Guild Wars 2

So… can we fix not losing placement due to DC people? They are DC for whole match, and we still lose?

Baffles my mind that in second season, it’s still a problem.

I don’t think they could figure out a way to stop people from paying another to DC on purpose at the sight of a loss…

I don’t think losing the placement with the DC counts towards your initial placement. So in a sense that’s sorta ok I guess. In the long run it’s just 10 games and you’re gonna need to play more anyway so placements aren’t that important.

sephiroth.4217:

I don’t think they could figure out a way to stop people from paying another to DC on purpose at the sight of a loss…

Per definition it is breaking of ToS and exploiting, in perfect world (and in about any other game) such players usually get banned. But this is gw2, where reporting is just pretty UI feature and nothing else.

fishball.7204:

I don’t think losing the placement with the DC counts towards your initial placement. So in a sense that’s sorta ok I guess. In the long run it’s just 10 games and you’re gonna need to play more anyway so placements aren’t that important.

Loss is a loss for placements. Issue is, if you say lost 1/3 of your matches due to DCd players, you going to get placed waaay below your rating. No biggie, right? Just climb back. The issue is rating gain decay. The more games you play, the less rating you get.

So here is example: A, B are equally good. Person A loses 2 matches out of 10 (no DCs) and gets placed around 1650. Person B loses 5 matches, 3 due to DCs, he gets placed in gold I.
There is 300 pts points between those two players.
Now here is the issue. Each of those players will gain 30 rating on first match down to 19 rating after 10 matches. Lets assume both of them on all 10 matches. So overall both gain around 240 rating.
Now person A is sitting at 1890, where B didn’t even reach plat yet.
Lets assume both players try to reach legend. With rating gain decay, assuming A and B only win and get hit by the same rating gain decay of say 15. A would need 4 more matches and he is done. B would need 24 matches. But this is not all. Since B continues to play, his rating gains continue to decay so after another 10 matches or so he would get even less (e.g. 8 rating). From 1590 to 1950 he would need 360 rating. 10 matches x 15 = 150. 360-150 = 210. 210 / 8 = 27. So 10 matches + 27 = 37 matches.

Bottom line, B would need to play 37 more matches (assuming he only wins) to reach same goal as A only because he had 3 placement matches with DCs on his team (which is very common atm).
Then we add reality check of forced 50% win rate, bad rng, paying for wins, trolls, griefers, bad class balance, class stacking etc. and the numbers will grow extremely high.

I went 6-4 in my placements where 2 of the 4 losses were 4v5 games. I ended up at 1654 rating. Just a couple games later I’m sitting at 1758. Placements only count kitten much. Just keep playing and you’ll get to where you’re supposed to be.

You don’t lose any rating in placements or real games if you have a DC > 2 min though.

But also, they’re scaling the leaderboards this season so the longer the season is, the more games needed to place on there. Pretty sure they said something like 100 games which totally makes your complaints a non issue as they’d both have to play that many games anyway.

Loop.8106:

I went 6-4 in my placements where 2 of the 4 losses were 4v5 games. I ended up at 1654 rating. Just a couple games later I’m sitting at 1758. Placements only count kitten much. Just keep playing and you’ll get to where you’re supposed to be.

Grats, i ended up in 1350 range with similar results (was plat last season). Not that i care much about rating, i can climb out of it. But 100% of matches for me atm are beyond one sided. I can solo druids/DHs and co. or 1v2 as thief at these ratings. It is just waste of time for me and not so fun for players i am facing (e.g. i basically spawn camped some mes yesterday, some people just ragequit).
The guy i kept running into in matches (thankfully on my team) was actually legend last season and he placed in silver. Take a guess how silver/gold players fare vs his engi xD

Then, as i mentioned, there is issue with rating gain decay, by the time i hit plat i will probably gain 5 pts for match. That is surely motivating~

fishball.7204:

You don’t lose any rating in placements or real games if you have a DC > 2 min though.

But also, they’re scaling the leaderboards this season so the longer the season is, the more games needed to place on there. Pretty sure they said something like 100 games which totally makes your complaints a non issue as they’d both have to play that many games anyway.

Stop making excuses for them. True Disconnects shouldn’t count toward your rating. There is no reason for them too. 100 games is nothing. Two players playing 100 games could have widely different ratings based soley on disconnects losing ratings say at 12-15 a pop. If one player had even 5 more disconnects that like 75 rating difference that could cost you 50 spots in the rankings. It could be the difference between high gold and low platinum it may not matter to you but it matters to some people. Stop rationalizing everything away. Its a trait of a doormat that settles for anything quite frankly. They definitely changed something even someone diconnecting for half the match now costs you rating. Basically they need to reduce the luck factor wherever possible. Well this is luck some people benefitting from others mistortunes basically. It should even out but not over 100 games necessarily. It would be one thing if the threshold was 200-300 games but at 100 games some luck can easily come into play based on this stupid disconnect change.

Cynz.9437:

Loop.8106:

I went 6-4 in my placements where 2 of the 4 losses were 4v5 games. I ended up at 1654 rating. Just a couple games later I’m sitting at 1758. Placements only count kitten much. Just keep playing and you’ll get to where you’re supposed to be.

Grats, i ended up in 1350 range with similar results (was plat last season). Not that i care much about rating, i can climb out of it. But 100% of matches for me atm are beyond one sided. I can solo druids/DHs and co. or 1v2 as thief at these ratings. It is just waste of time for me and not so fun for players i am facing (e.g. i basically spawn camped some mes yesterday, some people just ragequit).
The guy i kept running into in matches (thankfully on my team) was actually legend last season and he placed in silver. Take a guess how silver/gold players fare vs his engi xD

Then, as i mentioned, there is issue with rating gain decay, by the time i hit plat i will probably gain 5 pts for match. That is surely motivating~

Yeah, idk. I ended last season ~1900 rating. So shouldnt deviate that much. Then again, the placements are a joke as I Queued into Zan aswell as silver players in the same team.

steelheart.7386:

fishball.7204:

You don’t lose any rating in placements or real games if you have a DC > 2 min though.

But also, they’re scaling the leaderboards this season so the longer the season is, the more games needed to place on there. Pretty sure they said something like 100 games which totally makes your complaints a non issue as they’d both have to play that many games anyway.

Stop making excuses for them. True Disconnects shouldn’t count toward your rating. There is no reason for them too. 100 games is nothing. Two players playing 100 games could have widely different ratings based soley on disconnects losing ratings say at 12-15 a pop. If one player had even 5 more disconnects that like 75 rating difference that could cost you 50 spots in the rankings. It could be the difference between high gold and low platinum it may not matter to you but it matters to some people. Stop rationalizing everything away. Its a trait of a doormat that settles for anything quite frankly. They definitely changed something even someone diconnecting for half the match now costs you rating. Basically they need to reduce the luck factor wherever possible. Well this is luck some people benefitting from others mistortunes basically. It should even out but not over 100 games necessarily. It would be one thing if the threshold was 200-300 games but at 100 games some luck can easily come into play based on this stupid disconnect change.

Making up stuff doesn’t make it true. Ratings don’t go down if you have a DC that isn’t in your duo q.

Let me repeat, DISCONNECTS (>2 min) DON’T COUNT TOWARDS LOSSES IN RATING.

Prove me wrong or you’re just full of it and ranting because you’re salty

fishball.7204:

steelheart.7386:

fishball.7204:

You don’t lose any rating in placements or real games if you have a DC > 2 min though.

But also, they’re scaling the leaderboards this season so the longer the season is, the more games needed to place on there. Pretty sure they said something like 100 games which totally makes your complaints a non issue as they’d both have to play that many games anyway.

Stop making excuses for them. True Disconnects shouldn’t count toward your rating. There is no reason for them too. 100 games is nothing. Two players playing 100 games could have widely different ratings based soley on disconnects losing ratings say at 12-15 a pop. If one player had even 5 more disconnects that like 75 rating difference that could cost you 50 spots in the rankings. It could be the difference between high gold and low platinum it may not matter to you but it matters to some people. Stop rationalizing everything away. Its a trait of a doormat that settles for anything quite frankly. They definitely changed something even someone diconnecting for half the match now costs you rating. Basically they need to reduce the luck factor wherever possible. Well this is luck some people benefitting from others mistortunes basically. It should even out but not over 100 games necessarily. It would be one thing if the threshold was 200-300 games but at 100 games some luck can easily come into play based on this stupid disconnect change.

Making up stuff doesn’t make it true. Ratings don’t go down if you have a DC that isn’t in your duo q.

Let me repeat, DISCONNECTS (>2 min) DON’T COUNT TOWARDS LOSSES IN RATING.

Prove me wrong or you’re just full of it and ranting because you’re salty

Do YOU have proof that it doesn’t? The placement indicator clearly marks red as a loss even with DC. The way I got placed with TWO disconnects is way below where I should have been.

fishball.7204:

steelheart.7386:

fishball.7204:

You don’t lose any rating in placements or real games if you have a DC > 2 min though.

But also, they’re scaling the leaderboards this season so the longer the season is, the more games needed to place on there. Pretty sure they said something like 100 games which totally makes your complaints a non issue as they’d both have to play that many games anyway.

Stop making excuses for them. True Disconnects shouldn’t count toward your rating. There is no reason for them too. 100 games is nothing. Two players playing 100 games could have widely different ratings based soley on disconnects losing ratings say at 12-15 a pop. If one player had even 5 more disconnects that like 75 rating difference that could cost you 50 spots in the rankings. It could be the difference between high gold and low platinum it may not matter to you but it matters to some people. Stop rationalizing everything away. Its a trait of a doormat that settles for anything quite frankly. They definitely changed something even someone diconnecting for half the match now costs you rating. Basically they need to reduce the luck factor wherever possible. Well this is luck some people benefitting from others mistortunes basically. It should even out but not over 100 games necessarily. It would be one thing if the threshold was 200-300 games but at 100 games some luck can easily come into play based on this stupid disconnect change.

Making up stuff doesn’t make it true. Ratings don’t go down if you have a DC that isn’t in your duo q.

Let me repeat, DISCONNECTS (>2 min) DON’T COUNT TOWARDS LOSSES IN RATING.

Prove me wrong or you’re just full of it and ranting because you’re salty

For the most part this site correct. But if the person joins the match again and disconnects again, the timer is reset.

Or if they join during the last minute or so you still get a loss despite then bring gone for 90% of the match.

maybe do it like ow where if someone dc’s theres a timer in which if he returns all good but passed that timer the winning team get no win in their placemets

Dariya.9380:

Baffles my mind that in second season, it’s still a problem.

So you’re surprised that a problem not related to the game is not fixed by the game? I can say that’s hardly surprising.

Is it common for MMO’s to ‘reserve’ your game state if you DC nowadays? I don’t even know how that would be possible. How would the game know you DC on purpose or accident? To be frank, I think something that would reserve your gamestate in PVP would be very abusable.

Obtena.7952:

Dariya.9380:

Baffles my mind that in second season, it’s still a problem.

So you’re surprised that a problem not related to the game is not fixed by the game? I can say that’s hardly surprising.

Is it common for MMO’s to ‘reserve’ your game state if you DC nowadays? I don’t even know how that would be possible. How would the game know you DC on purpose or accident? To be frank, I think something that would reserve your gamestate in PVP would be very abusable.

How is losing placement rating in spite of prolonged DC of a teammate “a problem not related to the game”?
And I’m sure there is some way to track how often people DC, if it only happens in PvP, see if it happens in “loosing games” more often than in “winning games” etc, and decide whether it’s legitimate DCs or not from there.

yea it kinda sucks, but statistically it happens to pretty much everyone.. so it evens out over the long run.

the loss forgiven on DC should’ve never been implemented in the first place, tbh.

the only time a loss should be forgiven is if there are mass DC’s because of actual server issues.

If they’re gonna determine my “skill” based on only 10 games, then I don’t like the idea that a 4v5 loss is treated as any other loss.. and afaik the person actually DC:ing looses rating either way, along with any individual he/she queued up with, it just doesn’t punish his/her random teammates.

Najten.2418:

If they’re gonna determine my “skill” based on only 10 games, then I don’t like the idea that a 4v5 loss is treated as any other loss..

You don’t lose rating for losing a 4v5 in the case of a disconnect.

Unless you are the person disconnecting or grouped with the person disconnecting you don’t lose rating for a prolonged DC.

Crinn.7864:

Najten.2418:

If they’re gonna determine my “skill” based on only 10 games, then I don’t like the idea that a 4v5 loss is treated as any other loss..

You don’t lose rating for losing a 4v5 in the case of a disconnect.

Unless you are the person disconnecting or grouped with the person disconnecting you don’t lose rating for a prolonged DC.

Crinn.7864:

Najten.2418:

If they’re gonna determine my “skill” based on only 10 games, then I don’t like the idea that a 4v5 loss is treated as any other loss..

You don’t lose rating for losing a 4v5 in the case of a disconnect.

Unless you are the person disconnecting or grouped with the person disconnecting you don’t lose rating for a prolonged DC.

Well, loosing or not loosing rating in spite of disconnects is not obvious, is it? Atleast not from what we as players can see on our end. And referring to previous “anectdotal evidence” (unless you actually work for ArenaNet with coding this rating kitten, I dunno if you can get any other type) in this thread it seems to count as a “just another loss” no matter what. It sure looks like it counts as a loss, I just can’t see what “rating” I lost or didn’t loose.. Imo it shouldn’t count as a played game at all.. I’d much rather have it not count and have to play an 11th “qualifying” game.

Najten.2418:

Obtena.7952:

Dariya.9380:

Baffles my mind that in second season, it’s still a problem.

So you’re surprised that a problem not related to the game is not fixed by the game? I can say that’s hardly surprising.

Is it common for MMO’s to ‘reserve’ your game state if you DC nowadays? I don’t even know how that would be possible. How would the game know you DC on purpose or accident? To be frank, I think something that would reserve your gamestate in PVP would be very abusable.

How is losing placement rating in spite of prolonged DC of a teammate “a problem not related to the game”?
And I’m sure there is some way to track how often people DC, if it only happens in PvP, see if it happens in “loosing games” more often than in “winning games” etc, and decide whether it’s legitimate DCs or not from there.

People DCing isn’t necessarily a game-related effect and it’s averaged over time anyways; everyone gets them randomly. Maybe there is a way to track it, that’s not the point. The point is if there is any value in doing so; I don’t think there is … it’s just not frequent enough or severe enough to bother. I think it would be very poor judgment on Anet’s part to allow for an artificial adjustment of standing due to DC or teamate DC.

Loop.8106:

I went 6-4 in my placements where 2 of the 4 losses were 4v5 games. I ended up at 1654 rating. Just a couple games later I’m sitting at 1758. Placements only count kitten much. Just keep playing and you’ll get to where you’re supposed to be.

I went 6-4 with 1 game as a rager/afk/leaver and was put Gold 1….

Reading your post and placement and comparing to my results, I’m not going to bother with this season…. This season is just luck again.

sephiroth.4217:

Loop.8106:

I went 6-4 in my placements where 2 of the 4 losses were 4v5 games. I ended up at 1654 rating. Just a couple games later I’m sitting at 1758. Placements only count kitten much. Just keep playing and you’ll get to where you’re supposed to be.

I went 6-4 with 1 game as a rager/afk/leaver and was put Gold 1….

Reading your post and placement and comparing to my results, I’m not going to bother with this season…. This season is just luck again.

Your placements depends slightly on where you are last season. Loop was plat+ and you were silver-gold so obviously you placed around where you’re supposed to be with a 6-4 score. Also yes there’s some luck involved in placements but placements are like… worthless in the overall scheme of things since you could place really high but be bad and just keep losing or place really low and climb really easily since you’re good (eg. helseth).

fishball.7204:

sephiroth.4217:

Loop.8106:

I went 6-4 in my placements where 2 of the 4 losses were 4v5 games. I ended up at 1654 rating. Just a couple games later I’m sitting at 1758. Placements only count kitten much. Just keep playing and you’ll get to where you’re supposed to be.

I went 6-4 with 1 game as a rager/afk/leaver and was put Gold 1….

Reading your post and placement and comparing to my results, I’m not going to bother with this season…. This season is just luck again.

Your placements depends slightly on where you are last season. Loop was plat+ and you were silver-gold so obviously you placed around where you’re supposed to be with a 6-4 score. Also yes there’s some luck involved in placements but placements are like… worthless in the overall scheme of things since you could place really high but be bad and just keep losing or place really low and climb really easily since you’re good (eg. helseth).

Nah I’m definitely a Gold player, not good but not bad either….. I did all my placements on a D/D Lightning Rod Ele build and held my own really well, some games I went 18/0 but my rating on who I versed was pure luck.

Obtena.7952:

Najten.2418:

Obtena.7952:

Dariya.9380:

Baffles my mind that in second season, it’s still a problem.

So you’re surprised that a problem not related to the game is not fixed by the game? I can say that’s hardly surprising.

Is it common for MMO’s to ‘reserve’ your game state if you DC nowadays? I don’t even know how that would be possible. How would the game know you DC on purpose or accident? To be frank, I think something that would reserve your gamestate in PVP would be very abusable.

How is losing placement rating in spite of prolonged DC of a teammate “a problem not related to the game”?
And I’m sure there is some way to track how often people DC, if it only happens in PvP, see if it happens in “loosing games” more often than in “winning games” etc, and decide whether it’s legitimate DCs or not from there.

People DCing isn’t necessarily a game-related effect and it’s averaged over time anyways; everyone gets them randomly. Maybe there is a way to track it, that’s not the point. The point is if there is any value in doing so; I don’t think there is … it’s just not frequent enough or severe enough to bother. I think it would be very poor judgment on Anet’s part to allow for an artificial adjustment of standing due to DC or teamate DC.

We’re obviously viewing this issue in different ways.. My problem (and what I gather from the OPs initial post) is that the problem isn’t that people DC.. ofc they do, for probably a hundred different reasons varying from ISP issues to manually logging off/killing the game.
My problem, is that another person DC:ing, and therefore leaving me in a match with 4 players vs 5, costs me my initial placement. Even if it only happens once, it’s affecting 10% of my placement games. That’s not going to “even out”.
My friend that was in the same game but got his placement already, didn’t loose rating, but I got a LOSS in my placement rating. I don’t find that fair.