. Not to mention tons of stability and amazing condition removal.

I does seem easy, but I still don’t understand why the f1 skill on warrior does not go on full cd if you miss, is there some reason why warrior f1 is the exception to the rule?

I also think the f1 skill is on too short a CD, but that is just my subjective opinion; things that are logically inconsistent like the f1 going on full cd if you get blocked etc on all other classes but just going on a short cd on warrior are more annoying to me.

Poxxia.1547:

In short: Yes they have … I am almost certain that it has been brought up even numerous times. But hammer-stun is AoE anyway, so … .
On top: Asuras Skull Crack is the same animation as an auto-attack. So such a crucial effect can’t even be dodged on purpose unless you have supernatural mind-reading-skills.

Honestly, all of my dodging is based on prediction rather than reaction, anyway. This might be due to latency from playing on an EU server from the US, though; if I wait for the animation to start, it’s usually too late for me to evade.

That said, Asura in general need to… I dunno, be much bigger than they currently are, at least in sPvP. It’s much harder to see what they’re doing than it is to see what, for example, a Charr or Norn is doing.

ArenaNet should probably figure out some way of making all races roughly equivalent in size somehow. I suppose that’d toss lore out the window, but do people in sPvP even care much about the lore when they’re in a match?

tbh i don’t even mind hammer itself, i just hate how warriors as a package have no trade off like other classes have

regardless if they go bunker or zerker, they still do good dmg, have good survival, best mbolity in game and good CCs

Cynz.9437:

tbh i don’t even mind hammer itself, i just hate how warriors as a package have no trade off like other classes have

regardless if they go bunker or zerker, they still do good dmg, have good survival, best mbolity in game and good CCs

They rely entirely on locking down an opponent. Someone who can avoid or counter the CC can easily deal with a warrior. Stability, especially 1v1, is almost a hard counter for warriors. Warriors have no means of boon stripping other than weapon sigils, most of their burst comes from Unsuspecting Foe, and a lot of their survivability comes from never having to play defensive due to the pressure from CCs.

Blind is also extremely effective versus hammer warriors, and due to the mechanics of Healing Signet poison is a good soft counter. They also can’t recover from burst at all, again due to Healing Signet.

It’s also just 100% wrong that warriors have the best mobility in the game. Thieves without question take that title.

I do agree that they as a whole are incredibly strong, not one individual thing, but they do have trade offs and counters.

Larynx.2453:

Cynz.9437:

tbh i don’t even mind hammer itself, i just hate how warriors as a package have no trade off like other classes have

regardless if they go bunker or zerker, they still do good dmg, have good survival, best mbolity in game and good CCs

They rely entirely on locking down an opponent. Someone who can avoid or counter the CC can easily deal with a warrior. Stability, especially 1v1, is almost a hard counter for warriors. Warriors have no means of boon stripping other than weapon sigils, most of their burst comes from Unsuspecting Foe, and a lot of their survivability comes from never having to play defensive due to the pressure from CCs.

Blind is also extremely effective versus hammer warriors, and due to the mechanics of Healing Signet poison is a good soft counter. They also can’t recover from burst at all, again due to Healing Signet.

It’s also just 100% wrong that warriors have the best mobility in the game. Thieves without question take that title.

I do agree that they as a whole are incredibly strong, not one individual thing, but they do have trade offs and counters.

i am not talking about hammer warriors only, i was talking about warriors in generall

um, warriors do have best moblity… given, thieves can use shortbow and shs but it would bring them only so far

Cynz.9437:

tbh i don’t even mind hammer itself, i just hate how warriors as a package have no trade off like other classes have

regardless if they go bunker or zerker, they still do good dmg, have good survival, best mbolity in game and good CCs

This all over.

I could spec and gear to heal maybe similar amounts to healing signet on my necro, but my damage and a good chunk of my cc would take a hit [not to mention it would take more player input than warrior to achieve]. Warriors are getting static amounts of cc damage and survivability from passive traits, utilities and weapon sets which basically have no hard counter. They have everything rolled into one with no downside.

Yasha.5963:

I does seem easy, but I still don’t understand why the f1 skill on warrior does not go on full cd if you miss, is there some reason why warrior f1 is the exception to the rule?

Burst abilities go on full cooldown if you miss.

Cynz.9437:

Larynx.2453:

Cynz.9437:

tbh i don’t even mind hammer itself, i just hate how warriors as a package have no trade off like other classes have

regardless if they go bunker or zerker, they still do good dmg, have good survival, best mbolity in game and good CCs

They rely entirely on locking down an opponent. Someone who can avoid or counter the CC can easily deal with a warrior. Stability, especially 1v1, is almost a hard counter for warriors. Warriors have no means of boon stripping other than weapon sigils, most of their burst comes from Unsuspecting Foe, and a lot of their survivability comes from never having to play defensive due to the pressure from CCs.

Blind is also extremely effective versus hammer warriors, and due to the mechanics of Healing Signet poison is a good soft counter. They also can’t recover from burst at all, again due to Healing Signet.

It’s also just 100% wrong that warriors have the best mobility in the game. Thieves without question take that title.

I do agree that they as a whole are incredibly strong, not one individual thing, but they do have trade offs and counters.

i am not talking about hammer warriors only, i was talking about warriors in generall

um, warriors do have best moblity… given, thieves can use shortbow and shs but it would bring them only so far

I was speaking of warriors in general with the exception of condition builds and bunkers.

And no. It’s not even a question that is up for debate. Thieves have the best mobility in the game due the Z axis mobility. This is coming from someone who plays a thief.

do you truly believe that warriors right now don’t have less trade off than any other class?

as for moblity, yes and no, thieves still would have to sacrifice a lot of initiative or long CD to port somewhere..but if you gonna bring z axis for certan maps, ok, i agree

In a foot race warriors can be roughly equivalent to thieves but like others said, the z axis mobility makes thieves the best. My thief is designed to chase people down and if I don’t have all my utilities off cooldown I can’t catch a GS warrior with the leg mod trait (not sure on the exact name).

Kiting. Focus. Godlike dodgers.

15char.

Larynx.2453:

Yasha.5963:

I does seem easy, but I still don’t understand why the f1 skill on warrior does not go on full cd if you miss, is there some reason why warrior f1 is the exception to the rule?

Burst abilities go on full cooldown if you miss.

The cooldowns aren’t particularly long, especially if you trait Discipline.

I had a necro in spvp call my mace/shield+gs warr a perma stun warrior.

Considering he wasn’t permanently stunned I don’t understand why he said that . I just don’t think he liked the 3.kitten stun with hb to the face combo.

wow i did not know this. thanks OP. so the hammer, mace + shield stun build is better than I thought.

common sense says if an opponent dodges an F1 skill should lose all adrenaline at least and go on full cooldown. I could not have predicted this.

Healing Signet needs to be toned down at least. It’s absurd how well warriors can sustain without heavy healing power investment. No class should be capable of 50% crit chance on stunned with a Soldiers ammy with 400+hps with high damage skills, and condi-cleanse on burst to boot. It’s just simply broken, it’s truly beyond words to even consider contrary.

Excalibur.9748:

wow i did not know this. thanks OP. so the hammer, mace + shield stun build is better than I thought.

common sense says if an opponent dodges an F1 skill should lose all adrenaline at least and go on full cooldown. I could not have predicted this.

That will be a buff to warriors not a nerf.

If all F1 skills loses adrenaline no matter what, Cleansing Ire becomes way more stronger than before.

That’s kinda the reason why people run longbow (guaranteed condi cleanse on f1, plus longbow’s pretty good in general – can’t be kited). Warriors should be punished for missing f1 abilities however. (depletion of adrenaline/no cleansing ire proc would be my preferred choice)

runeblade.7514:

Excalibur.9748:

wow i did not know this. thanks OP. so the hammer, mace + shield stun build is better than I thought.

common sense says if an opponent dodges an F1 skill should lose all adrenaline at least and go on full cooldown. I could not have predicted this.

That will be a buff to warriors not a nerf.

If all F1 skills loses adrenaline no matter what, Cleansing Ire becomes way more stronger than before.

why should cleansing ire proc if an opponent dodged the attack? doesn’t make sense to me.

Larynx.2453:

Yasha.5963:

I does seem easy, but I still don’t understand why the f1 skill on warrior does not go on full cd if you miss, is there some reason why warrior f1 is the exception to the rule?

Burst abilities go on full cooldown if you miss.

Unless this was patched in the last week, my hammer and mace burst (f1) skills do not go on full CD and adrenaline does not deplete if I miss, the enemy evades, or the enemy uses invun. In other words it is almost completely all reward no risk. Shocking right?

In fact, you can use hammer f1 as a sort of low cd movement skill, since it only goes on 3-4 sec cd unless you hit and damage someone. Quite a fun way to get around actually, since the animation is really cool for that skill. Its no where near as mobile as GS of course, but its nice to use to get out of a pinch with if I mess up using mace/shield-hammer.

Excalibur.9748:

runeblade.7514:

Excalibur.9748:

wow i did not know this. thanks OP. so the hammer, mace + shield stun build is better than I thought.

common sense says if an opponent dodges an F1 skill should lose all adrenaline at least and go on full cooldown. I could not have predicted this.

That will be a buff to warriors not a nerf.

If all F1 skills loses adrenaline no matter what, Cleansing Ire becomes way more stronger than before.

why should cleansing ire proc if an opponent dodged the attack? doesn’t make sense to me.

Because Cleansing Ire procs when you spent adrenaline, not when you hit someone.

That is how Combustion shot remove conditions regardless if you hit anything.

runeblade.7514:

Excalibur.9748:

runeblade.7514:

Excalibur.9748:

wow i did not know this. thanks OP. so the hammer, mace + shield stun build is better than I thought.

common sense says if an opponent dodges an F1 skill should lose all adrenaline at least and go on full cooldown. I could not have predicted this.

That will be a buff to warriors not a nerf.

If all F1 skills loses adrenaline no matter what, Cleansing Ire becomes way more stronger than before.

why should cleansing ire proc if an opponent dodged the attack? doesn’t make sense to me.

Because Cleansing Ire procs when you spent adrenaline, not when you hit someone.

That is how Combustion shot remove conditions regardless if you hit anything.

combustion shot is an AoE DoT. cleansing ire should not proc when earthshaker misses for example. adrenaline is expended but that doesn’t mean anything when you don’t hit anyone.

Excalibur.9748:

runeblade.7514:

Excalibur.9748:

runeblade.7514:

Excalibur.9748:

wow i did not know this. thanks OP. so the hammer, mace + shield stun build is better than I thought.

common sense says if an opponent dodges an F1 skill should lose all adrenaline at least and go on full cooldown. I could not have predicted this.

That will be a buff to warriors not a nerf.

If all F1 skills loses adrenaline no matter what, Cleansing Ire becomes way more stronger than before.

why should cleansing ire proc if an opponent dodged the attack? doesn’t make sense to me.

Because Cleansing Ire procs when you spent adrenaline, not when you hit someone.

That is how Combustion shot remove conditions regardless if you hit anything.

combustion shot is an AoE DoT. cleansing ire should not proc when earthshaker misses for example. adrenaline is expended but that doesn’t mean anything when you don’t hit anyone.

It doesn’t matter about what you think should happen. What matter is that cleansing Ire procs when adrenaline is spent because that is how the trait work.

runeblade.7514:

Excalibur.9748:

runeblade.7514:

Excalibur.9748:

runeblade.7514:

Excalibur.9748:

wow i did not know this. thanks OP. so the hammer, mace + shield stun build is better than I thought.

common sense says if an opponent dodges an F1 skill should lose all adrenaline at least and go on full cooldown. I could not have predicted this.

That will be a buff to warriors not a nerf.

If all F1 skills loses adrenaline no matter what, Cleansing Ire becomes way more stronger than before.

why should cleansing ire proc if an opponent dodged the attack? doesn’t make sense to me.

Because Cleansing Ire procs when you spent adrenaline, not when you hit someone.

That is how Combustion shot remove conditions regardless if you hit anything.

combustion shot is an AoE DoT. cleansing ire should not proc when earthshaker misses for example. adrenaline is expended but that doesn’t mean anything when you don’t hit anyone.

It doesn’t matter about what you think should happen. What matter is that cleansing Ire procs when adrenaline is spent because that is how the trait work.

that can be changed.

runeblade.7514:

Excalibur.9748:

runeblade.7514:

Excalibur.9748:

runeblade.7514:

Excalibur.9748:

wow i did not know this. thanks OP. so the hammer, mace + shield stun build is better than I thought.

common sense says if an opponent dodges an F1 skill should lose all adrenaline at least and go on full cooldown. I could not have predicted this.

That will be a buff to warriors not a nerf.

If all F1 skills loses adrenaline no matter what, Cleansing Ire becomes way more stronger than before.

why should cleansing ire proc if an opponent dodged the attack? doesn’t make sense to me.

Because Cleansing Ire procs when you spent adrenaline, not when you hit someone.

That is how Combustion shot remove conditions regardless if you hit anything.

combustion shot is an AoE DoT. cleansing ire should not proc when earthshaker misses for example. adrenaline is expended but that doesn’t mean anything when you don’t hit anyone.

It doesn’t matter about what you think should happen. What matter is that cleansing Ire procs when adrenaline is spent because that is how the trait work.

Cleansing ire; might be fine as is except you can proc it to remove three conditions nearly every 8 secs, and the “side effect” of that proc is usually pretty good as well-like a ranged 2 sec aoe stun if using hammer.

I think the downside is kind of humorous though; if you don’t hit or the enemy has immunity you get a 3-4 sec cd to try again.

A ranged aoe 2 sec stun on 8 sec CD, which also cleanses three conditions- if you miss you can try again in 3-4 secs. Hmm.