Guild Wars 2

I play a necro, I’m level 60. I’m rank 11 in spvp just accidentally, from the time I’ve spent in there, not grinding or anything.

I decided to try a warrior yesterday, and I was absolutely demolishing people after reading my skills, and leveling to 6 to get an understanding of the class.

I’m not going to cry or complain or anything, but it’s clear to me that necros are absolutely, 100% broken. They rely solely on the opposing players inability to play properly to win fights. I was literally 1v3’ing people on my warrior…in seconds.

On my necro, I normally can’t kill anyone in the time it takes for their support to arrive. Then it’s obvious what happens.

It’s not a skill issue, as I would consider myself pretty good on my necro. I rarely lose 1v1 matches, it’s just that there simply isn’t enough pressure there to actually kill anyone who’s not bad.

I think part of the problem is design. I think another part is that condition damage scales so absolutely terribly with everything in this game. Vulnerability doesn’t help it. Might doesn’t help it. Fury doesn’t help it. Traits like “gives 5% more damage while health is over 90%” don’t help it. Power doesn’t help it. Precision doesn’t help it. It’s just brokenly weak. That’s a fact.

My auto attack does about the same at level 80 as my thief does who is level 40. It’s absolutely broken. If you want stats to affect you, you need to use the broken axe or the dagger…but then, with the dagger, you aren’t given the utility / mobility spells that are needed.

Before you bring up lich form, realize that in lich form, my hits do about 300 dmg per hit as a condition build…because, it’s just that bad. It’s a joke.

If you are getting outplayed that badly on a necro with condition build, then you are either playing against classes that have a lot of condition removal, or not stacking conditions up properly. If your versing an enemy without condition removal, you should be able to stack up enough bleeds/poisons to drop someones health relatively quickly. Condition damage doesn’t scale with anything, but that is fair, considering that it can not be mitigated either, only removed. If someone is constantly removing the conditions, then they are probably utilizing all of their utility skills and heal to do so, which means they have no real damage increases in their utility and it becomes more of a match of can you outlast them or not. A good condition build can do anywhere from 7-8k damage in 5-6 seconds if it doesn’t get removed ticking 100+ times in that period.

[edit]
If your going condition build and using lich form, you are doing it wrong. Why would you use lich form when you have plague form, which grants an increase in health, stability, and the ability to constantly stack more conditions on your foe?

I stopped playing condition build when i figured i was doing no damage to any non 100% noob player. Maybe in team vs team is more efficient when coordinated but in random spvp or 1v1 its useless. (just my opinion)

Anyway I think that necros are mostly based on alteration damage not condition. And alteration scales well with +power thats what i did on my necro.

Also it seems different classes have different learning curves… playing a necro for a while u were not that noob when rolling a warrior which is probably one if not the most straight forward (easy) class to play /shrug

Condition builds are at a bit of a disadvantage because a lot of builds counter them. There’s not really much that counters just raw damage (except bunker guardians, but they counter all damage!).

I find this thread amusing because I usually played mesmer but I decided to make a necro for spvp last night. Now having just starting playing necro I was basically just going into matches and hitting buttons. I went with a well focused build since I figured with so much fighting around the point nodes being able to spam a couple of wells would tip the fights in my teams favor.

Most classes were pretty rough to fight, but of all the classes warrior was without a doubt the easiest to kill. I mean they all do the SAME thing BULL RUSH, HUNDRED BLADES! I just went lol dodged an spammed my auto attack until they died.

1v3? I would say maybe you’re are just ubber awesomesauce with said class. I play a warrior and never 1v3 anyone, and I’m no scrub!

The problem is not the warrior is the burst in general…

JonPeters.5630:

once people start mastering DS, I’m afraid of how strong Necro will be

I might be taking this out of context, but does that mean we have to be specced to DS basically to be able to hold our own weight?

I find blood and conditionmancer to be way more fun then just trying to get into DS. Guess it’s time to re roll.

Mastering DS? Excuse me? What’s to master? What on earth do you think us Necros have been doing since BWE1?

The top necro players from Paradigm etc. are all saying similar things re: bugs, balance and design. I appreciate we might not have the same godlike holistic view of the design you’ve created here Jon, but there’s a serious shortage of people who think the necro is fine and any issues are a result of L2P deficit.

I don’t believe I’ve ever said this to a developer before, but if you could provide video proof of someone utilising DS to devastating effect I’d be more than happy to accept your statement as relevant/accurate. The “good PvP” videos of necros dried up immediately after BWE2 and the DS HP/LF nerf.

JonPeters it was the cleanse nerf that countered Master Yi. It used to give 3 seconds I believe of CC immunity which was more than enough time for Yi to blast whoever he wanted. Get it? Cleanse nerf? Cleanse conditions, too strong? Anyways, I made a Mesmer to PvP with, which by the way is the premier pick-up sPvP class, as well as being too strong right now. Mesmers will remain so simply because of their tools.

If any of you Devs read this, right now mobility and escapes are the most important things you can have in the average pick-up game. Thieves, mesmers and elementalists get to pick their battles, which is a much stronger tool than you can imagine. Elementalists aren’t a problem, they are pretty underpowered at this moment, but Mesmers and Thieves excel at sPvP.

I think you guys should seriously take a look at Necros and Elementalists. They really have it rough. I don’t play a necro myself but the only viable spec to play is condition damage. How about some love for a power or damage build? For the axe weapon which my bro who plays necro tells me is the worst thing he’s ever seen.

A simple solution would be to implement a curse that makes sure conditions stay on for a set amount of time so they actually see some damage ticks. And also, the engineer trait that lets them enjoy complete condition immunity under 25% health is fundamentally broken.

Ezekeel I agree with you but you should be more polite.

Maybe we should pop in and out DS to use it as bonus 4 skills. I’m newbie when it comes to PvP but I only used DS as way to escaping enemies, sometimes used #4 during bigger team fights. It may be my fault for not seeing full potential of DS. Maybe some time in game I will.

I was rocking people with a minion master for awhile…

Yesterday I went up against a necro who spent 2 seconds going throu his rotation wich afterwards melted my 16k hp in a matter of seconds. I dont see how this is pathetic dmg. Yes 16k is not much, it is very low but still it melted away and he was really tanky. Necroes do good dmg in right specc. But again from what I have heard there are very few viable speccs a necro can run.

DS even in fully specced and in full power gear does NOWHERE near the dmg some of the other classes can pump out with their DPS weapon sets and the dmg gets lower with each use of the Nr.1 ability since its tied to Lifeforce we currently have, neither does it last long enough and it cuts us off from all our utilitys and elite skills, how is that supposed to be the factor that makes us “Balanced” compared to the other classes or hell make anyone afraid of us? In its current form no one uses it for anything other then a fear that lasts a lovely one second or a damage absorber. And being told that we just need to L2P the Class to be able to do anything is just…

I find DS boring as well and only use it to get away from enemies, when I am about to die, or to get into a keep that has 100 people smashing on the door. I don’t like the skills DS has, they just seem to plain and not like “OH, CRAP!, THAT NECRO JUST WENT DS” as to…“great he/she is going to live a little longer because he has DS”.

It seems silly to HAVE to spec that way to be able to to compete with other classes.

You can master DS by mixing some crucial traits here and there that give you bonuses, and exploit the game a little bit with some channeling and DS=HP mechanics.
But with the amount of hidden CDs, long CDs, bugs, non scaling condition damage, low scaling Power damage, slow attack speed is not profitable.
And even doing that micro-management, that gives no diversity to the class.

Dont let me start about underwater combat… many times GW2 made me Alt+F4 ragequit.

For the record, I only made this post because I love a necro. The devs need to realize that. I didn’t make it because I want to faceroll. Only because I want to play on a level playing field, which the necro community, at large, doesn’t think we are playing on.

Jadda.1753:

Ezekeel.2837:

JonPeters.5630:

snip.

The OP is 100% correct. The damage with the necro is just pathetic compared to other professions. DS does not give any significant damage boost, so telling people that they just need to learn to properly use DS is complete nonsense.

You are responsible for the balancing and you failed. Stop patronizing us, stop talking nonsense and do your job!

Yesterday I went up against a necro who spent 2 seconds going throu his rotation wich afterwards melted my 16k hp in a matter of seconds. I dont see how this is pathetic dmg. Yes 16k is not much, it is very low but still it melted away and he was really tanky. Necroes do good dmg in right specc. But again from what I have heard there are very few viable speccs a necro can run.

The is no way a necro can dish out 16k damage in 2sec in PvP – not even with lucky crits. That is simple math. If you do not believe me roll a necro and try yourself.

Stop crying, I play a Thief, Necromancer and Warrior.

I dominate and destroy 90% of the people I face when I play on my Thief and Necromancer. I LOSE 70% of my fights when I play a Warrior.

Does this mean Thieves and Necromancers are OP and Warriors are weak? Of course not!

This means that I am good at playing Thief and Necromacner, but not good at playing Warrior.

The balance in GW2 is very decent, the problem is not the game but the PLAYERS! Understand this, practice and improve.

Even if you are stubborn enough to disagree, nothing stops you from making the profession you think is OP and playing that. It takes you 3 minuts to do the intro and 5 minuts to get the build.

Arenanet should issue forum bans against bad PvP players that do nothing but cry, if you have a complainment give critical and factual arguments and provide data and sources for your claims.

That is all.

I’ve faced some dominant necros in tournaments, not seen really any good ones outside of them though.

My attempt at playing one didn’t go so well either.

Ezekeel.2837:

You are responsible for the balancing and you failed. Stop patronizing us, stop talking nonsense and do your job!

show some respect, and appreciate what you DID get. do you have any idea how hard his job is? the game just came out.

looks like john peters is going to be the new ghostcrawler lol

JonPeters.5630:

Keep in mind that some professions are harder to master than others. I believe Necro is the hardest, opinions may vary, but just keep this in mind. No we arent ignoring Necro, but once people start mastering DS, I’m afraid of how strong Necro will be. Give it some time for the average player to learn these things. For example early on in LOL master yi was dominant until people learned how to counter him.

This is not utilizing DS but necro damage is there at least for pvp…

My team mate skillotine shows off his burst:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7zZDtrhwZ_w&feature=plcp starts @ 1:11

I myself run a bunker well build that goes toe to toe with any guardian, and is capable of holding off multiple people untill help arrives. Guess what my secret is? DS and creative use of utilitys.

While yes necromancers are quite buggy they aren’t as bad as everyone says they are.

Boon control is OP…

Ezekeel.2837:

Stop patronizing us, stop talking nonsense and do your job!

You’ve got one hell of a lot of nerve.

Wow. That was amazing. Couple of you people are so out of line with human decency, let alone basic respect for the people that created the game you are playing it’s jaw-dropping.

Especially this one:

Ezekeel.2837:

The OP is 100% correct. The damage with the necro is just pathetic compared to other professions. DS does not give any significant damage boost, so telling people that they just need to learn to properly use DS is complete nonsense.

You are responsible for the balancing and you failed. Stop patronizing us, stop talking nonsense and do your job!

Completely oblivious to how the game works and the idea that maybe, just maybe, classes are not balanced only around their damage output. What a joke.

Edit: Oh wow he’s still posting that bs…

We can build tanky, we can do that, But in a power build we do less dmg then the other classes with a full power setup and using our Elite nuking skill Lich form we can get 3-4k hits wich is quite low compared to the other professions in full power gear, In Conditionmancer spec is the only thing we realy shine in yet we cant apply conditions as fast as many other professions our only real job there is condition control and thanks to some bugs that isnt even good (Plague signet for example just copyign conditions of others and not removing them ) We just seem to have no viable job taht any other class cant do better then us, lets not even go into the fact that a huge part of necro is not viable because of horrible AI and nonexistant usability in most content in the game

Garadon.3189:

Ezekeel.2837:

Stop patronizing us, stop talking nonsense and do your job!

You’ve got one hell of a lot of nerve.

They promised something and didn’t deliver then tried to give everyone the middle finger saying L2P that is just an insult.

milo.6942:

Wow. That was amazing. Couple of you people are so out of line with human decency, let alone basic respect for the people that created the game you are playing it’s jaw-dropping.

Especially this one:

Ezekeel.2837:

The OP is 100% correct. The damage with the necro is just pathetic compared to other professions. DS does not give any significant damage boost, so telling people that they just need to learn to properly use DS is complete nonsense.

You are responsible for the balancing and you failed. Stop patronizing us, stop talking nonsense and do your job!

Completely oblivious to how the game works and the idea that maybe, just maybe, classes are not balanced only around their damage output. What a joke.

Edit: Oh wow he’s still posting that bs…

You did not get told that the class you have spent upwards of 200 hours playing is fine and you just have to L2P it by a Game Designer when 90% of necros agree that theres something wrong with the profession compared to the others. Compared to the utter lack of information Necro´s have gotten from any developers nearly the only info we get is that we have just yet to Master the class to be good isnt a fun fact.

I appreciate the work the Game Designers did, in GW1 they did a great job, and I know it is a quite hard job but I don’t want the Necromancer become a sort of Paragon as it was in GW1. There are 2 entire weapons which are totally useless for the Necromancer. These weapons are Axe end MH Dagger.

The Axe do a so poor damage compared to other professions, also when fully specced in Power/Crit while having an insane low range. I don’t know if someone has played Axe Necro, but it’s something you would never do it again after you tried.

The MH Dagger is in the same position. The damage is too low to be a melee range, while the channeling 2 skill can’t hit 4k damage after 3 seconds of damage, always fully specced of course.

That’s why there are only condition-tanky Necros, both in PvP and in PvE, because there are no alternatives. And also at spamming conditions, Necomancers are bad compared to other professions, due to broken traits and poor scepter bleed duration. A Thief can stack much more than 7-8 bleeds, which is the cap the Necro has when running Scepter/Dagger, in half a time, so can do the Warrior.

And I didn’t touched the bunch of useless and negative traits the Necro has. Do you want to talk about the free-rally 100hp Jagged Horror? The sad thing is that it is a minor trait of Death Magic, at 5 trait points. You have it anyways if you want to have some more toughness, it is a sort of malus.

I cant seem to find a solid build for my necro. I used to do condition damage. But, it felt like i was ignoring my DS which is a huge part of the necro. As a condition built necro the DS is just extending your life/hp.

Now i went tanky with alot of power. Axe/dagger – dagger/focus build, traited for DS. DS still feels weak when i enter and try to fight in it. Life Transfer is the only skill that is worth while. 3k aoe damage. However, my engineer with Big Ol Bomb does that every few seconds.

JonPeters.5630:

Keep in mind that some professions are harder to master than others. I believe Necro is the hardest, opinions may vary, but just keep this in mind. No we arent ignoring Necro, but once people start mastering DS, I’m afraid of how strong Necro will be. Give it some time for the average player to learn these things. For example early on in LOL master yi was dominant until people learned how to counter him.

Would you mind explaining this? I play necro soley and while I do very fine your comment is a bit strange to me. I talk here and there with the necro mains at Team Paradigm and try to get as many opinions as possible. Necro’s DS is easily countered in many respects unless you have stability, the freeze bleed skill takes WAY to long to go off (simply changing this to go off much faster would do a lot of the class), as a melee necro fearing sometimes is counter to keeping them close so its a weird synergy at times and THE NUMBER ONE issue with D.S. is that you need to get a decent way into a battle to make it usefull and this is the time when necro is most vulnerable. I tell my group to ALWAYS focus necro in the start of team fights, because unless speced with lots of protection (I’m one of the only necro’s i know who do this) they will go down pretty fast since they don’t have stored life force to fall back on. They may pop a Spectral armor but they will have to dodge and prematurely go into D.S. (because damage is to high to just take and the protection is just a momentary buffer vrs focus and the life force gaining aspect will be removed). At this point a few more hits while in D.S. and then they are out and easily killed at that point (takes a lot of team cordination at this point to get you out of this downward spiral).

Now if they have plague form, the necro is balanced (but I don’t know if centering around a elites for balance is good design)

Get the trait that gives you retribution when you activate DS.

Wait for a warrior to HB you.

Activate DS.

Win?

Right, so maybe this isn’t clear to people that haven’t played guild wars 1, but the necro was not a “damage dealer”. He provided mostly enemy debuffs, buff stripping, degeneration, light cc, and if you build him properly, a moderate amount of damage. I feel like I have to spell this out: The necro was a team asset. You didn’t play necro and then complain on forums that you did no damage. Which is what you people are doing. Which is why everyone needs to get a grip, relax, and apologize to Mr. Peters, who was trying to help out.

(yes, bloodspike, aura of the lich, and a few other gimmick builds for high damage, but they got nerfed and I was speaking about their more standard roles.)

Hm…i’m playing mostly with elementalist, and I can tell you that i have most problems with necros and mesmers. Necro can burn my health in a 2-3 secs, and i can’t do anything about it. I didn’t play with necro myself, and maybe i’m doing something wrong when fighting them 1vs1 (i’m trying to remove conditions, but still, going down so fast)…most of the time when fighting good necro, I’m dead.

I don’t have so much problem with other classes, but those two…uh…

milo.6942:

Right, so maybe this isn’t clear to people that haven’t played guild wars 1, but the necro was not a “damage dealer”. He provided mostly enemy debuffs, buff stripping, degeneration, light cc, and if you build him properly, a moderate amount of damage. I feel like I have to spell this out: The necro was a team asset. You didn’t play necro and then complain on forums that you did no damage. Which is what you people are doing. Which is why everyone needs to get a grip, relax, and apologize to Mr. Peters, who was trying to help out.

Uh, bloodspike?

But yes, they were generally an annoyance class. A weaker annoyance class than mesmer, but annoying nonetheless.

JonPeters.5630:

Keep in mind that some professions are harder to master than others. I believe Necro is the hardest, opinions may vary, but just keep this in mind. No we arent ignoring Necro, but once people start mastering DS, I’m afraid of how strong Necro will be. Give it some time for the average player to learn these things. For example early on in LOL master yi was dominant until people learned how to counter him.

Would you mind explaining this? I play necro soley and while I do very fine your comment is a bit strange to me. I talk here and there with the necro mains at Team Paradigm and try to get as many opinions as possible. Necro’s DS is easily countered in many respects unless you have stability, the freeze bleed skill takes WAY to long to go off (simply changing this to go off much faster would do a lot of the class), as a melee necro fearing sometimes is counter to keeping them close so its a weird synergy at times and THE NUMBER ONE issue with D.S. is that you need to get a decent way into a battle to make it usefull and this is the time when necro is most vulnerable. I tell my group to ALWAYS focus necro in the start of team fights, because unless speced with lots of protection (I’m one of the only necro’s i know who do this) they will go down pretty fast since they don’t have stored life force to fall back on. They may pop a Spectral armor but they will have to dodge and prematurely go into D.S. (because damage is to high to just take and the protection is just a momentary buffer vrs focus and the life force gaining aspect will be removed). At this point a few more hits while in D.S. and then they are out and easily killed at that point (takes a lot of team cordination at this point to get you out of this downward spiral).

Now if they have plague form, the necro is balanced (but I don’t know if centering around a elites for balance is good design)

I know this may sound weird, but I think by having necro’s start with 100% D.S. and balancing from there is much better, than working from 0-100% (and Ya things would need to be adjusted from current)

milo.6942:

Right, so maybe this isn’t clear to people that haven’t played guild wars 1, but the necro was not a “damage dealer”. He provided mostly enemy debuffs, buff stripping, degeneration, light cc, and if you build him properly, a moderate amount of damage. I feel like I have to spell this out: The necro was a team asset. You didn’t play necro and then complain on forums that you did no damage. Which is what you people are doing. Which is why everyone needs to get a grip, relax, and apologize to Mr. Peters, who was trying to help out.

Your wrong in GW2 We do not have many debuffs, buffs, etc etc that was in GW1. In GW2 necromancer is completly diffrent without the varied skill option in GW1. And without those skills our complete lack of DMG compared to the other profession atm is unfair, we are pigeon holed into being a conditionmancer ( A job we arent even in third place on being the best at since several other professions can apply and maintain bleeds more rapidly than us ) or a well support build ( wich is a gimmick device in PvP where the fights are always moving ) wich is only usefull realy if we want to be the guy in the back defending the points, Telling evry necro that we need to learn to play using DS to be any good is a low blow coming from a Game Designer

ive played necro quite a bit, i rarely run conditions. if you want video on tournament necro, twitch.tv/skillotine videos are there. i cant stand seeing people saying “conditions is only viable thing” or “MH dagger is aweful” the proof is in the pudding. Our tournament team has beat some of the best teams out there, please watch and then make any judgement calls. these videos are of me playing a necro after just picking up the class and tweaking a build my friend gave me for it.

milo.6942:

Right, so maybe this isn’t clear to people that haven’t played guild wars 1, but the necro was not a “damage dealer”. He provided mostly enemy debuffs, buff stripping, degeneration, light cc, and if you build him properly, a moderate amount of damage. I feel like I have to spell this out: The necro was a team asset. You didn’t play necro and then complain on forums that you did no damage. Which is what you people are doing. Which is why everyone needs to get a grip, relax, and apologize to Mr. Peters, who was trying to help out.

(yes, bloodspike, aura of the lich, and a few other gimmick builds for high damage, but they got nerfed and I was speaking about their more standard roles.)

The point is, what has this game of Guild Wars except the name? Seriously, the difference are too much to compare them. The N in GW meant curses and debuffs, true, but in GW there was also the secondary profession.

There are 2 weapons (Axe and MH dagger) that focus on damage rather than debuffs and conditions, so why the hell they have to do so low damage? To discourage players to use them?
And what about the totally useless traits, as I said in my last post? Have you tried the Jagged Horror?

Ezekeel.2837:

nerva.7940:

Ezekeel.2837:

You are responsible for the balancing and you failed. Stop patronizing us, stop talking nonsense and do your job!

show some respect, and appreciate what you DID get. do you have any idea how hard his job is? the game just came out.

Yeah? What did I get?

I paid 59 Euro for a game which claims to be most balanced MMO PvP game there is. I spend my time leveling up a necro which is severly broken in both PvP and endgame PvE due to its lackluster dps. I spend countless hours trying different weapon and skill combinations and nothing is working in a way that I feel I can be of benefit for the team and not better replaced by another profession.

I am aware this game is is relatively new and a proper balancing takes some time and I was planning on giving the designers some time to get it right.

However then I read the post of Mr. Peters. And he is denying that there is a problem with the necro and basically telling people that they just need to learn to play. This means there will be no major balancing changes for the necro. Since I am not interested in playing another professions this means this game will be no fun for me in the foreseeable future.

That is what I got for my 59 Euro. And you think a should be more grateful for that?

You are a bad PvP player, that is the reason for your failure as a Necromancer in PvP. That is the real problem, not the game. I play a Necromancer too, your bluff is called, what will you do now?

Really some people should go back to WoW where they nerf/OP proffessions the more people whine.

GW2 gave you this, you play with it and make the most of it. Not cry on a forum.

However i do notice some traits are bugged which should get looked into instead of balancing. Balancing is an illusion (look at Worst of Worldcraft) – but fix bugs.
Crying on forum after a few weeks rofl…

He’s not saying L2P. He’s not saying there shouldn’t be adjustments. All he said was that he doesn’t think people have mastered the use of DS yet.. which is fair to say considering the game is less than 30 days old. No one in the general public (not even Team Paradigm, Super Squad, Team Legacy, etc…) has MASTERED PvP yet.

Calm down people.

We were told in the BWE that Necro “Needed some love” it was followed up by a nerf to our most viable spec. Now he tells us that we are fine and that evry necro just needs too “Master” DS to be viable, We are the least desired PvP class up there with Elementalist thats just a fact, In PvE yet again least desirable class. For the people who acctualy lvled up Necro and like it who were waiting for that “Love” they promised we have now just been told that we are fine and we need to L2P it properly. That kind of information tends to upset people.

JonPeters.5630:

Keep in mind that some professions are harder to master than others. I believe Necro is the hardest, opinions may vary, but just keep this in mind. No we arent ignoring Necro, but once people start mastering DS, I’m afraid of how strong Necro will be. Give it some time for the average player to learn these things. For example early on in LOL master yi was dominant until people learned how to counter him.

yap, with all those nerfs arenanet give to Necros obvious this class is by far the one to be master. master DS? what exist to master? DS isnt even a break stun, a condition build cant even generate LF unless trait for 3% marks (btw staff auto atack is useless you know that all player say this right?)

than we have all those bugged/ useless traits/skills. corrupt boon dont work most of time even when dont is evade or blocked, spectral atunement dont do nothing to increase boon of spectral skills, summon a jagged horror is garbage; last gasp only give the LF per hit not the important break stun and protection; epidemic have a 1-2s cast time make it not so good, why dont make it 30s and isntant cast?

greater marks can still be blocked, gluttony si another bug thing, for sure isnt give more 5% LF.

would love to see the people who design Necro of arenanet and see the best Necro arenanet player with a condition build on 1vs1 fights, like mastering DS is very hard. DS need to be a break stun, our best BS have a 60s base CD and most of classes have much lower skills BS.

say something to me, why is spite line with the condition duration passive buff? a line completly uselss for a condition builds.

after i say someone have the idea to put a internal CD of 2-3s on DS on i think BW2 i stop believe on internal arenanet testers, serious any casual player know that wouldnt work and after 1 week obvious you remove it, but how internal testers didnt saw that was ridiculous?

please start correct our stuff, and give buff to us or nerf all classes except elementalist (those are other serious problem….)

necro arent even top3 classes to stack bleeds, not even close.

yap, we are hard to master because we are a UP class. i saw lot of thief on sPvP so was one few classes i did play, i pick one did the HS spam fest and in all 4-5 games i was the top player with almost 300 rank points.

would love see a thief player pick a necro for first time and do that…

love the game but play with necro is so frustrating, sorry for my bad english but inst clearly my first language

The problem is exactly as Mr. Peters has said. I can see how the game is multi layered, and I can see that people are not getting past the 1st one and they think they know it all. I don’t play necro, but I took a look at some of their skills. Did you know there was a skill that removed 3 buffs? With a 20 second CD? Do you have any idea how good that is… No I don’t want to hear about how you can strip someone’s protection so you can do more damage (layer 1), or even how you can anticipate a guardian’s retaliation because your warrior is about to burst him and save your warrior’skitten (layer 2). How about you anticipate your team’s cc that is about to hit an enemy thief, who is about to stomp your teammate and will receive stability from his guardian and possibly a cover buff too, all so that you can prevent your teammate from getting stomped (layer). And I don’t even play necro. Calm down, use brain, not everything is about dps.

The power of DS isn’t in the damage (well not only) – it is the utility it provides, the ability to
stay in battle and get skills recharged,
swap weapons inside it,
go in and out just for this short fear that can be used for interrupts,
use ‘4’ just before going out and still get it’s effect,
baah, even the second skill is designed well – many people complain about it being a projectile, etc. – but think about it this way – let’s think of a glassy ele that uses mistform to get out of battle – if timed well the DS teleport hand can reach him just after his mistform ends and position you for a kill – and that’s just one idea.

While I personally think necro could use some changes (for instance getting the axe working; the skillset is miserable as well as working on trait trees) I have stood by necro for a long time and I start seeing it’s strengths and… incredible potential.

Yes, being killed in 10 seconds by a warrior that caught me unprepared or by a whip thief that was just too fast or by a mesmer that I believe is the best duelist class in the game (and right now single duelists are the most effective way to win) definitely isn’t fun. Fighting a warrior that has blocks, a thief that has evades, a mesmer with some nasty deflections and invulnerablilties not having any yourself isn’t always fun and surely isn’t easy. Being unable to deal with a bunker guardian not letting you walk to a capture point also isn’t most entertaining. But you can still win tournaments as necro with a decent team. And if you find playing necro fun, why not play it?

The only real problem is developers’ lack of communication.

I’ll give you a fun fact – I watched all the offical stream videos from BWE3 (yes, I did), just to see some necro gameplay. There wasn’t any. Every profession was featured but necro. The developers respond to particular bugs and problems in every profession subforum since BWE3, every but necro’s.
It all makes me feel, that necro is the least played profession in Bellevue, like it was left for the interns to balance, while ‘cool devs’ tinker with warriors and mesmers or any other ‘cool’ profession.

This is the real problem, this is where bad communication brings us all.

Demonical.1039:

We were told in the BWE that Necro “Needed some love” it was followed up by a nerf to our most viable spec. Now he tells us that we are fine and that evry necro just needs too “Master” DS to be viable, We are the least desired PvP class up there with Elementalist thats just a fact, In PvE yet again least desirable class. For the people who acctualy lvled up Necro and like it who were waiting for that “Love” they promised we have now just been told that we are fine and we need to L2P it properly. That kind of information tends to upset people.

When the heck did he say that Necros are fine and that every necro just needs to master ds to be viable? That is NOT what he said. Re-read his statement, he only offered an insight that he feels when people master DS that it is going to be interesting. Not that that was the ONLY viable spec, or that they didn’t want to tweak the class.

Keep in mind that some professions are harder to master than others. I believe Necro is the hardest, opinions may vary, but just keep this in mind. No we arent ignoring Necro, but once people start mastering DS, I’m afraid of how strong Necro will be. Give it some time for the average player to learn these things. For example early on in LOL master yi was dominant until people learned how to counter him.

His first line basicly tell us Necro is hard to master, hence most problems arise from our ability to properly play it, he also said Once people start mastering DS, “He´s afraid of how strong necro´s will be” Thats in our current form, then follows it up with we just need to give it time so us “Average” players learn to play it, Where in that message do you get the message that we arent “fine” according to him after we learn how to play using DS. I didnt get a hint that we were gonna get any fixes like that “Love” they said was coming our way, ( Followed up with a few days later a big nerf to condition builds )

Demonical.1039:

We were told in the BWE that Necro “Needed some love” it was followed up by a nerf to our most viable spec. Now he tells us that we are fine and that evry necro just needs too “Master” DS to be viable, We are the least desired PvP class up there with Elementalist thats just a fact, In PvE yet again least desirable class. For the people who acctualy lvled up Necro and like it who were waiting for that “Love” they promised we have now just been told that we are fine and we need to L2P it properly. That kind of information tends to upset people.

Well, what Jon is trying to say is more like ’grow some, guys, and have patience with the most difficult profession in the game. Play it, learn from your mistakes and you will be just fine.

While I understand him, I can also empathise with people that would want a smoother, more enjoyable and casual necro gameplay.