Guild Wars 2

Just had my first few games of Spvp after the patch and i just wanted to give my feedback on the new version of Assassins signet. i’m loving it, not only will it be viable to use for a pistol whip or heartseeker build, but for people who ran fairly balanced backstab builds this is a great change too.

With my build i never go over 10k anyway, but now its alot easier to keep the pressure going since i got my signet for 2 more cloak and daggers and two more backstabs or just some nice extra damage for the next 4 heartseekers im going to spam.

a nerf? i would even go so far as calling this a slight buff! thank you Anet<3

i guess ppl dont realise what buff, nerf and FIX means…

i only said nerf because when you see that the signet went down in power maybe people’s reaction will be negative at first, but it a fix yes. needed? not really, it wasent the instagib fest people made it out to be but still, me likey this ‘fix’ =)

im appreciative of the change as it was i feel the correct way to affect backstab specs. time will tell if it was enough or not.

I agree, its a buff for those thiefs that dont rely on killing their target with the initial CD + BS
….
the 3 of them

for the rest of terribads its a nerf that will possibly make them reroll

I’m not sure what to make of this change. Either it’s good…or it’s going to make thing even worse.

While previously hitting Assassin’s Singet just before the Backstab (and not before the C&D/Steal) took quite a bit of finesse and good reaction times. After all you have 3 different attacks all hitting within a second.

And yet now I can just pop the Singet before I even engage a target and get a 15% damage boost for Steal, Cloak and Dagger and Backstab + the following Heartseekers all at once.

Sure, you may no longer die to a 5-digit Backstab that often but you’re still going to die just as fast as before.

The good thing is though that it should now make Assassin’s Singet a viable choice for more than just Backstab builds.

I agree, its a buff for those thiefs that dont rely on killing their target with the initial CD + BS
….
the 3 of them
for the rest of terribads its a nerf that will possibly make them reroll

Except you didn’t think this through. The assassin’s signet will now affect Steal, C&D, BS and a Double Strike or on rare occasions a Heartseeker. That’s it and there’s really nothing you can do about it.

It would have been much smarter to have Assassin’s Signet only affect the next 5 attacks out of stealth. (All builds have stealth attacks after all.)

yeah on reflection i dont think this will really help much in toning down the BS burst build. In fact, against more experienced players who tended to avoid the BS with stunbreaker/port etc, it is worse: the CnD and Steal (which are the hard part to avoid) are now 15% higher!! So…. er…. yeah… I would have preferred changing steal to non-instant cast. Ah well.

So…. er…. yeah… I would have preferred changing steal to non-instant cast.

Why? That would just kitten tons of specs instead of just the one they are trying to target.

I dont see this changing anything but the influx of “zomfg check this totally whack backstab i just took”.

You get hit in rapid succesion by several hits. And they now all do 15% more instead of one ability doing 50% more. And now they dont have to wait with it for a big hit, but they can even use it on the steal+CnD crap.

If anything, this would probably be a buff.

I would love it too if I were a Thief.

It’s definitely a buff and allows more builds to take advantage of a Signet that they made even MORE required now…lol.

I don’t see anything in this patch materially changing Thief Wars 2. At a minimum, I thought they would stop the ability to finish someone while stealthed.

Very strange…

@ Speshal

Finishing someone in stealth is no stronger than finishing someone with stability. I don’t see how that’s an issue by comparison of the two, considering stealth doesn’t grant stability. You can’t stop someone from stomping you in stealth as per say a warrior / necro? Well … you still can’t stop them from stomping you if they have stability on. Same thing, just can’t see them.

That would be why they didn’t change it, and probably don’t plan to.

imo its a buff just saw some thiefs in tourneys now that can litarely melt 30k hp in sub 2 seconds with the thing active, with the old way you just have to take care of 1 spike now you have to take care of 5 spikes

The change just proves even Anet think its a l2p issue. spreading the bonus damage over multiple attacks, meaning the player is suppose to stunbreak it.

Rather then a thief using hide in shadows>assasins signet> backstab which is too hard to avoid.

Anyway, if a thief lands his cnd>steal>bs> auto attack(first combo x2 hits), its now 75% bonus damage instead of 50%, its just even more of a “noob killer” now.

Jesiah.2457:

@ Speshal

Finishing someone in stealth is no stronger than finishing someone with stability. I don’t see how that’s an issue by comparison of the two, considering stealth doesn’t grant stability. You can’t stop someone from stomping you in stealth as per say a warrior / necro? Well … you still can’t stop them from stomping you if they have stability on. Same thing, just can’t see them.

That would be why they didn’t change it, and probably don’t plan to.

theres a big diference between stability and stealth as in stealth makes you invisible where as stability doesnt. stability gives your team time to react on the downed player situation stealth on the other hand makes your team think the downed player is ok while obviously a thief is finishing him off invisible..

@ barti

a thief would have to use “hide in shadows”, “blinding powder” giving 6 seconds stealth, and then shadowstep from a distance, to go unrecognised in his attempt to stealth stomp someone. and in doing so he would burn 3 utility’s for a stomp.

As for shadow refuge stomp, its kitten obvious. if you decide to leave a player on the ground because you cant see anyone around, you’re taking the risk.

theres so many ways to interupt stomp.

barti.7685:

Jesiah.2457:

@ Speshal

Finishing someone in stealth is no stronger than finishing someone with stability. I don’t see how that’s an issue by comparison of the two, considering stealth doesn’t grant stability. You can’t stop someone from stomping you in stealth as per say a warrior / necro? Well … you still can’t stop them from stomping you if they have stability on. Same thing, just can’t see them.

That would be why they didn’t change it, and probably don’t plan to.

theres a big diference between stability and stealth as in stealth makes you invisible where as stability doesnt. stability gives your team time to react on the downed player situation stealth on the other hand makes your team think the downed player is ok while obviously a thief is finishing him off invisible..

Stealth lasts 3 seconds (4 if traited). There are 3 utilities that a thief can use to stealth (Hide in shadow, blinding powder, shadow refuge). Other than that, its CnD or Black powder→HS. This isn’t a game where a thief can come from outside the fight already stealthed, and stomp you before anyone knows it (95% of the time, there is the occasional situation where this happens. Even then though, stealth will tend to drop mid-stomp, Since it only lasts 3-4 seconds). If you see a thief stealth near a downed player react accordingly.

I’ve been knocked down/stunned/dazed/DPS blitzed down a dozen times on stealth stomps because players saw me stealth near a downed teammate, and realize that I’m probably going for the stomp.

When someone stability stomps, your only options are to try and burn that player down ASAP, or hope your teammate can be revived before the stomp goes through (which is a much shorter list of counters than a stealth stomp).

Now, back to the point.

Wow, didn’t take the boards long to drift from “Assassins signet changes are great, no more BS instagib builds!” to “This new assassins signet is even more powerful than the last one!” did it? What was it, like 6 posts?

Anyway, if a thief lands his cnd>steal>bs> auto attack(first combo x2 hits), its now 75% bonus damage instead of 50%, its just even more of a “noob killer” now.

So? The amount of procentual bonus damage means nothing.

6k * 1.5 = 9k = 3k Bonus DMG
(6k+3k+3k+3k+3k) * 1.15 = 20,7k = 2,7k Bonus DMG

Did i pull this values out of my kitten Yes i did, does “75% > 50%” mean anything without context? No.

PS: Just something to think about – new signet + autoattacks.

I crunched the numbers and Mug+CnD+BS is definitely weaker by a noticeable margin. Depending on how effective the Thief is at executing the combo, they will have 0, 1 or 2 remaining attacks. I’d assume they’d use HS after that but on the plus side, the target has more time to react to those attacks.
Another plus/minus is AS is now more useful to other builds, encouraging thieves to explore more. (However, if they clue into this is up to them.)

i dont understand your point, sorry gajarell, me no smart.

all im saying is, its a good balance change on the signet.

easier to use now, because you can activate it before going in for the cnd>steal>bs combo.

but will do 5% less damage for the combo. and also opens up more possibilty’s for other builds.

im stupid, i still dont see the point of your post.

In other words a strong Pistol Whip is back into the game….didnt play with the new patch, but it sounds like a buff for the thief. Unbelieveable.

I’d rather have the new signet than the old one. At least I’ve got some time to react instead of getting 3-shotted with a Mug ,CnD, Backstab.

@Moxrox: A 15% increase isn’t equivalent to a 15% decrease. An AS charged PW should perform at 92.083% of its former state. Assuming all 9 hits of PW count as a separate attack.

this is amazing, and is mathematically every bit of a buff. this literally just made things worse. cannot WAIT for the tears to flow.,.,.,

Assassin signet wasn’t a very good signet to begin with. I still don’t think it’s up to par/worth running over certain others.

spoonfoy.7315:

this is amazing, and is mathematically every bit of a buff. this literally just made things worse. cannot WAIT for the tears to flow.,.,.,

It’s interesting really, it’s a nerf Mug+CnD+BS (by about 13% by my calculations, also assuming you’ll dodge or CC after BS) and like combos yet a buff to everything else.
I’ll test my calculations further later.

spoonfoy.7315:

this is amazing, and is mathematically every bit of a buff. this literally just made things worse. cannot WAIT for the tears to flow.,.,.,

Congratulation, that is pretty shortsighted. Why?
1. People will just get annoyed and play an other game. October-January is usually the time where new hot titles get released
2. You will see even more thieves and the diversity will go down the drain
3. Even more people will play bunker builds making the game even more bland

Thief and mesmer have too much damage when you take their control/survivabilty mechanics into account.

It is simple maths: watch the numbers a thief can frontload and how long e.g. a power specced necro takes to do that amount of damage – and has hardly more survivability than a thief (imo even less). You will be surprised.

Nevertheless it is like in many mmos: there are 2-3 classes which are totally out of whack but people simply deny it for various reasons. In this game, however, it gets problematic because it is easy to simply use that class and do not have to level a character – which kills diversity.

@asmodean

whether it is or not

apparently anet doesnt quite agree

granted im really just waiting for them to fix stealth before i put up anything else. that should change there survivability noticeably.

It’s a good change. The problem with thief isn’t too high sustain, it was that initial 18k damage in 1.5 seconds from stealth.

pistol unload became more viable from this signet. The signet gave a nerf to backstab gibs and a buff to p/w and p/p builds and auto attacks and many other builds

was a very smart move.

People wont be happy till they see nerfs with big crit numbers like: Reduced assassin signet damamge by 10000%

Great fix, give other class a chance to avoid dammage.

So many derps here, it is/was a nerf, if you are saying you love the way it is now, you were doing it wrong before. The ONLY reason it was being used previously at higher levels of play was for the gimmicky backstab burst. Now you are getting a much lower % damage modifier on your hardest hitting ability and spreading the increase across lower damaging abilities… You don’t need to be a mathematician to see that this equals much less burst.

Of course if you didn’t use this playstyle pre patch it won’t affect you now, but to go so far as to say its a BUFF, well you are just an idiot.

Sanis

i guess ppl dont realise what buff, nerf and FIX means…

That depends.

If you’re implying that this was a “buff”… that’s debatable.

If you’re implying that this was a “fix”… it wasn’t. Since the tooltip was accurate and the ability functioned exactly as stated.

If you’re implying that it was a “nerf”… that’s debatable.

Bottom line: It wasn’t a “fix” since it was functioning as intended/designed. A “fix” is what Protector’s Strike went through. An ability not functioning as intended/designed.

rickshaw.5279:

Sanis

i guess ppl dont realise what buff, nerf and FIX means…

That depends.

If you’re implying that this was a “buff”… that’s debatable.

If you’re implying that this was a “fix”… it wasn’t. Since the tooltip was accurate and the ability functioned exactly as stated.

If you’re implying that it was a “nerf”… that’s debatable.

Bottom line: It wasn’t a “fix” since it was functioning as intended/designed. A “fix” is what Protector’s Strike went through. An ability not functioning as intended/designed.

I disagree. I define “nerf” as “Unnecessary negative change to an ability”, and fix as “Bug fix/balance fix”. The PW change was a nerf – it was completely unnecessary, and didn’t change the issue people were having (Quickness PW spam). The assassins Sig change was a “fix” – the original sig was being used in a way Anet hadn’t envisioned (glass cannon 2 shotting), so it was “fixed” to be more viable for other builds, and less gimmicky. Of course, this is just the way I see it, not trying to claim it as fact.

I took a 8k cloak and dagger the other day on my glassmer.