Guild Wars 2

Not sure if it’s something that only happens to me but my soloQ pug team does better the more rangers we have.

Just recently when I was on my ele, an engie was complaining that we had 3 rangers and at least one should swap out. None of the rangers responded and I told him it’s ok, rangers OP soloQ

From my experience, the classes the stack the best (having 3 or more) are:
dd eles
rangers
guardians

What do you folks think? If you’re not sure about rangers, just observe what happens when you have them stacked in your team.

Edit: I’ve won all soloQ matches that had 4 rangers in my team. It occurred 4-5 times in 3mos.

Very easy to play; Especially against unskilled combatants.

I wish my experiences were the same, though. Generally when I end up with multiple rangers on a team, it’s a sure loss.

I dont think the enemy.has to be unskilled but generally when average+ solo players have little coordination/doesnt support each other, theyre easy targets to pick off and trafitional lb ranger has that range with possibly no downtime on damage. In a larger onpoint fight, if only one or two decide to go outside point after a ranger theyre also leaving some room for ranger team/less pressure on point, which sometimes means a point loss when chased ranger keeps up, just as an example.

But I havent really had this exp tho that the more rangers the higher win, pure random here.

It’s weird. I’m not sure why that is. Teams with 2,3 or 4 rangers turn out more positively for me than otherwise. Once my solo pug attempted 5 rangers but that failed, lol.

Yeah I noticed that today as well (ranger daily) – most of my matches today with 2 rangers (or more) tended to work out really well. Maybe it’s an MMR thing, or like Sevans said, against unskilled combatants.

why make it so hard.

take some cele eles and maybe a soldier engi, works much better.
what should rangers do against this outsustain/outroaming
and aswell easy to play mechanics?

3 eles, one thief or mesmer and a soldier engi.
you heave your perfect soloq comp with no need to communicate

or maybe ranger players became so good from this 1 year beeing the worst profession
that they start to shine in random soloq matches now :P

Now just make thieves somehow stack well, I want to not auto-lose with a 4 thief team.

its a good soloQ build/class. Usually its power rangers, in a way its a strong build, does a bit of everything and it doesnt have any major flaws. Contrary to outdated beliefs its actually a strong on-point fighter – pretty tanky for marauder, good condi removal, tons of CC (especially knockbacks), i can get a decap against any other build in a very short time. It has good damage (both burst and sustained), it has good mobility, its good at “+1” Stone signet/stealth/evades/2x stunbreak make for a decent defence against focusing in teamfights. QZ+wolf+SA makes them at least decent at stomping/rezing. THey have some stealth counterplay (taunt+fear).

Nothing hard-counters rangers, it can put up a fair fight against all commonly used builds (not saying it wins all 1v1s or that its the best 1v1 build, but nothing beats ranger by default).

Thats why its no problem getting multiple rangers (if they are good players ofc), good all-around spec, decent at most roles. It sucks to stack specialized classes – 2 hard bunkers and you lack dmg, 2x thieves or mesmer and you lack point presence etc.

Different condi ranger builds are similar but somewhat weaker.

(Power) Ranger is a map control based spec. You either complitely dominate the opponent team or you lose harrd.

Once you dominate more ranger will add up to this effect. Also strongly depends on the map (foefire being good for obvious reasons) and the other classes in your/enemy team.

LOL, yep they do. There have been more than a couple times I’ve been on a team with 3+ Rangers, me usually being one of them, and every time I see my teammates I think “crap, this is a fail already” and every time it’s a victory instead.

Someone here has said that it’s because Rangers are easy to play and while I agree to an extent I think it’s also because not all of said Rangers are always LB pew pew builds. Most times there are at least one or two melee, condi or bunker-ish builds on the team as well and Rangers are good skirmishers whether people want to admit that or not. High access to poison and soft CC, lots of evades with the proper weapon choices and good sustained pressure make them rough to fight given a skilled player.

I’m still gonna be concerned any time I’m on a team with a lot of Rangers but they definitely stack better than Thieves I’ll tell you that much. Never once been on a team with more than 3 Thieves that won, lol.

SpellOfIniquity.1780:

LOL, yep they do. There have been more than a couple times I’ve been on a team with 3+ Rangers, me usually being one of them, and every time I see my teammates I think “crap, this is a fail already” and every time it’s a victory instead.

Someone here has said that it’s because Rangers are easy to play and while I agree to an extent I think it’s also because not all of said Rangers are always LB pew pew builds. Most times there are at least one or two melee, condi or bunker-ish builds on the team as well and Rangers are good skirmishers whether people want to admit that or not. High access to poison and soft CC, lots of evades with the proper weapon choices and good sustained pressure make them rough to fight given a skilled player.

I’m still gonna be concerned any time I’m on a team with a lot of Rangers but they definitely stack better than Thieves I’ll tell you that much. Never once been on a team with more than 3 Thieves that won, lol.

Yup. I always have 2 builds at the ready (since no template, have to buy character slot) melee and condi trap lol, the melee is more of a 1v1 build but does surprisingly well when assaulting far. I swap to the LB from time to time but it’s not a permanent build I run.

Rangers are versatile. Began the love for rangers when it was the class that was looked down on. I support the underdogs! Although I don’t think I’d call them that now.

Multiple rangers is actually inherently strong. There is almost no escape from a LB ranger +1 even for thief and mesmer. They also have good map control with the range.

However, multiple ranger composition has the inherent weakness of dealing with reflection. But sadly no guardian, mesmer is willing to adapt by taking their reflection. There was one time we were facing a 3-ranger team and I asked our bunker guard to take WoR and he replied it would make his build not work…

Eh, I feel like WoR is underwhelming in PvP. I prefer for our team to just pressure the Rangers as oppose to having a long CD WoR.

Cat Has Ducks.1982:

Eh, I feel like WoR is underwhelming in PvP. I prefer for our team to just pressure the Rangers as oppose to having a long CD WoR.

It is very hard for your ganker teammate to pressure ranger when there are multiple. They have to go off point to chase down the ranger while the other ranger pewpew them from long distance away. As long as two rangers stand in LoS with each other, it becomes very hard to break that ‘chain’ in an uncoordinated group.

All it takes is one guardian, thief, mesmer, or warrior to completely shut that ranger down.

SlayerSixx.5763:

All it takes is one guardian, thief, mesmer, or warrior to completely shut that ranger down.

Clearly you never tried to play thief or mes vs a team with 3+ rangers, if anything they’ll shut YOU down.

I have. In fact, all I’ve BEEN playing is thief for the last month, getting my skills up to snuff before HoT. Also, I HAVE run into a game of 2/3+ rangers in one team. The usual burst rotation is more than enough to down one instantly. It also helps incredibly that they’re one trick ponies and their stuff is so easy to evade. Since all of the rangers are too busy shooting at the people they can see, steal+w.e burst combo you prefer from behind a wall when they don’t expect it is the eeeeasiest thing to do.

Naturally, this only works when the targets are spread out. If they’re clustered together? Your team can’t bomb three tightly packed squishies? Hell, mesmer could make ridiculously easy work of that. Also, if your class has access to it, take a reflect if you see that many rangers. It isn’t rocket science, really.

There’s a reason why rangers see almost no play at higher levels.

SlayerSixx.5763:

All it takes is one guardian, thief, mesmer, or warrior to completely shut that ranger down.

disagree. ranger can hold its own against any of those classes. Warrior has a tough time sticking on the ranger, mesmer is the only class that hates ranger pets as much as rangers do (instant you leave the stealth the pet picks you out and it has a speed advantage so it can actually hit every once in a while), ranger is very good at counter-pressuring a mesmer. ranger can go through guard blocks with rapidfire and pet attacks and has quick and solid burn cleanses. thief is thief – one rapid fire/maul/bird slash – he has to disengage, you can counter stealth with CC, rapidfire.

Ranger has solid invul with SoS, frequent stealth for repositioning, stealth and taunt for detargeting, protection, evades, swoop to create destance, tons of CC, its bursts are quick and frequent. Its NOT an easy target to shut down.

Ranger doesnt excel at anything, thats its real problem, but its a good jack-of-all kinda build for soloQ, no glaring weakness, always a fighting chance. thats why you are never inherently at a disadvantage when rolling few of them in a pug team. if skilled enough, can do everything from 1v1 skirmishing to +1ing, decaping and teamfights . Its not the best at any of those roles but is good enough.

This all changes in couple hours though. Chronos and scrappers will wipe the floor with it every time and good luck ever hitting a revenant with a projectile attack, plus its hammer is like 30% improved version of longbow. So this discussion is pointless, completely new meta is coming. imo ranger got nothing to keep up with the power creep (unless more changes where made to druids offensive potential) and will need a balance pass asap. We will see soon enough

P.S. Im talking about decent level of skill here. Yeah if its one of those rangers whos entire gameplan is pew-pew from 1500 high ground the entire match, most things counter that. If the ranger actually uses all the tools it has, its a tough matchup for anyone.

Pimsley.3681:

It’s weird. I’m not sure why that is. Teams with 2,3 or 4 rangers turn out more positively for me than otherwise. Once my solo pug attempted 5 rangers but that failed, lol.

No, no, Rangers are obviously underpo…. Hey, that’s me in the first screenshot! How did you get more points than me!?

Yeah, the right kind of rangers stack well. I find my little Esparie works best when paired with medi-gaurds, tanky dd Elems, and other Rangers. I actually have the hardest time with thieves and others that are so anxious to decap far that they leave you -1 in a good group fight.

Once won a game with 3 rangers and two thieves 500-420

A lot of you are talking about a LB ranger which, recently, has started to lose favour. Most Rangers today are carrying condi builds or GS/S+A builds, and as a Ranger I can tell you how easy it is to beat a LB user with one of the above.

Rangers straight up aren’t so useless anymore. We’ve learnt and adapted and now we’re being made stronger. In fact, in PvE at least, if it weren’t for our spirits being immobile (which may not matter soon anyway thanks to minion invuln) we’d be kitten near the best support the game has to offer when Druid comes. a slight DPS boost (which will come through power creep I have no doubt, as history has told us) and we’re golden.

SlayerSixx.5763:

All it takes is one guardian, thief, mesmer, or warrior to completely shut that ranger down.

This is possibly one of the more ignorant things I’ve seen on the forums around here. Thieves are very easily defeated by Ranger due to one skill a lot of power Rangers are taking these days and thats Sic Em. Guardians, well most are either bunker or burn guards and bunker guards can’t kill kitten. Burn guards can go down easy enough due to Rangers good Condi cleanse (It’s not sustained condi cleanse, but you don’t need that against a burn guard) and just straight dps. Warriors are countered pretty well with just stability, which ranger has good access to through 2 frequently taken skills, SoW and SotP. Mesmers are the only things I tend to struggle with but that could just be me.

Rangers can also run builds that allows them to sustain against 2 foes (more if you get lucky) for quite some time. Provided a Ranger knows what he’s doing and isn’t a scrub straight outta the pan, I think a lot of you will consider taking one sooner than you think.

Archon.6480:

Pimsley.3681:

It’s weird. I’m not sure why that is. Teams with 2,3 or 4 rangers turn out more positively for me than otherwise. Once my solo pug attempted 5 rangers but that failed, lol.

No, no, Rangers are obviously underpo…. Hey, that’s me in the first screenshot! How did you get more points than me!?

Yeah, the right kind of rangers stack well. I find my little Esparie works best when paired with medi-gaurds, tanky dd Elems, and other Rangers. I actually have the hardest time with thieves and others that are so anxious to decap far that they leave you -1 in a good group fight.

Esparie!!!

For some reason, my screenshots got deleted so I started taking them again. I have a bunch of newer ones from recent matches but for ranger stacking, I had to get it from my forum archives.

But yeah, rangers never cease to amaze me at how well they perform in ranked soloQ.

Maybe I just get lucky sometimes and end up with good rangers like you, haha.

Jack of all trades, master of none. Agood ranger can adapt to fill pretty much any role on the fly but there is always a profession that can do the job better. This is why they do well solo queuing but are rarely seen in competitive teams.

Puck.9612:

Jack of all trades, master of none. A good ranger can adapt to fill pretty much any role on the fly but there is always a profession that can do the job better. This is why they do well solo queuing but are rarely seen in competitive teams.

Pretty much this.

Stilgar.6437:

-snip-.

Ranger, without tricking pets out for taunt, only has LB knock back. Assuming GS and not some boring shoutbow build, warrior has two quick (and very powerful) gap closers and GS toss. Taking stances and the stance line (defense, iirc) gives warrior access to nearly 10s of invuln and balanced stance(while ticking signet). This isn’t considering the other two utilities and elite, or his other two trait lines. If he brings hammer with his GS, the ranger may as well just run back to spawn and save himself the struggle and time wasted. I’m not mentioning ranger’s GS since tangoing with a warrior in melee without a consistent form of damage mitigation is a death wish. SoS would basically prolong the inevitable.

Idk what you guys do wrong, but the mesmers I know nearly insta kill anyone with under 20k HP who isn’t ready. Like, its not even a fight. If the target survives thanks to a passive proc, they stealth and either wait until they can burst again or swap to their alt set and go to town.

For guard, don’t assume burn. Burn is far too easy to counter if the guard doesn’t bring a million mini condis to cover the burn. A power guardian, on the other hand, will thank you for the free might and basically pound you into dust. If the guard can land any one of his 1million forms of damage mitiagation to avoid the knock back, the following rapid fire doesn’t land then GG.

You speak about decent level. What level is this? I know our definitions of decent differ greatly since there’s a reason why ranger hasnt been meta for over a year now.

I suppose I should’ve specified builds for my previous response, but oh well.

@Rogue

You go stealth. Ranger uses sic em. You stay in stealth and try running around and then get hilariously rekt or……use steal or basilisk venom and start pressuring early. All it’d take if running the meta d/p is steal > heartseeker > stabstabstab > blind the knock back and Dodge the rapid fire. At that point, the ranger would be severely distressed and popping all of the invulns and heals trying to stay alive. If you catch the ranger before the sic em takes effect, you could shadowshot and back stab before the sic em takes effect THEN get your combo going.

Its not rocket science and I know the better thieves out there have even more ways of taking care of such a simple spec.

Puck.9612:

Jack of all trades, master of none. Agood ranger can adapt to fill pretty much any role on the fly but there is always a profession that can do the job better. This is why they do well solo queuing but are rarely seen in competitive teams.

I don’t know of any Ranger build that would fit this description…

- PewPew has very low sustain and can’t hold a node against most 1v1-oriented builds. Also, it gets hard-countered incredibly easy by the vast amount of projectile reflects/absorb currently in the game (it will get even worse with HoT).

- Trap-Rangers have low mobility, at best mediocre sustain, few stunbreakers and get countered by decent condition-removal and absolutely shredded by most necro-builds.

PewPew is decent at a low skill-level cuz ppl don’t focus him properly and run bad compositions that can’t deal with ranged stuff shooting from far away up on some cliff or sth.
Also, most ppl don’t know how to properly LoS.

I absolutely hate having pewpew’s on the team, it’s just a bad build at a decent skill-level when you don’t run a very specific comp.

PowerBottom.5796:

Puck.9612:

Jack of all trades, master of none. Agood ranger can adapt to fill pretty much any role on the fly but there is always a profession that can do the job better. This is why they do well solo queuing but are rarely seen in competitive teams.

I don’t know of any Ranger build that would fit this description…

- PewPew has very low sustain and can’t hold a node against most 1v1-oriented builds. Also, it gets hard-countered incredibly easy by the vast amount of projectile reflects/absorb currently in the game (it will get even worse with HoT).

- Trap-Rangers have low mobility, at best mediocre sustain, few stunbreakers and get countered by decent condition-removal and absolutely shredded by most necro-builds.

PewPew is decent at a low skill-level cuz ppl don’t focus him properly and run bad compositions that can’t deal with ranged stuff shooting from far away up on some cliff or sth.
Also, most ppl don’t know how to properly LoS.

I absolutely hate having pewpew’s on the team, it’s just a bad build at a decent skill-level when you don’t run a very specific comp.

Longbow GS actually does really well on point when used by a decent player. You’ve got fear, multiple knockdowns, block, 2 knockbacks, taunt, immobilize, immunity to direct damage, multiple stun breaks, good condi removal, evades, and a pretty low cooldown burst heal with regen or a decent heal over time with additional condi removal.

If you manage your cooldowns well you can easily decap and hold a point.

+ passive protection and weakness every 15 sec.

Oddly, my ranger seems to have no pets available to him in sPvP (literally, cannot select or call out any pet at all). Not sure how that happened.

Runiir.6425:

Oddly, my ranger seems to have no pets available to him in sPvP (literally, cannot select or call out any pet at all). Not sure how that happened.

It’s a bug that anet is in no hurry to fix since it doesn’t benefit rangers. Try spectating a hot join match with a ranger in it and then open your pet menu. This workaround fixes it for some people.

Puck.9612:

Runiir.6425:

Oddly, my ranger seems to have no pets available to him in sPvP (literally, cannot select or call out any pet at all). Not sure how that happened.

It’s a bug that anet is in no hurry to fix since it doesn’t benefit rangers. Try spectating a hot join match with a ranger in it and then open your pet menu. This workaround fixes it for some people.

I’ll have to try that, thanks. I managed to do pretty good in a match when it first happened to me (was on autopilot joining then noticed I had no pet with me).

SlayerSixx.5763:

Stilgar.6437:

-snip-.

You speak about decent level. What level is this? I know our definitions of decent differ greatly since there’s a reason why ranger hasnt been meta for over a year now.

I suppose I should’ve specified builds for my previous response, but oh well.

Anywhere from average to elite. I have pretty high MMR and am constantly matched against quality players including the very top – orange, asdf, tcg etc. I have a fair shot and consistently win my share of fights against any of them. I play LB/GS marauder, i take skirmishing (i just prefer it more for doubling skills i need at that moment, much prefer that to MM bonuses and it makes for a stronger 1v1 but a bit weaker dps when pew-pewing or “+1”). I never go into a fight feeling hard-countered. Some are easier, some are a bit harder but I have enough tools to beat any of them, it comes down to who outplays whom, some i win some i loose, but i never feel like its was the build that decided.

Burn or power guard is absolutley a fair fight, so is almost everyone else.

Ok the d/d ele god has quite a bit of heals and strong kiting potential, but he cant kill me quickly either, worst case i can stall enough to get support, i have superior CC (quick decap if the point is his, if he is assaulting my point at start i get a full cap almost always), i can disrupt his might rotations and with timed bursts i even down a fair share.

Yes the ranger is weak for high level team comps, but not because its hard-countered by more common meta-builds. They just bring more to the table, big-picture wise.

But again this is pointless, in couple hours ranger will fall out of play completely, it cant compete with chronos, scrappers or revs in any aspect of pvp. You will be right then, ranger will be hard-countered by almost everything in the new meta, because it got no improvements (it got a whole new separate thing, which is great in general but no place for healers in pvp)

Hard to say what happens when there are that many of the same class regardless if it is Ranger. Usually when it happens to me, and I’m on my ranger, at least I know I’ll be odd man out I usually am running a sustain/cele double melee build. I’ll let the other two party at range and it usually works out well.

Pug play, not to say it is bad, but as others pointed out usually it is for daily, just practicing, working on builds, etc. Some people/friends play and communicate or target assist, but in general unranked matches are just that. A play ground.

SlayerSixx.5763:

Stilgar.6437:

-snip-.

Idk what you guys do wrong, but the mesmers I know nearly insta kill anyone with under 20k HP who isn’t ready. Like, its not even a fight. If the target survives thanks to a passive proc, they stealth and either wait until they can burst again or swap to their alt set and go to town.

And as for mesmers, the ranger is one of the best classes for countering the shatter-burst. All utilities are excelent against it. SoS is obvious, LR stunbreaks, clears immob, clears vuln, creates distance from clones/mirror-blade, QZ breaks stuns, clears condis and provides instant counter preassure – even gs auto hurts the mesmer under quickness and so does super-speed pet.
Entangle forces a memser cd to get rid of, roots illusions and clears condis (vuln). Bark skin takes the first hit passivly, shared anguish takes the first CC. Rangers burst is strong, low setup time, lots of CC and mesmer lacks stability, taunt can counter stealth, RF can track in stealth, barrage clears illusions, pet stays on mesmer all the time if you call it, it doesnt get distracted by smart blinks or stealth, helps with quick retargetting, pet is faster then the mesmer which helps land hits, LB keeps the preassure at range.

This is not theory, these things work (well worked until chrono) in practice against good mesmers as long as ranger knows how to use them. If he just stands still and pew-pews a random target, ofc he will die.

Except none of these things apply when the mesmer can basically insta kill the target. Also, entangle is probably one of the most telegraphed skills in the game.

Stilgar.6437:

SlayerSixx.5763:

Stilgar.6437:

-snip-.

Idk what you guys do wrong, but the mesmers I know nearly insta kill anyone with under 20k HP who isn’t ready. Like, its not even a fight. If the target survives thanks to a passive proc, they stealth and either wait until they can burst again or swap to their alt set and go to town.

And as for mesmers, the ranger is one of the best classes for countering the shatter-burst. All utilities are excelent against it. SoS is obvious, LR stunbreaks, clears immob, clears vuln, creates distance from clones/mirror-blade, QZ breaks stuns, clears condis and provides instant counter preassure – even gs auto hurts the mesmer under quickness and so does super-speed pet.
Entangle forces a memser cd to get rid of, roots illusions and clears condis (vuln). Bark skin takes the first hit passivly, shared anguish takes the first CC. Rangers burst is strong, low setup time, lots of CC and mesmer lacks stability, taunt can counter stealth, RF can track in stealth, barrage clears illusions, pet stays on mesmer all the time if you call it, it doesnt get distracted by smart blinks or stealth, helps with quick retargetting, pet is faster then the mesmer which helps land hits, LB keeps the preassure at range.

This is not theory, these things work (well worked until chrono) in practice against good mesmers as long as ranger knows how to use them. If he just stands still and pew-pews a random target, ofc he will die.

How can a good mesmer get hit by entangle? And even if so, they have one of the easiest time to getting out of it.

I don’t think its that rangers stack well in soloqueue, but rather that good players stack well in soloqueue.

nearlight.3064:

I don’t think its that rangers stack well in soloqueue, but rather that good player stack well in soloqueue.

^ This.

Pimsley.3681:

It’s weird. I’m not sure why that is. Teams with 2,3 or 4 rangers turn out more positively for me than otherwise. Once my solo pug attempted 5 rangers but that failed, lol.

LMAO that second screenie.

So brutal. You should have let them score. Spread the love m8.

Puck.9612:

Jack of all trades, master of none. Agood ranger can adapt to fill pretty much any role on the fly but there is always a profession that can do the job better. This is why they do well solo queuing but are rarely seen in competitive teams.

+1

No, revenants #1
guards, engis, eles, mesmers

rangers are at the very bottom even under thieves

Chasind.3128:

No, revenants #1
guards, engis, eles, mesmers

rangers are at the very bottom even under thieves

lol wut lol