Guild Wars 2

It just seems that you just can’t win with people. They’ll always cry for nerf against builds they don’t want to adapt to or builds they don’t know how to counter. I just really hope ANet doesn’t change ANYTHING within the next months so that they will give players the opportunity to adapt. If they keep changing classes, it will be right back to the nerf QQ this community loves to delve in. In a sense, ANet has sort of encouraged this behavior indirectly given how apt they are at listening to the community. Bit of a Catch 22, innit?

In the opinion of this humble warrior, I strongly feel there shouldn’t any balance changes for a good, long while.

I hope Skull Crack wont be nerfed, people need to use stun breakers, and learn when to use it.
Most of the time they die because they run full glass canon builds or because they use it when it’s not necessary. Those builds need to be punished, and the punishment comes after a stun.

Stun builds are good for now a days. People need to get punished for running such glassyness.

so they need to be punished for not bring condi removal too?

vicious.5683:

so they need to be punished for not bring condi removal too?

The classes who are affected by this the most are the Condi meta culprits (Engi, Necro mostly).

Other classes have plenty of teleports, stealths, stunbreaks or stability to competitively evade getting chain stunned.

So yes. Condi spam classes should have something that punishes them for going so glassy.

Agree with Defektive on this one, there needs to be a build that has a good chunk of CC to punish those who run with no stability + glass build.

When it comes to PvP, I play Guardian/Mesmer/Warrior/Ranger (over 2800 games), so I like to think I am not biased when it comes to different professions/builds

Except my engi ain’t glassy? O.o but it does crack me up how hilarious CC warriors are. Please Anet don’t nerf these poor souls being a warrior is still hard even if it is a cc warrior

The thing about CC warriors is that every ounce of CC a warrior has is strongly telegraphed and easily dodged. If you are complaining about a CC warrior, you need to significantly re-evaluate your playstyle.

^a lot of times for warriors to land said Cc they need someone else to CC the target so its like hey I need to CC but can you do it first so that I can CC your CC and we CC together

I’ve realized since playing Warrior more and more over the past couple months that most professions load their utility bar up with offensive abilities – Warriors are all defense usually.

Time for other professions to make the same choice. Load up on offensive utilities and get owned by stunlock Warriors, or load up on the defensive utilities and have a chance when you get focused.

jportell.2197:

Except my engi ain’t glassy? O.o but it does crack me up how hilarious CC warriors are. Please Anet don’t nerf these poor souls being a warrior is still hard even if it is a cc warrior

Most Engis are not “glassy”…but they do tend to neglect bringing stun breaks.

The popular “Teldo build” for example so many are running has 0 stun breaks. There’s some good options for making a CC miss with the instant blind on FT, etc…but usually no stun breaker.

People complain about CC heavy warriors? I didn’t realize they were a problem. Sure they suck if they land a good hit on my necro but I can’t imagine that all the stability and blocks everyone else has would prove ineffective against them.

Pyroatheist.9031:

The thing about CC warriors is that every ounce of CC a warrior has is strongly telegraphed and easily dodged. If you are complaining about a CC warrior, you need to significantly re-evaluate your playstyle.

This is so true, though currently they are the hard counter to necros….wait nope we can just fear them away. It is fun watching Defekitve and hopefully Kpop soon do their stun lock thing!

This reminds me of when all the people cried about Eviscerate damage in the beginning.

Or Bulls, Frenzy, 100b.

Total and complete proof that the forums can, and will, complain about ANYTHING, even if it has an easy counter.

It’s true that most people, including the forum users, have no idea what they’re talking about (including when they talk about GW2). This does include “present company”.

Warrior’s Mace might need a very slight tone down, given that it’s a one handed weapon that can be paired with more CC on the offhand (shield or mace). With a Sigil of Paralyzation and an offhand with CC, it becomes incredibly difficult to melee a mace warrior at all.

Keywords: Very slight. The Mace is a no-mobility weapon. It needs to back it up with something when it gets close.

That said, changes are very new. Give it time.

almost every profession has access to blind,block,evades,stability,stun breaks so many options that counter stun warriors i can see counters to stun warriors from every profession even necro with the blind wells and slows signet of spite dead warrior, s/d and d/p theifs can be murder to land a blow we are easily kited by many professions.engineers have more cc knockbacks knockdowns etc than warriors have stuns

I’m a bit of a fan of the effect viable stunwarriors have on the game, and I usually hate all the CC chains in this game. I main necro so they kinda kitten me up, but that’s fine. I like where they’re at right now I think. Have been playing in the kitten brackets so I haven’t faced many good ones since this last patch though.

It’s really amazing how people actually started crying about CC warrior now, when (correct me if I’m wrong) you could run the same build ever since release of the game. Yeah, I’ve been running Axe/Mace + Mace/Shield and Hammer + Mace/Shield Warrior a year ago, when everyone was all about 100b. The only difference now is that one set uses a 1h sword. And guess what, people weren’t complaining that much about this build back then. Also people carried more stunbreakers back then! :oo

When a Necromancer that has 0 stunbreakers on his utility bar (all used by minions) cries about being perma-stuned by Warrior… Well that just makes my day.

Approaching the fight against good players with CC warrior can still get tricky and success is far from guaranteed… I still got bursted down by a vigilant mesmer before I could really threaten him, I still got kitten d by an ever annoying (properly built and properly played) Engineer…

Yeah I haven’t heard any of it yet, but I wouldn’t be surprised if I do. My response would be the same as it is to any ‘nerf X’ comment:

If they’re not strong enough for you to play one, I guess they’re not that strong after all. On the other hand, if your team is running multiple stun warriors, sure, I believe you when you say they might be too strong.

shimmerless.4560:

playing stun warrior is really satisfying too there’s a real sense of timing and counter play

I agree, really enjoy this about it. You can be absolutely devastating if your timing is good, or you can miss most of your attempts and be a joke.

It is pretty balanced due to the fact that the mace stun requires one to be in melee range and it can only hit one person. Not to mention with a lot of AI running around, it can act as a body block. I wouldn’t be mad though if ANet does decide to shave off .5 of a second off the mace stun.

It can be countered very easily with aegis, block, invulnerability, blind, stability and a stunbreaker. It requires good timing and making sure the conditions are met in order to unleash a successful stun.

It is one weapon, one that has zero mobility and for the most part single target.

Defektive.7283:

vicious.5683:

so they need to be punished for not bring condi removal too?

The classes who are affected by this the most are the Condi meta culprits (Engi, Necro mostly).

Other classes have plenty of teleports, stealths, stunbreaks or stability to competitively evade getting chain stunned.

So yes. Condi spam classes should have something that punishes them for going so glassy.

even if u has 3 stunbreakers in your slots it just delay the chainstun.. actual its not that hard to chainstun anyone even if he has stunbreakers. it is simply overpowered atm. the amount of possible stuns dont match the amount and reload of stunbreakers or stabilityduration.

your argument is a simple excuse to avoid nerf.. but be honest a nerf is needed if stunbreakers gets no buffs in reloadtime or amount of stunbreakers.

hooma.9642:

Defektive.7283:

vicious.5683:

so they need to be punished for not bring condi removal too?

The classes who are affected by this the most are the Condi meta culprits (Engi, Necro mostly).

Other classes have plenty of teleports, stealths, stunbreaks or stability to competitively evade getting chain stunned.

So yes. Condi spam classes should have something that punishes them for going so glassy.

even if u has 3 stunbreakers in your slots it just delay the chainstun.. actual its not that hard to chainstun anyone even if he has stunbreakers. it is simply overpowered atm. the amount of possible stuns dont match the amount and reload of stunbreakers or stabilityduration.

your argument is a simple excuse to avoid nerf.. but be honest a nerf is needed if stunbreakers gets no buffs in reloadtime or amount of stunbreakers.

Stability.
or
Blinds.

Defektive.7283:

hooma.9642:

Defektive.7283:

vicious.5683:

so they need to be punished for not bring condi removal too?

The classes who are affected by this the most are the Condi meta culprits (Engi, Necro mostly).

Other classes have plenty of teleports, stealths, stunbreaks or stability to competitively evade getting chain stunned.

So yes. Condi spam classes should have something that punishes them for going so glassy.

even if u has 3 stunbreakers in your slots it just delay the chainstun.. actual its not that hard to chainstun anyone even if he has stunbreakers. it is simply overpowered atm. the amount of possible stuns dont match the amount and reload of stunbreakers or stabilityduration.

your argument is a simple excuse to avoid nerf.. but be honest a nerf is needed if stunbreakers gets no buffs in reloadtime or amount of stunbreakers.

Stability.
or
Blinds.

sorry very stupid answer.. so take a quick look at ranger as example and count the amount of stabilitysources + duration, the amount of stunbreakers and theyre reload and then the amount of blindsources.

if u try to argument for the actual cc possiblity then at least look at more then ur class. as a hint: there are 7 more. some with less less defensivcapabilities.

hooma.9642:

Defektive.7283:

hooma.9642:

Defektive.7283:

vicious.5683:

so they need to be punished for not bring condi removal too?

The classes who are affected by this the most are the Condi meta culprits (Engi, Necro mostly).

Other classes have plenty of teleports, stealths, stunbreaks or stability to competitively evade getting chain stunned.

So yes. Condi spam classes should have something that punishes them for going so glassy.

even if u has 3 stunbreakers in your slots it just delay the chainstun.. actual its not that hard to chainstun anyone even if he has stunbreakers. it is simply overpowered atm. the amount of possible stuns dont match the amount and reload of stunbreakers or stabilityduration.

your argument is a simple excuse to avoid nerf.. but be honest a nerf is needed if stunbreakers gets no buffs in reloadtime or amount of stunbreakers.

Stability.
or
Blinds.

sorry very stupid answer.. so take a quick look at ranger as example and count the amount of stabilitysources + duration, the amount of stunbreakers and theyre reload and then the amount of blindsources.

if u try to argument for the actual cc possiblity then at least look at more then ur class. as a hint: there are 7 more. some with less less defensivcapabilities.

I’ve played against a number of good spirit rangers who can withstand a CC Warrior.

I’m confused, would you rather warriors have 0 viable builds for tPvP or are you just upset that if you let us get to close to you we can just apply the jaws and life and stick like white on rice.

hooma.9642:

Defektive.7283:

vicious.5683:

so they need to be punished for not bring condi removal too?

The classes who are affected by this the most are the Condi meta culprits (Engi, Necro mostly).

Other classes have plenty of teleports, stealths, stunbreaks or stability to competitively evade getting chain stunned.

So yes. Condi spam classes should have something that punishes them for going so glassy.

even if u has 3 stunbreakers in your slots it just delay the chainstun.. actual its not that hard to chainstun anyone even if he has stunbreakers. it is simply overpowered atm. the amount of possible stuns dont match the amount and reload of stunbreakers or stabilityduration.

your argument is a simple excuse to avoid nerf.. but be honest a nerf is needed if stunbreakers gets no buffs in reloadtime or amount of stunbreakers.

Warriors are countering the condi meta because when people said “Necro is OP now Condis are too much” the necro Response was “We have no escapes L2P focus us first. We have NO STUNBREAKS!” So when the community found a way to counter that the necro response is to nerf? Seriously.

The amount of CC a Warriors have at their disposal hasn’t changed. The only thing that has changed recently is the increase of 1s on Skullcrack, which makes perfect sense, because why would it have the same length as Earthshaker which is a gap closer and AoE attack, and the potentially decreased cooldown of burst skills in general. (And Rampage I guess but it’s still subpar)
So how has it not been a problem before?

In addition to that Rangers rely heavily on range attacks while Warriors who want to make use of CC need to get into melee range to use and to land any attacks. If the ranger manages to kite the warrior he’s rendered useless, if the Warrior manages to close the gap and manages to CC that is simply the counter play to the kiting tactic and exactly what the Devs said they want Warriors to be able to do. Close the gap, stick on the target and apply pressure.

I would assume that Rangers have less stunbreakers and access to stability by design, because they have a ton of evasive skills and kite potential. In the situation there needs to be an achiles heel for both. Keep the Warrior at distance you win, if he gets on top of you, either you get the heck out or he wins.

jportell.2197:

hooma.9642:

Defektive.7283:

vicious.5683:

so they need to be punished for not bring condi removal too?

The classes who are affected by this the most are the Condi meta culprits (Engi, Necro mostly).

Other classes have plenty of teleports, stealths, stunbreaks or stability to competitively evade getting chain stunned.

So yes. Condi spam classes should have something that punishes them for going so glassy.

even if u has 3 stunbreakers in your slots it just delay the chainstun.. actual its not that hard to chainstun anyone even if he has stunbreakers. it is simply overpowered atm. the amount of possible stuns dont match the amount and reload of stunbreakers or stabilityduration.

your argument is a simple excuse to avoid nerf.. but be honest a nerf is needed if stunbreakers gets no buffs in reloadtime or amount of stunbreakers.

Warriors are countering the condi meta because when people said “Necro is OP now Condis are too much” the necro Response was “We have no escapes L2P focus us first. We have NO STUNBREAKS!” So when the community found a way to counter that the necro response is to nerf? Seriously.

u should find the answer in ur own response

so if a enemy has 0 stunbreaker, how much stuns u need to kill them? 1 or 1000? maybe u should learn to use stability and stun or interrupt the important skills that rip your stability.. then 1 stun is enough to kill a necro.

but ur logic says they spam condition so i spam stuns, cause i has not enough condition clear. or my team is to bad to build use a waterele or use a hybridshoutwarrior who support the group..

the answer was not a change in teamcomposition, only fight cheese with cheese. atm gw2 give enough tools to work with.. just open ur eyes. but i guess class x with y dps is always worse than class z with y+5 dps.. no matter what it brings to the group or against the enemy build. that view is the whole problem!

and the worst part of the story is our “top” players play the same cheese like the lowest possible player.

Everyone in this thread that is defending a 3 sec stun on a 7 1/2 sec cd must think WoW has good pvp.

Anet should of been smart and followed the direction of gw1, aka not losing control of your character for a significant amount of time.

The problem with this build is it doesn’t just punishes necros.

It punishes anyone who isn’t humping a guardian.

Cool, so a bunker ranger can withstand CC.

What about any build that isn’t condi ranger? Ranger hasn’t had a viable offensive or glass build in ages. Even if you bring lightning reflexes and signet of renewal you will get steamrolled.

Stun or daze spam is just as cheap as fear spam. You lose control of your character for ridiculous periods of time while the opposing team just tunnels damage into you.

So power (non-condi) necros, rangers, and engineers are dead on arrival and these warriors will make sure the extinction is complete.

Give warriors better sustained. Healing, team utility. Don’t just give them more CC and unpeelable damage.

This game has devolved into a total arms race for who can gib the other first instead of actually being fights of attrition.

hooma.9642:

jportell.2197:

hooma.9642:

Defektive.7283:

vicious.5683:

so they need to be punished for not bring condi removal too?

The classes who are affected by this the most are the Condi meta culprits (Engi, Necro mostly).

Other classes have plenty of teleports, stealths, stunbreaks or stability to competitively evade getting chain stunned.

So yes. Condi spam classes should have something that punishes them for going so glassy.

even if u has 3 stunbreakers in your slots it just delay the chainstun.. actual its not that hard to chainstun anyone even if he has stunbreakers. it is simply overpowered atm. the amount of possible stuns dont match the amount and reload of stunbreakers or stabilityduration.

your argument is a simple excuse to avoid nerf.. but be honest a nerf is needed if stunbreakers gets no buffs in reloadtime or amount of stunbreakers.

Warriors are countering the condi meta because when people said “Necro is OP now Condis are too much” the necro Response was “We have no escapes L2P focus us first. We have NO STUNBREAKS!” So when the community found a way to counter that the necro response is to nerf? Seriously.

u should find the answer in ur own response

so if a enemy has 0 stunbreaker, how much stuns u need to kill them? 1 or 1000? maybe u should learn to use stability and stun or interrupt the important skills that rip your stability.. then 1 stun is enough to kill a necro.

but ur logic says they spam condition so i spam stuns, cause i has not enough condition clear. or my team is to bad to build use a waterele or use a hybridshoutwarrior who support the group..

the answer was not a change in teamcomposition, only fight cheese with cheese. atm gw2 give enough tools to work with.. just open ur eyes. but i guess class x with y dps is always worse than class z with y+5 dps.. no matter what it brings to the group or against the enemy build. that view is the whole problem!

and the worst part of the story is our “top” players play the same cheese like the lowest possible player.

Because NOBODY has enough condi cleanse to deal with the amount of conditons one or two necros/HGH engis brings. Nobody. And we were told the counter to it. CC. So what did we do bring CC. Arguing for a nerf because it counters something that only has one or two counters is sad. And also warrior CC really only hurts Necros and engis. Maybe some rangers. But these two are the main ones that it hurts. So no it doesn’t need a nerf. It’s counterplay.

jportell.2197:

hooma.9642:

jportell.2197:

hooma.9642:

Defektive.7283:

vicious.5683:

so they need to be punished for not bring condi removal too?

The classes who are affected by this the most are the Condi meta culprits (Engi, Necro mostly).

Other classes have plenty of teleports, stealths, stunbreaks or stability to competitively evade getting chain stunned.

So yes. Condi spam classes should have something that punishes them for going so glassy.

even if u has 3 stunbreakers in your slots it just delay the chainstun.. actual its not that hard to chainstun anyone even if he has stunbreakers. it is simply overpowered atm. the amount of possible stuns dont match the amount and reload of stunbreakers or stabilityduration.

your argument is a simple excuse to avoid nerf.. but be honest a nerf is needed if stunbreakers gets no buffs in reloadtime or amount of stunbreakers.

Warriors are countering the condi meta because when people said “Necro is OP now Condis are too much” the necro Response was “We have no escapes L2P focus us first. We have NO STUNBREAKS!” So when the community found a way to counter that the necro response is to nerf? Seriously.

u should find the answer in ur own response

so if a enemy has 0 stunbreaker, how much stuns u need to kill them? 1 or 1000? maybe u should learn to use stability and stun or interrupt the important skills that rip your stability.. then 1 stun is enough to kill a necro.

but ur logic says they spam condition so i spam stuns, cause i has not enough condition clear. or my team is to bad to build use a waterele or use a hybridshoutwarrior who support the group..

the answer was not a change in teamcomposition, only fight cheese with cheese. atm gw2 give enough tools to work with.. just open ur eyes. but i guess class x with y dps is always worse than class z with y+5 dps.. no matter what it brings to the group or against the enemy build. that view is the whole problem!

and the worst part of the story is our “top” players play the same cheese like the lowest possible player.

Because NOBODY has enough condi cleanse to deal with the amount of conditons one or two necros/HGH engis brings. Nobody. And we were told the counter to it. CC. So what did we do bring CC. Arguing for a nerf because it counters something that only has one or two counters is sad. And also warrior CC really only hurts Necros and engis. Maybe some rangers. But these two are the main ones that it hurts. So no it doesn’t need a nerf. It’s counterplay.

so ur answer to spam is spam and ur argument that it isnt that bad is other spam?

interessting.. we should ask anet to reduce the amount of skills to 1 and the amount of class to 1. so we all can spam 1, we dont need to build a teamcompisiton that maybe has its weakness but other strenght. we dont need to coordinate something.
we just spam spam spam.. interesting that even our “top” players need to spam cause they lack of creatitivity on builds or coordination.

cc hurts everybody.. u defend on the false end of the problem.

conditions are there to spam, cause they are conditions they hurt in mass. so every conditionremove hurts conditionspam. the problem is that u let them spam conditons without proper change in your builds!

its a complete risk vs reward thing.. u all are just unwilling to accept it and to adjust ur build to ur enemy.

Aza.2105:

Everyone in this thread that is defending a 3 sec stun on a 7 1/2 sec cd must think WoW has good pvp.

Anet should of been smart and followed the direction of gw1, aka not losing control of your character for a significant amount of time.

u forget sigel of paralyzation.

hooma.9642:

so ur answer to spam is spam and ur argument that it isnt that bad is other spam?

Warrior CC is hammer and Mace/Shield. Mace/Shield is all single target CC. Hammer has two AOE CCs one of which has a very short range around the warrior the other is a very obvious AOE leap. How obvious is Reapers Mark compared to others or the fear in death shroud? Oh wait its instant! Nvm. So no warriors cannot AOE Spam CC like necros and engis can AOE spam Conditons.

hooma.9642:

interessting.. we should ask anet to reduce the amount of skills to 1 and the amount of class to 1. so we all can spam 1, we dont need to build a teamcompisiton that maybe has its weakness but other strenght. we dont need to coordinate something.
we just spam spam spam.. interesting that even our “top” players need to spam cause they lack of creatitivity on builds or coordination.

This is exactly whats going on people don’t like playing Cheese AOE condi nuke builds so instead they build to counter it. And the warrior CC build is now viable because before the meta had way more thieves eles and mesmers who had tons of stun breaks and escape abilities. Now that the meta is AOE condition spam by classes that either don’t run or refuse to run stunbreaks. Warrior is viable and it just so happens to be CC.

hooma.9642:

cc hurts everybody.. u defend on the false end of the problem.

Condition spam hurts everybody. Especially when a warrior cannot keep CC up permanently A necro can permanently apply conditions (Scepter 1 anybody? Marks? Wells?) and so can an HGH nade engi (Shrapnel grenade the bleed duration is longer than the CD of the grenade)

hooma.9642:

conditions are there to spam, cause they are conditions they hurt in mass. so every conditionremove hurts conditionspam. the problem is that u let them spam conditons without proper change in your builds!

And every condition remove is usually limited to the number of conditions except a couple heal skills and other wise poor utility skills. And we changed our builds I run a bunker engineer with the trait that grants condition immunity at 25% people started running warriors and using cleansing ire… Sounds like we adapted and aren’t letting them spam conditions anymore…. Maybe you should change your build?

hooma.9642:

its a complete risk vs reward thing.. u all are just unwilling to accept it and to adjust ur build to ur enemy.

How much risk is there for a necro to sit off point and corrupt boon/epidemic everyone and their mother on the point. How much risk is there for an HGH nade engi to stand on top of the clock tower in khylo and spam grenades on to the point with 25 stacks of might? A CC warrior still runs high risk because HE MUST LAND HIS CC IN MELEE. A necro can do everything from 1200 an hgh engi can do it all from 1500. So maybe you need to adjust your build to your enemy.

I find it funny though that now people are saying “we can’t pack that many stunbreaks” well noone can pack enough condi clear to keep up with even one necro let alone two. We found a counter and it works. Doesn’t mean its OP.

vicious.5683:

so they need to be punished for not bring condi removal too?

yes, yes and yes

also I forgot to mention I don’t think warrior cc should be nerfed.

As a condition necromancer, CC warriors are my counter. I still think they’re fine. They’re not outrageous enough that I can’t do anything, but they definitely hurt.

Considering the metagame, I’m not sure bringing my class down a bit is a bad thing.

If stunbreaks actually broke technical stuns, IE: Knockbacks, Launches, Knockdowns upon using the stunbreak, I wouldn’t think “CC” warriors were overpowered or imbalanced in any form or way. They can dish out quite a lot of damage due to particular trait setup but at least they’re actually good.

The only really debatable thing about it being even remotely overpowered is how often and consistently they can do it. But, as many have stated, and I will state myself, it has it’s own share of counters to it and generally requires team play to make truly effective, which is really the only time it starts to feel OP rather than annoying as hell.

My ONLY complaint about stuns is using stunbreak against with knockbacks / launches / anything other than a stationary stun. Stunbreakers are broken / bugged in the way that if you immediately use it via fast reaction time, you’re still sitting there because you didn’t wait for the flopping animation to finish.

That IMO is absolutely terrible design because waiting around in a game where damage comes in so stupidly fast is asking to die and makes stunbreakers much less useful than they should be.

Jesiah.2457:

.. But, as many have stated, and I will state myself, it has it’s own share of counters to it and generally requires team play to make truly effective, which is really the only time it starts to feel OP rather than annoying as hell.
…

condition spam has counter too and maybe our 2 pros should start not sitting all clump together.

jportell.2197:

…
I find it funny though that now people are saying “we can’t pack that many stunbreaks” well noone can pack enough condi clear to keep up with even one necro let alone two. We found a counter and it works. Doesn’t mean its OP.

u move ur arguments how u need it and ignore the wrong part.. so u mention that not all cc on warrior are aoe.. the same goes for necro. he cant not fearchain the whole team. except that team is so stupid to camp in a well with stability or consistent moving into the fearwall. that is a l2p issue and a single issue how u choose ur fightground.

ur other boths arguments are clearly a l2p issue too. if u let your enemy stay on range and spam range attack its your fault and not his.

the next goes to your change.. so u complain the whole time about AOE Condition!!! and ur answer as team was that u are immun against conditons and warrior with cleansing ire.. so 2 of 5 has picked something as counter.. interesting, another l2p issue..

the big difference between conditions and stuns is u can act during the condition ticks.. so my advice would be to move ur kitten and stop that apply of conditions and maybe using conditionremove more smartly.

cc is op not cause u can cc.. its op cause it shuts down every ppl that hasnt enough stunbreaks and even then its just a delay of time when the chain starts.. a necro cant fearchain xxxx hours.

but i stop the discussion with u.. u are not willing to see that the amount of cc, the duration and the frequency makes it op.. esp if u already has enough counter to conditions. another reason is u start to act emotional with ur assault i should change my build. in difference to u i hasnt complained about conditionsspam, nor im using cc chains or streaming my build via twitch with always the same teamcompisiton until the next patch without adjustments to the opponent. im smart enough to press “B” before the battle starts and pick my traits and utilities depending on my enemy. if i know enemy applies aoe conditions via marks then i try to coordinate my attack with other to different angles and hold distance to my mates. all l2p and adjustment..

ur answer is still the same op spam against op spam while other op spam isnt affected.. thats truly the way balancing should go. and our “pro” teams and u clearly shows how “pro” they are. qq and defending op, but at the same dont forget to mention that your runs prop. a necro too who spams conditions.. at least defektives team runs a necro and engi who spams condition.

i guess 1 team with waterele and maybe shoutwarrior beats u all if they are effective in spamming like u.

if u start to argument that u cant see the difference between the marks or walls by the animation that is your problem and a l2p issue too. i has suggested months ago that a castbar would prevent such problems with same animations and graphical cluster. but pros like u has negleted my suggestions cause ppl would not require so much skill. so i guess now comes it all back.. the sum is u need 1 op to beat other stuff cause u miss the skill! and cause u cant admit that u start to defend that..
i guess all backstabthiefs was still right and anet who nerfed them was always wrong… pick more examples if u need.

hooma.9642:

cc is op not cause u can cc.. its op cause it shuts down every ppl that hasnt enough stunbreaks and even then its just a delay of time when the chain starts.. a necro cant fearchain xxxx hours.

These necro tears are simply delicious. Please go on and tell me about how unfortunate you are to not trait for stability because it would wreck your AoE condi spam.

Brutal Arts.6307:

hooma.9642:

cc is op not cause u can cc.. its op cause it shuts down every ppl that hasnt enough stunbreaks and even then its just a delay of time when the chain starts.. a necro cant fearchain xxxx hours.

These necro tears are simply delicious. Please go on and tell me about how unfortunate you are to not trait for stability because it would wreck your AoE condi spam.

how comes that u think im playing necro??? does that illusion makes ur argument cc is not op true or why u start to disrubt an objectiv discussion with emotional bullkitten?

or should that be a puzzle and i shall estimate ur braincells or iq?

Your argument has hardly any legs to stand on.
Warrior CC isn’t spammed and they work best on rotations. Half of those skills are on high cooldowns (Shieldbash, Tremor, Backbreaker and Staggering Blow), they also have obvious animations and thus can easily be dodged, blocked or blinded. Earthshaker and Skullcrack (while potentially on very low cds) also depend on the amount of adrenaline gained and are much less effective without full adrenaline.
Warriors have to factor in all of the above plus, stunbreakers and stability if they want to effectively stunlock someone.

On top of all that Warriors have to put themselves right in the line of fire in order to be able to attempt to carry them out in the first place, making it a high risk manouever.

As pointed out above this is a completely different situation to ranged condition spamming and in my opionion the same would apply to burst spamming out of stealth (thief) or swarming you with pets while spamming auto attacks from distance paired with evades/teleports on weaponskills when they get close? (ranger/mesmer).

There are multiple counters to warrior CCs:
precautionary – blinds, kiting, stability
active – dodges and blocks
reactive – stun breakers which can be followed by any of the above.

How is this the same situation as with the accessibility of massive condition pressure and the limited accessibilty to its only hard counter – condi cleanse.

Besides that, for the longest time warriors had to try and balance their offensive potential with all the defensive capabilities they could get hold of just to be able to get into the fight, at which point they were still at high risk and considered a free kill by almost everyone (even other warriors). Utilityslots and even weapon slot are usually filled with defensive skills like stunbreakers, condi cleanses and whatever else they can get their hands on to make sure they get into the fight in the first place and then don’t get killed instantly. It’s only fair they can finally bring something to the table that forces the other classes to also consider counterplays.

hooma.9642:

Brutal Arts.6307:

hooma.9642:

cc is op not cause u can cc.. its op cause it shuts down every ppl that hasnt enough stunbreaks and even then its just a delay of time when the chain starts.. a necro cant fearchain xxxx hours.

These necro tears are simply delicious. Please go on and tell me about how unfortunate you are to not trait for stability because it would wreck your AoE condi spam.

how comes that u think im playing necro??? does that illusion makes ur argument cc is not op true or why u start to disrubt an objectiv discussion with emotional bullkitten?

or should that be a puzzle and i shall estimate ur braincells or iq?

I wouldn’t throw around arguments about intelligence when you’re typing lik dis u guy huheuheue.

That aside, if you are getting chain stunned by anyone you only have yourself to blame. Stun Break, Dodge, Stability, Blind. If you’re getting chain stunned by a warrior you’re not doing one of these things. If all of those options were on cool down than guess what, you got outplayed.

Maybe the warriors team mate softened you up, maybe you were getting focused down, maybe you’re just terrible at reading a warriors obvious animations. But if you get to the point where you’re stunned by a build specializing in stuns and you can’t break free because you have no stunbreaks/stability, your crying is about as foolish as complaining that staff ele aoe is too o/p because you couldn’t be bothered to move out of the circles.

so mace/mace or mace/shield has 3 cc and hammer 3. 6 possible cc to chain. some with higher cooldown. some not. mace f1 is possible all ca. 71/2 seconds if i remember right. so using sigel or paralyzation brings u to 31/2 seconds to fill to use mace f1 again. if that isnt spam what is it then?

the rest of ur argumentation is invalid.. wanna know why? ask our pros they will tell u that the game isnt balanced 1vs1 its should be balanced 5vs5.. a single water ele can aoe clear 3-4 conditions all 9 seconds with attunment swap alone. if that isnt a counter to conditionspam i dont know.

do u guys expect that a counter means u get 0 conditons or 0secs duration?

Brutal Arts.6307:

hooma.9642:

Brutal Arts.6307:

hooma.9642:

cc is op not cause u can cc.. its op cause it shuts down every ppl that hasnt enough stunbreaks and even then its just a delay of time when the chain starts.. a necro cant fearchain xxxx hours.

These necro tears are simply delicious. Please go on and tell me about how unfortunate you are to not trait for stability because it would wreck your AoE condi spam.

how comes that u think im playing necro??? does that illusion makes ur argument cc is not op true or why u start to disrubt an objectiv discussion with emotional bullkitten?

or should that be a puzzle and i shall estimate ur braincells or iq?

I wouldn’t throw around arguments about intelligence when you’re typing lik dis u guy huheuheue.

That aside, if you are getting chain stunned by anyone you only have yourself to blame. Stun Break, Dodge, Stability, Blind. If you’re getting chain stunned by a warrior you’re not doing one of these things. If all of those options were on cool down than guess what, you got outplayed.

Maybe the warriors team mate softened you up, maybe you were getting focused down, maybe you’re just terrible at reading a warriors obvious animations. But if you get to the point where you’re stunned by a build specializing in stuns and you can’t break free because you have no stunbreaks/stability, your crying is about as foolish as complaining that staff ele aoe is too o/p because you couldn’t be bothered to move out of the circles.

ok u get a response unaware how stupid u seem to be. thanks for pointing out that english isnt my motherlanguage, but i guess u can understand.

so i got outplayed by a warrior if i loose. ok maybe u should pick ur brother in mind defektive and show me as a normal ranger how u defend yourself against a cc warrior with ur blinds and that many stunbreakers or dodges a normal not bunker spirit ranger has. maybe i change my mind if u manage to beat him under that circumstances.

your complete argumentation is invalid. u try to argument that cc is needed to counter condition spam. but cc is a counter to everything and in that amount atm op. there is also no need to always refer to necs or engis or condition spam. dont know u all dont want accept that. esp if i follow ur argument u demand that i choose my counter to cc wisely but neglate the use of conditionremoval wisely.

Warrior always had the cc capability with mace. The real benefit that wars got, which nobody seems to be talking about actually makes this build viable now.

kurtdg.2370:

Warrior always had the cc capability with mace. The real benefit that wars got, which nobody seems to be talking about actually makes this build viable now.

yeah but the duration got buffed 1 whole second..

i remember the time s/d got a nerf cause they could dazechain some. thats nearly the same story.

I agree to disagree. If you’re speaking about a team fight, the same situation applies for CC, a guardian can use shouts with stunbreakers to get you out and give you stability, your team mates can blind the warrior and focus him down. I have a feeling were running in circles here.

And not I don’t consider skills on 30, 25 and 20s cooldowns spammable in a situatin where you swap weapons every 5. If you want cooldown reductions on those you need to heavily invest into the Defense tree, which lowers your overall damage output significantly. (it is also more advisable to use other traits there) In oder to get burst skills on a 7 1/2 cd you need to invest another 30 points into Discipline, effectively giving you 10 more points which you pretty much have to invest into unsuspecting foe, in order to give you a half decent chance at benefitting from the crit damage you just heavily invested in, BUT only as long as your opponent is stunned, not knockbacked, not knocked down, not dazed.

So there’s a lot of sacrifice in order to get into the situation in the first place.

yeah but ur team cant help u all 71/2 seconds. that investment is it worth in a teamfight to lock a target to bring it down.

i agree that a cc chain warrior in a teamfight maybe isnt that op if the same isnt running the other cheese. but atm it is. even pro teams consist of cheese. engiconditonspam, necro and cc warrior. nothing different to other teams.

but u need to agree that the smaller the battle goes the more op the warrior comes.