Guild Wars 2

Make rangers’ pets scale directly off of the rangers’ stats. That way, glassy rangers have strong, glassy pets, and tanky rangers do not, which encourages them to get utility/survivable pets instead.

Right now, why use tanky pets when you can use pets that crit for 6k even for bunker rangers? More diversity in pet choices. More logical game mechanics (bunkers critting for 6-8k is awkward balance). Done and done.

Or we can nerf Ranger pets by introducing the “Warrior” pet.

Now with new Hundred Fails! Twice the damage you wish you could do to moving opponents!

zone.1073:

Make rangers’ pets scale directly off of the rangers’ stats. That way, glassy rangers have strong, glassy pets, and tanky rangers do not, which encourages them to get utility/survivable pets instead.

Right now, why use tanky pets when you can use pets that crit for 6k even for bunker rangers? More diversity in pet choices. More logical game mechanics (bunkers critting for 6-8k is awkward balance). Done and done.

If Anet were to implement a system like this, how much would you say the jaguar should be able to hit for, if I were to go full glass cannon? How much should the birds hit for? This would be very interesting to know.

Full glass, I’d say no more than 1,000 extra than what they hit for now. As at the moment, they’re already incredibly strong

If i were glass cannon ranger then i would like to have a pet being able to tank so that i can deal damage without interrupting for dodge/heal/support/protection skills

edit: ok… in spvp pets are not really often the target of any enemy player…^^

TheMightyAltroll.3485:

Full glass, I’d say no more than 1,000 extra than what they hit for now. As at the moment, they’re already incredibly strong

Yeah, that’s what I thought – another thread calling for massive nerfs.

The ability for a full bunker ranger to be able to hit for huge damage because of his pet is ridiculous, and there isn’t any way that a Ranger can justify it. Balance is set up around the idea that you start off at some base, and sacrifice something to get something else. If you run with high damage, you sacrifice survivability. If you run high survivability, you sacrifice damage.

Right now, Rangers get burst damage comparable to glassy builds, but with the tankiness of a full bunker. That is not balanced.

GREAT IDEA! This way my pets bleed on autoattack and 2 skills that put 4 stacks of bleeding on, and my SB skill where my pets next three attacks also inflict another bleed will also tic for 120 along with all my bleeds. 25 bleed stacks here I come. On top of that it will be IMPOSSIBLE to kill with 2k toughness….

This method will not work. People just need to learn to kite and learn to dodge and learn to apply protection. BM is easily countered and brings NOTHING to a team fight.

Pet scalling with stats rips off the freedom of what the player want to do with their class. The real problem is that there should be a trade off, if your pet does high damage he should die easily.
It would be better to reduce pet HP, make then take less AoE dmg or to have stats adjust on traits. For example:

Beastmastery trait 12
Natural Healing
Your pets have natural health regeneration, but it does 10% less damage.

*The number is just for the example, instead of saying that 10% is a bad/good number stick to the idea.

ranger’s pet should account for half the character dps
a bunker ranger should deal the same damage any other bunker “insert class”…I don’t recall guardian bunkers bursting for 5-6k with drake/bird.
pet’s damage has to be toned down, A LOT (same goes for rock dogs, or elementalists’ summons, thieves’ guild and so on…everything should scale according to character’s stats, not be a fixed value)

Eurantien.4632:

GREAT IDEA! This way my pets bleed on autoattack and 2 skills that put 4 stacks of bleeding on, and my SB skill where my pets next three attacks also inflict another bleed will also tic for 120 along with all my bleeds. 25 bleed stacks here I come. On top of that it will be IMPOSSIBLE to kill with 2k toughness….

This method will not work. People just need to learn to kite and learn to dodge and learn to apply protection. BM is easily countered and brings NOTHING to a team fight.

Actually, if you can stack 25 bleeds with your pet and yourself, what’s wrong with that?

It’s not even comparable to getting hit for up to 15k almost in a second by ravens.

The basic premise that your stats determine your damage and survivability with all the trade offs and the opportunity costs has to be established for the ranger class firstly. If the ratio between survivability and damage is then skewed towards any one direction due to the traits or weapon/pet skills, that’s something that can be tackled afterwards.

This change alone may not address the issue with NPC damage across the board, but just for the ranger and it is much needed.

Shar.3402:

ranger’s pet should account for half the character dps
a bunker ranger should deal the same damage any other bunker “insert class”…I don’t recall guardian bunkers bursting for 5-6k with drake/bird.
pet’s damage has to be toned down, A LOT (same goes for rock dogs, or elementalists’ summons, thieves’ guild and so on…everything should scale according to character’s stats, not be a fixed value)

nobody complains about necro minions =(

Personally I would rather have pets gain stats from the ranger then a nerf to all rangers due to the strength of a bunker ranger with a dps pet. I have known this would one day be an issue in that it is impossible to properly balance. When you have the ability to be survivable and do great burst damage it is a problem, the reverse of this would be an issue too but pet’s can’t really force a player to attack them in sPvP. The other issues are condition rangers using burst pets and other such things.

I am of course not saying that pets should be completely mirrored in player stats, that may be a little much. But have a certain amount of the pets attributes be base, and the ranger adds a a portion of their attributes on top of it. This way the dps pets on a BM would not outburst a power rangers burst, but they would certainly take less damage than it allowing for the integrity of roles to be in place.

vicious.5683:

Shar.3402:

ranger’s pet should account for half the character dps
a bunker ranger should deal the same damage any other bunker “insert class”…I don’t recall guardian bunkers bursting for 5-6k with drake/bird.
pet’s damage has to be toned down, A LOT (same goes for rock dogs, or elementalists’ summons, thieves’ guild and so on…everything should scale according to character’s stats, not be a fixed value)

nobody complains about necro minions =(

they take up utility slots, and don’t burst like ravens or drakes or whatever anyway :p

Shar.3402:

vicious.5683:

Shar.3402:

ranger’s pet should account for half the character dps
a bunker ranger should deal the same damage any other bunker “insert class”…I don’t recall guardian bunkers bursting for 5-6k with drake/bird.
pet’s damage has to be toned down, A LOT (same goes for rock dogs, or elementalists’ summons, thieves’ guild and so on…everything should scale according to character’s stats, not be a fixed value)

nobody complains about necro minions =(

they take up utility slots, and don’t burst like ravens or drakes or whatever anyway :p

I don’t think we should compare utility skill with rangers’ pets and drakes have one burst skill thats easy to see if you pay attention to the pet. That being said i think best would be for pets to have base stats and then get some % from the rangers stats.

I’ve never understood why pets were an entirely separate entity from the player itself.

Example: One of the biggest weaknesses for a condition spec’d player is the lack of burst. You get strong consistent damage in exchange for the ability to say “at X%, I can drop you”, which is completely fair.

However for some reason Rangers are allowed this split. The ranger himself can do excellent condition damage, and their pet can do solid direct damage. Why? Why do they, out of 8 separate classes, get the ability to split their spec? Its not like condi spec rangers are clearly inferior to other condi specs – they’re competitively powerful compared to other condi specs, why do they get a pet that does direct damage to complement their spec?

Rangers are OP atm. We have to really outwit ourselves to get passed some of those bunker rangers nowadays. I died of a pet hitting me 4k while in downed state and his master nowhere in sight (lols). I think the pets range of attack should be reduced if anything. If the ranger is not facing his opponent then his pet shouldn’t be after him for miles away from his master.

The leash range needs to be shortened. I do not think the “AI” is too strong because other classes are just as powerful with their “AI” like phantasm mesmer and a few turret engies for those skilled enough to use turrets. Those builds kitten on beastmasters. Like all these builds they bring nothing to a team fight and are good only for that backpoint or farpoint 1 v 1 and adds a little bit of diversity to the game. However, ranger has the advantage that his pet can go chase half way across the map. Remove this ability and it should be good (though pet should be able to chase a bit out of the ranger’s 1200 range imo).

When exactly was it that rangers were turned into gods, according to all the whining threads ?

I know these threads started post april 30th patch, yet noone can point to anything in that patch that changed our status so much to be worthy of all the crying you see on a daily basis. Of course, all these threads are posted by the same people…

The BM ranger build has been around since release, yet it is now that ppl complain about it. Perhaps it may just be that many players have gotten better at playing their rangers?

zone.1073:

Make rangers’ pets scale directly off of the rangers’ stats. That way, glassy rangers have strong, glassy pets, and tanky rangers do not, which encourages them to get utility/survivable pets instead.

Right now, why use tanky pets when you can use pets that crit for 6k even for bunker rangers? More diversity in pet choices. More logical game mechanics (bunkers critting for 6-8k is awkward balance). Done and done.

You can nerf the damage of my bunker ranger’s pets when his Ricochet (axe auto) stops hitting for 197 damage because all ranger attacks by default do half or less of the damage of other classes.

You can nerf bunker ranger pet damage when we get some team utility. Last I checked, the guardian and ele bring myriad boons, healing, CC, and with retal guardians actually grant the group a lot of damage and bunker eles can run hybrid bunker and not only do burst and sustained, but unlike the bunker ranger their damage is all AoE.

All my BM bunker brings is 1v1 ability. He brings nothing else that another class can’t do better. He’s got crap sustained damage, his damage is single target, he’s only gor 1 CC with aoe wolf fear on a long cd and a stupid ai that does it whenever it feels like (and a base 1.5 sec cast time).

i agree with this idea

It really is a no-brainer to everyone with an objective view on it.

sure. swap dps pets for double moa ( cone daze ). this ranger would be far tankier than the current variety with better teamfight support.

would pets scale off our critical damage bonus? if so, the glass rangers would put out more damage than thieves could have pre-mug nerf. 1500 range longbow with 20 stacks of vuln on opener with pets that hit a lot harder than jag & raven currently do.

you can’t make a power spec atm that has effective pets since power relies on crit & crit dmg to succeed, which leaves no points for BM, let alone Wilderness Survival ( 5 points at least is pmuch mandatory ). but if our pets scaled along with this investment, the burst would be, well, totally radical. please do give.

condi-wise, rabid amu w/ BM VII would be the most viable option ( prob with reef / marsh drake ).

a change like this would require an entire balance pass of all pet abilities in relation to their potential impact based on character spec. i think ANet chose the current path b/c it is far easier to balance the pets individually if they only rely on their own stats for performance.

Pet does too much of the Rangers damage. It is also completely not viable to try and kill a pet because they have Uranium-Nickel plating and barely take damage. Both of these things need to be addressed.

faeral.7120:

sure. swap dps pets for double moa ( cone daze ). this ranger would be far tankier than the current variety with better teamfight support.

would pets scale off our critical damage bonus? if so, the glass rangers would put out more damage than thieves could have pre-mug nerf. 1500 range longbow with 20 stacks of vuln on opener with pets that hit a lot harder than jag & raven currently do.

you can’t make a power spec atm that has effective pets since power relies on crit & crit dmg to succeed, which leaves no points for BM, let alone Wilderness Survival ( 5 points at least is pmuch mandatory ). but if our pets scaled along with this investment, the burst would be, well, totally radical. please do give.

condi-wise, rabid amu w/ BM VII would be the most viable option ( prob with reef / marsh drake ).

a change like this would require an entire balance pass of all pet abilities in relation to their potential impact based on character spec. i think ANet chose the current path b/c it is far easier to balance the pets individually if they only rely on their own stats for performance.

Hehe yeah, but that’s not what anyone here crying for nerfs would like to see. They want to see rangers nerfed, simple as that, and I can tell you noone that agrees with this idea would like to see the damage from our pets increase, which would be the natural and obvious thing to happen as well. A pet that constantly crits like its master- hell yes, we would be able to burn anything down so fast it would cause another uproar.

But I guess, that wasn’t what the OP or the other folks in this thread had in mind, right?

OGDeadHead.8326:

A pet that constantly crits like its master- hell yes, we would be able to burn anything down so fast it would cause another uproar.

But I guess, that wasn’t what the OP or the other folks in this thread had in mind, right?

I’m pretty sure what the OP had in mind was to ->balance<- the class cause that… would make the game more balanced = better?!
If the ranger needs a nerf to be balanced, like you proposed then so be it because you said yourself: “to burn anything down” would not be balanced.
To scale pet stats of the ranger stats is just the logical thing to do. A pet from a bunker ranger should not do the same dmg as the same pet from an offensive ranger.
The actually numbers have to be balanced ofc.
If the raven crits for 8k with f2 atm it’s probably not very balanced if he would crit for 15k afterwards – or is that your understanding of balance???

tarcheg.4872:

OGDeadHead.8326:

A pet that constantly crits like its master- hell yes, we would be able to burn anything down so fast it would cause another uproar.

But I guess, that wasn’t what the OP or the other folks in this thread had in mind, right?

I’m pretty sure what the OP had in mind was to ->balance<- the class cause that… would make the game more balanced = better?!
If the ranger needs a nerf to be balanced, like you proposed then so be it because you said yourself: “to burn anything down” would not be balanced.
To scale pet stats of the ranger stats is just the logical thing to do. A pet from a bunker ranger should not do the same dmg as the same pet from an offensive ranger.
The actually numbers have to be balanced ofc.
If the raven crits for 8k with f2 atm it’s probably not very balanced if he would crit for 15k afterwards – or is that your understanding of balance???

Nope, it isn’t. But this thread is a suggestion to nerf rangers, pure and simple. You propose us to have our pets scale of our stats, but only in a way so it benefits our opponents. If that change were to make our pets stronger than they currently are, that would of course not be accepted.

This is just another “cry for nerfs”-thread.

Also, “To scale pet stats of the ranger stats is just the logical thing to do” – is it now? Aren’t the pet a separate being from their masters? It would seem the will is to make rangers keep all of the drawbacks being forced to use a pet brings, but not keep any of the advantages.

Also, I ask once again – why this sudden uproar since april 30th – anyone?

You do realize that something that is blatantly overpowered has to be nerfed? That’s how it works.
If you buy smokes with a 10 dollar bill and get change for a 100 dollar bill, that doesn’t mean you can now keep the money or demand to at least get an extra 50 bucks to give it back, just because the cashier realized it a couple seconds after she handed you the money.

No OP, they don’t need to do that…they need to change the ratio of damage. Did you know that a pet accounts for at least 40% of a rangers damage output? Lower that and give the power back to the Ranger. Congratulations, you guys aren’t complaining about the pets for BMs now…you’re complaining about the class’s overall damage.

Reduce pet’s aggro range, give the ranger one pet only (why the need for two pets in pvp I have no idea) and remove the ranger pet’s ability to regen health (but allow it to keep ‘gain health on critical hits’) if the bm chooses to trait in it.

These would be my fixes if I could do it.