Guild Wars 2

I loved Guild Wars PVP. I was quite seriously into it at one point. I like PVP in general, and I like ArenaNet’s logical normalization of PVP. That said, sPVP is dishearteningly undesirable right now.

Why:

1. Capture Point is boring. – Capture Point is one of the least beloved modes of PVP out there for mmorpgs. It’s not horrible, but it’s often meh, and often bad. Capture Point was easily the worst part of GW1 PVP. It’s better in the sequel, but not improved enough to be the only option available.

It is also a game type that lends itself to being repetitive. Tactics are determined by the map, and the maps do not change in the same way players and builds can change and grow. As well, “holding” builds are weighted heavily to the point where other types of builds that do other things, even if well made, simply do not have a place. So, you have the same strategies over and over, the same types of builds over and over, and then you have a small selection of the same four maps over and over.

I was already tiring of it at the end of beta. It’s simply mind numbing after two weeks of launch play.

2. Balance isn’t ready. – Downed skills, Underwater Combat, AI behavior and how so many classes have pets/AI dependency. It’s really frustrating. PVPers want more direct control over what they’re doing, not secondary control through AI, and they want to fight other players, and not their pets.

2a. Downed State. – It has never felt like it belongs. It adds new strategies and points of contention, but it is basing those things around someone losing. The fact that the player killed* becomes the most important player goes against the heart of PVP.

*Yes, according to GW2s rules, the player is not killed, but the player has been defeated, and is otherwise dead in any other game. Downed is the same as Killed in this respect.

3. No good option for solo queues and no real ranking system. – I wonder if I should title this point “Hot Join is a Hot Mess.” From what the ANet developers have said, they saw hotjoin as their public play option that would give people a chance to play for fun, and a chance to learn the pvp game, and then form up with other PVPers they meet.

That plan has absolutely failed.

Hot Join may be capture point, but its nothing like Tournament Play. Hot Join is a zerg, where playing like you would for Tournament play is actually less effective than just going around killing. All the things that matter in Tournament, don’t have a place in Hot Join. It’s just an unfun mess. It’s not even useful for build testing because of this.

Free Tournament mode should be the spot between real team tournaments and Hot Join, but its plagued by pub stomping and people grinding for Glory to rank up in a system that doesn’t even matter. If there’s matchmaking being done then it’s being done poorly. My rank seems to be a reflection of attrition and not in line with any sense of where you are in the game’s level of competition.

4. It looks and feels like it’s in Beta. – The Hot Join server selection screen is jarringly basic in comparison to the menus and features of every other part of the game. It’s a plain list of games going on, with minimal info, minimal flourish, and little purpose.

Meanwhile, tournament rewards are delivered to you by crippled turtles if delivered at all.

Just so much of the sPVP part of the game feels unpolished and rudimentary. There’s a lot of detail and touches in the rest of the game. sPVP feels more cheaply made in comparison.

Speak for yourself, you do not represent the PvP community.

I like capture the point, a lot more than capture the flag and what have you.

A variety of gametypes would be nice for hot joins. I understand that they wanted to keep it to one gametype in tourneys so it would be easier to balance. I feel like arenanet has a lot more planned for this game, so I’m going to be patient and see how things develop. Its definitely the funniest game I’ve played in a while.

And good ol’ warsong gulch was always my favorite from BC to Cata.

Vandal.8029:

And good ol’ warsong gulch was always my favorite from BC to Cata.

Resto druids were op from bc to wrath, PvE geared i could stil solo run steal the flag and be back at base with full mana and health, was amusing to do lol.

Hot join is really nothing but a zergfest and it’s because of the way the points are balanced. Having a skirmish bonus may be nice if your roamer catches someone off guard in a tourney match but in hot join it just means 15 points for every kill not at a capture point, not to mention you get the same bonus for geting that kill as an assault or defend bonus on the point depending on who has control of it.

Vandal.8029:

A variety of gametypes would be nice for hot joins. I understand that they wanted to keep it to one gametype in tourneys so it would be easier to balance. I feel like arenanet has a lot more planned for this game, so I’m going to be patient and see how things develop. Its definitely the funniest game I’ve played in a while.

And good ol’ warsong gulch was always my favorite from BC to Cata.

Another gametype is needed for tournament play as well. ANet is scared that a large amount will bail from Cap Point Tournies if they introduce a new mode, but if that threat is true then it means people really don’t want Cap Point.

“The fact that the player killed* becomes the most important player goes against the heart of PVP.” …in your opinion what exactly is the “heart” of pvp? When I think of good pvp I think of a game that requires people to work together as a team to accomplish the objective. The downed state only encourages team work.

As far as game modes go, it would be nice to see some variety. I do like capture points but it gets old when you are playing slight variations of capture points over and over. I’d like to see capture the flag and would love to see Anet get really creative with it. Throw in a objective mode no one’s ever seen before.

I don’t think sPVP is bad by any means, but I have to agree that out of everything in the game it seems like sPVP was given the least attention. One thing that bothers me is EVERYTHING in the game rewards you with xp except sPVP. I like to feel like I’m making progress no matter what I’m doing in gw2 and I just don’t feel like I’m making any real progress when I play sPVP.

Post is a complete waste of time. Nothing is valid.

Porphyria:

There is teamwork invovled, but teamwork is a part of the whole match. So it does fit within the teamwork theme. The issue is that PVP has a flow to it, and downed state interrupts that flow. It also rewards being defeated and that particularly doesn’t feel right in PVP.

In Guild Wars, Hall of Heroes/Tombs/Whatever, had the final map and winner determined by a Guild Lord NPC capping a shrine point. For much of the tournament, combat and matches were won and lost based on combat, teamwork, and the whole of everything brought to the match. Guild Lord capping turned victory into a matter of interrupt chaining Guild Lords so they don’t cap. Suddenly, tournament winners were decided by one type of skill. It wasn’t all that good, and it interrupted the flow and nature of the entire tournament.

People complained. Things never felt right because of the mechanic. Eventually, ANet wisened up and changed Halls to a different type of win scenario that wasn’t based solely around interrupts. The game was better for it. Downed State is that same annoying Halls mechanic repeated over and over. =/

game released 28(25)/08/2012.
give them time till 01/10/2012, a month will be passed and maybe they will upgrade pvp.
they focused more attention in pve and wvwvw to attract mmorpg players, and i think pve and wvwvw are wonderful. i am a pvp player, i feel i can stll play this mode for another 2 weeks, then i will pretend some love for the pvp part of the game.

let’s wait. don’t you think so?

I couldn’t agree more with the OP. Some folks are quick to jump in, say its all rubbish, and defend the game, but read around and there are more than enough people saying the same things to know its a problem.

I’ve seen this in other games, TOR being a recent example. Lots of folks complaining about the PvP in the forums, folks try to diminish their POV and brush them off as the “forum minority,” but in the end the game – starting with its PvP – started to die off.

I really hope something is done, because I don’t want to see what could be a really great game lost to some of these silly imperfections.

guttermessiah.6350:

Post is a complete waste of time. Nothing is valid.

If you speak of your own post, then you’re right. But I feel the pubstomp in free tournies due to PUGs vs. 5-mans to be extremely vaild, for starters.

You can have a revive mechanic WITHOUT downed state, guys. You can still promote teamwork without having jarring, annoying systems like downed state that reward poor play, and/or punish/don’t reward good play.

Agreed with all of the points the OP makes. Need more game-types, and 8v8 really shouldn’t be here. It’s not even a good way to practice for tournaments or anything else since it’s just a zergfest. I don’t really understand its place in the game. That said, if you want 5v5 you can solo-queue for tournies, but then you run into guild 5-mans that just stomp your PUG’s face. Isn’t that why they let parties get autobalanced in 8v8?

Blazer Hellsing.9184:

Speak for yourself, you do not represent the PvP community.

I like capture the point, a lot more than capture the flag and what have you.

Exactly, this pvp is way better than anything else out there.

etiolate.9185:

3. No good option for solo queues and no real ranking system. – I wonder if I should title this point “Hot Join is a Hot Mess.” From what the ANet developers have said, they saw hotjoin as their public play option that would give people a chance to play for fun, and a chance to learn the pvp game, and then form up with other PVPers they meet.

That plan has absolutely failed.

Hot Join may be capture point, but its nothing like Tournament Play. Hot Join is a zerg, where playing like you would for Tournament play is actually less effective than just going around killing. All the things that matter in Tournament, don’t have a place in Hot Join. It’s just an unfun mess. It’s not even useful for build testing because of this.

I agree with this point. Hot Join is definitely a Hot Mess.

You may join and just get zerged repeatedly by the other team and wonder where the hell your team is – oh that’s right, they’re dead because there’s an 8 man army running from point to point. Or you may enter a losing match midway through. Or you’re on a team with less players than the other. Or you (and this has happened several times today in a row) get thrown into an empty server with a half played game by yourself.

There is the occasional run of smaller fun games that end up only have 4 or 5 players on a side, but the larger games are never fun, and ending up in one of these lucky fun games requires far too much frustration and luck with all the other crappy situations.

Maybe you finally get a good streak where you’re having fun for a few games in a row, your team is decent and you’re doing well personally and having fun. But then because no one likes losing, people start leaving the enemy team and you eventually get auto balanced to the opposite side and want to punch someone. On top of a broken system that brings more crappy unbalanced games than actually fun ones, getting one good one finally and then being moved to the losing team mid-match, makes me so mad I can’t even tell you.

So much frustration and just quitting the GW2 client altogether because I just can’t have fun with Hot Join. It needs so much work, it’s appalling.