Guild Wars 2

After the patch?

I don’t think dhuumfire will be viable after the patch because it is in a bad line and the cast time on the ds#1 is too long for a condi build to make use of, espicially as you need to cast it probably 4/5 times for it to proc. That is ages when you could be doing other conditions for damage and/or not losing sustain. By wasting your ds on doing ds#1 you lose a ton of sustain and a ton of damage.

Lets remember that since the dhuumfire patch anet made way for burning with a series of nerfs including:
1, Losing many bleeds
2, Losing a ton of weakness duration
3, Nerfing fear damage
4, traits being moved around to nerf many builds (greater marks and terror)
5, Huge buffs to other classes condi removal
6, Addition of sigils that buff condi removal even with no crit

Necro is gonna suck imo

First, dhhumfire will proc on Life Blast, not on Life Blast crit (http://dulfy.net/2014/01/17/gw2-ready-up-skill-and-balance-developer-livestream-notes/), you only need to land it one time to make it proc (and they could do that while the ennemy is feared or immobilized).

1)They lost 1 bleed on the bleed mark, are there other nerfs?

2)They lost weakness duration but they have +30% duration via the first traitline and weakness was buffed, hence the duration nerfs.

3)Fear damage was basically a loss of 70 damage…fear still does 1k damage PER TICK (it can do 2 or 3k).

4)Yes, necros can’t have greater unblockable marks but they still have access to many unblockable skills (corrupt boon, #2 DS, Lich auto attack, wells). Their marks got buffed in the process too so that the greater marks trait is unnecessary. Pretty much every condi necro is still running Terror which is only at 20 points in the condi traitline, not that much of a big deal. Btw, if you recall, they moved Terror at 20 points and moved Greater Marks so that people couldn’t get GM and Terror..But then they gave up on Greater Marks thanks to the marks being buffed, and they were able to get their hands on http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Master_of_Terror at 20 points in Soul Reaping (more fear ticks, so more damage). So yes, nerfs resulting in a buff.

5)Huge buffs to other classes condi removal? what are you refering to? I mean it’s about that time that ele got an ICD on cleansing water and that cleansing fire got nerfed, nothing has changed as far as engineer is concerned (traduction : still is a free kill for necros), nothing for thief either if I’m not mistaken, nothing for guardian…please explain.

6)The addition of sigils that buff condi removal in the next patch may prove to be a little issue for all condi players, not just necros. Since I don’t see any other justified point and this one is hardly important, I don’t get why necros would suck.

I just don’t get it.

go play power necro its still OP but less players use it.

Lord Hammer Hand.4815:

go play power necro its still OP but less players use it.

Power necro is as amazing as ice cream served by Jesus… true story.

so you can’t take time out of auto attacking to cast 1 life blast?
besides, after the patch 5% of all of your condition damage will heal you,
think about that when using epidemic in team fights.

5% may seem small, 6 health per second per bleed stack, but you can quite easily keep up 10 or more bleed stacks (60hps) throw in poison, terror plus your burning and torment from deathshroud and you can quite easily get it up to almost healing signet values, but you still have your healing skill aswell.

Liewec.2896:

so you can’t take time out of auto attacking to cast 1 life blast?
besides, after the patch 5% of all of your condition damage will heal you,
think about that when using epidemic in team fights.

You can’t have both the 5% condition heals and burning at the same time. Both are GM traits in the same line.

Uhtameit.2413:

First, dhhumfire will proc on Life Blast, not on Life Blast crit (http://dulfy.net/2014/01/17/gw2-ready-up-skill-and-balance-developer-livestream-notes/), you only need to land it one time to make it proc (and they could do that while the ennemy is feared or immobilized).

1)They lost 1 bleed on the bleed mark, are there other nerfs?

2)They lost weakness duration but they have +30% duration via the first traitline and weakness was buffed, hence the duration nerfs.

3)Fear damage was basically a loss of 70 damage…fear still does 1k damage PER TICK (it can do 2 or 3k).

4)Yes, necros can’t have greater unblockable marks but they still have access to many unblockable skills (corrupt boon, #2 DS, Lich auto attack, wells). Their marks got buffed in the process too so that the greater marks trait is unnecessary. Pretty much every condi necro is still running Terror which is only at 20 points in the condi traitline, not that much of a big deal. Btw, if you recall, they moved Terror at 20 points and moved Greater Marks so that people couldn’t get GM and Terror..But then they gave up on Greater Marks thanks to the marks being buffed, and they were able to get their hands on http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Master_of_Terror at 20 points in Soul Reaping (more fear ticks, so more damage). So yes, nerfs resulting in a buff.

5)Huge buffs to other classes condi removal? what are you refering to? I mean it’s about that time that ele got an ICD on cleansing water and that cleansing fire got nerfed, nothing has changed as far as engineer is concerned (traduction : still is a free kill for necros), nothing for thief either if I’m not mistaken, nothing for guardian…please explain.

6)The addition of sigils that buff condi removal in the next patch may prove to be a little issue for all condi players, not just necros. Since I don’t see any other justified point and this one is hardly important, I don’t get why necros would suck.

I just don’t get it.

1) 1x bleed on staff#2, 1x bleed on dodge mark + 1x bleed on traited weakness shroud so less bleed bursting which was actual skillplay, 1x bleed on scepter #2 -pvp only

2) The weaknes was OP, but nerfed hard. It is wrong logic starting with base 30% condi duration and god forbid the DS-recharge perfect scenario, because it only forces condispam instead of stack and pushes condi necros into useless tree.

3) 17% of +1k dmg is trivial, the nerf back then had 0 effect. I just wnt a moral victory of them admitting a mistake

4) It is a 10 trait points buff, but it removed the unblockables and most imporatant, reduced AoE dmg by a lot, youre avoiding 3k bleeds every 6s now in a teamfight

5) Idk any specific, but theyre logic last 9 months was bringing condi removal up. Lyssa is finaly getting nerfed so im neutral here

6) Will see what new stuff is brought to all classes

But with current knowledge, theorycrafting, condi necro will be weak. Im all for removal of condi spam, just as long engie IP and bomb/nades are next, spirits should dissapear and the warior bow could have a smaller radius.

First of, you overlooked what I said about burn still being an option.

1) Necros are doing fine without that dodge mark, and without those bleeds overall. +30% condition duration makes up for it, easily. Once, I tried my condi necro and I put the wrong grandmaster trait in the first traitline : I was still doing insane damage. Try it out for yourself, with the +20% bleed duration trait. They also have torment as a new source of damage.

2) It was nerfed logically, necros still have a lot of it and they can use SoS (which was buffed, along with Wall of Fear which is yet another possible source of damage). I mean 5 with dagger still puts a few seconds, the combo with staff too, and SoS puts 10s weakness so no, they can have weakness if they want to.

4) Indeed it’s a nerf for a teamfight, but now if people don’t use DhuumFire (some won’t, it’s quite obvious), they’ll have access to those marks again and to -20% CD on staff, so yes…they have to give up a good trait to get another good trait

5) Well I do know the specifics and I guarantee that engineer and elementalist at least got no new condition removals and that ele’s condition removals even got nerfed at the time.

Well, I like my engi why are you even comparing bomb/nades engi to DhuumFire Necro and Spirit ranger? bombs are so easily dodged, same for grenades. With an engineer you have to put twice the effort of a necro to do damage, and you have half the survivability. I seriously doubt it needs nerf.

Under powered… XD The fourms never disappointing that changes jest makes it so you have control of it. There still is the zero tell ds 3 to set it up.

Flumek.9043:

Uhtameit.2413:

First, dhhumfire will proc on Life Blast, not on Life Blast crit (http://dulfy.net/2014/01/17/gw2-ready-up-skill-and-balance-developer-livestream-notes/), you only need to land it one time to make it proc (and they could do that while the ennemy is feared or immobilized).

1)They lost 1 bleed on the bleed mark, are there other nerfs?

2)They lost weakness duration but they have +30% duration via the first traitline and weakness was buffed, hence the duration nerfs.

3)Fear damage was basically a loss of 70 damage…fear still does 1k damage PER TICK (it can do 2 or 3k).

4)Yes, necros can’t have greater unblockable marks but they still have access to many unblockable skills (corrupt boon, #2 DS, Lich auto attack, wells). Their marks got buffed in the process too so that the greater marks trait is unnecessary. Pretty much every condi necro is still running Terror which is only at 20 points in the condi traitline, not that much of a big deal. Btw, if you recall, they moved Terror at 20 points and moved Greater Marks so that people couldn’t get GM and Terror..But then they gave up on Greater Marks thanks to the marks being buffed, and they were able to get their hands on http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Master_of_Terror at 20 points in Soul Reaping (more fear ticks, so more damage). So yes, nerfs resulting in a buff.

5)Huge buffs to other classes condi removal? what are you refering to? I mean it’s about that time that ele got an ICD on cleansing water and that cleansing fire got nerfed, nothing has changed as far as engineer is concerned (traduction : still is a free kill for necros), nothing for thief either if I’m not mistaken, nothing for guardian…please explain.

6)The addition of sigils that buff condi removal in the next patch may prove to be a little issue for all condi players, not just necros. Since I don’t see any other justified point and this one is hardly important, I don’t get why necros would suck.

I just don’t get it.

1) 1x bleed on staff#2, 1x bleed on dodge mark + 1x bleed on traited weakness shroud so less bleed bursting which was actual skillplay, 1x bleed on scepter #2 -pvp only

2) The weaknes was OP, but nerfed hard. It is wrong logic starting with base 30% condi duration and god forbid the DS-recharge perfect scenario, because it only forces condispam instead of stack and pushes condi necros into useless tree.

3) 17% of +1k dmg is trivial, the nerf back then had 0 effect. I just wnt a moral victory of them admitting a mistake

4) It is a 10 trait points buff, but it removed the unblockables and most imporatant, reduced AoE dmg by a lot, youre avoiding 3k bleeds every 6s now in a teamfight

5) Idk any specific, but theyre logic last 9 months was bringing condi removal up. Lyssa is finaly getting nerfed so im neutral here

6) Will see what new stuff is brought to all classes

But with current knowledge, theorycrafting, condi necro will be weak. Im all for removal of condi spam, just as long engie IP and bomb/nades are next, spirits should dissapear and the warior bow could have a smaller radius.

Berzerker stance and cleansing ire are the obvious buffs to condi removal. But also diamond skin and null field too.

And to earlier post imo that 5% condi damage to health trait is soooo bad. Why do you want healing when you are doing massive damage? You dont need healing at that point. Also epidemic is kind of meh because of condition immunity, guardian shouts and full condi cleanses.

The ONLY huge nerf in the patch is to condi necro. Dhuumfire change just guts a build totally. It would be like removing berzerker stance and cleansing ire from warrior and saying have fun. Or removing spirits activate on death from rangers. It just guts the build and the class totally. And all this for necro? Necro is a noob-bashing class. It owns newbies who aren’t smart enough to play well. But it struggles to be powerful when people get semi-competent. Why is the only class being gutted completely necro when it is probably 6th strongest out of 8?

Personally I don’t find necro to even be that powerful at the moment. Not when compared to all the engineers and warriors. Not that I even really played this game, but anyway.

Necro will suck hard post patch.

They will remove dhumm ( oh god, no condi necro will ever take it again in PvP, good luck landing life blast and good luck even having enough Life Force to use it anyway).

Nec will be back to pre-dumb fire patch but

- with less bleeds
- less terror damage

So basically worse LOL.

I would go power nec ( i’ve been playing it quite succesfully in top solo q, though i don’t think it will be viable in team q), point is pow nec sucks in 1vs1 if you don’t bring corrupt boon, weakening shroud and signet of spite, and in team q you need to bring wells for lich form shanenigans.

This means you’re gonna lose every 1vs1 against any random war and even against other classes, EVEN ELES ( all its utilities counter power necro, especially in small time frames) something that a condi nec would have never suffered.

One of the biggest advantages of a condi nec is how strong it is 1vs1, against everything but hardcounters: post patch nec will suck in any scenario, teamfight power, 1vs1 and survivability.

Lordrosicky.5813:

Berzerker stance and cleansing ire are the obvious buffs to condi removal. But also diamond skin and null field too.

Diamond skin is pretty but useless in a team fight and at 30 points in the worse traitline ele has so almost no one uses it. Null field? a cleanse every 40s is annoying to a necro?I..uh…okay.

Lordrosicky.5813:

The ONLY huge nerf in the patch is to condi necro. Dhuumfire change just guts a build totally. It would be like removing berzerker stance and cleansing ire from warrior and saying have fun. Or removing spirits activate on death from rangers. It just guts the build and the class totally. And all this for necro? Necro is a noob-bashing class. It owns newbies who aren’t smart enough to play well. But it struggles to be powerful when people get semi-competent. Why is the only class being gutted completely necro when it is probably 6th strongest out of 8?

It also owns eles that don’t have many condition removals (I mean except eles that take every single condi removal they can find, thus putting them at a disadvantage against direct damage) and engineers as well. So yeah, no, it doesn’t struggle at all. SoS more and you’ll be fine.

Mrbig.8019:

Necro will suck hard post patch.

They will remove dhumm ( oh god, no condi necro will ever take it again in PvP, good luck landing life blast and good luck even having enough Life Force to use it anyway).

How about taking X in soul reaping to get some LF, and using Life Blast while the opponent is feared/immobilized? no? I guess not.

Mrbig.8019:

Nec will be back to pre-dumb fire patch but

- with less bleeds
- less terror damage

Please read my post from above, they got torment damage and if you spec +duration, it is fine without the bleeds. Terror damage nerf was approximately -70 damage for each 1k tick of terror so again, lol.

Mrbig.8019:

This means you’re gonna lose every 1vs1 against any random war and even against other classes, EVEN ELES ( all its utilities counter power necro, especially in small time frames) something that a condi nec would have never suffered.

Except, you know, if you have full DS or if the ele plays staff.

Mrbig.8019:

Necro will suck hard post patch.

They will remove dhumm ( oh god, no condi necro will ever take it again in PvP, good luck landing life blast and good luck even having enough Life Force to use it anyway).

Nec will be back to pre-dumb fire patch but

- with less bleeds
- less terror damage

So basically worse LOL.

I would go power nec ( i’ve been playing it quite succesfully in top solo q, though i don’t think it will be viable in team q), point is pow nec sucks in 1vs1 if you don’t bring corrupt boon, weakening shroud and signet of spite, and in team q you need to bring wells for lich form shanenigans.

This means you’re gonna lose every 1vs1 against any random war and even against other classes, EVEN ELES ( all its utilities counter power necro, especially in small time frames) something that a condi nec would have never suffered.

One of the biggest advantages of a condi nec is how strong it is 1vs1, against everything but hardcounters: post patch nec will suck in any scenario, teamfight power, 1vs1 and survivability.

Good post. I find the problem with power necro is its a total glass build with zero mobility/invuln/dodge. So basically its the easiest build to focus in the game.

And the only good weapon with power is basically dagger and to use that you need to be within 130 range which means you die.

Power necro is decent for wells and life blast. It is a 1 spamming build I find, not very enjoyable to play and yet can easily be 1 shotted by any coordinated players.

I just can’t see condi necro ever getting kills after the patch. Sustain of other classes is too high

Soooo how bout necros start playing power builds? Just as scary and still hard to kill… Gawd you people act like its condi necro or bust.

jportell.2197:

Soooo how bout necros start playing power builds? Just as scary and still hard to kill… Gawd you people act like its condi necro or bust.

Point is, a power nec needs to be babysitted in team q. If you can babysit him, as soon as someone goes down the whole team will follow, but if they focus you you’re going down at the first spike.

moreover, if not built for it, it sucks in every 1vs1 ( an it will be never built for it).

Basically a teamfight machine.

Current condi nec is not only a teamfight machine, but also very stron 1vs1: the only thing he lacks is mobility.

Travelers rune may help with pow nec, otherwise it’s a slow teamfight build capable of doing nothing else.

You think they care that necro will be unviable? It should be blatantly obvious to everyone that saw the balance preview that anet is no longer trying to balance the game at this point, they’re just trying to change things.

A lot of veteran necros thought that dhuumfire was not necessary. At the time of implementation, the necro community was asking for mobility and CC buffs but instead got dhuumfire. It’s good to have access to a powerful condition such as burning, but to have it proc on crits makes it too passive of a tool. I think having it proc on Life Blasts is a decent idea, but we won’t know how it will affect our gameplay until it’s actually implemented. I see what the devs are trying to do with making the game more active and since DS is so underused in condi builds, it forces us necros to be a little more active and to use all of our abilities.

SuperHaze.4210:

A lot of veteran necros thought that dhuumfire was not necessary. At the time of implementation, the necro community was asking for mobility and CC buffs but instead got dhuumfire. It’s good to have access to a powerful condition such as burning, but to have it proc on crits makes it too passive of a tool. I think having it proc on Life Blasts is a decent idea, but we won’t know how it will affect our gameplay until it’s actually implemented. I see what the devs are trying to do with making the game more active and since DS is so underused in condi builds, it forces us necros to be a little more active and to use all of our abilities.

Ds is underused in condi builds because condi builds lack ways to built it.

No i won’t take LF on marks lawl.

Post patch we’ll have a weaker pre-dumbfire nec, NO ONE will ever go for dhuumfire after patch.

As for diamond skin i can only say, very few elementalists use it.
Cause if you invest 30 in earth u sacrifice pretty much dmg.
If you want your classic condition removal build on ele, you need to invest in water as well. Investing in Earth AND Water results in having an incredibly low dmg output and can be ignored.
I have NO condition removal at all right now, cause once a necro starts putting conditions at me I cant keep up with removing them anyway, so I just maximized my dmg in order to kill faster than the conditions
Unfortunately that Death Shroud is a dangerous counter.

SuperHaze.4210:

A lot of veteran necros thought that dhuumfire was not necessary. At the time of implementation, the necro community was asking for mobility and CC buffs but instead got dhuumfire. It’s good to have access to a powerful condition such as burning, but to have it proc on crits makes it too passive of a tool. I think having it proc on Life Blasts is a decent idea, but we won’t know how it will affect our gameplay until it’s actually implemented. I see what the devs are trying to do with making the game more active and since DS is so underused in condi builds, it forces us necros to be a little more active and to use all of our abilities.

Whether dhuumfire was necessary is debatable, but something was definitely needed at the time. They decided NOT to give additional mobility, evades, vigor, stealth, stability, immunity, or any other kind of defensive buffs…so…I think they’ve pretty much admitted now that they were wrong to give an offensive buff.

Unfortunately, they still haven’t made any material changes to defenses or LF generation to compensate for the Dhuumfire nerf…so…there is genuine concern.

If you think the nerf to Dhuumfire isn’t massive, all you need to do is record an hour of sPvP and count how many times Dhuumfire proc’d. Now, go back and count how many times you landed a Life Blast.

It’s an enormous discrepancy…plus it will be forcing you into your defensive stance when not needed just to get your 30 point talent to do anything. Condi necros will almost always be out of LF compared to now AND doing less damage.

If they think an 8% nerf to warrior healing signet is a material decrease to their survivability, maybe they should run the numbers on how much extra damage necros take with no life force…it will be MUCH bigger than 8%.

Anyone running Dhuumfire post patch will quickly realize how much of a nerf it was to BOTH damage and survivability.

Now…that being said…I can totally get on board with making the game more “active” versus passive…ONLY IF THEY ARE CONSISTENT.

The Warrior healing signet and allowing perplexity runes into sPvP are two of the most obvious counter examples. Anyone with half a brain knows these things are OP and used over other options for a reason. The major problem with these things are the passive aspect…yet they have done NOTHING to make them more active.

These turn their whole Dhuumfire nerf logic into sheer folly and makes Anet look silly.

SPESHAL.9106:

SuperHaze.4210:

A lot of veteran necros thought that dhuumfire was not necessary. At the time of implementation, the necro community was asking for mobility and CC buffs but instead got dhuumfire. It’s good to have access to a powerful condition such as burning, but to have it proc on crits makes it too passive of a tool. I think having it proc on Life Blasts is a decent idea, but we won’t know how it will affect our gameplay until it’s actually implemented. I see what the devs are trying to do with making the game more active and since DS is so underused in condi builds, it forces us necros to be a little more active and to use all of our abilities.

Whether dhuumfire was necessary is debatable, but something was definitely needed at the time. They decided NOT to give additional mobility, evades, vigor, stealth, stability, immunity, or any other kind of defensive buffs…so…I think they’ve pretty much admitted now that they were wrong to give an offensive buff.

Unfortunately, they still haven’t made any material changes to defenses or LF generation to compensate for the Dhuumfire nerf…so…there is genuine concern.

If you think the nerf to Dhuumfire isn’t massive, all you need to do is record an hour of sPvP and count how many times Dhuumfire proc’d. Now, go back and count how many times you landed a Life Blast.

It’s an enormous discrepancy…plus it will be forcing you into your defensive stance when not needed just to get your 30 point talent to do anything. Condi necros will almost always be out of LF compared to now AND doing less damage.

If they think an 8% nerf to warrior healing signet is a material decrease to their survivability, maybe they should run the numbers on how much extra damage necros take with no life force…it will be MUCH bigger than 8%.

Anyone running Dhuumfire post patch will quickly realize how much of a nerf it was to BOTH damage and survivability.

Now…that being said…I can totally get on board with making the game more “active” versus passive…ONLY IF THEY ARE CONSISTENT.

The Warrior healing signet and allowing perplexity runes into sPvP are two of the most obvious counter examples. Anyone with half a brain knows these things are OP and used over other options for a reason. The major problem with these things are the passive aspect…yet they have done NOTHING to make them more active.

These turn their whole Dhuumfire nerf logic into sheer folly and makes Anet look silly.

The dhuumfire nerf is beyond massive. The new curses GM trait helps but still. It is very lame that dhuumfire is the only thing being nerfed that really makes a class seriously bad.

I mean I literally think it will be impossible to kill a warrior without burning. For 20% of the time they are immune to ALL my damage. And they they have so many condi clears and still a broken healing signet/adrenal health/cleansing ire combo of ownage.

The strength of dhuumfire is 2 fold:
1, It is a condition to cover your bleeds/poison
2, Burning does a ton of damage

This means that the amount of dps necro loses is a ton. Possibly as much as 10-15k during a 1v1 with a warrior (from testing). That is ridiculous. To lose 15k damage every minute is absurd. And all cos they nerfed fear by 17% (a ton), bleed bombing by alot (it is way less now). Like it is ridiculous. And torment is meant to be the necro condition to stop people running away and who gets it? Warriors obviously.

I like how all the necro fanboys just ignored my counter arguments. Nice. Time to L2P I guess.

Uhtameit.2413:

I like how all the necro fanboys just ignored my counter arguments. Nice. Time to L2P I guess.

I’m pretty sure it is you who needs to learn to play if you think the “counter” to the Dhuumfire nerf is….

“How about taking X in soul reaping to get some LF, and using Life Blast while the opponent is feared/immobilized? no? I guess not.”

I’ll explain this one more time, so you can specifically prove it to yourself.

Record an hour of playing sPvP with Dhuumfire and then count how many times it procs and how much damage it does.

Then, go ahead and spec your “counter” in soul reaping. Record an hour of sPvP and count how many times you land a Life Blast. Don’t even bother playing smart and saving your LF and fear for defensive purposes. Go ahead and swap to DS as much as possible and waste as much LF as possible to cast fear/life blast to get a hypothetical post-patch Dhuumfire to proc.

Count how many times you were able to do it and it will be a fraction of what proc’d before. Not to mention how much you neutered your defensive/survivability just to get your Grandmaster trait to do anything.

After you do this exercise…come back to the forum and admit that it is YOU who needs to L2P.

Uhtameit.2413:

I like how all the necro fanboys just ignored my counter arguments. Nice. Time to L2P I guess.

That’s mostly because your counter arguments are all wrong, but since you want people’s attention on your mistakes, here it is.

Points in soulreaping don’t allow you to spend more time or aggregate more Life force, both values are percentage based.

70 is not 17% of a thousand.

Kiriakulos.1690:

Uhtameit.2413:

I like how all the necro fanboys just ignored my counter arguments. Nice. Time to L2P I guess.

That’s mostly because your counter arguments are all wrong, but since you want people’s attention on your mistakes, here it is.

Points in soulreaping don’t allow you to spend more time or aggregate more Life force, both values are percentage based.

70 is not 17% of a thousand.

X in soul reaping does help getting LF. Time to learn how to read.

SPESHAL.9106:

Uhtameit.2413:

I like how all the necro fanboys just ignored my counter arguments. Nice. Time to L2P I guess.

I’m pretty sure it is you who needs to learn to play if you think the “counter” to the Dhuumfire nerf is….

“How about taking X in soul reaping to get some LF, and using Life Blast while the opponent is feared/immobilized? no? I guess not.”

I’ll explain this one more time, so you can specifically prove it to yourself.

Record an hour of playing sPvP with Dhuumfire and then count how many times it procs and how much damage it does.

Then, go ahead and spec your “counter” in soul reaping. Record an hour of sPvP and count how many times you land a Life Blast. Don’t even bother playing smart and saving your LF and fear for defensive purposes. Go ahead and swap to DS as much as possible and waste as much LF as possible to cast fear/life blast to get a hypothetical post-patch Dhuumfire to proc.

Count how many times you were able to do it and it will be a fraction of what proc’d before. Not to mention how much you neutered your defensive/survivability just to get your Grandmaster trait to do anything.

After you do this exercise…come back to the forum and admit that it is YOU who needs to L2P.

Sure, it will proc less. The fact that it procced every 10s made scepter AA op, now it isn’t OP and QQ-ers are everywhere .

I love your tears.

While i like the change to a point cuz it gives life blast a use in condition builds.Yea its gunna be a big nerf. Mostly becuase the duration didn’t really change and now burning is locked behind death shroud. We start with 0 life force in tpvp and if someone bursts down your death shroud i doubt you will be able to proc the little 3 sec burn enough for it to do some serious damage. And many of our other condition abilities got nerfed thnx to dhuumfire. I think if they made dhuumfire 4 secs on life blast instead of 3 then it wouldn’t be OP but still be worth casting. It is a grandmaster trait after all.

Considering that condi necros dont have much mobility, cant really reset fights, and can get bursted down easily in teamfights. Necs role as condition bomb damage getting nerfed. I dont really have much hope in the new traits so after patch im not sure what necro will be useful for, can only wait and see now. And plz dont say MM cause that is such a gimmicky build. I might change to power nec and see how useful it is in tpvp. It never really appealed to me before.

OMNIBUS.2913:

While i like the change to a point cuz it gives life blast a use in condition builds.Yea its gunna be a big nerf. Mostly becuase the duration didn’t really change and now burning is locked behind death shroud. We start with 0 life force in tpvp and if someone bursts down your death shroud i doubt you will be able to proc the little 3 sec burn enough for it to do some serious damage. And many of our other condition abilities got nerfed thnx to dhuumfire. I think if they made dhuumfire 4 secs on life blast instead of 3 then it wouldn’t be OP but still be worth casting. It is a grandmaster trait after all.

Considering that condi necros dont have much mobility, cant really reset fights, and can get bursted down easily in teamfights. Necs role as condition bomb damage getting nerfed. I dont really have much hope in the new traits so after patch im not sure what necro will be useful for, can only wait and see now. And plz dont say MM cause that is such a gimmicky build. I might change to power nec and see how useful it is in tpvp. It never really appealed to me before.

The issue with lifeblast is that its not in the condition rotation. So to put it in spends an extra 3/4 (at least) seconds trying to get it off. Meanwhile your life force (and therefore your sustain) decreases and you are not doing any other condition pressure (with marks or scepter). So you lose a ton of damage. It is simply going to be more trouble than it is worth trying to get dhuumfire off on a pure condi build.

And I think anet’s treatment of minion master is displaying a lack of connection to the meta. There is nobody who is good at the game who runs MM at high level solo queue or in team queue. This is because the build is garbage. It doesn’t do much damage. It dies 1 on 1 to alot of builds. In team fights it is utterly useless. To nerf it seems odd. I dont mind it because it is lame, but if they really think MM is overpowered then it is a worry. It is impossible to tell people they are wrong in all walks of life. Game development is obviously no different.

I am glad necro is getting nerfed. I am glad 1/3 of the lame immunities are getting nerfed (AR). But I am sad that berzerker stance and diamond skin currently remain. Diamond skin is a ticking time bomb. It is literally only a matter of time before it breaks the game. Full immunity conditional only on keeping your health up is absurd and way stronger and most frustrating than AR.

And it isn’t just necro. I hate spirit ranger with a passion but I feel sorry for rangers because anet also pigeon holes them into condi specs (which is fine). But then introducing 100-0 counters like diamond skin or zerker stance which must be frustrating for rangers. Engis too. Ask any engi, necro or ranger whether facing diamond skin would just make them quit the game and most would say it would. It is sooo lame to fight against. Skill should decide combat not 100% immunity.

I hope engi, ranger and necro community can lobby for changes against these immunities.

Lordrosicky.5813:

And I think anet’s treatment of minion master is displaying a lack of connection to the meta. There is nobody who is good at the game who runs MM at high level solo queue or in team queue. This is because the build is garbage. It doesn’t do much damage. It dies 1 on 1 to alot of builds. In team fights it is utterly useless. To nerf it seems odd. I dont mind it because it is lame, but if they really think MM is overpowered then it is a worry. It is impossible to tell people they are wrong in all walks of life. Game development is obviously no different.

Im with u on this so much. I was kinda surprised mm is getting nerfed…. It’s such an unreliable build and easily blown up if you know how. Why nerf it?

To be honest though, diamond skin and zerk stance have not been huge issues for me so far but i agree that 100% immunities is bad design.

OMNIBUS.2913:

Lordrosicky.5813:

And I think anet’s treatment of minion master is displaying a lack of connection to the meta. There is nobody who is good at the game who runs MM at high level solo queue or in team queue. This is because the build is garbage. It doesn’t do much damage. It dies 1 on 1 to alot of builds. In team fights it is utterly useless. To nerf it seems odd. I dont mind it because it is lame, but if they really think MM is overpowered then it is a worry. It is impossible to tell people they are wrong in all walks of life. Game development is obviously no different.

Im with u on this so much. I was kinda surprised mm is getting nerfed…. It’s such an unreliable build and easily blown up if you know how. Why nerf it?

To be honest though, diamond skin and zerk stance have not been huge issues for me so far but i agree that 100% immunities is bad design.

My theory is that they either just watch NA and balance on the basis of that. Or in their “internal” testing they decided it was too strong. Either way it explains why they never seemed to think pistol whip or warrior was a problem.

OMNIBUS.2913:

Lordrosicky.5813:

And I think anet’s treatment of minion master is displaying a lack of connection to the meta. There is nobody who is good at the game who runs MM at high level solo queue or in team queue. This is because the build is garbage. It doesn’t do much damage. It dies 1 on 1 to alot of builds. In team fights it is utterly useless. To nerf it seems odd. I dont mind it because it is lame, but if they really think MM is overpowered then it is a worry. It is impossible to tell people they are wrong in all walks of life. Game development is obviously no different.

Im with u on this so much. I was kinda surprised mm is getting nerfed…. It’s such an unreliable build and easily blown up if you know how. Why nerf it?

To be honest though, diamond skin and zerk stance have not been huge issues for me so far but i agree that 100% immunities is bad design.

The reason why it got nerfed is that it relies too much on passive abilities (same as spirit ranger). I think they mentioned during a past ready up that they want to continue to reduce passive skill items and strengthen the active skill items.

Uhtameit.2413:

Sure, it will proc less. The fact that it procced every 10s made scepter AA op, now it isn’t OP and QQ-ers are everywhere .

I love your tears.

I’m glad you finally abandoned your “counter” and “L2P” arguments and resorted to the more accurate characterization of your posts – “Ha..Ha..Sucks to be you”

Save yourself the embarrassment next time and just say that in your first post.

Also if they want to put immunities like diamond skin and zerker stance in the game then they need to buff the physical damage of the scepter auto attack and buff the staff auto attack so it hits ever. They would need to make the staff have a cast time of 1/2s and travel 3 times as fast and the scepter would need to do 200% more damage or something.

Or they could just get rid of immunities…

But if there are hard counters (epsicially when you now make it easier to respec vs different comps with the new build thing) then please dont pigeon hole necro into condis.

Also if you are going to have immunities please buff ranger greatsword and dps traits to the sky. And make power necro better. Either get rid of immunities or introduce massive power creep. Those are the only options.

Trust me, fighting vs diamond skin is the worst experience I have ever seen in any game. And you have inflicted this on any condi build. SO many people will quit if diamond skin ever becomes played. Especially in solo q it will be totally broken and lame, it will make decap engis seem like childs play.

Admit you were wrong and change this trait anet.

SPESHAL.9106:

Uhtameit.2413:

Sure, it will proc less. The fact that it procced every 10s made scepter AA op, now it isn’t OP and QQ-ers are everywhere .

I love your tears.

I’m glad you finally abandoned your “counter” and “L2P” arguments and resorted to the more accurate characterization of your posts – “Ha..Ha..Sucks to be you”

Save yourself the embarrassment next time and just say that in your first post.

Why would I bother since you don’t read them and don’t answer them seriously? It sucks to be you because you can’t even think (nor consider) of an active way to play that would start to make up for the passive mechanisms that are being removed. Hell, you probably can’t even reckon that DF needed a nerf or that necro can still be okay…

You can still put burn, you will just put less of it. I put forward several arguments explaining why necro will still do quite a lot of damage. Feel free to read them.

I won’t be answering your comments since I now see that you aren’t even aware of what’s happening in the game : Perplexity Runes are not added in sPvP. If you answer someone, try to get some facts aforehand.

Rickster.8752:

And all cos they nerfed fear by 17% (a ton)

Terror damage went from ~1100 to ~1000 per tick. How is that a ton? I mean, have you even played before and after the nerf?

switching the burn to deathshroud will give necros the new ability to spike with their condis without the RNG.
since deathshroud gives you an instant fear and you can now control when you cause burning, you can trigger both at the same time.

pop deathshroud 5 causing torment,
pop deathshroud 1+3 causing burning and terror at the same time.
thats pretty impressive damage.

yes it might not be as brainless as spamming auto attacks to cause burning, poison and bleed, but this change was needed, good condi necros will still like dhuumfire.

Liewec.2896:

switching the burn to deathshroud will give necros the new ability to spike with their condis without the RNG.
since deathshroud gives you an instant fear and you can now control when you cause burning, you can trigger both at the same time.

pop deathshroud 5 causing torment,
pop deathshroud 1+3 causing burning and terror at the same time.
thats pretty impressive damage.

yes it might not be as brainless as spamming auto attacks to cause burning, poison and bleed, but this change was needed, good condi necros will still like dhuumfire.

+ transfer conditions and it looks like a normal fight vs engi. Spike them from 100 to 0 since April 1980 because they can’t counter that.