Guild Wars 2

Dhuumfire, you’ve served your purpose.

Thank you for showing us how OP things can become if you give too much to a profession at once.
We now know it was a mistake, the Torment would more than suffice, Terror does the job as well.

Necro burning needs to go. The profession needs to be brought back in line with others just like it was (relatively, taking all other profession buffs into account) pre-patch.

It should never, NEVER, be most optimal to spec into an ultra offensive (30,30,10) build like necros do right now. Please replace Dhuumfire with something that incentivizes skilled, timely and tactical gameplay instead of a mindless spamming of unblockable AoE.

Please bump this thread.

There is a topic in the Necro forum which predicted the burning QQ to Necros.
In my opinion, Necro did not need a buff to condition spec. He just needed improved LF generation to condition specs to allow them to properly build LF to defend themselves.

I actually dislike Dhuumfire, because it forces you to spend 30 points into the power traitline you don’t want to take.

Anyhow, I don’t think that this will stop the QQ. Once Dhuumfire is gone, people will start complaining again about Terror (as they are doing right now), which bring us again to the start.

Dhuumfire it’s a 30 points investment. 30/30/10 it’s so squishy that it’s not viable in tpvp. Seems OP, but let ppl adapt to new necro skills.

This trait it’s ok, since it brings more build diversity. Now you can add burning to some builds like chill necro. Decent CC and decent damage.

You may think terror+burning it’s too much, but you forget that other glass cannons do as much or more damage with same or more survivability. Thieves can still 1 hit K.O. a 30/30/10 necromancer.

So, please stop this nonsense. I don’t see why it’s ok if thieves can burst, eles can burst, warriors can burst, mesmers can burst, but if necros can burst —→ “OMG nerf it plzzzzz!!!111!!! Necros ar sooo OP nao”

hi i’m a glass cannon necro with 18.5k hp and 1.8k toughness. I’m glass cannon.

Symbolic.7910:

hi i’m a glass cannon necro with 18.5k hp and 1.8k toughness. I’m glass cannon.

Forgot to mention: with no mobility, no stealth, no stability, no evade spamming

sorrow.2364:

Anyhow, I don’t think that this will stop the QQ. Once Dhuumfire is gone, people will start complaining again about Terror (as they are doing right now), which bring us again to the start.

No one complained about terror before. People barely used necros in sPvP even with terror as it is now. Terror isn’t the problem. Never was. Most necros wanted survivability, not burning.

What does confuse me, however, is before this patch, engineers put out similar condition damage with their HGH builds. The level of crying about engineers wasn’t nearly as bad then as it is with necromancers now. Frankly, engineers did a better job at being condition pressure than necros at the time. Now that these roles have been reversed (not really, HGH still exists), suddenly its OP? It can’t be because of epidemic. Engineers didn’t need epidemic to spam conditions on an entire point.

All necros really got was burning. Yeah, theres torment too, but 3 stacks is nothing. Barely a blip on the radar as far as damage goes.

sorrow.2364:

There is a topic in the Necro forum which predicted the burning QQ to Necros.
In my opinion, Necro did not need a buff to condition spec. He just needed improved LF generation to condition specs to allow them to properly build LF to defend themselves.

I actually dislike Dhuumfire, because it forces you to spend 30 points into the power traitline you don’t want to take.

Anyhow, I don’t think that this will stop the QQ. Once Dhuumfire is gone, people will start complaining again about Terror (as they are doing right now), which bring us again to the start.

1. Dhuumfire it’s not for condition builds, but for power or cc builds.
2. If you don’t want to, don’t trait for it. Nobody compels you.
3. Necros have no defenses. Thieves bursters have stealth, mesmer bursters have clones and stealth too. Necros just have 20k hp and almost zero life force to sponge damage in a 30/30/10 glass condi canon buil, the one with terror+burning.

Burning by itself it’s not a problem at all, go to necro forums and see the math on dps from burning trait, it’s laughable.

vicious.5683:

Burning by itself it’s not a problem at all, go to necro forums and see the math on dps from burning trait, it’s laughable.

Just watch this, I use 3 abilities.

Symbolic.7910:

hi i’m a glass cannon necro with 18.5k hp and 1.8k toughness. I’m glass cannon.

hey, tell me how many Heart Seeker/Back Stab skills you can take before go down…

30/30/10 with no escapes, no dodge skills, no invul, no stealth, no vigor, no blocks, no life force generation. Yeah you are sooooo tanky!!!!

vicious.5683:

Symbolic.7910:

hi i’m a glass cannon necro with 18.5k hp and 1.8k toughness. I’m glass cannon.

hey, tell me how many Heart Seeker/Back Stab skills you can take before go down…

30/30/10 with no escapes, no dodge skills, no invul, no stealth, no vigor, no blocks, no life force generation. Yeah you are sooooo tanky!!!!

Except for the fact that you can now carry a stunbreaker, put down a spectral wall and kite through it while damaging the thief.

Symbolic.7910:

vicious.5683:

Burning by itself it’s not a problem at all, go to necro forums and see the math on dps from burning trait, it’s laughable.

Just watch this, I use 3 abilities.

lot of gc builds can kill that golem in no time, you take like 15 secs and not even kill it.

Symbolic.7910:

vicious.5683:

Burning by itself it’s not a problem at all, go to necro forums and see the math on dps from burning trait, it’s laughable.

Just watch this, I use 3 abilities.

People used to say that about Bulls Rush, Frenzy, Hundred Blades. Now look at it. Nothing has changed about those three skills, but no one complains about it any more. Why? Cause people learned how to counter it. Its been 4 days since the patch. Thats not enough time.

vicious.5683:

Symbolic.7910:

vicious.5683:

Burning by itself it’s not a problem at all, go to necro forums and see the math on dps from burning trait, it’s laughable.

Just watch this, I use 3 abilities.

lot of gc builds can kill that golem in no time, you take like 15 secs and not even kill it.

Those other classes that burst the golem down that fast have to wait a bit before trying again. With the amount of conditions that necros have they can just use one more skill (scepter AA even) and bam… its gg

Symbolic.7910:

vicious.5683:

Symbolic.7910:

hi i’m a glass cannon necro with 18.5k hp and 1.8k toughness. I’m glass cannon.

hey, tell me how many Heart Seeker/Back Stab skills you can take before go down…

30/30/10 with no escapes, no dodge skills, no invul, no stealth, no vigor, no blocks, no life force generation. Yeah you are sooooo tanky!!!!

Except for the fact that you can now carry a stunbreaker, put down a spectral wall and kite through it while damaging the thief.

Then ask for nerf spectral wall, not Dhuumfire

jportell.2197:

vicious.5683:

Symbolic.7910:

vicious.5683:

Burning by itself it’s not a problem at all, go to necro forums and see the math on dps from burning trait, it’s laughable.

Just watch this, I use 3 abilities.

lot of gc builds can kill that golem in no time, you take like 15 secs and not even kill it.

Those other classes that burst the golem down that fast have to wait a bit before trying again. With the amount of conditions that necros have they can just use one more skill (scepter AA even) and bam… its gg

So you get you berzerker phantasm fixed and now you have plenty of time to ask for nerf other classes. Good for you!!

if mesmers are susceptible to conditions, it’s not necros fault. Ask Anet for better condi defense. Necros are susceptible to damage, so I should ask for nerf damage on mesmer illusions o MW or what ever? I don’t get your logic.

Well I’d say the thing that’s making people freak out the most is the fact that we got a lot of things at once. Basically new burning and torment. But then on top of all of this we suddenly get this super terror spectral wall and possibly the improved signet of spite, that people start using. So we end up getting a spec with burning, torment + inscreased terror application abilities compared to a terror build pre patch(except for the duration for a terror build but you can make it tick twice anyways with necromancer runes on top of 30 points into spite). This combination of everything is a bit too much.

It saddens me though to see how most of the buffs that we got were really not asked for by the community. The things that have mostly been mentioned were defensive problems, slow cast times and people also asked for a tiny little possible buff on the offense. As a result we mostly get a huge offensive buff lol.

Also the pre patch terror build that I was using got screwed with the terror move from adept to master, screwed up my 20 points into curses terror+banshees vail combo.=/ I personally do not care that much about burning and I don’t mind seeing it go, if you go with a similar build with wells and take close to death it’s gonna be a good build as well. I also think that the new spectral wall is over the top, I liked the previous version already and was hoping they would fix the combo field bug with the spectral attunement trait but then we suddenly randomly get a fear to it with reduced duration and increased CD. Again I do not mind seeing the current wall go and returning to the pre patch version, but fixed.

I also do not mind seeing epidemic not being available in sPVP.

If they start trying some changes outside of spectral wall and burning now, that is going to probably screw my pre patch build even more and that is going to be very sad, I’m already missing 10 trait points for it.=(

I do not know if it’s gonna give me any credit but I am only rank 28 or 29 and played around hmmm close to 400 tPVP matches, all solo queue on my terrormancer pre patch(don’t feel like playing post patch with the way the patch was handled and all this current crap regarding necros on the forums as well as sudden necro spam in the game). I usually kept 30+ more wins than losses and got to 535 on the leaderbaords at one point. Then I dropped back to 700+, took a break from the game, came back and dropped back to 96% or something. All pre patch solo queue on my terrormancer. Flesh wurm is awesome btw and a must have ability in my opinion.

Anyway I made a thread on the necro forums pre patch saying that if we get burning on top of terror, people will QQ about it a lot and we will be nerfed cause we’re gonna be op. You can check my prophecy in the attachment. I thought that if we would get burning on top of some decent pre patch terror, that would make people scream. And then we get increased terror application abilities+burning+torment+ some other stuff, lol. And can have two tick terrors in the burning build with spectral wall lol.

Again, please, if they are going to nerf something, start from spectral wall and burning.
Prioritize spectral wall though please. I do not want to be left without my pre patch terrormancer build or at least a similar build as a result…. Don’t screw us with the incorrect nerfs please, do not reapeat the mistake of this patch.

This is a condition burst and i still could have applied more conditions than I did. It’s just stupid.

vicious.5683:

jportell.2197:

vicious.5683:

Symbolic.7910:

vicious.5683:

Burning by itself it’s not a problem at all, go to necro forums and see the math on dps from burning trait, it’s laughable.

Just watch this, I use 3 abilities.

lot of gc builds can kill that golem in no time, you take like 15 secs and not even kill it.

Those other classes that burst the golem down that fast have to wait a bit before trying again. With the amount of conditions that necros have they can just use one more skill (scepter AA even) and bam… its gg

So you get you berzerker phantasm fixed and now you have plenty of time to ask for nerf other classes. Good for you!!

if mesmers are susceptible to conditions, it’s not necros fault. Ask Anet for better condi defense. Necros are susceptible to damage, so I should ask for nerf damage on mesmer illusions o MW or what ever? I don’t get your logic.

The point is necros still have some what decent survivability and arguably the best CC in the game (mesmer cc got nerfed hard this patch) And phantasmal berserker was a bug not a buff. It being fixed is something that took entirely too long (IMO any buffs/nerfs should wait til ALL bugs are fixed and every thing is running as it should.)
Also necro’s at their most GC have better condi cleanse than other classes. And also mesmer illusions got nerfed all illusion summons that aren’t in a shatter build now have a 20% longer cool down. What we are getting at is Anet overstepped when buffing the necro… The amount of condi pressure is more than even the most condition clearing specced classes can deal with. That is why it needs toned down. The addition of torment isn’t OP on its own but it makes it another condition that is on the bar that has to be cleared and may be taken off over other conditions first… This combination of things is why necros are currently a little stronger than the meta is ready for and should be toned down ( or anet needs to massively buff everyones condi clearing to make up for it) which do you think will happen first/?

Symbolic.7910:

This is a condition burst and i still could have applied more conditions than I did. It’s just stupid.

Well if we take this specific situation, I’d like to point out that the only difference from a pre patch terrormancer here is burning and torment. I did similar bursts pre patch but they lasted a 1,5-2 second longer.

jportell.2197:

Those other classes that burst the golem down that fast have to wait a bit before trying again. With the amount of conditions that necros have they can just use one more skill (scepter AA even) and bam… its gg

You act as if necro abilities don’t have cool downs. Fact is, most of them have longer than 15 second cool down. The one that has a cool down under 15 seconds only puts 3 stacks of bleeds and is attached to the worst sustaining weapon we have (staff).

Oh, but thats ok if mesmers can poop out phantasms every 5 seconds, go invisible, and make themselves invulnerable while still dishing out ridiculous amounts of damage. Just nerf necros. I understand that you don’t feel like learning how to counter them. You want to be able to have your cake and eat it too…

If you think this is a personal attack, don’t. I’m just using the same hyperbole that you’re using right now. Doesn’t feel to great, does it?

The amount of condi pressure is more than even the most condition clearing specced classes can deal with.

On a more serious note, its really no more than what an HGH engineer can put out. They can even use rabid amulets like necromancers as well. Engineers don’t have torment, but they get confusion instead. They even have the same trait that sets people on fire when they crit, except its an adept level trait.

Iceflame.5024:

Symbolic.7910:

This is a condition burst and i still could have applied more conditions than I did. It’s just stupid.

Well if we take this specific situation, I’d like to point out that the only difference from a pre patch terrormancer here is burning and torment. I did similar bursts pre patch but they lasted a 1,5-2 second longer.

It’s the burning/torment/doom changes. Plus the extra 30% condition duration for getting Dhuumfire, the spinal shivers proc at 25%. The spite traitline is better than the curses traitline, the only good thing in the curses traitline is terror/weakening shroud. This in itself allows for more coverage of the bleed/burning/poison making sure it’s not cleansed first.

just give each team in tournament the option to ban 1 class

would fix it fast^^

Kravick.4906:

jportell.2197:

Those other classes that burst the golem down that fast have to wait a bit before trying again. With the amount of conditions that necros have they can just use one more skill (scepter AA even) and bam… its gg

You act as if necro abilities don’t have cool downs. Fact is, most of them have longer than 15 second cool down. The one that has a cool down under 15 seconds only puts 3 stacks of bleeds and is attached to the worst sustaining weapon we have (staff). Oh, but thats ok if mesmers can poop out phantasms every 5 seconds, go invisible, and make themselves invulnerable while still dishing out ridiculous amounts of damage.

I’ve seen your posts before. I honestly have to say that your issue is a learn to play one. It is after all what you’ve told everyone else.

If you think this is a personal attack, don’t. I’m just using the same hyperbole that you’re using right now. Doesn’t feel to great, does it?

I’d say your issue was a learn to play one in all honesty.

Kravick.4906:

jportell.2197:

Those other classes that burst the golem down that fast have to wait a bit before trying again. With the amount of conditions that necros have they can just use one more skill (scepter AA even) and bam… its gg

You act as if necro abilities don’t have cool downs. Fact is, most of them have longer than 15 second cool down. The one that has a cool down under 15 seconds only puts 3 stacks of bleeds and is attached to the worst sustaining weapon we have (staff). Oh, but thats ok if mesmers can poop out phantasms every 5 seconds, go invisible, and make themselves invulnerable while still dishing out ridiculous amounts of damage.

I’ve seen your posts before. I honestly have to say that your issue is a learn to play one. It is after all what you’ve told everyone else.

I run one of the most anti condi mesmer builds there is (also have a necromancer.) It has been said that when the best way of dealing with a certain class is the same class it is OP… This was said of phantasm mesmers (and they still need a nerf IMO.) Right now if a team is facing 2 necros and they don’t have at least the same amount on theirs they are done. Also mesmers are still not taken for their damage dealing they are taken for IOL (which necros have a better version of) and portal ( which now has a very limited range.) Beyond that there are classes that can burst better/survive better/bunker better and provide condition over time better. If mesmer didn’t have portal no top tourney team would run them. And staff is an amazing necro weapon. Lets not forget that once you force someone to run through all their condi cleanses (most are on longer cooldowns than your condi application) you can wreck them extremely fast…. This isn’t so much an argument for a nerf against necros as it is AOE condi spam. But unfortunately necros out do everybody in that and there isn’t a team one that can keep up with the amount of condition spam they can put out.

Conditions in general need to change. Atm all damaging condis except for poison are complete faceroll. The class that can dish out the most is the best….

Make conditions stronger but way less spammable.

On the topic of necro’s: Considering every tournament there is atleast 2 on each team and they do very well while being mostly fotm players (only playing necro for a couple days) says it all really.

jportell.2197:

This combination of things is why necros are currently a little stronger than the meta is ready for and should be toned down ( or anet needs to massively buff everyones condi clearing to make up for it) which do you think will happen first/?

your mesmer needs as much condi cleanse as my necro needs blocks, evades, invulns, stealths or any other defensive mechanic against raw damage.
Conditions it’s the way necromancers do damage to the opponent. You are telling me that necros should not do damage, that conditions should be slow so you can have time to heal, stealth, recover, etc. You are telling me that high raw, quick damage it’s OK but high condition, quick damage it’s not OK. Don’t make sense. And as it doesn’t make sense, it won’t be any nerf soon, no matter how many threads you open in this forums.

What you don’t understand is that every class has a weakness. You can’t pretend to have all in one build. You are really biased towards condition pressure ‘cause your character it’s weak against conditions. I know ‘cause I leveled up a mesmer to 80 in WvW. It’s really hard to arguing with someone that don’t want to listen.

vicious.5683:

jportell.2197:

This combination of things is why necros are currently a little stronger than the meta is ready for and should be toned down ( or anet needs to massively buff everyones condi clearing to make up for it) which do you think will happen first/?

your mesmer needs as much condi cleanse as my necro needs blocks, evades, invulns, stealths or any other defensive mechanic against raw damage.
Conditions it’s the way necromancers do damage to the opponent. You are telling me that necros should not do damage, that conditions should be slow so you can have time to heal, stealth, recover, etc. You are telling me that high raw, quick damage it’s OK but high condition, quick damage it’s not OK. Don’t make sense. And as it doesn’t make sense, it won’t be any nerf soon, no matter how many threads you open in this forums.

What you don’t understand is that every class has a weakness. You can’t pretend to have all in one build. You are really biased towards condition pressure ‘cause your character it’s weak against conditions. I know ‘cause I leveled up a mesmer to 80 in WvW. It’s really hard to arguing with someone that don’t want to listen.

I am fine with high condition damage from necros… They needed a little bit more. But got way more than was necessary do you not see the disconnect?

I am not saying necros need to be exactly at where they were pre patch. I am saying one or some of the buffs in this patch need toned down…. And I know every class has a weakness ANet has designed them this way. I’ll take mesmer they have great burst and great survivability (when specced not all in one build.) They aren’t very good at damage over time have limited escape (I mean just out right running from a fight.) and the worst innate condition clearing in the game (not in the heal skill.) Which I am fine with. Necros are currently overpowering EVERY class with their amount of conditions applied and reapplied.

jportell.2197:

… But unfortunately necros out do everybody in that and there isn’t a team one that can keep up with the amount of condition spam they can put out.

those teams do exist. they are called not-awful teams.

and something else. NEcros put a lot of condition cause necros have abysmal access to all kind of boons. The logic it’s quite simple: you get strong through buff I get strong through conditions. You take conditions away from necro and you have to give them buffs, but none of those are gonna happen.

vicious.5683:

jportell.2197:

… But unfortunately necros out do everybody in that and there isn’t a team one that can keep up with the amount of condition spam they can put out.

those teams do exist. they are called not-awful teams.

and something else. NEcros put a lot of condition cause necros have abysmal access to all kind of boons. The logic it’s quite simple: you get strong through buff I get strong through conditions. You take conditions away from necro and you have to give them buffs, but none of those are gonna happen.

So team Ugly is just god awful right? How bout the other x amount of teams that paradigm just rolled through on account of having two necros? When people playing the class admit that it is over powered it should be a hint (I SAY THE SAME THING FOR PHANTASM MESMERS!)

jportell.2197:

vicious.5683:

jportell.2197:

This combination of things is why necros are currently a little stronger than the meta is ready for and should be toned down ( or anet needs to massively buff everyones condi clearing to make up for it) which do you think will happen first/?

your mesmer needs as much condi cleanse as my necro needs blocks, evades, invulns, stealths or any other defensive mechanic against raw damage.
Conditions it’s the way necromancers do damage to the opponent. You are telling me that necros should not do damage, that conditions should be slow so you can have time to heal, stealth, recover, etc. You are telling me that high raw, quick damage it’s OK but high condition, quick damage it’s not OK. Don’t make sense. And as it doesn’t make sense, it won’t be any nerf soon, no matter how many threads you open in this forums.

What you don’t understand is that every class has a weakness. You can’t pretend to have all in one build. You are really biased towards condition pressure ‘cause your character it’s weak against conditions. I know ‘cause I leveled up a mesmer to 80 in WvW. It’s really hard to arguing with someone that don’t want to listen.

I am fine with high condition damage from necros… They needed a little bit more. But got way more than was necessary do you not see the disconnect?

I am not saying necros need to be exactly at where they were pre patch. I am saying one or some of the buffs in this patch need toned down…. And I know every class has a weakness ANet has designed them this way. I’ll take mesmer they have great burst and great survivability (when specced not all in one build.) They aren’t very good at damage over time have limited escape (I mean just out right running from a fight.) and the worst innate condition clearing in the game (not in the heal skill.) Which I am fine with. Necros are currently overpowering EVERY class with their amount of conditions applied and reapplied.

Your biased. Extremely biased. Don’t lump my guardian and ranger into your troubles of having condition removal problems. I’m not having any of the problems you’re talking about on these classes.

vicious just stop – it isnt even more funny to read what you write

watch the replay from tournament yesterday – pradigm destroyed all the teams with 2 necros and they dont played vs noobs – this was TOP TEAMS
after tournament they even said they dont used any tactic or strategie they just went to the node and said to the necros kill something – done

seriously – just stop – even a 5 year old would understand how broken the game is atm

I like pie. Hi Symbolic, my BFF.

jportell.2197:

vicious.5683:

jportell.2197:

… But unfortunately necros out do everybody in that and there isn’t a team one that can keep up with the amount of condition spam they can put out.

those teams do exist. they are called not-awful teams.

and something else. NEcros put a lot of condition cause necros have abysmal access to all kind of boons. The logic it’s quite simple: you get strong through buff I get strong through conditions. You take conditions away from necro and you have to give them buffs, but none of those are gonna happen.

So team Ugly is just god awful right? How bout the other x amount of teams that paradigm just rolled through on account of having two necros? When people playing the class admit that it is over powered it should be a hint (I SAY THE SAME THING FOR PHANTASM MESMERS!)

They rolled through those teams because those teams weren’t expecting to deal with necromancers. No one ran necromancers before the patch. They were useless in team fights because of how easy they were to focus fire down. Now people have a reason to use necromancers, people need to learn how to deal with them. Its simple. Actually its not. Necro defense has not been changed one bit. They still die extremely fast to focus fire. They have very little to no defense against more than 2 people hitting them.

There, I just told you how to beat necros. Even top teams need to learn to adapt. They’re not going to know what to do when something changes right away.

Romek.4201:

vicious just stop – it isnt even more funny to read what you write

watch the replay from tournament yesterday – pradigm destroyed all the teams with 2 necros and they dont played vs noobs – this was TOP TEAMS
after tournament they even said they dont used any tactic or strategie they just went to the node and said to the necros kill something – done

seriously – just stop – even a 5 year old would understand how broken the game is atm

Thank you! Once again when someone using them on the team that won says it is ONLY because of having those 2 necros on their team that should mean something!

jportell.2197:

vicious.5683:

jportell.2197:

… But unfortunately necros out do everybody in that and there isn’t a team one that can keep up with the amount of condition spam they can put out.

those teams do exist. they are called not-awful teams.

and something else. NEcros put a lot of condition cause necros have abysmal access to all kind of boons. The logic it’s quite simple: you get strong through buff I get strong through conditions. You take conditions away from necro and you have to give them buffs, but none of those are gonna happen.

So team Ugly is just god awful right? How bout the other x amount of teams that paradigm just rolled through on account of having two necros? When people playing the class admit that it is over powered it should be a hint (I SAY THE SAME THING FOR PHANTASM MESMERS!)

maybe they are just great players with new and useful weapons.
maybe 2 necros have a great synergy.
maybe 2 necros both with spectral wall and terror it’s a bit or too OP

but in any case, this has nothing to do with Dhuumfire

vicious.5683:

jportell.2197:

vicious.5683:

jportell.2197:

… But unfortunately necros out do everybody in that and there isn’t a team one that can keep up with the amount of condition spam they can put out.

those teams do exist. they are called not-awful teams.

and something else. NEcros put a lot of condition cause necros have abysmal access to all kind of boons. The logic it’s quite simple: you get strong through buff I get strong through conditions. You take conditions away from necro and you have to give them buffs, but none of those are gonna happen.

So team Ugly is just god awful right? How bout the other x amount of teams that paradigm just rolled through on account of having two necros? When people playing the class admit that it is over powered it should be a hint (I SAY THE SAME THING FOR PHANTASM MESMERS!)

maybe they are just great players with new and useful weapons.
maybe 2 necros have a great synergy.
maybe 2 necros both with spectral wall and terror it’s a bit or too OP

but in any case, this has nothing to do with Dhuumfire

Dhuumfire is just a part of the whole. Removal of anyone or some (not all) of the buffs necros were given this patch (or toning down of duration ease of application etc) would help greatly.

God forbid they give something good to a class other than Guardian or Mesmer.

I like it, it gives axe specs a huge damage boost. Necros weren’t simply doing the damage output required in fights. With the amount of AOE condi removals and sacrificing a good chunk of surviveabilty to gain dhuumfire, i say its balanced in all sense. I love seeing an increase in necros playing. Dhuumfire is not OP. The cons and pros are perfect for it. If they do decide to nerf it, they need to buff corrupt boon again , or make stability priority.

Romek.4201:

vicious just stop – it isnt even more funny to read what you write

Kravick.4906:

They rolled through those teams because those teams weren’t expecting to deal with necromancers. No one ran necromancers before the patch. They were useless in team fights because of how easy they were to focus fire down.

^ this!
let the meta learn to counter necros before asking for nerfs.

jportell.2197:

Dhuumfire is just a part of the whole. Removal of anyone or some (not all) of the buffs necros were given this patch (or toning down of duration ease of application etc) would help greatly.

Ppl l2p and you stop crying would help much more.

vicious.5683:

Kravick.4906:

They rolled through those teams because those teams weren’t expecting to deal with necromancers. No one ran necromancers before the patch. They were useless in team fights because of how easy they were to focus fire down.

^ this!
let the meta learn to counter necros before asking for nerfs.

jportell.2197:

Dhuumfire is just a part of the whole. Removal of anyone or some (not all) of the buffs necros were given this patch (or toning down of duration ease of application etc) would help greatly.

Ppl l2p and you stop crying would help much more.

Okay so phantasm mesmer is nowhere near OP right? (hint it is) Pre-pistol whip nerf thief (nov) was not OP at all? The amount of healing guardians and eles could do was not OP? The reasons for having certain boon duration runes nerfed in PvP is invalid and they should equal their pve equivalents? L2P is not an issue when people that have run anti condi cleanse specs can still not keep up… Other necros have said it (even the mightyatroll who i generally disagree with) that necros needed love in the defensive area….

Deified.7520:

God forbid they give something good to a class other than Guardian or Mesmer.

I like it, it gives axe specs a huge damage boost. Necros weren’t simply doing the damage output required in fights. With the amount of AOE condi removals and sacrificing a good chunk of surviveabilty to gain dhuumfire, i say its balanced in all sense. I love seeing an increase in necros playing. Dhuumfire is not OP. The cons and pros are perfect for it. If they do decide to nerf it, they need to buff corrupt boon again , or make stability priority.

Pretty much this. Right now, the top teams are all running guardian/mesmer/elementalist. If you don’t have at least 2 of these three classes on your team, your team comp is very unlikely to do well. Honestly, its almost required to have a guardian. Without one, your team comp is REALLY going to struggle.

Honesty nothing has really changed for necors I saw. They got dhuumfire, #5, and spectral wall. Our corrupt boon got nerfed. The deahtshroud mechanics are still the same as before. Necros are very very easy to counter. With condi removal, CC, or even immobilizes you can easily shut one down. The necromancers mechanics of defense are taking hits. Not constant evades, not stealth, not invulnerabilities, not teleporting. They are literally made to just absorb hits. From what I see it is just people reacting to a new meta. If you honestly think that dhuumfire is making necors this OP, you should really look back on mesmers insane burst damage with great utilities in both their weaponskills and other skills, guardians amazing overall surviveability, thieves ability to hit for insane amount of single target DPS. People will complain about necros for about a month, just like they did with mes, guard, and thieves at release. Nothing will happen, they’ll quiet down and the meta will adjust. Anet wil decide to buff another class to actually make it viable, rinse and repeat.

Deified.7520:

Honesty nothing has really changed for necors I saw. They got dhuumfire, #5, and spectral wall. Our corrupt boon got nerfed. The deahtshroud mechanics are still the same as before. Necros are very very easy to counter. With condi removal, CC, or even immobilizes you can easily shut one down. The necromancers mechanics of defense are taking hits. Not constant evades, not stealth, not invulnerabilities, not teleporting. They are literally made to just absorb hits. From what I see it is just people reacting to a new meta. If you honestly think that dhuumfire is making necors this OP, you should really look back on mesmers insane burst damage with great utilities in both their weaponskills and other skills, guardians amazing overall surviveability, thieves ability to hit for insane amount of single target DPS. People will complain about necros for about a month, just like they did with mes, guard, and thieves at release. Nothing will happen, they’ll quiet down and the meta will adjust. Anet wil decide to buff another class to actually make it viable, rinse and repeat.

Lets not forget about the massive outcry people had for Bulls Rush -> Frenzy -> Hundred Blades spammers. The tPvP scene was dominated by this play style in the beginning. ANet did literally nothing to change that combo. Now, people laugh at warriors because they learned to slot a stunbreaker. Amazing what a little foresight does for you.

Oh, and most recently, Larcenous Strike! I’m sure ANet is going to give necros a token nerf like they gave thieves (1 extra initiative cost? LOL, they still spam the kitten out of it.). Probably by reducing the duration of burning by 1 second, or possibly reduce terror damage by 10%, but overall I doubt anything is really going to change.

People will learn to adapt like they always have.

Stunbreaker? Just walk away from the charge.XD

I avoided bull rushes by just strafing.

As I mentioned in Purie’s threat, I think that Dhuumfire and the buff to Doom where uncalled for, specially with the addition of torment that helps us cover up our bleeds. Our damage wasn’t that bad before the patch, it was mostly our ability to disengange that was, and still is, at fault. As much as it is nice to finally be noticed by the devs, this patch did way more harm than good.

Still, some people are just being way too obnoxious about the whole issue. No one asked for this to happen, so don’t be little smug kittens.

The best solution, imho, is to merge Terror with Master of Terror, bring it to the Soul Reaping traitline, make it scale with Power instead of Condition Damage buff the damage and remove the damage bonus with conditions.

Now that Necros have burning, Terror is too much bursty and they don’t need them in order to have enough pressure.
Power Necros, on the other hand, are still a bit lacking and Terror being a Power trait will be an huge improvement to their capabilities (both offensive and defensive).

Less than 360 dps. Q kittening Q.

We didnt ask for burning, actually if everything else stay as it is, i could drop burning and save those 30 points for some more survivability and LF regen.

Iceflame.5024:

Well I’d say the thing that’s making people freak out the most is the fact that we got a lot of things at once. Basically new burning and torment. But then on top of all of this we suddenly get this super terror spectral wall and possibly the improved signet of spite, that people start using. So we end up getting a spec with burning, torment + inscreased terror application abilities compared to a terror build pre patch(except for the duration for a terror build but you can make it tick twice anyways with necromancer runes on top of 30 points into spite). This combination of everything is a bit too much.

It saddens me though to see how most of the buffs that we got were really not asked for by the community. The things that have mostly been mentioned were defensive problems, slow cast times and people also asked for a tiny little possible buff on the offense. As a result we mostly get a huge offensive buff lol.

Also the pre patch terror build that I was using got screwed with the terror move from adept to master, screwed up my 20 points into curses terror+banshees vail combo.=/ I personally do not care that much about burning and I don’t mind seeing it go, if you go with a similar build with wells and take close to death it’s gonna be a good build as well. I also think that the new spectral wall is over the top, I liked the previous version already and was hoping they would fix the combo field bug with the spectral attunement trait but then we suddenly randomly get a fear to it with reduced duration and increased CD. Again I do not mind seeing the current wall go and returning to the pre patch version, but fixed.

I also do not mind seeing epidemic not being available in sPVP.

If they start trying some changes outside of spectral wall and burning now, that is going to probably screw my pre patch build even more and that is going to be very sad, I’m already missing 10 trait points for it.=(

I do not know if it’s gonna give me any credit but I am only rank 28 or 29 and played around hmmm close to 400 tPVP matches, all solo queue on my terrormancer pre patch(don’t feel like playing post patch with the way the patch was handled and all this current crap regarding necros on the forums as well as sudden necro spam in the game). I usually kept 30+ more wins than losses and got to 535 on the leaderbaords at one point. Then I dropped back to 700+, took a break from the game, came back and dropped back to 96% or something. All pre patch solo queue on my terrormancer. Flesh wurm is awesome btw and a must have ability in my opinion.

Anyway I made a thread on the necro forums pre patch saying that if we get burning on top of terror, people will QQ about it a lot and we will be nerfed cause we’re gonna be op. You can check my prophecy in the attachment. I thought that if we would get burning on top of some decent pre patch terror, that would make people scream. And then we get increased terror application abilities+burning+torment+ some other stuff, lol. And can have two tick terrors in the burning build with spectral wall lol.

Again, please if they are going to nerf something, start from spectral wall and burning.
Prioritize spectral wall though please. I do not want to be left without my pre patch terrormancer build or at least a similar build as a result…. Don’t screw us with the incorrect nerfs please, do not reapeat the mistake of this patch.

Well said.

I remember people asking for greater marks to be baseline, some vigor/stability, bit more mobility… not sure what happened to all of that.

As someone who has a Necro, I was having similar problems dealing with the switch to more condition versus direct damage in the game.

I did 3 things that helped.

1. I swapped toughness for more vitality.
2. Used Well of Power to turn all those conditions into boons
3. Spec’d 10 pts into healing/vitality which also gave me regen at 90% and mark of blood for possible regen everytime I dodged.

On my Ranger, I’m doing similar tweaking. I play a few other classes, but haven’t had time to thoroughly test all the proper changes yet.

Of course, if you don’t want to change your build/trait/runes/sigils and expect the game to play the same as pre-patch, then you probably are better off staying here on the forum and whine about getting things like Dhuumfire removed.

If anything warrants nerfing on Necros, it’s going to be the Terror trait. It’s probably overbudget now that there are more sources of fear.

I tried a Power Necro without Terror and it is not anything people would think is OP, yet the added fears are really helpful for defense and making it playable.