Logic behind losing or gaining rating points?

Logic behind losing or gaining rating points?

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Posted by: Burjis.3087

Burjis.3087

So far, I haven’t figured out the logic that the game uses to determine how much rating points should it deduce from players when they lose or give them when they win.
My assumption has always been that it compares the average or total rating of my team against the enemy’s and it calculates the final points subtracted from, or added to each team based on the difference of the initial total/average ratings.

However it seems to me that I usually lose more points when I lose than gain them when I win (I’m at the bottom tier of the gold division). Asking some other players, most of them seem to report something similar.
It seems to me, that advancing up the ladder is almost impossible for me unless I have a win rate of above 70% based on the amount of points I lose and gain.

Any ideas.

Everlasting Sacred Path [ESP] (www.espguild.com)

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Posted by: Cynz.9437

Cynz.9437

I think it is your personal rating vs overall rating of enemy team. You notice it if you queue with someone higher or lower than your rating – you will gain different amount of points.

I think what is really wrong about it is that game doesn’t consider that you often have to carry players way below your rating vs players of your or even higher rating (yes, it is a thing, did some research on players i get in my matches). So not only you are put in matches you are guaranteed to lose, the game also thinks that you had fair match and deduces points accordingly.

I can kind of understand that it is to prevent MM manipulation (e.g. queue with lower rank to get easier matches and still gain same amount of points) BUT as long as matchmaking doesn’t provide fair matches (which it simply doesn’t, apparently overall rating difference of 50-300 is acceptable) i think it should at least somehow consider set up of your team and not just your personal rating.

All is Vain~
[Teef] guild :>

(edited by Cynz.9437)

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Posted by: Phineas Poe.3018

Phineas Poe.3018

It seems to me, that advancing up the ladder is almost impossible for me unless I have a win rate of above 70% based on the amount of points I lose and gain.

Just curious, but why do you think you should advance up the ladder without winning at least 2 out of every 3 games?

That you have to have a win rate of 70% or better to advance up the ladder is kind of the point; if you’re hovering around a 50% win rate, you’re probably exactly where you should be.

[EG] Ethereal Guardians

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Posted by: Burjis.3087

Burjis.3087

That 70% was just an estimated figure. Although 2 out of 3 game is 66% anyway and not very different.
I was still not moving upward when my win rating was close to 60%. Besides, I should expect to be fighting easier matches if I go down the ladder, or harder enemies when I team up with a person in platinum. That so far hasn’t been the case.

Everlasting Sacred Path [ESP] (www.espguild.com)

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Posted by: Cynz.9437

Cynz.9437

It seems to me, that advancing up the ladder is almost impossible for me unless I have a win rate of above 70% based on the amount of points I lose and gain.

Just curious, but why do you think you should advance up the ladder without winning at least 2 out of every 3 games?

That you have to have a win rate of 70% or better to advance up the ladder is kind of the point; if you’re hovering around a 50% win rate, you’re probably exactly where you should be.

You assume that matchmaking creates fair matches LOL. Newsflash: it doesn’t. Of course, game can’t measure all player skills but it doesn’t even attempt to create fair matches based on measurable numbers like MMR and rating….

All is Vain~
[Teef] guild :>

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Posted by: Wolfric.9380

Wolfric.9380

I encounter the same. A 60% winrate is not enough to advance. OK maybe a bit. Over 150 matches and propably a total of +30 points…. And i have the feeling that i will easily stand my groung a division higher. It´s heavy grinding after bad placement. I don´t think i am platin or higher but when it´s like easymode against 4 out of 5 oponents but matches are lost by teammates feeding or camping close it feels very bad….

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Posted by: Gwaihir.1745

Gwaihir.1745

I find t3 gold much harder than t1 gold. Still winning around 70% rate, been in plat a couple times. Then dropped to t1 gold again since I stopped carin. And qued with a bronze dude for lolz.

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Posted by: NeXeD.3042

NeXeD.3042

havent played in a few days due to work but i was in the highest tier gold before decay…. did it with a little over 60% and let me add this i havent been playing meta builds….. lol ive even played chrono rune gs well necro and have won pretty hard.

Attention Moderators I am not
S P E E D Starr #0 Necro NA or
I Am NeXeD awful d/D ele NA

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Posted by: Phineas Poe.3018

Phineas Poe.3018

It seems to me, that advancing up the ladder is almost impossible for me unless I have a win rate of above 70% based on the amount of points I lose and gain.

Just curious, but why do you think you should advance up the ladder without winning at least 2 out of every 3 games?

That you have to have a win rate of 70% or better to advance up the ladder is kind of the point; if you’re hovering around a 50% win rate, you’re probably exactly where you should be.

You assume that matchmaking creates fair matches LOL. Newsflash: it doesn’t. Of course, game can’t measure all player skills but it doesn’t even attempt to create fair matches based on measurable numbers like MMR and rating….

Why do you think the system creates unfair matches? What makes them so?

[EG] Ethereal Guardians

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Posted by: BloodriverTim.2031

BloodriverTim.2031

It seems to me, that advancing up the ladder is almost impossible for me unless I have a win rate of above 70% based on the amount of points I lose and gain.

Just curious, but why do you think you should advance up the ladder without winning at least 2 out of every 3 games?

That you have to have a win rate of 70% or better to advance up the ladder is kind of the point; if you’re hovering around a 50% win rate, you’re probably exactly where you should be.

You assume that matchmaking creates fair matches LOL. Newsflash: it doesn’t. Of course, game can’t measure all player skills but it doesn’t even attempt to create fair matches based on measurable numbers like MMR and rating….

Why do you think the system creates unfair matches? What makes them so?

I’ve seen several instances personally where if I win more than three or four in a row, I go on a losing streak of about the same. The matchmaking wants to keep you at a 50% winrate and will do what it needs to in order to achieve that. Of the last 20 games, maybe 3 have been close in point spread at the end; the rest have been blowouts either win or loss. When I say blowout, I mean the losing team loses by 200+ points. This seems to be the standard for the season for most people from what I hear.

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Posted by: Phineas Poe.3018

Phineas Poe.3018

I’ve seen several instances personally where if I win more than three or four in a row, I go on a losing streak of about the same. The matchmaking wants to keep you at a 50% winrate and will do what it needs to in order to achieve that.

I see this fairly often around here. You claim to deserve the wins you get, but the losses are simply out of your control. Did you maybe stop to consider that you just happened to get overconfident with your win streaks or get tilted during your losing streaks? Or is personal accountability just not a factor of success in your mind?

There is no need for a forced 50/50 algorithm with a glicko rating system, and the leaderboard is filled with players with >75% win rates with over 100 games played.

I don’t know if you follow sports, but teams go on winning and losing streaks all the time, even one after another. It’s not uncommon for teams to win 3-4 games in a row and then lose the same number, and most teams gravitating toward .500 over the course of a season is a representation of parity and general competition level, not “unfairness.” And let’s face it: not everyone can be the Chicago Blackhawks. That doesn’t mean the system is broken; it just makes their achievement that much more impressive—the same as those sitting in the top 250 with a >75% win rate.

I personally am sitting with a ~52% win rate myself, but that isn’t anything because of some forced algorithm but probably that I belong in the range I’m sitting in and no higher (1700-1800), combined with the fact that I am literally spamming games for dyes/gifts/gold.

I hold no delusions about my skill level being any more than that, but it appears some around here are uncomfortable accepting that they perhaps belong in gold or silver and no higher.

Edit: Sorry for the late edits. Hit submit too early.

[EG] Ethereal Guardians

(edited by Phineas Poe.3018)

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Posted by: NeXeD.3042

NeXeD.3042

It seems to me, that advancing up the ladder is almost impossible for me unless I have a win rate of above 70% based on the amount of points I lose and gain.

Just curious, but why do you think you should advance up the ladder without winning at least 2 out of every 3 games?

That you have to have a win rate of 70% or better to advance up the ladder is kind of the point; if you’re hovering around a 50% win rate, you’re probably exactly where you should be.

You assume that matchmaking creates fair matches LOL. Newsflash: it doesn’t. Of course, game can’t measure all player skills but it doesn’t even attempt to create fair matches based on measurable numbers like MMR and rating….

Why do you think the system creates unfair matches? What makes them so?

I’ve seen several instances personally where if I win more than three or four in a row, I go on a losing streak of about the same. The matchmaking wants to keep you at a 50% winrate and will do what it needs to in order to achieve that. Of the last 20 games, maybe 3 have been close in point spread at the end; the rest have been blowouts either win or loss. When I say blowout, I mean the losing team loses by 200+ points. This seems to be the standard for the season for most people from what I hear.

Please explain how ive managed a 60% career winrate

Attention Moderators I am not
S P E E D Starr #0 Necro NA or
I Am NeXeD awful d/D ele NA

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Posted by: Cynz.9437

Cynz.9437

It seems to me, that advancing up the ladder is almost impossible for me unless I have a win rate of above 70% based on the amount of points I lose and gain.

Just curious, but why do you think you should advance up the ladder without winning at least 2 out of every 3 games?

That you have to have a win rate of 70% or better to advance up the ladder is kind of the point; if you’re hovering around a 50% win rate, you’re probably exactly where you should be.

You assume that matchmaking creates fair matches LOL. Newsflash: it doesn’t. Of course, game can’t measure all player skills but it doesn’t even attempt to create fair matches based on measurable numbers like MMR and rating….

Why do you think the system creates unfair matches? What makes them so?

If MM can’t find people in same range within a min it just throws anything it can find in a match which results in absolutely lopsided matches for the sake of short queue times.

I had matches with/below 1700 players + me 1887 on my team vs people in 1800-1900+ range on enemy team during prime time. Take a guess how it went. I also have been in matches with double duoq of top 5 players (2100) vs 1800 team #workingasintended.

All is Vain~
[Teef] guild :>

(edited by Cynz.9437)

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Posted by: BloodriverTim.2031

BloodriverTim.2031

It seems to me, that advancing up the ladder is almost impossible for me unless I have a win rate of above 70% based on the amount of points I lose and gain.

Just curious, but why do you think you should advance up the ladder without winning at least 2 out of every 3 games?

That you have to have a win rate of 70% or better to advance up the ladder is kind of the point; if you’re hovering around a 50% win rate, you’re probably exactly where you should be.

You assume that matchmaking creates fair matches LOL. Newsflash: it doesn’t. Of course, game can’t measure all player skills but it doesn’t even attempt to create fair matches based on measurable numbers like MMR and rating….

Why do you think the system creates unfair matches? What makes them so?

I’ve seen several instances personally where if I win more than three or four in a row, I go on a losing streak of about the same. The matchmaking wants to keep you at a 50% winrate and will do what it needs to in order to achieve that. Of the last 20 games, maybe 3 have been close in point spread at the end; the rest have been blowouts either win or loss. When I say blowout, I mean the losing team loses by 200+ points. This seems to be the standard for the season for most people from what I hear.

Please explain how ive managed a 60% career winrate

I don’t get why I’m getting flamed. This is how the system works whether or not you want to believe it. You can manage a better than 50/50 by not playing enough games, which would cause you to still be below your true placement.

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Posted by: Lordrosicky.5813

Lordrosicky.5813

I think it is your personal rating vs overall rating of enemy team. You notice it if you queue with someone higher or lower than your rating – you will gain different amount of points.

I think what is really wrong about it is that game doesn’t consider that you often have to carry players way below your rating vs players of your or even higher rating (yes, it is a thing, did some research on players i get in my matches). So not only you are put in matches you are guaranteed to lose, the game also thinks that you had fair match and deduces points accordingly.

I can kind of understand that it is to prevent MM manipulation (e.g. queue with lower rank to get easier matches and still gain same amount of points) BUT as long as matchmaking doesn’t provide fair matches (which it simply doesn’t, apparently overall rating difference of 50-300 is acceptable) i think it should at least somehow consider set up of your team and not just your personal rating.

It is true. Sometimes it will pop and be 5 people 1850-1900 and we will be vs 2 duo queues of people rated 2000+. It makes no sense.

Character: Henry rank million/Duke Henry
Necromancer/Casual Warrior
[Team] Best WvW guild of all time. EASILY.

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Posted by: Lordrosicky.5813

Lordrosicky.5813

It seems to me, that advancing up the ladder is almost impossible for me unless I have a win rate of above 70% based on the amount of points I lose and gain.

Just curious, but why do you think you should advance up the ladder without winning at least 2 out of every 3 games?

That you have to have a win rate of 70% or better to advance up the ladder is kind of the point; if you’re hovering around a 50% win rate, you’re probably exactly where you should be.

You assume that matchmaking creates fair matches LOL. Newsflash: it doesn’t. Of course, game can’t measure all player skills but it doesn’t even attempt to create fair matches based on measurable numbers like MMR and rating….

Why do you think the system creates unfair matches? What makes them so?

If MM can’t find people in same range within a min it just throws anything it can find in a match which results in absolutely lopsided matches for the sake of short queue times.

I had matches with/below 1700 players + me 1887 on my team vs people in 1800-1900+ range on enemy team during prime time. Take a guess how it went. I also have been in matches with double duoq of top 5 players (2100) vs 1800 team #workingasintended.

I have had what you said at the end too. Many times. It is almost as if sync queueing is back again and the rosters are not defined when the 10 players are collected. That is the only explanation. I think it puts people into teams then tries to match those teams.

What it should do is collect 10 players and then divide into fair mmr teams. It sucks that it fails at doing this.

Character: Henry rank million/Duke Henry
Necromancer/Casual Warrior
[Team] Best WvW guild of all time. EASILY.

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Posted by: NeXeD.3042

NeXeD.3042

It seems to me, that advancing up the ladder is almost impossible for me unless I have a win rate of above 70% based on the amount of points I lose and gain.

Just curious, but why do you think you should advance up the ladder without winning at least 2 out of every 3 games?

That you have to have a win rate of 70% or better to advance up the ladder is kind of the point; if you’re hovering around a 50% win rate, you’re probably exactly where you should be.

You assume that matchmaking creates fair matches LOL. Newsflash: it doesn’t. Of course, game can’t measure all player skills but it doesn’t even attempt to create fair matches based on measurable numbers like MMR and rating….

Why do you think the system creates unfair matches? What makes them so?

I’ve seen several instances personally where if I win more than three or four in a row, I go on a losing streak of about the same. The matchmaking wants to keep you at a 50% winrate and will do what it needs to in order to achieve that. Of the last 20 games, maybe 3 have been close in point spread at the end; the rest have been blowouts either win or loss. When I say blowout, I mean the losing team loses by 200+ points. This seems to be the standard for the season for most people from what I hear.

Please explain how ive managed a 60% career winrate

I don’t get why I’m getting flamed. This is how the system works whether or not you want to believe it. You can manage a better than 50/50 by not playing enough games, which would cause you to still be below your true placement.

im not flaming you, and i have a decent amount of career games……. Im not sure if you are complaining about having a 50% winrate or complaining that the system forces you into a 50% winrate… however i and quite a few others have managed to maintain over a 60% winrate. How exactly is that possible if the system forces you to have a 50% winrate.

Attention Moderators I am not
S P E E D Starr #0 Necro NA or
I Am NeXeD awful d/D ele NA

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Posted by: BloodriverTim.2031

BloodriverTim.2031

It seems to me, that advancing up the ladder is almost impossible for me unless I have a win rate of above 70% based on the amount of points I lose and gain.

Just curious, but why do you think you should advance up the ladder without winning at least 2 out of every 3 games?

That you have to have a win rate of 70% or better to advance up the ladder is kind of the point; if you’re hovering around a 50% win rate, you’re probably exactly where you should be.

You assume that matchmaking creates fair matches LOL. Newsflash: it doesn’t. Of course, game can’t measure all player skills but it doesn’t even attempt to create fair matches based on measurable numbers like MMR and rating….

Why do you think the system creates unfair matches? What makes them so?

I’ve seen several instances personally where if I win more than three or four in a row, I go on a losing streak of about the same. The matchmaking wants to keep you at a 50% winrate and will do what it needs to in order to achieve that. Of the last 20 games, maybe 3 have been close in point spread at the end; the rest have been blowouts either win or loss. When I say blowout, I mean the losing team loses by 200+ points. This seems to be the standard for the season for most people from what I hear.

Please explain how ive managed a 60% career winrate

I don’t get why I’m getting flamed. This is how the system works whether or not you want to believe it. You can manage a better than 50/50 by not playing enough games, which would cause you to still be below your true placement.

im not flaming you, and i have a decent amount of career games……. Im not sure if you are complaining about having a 50% winrate or complaining that the system forces you into a 50% winrate… however i and quite a few others have managed to maintain over a 60% winrate. How exactly is that possible if the system forces you to have a 50% winrate.

The new system tries to get you to 50% winrate. The old system made winning players win more and losing players lose more. As you play more games in this new system. You will trend toward 50%, or be at the top of the leaderboards.

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Posted by: NeXeD.3042

NeXeD.3042

It seems to me, that advancing up the ladder is almost impossible for me unless I have a win rate of above 70% based on the amount of points I lose and gain.

Just curious, but why do you think you should advance up the ladder without winning at least 2 out of every 3 games?

That you have to have a win rate of 70% or better to advance up the ladder is kind of the point; if you’re hovering around a 50% win rate, you’re probably exactly where you should be.

You assume that matchmaking creates fair matches LOL. Newsflash: it doesn’t. Of course, game can’t measure all player skills but it doesn’t even attempt to create fair matches based on measurable numbers like MMR and rating….

Why do you think the system creates unfair matches? What makes them so?

I’ve seen several instances personally where if I win more than three or four in a row, I go on a losing streak of about the same. The matchmaking wants to keep you at a 50% winrate and will do what it needs to in order to achieve that. Of the last 20 games, maybe 3 have been close in point spread at the end; the rest have been blowouts either win or loss. When I say blowout, I mean the losing team loses by 200+ points. This seems to be the standard for the season for most people from what I hear.

Please explain how ive managed a 60% career winrate

I don’t get why I’m getting flamed. This is how the system works whether or not you want to believe it. You can manage a better than 50/50 by not playing enough games, which would cause you to still be below your true placement.

im not flaming you, and i have a decent amount of career games……. Im not sure if you are complaining about having a 50% winrate or complaining that the system forces you into a 50% winrate… however i and quite a few others have managed to maintain over a 60% winrate. How exactly is that possible if the system forces you to have a 50% winrate.

The new system tries to get you to 50% winrate. The old system made winning players win more and losing players lose more. As you play more games in this new system. You will trend toward 50%, or be at the top of the leaderboards.

Wrong. My winrate is career and i started very shortly after the start of the game. Please show me proof the “Old” system made winners win and losers lose?

I know what you think you are talking about but im pretty sure what your talking about was only during 1 or 2 seasons total. Yet this game has been using glicko2 since launch.

If you did trend to 50% and stay there, id say you belong there.

Attention Moderators I am not
S P E E D Starr #0 Necro NA or
I Am NeXeD awful d/D ele NA

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Posted by: BloodriverTim.2031

BloodriverTim.2031

It seems to me, that advancing up the ladder is almost impossible for me unless I have a win rate of above 70% based on the amount of points I lose and gain.

Just curious, but why do you think you should advance up the ladder without winning at least 2 out of every 3 games?

That you have to have a win rate of 70% or better to advance up the ladder is kind of the point; if you’re hovering around a 50% win rate, you’re probably exactly where you should be.

You assume that matchmaking creates fair matches LOL. Newsflash: it doesn’t. Of course, game can’t measure all player skills but it doesn’t even attempt to create fair matches based on measurable numbers like MMR and rating….

Why do you think the system creates unfair matches? What makes them so?

I’ve seen several instances personally where if I win more than three or four in a row, I go on a losing streak of about the same. The matchmaking wants to keep you at a 50% winrate and will do what it needs to in order to achieve that. Of the last 20 games, maybe 3 have been close in point spread at the end; the rest have been blowouts either win or loss. When I say blowout, I mean the losing team loses by 200+ points. This seems to be the standard for the season for most people from what I hear.

Please explain how ive managed a 60% career winrate

I don’t get why I’m getting flamed. This is how the system works whether or not you want to believe it. You can manage a better than 50/50 by not playing enough games, which would cause you to still be below your true placement.

im not flaming you, and i have a decent amount of career games……. Im not sure if you are complaining about having a 50% winrate or complaining that the system forces you into a 50% winrate… however i and quite a few others have managed to maintain over a 60% winrate. How exactly is that possible if the system forces you to have a 50% winrate.

The new system tries to get you to 50% winrate. The old system made winning players win more and losing players lose more. As you play more games in this new system. You will trend toward 50%, or be at the top of the leaderboards.

Wrong. My winrate is career and i started very shortly after the start of the game. Please show me proof the “Old” system made winners win and losers lose?

I know what you think you are talking about but im pretty sure what your talking about was only during 1 or 2 seasons total. Yet this game has been using glicko2 since launch.

If you did trend to 50% and stay there, id say you belong there.

Sorry but I’m not wrong…
https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/upcoming-changes-for-pvp-league-season-5/
In seasons 1-4, the system paired you with teammates who were similar in skill to you, and it put you against players in your same pip range regardless of their skill rating. This forced players with low skill ratings to fall, and pushed players with high skill rating up in a spiral. Please stop flaming and learn more before posting.

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Posted by: NeXeD.3042

NeXeD.3042

It seems to me, that advancing up the ladder is almost impossible for me unless I have a win rate of above 70% based on the amount of points I lose and gain.

Just curious, but why do you think you should advance up the ladder without winning at least 2 out of every 3 games?

That you have to have a win rate of 70% or better to advance up the ladder is kind of the point; if you’re hovering around a 50% win rate, you’re probably exactly where you should be.

You assume that matchmaking creates fair matches LOL. Newsflash: it doesn’t. Of course, game can’t measure all player skills but it doesn’t even attempt to create fair matches based on measurable numbers like MMR and rating….

Why do you think the system creates unfair matches? What makes them so?

I’ve seen several instances personally where if I win more than three or four in a row, I go on a losing streak of about the same. The matchmaking wants to keep you at a 50% winrate and will do what it needs to in order to achieve that. Of the last 20 games, maybe 3 have been close in point spread at the end; the rest have been blowouts either win or loss. When I say blowout, I mean the losing team loses by 200+ points. This seems to be the standard for the season for most people from what I hear.

Please explain how ive managed a 60% career winrate

I don’t get why I’m getting flamed. This is how the system works whether or not you want to believe it. You can manage a better than 50/50 by not playing enough games, which would cause you to still be below your true placement.

im not flaming you, and i have a decent amount of career games……. Im not sure if you are complaining about having a 50% winrate or complaining that the system forces you into a 50% winrate… however i and quite a few others have managed to maintain over a 60% winrate. How exactly is that possible if the system forces you to have a 50% winrate.

The new system tries to get you to 50% winrate. The old system made winning players win more and losing players lose more. As you play more games in this new system. You will trend toward 50%, or be at the top of the leaderboards.

Wrong. My winrate is career and i started very shortly after the start of the game. Please show me proof the “Old” system made winners win and losers lose?

I know what you think you are talking about but im pretty sure what your talking about was only during 1 or 2 seasons total. Yet this game has been using glicko2 since launch.

If you did trend to 50% and stay there, id say you belong there.

Sorry but I’m not wrong…
https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/upcoming-changes-for-pvp-league-season-5/
In seasons 1-4, the system paired you with teammates who were similar in skill to you, and it put you against players in your same pip range regardless of their skill rating. This forced players with low skill ratings to fall, and pushed players with high skill rating up in a spiral. Please stop flaming and learn more before posting.

Im not flaming so please stop accusing me of flaming i do not appreciate your unkind words. please show me where it says it is forcing you to have a 50% winrate?

Attention Moderators I am not
S P E E D Starr #0 Necro NA or
I Am NeXeD awful d/D ele NA

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Posted by: BloodriverTim.2031

BloodriverTim.2031

It seems to me, that advancing up the ladder is almost impossible for me unless I have a win rate of above 70% based on the amount of points I lose and gain.

Just curious, but why do you think you should advance up the ladder without winning at least 2 out of every 3 games?

That you have to have a win rate of 70% or better to advance up the ladder is kind of the point; if you’re hovering around a 50% win rate, you’re probably exactly where you should be.

You assume that matchmaking creates fair matches LOL. Newsflash: it doesn’t. Of course, game can’t measure all player skills but it doesn’t even attempt to create fair matches based on measurable numbers like MMR and rating….

Why do you think the system creates unfair matches? What makes them so?

I’ve seen several instances personally where if I win more than three or four in a row, I go on a losing streak of about the same. The matchmaking wants to keep you at a 50% winrate and will do what it needs to in order to achieve that. Of the last 20 games, maybe 3 have been close in point spread at the end; the rest have been blowouts either win or loss. When I say blowout, I mean the losing team loses by 200+ points. This seems to be the standard for the season for most people from what I hear.

Please explain how ive managed a 60% career winrate

I don’t get why I’m getting flamed. This is how the system works whether or not you want to believe it. You can manage a better than 50/50 by not playing enough games, which would cause you to still be below your true placement.

im not flaming you, and i have a decent amount of career games……. Im not sure if you are complaining about having a 50% winrate or complaining that the system forces you into a 50% winrate… however i and quite a few others have managed to maintain over a 60% winrate. How exactly is that possible if the system forces you to have a 50% winrate.

The new system tries to get you to 50% winrate. The old system made winning players win more and losing players lose more. As you play more games in this new system. You will trend toward 50%, or be at the top of the leaderboards.

Wrong. My winrate is career and i started very shortly after the start of the game. Please show me proof the “Old” system made winners win and losers lose?

I know what you think you are talking about but im pretty sure what your talking about was only during 1 or 2 seasons total. Yet this game has been using glicko2 since launch.

If you did trend to 50% and stay there, id say you belong there.

Sorry but I’m not wrong…
https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/upcoming-changes-for-pvp-league-season-5/
In seasons 1-4, the system paired you with teammates who were similar in skill to you, and it put you against players in your same pip range regardless of their skill rating. This forced players with low skill ratings to fall, and pushed players with high skill rating up in a spiral. Please stop flaming and learn more before posting.

Im not flaming please show me where it says it is forcing you to have a 50% winrate?

I’m done, good luck champ. It clearly doesn’t say that in plain English, but if you knew anything about matchmaking then you’d understand that that is the goal of the system. Congrats, you dragged me down to your level and beat me with your experience.

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Posted by: Phineas Poe.3018

Phineas Poe.3018

I had matches with/below 1700 players + me 1887 on my team vs people in 1800-1900+ range on enemy team during prime time. Take a guess how it went. I also have been in matches with double duoq of top 5 players (2100) vs 1800 team #workingasintended.

The entry point to the top 250 is roughly around 1750 in North America. While who holds that #250 position is bound to fluctuate, there’s no way there are more than 400 total players above 1700 at any given time. And there’s no way all those 400 players are going to be online at the same time—or even a fraction of them.

You’re going to play with people in gold, even during prime time. It’s just how it is. It’s how it has always been, in every season. The game mode just isn’t popular enough to keep you playing with/against people within ~50 rating of you every single match, especially when you’re nearing legendary.

[EG] Ethereal Guardians

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Posted by: NeXeD.3042

NeXeD.3042

It seems to me, that advancing up the ladder is almost impossible for me unless I have a win rate of above 70% based on the amount of points I lose and gain.

Just curious, but why do you think you should advance up the ladder without winning at least 2 out of every 3 games?

That you have to have a win rate of 70% or better to advance up the ladder is kind of the point; if you’re hovering around a 50% win rate, you’re probably exactly where you should be.

You assume that matchmaking creates fair matches LOL. Newsflash: it doesn’t. Of course, game can’t measure all player skills but it doesn’t even attempt to create fair matches based on measurable numbers like MMR and rating….

Why do you think the system creates unfair matches? What makes them so?

I’ve seen several instances personally where if I win more than three or four in a row, I go on a losing streak of about the same. The matchmaking wants to keep you at a 50% winrate and will do what it needs to in order to achieve that. Of the last 20 games, maybe 3 have been close in point spread at the end; the rest have been blowouts either win or loss. When I say blowout, I mean the losing team loses by 200+ points. This seems to be the standard for the season for most people from what I hear.

Please explain how ive managed a 60% career winrate

I don’t get why I’m getting flamed. This is how the system works whether or not you want to believe it. You can manage a better than 50/50 by not playing enough games, which would cause you to still be below your true placement.

im not flaming you, and i have a decent amount of career games……. Im not sure if you are complaining about having a 50% winrate or complaining that the system forces you into a 50% winrate… however i and quite a few others have managed to maintain over a 60% winrate. How exactly is that possible if the system forces you to have a 50% winrate.

The new system tries to get you to 50% winrate. The old system made winning players win more and losing players lose more. As you play more games in this new system. You will trend toward 50%, or be at the top of the leaderboards.

Wrong. My winrate is career and i started very shortly after the start of the game. Please show me proof the “Old” system made winners win and losers lose?

I know what you think you are talking about but im pretty sure what your talking about was only during 1 or 2 seasons total. Yet this game has been using glicko2 since launch.

If you did trend to 50% and stay there, id say you belong there.

Sorry but I’m not wrong…
https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/upcoming-changes-for-pvp-league-season-5/
In seasons 1-4, the system paired you with teammates who were similar in skill to you, and it put you against players in your same pip range regardless of their skill rating. This forced players with low skill ratings to fall, and pushed players with high skill rating up in a spiral. Please stop flaming and learn more before posting.

Im not flaming please show me where it says it is forcing you to have a 50% winrate?

I’m done, good luck champ. It clearly doesn’t say that in plain English, but if you knew anything about matchmaking then you’d understand that that is the goal of the system. Congrats, you dragged me down to your level and beat me with your experience.

I understand the matchmaking quite well and i also understand I and many other people have managed to maintain winrates over 60% even with this so called forced 50% win that if you search through some post history of devs you would find multiple devs saying there is no such things a 50% forced winrate.

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I Am NeXeD awful d/D ele NA

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Posted by: Starbreaker.6507

Starbreaker.6507

Wasn’t the pip system from seasons 1-4 worse because of the safety net they put into place?

I remember late-season low ruby game and they were absolutely awful filled with people that had no business being there, but ground their way up into it.

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Posted by: NeXeD.3042

NeXeD.3042

Wasn’t the pip system from seasons 1-4 worse because of the safety net they put into place?

I remember late-season low ruby game and they were absolutely awful filled with people that had no business being there, but ground their way up into it.

yep you could literally grind your way to legendary with enough games.

Attention Moderators I am not
S P E E D Starr #0 Necro NA or
I Am NeXeD awful d/D ele NA

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Posted by: Cynz.9437

Cynz.9437

I had matches with/below 1700 players + me 1887 on my team vs people in 1800-1900+ range on enemy team during prime time. Take a guess how it went. I also have been in matches with double duoq of top 5 players (2100) vs 1800 team #workingasintended.

The entry point to the top 250 is roughly around 1750 in North America. While who holds that #250 position is bound to fluctuate, there’s no way there are more than 400 total players above 1700 at any given time. And there’s no way all those 400 players are going to be online at the same time—or even a fraction of them.

You’re going to play with people in gold, even during prime time. It’s just how it is. It’s how it has always been, in every season. The game mode just isn’t popular enough to keep you playing with/against people within ~50 rating of you every single match, especially when you’re nearing legendary.

It is 1830+ for EU last time i checked….

You actually think it is ok to have by far lower ranked teams vs top 10 players? Why have MM on first place then? Let’s just throw everyone in same match together!

All is Vain~
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Posted by: Phineas Poe.3018

Phineas Poe.3018

Dude, what? I said…

The game mode just isn’t popular enough to keep you playing with/against people within ~50 rating of you every single match, especially when you’re nearing legendary.

And somehow you took that to mean….

You actually think it is ok to have by far lower ranked teams vs top 10 players?

I don’t think personal opinion has anything to do with it, but I’ve already accepted the reality that I must regularly face pro league duos just to stay in platinum. The game’s population just isn’t there to avoid it.

Guild Wars 2 is very stable, healthy, and has a bright future ahead of it. But it is not League of Legends, CS:GO, or Overwatch. GW2 PvP has historically been the least popular of the three game modes, and has always lagged behind PvE and WvW in population—and arguably still does, at least when counting those that take the content seriously.

As such, there are very few people that actually know how to PvP, and while the disparity between pro league players and the average player like myself is substantial, leveling my alt account to rank 20 and seeing low MMR play has been a surreal experience. Players don’t even chase after objectives, opting to team fight at spawn points. You see condi elementalists, hammer warriors, and Supply Crates.

Guild Wars 2 has always thrived when it treats PvE, WvW, and PvP less like individual modes and more like a venn diagram—catering to the greater PvX population so that everyone gets something out of it. I think everyone who’s been playing this game as long as I have knows that part of the reason PvP hasn’t ever taken off is because Conquest is a hard enough game mode to enter into but that it never held that carrot on a stick to keep people playing.

While bringing back the leaderboard is good for the hardcore and semi-hardcore, PvP is finally bringing in the casuals en masse, and you can see how much more popular the game mode is now because of it. So while pro league players may be farming plat/gold players, given a few more months of free ascended armor and easy gold will breathe a lot of life into a starving game mode and make matchmaking more accurate.

[EG] Ethereal Guardians

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Posted by: Shaogin.2679

Shaogin.2679

I don’t agree with the statement that matchmaking is trying to force a 50% win rate on people. However, it is very possible with the way matchmaking is currently functioning that players are getting put in badly lopsided matches. The mm system isn’t evenly dividing players into two teams with fairly close average ratings. Currently, one team will generally have 2-3 players with a higher rating than everyone on the other team, and that other team often has 2-3 players with a rating lower than those on the first team. This creates lopsided matches when you queue and there aren’t many players around your rating in the queue to pull from.

The mm system does still need work, but I don’t believe that it is intentionally trying to sabotage your win rate.

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Posted by: Zietlogik.6208

Zietlogik.6208

I have always lost more rating for a loss, than ever gained for a win. Average per win is usually 6-9, and lately per loss 15-17.

And it seems the more unfair the matchup, the more you lose? which makes no sense to me. I have had matches with leavers/afkers and people who have never finished their placement matches yet, and lost up to -19 rating for the loss…

Zietlogik [Warrior] Chronologix [Ranger] Ziet The Dreaded [Necromancer] Zietlogic [Revenant]

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Posted by: Ario.8964

Ario.8964

My most recent win gave me 6 with a loss taking like 17… I have about a 57% win rate (Last time i calculated so it may have changed) but with what feels like overall very little progress. I started at 1650 so it said t3 gold so i fought up to 1750 and would drop down to 1545 then go back up to 1740 then drop to 1640 with this repeating. It’s not just a random happenstance because it has been constant streaks of blowout wins followed by blowout losses. There’s no consistency in the way matchmaking works and because they made skill rating completely based on win/loss percentage they invalidated any measure it had of “skill”. Evidence you ask? Because I have played matches where i win constant 1v2’s, +1 and win every side node fight (mostly focused on home cause i keep far decapped), end with every top stat and lose 20 rating because my team feeding the other means that I am an unskilled player. I don’t put stake into rating anymore and I know for a fact I don’t belong in legendary so it’s not a matter of me feeling like I’m in the wrong division, it’s a matter of the system trying to measure skill through win/loss ratio and rating being so volatile especially with the whole blowout streak (both win and loss) behavior.

[Teef] Dragonbrand Thief and Engi main www.twitch.tv/ariodoesgaming and Ario Does Gaming on Youtube!