Guild Wars 2

How does an NFL team have an 0-16 record for the season? Must be bad matchmaking, right? No. Not right. It’s bad teamwork.

Like when when we lose a teamfight at the beginning of a match and 2 people on my team say GG in team chat. That’s a loser mentality. I’m not saying get good, just stop lying to yourselves.

R O C.6574:

How does an NFL team have an 0-16 record for the season? Must be bad matchmaking, right? No. Not right. It’s bad teamwork.

Like when when we lose a teamfight at the beginning of a match and 2 people on my team say GG in team chat. That’s a loser mentality. I’m not saying get good, just stop lying to yourselves.

Thats the definition of bad matchmaking. They were partnered with bad players.

I agree its basically a lie. But what does happen in this game since just about any idiot can grind to ruby is people end up being stuck playing with people much better then they are if they play a lot since you can’t go down in league even if you lose 100 in a row. I think that’s what we are seeing in some cases when people talk about losing streaks.

Drussthelegend.2630:

I agree its basically a lie. But what does happen in this game since just about any idiot can grind to ruby is people end up being stuck playing with people much better then they are if they play a lot since you can’t go down in league even if you lose 100 in a row. I think that’s what we are seeing in some cases when people talk about losing streaks.

If this were the real reason, people would only get stuck in “MMR Hell” at division barriers, which isn’t the case, is it?

Salamander.2504:

If this were the real reason, people would only get stuck in “MMR Hell” at division barriers, which isn’t the case, is it?

They’d get stuck in “MMR Hell” 15 pips from division barriers is probably closer.

Reikou.7068:

Salamander.2504:

If this were the real reason, people would only get stuck in “MMR Hell” at division barriers, which isn’t the case, is it?

They’d get stuck in “MMR Hell” 15 pips from division barriers is probably closer.

So….. pretty much every time except mid diamond lol

Sooloo.1364:

R O C.6574:

How does an NFL team have an 0-16 record for the season? Must be bad matchmaking, right? No. Not right. It’s bad teamwork.

Like when when we lose a teamfight at the beginning of a match and 2 people on my team say GG in team chat. That’s a loser mentality. I’m not saying get good, just stop lying to yourselves.

Thats the definition of bad matchmaking. They were partnered with bad players.

And those bad players go to the forums and complain about matchmaking. Which parties are in the wrong here?

Point is, it’s very much a team game and the majority of players don’t know how to work together. So instead of fixing their playstyle and actually work with the weakest link, they pray to the matchmaking Gods to give them a team that works well for them.

I’m a DH that had a winrate of 80% till Diamond, finished off the season at 69% winrate. It’s very much a L2P issue for a lot of players who are stuck in a division because they roll the dice by doing they’re own thing.

ROC for President!

Lets make Pvp great again……..

I agree bud I came back to the game last night and played 11 games 7 wins and 4 losses. In the losses I noticed a lot of players with gear and stuff that most pvp players dont so I assume these guys spend a lot of time in pve. Second in 2 matches I was on the team with this thief that cried we all sucked but when I fought next to this guy I noticed he stood in one place beating on the same guy. Poor players will always loss more games then those are good. 1-2 great players can win matches for their team.

Moving forward out of the 11 matches I have played MMR seems to be a non-factor!

R O C.6574:

My analogy is trying to show that even a premade team of professionals can go a whole season without winning: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2008_Detroit_Lions_season

This upsets me more than any other comment in this thread. Low blow.

CtrlAltDLEET.6430:

R O C.6574:

My analogy is trying to show that even a premade team of professionals can go a whole season without winning: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2008_Detroit_Lions_season

This upsets me more than any other comment in this thread. Low blow.

LOL. Go Chargers! (if it makes you feel better my team sucks too)

This season there’s been a lot less ‘getting stuck’ for me than the past. I think they’ve mostly fixed MMR hell for all but the worst players who actually are the reason they are in MMR hell.

There are still those unwinnable games here and there either because your team is worse or their team is better but not enough to constantly cause losses into a 20 loss streak or even a 10 loss streak.

Sooloo.1364:

R O C.6574:

How does an NFL team have an 0-16 record for the season? Must be bad matchmaking, right? No. Not right. It’s bad teamwork.

Like when when we lose a teamfight at the beginning of a match and 2 people on my team say GG in team chat. That’s a loser mentality. I’m not saying get good, just stop lying to yourselves.

Thats the definition of bad matchmaking. They were partnered with bad players.

I can’t tell if this is sarcasm or not. We are supposedly being matched with players in our MMR range and are matched against players slightly above or below the MMR of our team. My experience in S3 reflects this. I’ve had a couple of blowout loses, but those are caused by AFK/DC scumbags, not Anet matchmaking algorithms.

That’s odd. Seems around 80% of my matches result in blowouts.

I find the whole thread self serving and full of lies, just like the OP said about me. I am not lying. I am not grinding. I resent that you call me a liar. I experienced mmr hell in seas 2. It is real. It is not fun. I am not a bad player. I don’t suck.

People probably want to believe they earned their 20+ game win streak just as much as people want to believe they didn’t deserve their 20+ losing streak. In both cases, they likely didn’t deserve it. Of course there are a lot of excellent and terrible players, but any system that rewards and punishes them to this extreme is broken. Then you have the decent, mostly competent players caught in the middle getting stuck in Sapphire or carried to Legendary, depending on which end of MMR they find themselves on. It’s absurd.

Of course this is overly simplified, but it seems to be more or less what’s happening.

We can argue back in forth all day, but until someone can prove something with some math its a baseless argument on both ends.

I don’t think there is anything to prove.
You can have no matchmaking where everyone is thrown into the first spot available and the winner is totally random.
You can have real matchmaking where every game is almost a draw.
Or you can have whatever this is, pre-determined win/loss.

Sooloo.1364:

I don’t think there is anything to prove.
You can have no matchmaking where everyone is thrown into the first spot available and the winner is totally random.
You can have real matchmaking where every game is almost a draw.
Or you can have whatever this is, pre-determined win/loss.

Good luck creating an mmr system that makes every game a close match regardless of team comp and individual player skill.

kin korn karn.9023:

People probably want to believe they earned their 20+ game win streak just as much as people want to believe they didn’t deserve their 20+ losing streak. In both cases, they likely didn’t deserve it. Of course there are a lot of excellent and terrible players, but any system that rewards and punishes them to this extreme is broken. Then you have the decent, mostly competent players caught in the middle getting stuck in Sapphire or carried to Legendary, depending on which end of MMR they find themselves on. It’s absurd.

Of course this is overly simplified, but it seems to be more or less what’s happening.

So i’m stuck in sapphire and I consider myself a mostly competent player, why exactly do you think I could be getting carried to Legendary? So if what you say is true, I could get an alt account and take my pristine MMR and go straight to Legendary. Sorry, not buying it. I do think if I figured out how to play through CC chains, condi melt, and hard focus, I would then be Legendary.

R O C.6574:

So i’m stuck in sapphire and I consider myself a mostly competent player, why exactly do you think I could be getting carried to Legendary? So if what you say is true, I could get an alt account and take my pristine MMR and go straight to Legendary. Sorry, not buying it. I do think if I figured out how to play through CC chains, condi melt, and hard focus, I would then be Legendary.

What I meant was… Say you have two players with similar skill, general competence, who end up on opposite sides of MMR. One of them could shine being matched with skilled players and ride a couple healthy streaks all the way to Legendary. While the other gets stuck with inexperienced players he/she can’t carry for most of the season.

As for alt accounts, if you’ve been reading this forum, you know that there are examples of people experiencing both extremes on separate accounts. But I wouldn’t recommend hopping on your alt acct until you feel comfortable playing in this meta. (No offense, but in your last sentence you clearly stated that you do not.)

kin korn karn.9023:

R O C.6574:

So i’m stuck in sapphire and I consider myself a mostly competent player, why exactly do you think I could be getting carried to Legendary? So if what you say is true, I could get an alt account and take my pristine MMR and go straight to Legendary. Sorry, not buying it. I do think if I figured out how to play through CC chains, condi melt, and hard focus, I would then be Legendary.

What I meant was… Say you have two players with similar skill, general competence, who end up on opposite sides of MMR. One of them could shine being matched with skilled players and ride a couple healthy streaks all the way to Legendary. While the other gets stuck with inexperienced players he/she can’t carry for most of the season.

As for alt accounts, if you’ve been reading this forum, you know that there are examples of people experiencing both extremes on separate accounts. But I wouldn’t recommend hopping on your alt acct until you feel comfortable playing in this meta. (No offense, but in your last sentence you clearly stated that you do not.)

I play condi trap druid. Most of the time i do pretty well. But there are just some matches were i get killed. It seems to be teams with good condi pressure and clense for their teams. So just to keep this on point, i don’t blame mmr or matchmaking. I blame my own experience and knowledge of the game.

FrownyClown.8402:

We can argue back in forth all day, but until someone can prove something with some math its a baseless argument on both ends.

The existence of mmr hell/heaven in S2 has been proven with math. There was a big thread on it, even devs acknowledged it.

FrownyClown.8402:

Good luck creating an mmr system that makes every game a close match regardless of team comp and individual player skill.

The problem is not that this matchmaking doesn’t manage to accomplish that. The problem is, it’s not even trying to. Quite the opposite, in fact.

Astralporing.1957:

FrownyClown.8402:

We can argue back in forth all day, but until someone can prove something with some math its a baseless argument on both ends.

The existence of mmr hell/heaven in S2 has been proven with math. There was a big thread on it, even devs acknowledged it.

FrownyClown.8402:

Good luck creating an mmr system that makes every game a close match regardless of team comp and individual player skill.

The problem is not that this matchmaking doesn’t manage to accomplish that. The problem is, it’s not even trying to. Quite the opposite, in fact.

That was season 2 bro. It’s way better this season

here’s my take on it….

when the season starts everyone is in a lower division that they more or less can crush and get on a massive win streak leading to a very good MMR and while there riding this high they get paired with other players who are also all on win streaks of course this mean playing against better players however your teammates are likely very solid….. now if somehow you start to lose maybe duo or premading with friends of a lesser skill and therefore losing a few games ( all in the name of having fun with friends…isn’t that the point after all) your mmr gets lowered drastically closer to the 50/50 win rate level where your paired with people who also have this win rate (which is where the baddies come in) since you are paired with them and against them its impossible to string a win streak together to climb out of that predicament bc some games are a blowout(when you play against the baddies) and some are impossible to win( the otherside of the coin)….

personally id just like to see 2 things…

1. players can drop divisions nothing is more frustrating then getting to t7 diamond and getting paired with someone in legendary who no longer cares if they lose pips ( there would need to be decay on pips aswell to avoid people from simply not playing) i would suggest once you unlock the “title” for that season you forever keep that however you will lose the emblem.

2. players should be paired with random players in a certain pip range reguardless of MMR OR the PIP system should be chunked or only used as a reward system and make leagues based SOLELY on MMR

Managed a 4 game win streak already this season, compared to last, I just went through long losing streaks or win loss win win loss loss win loss loss etc, but most matches seem a bit one sided.

R O C.6574:

kin korn karn.9023:

R O C.6574:

So i’m stuck in sapphire and I consider myself a mostly competent player, why exactly do you think I could be getting carried to Legendary? So if what you say is true, I could get an alt account and take my pristine MMR and go straight to Legendary. Sorry, not buying it. I do think if I figured out how to play through CC chains, condi melt, and hard focus, I would then be Legendary.

What I meant was… Say you have two players with similar skill, general competence, who end up on opposite sides of MMR. One of them could shine being matched with skilled players and ride a couple healthy streaks all the way to Legendary. While the other gets stuck with inexperienced players he/she can’t carry for most of the season.

As for alt accounts, if you’ve been reading this forum, you know that there are examples of people experiencing both extremes on separate accounts. But I wouldn’t recommend hopping on your alt acct until you feel comfortable playing in this meta. (No offense, but in your last sentence you clearly stated that you do not.)

I play condi trap druid. Most of the time i do pretty well. But there are just some matches were i get killed. It seems to be teams with good condi pressure and clense for their teams. So just to keep this on point, i don’t blame mmr or matchmaking. I blame my own experience and knowledge of the game.

And very well you should. There are a lot of delusional players who think they’re better than they are. (I’m probably one of them, to a degree.) For the ones on losing streaks they DO deserve, they get angry and refuse to look inward. For the ones who end up with win steaks they DON’T deserve, the poor matchmaking reinforces their delusions.

Anyway, you might feel confident that matchmaking is working fine for you, but don’t assume that everyone is having the same experience. It’s very clearly failing many players. A lot of the evidence is based on a player’s self-assessment, which is typically very skewed, to be sure. But there’s way more to it than that.

Personally I don’t think they’ll find a way to make matchmaking fair for everyone while also pandering to both new and elite PvPers, which seems to be the priority. Everyone between be kitten ed (or perhaps exalted, depending on your luck).

Btw, I’d strongly recommend ditching your trap druid.

R O C.6574:

That was season 2 bro. It’s way better this season

Yes, it is. Which doesn’t change the fact that the system is intentionally creating uneven matches.

It is better only in the context of s2 being really, really, really bad.

Weaker players bubble up further than they should because of the way the pip and division protection works along with streaks. Ruby and above is really where the model starts to work – except there’s a contingent of players in Ruby that are not strong enough for the league, but don’t fall back so they hover in ruby and imbalance fights. Mismatching aside (possible algorithm v population issue) , this is the core issue.

vesica tempestas.1563:

Weaker players bubble up further than they should because of the way the pip and division protection works along with streaks. Ruby and above is really where the model starts to work – except there’s a contingent of players in Ruby that are not strong enough for the league, but don’t fall back so they hover in ruby and imbalance fights. Mismatching aside (possible algorithm v population issue) , this is the core issue.

Division protection is a lesser problem than protection from losing ranks in division 1-3 and protection from losing pips in amber. Without this many people wouldn’t even get into the next division.