Guild Wars 2

I’m trying really hard to not full this post of bad words, but I think that matchmaking is still the same of the last season where if you start losing, you keep losing all the kittening day. I had a 12 streak loss after 1 victory.
I won’t complayining about ignorant people that accuse everybody to not doing their job, in an arena, but I think that they are frustrated as much as I am, because this PvP is really becoming not funny.

So according to forum, loss streak =broken MM. Win streak =broken MM. 50%=broken MM. I can not even.

When you get a 12 streak loss/win, I think that yes, MM is broken, if you join in solo. If you join as a premade you can even don’t lose/win a match, but matches should be balanced and a streak of the same result means that it’s not, imho

Strangely most people complaining about MM are on a loose streak.
Last season a lot of us (including myself) came to the conclusion because of ridicuolusly long winning streaks and spawn camping.
Oh and: 12 games? Those who complained last season easily lost 60 matches in a row.
That is broken MM.
Loosing a few games is just the usual clustering. Randomness does that. If you roll a dice6 you wont always get ‘1,2,3,45,6’, you will have 6,6,6,6,4,3,3 much more often than you expect.

Matchmaking is not broken. It just got worse – as intended. Last season you got matched with similar skilled players in one team. This is gone. Maybe its better for beginners and bad players now.

warbignime.4610:

So according to forum, loss streak =broken MM. Win streak =broken MM. 50%=broken MM. I can not even.

I think you misunderstand problem about 50% w/l. In most cases algorithm always puts together a team that has 90% win chance and other team with 10% win chances which leads to very lopsided and boring matches. Why is it done? To ensure that very 50% w/l ratio. Take same player with high MMR, he will be experiencing win-> loss->win -> loss -> win -> loss. It is not fun.

In any game where devs used common sense both teams have relative same chance to win. If you win more games you face better opponents but also get better teammates. In GW2 it is not the case. The old 50/50 algo always made sure you have 50% w/l ration (not win chance) by forcing you into lopsided matches. Season 2 also added extra logic which ensured that one team always had better chance to win to make players with high MMR to climb faster to high divisions. Those 2 combined led to real extremes in matches. Personally as a player i feel like i am strapped to the chair and forced to watch same 2 videos: 1 where my team gets spawn camped and next one where my team spawn camps enemy team. I don’t have any impact on outcome.

Cynz.9437:

warbignime.4610:

So according to forum, loss streak =broken MM. Win streak =broken MM. 50%=broken MM. I can not even.

I think you misunderstand problem about 50% w/l. In most cases algorithm always puts together a team that has 90% win chance and other team with 10% win chances which leads to very lopsided and boring matches. Why is it done? To ensure that very 50% w/l ratio. Take same player with high MMR, he will be experiencing win-> loss->win -> loss -> win -> loss. It is not fun.

In any game where devs used common sense both teams have relative same chance to win. If you win more games you face better opponents but also get better teammates. In GW2 it is not the case. The old 50/50 algo always made sure you have 50% w/l ration (not win chance) by forcing you into lopsided matches. Season 2 also added extra logic which ensured that one team always had better chance to win to make players with high MMR to climb faster to high divisions. Those 2 combined led to real extremes in matches. Personally as a player i feel like i am strapped to the chair and forced to watch same 2 videos: 1 where my team gets spawn camped and next one where my team spawn camps enemy team. I don’t have any impact on outcome.

Dude, you couldn’t be more wrong, idk where you are reading that. But first before commenting on anything you are clueless about, my advice is to first read the notes or how the algo is supposed to work. Without more ado, here is how it works:

-BOTH TEAM HAVE A 50% CHANCE OF WINNING THE GANE it’s not 90% chance of winning or 10% of losing, that’s miscontruing the data or asinine math. How is 5 vs 5 result in one team having 90% chnace of winning???

-The outlier are 4 vs 6; and these games are winnable as well since all it takes is a mistake to turn the game around.

No, you are jut were you belong, accept that fact. If you can’t win 5 vs 5 or 4 vs 6. I am afraid you are were you belong, though achievement chaser could be hampering your progress but how often are you match with them?

And how are you gonna explain 500-100, 100-500, 500-100, 100-500 matches if you really think that each team has 50% win/loss chance? Unless i team up with someone or play later at night, it is always the same i either watch my team being spawn camped or my team spawn camps enemy team. Even matches are extremely rare.

Match making’s biggest problem is that it lacks the incorporation of certain factors that it needs to be able to create good matches. It looks only at numbers and not identification of the game’s current meta or “state of class balancing within conquest”. So we get a lot of those matches where it’s a bad class stack vs. a good class stack and even best case scenario “all players are of same exact skill”, we already know who is going to win in: Tempest/Tempest/Rev/Scrapper/Reaper vs. Thief/Thief/DH/War/Vanilla Ranger.

They’d have a good start on fixing this problem by not allowing class stacking general. This way we get 5 different classes, regardless. This would really help to create better game match ups.

I for one, would rather wait an extra 2-3 minutes in que for less volatile matches.

Cynz.9437:

And how are you gonna explain 500-100, 100-500, 500-100, 100-500 matches if you really think that each team has 50% win/loss chance? Unless i team up with someone or play later at night, it is always the same i either watch my team being spawn camped or my team spawn camps enemy team. Even matches are extremely rare.

Achievement chasers , mistake, noobs players/new player who rode the high MMR train last season. It has nothing to do with the MM system. Heck, I have won game where we were behind by 300 pts, all it takes is one mistake.

Let’s say a 1 rode the HIGH MMR ride during S2, so the system unmistakably label him as a 10, dont you think this guy would be a detriment on a 5 vs 5 game?

Another one is the disparities between both camps, like supp have to prioritize by the MMR. A team with no supp has slim chacne of winning against a team with a supp (ele).

In short, the MM algo is the best we ever had, and if u can’t win your matchup especially if you didn’t start in amber then maybe you are where you belong.

Fivedawgs.4267:

Cynz.9437:

And how are you gonna explain 500-100, 100-500, 500-100, 100-500 matches if you really think that each team has 50% win/loss chance? Unless i team up with someone or play later at night, it is always the same i either watch my team being spawn camped or my team spawn camps enemy team. Even matches are extremely rare.

Achievement chasers , mistake, noobs players/new player who rode the high MMR train last season. It has nothing to do with the MM system. Heck, I have won game where we were behind by 300 pts, all it takes is one mistake.

Let’s say a 1 rode the HIGH MMR ride during S2, so the system unmistakably label him as a 10, dont you think this guy would be a detriment on a 5 vs 5 game?

Another one is the disparities between both camps, like supp have to prioritize by the MMR. A team with no supp has slim chacne of winning against a team with a supp (ele).

In short, the MM algo is the best we ever had, and if u can’t win your matchup especially if you didn’t start in amber then maybe you are where you belong.

You really don’t read what i say do you? I give up.

Well, let’s see…

Cynz.9437:

Fivedawgs.4267:

Cynz.9437:

And how are you gonna explain 500-100, 100-500, 500-100, 100-500 matches if you really think that each team has 50% win/loss chance? Unless i team up with someone or play later at night, it is always the same i either watch my team being spawn camped or my team spawn camps enemy team. Even matches are extremely rare.

First reason Achievement chasers , mistake, noobs players/new player who rode the high MMR train last season. It has nothing to do with the MM system. Heck, I have won game where we were behind by 300 pts, all it takes is one mistake.

Detailed explanatiin of the first reason Let’s say a 1 rode the HIGH MMR ride during S2, so the system unmistakably label him as a 10, dont you think this guy would be a detriment on a 5 vs 5 game?

Second reason Another one is the disparities between both camps, like supp have to prioritize by the MMR. A team with no supp has slim chacne of winning against a team with a supp (ele).

In short, the MM algo is the best we ever had, and if u can’t win your matchup especially if you didn’t start in amber then maybe you are where you belong.

You really don’t read what i say do you? I give up.

Just say, you are giving up because you are wrong .. that works as well

I am not sure if the algorith intentionally creates a 50/50% winrate.
It seems to be what most players think, Ive heard it a couple of times, but never seen actual proof of it.
Ive read trough the matchmaking pseudo code in the wiki. I didnt see anything that would imply it, but honestly Im not good enough at programming to be able to tell for sure. Also its like a year old or smthng.

However I would like to apply simple logical thinking to the situation.
The current matchmaking tries to create ‘fair’ matchups by setting an average and mixing above and below average players together in both teams.
Now usually your personal rating should not change significantly with every match, but let me overexagurate:
Basic) You are an average player.
1) You win a match
2) System now thinks you are above average>Places you with below average
3) You loose a match
4) System now thinks you are below average> Places you with above average
5) You win a match

And so on. So even if the algorithm didnt actually try to create rigged matches, it might unintentionally do so. However that would imply a much higher impact from recently played games than likely.
Almost as if we had the ‘MMR-reset’ so many of us asked for.
If that was the case things should settle in the next days.

If your matchups are repeadedly unfair and create streaks, it could either be due to luck/bad luck, which seems most likely, unusual high impact of other factors like Q time, amount of players to choose from…or it could be that the system considers you a lot better than you actually are (for example if you had undeserved winning streaks in S2) and thinks you should win matchups you possibly cant. In that case you just need to hold out until you reach your skill level.

Did you people miss the official explaination from Anet in one of the threads that was posted a few days ago? The mm explaination isnt on wiki bc we have a totally new mm for season 3 that Anet created for the league only. https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/pvp/so-we-re-back-to-50-50-matches/first.

One team will always have an advantage over the other in the matchups. Both teams never have 50% chance to win, more like 60%-40% to win/lose.

Evan Lesh.3295:

Deimos Tel Arin.7391:

season 3 we get both
i.e.

red – blue
8 – 8
8 – 9
9 – 8
8 – 9
9 – 8

something like that maybe.
otherwise, one team gonna have slightly higher overall MMR.

Season 1 would have been closer:
6 – 7
6 – 5
5 – 5
5 – 4
4 – 4

Your season 2 example is accurate, though could be closer in some circumstances.

Season 3 will be like a sorted version of season 1:
4 – 5
4 – 5
4 – 6
5 – 6
5 – 7

sanctuary.1068:

Did you people miss the official explaination from Anet in one of the threads that was posted a few days ago? The mm explaination isnt on wiki bc we have a totally new mm for season 3 that Anet created for the league only. https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/pvp/so-we-re-back-to-50-50-matches/first.

One team will always have an advantage over the other in the matchups. Both teams never have 50% chance to win, more like 60%-40% to win/lose.

Evan Lesh.3295:

Deimos Tel Arin.7391:

season 3 we get both
i.e.

red – blue
8 – 8
8 – 9
9 – 8
8 – 9
9 – 8

something like that maybe.
otherwise, one team gonna have slightly higher overall MMR.

Season 1 would have been closer:
6 – 7
6 – 5
5 – 5
5 – 4
4 – 4

Your season 2 example is accurate, though could be closer in some circumstances.

Season 3 will be like a sorted version of season 1:
4 – 5
4 – 5
4 – 6
5 – 6
5 – 7

I belive that was an outlier, if the system can’t find a 5 vs 5 it will hop on a 6 vs 4. Based on my experience in game, I have yet to face a team where I was like kitten , the MM sucks. Every game I lost was due to afker, * no supp on my team* * Dc*, got outplayed, made a mistake, or matched with legendary wings chasers.

Fivedawgs.4267:

sanctuary.1068:

Did you people miss the official explaination from Anet in one of the threads that was posted a few days ago? The mm explaination isnt on wiki bc we have a totally new mm for season 3 that Anet created for the league only. https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/pvp/so-we-re-back-to-50-50-matches/first.

One team will always have an advantage over the other in the matchups. Both teams never have 50% chance to win, more like 60%-40% to win/lose.

Evan Lesh.3295:

Deimos Tel Arin.7391:

season 3 we get both
i.e.

red – blue
8 – 8
8 – 9
9 – 8
8 – 9
9 – 8

something like that maybe.
otherwise, one team gonna have slightly higher overall MMR.

Season 1 would have been closer:
6 – 7
6 – 5
5 – 5
5 – 4
4 – 4

Your season 2 example is accurate, though could be closer in some circumstances.

Season 3 will be like a sorted version of season 1:
4 – 5
4 – 5
4 – 6
5 – 6
5 – 7

I belive that was an outlier, if the system can’t find a 5 vs 5 it will hop on a 6 vs 4. Based on my experience in game, I have yet to face a team where I was like kitten , the MM sucks. Every game I lost was due to afker, * no supp on my team* * Dc*, got outplayed, made a mistake, or matched with legendary wings chasers.

Nah i think it works exactly how Evan described it. In that way it could be possible to keep a close 50% winrate. If both teams had 50% to win every match, good players could have a really high winrate anyway. If you get 60% winchance you most of the time win bc the quality of the other teams skill is often really low with a few decent players in the teams. Everytime it goes well for me, win streaks, w.e, anet throws me into premades with low divisions in them. True story. The result is as expected, about 40% winrate in those matches when i get those scrubs.

sanctuary.1068:

Fivedawgs.4267:

sanctuary.1068:

Did you people miss the official explaination from Anet in one of the threads that was posted a few days ago? The mm explaination isnt on wiki bc we have a totally new mm for season 3 that Anet created for the league only. https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/pvp/so-we-re-back-to-50-50-matches/first.

One team will always have an advantage over the other in the matchups. Both teams never have 50% chance to win, more like 60%-40% to win/lose.

Evan Lesh.3295:

Deimos Tel Arin.7391:

season 3 we get both
i.e.

red – blue
8 – 8
8 – 9
9 – 8
8 – 9
9 – 8

something like that maybe.
otherwise, one team gonna have slightly higher overall MMR.

Season 1 would have been closer:
6 – 7
6 – 5
5 – 5
5 – 4
4 – 4

Your season 2 example is accurate, though could be closer in some circumstances.

Season 3 will be like a sorted version of season 1:
4 – 5
4 – 5
4 – 6
5 – 6
5 – 7

I belive that was an outlier, if the system can’t find a 5 vs 5 it will hop on a 6 vs 4. Based on my experience in game, I have yet to face a team where I was like kitten , the MM sucks. Every game I lost was due to afker, * no supp on my team* * Dc*, got outplayed, made a mistake, or matched with legendary wings chasers.

Nah i think it works exactly how Evan described it. In that way it could be possible to keep a close 50% winrate. If both teams had 50% to win every match, good players could have a really high winrate anyway. If you get 60% winchance you most of the time win bc the quality of the other teams skill is often really low with a few decent players in the teams. Everytime it goes well for me, win streaks, w.e, anet throws me into premades with low divisions in them. True story. The result is as expected, about 40% winrate in those matches when i get those scrubs.

Well what you are overshadowing is this :

League Matchmaking
Season 2 matchmaking was changed from Season 1 Ranked and Unranked matchmaking to help ensure league positions correlated more with skill instead of simply being based on the hours played. These changes saw a multitude of improvements for Season 2, but unfortunately they also spread out win rates further than we would have liked, as matches became a bit too uneven. We’ve created a new matchmaker for Season 3 that will strike a balance between the two previous seasons, accomplishing the same goals of accuracy from Season 2 but doing so with the evenness of matches that players experienced in Season 1

What Evans gave was an example, I believe it’s an outlier and you believe it’s not, that’s ok but it doesn’t change the fact that the system try to create evenness of matches players experienced in S1 hence 5 vs 5.

Fivedawgs.4267:

sanctuary.1068:

Fivedawgs.4267:

sanctuary.1068:

Did you people miss the official explaination from Anet in one of the threads that was posted a few days ago? The mm explaination isnt on wiki bc we have a totally new mm for season 3 that Anet created for the league only. https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/pvp/so-we-re-back-to-50-50-matches/first.

One team will always have an advantage over the other in the matchups. Both teams never have 50% chance to win, more like 60%-40% to win/lose.

Evan Lesh.3295:

Deimos Tel Arin.7391:

season 3 we get both
i.e.

red – blue
8 – 8
8 – 9
9 – 8
8 – 9
9 – 8

something like that maybe.
otherwise, one team gonna have slightly higher overall MMR.

Season 1 would have been closer:
6 – 7
6 – 5
5 – 5
5 – 4
4 – 4

Your season 2 example is accurate, though could be closer in some circumstances.

Season 3 will be like a sorted version of season 1:
4 – 5
4 – 5
4 – 6
5 – 6
5 – 7

I belive that was an outlier, if the system can’t find a 5 vs 5 it will hop on a 6 vs 4. Based on my experience in game, I have yet to face a team where I was like kitten , the MM sucks. Every game I lost was due to afker, * no supp on my team* * Dc*, got outplayed, made a mistake, or matched with legendary wings chasers.

Nah i think it works exactly how Evan described it. In that way it could be possible to keep a close 50% winrate. If both teams had 50% to win every match, good players could have a really high winrate anyway. If you get 60% winchance you most of the time win bc the quality of the other teams skill is often really low with a few decent players in the teams. Everytime it goes well for me, win streaks, w.e, anet throws me into premades with low divisions in them. True story. The result is as expected, about 40% winrate in those matches when i get those scrubs.

Well what you are overshadowing is this :

League Matchmaking
Season 2 matchmaking was changed from Season 1 Ranked and Unranked matchmaking to help ensure league positions correlated more with skill instead of simply being based on the hours played. These changes saw a multitude of improvements for Season 2, but unfortunately they also spread out win rates further than we would have liked, as matches became a bit too uneven. We’ve created a new matchmaker for Season 3 that will strike a balance between the two previous seasons, accomplishing the same goals of accuracy from Season 2 but doing so with the evenness of matches that players experienced in Season 1

What Evans gave was an example, I believe it’s an outlier and you believe it’s not, that’s ok but it doesn’t change the fact that the system try to create “even essential of matches players experienced in S1” hence 5 vs 5.

In season 2 it made sure the higher mmr players would progress faster to legendary by teaming them together vs lower mmr players. Essentially the best season thus far measuring skill. Season 1 it mixed scrubs with pro players since divison was 50% of the mm and mmr 50% which lead to alot of scrubs got carried by the better players. Now in season 3 the mm tries to mix the higher mmr together so they have a slight advantage but not as in season 2 with such blowouts since its a smaller distance between the mmr teams. However, one team has ALWAYS an advantage over the other team as in slightly higher mmr.

sanctuary.1068:

Fivedawgs.4267:

sanctuary.1068:

Fivedawgs.4267:

sanctuary.1068:

Did you people miss the official explaination from Anet in one of the threads that was posted a few days ago? The mm explaination isnt on wiki bc we have a totally new mm for season 3 that Anet created for the league only. https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/pvp/so-we-re-back-to-50-50-matches/first.

One team will always have an advantage over the other in the matchups. Both teams never have 50% chance to win, more like 60%-40% to win/lose.

Evan Lesh.3295:

Deimos Tel Arin.7391:

season 3 we get both
i.e.

red – blue
8 – 8
8 – 9
9 – 8
8 – 9
9 – 8

something like that maybe.
otherwise, one team gonna have slightly higher overall MMR.

Season 1 would have been closer:
6 – 7
6 – 5
5 – 5
5 – 4
4 – 4

Your season 2 example is accurate, though could be closer in some circumstances.

Season 3 will be like a sorted version of season 1:
4 – 5
4 – 5
4 – 6
5 – 6
5 – 7

I belive that was an outlier, if the system can’t find a 5 vs 5 it will hop on a 6 vs 4. Based on my experience in game, I have yet to face a team where I was like kitten , the MM sucks. Every game I lost was due to afker, * no supp on my team* * Dc*, got outplayed, made a mistake, or matched with legendary wings chasers.

Nah i think it works exactly how Evan described it. In that way it could be possible to keep a close 50% winrate. If both teams had 50% to win every match, good players could have a really high winrate anyway. If you get 60% winchance you most of the time win bc the quality of the other teams skill is often really low with a few decent players in the teams. Everytime it goes well for me, win streaks, w.e, anet throws me into premades with low divisions in them. True story. The result is as expected, about 40% winrate in those matches when i get those scrubs.

Well what you are overshadowing is this :

League Matchmaking
Season 2 matchmaking was changed from Season 1 Ranked and Unranked matchmaking to help ensure league positions correlated more with skill instead of simply being based on the hours played. These changes saw a multitude of improvements for Season 2, but unfortunately they also spread out win rates further than we would have liked, as matches became a bit too uneven. We’ve created a new matchmaker for Season 3 that will strike a balance between the two previous seasons, accomplishing the same goals of accuracy from Season 2 but doing so with the evenness of matches that players experienced in Season 1

What Evans gave was an example, I believe it’s an outlier and you believe it’s not, that’s ok but it doesn’t change the fact that the system try to create “even essential of matches players experienced in S1” hence 5 vs 5.

In season 2 it made sure the higher mmr players would progress faster to legendary by teaming them together vs lower mmr players. Essentially the best season thus far measuring skill. Season 1 it mixed scrubs with pro players since divison was 50% of the mm and mmr 50% which lead to alot of scrubs got carried by the better players. Now in season 3 the mm tries to mix the higher mmr together so they have a slight advantage but not as in season 2 with such blowouts since its a smaller distance between the mmr teams. However, one team has ALWAYS an advantage over the other team as in slightly higher mmr.

And that’s not what this says:

League Matchmaking
Season 2 matchmaking was changed from Season 1 Ranked and Unranked matchmaking to help ensure league positions correlated more with skill instead of simply being based on the hours played. These changes saw a multitude of improvements for Season 2, but unfortunately they also spread out win rates further than we would have liked, as matches became a bit too uneven. We’ve created a new matchmaker for Season 3 that will strike a balance between the two previous seasons, accomplishing the same goals of accuracy from Season 2 but doing so with the evenness of matches that players experienced in Season 1

And I won’t even argue about S2 ladder being the best one,when it was the most despised ladder ever by pro player and casual alike. Helseth quite caused of it.

But you are entitled to your own opinion, hence your own interpretation of the data. So let’s just agree to disagree.

sanctuary.1068:

In season 2 it made sure the higher mmr players would progress faster to legendary by teaming them together vs lower mmr players. Essentially the best season thus far measuring skill. Season 1 it mixed scrubs with pro players since divison was 50% of the mm and mmr 50% which lead to alot of scrubs got carried by the better players. Now in season 3 the mm tries to mix the higher mmr together so they have a slight advantage but not as in season 2 with such blowouts since its a smaller distance between the mmr teams. However, one team has ALWAYS an advantage over the other team as in slightly higher mmr.

Sry to interfere here but thats bullkitten.
If the matchmaking intentionally creates matchups favourable for ‘better’ players, it is exactly the opposite of a good measuring for skill.
Even if we leave the inaccuracy in detecting ‘better’ aside, you qualify as a good player by winning fair matches.
In other words: The only way you can ever prove to be good is if there is any adversity to overcome to begin with.
If you are truly a good player you will advance no matter what opponents you face.
A perfectly competitive game levels out the playing field and leave the rest to the players, it doent try to do their work for them.
Imagine you would coach an athlete but rig his games to only face the very worst competitors because he ‘deserves to win’

Fivedawgs.4267:

sanctuary.1068:

Fivedawgs.4267:

sanctuary.1068:

Fivedawgs.4267:

sanctuary.1068:

Did you people miss the official explaination from Anet in one of the threads that was posted a few days ago? The mm explaination isnt on wiki bc we have a totally new mm for season 3 that Anet created for the league only. https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/pvp/so-we-re-back-to-50-50-matches/first.

One team will always have an advantage over the other in the matchups. Both teams never have 50% chance to win, more like 60%-40% to win/lose.

Evan Lesh.3295:

Deimos Tel Arin.7391:

season 3 we get both
i.e.

red – blue
8 – 8
8 – 9
9 – 8
8 – 9
9 – 8

something like that maybe.
otherwise, one team gonna have slightly higher overall MMR.

Season 1 would have been closer:
6 – 7
6 – 5
5 – 5
5 – 4
4 – 4

Your season 2 example is accurate, though could be closer in some circumstances.

Season 3 will be like a sorted version of season 1:
4 – 5
4 – 5
4 – 6
5 – 6
5 – 7

I belive that was an outlier, if the system can’t find a 5 vs 5 it will hop on a 6 vs 4. Based on my experience in game, I have yet to face a team where I was like kitten , the MM sucks. Every game I lost was due to afker, * no supp on my team* * Dc*, got outplayed, made a mistake, or matched with legendary wings chasers.

Nah i think it works exactly how Evan described it. In that way it could be possible to keep a close 50% winrate. If both teams had 50% to win every match, good players could have a really high winrate anyway. If you get 60% winchance you most of the time win bc the quality of the other teams skill is often really low with a few decent players in the teams. Everytime it goes well for me, win streaks, w.e, anet throws me into premades with low divisions in them. True story. The result is as expected, about 40% winrate in those matches when i get those scrubs.

Well what you are overshadowing is this :

League Matchmaking
Season 2 matchmaking was changed from Season 1 Ranked and Unranked matchmaking to help ensure league positions correlated more with skill instead of simply being based on the hours played. These changes saw a multitude of improvements for Season 2, but unfortunately they also spread out win rates further than we would have liked, as matches became a bit too uneven. We’ve created a new matchmaker for Season 3 that will strike a balance between the two previous seasons, accomplishing the same goals of accuracy from Season 2 but doing so with the evenness of matches that players experienced in Season 1

What Evans gave was an example, I believe it’s an outlier and you believe it’s not, that’s ok but it doesn’t change the fact that the system try to create “even essential of matches players experienced in S1” hence 5 vs 5.

In season 2 it made sure the higher mmr players would progress faster to legendary by teaming them together vs lower mmr players. Essentially the best season thus far measuring skill. Season 1 it mixed scrubs with pro players since divison was 50% of the mm and mmr 50% which lead to alot of scrubs got carried by the better players. Now in season 3 the mm tries to mix the higher mmr together so they have a slight advantage but not as in season 2 with such blowouts since its a smaller distance between the mmr teams. However, one team has ALWAYS an advantage over the other team as in slightly higher mmr.

And that’s not what this says:

League Matchmaking
Season 2 matchmaking was changed from Season 1 Ranked and Unranked matchmaking to help ensure league positions correlated more with skill instead of simply being based on the hours played. These changes saw a multitude of improvements for Season 2, but unfortunately they also spread out win rates further than we would have liked, as matches became a bit too uneven. We’ve created a new matchmaker for Season 3 that will strike a balance between the two previous seasons, accomplishing the same goals of accuracy from Season 2 but doing so with the evenness of matches that players experienced in Season 1

And I won’t even argue about S2 ladder being the best one,when it was the most despised ladder ever by pro player and casual alike. Helseth quite caused of it.

But you are entitled to your own opinion, hence your own interpretation of the data. So let’s just agree to disagree.

Its exactly what it says, you know how season 1 and 2 matchmaking worked right? I just explained to you how it worked. Thats how it is. Right now you just sound like you dont want to understand or simply…you dont understand xD Either way what i described is how it works. You always have about 60% to win or lose. Anet tweaked it in this way to not have such blowouts like in season 2. So now closer mmr groups fight vs eachother, but one team has always a slightly higher mmr than the other.

Fivedawgs.4267:

League Matchmaking
Season 2 matchmaking was changed from Season 1 Ranked and Unranked matchmaking to help ensure league positions correlated more with skill instead of simply being based on the hours played. These changes saw a multitude of improvements for Season 2, but unfortunately they also spread out win rates further than we would have liked, as matches became a bit too uneven. We’ve created a new matchmaker for Season 3 that will strike a balance between the two previous seasons, accomplishing the same goals of accuracy from Season 2 but doing so with the evenness of matches that players experienced in Season 1

Then they failed. Utterly. I am not the only one seeing results like this.

Asrat.2645:

sanctuary.1068:

In season 2 it made sure the higher mmr players would progress faster to legendary by teaming them together vs lower mmr players. Essentially the best season thus far measuring skill. Season 1 it mixed scrubs with pro players since divison was 50% of the mm and mmr 50% which lead to alot of scrubs got carried by the better players. Now in season 3 the mm tries to mix the higher mmr together so they have a slight advantage but not as in season 2 with such blowouts since its a smaller distance between the mmr teams. However, one team has ALWAYS an advantage over the other team as in slightly higher mmr.

Sry to interfere here but thats bullkitten.
If the matchmaking intentionally creates matchups favourable for ‘better’ players, it is exactly the opposite of a good measuring for skill.
Even if we leave the inaccuracy in detecting ‘better’ aside, you qualify as a good player by winning fair matches.
In other words: The only way you can ever prove to be good is if there is any adversity to overcome to begin with.
If you are truly a good player you will advance no matter what opponents you face.
A perfectly competitive game levels out the playing field and leave the rest to the players, it doent try to do their work for them.
Imagine you would coach an athlete but rig his games to only face the very worst competitors because he ‘deserves to win’

Yes its not fair, but it was a better measure of skill. The higher mmr players went to legendary fast, where they belonged, and it took longer for the lower mmr players to progress but they still could. Now it takes longer time for everyone to progress because of this new system. Right now we have a grind system…just like in season 1. Season 2 wasnt a grind because the better players progressed to where they belonged faster, average progressed quite fast also, it was just the worst of the worst who still were in amber/emerald.

Fivedawgs.4267:

Cynz.9437:

And how are you gonna explain 500-100, 100-500, 500-100, 100-500 matches if you really think that each team has 50% win/loss chance? Unless i team up with someone or play later at night, it is always the same i either watch my team being spawn camped or my team spawn camps enemy team. Even matches are extremely rare.

Achievement chasers , mistake, noobs players/new player who rode the high MMR train last season. It has nothing to do with the MM system. Heck, I have won game where we were behind by 300 pts, all it takes is one mistake.

Let’s say a 1 rode the HIGH MMR ride during S2, so the system unmistakably label him as a 10, dont you think this guy would be a detriment on a 5 vs 5 game?

Another one is the disparities between both camps, like supp have to prioritize by the MMR. A team with no supp has slim chacne of winning against a team with a supp (ele).

In short, the MM algo is the best we ever had, and if u can’t win your matchup especially if you didn’t start in amber then maybe you are where you belong.

Who say you were not where you deserved to be last season?….the system is not better simply because it favours you am I right?

Last season you had teammates who shared similar MMr with you, this season we’re back to S1 50/50 bs where the match decided even before starting, but I guess they went back on this system..because if favour the bad players who are the majority..reason for all the qq threads last time

sanctuary.1068:

Yes its not fair, but it was a better measure of skill. The higher mmr players went to legendary fast, where they belonged, and it took longer for the lower mmr players to progress but they still could. Now it takes longer time for everyone to progress because of this new system. Right now we have a grind system…just like in season 1. Season 2 wasnt a grind because the better players progressed to where they belonged faster, average progressed quite fast also, it was just the worst of the worst who still were in amber/emerald.

Well, I do see how its favourable to seperate good and bad players quickly.
But the current system of placing them in different leagues to begin with appears to be much more promising.
All in all I stick to my statement
I am not good because I win
I win because im good
(Or maybe I dont win at all, but im not a pro player so thats alright)

And what do you prefer: Painful grinding for a meaningful reward, or a free ticket to a meaningless badge.

Asrat.2645:

sanctuary.1068:

Yes its not fair, but it was a better measure of skill. The higher mmr players went to legendary fast, where they belonged, and it took longer for the lower mmr players to progress but they still could. Now it takes longer time for everyone to progress because of this new system. Right now we have a grind system…just like in season 1. Season 2 wasnt a grind because the better players progressed to where they belonged faster, average progressed quite fast also, it was just the worst of the worst who still were in amber/emerald.

Well, I do see how its favourable to seperate good and bad players quickly.
But the current system of placing them in different leagues to begin with appears to be much more promising.
All in all I stick to my statement
I am not good because I win
I win because im good
(Or maybe I dont win at all, but im not a pro player so thats alright)

And what do you prefer: Painful grinding for a meaningful reward, or a free ticket to a meaningless badge.

Its meaningless either way, because league means nothing. Everyone and their mother can get to legendary, all it require is time.

sanctuary.1068:

Fivedawgs.4267:

sanctuary.1068:

Fivedawgs.4267:

sanctuary.1068:

Fivedawgs.4267:

sanctuary.1068:

Did you people miss the official explaination from Anet in one of the threads that was posted a few days ago? The mm explaination isnt on wiki bc we have a totally new mm for season 3 that Anet created for the league only. https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/pvp/so-we-re-back-to-50-50-matches/first.

One team will always have an advantage over the other in the matchups. Both teams never have 50% chance to win, more like 60%-40% to win/lose.

Evan Lesh.3295:

Deimos Tel Arin.7391:

season 3 we get both
i.e.

red – blue
8 – 8
8 – 9
9 – 8
8 – 9
9 – 8

something like that maybe.
otherwise, one team gonna have slightly higher overall MMR.

Season 1 would have been closer:
6 – 7
6 – 5
5 – 5
5 – 4
4 – 4

Your season 2 example is accurate, though could be closer in some circumstances.

Season 3 will be like a sorted version of season 1:
4 – 5
4 – 5
4 – 6
5 – 6
5 – 7

I belive that was an outlier, if the system can’t find a 5 vs 5 it will hop on a 6 vs 4. Based on my experience in game, I have yet to face a team where I was like kitten , the MM sucks. Every game I lost was due to afker, * no supp on my team* * Dc*, got outplayed, made a mistake, or matched with legendary wings chasers.

Nah i think it works exactly how Evan described it. In that way it could be possible to keep a close 50% winrate. If both teams had 50% to win every match, good players could have a really high winrate anyway. If you get 60% winchance you most of the time win bc the quality of the other teams skill is often really low with a few decent players in the teams. Everytime it goes well for me, win streaks, w.e, anet throws me into premades with low divisions in them. True story. The result is as expected, about 40% winrate in those matches when i get those scrubs.

Well what you are overshadowing is this :

League Matchmaking
Season 2 matchmaking was changed from Season 1 Ranked and Unranked matchmaking to help ensure league positions correlated more with skill instead of simply being based on the hours played. These changes saw a multitude of improvements for Season 2, but unfortunately they also spread out win rates further than we would have liked, as matches became a bit too uneven. We’ve created a new matchmaker for Season 3 that will strike a balance between the two previous seasons, accomplishing the same goals of accuracy from Season 2 but doing so with the evenness of matches that players experienced in Season 1

What Evans gave was an example, I believe it’s an outlier and you believe it’s not, that’s ok but it doesn’t change the fact that the system try to create “even essential of matches players experienced in S1” hence 5 vs 5.

In season 2 it made sure the higher mmr players would progress faster to legendary by teaming them together vs lower mmr players. Essentially the best season thus far measuring skill. Season 1 it mixed scrubs with pro players since divison was 50% of the mm and mmr 50% which lead to alot of scrubs got carried by the better players. Now in season 3 the mm tries to mix the higher mmr together so they have a slight advantage but not as in season 2 with such blowouts since its a smaller distance between the mmr teams. However, one team has ALWAYS an advantage over the other team as in slightly higher mmr.

And that’s not what this says:

League Matchmaking
Season 2 matchmaking was changed from Season 1 Ranked and Unranked matchmaking to help ensure league positions correlated more with skill instead of simply being based on the hours played. These changes saw a multitude of improvements for Season 2, but unfortunately they also spread out win rates further than we would have liked, as matches became a bit too uneven. We’ve created a new matchmaker for Season 3 that will strike a balance between the two previous seasons, accomplishing the same goals of accuracy from Season 2 but doing so with the evenness of matches that players experienced in Season 1

And I won’t even argue about S2 ladder being the best one,when it was the most despised ladder ever by pro player and casual alike. Helseth quite caused of it.

But you are entitled to your own opinion, hence your own interpretation of the data. So let’s just agree to disagree.

Its exactly what it says, you know how season 1 and 2 matchmaking worked right? I just explained to you how it worked. Thats how it is. Right now you just sound like you dont want to understand or simply…you dont understand xD Either way what i described is how it works. You always have about 60% to win or lose. Anet tweaked it in this way to not have such blowouts like in season 2. So now closer mmr groups fight vs eachother, but one team has always a slightly higher mmr than the other.

You explained nothing to me. I could write an essay on S1 and S2 matchmaking, and get an A ON IT. Here are the facts :

-I have studied the S1 and S2 matchmaker.
- I have more knowledge on both algo than YOU and that’s a fact.

If you knew how they both works, you wouldn’t have said that S2 was the best system; that’s what prompted me to end the conviction., since you are clueless about what you are saying.

Supreme.3164:

Fivedawgs.4267:

Cynz.9437:

And how are you gonna explain 500-100, 100-500, 500-100, 100-500 matches if you really think that each team has 50% win/loss chance? Unless i team up with someone or play later at night, it is always the same i either watch my team being spawn camped or my team spawn camps enemy team. Even matches are extremely rare.

Achievement chasers , mistake, noobs players/new player who rode the high MMR train last season. It has nothing to do with the MM system. Heck, I have won game where we were behind by 300 pts, all it takes is one mistake.

Let’s say a 1 rode the HIGH MMR ride during S2, so the system unmistakably label him as a 10, dont you think this guy would be a detriment on a 5 vs 5 game?

Another one is the disparities between both camps, like supp have to prioritize by the MMR. A team with no supp has slim chacne of winning against a team with a supp (ele).

In short, the MM algo is the best we ever had, and if u can’t win your matchup especially if you didn’t start in amber then maybe you are where you belong.

Who say you were not where you deserved to be last season?….the system is not better simply because it favours you am I right?

Last season you had teammates who shared similar MMr with you, this season we’re back to S1 50/50 bs where the match decided even before starting, but I guess they went back on this system..because if favour the bad players who are the majority..reason for all the qq threads last time

Nope far from it, the system is better because it’s 5 vs 5. If you re read my post, it’s implied that vet amber or emerald player can still face these problem since we still don’t know how the system ranks new player. We also don’t know if new player are evenly allocated to both team. But emerald or sapphire played are better off this season than the last, due to 5 vs 5 or 4 vs 6 (outlier).

Last season was rigged against vet with less than a 50% winrate. So in short, it was a joke.

Fivedawgs.4267:

sanctuary.1068:

Fivedawgs.4267:

sanctuary.1068:

Fivedawgs.4267:

sanctuary.1068:

Fivedawgs.4267:

sanctuary.1068:

Did you people miss the official explaination from Anet in one of the threads that was posted a few days ago? The mm explaination isnt on wiki bc we have a totally new mm for season 3 that Anet created for the league only. https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/pvp/so-we-re-back-to-50-50-matches/first.

One team will always have an advantage over the other in the matchups. Both teams never have 50% chance to win, more like 60%-40% to win/lose.

Evan Lesh.3295:

Deimos Tel Arin.7391:

season 3 we get both
i.e.

red – blue
8 – 8
8 – 9
9 – 8
8 – 9
9 – 8

something like that maybe.
otherwise, one team gonna have slightly higher overall MMR.

Season 1 would have been closer:
6 – 7
6 – 5
5 – 5
5 – 4
4 – 4

Your season 2 example is accurate, though could be closer in some circumstances.

Season 3 will be like a sorted version of season 1:
4 – 5
4 – 5
4 – 6
5 – 6
5 – 7

I belive that was an outlier, if the system can’t find a 5 vs 5 it will hop on a 6 vs 4. Based on my experience in game, I have yet to face a team where I was like kitten , the MM sucks. Every game I lost was due to afker, * no supp on my team* * Dc*, got outplayed, made a mistake, or matched with legendary wings chasers.

Nah i think it works exactly how Evan described it. In that way it could be possible to keep a close 50% winrate. If both teams had 50% to win every match, good players could have a really high winrate anyway. If you get 60% winchance you most of the time win bc the quality of the other teams skill is often really low with a few decent players in the teams. Everytime it goes well for me, win streaks, w.e, anet throws me into premades with low divisions in them. True story. The result is as expected, about 40% winrate in those matches when i get those scrubs.

Well what you are overshadowing is this :

League Matchmaking
Season 2 matchmaking was changed from Season 1 Ranked and Unranked matchmaking to help ensure league positions correlated more with skill instead of simply being based on the hours played. These changes saw a multitude of improvements for Season 2, but unfortunately they also spread out win rates further than we would have liked, as matches became a bit too uneven. We’ve created a new matchmaker for Season 3 that will strike a balance between the two previous seasons, accomplishing the same goals of accuracy from Season 2 but doing so with the evenness of matches that players experienced in Season 1

What Evans gave was an example, I believe it’s an outlier and you believe it’s not, that’s ok but it doesn’t change the fact that the system try to create “even essential of matches players experienced in S1” hence 5 vs 5.

In season 2 it made sure the higher mmr players would progress faster to legendary by teaming them together vs lower mmr players. Essentially the best season thus far measuring skill. Season 1 it mixed scrubs with pro players since divison was 50% of the mm and mmr 50% which lead to alot of scrubs got carried by the better players. Now in season 3 the mm tries to mix the higher mmr together so they have a slight advantage but not as in season 2 with such blowouts since its a smaller distance between the mmr teams. However, one team has ALWAYS an advantage over the other team as in slightly higher mmr.

And that’s not what this says:

League Matchmaking
Season 2 matchmaking was changed from Season 1 Ranked and Unranked matchmaking to help ensure league positions correlated more with skill instead of simply being based on the hours played. These changes saw a multitude of improvements for Season 2, but unfortunately they also spread out win rates further than we would have liked, as matches became a bit too uneven. We’ve created a new matchmaker for Season 3 that will strike a balance between the two previous seasons, accomplishing the same goals of accuracy from Season 2 but doing so with the evenness of matches that players experienced in Season 1

And I won’t even argue about S2 ladder being the best one,when it was the most despised ladder ever by pro player and casual alike. Helseth quite caused of it.

But you are entitled to your own opinion, hence your own interpretation of the data. So let’s just agree to disagree.

Its exactly what it says, you know how season 1 and 2 matchmaking worked right? I just explained to you how it worked. Thats how it is. Right now you just sound like you dont want to understand or simply…you dont understand xD Either way what i described is how it works. You always have about 60% to win or lose. Anet tweaked it in this way to not have such blowouts like in season 2. So now closer mmr groups fight vs eachother, but one team has always a slightly higher mmr than the other.

You explained nothing to me. I could write an essay on S1 and S2 matchmaking, and get an A ON IT. Here are the facts :

-I have studied the S1 and S2 matchmaker.
- I have more knowledge on both algo than YOU and that’s a fact.

If you knew how they both works, you wouldn’t have said that S2 was the best system; that’s what prompted me to end the conviction., since you are clueless about what you are saying.

“I have studied the s1 and s2 mm” rly now, you have the numbers from Anet? Is this a fact now that you know mm better than i do? I didnt think you could sound more dumb but you outdid yourself. Gz. Besides i said season 2 was a better measure of skill and was better bc high mmr players progressed where they belonged faster, instead of this grind system.

Well, I invite you to peruse my posts. I ve read, tested and made my own MMR machine based on glicko 2 to see how the deviation shifted and else( such as, how many points ate awarded aftet a loss or win). I know the in and out of both systems.

Asrat.2645:

sanctuary.1068:

Yes its not fair, but it was a better measure of skill. The higher mmr players went to legendary fast, where they belonged, and it took longer for the lower mmr players to progress but they still could. Now it takes longer time for everyone to progress because of this new system. Right now we have a grind system…just like in season 1. Season 2 wasnt a grind because the better players progressed to where they belonged faster, average progressed quite fast also, it was just the worst of the worst who still were in amber/emerald.

Well, I do see how its favourable to seperate good and bad players quickly.
But the current system of placing them in different leagues to begin with appears to be much more promising.
All in all I stick to my statement
I am not good because I win
I win because im good
(Or maybe I dont win at all, but im not a pro player so thats alright)

And what do you prefer: Painful grinding for a meaningful reward, or a free ticket to a meaningless badge.

I afk’d in matches just as an experiment. Still won games. Where does it fit?

sanctuary.1068:

Its meaningless either way, because league means nothing. Everyone and their mother can get to legendary, all it require is time.

Also this ^^ lol

Fivedawgs.4267:

Well, I invite you to peruse my posts. I ve read, tested and made my own MMR machine based on glicko 2 to see how the deviation shifted and else( such as, how many points ate awarded aftet a loss or win). I know the in and out of both systems.

Still you have low understanding of written sentences. Even when i quoted what Evan said and he even made an example of how it works (notice how season 1 mm was more 50%-50% matches) vs his third example for season 3 mm roughly 60%-40% examples (since its a bit influenced by season 2). Combine that with the quote you quoted yourself about the new mm for season 3, and wallah. Whats so hard to understand? It sounds like you dont understand written text very well, or the context in a text.

Cynz.9437:

Asrat.2645:

sanctuary.1068:

Yes its not fair, but it was a better measure of skill. The higher mmr players went to legendary fast, where they belonged, and it took longer for the lower mmr players to progress but they still could. Now it takes longer time for everyone to progress because of this new system. Right now we have a grind system…just like in season 1. Season 2 wasnt a grind because the better players progressed to where they belonged faster, average progressed quite fast also, it was just the worst of the worst who still were in amber/emerald.

Well, I do see how its favourable to seperate good and bad players quickly.
But the current system of placing them in different leagues to begin with appears to be much more promising.
All in all I stick to my statement
I am not good because I win
I win because im good
(Or maybe I dont win at all, but im not a pro player so thats alright)

And what do you prefer: Painful grinding for a meaningful reward, or a free ticket to a meaningless badge.

I afk’d in matches just as an experiment. Still won games. Where does it fit?

sanctuary.1068:

Its meaningless either way, because league means nothing. Everyone and their mother can get to legendary, all it require is time.

Also this ^^ lol

Anet, we have an afker…. a ban, at this point, is acceptable.

But video of it or it didn’t happen.

As far as the league being meaningless this season, you couldn’t be more wrong. First, because time is valuable and Noone would invest their time in something they deemed meaningless. Also, it’s kind of wierd that you agree with sanctuary, since you are struggling to climb the ladder.

sanctuary.1068:

Fivedawgs.4267:

Well, I invite you to peruse my posts. I ve read, tested and made my own MMR machine based on glicko 2 to see how the deviation shifted and else( such as, how many points ate awarded aftet a loss or win). I know the in and out of both systems.

Still you have low understanding of written sentences. Even when i quoted what Evan said and he even made an example of how it works (notice how season 1 mm was more 50%-50% matches) vs his third example for season 3 mm roughly 60%-40% examples (since its a bit influenced by season 2). Combine that with the quote you quoted yourself about the new mm for season 3, and wallah. Whats so hard to understand? It sounds like you dont understand written text very well, or the context in a text.

why are you making this complicated?? it looks as if you are the one who cant read. Look Evan is part of the balance team; Ok let me be blunt since you dont appreciate my kindness.

First you agree that S1 was 50/50 ok, now lets look at Evan S1 example:

Season 1 would have been closer:
6 – 7
6 – 5
5 – 5
5 – 4
4 – 4

Does this look like a 50/50 to you? Or are you just arguing for the sake of the argument.

Season 3 will be like a sorted version of season 1:
4 – 5
4 – 5
4 – 6
5 – 6
5 – 7

I am telling you his S3 example is an outlier. Evan is part of the balance Team and has released the above statement, whereas the balance TEAM AS A WHOLE said this:

League Matchmaking
Season 2 matchmaking was changed from Season 1 Ranked and Unranked matchmaking to help ensure league positions correlated more with skill instead of simply being based on the hours played. These changes saw a multitude of improvements for Season 2, but unfortunately they also spread out win rates further than we would have liked, as matches became a bit too uneven. We’ve created a new matchmaker for Season 3 that will strike a balance between the two previous seasons, accomplishing the same goals of accuracy from Season 2 but doing so with the evenness of matches that players experienced in Season 1

Have a nice say, and learn to read.

Fivedawgs.4267:

Cynz.9437:

Asrat.2645:

sanctuary.1068:

Yes its not fair, but it was a better measure of skill. The higher mmr players went to legendary fast, where they belonged, and it took longer for the lower mmr players to progress but they still could. Now it takes longer time for everyone to progress because of this new system. Right now we have a grind system…just like in season 1. Season 2 wasnt a grind because the better players progressed to where they belonged faster, average progressed quite fast also, it was just the worst of the worst who still were in amber/emerald.

Well, I do see how its favourable to seperate good and bad players quickly.
But the current system of placing them in different leagues to begin with appears to be much more promising.
All in all I stick to my statement
I am not good because I win
I win because im good
(Or maybe I dont win at all, but im not a pro player so thats alright)

And what do you prefer: Painful grinding for a meaningful reward, or a free ticket to a meaningless badge.

I afk’d in matches just as an experiment. Still won games. Where does it fit?

sanctuary.1068:

Its meaningless either way, because league means nothing. Everyone and their mother can get to legendary, all it require is time.

Also this ^^ lol

Anet, we have an afker…. a ban, at this point, is acceptable.

But video of it or it didn’t happen.

As far as the league being meaningless this season, you couldn’t be more wrong. First, because time is valuable and Noone would invest their time in something they deemed meaningless. Also, it’s kind of wierd that you agree with sanctuary, since you are struggling to climb the ladder.

Im ruby and progressed into high divisions in both earlier seasons. Ive never had issues to progress in any season, but i dislike season 1 & 3 bc its based on grind and not skill. Season 2 was more of a measure of skill since the worst couldnt progress out of emerald. Pvp isnt a reward track, like many others have said before like many wants it to be. Gw1 never had this kind of bull, when you lost you lost, when you won you won. You could lose 100 times in a row until you improved. Its about getting better at pvp, its not pve.

Fivedawgs.4267:

Cynz.9437:

Asrat.2645:

sanctuary.1068:

Yes its not fair, but it was a better measure of skill. The higher mmr players went to legendary fast, where they belonged, and it took longer for the lower mmr players to progress but they still could. Now it takes longer time for everyone to progress because of this new system. Right now we have a grind system…just like in season 1. Season 2 wasnt a grind because the better players progressed to where they belonged faster, average progressed quite fast also, it was just the worst of the worst who still were in amber/emerald.

Well, I do see how its favourable to seperate good and bad players quickly.
But the current system of placing them in different leagues to begin with appears to be much more promising.
All in all I stick to my statement
I am not good because I win
I win because im good
(Or maybe I dont win at all, but im not a pro player so thats alright)

And what do you prefer: Painful grinding for a meaningful reward, or a free ticket to a meaningless badge.

I afk’d in matches just as an experiment. Still won games. Where does it fit?

sanctuary.1068:

Its meaningless either way, because league means nothing. Everyone and their mother can get to legendary, all it require is time.

Also this ^^ lol

Anet, we have an afker…. a ban, at this point, is acceptable.

But video of it or it didn’t happen.

As far as the league being meaningless this season, you couldn’t be more wrong. First, because time is valuable and Noone would invest their time in something they deemed meaningless. Also, it’s kind of wierd that you agree with sanctuary, since you are struggling to climb the ladder.

sanctuary.1068:

Fivedawgs.4267:

Well, I invite you to peruse my posts. I ve read, tested and made my own MMR machine based on glicko 2 to see how the deviation shifted and else( such as, how many points ate awarded aftet a loss or win). I know the in and out of both systems.

Still you have low understanding of written sentences. Even when i quoted what Evan said and he even made an example of how it works (notice how season 1 mm was more 50%-50% matches) vs his third example for season 3 mm roughly 60%-40% examples (since its a bit influenced by season 2). Combine that with the quote you quoted yourself about the new mm for season 3, and wallah. Whats so hard to understand? It sounds like you dont understand written text very well, or the context in a text.

why are you making this complicated?? it looks as if you are the one who cant read. Look Evan is part of the balance team; Ok let me be blunt since you dont appreciate my kindness.

First you agree that S1 was 50/50 ok, now lets look at Evan S1 example:

Season 1 would have been closer:
6 – 7
6 – 5
5 – 5
5 – 4
4 – 4

Does this look like a 50/50 to you? Or are you just arguing for the sake of the argument.

Season 3 will be like a sorted version of season 1:
4 – 5
4 – 5
4 – 6
5 – 6
5 – 7

I am telling you his S3 example is an outlier. Evan is part of the balance Team and has released the above statement, whereas the balance TEAM AS A WHOLE said this:

Have a nice say, and learn to read.

Its you that cant read, according to the system second team has gotten a 7 followed by a 5 while other team two 6’s. The system “thinks” the 7 will carry that game and gives it lower numbers to even out. Eventually its the closest to a 50% game it can get compared to season 3 example. A game will never have exactly 50% in both teams and thats what ive been saying all along. What i said was, season 1 was “more of 50%” matches. I didnt say it was exact 50% matchups cause that will never happen. If you compare season 1 to 3, you can see a clear difference one team is in favor above the other. In the season 3 example, theres no one in the other team who has higher mmr to be seen as “carrying” like in the season 1 example. Just learn to read dawg im getting annoyed with your reading dissabilities.

Its closer to 50% but its not. Hence shouldn’t be called as such.. just like his S3 example is closer to 50 but its not.

dude, have a nice day. Youa re rambling nonsense now

Fivedawgs.4267:

Cynz.9437:

Asrat.2645:

sanctuary.1068:

Yes its not fair, but it was a better measure of skill. The higher mmr players went to legendary fast, where they belonged, and it took longer for the lower mmr players to progress but they still could. Now it takes longer time for everyone to progress because of this new system. Right now we have a grind system…just like in season 1. Season 2 wasnt a grind because the better players progressed to where they belonged faster, average progressed quite fast also, it was just the worst of the worst who still were in amber/emerald.

Well, I do see how its favourable to seperate good and bad players quickly.
But the current system of placing them in different leagues to begin with appears to be much more promising.
All in all I stick to my statement
I am not good because I win
I win because im good
(Or maybe I dont win at all, but im not a pro player so thats alright)

And what do you prefer: Painful grinding for a meaningful reward, or a free ticket to a meaningless badge.

I afk’d in matches just as an experiment. Still won games. Where does it fit?

sanctuary.1068:

Its meaningless either way, because league means nothing. Everyone and their mother can get to legendary, all it require is time.

Also this ^^ lol

Anet, we have an afker…. a ban, at this point, is acceptable.

But video of it or it didn’t happen.

As far as the league being meaningless this season, you couldn’t be more wrong. First, because time is valuable and Noone would invest their time in something they deemed meaningless. Also, it’s kind of wierd that you agree with sanctuary, since you are struggling to climb the ladder.

sanctuary.1068:

Fivedawgs.4267:

Well, I invite you to peruse my posts. I ve read, tested and made my own MMR machine based on glicko 2 to see how the deviation shifted and else( such as, how many points ate awarded aftet a loss or win). I know the in and out of both systems.

Still you have low understanding of written sentences. Even when i quoted what Evan said and he even made an example of how it works (notice how season 1 mm was more 50%-50% matches) vs his third example for season 3 mm roughly 60%-40% examples (since its a bit influenced by season 2). Combine that with the quote you quoted yourself about the new mm for season 3, and wallah. Whats so hard to understand? It sounds like you dont understand written text very well, or the context in a text.

why are you making this complicated?? it looks as if you are the one who cant read. Look Evan is part of the balance team; Ok let me be blunt since you dont appreciate my kindness.

First you agree that S1 was 50/50 ok, now lets look at Evan S1 example:

Season 1 would have been closer:
6 – 7
6 – 5
5 – 5
5 – 4
4 – 4

Does this look like a 50/50 to you? Or are you just arguing for the sake of the argument.

Season 3 will be like a sorted version of season 1:
4 – 5
4 – 5
4 – 6
5 – 6
5 – 7

I am telling you his S3 example is an outlier. Evan is part of the balance Team and has released the above statement, whereas the balance TEAM AS A WHOLE said this:

League Matchmaking
Season 2 matchmaking was changed from Season 1 Ranked and Unranked matchmaking to help ensure league positions correlated more with skill instead of simply being based on the hours played. These changes saw a multitude of improvements for Season 2, but unfortunately they also spread out win rates further than we would have liked, as matches became a bit too uneven. We’ve created a new matchmaker for Season 3 that will strike a balance between the two previous seasons, accomplishing the same goals of accuracy from Season 2 but doing so with the evenness of matches that players experienced in Season 1

Have a nice say, and learn to read.

We can all read and we can all see that season 3 is nothing more than season 1 recycled, it favours bad players that have been crying during season 2.

Now you can grind your way up to legendary, flying on the wings on a MMR system that favour pvers and achievement hunters

Look around you! No QQ threads! and you know why?
The amount of bad players has always vastly outnumbered the rest and they have been answered because :if you cry loudly and long enough on the forum..you get your way as long as you’re a pver/gem buyer EZZZPOORT

Fivedawgs.4267:

Its closer to 50% but its not. Hence shouldn’t be called as such.. just like his S3 example is closer to 50 but its not.

dude, have a nice day. Youa re rambling nonsense now

Well you just proved me right. You told us all along we have a 50% winchance system while i said we now have a 60% to 40% win/lose chance. Thank you for proving me right finally, you can stop argue now.

sanctuary.1068:

Fivedawgs.4267:

Its closer to 50% but its not. Hence shouldn’t be called as such.. just like his S3 example is closer to 50 but its not.

dude, have a nice day. Youa re rambling nonsense now

Well you just proved me right. You told us all along we have a 50% winchance system while i said we now have a 60% to 40% win/lose chance. Thank you for proving me right finally, you can stop argue now.

Not at all, you are taking what i said out of context. You rambled for 1 hour about how S1 is 50/50 so 8 2 2 2 2 vs 4 4 4 2 2 (16 vs 16). Evan example doesn’t show that. So i have proved my point, but disproving one of your claim.

Fivedawgs.4267:

sanctuary.1068:

Fivedawgs.4267:

Its closer to 50% but its not. Hence shouldn’t be called as such.. just like his S3 example is closer to 50 but its not.

dude, have a nice day. Youa re rambling nonsense now

Well you just proved me right. You told us all along we have a 50% winchance system while i said we now have a 60% to 40% win/lose chance. Thank you for proving me right finally, you can stop argue now.

Not at all, you are taking what i said out of context. You rambled for 1 hour about how S1 is 50/50 so 8 2 2 2 2 vs 4 4 4 2 2 (16 vs 16). Evan example doesn’t show that. So i have proved my point, but disproving one of your claim.

My claim was never that season 1 was EXACT 50%. I said it was closer to 50% than any other season in theory because it tried to even out the combined group mmr similar to the other groups combined mmr which means they could throw in a higher mmr player to substitute for a lower mmr player and same with the other team. That doesnt mean both teams have exactly same combined mmr number. Season 1 was closer to 50% than season 3 is since one team will always have slightly higher mmr than the other team. You have proved nothing dawg since you try to prove something i havent said and only have disproved your own statement that we have a 50% matchmaking system where everyone can win as long as they play good (wrong btw), when we have more of a 60% win/lose ratio system atm.

Fivedawgs.4267:

-BOTH TEAM HAVE A 50% CHANCE OF WINNING THE GANE it’s not 90% chance of winning or 10% of losing, that’s miscontruing the data or asinine math. How is 5 vs 5 result in one team having 90% chnace of winning???

Facepalm -_-

Actually, you never explicitly said S1 was 50/50, but everyone pretty much agree that what the system tried to and Evan example is not representative of that, which pretty much lessen the credibility of his example. But my point is Evan is not the Balance TEAM, he is part of it. The balance team as whole released the following statement:

League Matchmaking
Season 2 matchmaking was changed from Season 1 Ranked and Unranked matchmaking to help ensure league positions correlated more with skill instead of simply being based on the hours played. These changes saw a multitude of improvements for Season 2, but unfortunately they also spread out win rates further than we would have liked, as matches became a bit too uneven. We’ve created a new matchmaker for Season 3 that will strike a balance between the two previous seasons, accomplishing the same goals of accuracy from Season 2 but doing so with the evenness of matches that players experienced in Season 1

Evan example go against what/how everyone think of S1 (50/50). So, it;s up to you, Do you want to be narrow minded and limit yourself to even example or Look at the bigger picture (BALANCE TEAM statement).

Now if you dont understand which statement holds more credibility then i have nothing else to say to you.

@supreme, i get the saltiness, i know how hard is it to beat your opposition; i am sorry that you can no longer stomp Low MMR players.

lmao, nice out of context quote, did you read the second point? like the next one?

Fivedawgs.4267:

bla bla

I mentioned the 50% from season 1 to begin with because you claimed in your first post we had a pure 50% winchance system where everyone has equal chances to win, which we obviously dont.

Im not gonna repeat myself, and since you keep repeating yourself over and over with the same quotes ive answered already im done arguing with you.

warbignime.4610:

So according to forum, loss streak =broken MM. Win streak =broken MM. 50%=broken MM. I can not even.

No other replies should’ve been needed.

I refuse to be taken out of context: I assume everyone can read.

Fivedawgs.4267:

Cynz.9437:

warbignime.4610:

So according to forum, loss streak =broken MM. Win streak =broken MM. 50%=broken MM. I can not even.

I think you misunderstand problem about 50% w/l. In most cases algorithm always puts together a team that has 90% win chance and other team with 10% win chances which leads to very lopsided and boring matches. Why is it done? To ensure that very 50% w/l ratio. Take same player with high MMR, he will be experiencing win-> loss->win -> loss -> win -> loss. It is not fun.

In any game where devs used common sense both teams have relative same chance to win. If you win more games you face better opponents but also get better teammates. In GW2 it is not the case. The old 50/50 algo always made sure you have 50% w/l ration (not win chance) by forcing you into lopsided matches. Season 2 also added extra logic which ensured that one team always had better chance to win to make players with high MMR to climb faster to high divisions. Those 2 combined led to real extremes in matches. Personally as a player i feel like i am strapped to the chair and forced to watch same 2 videos: 1 where my team gets spawn camped and next one where my team spawn camps enemy team. I don’t have any impact on outcome.

Dude, you couldn’t be more wrong, idk where you are reading that. But first before commenting on anything you are clueless about, my advice is to first read the notes or how the algo is supposed to work. Without more ado, here is how it works:

-BOTH TEAM HAVE A 50% CHANCE OF WINNING THE GANE it’s not 90% chance of winning or 10% of losing, that’s miscontruing the data or asinine math. How is 5 vs 5 result in one team having 90% chnace of winning???

-The outlier are 4 vs 6; and these games are winnable as well since all it takes is a mistake to turn the game around.

No, you are jut were you belong, accept that fact. If you can’t win 5 vs 5 or 4 vs 6. I am afraid you are were you belong, though achievement chaser could be hampering your progress but how often are you match with them?

matchmaking clearly not broken

Spirits Reloaded.3674:

matchmaking clearly not broken

Well, it’s clearly working, you had an Afk, so what were you expecting?

btw, after reading the chat, i wouldnt want collero on my team… Such a nasty attitude and outlook on games.

Fivedawgs.4267:

Cynz.9437:

Asrat.2645:

sanctuary.1068:

Yes its not fair, but it was a better measure of skill. The higher mmr players went to legendary fast, where they belonged, and it took longer for the lower mmr players to progress but they still could. Now it takes longer time for everyone to progress because of this new system. Right now we have a grind system…just like in season 1. Season 2 wasnt a grind because the better players progressed to where they belonged faster, average progressed quite fast also, it was just the worst of the worst who still were in amber/emerald.

Well, I do see how its favourable to seperate good and bad players quickly.
But the current system of placing them in different leagues to begin with appears to be much more promising.
All in all I stick to my statement
I am not good because I win
I win because im good
(Or maybe I dont win at all, but im not a pro player so thats alright)

And what do you prefer: Painful grinding for a meaningful reward, or a free ticket to a meaningless badge.

I afk’d in matches just as an experiment. Still won games. Where does it fit?

sanctuary.1068:

Its meaningless either way, because league means nothing. Everyone and their mother can get to legendary, all it require is time.

Also this ^^ lol

Anet, we have an afker…. a ban, at this point, is acceptable.

But video of it or it didn’t happen.

As far as the league being meaningless this season, you couldn’t be more wrong. First, because time is valuable and Noone would invest their time in something they deemed meaningless. Also, it’s kind of wierd that you agree with sanctuary, since you are struggling to climb the ladder.

sanctuary.1068:

Fivedawgs.4267:

Well, I invite you to peruse my posts. I ve read, tested and made my own MMR machine based on glicko 2 to see how the deviation shifted and else( such as, how many points ate awarded aftet a loss or win). I know the in and out of both systems.

Still you have low understanding of written sentences. Even when i quoted what Evan said and he even made an example of how it works (notice how season 1 mm was more 50%-50% matches) vs his third example for season 3 mm roughly 60%-40% examples (since its a bit influenced by season 2). Combine that with the quote you quoted yourself about the new mm for season 3, and wallah. Whats so hard to understand? It sounds like you dont understand written text very well, or the context in a text.

why are you making this complicated?? it looks as if you are the one who cant read. Look Evan is part of the balance team; Ok let me be blunt since you dont appreciate my kindness.

First you agree that S1 was 50/50 ok, now lets look at Evan S1 example:

Season 1 would have been closer:
6 – 7
6 – 5
5 – 5
5 – 4
4 – 4

Does this look like a 50/50 to you? Or are you just arguing for the sake of the argument.

Season 3 will be like a sorted version of season 1:
4 – 5
4 – 5
4 – 6
5 – 6
5 – 7

I am telling you his S3 example is an outlier. Evan is part of the balance Team and has released the above statement, whereas the balance TEAM AS A WHOLE said this:

League Matchmaking
Season 2 matchmaking was changed from Season 1 Ranked and Unranked matchmaking to help ensure league positions correlated more with skill instead of simply being based on the hours played. These changes saw a multitude of improvements for Season 2, but unfortunately they also spread out win rates further than we would have liked, as matches became a bit too uneven. We’ve created a new matchmaker for Season 3 that will strike a balance between the two previous seasons, accomplishing the same goals of accuracy from Season 2 but doing so with the evenness of matches that players experienced in Season 1

Have a nice say, and learn to read.

I bolded the most horrible thing I’ve read about MM ever. Why in all hells would you be rewarded with better teammates just b/c you no lifed this game. You could be the worst player in the game, but b/c you played a lot you get good teammates.

kitten that and it should have never been reincorporated in any form into season 3

/fail

My experience

- longer queue than s2
- not better games than s2

So yes, it’s worst than s2

Azukas.1426:

Fivedawgs.4267:

Cynz.9437:

Asrat.2645:

sanctuary.1068:

Yes its not fair, but it was a better measure of skill. The higher mmr players went to legendary fast, where they belonged, and it took longer for the lower mmr players to progress but they still could. Now it takes longer time for everyone to progress because of this new system. Right now we have a grind system…just like in season 1. Season 2 wasnt a grind because the better players progressed to where they belonged faster, average progressed quite fast also, it was just the worst of the worst who still were in amber/emerald.

Well, I do see how its favourable to seperate good and bad players quickly.
But the current system of placing them in different leagues to begin with appears to be much more promising.
All in all I stick to my statement
I am not good because I win
I win because im good
(Or maybe I dont win at all, but im not a pro player so thats alright)

And what do you prefer: Painful grinding for a meaningful reward, or a free ticket to a meaningless badge.

I afk’d in matches just as an experiment. Still won games. Where does it fit?

sanctuary.1068:

Its meaningless either way, because league means nothing. Everyone and their mother can get to legendary, all it require is time.

Also this ^^ lol

Anet, we have an afker…. a ban, at this point, is acceptable.

But video of it or it didn’t happen.

As far as the league being meaningless this season, you couldn’t be more wrong. First, because time is valuable and Noone would invest their time in something they deemed meaningless. Also, it’s kind of wierd that you agree with sanctuary, since you are struggling to climb the ladder.

sanctuary.1068:

Fivedawgs.4267:

Well, I invite you to peruse my posts. I ve read, tested and made my own MMR machine based on glicko 2 to see how the deviation shifted and else( such as, how many points ate awarded aftet a loss or win). I know the in and out of both systems.

Still you have low understanding of written sentences. Even when i quoted what Evan said and he even made an example of how it works (notice how season 1 mm was more 50%-50% matches) vs his third example for season 3 mm roughly 60%-40% examples (since its a bit influenced by season 2). Combine that with the quote you quoted yourself about the new mm for season 3, and wallah. Whats so hard to understand? It sounds like you dont understand written text very well, or the context in a text.

why are you making this complicated?? it looks as if you are the one who cant read. Look Evan is part of the balance team; Ok let me be blunt since you dont appreciate my kindness.

First you agree that S1 was 50/50 ok, now lets look at Evan S1 example:

Season 1 would have been closer:
6 – 7
6 – 5
5 – 5
5 – 4
4 – 4

Does this look like a 50/50 to you? Or are you just arguing for the sake of the argument.

Season 3 will be like a sorted version of season 1:
4 – 5
4 – 5
4 – 6
5 – 6
5 – 7

I am telling you his S3 example is an outlier. Evan is part of the balance Team and has released the above statement, whereas the balance TEAM AS A WHOLE said this:

League Matchmaking
Season 2 matchmaking was changed from Season 1 Ranked and Unranked matchmaking to help ensure league positions correlated more with skill instead of simply being based on the hours played. These changes saw a multitude of improvements for Season 2, but unfortunately they also spread out win rates further than we would have liked, as matches became a bit too uneven. We’ve created a new matchmaker for Season 3 that will strike a balance between the two previous seasons, accomplishing the same goals of accuracy from Season 2 but doing so with the evenness of matches that players experienced in Season 1

Have a nice say, and learn to read.

I bolded the most horrible thing I’ve read about MM ever. Why in all hells would you be rewarded with better teammates just b/c you no lifed this game. You could be the worst player in the game, but b/c you played a lot you get good teammates.

kitten that and it should have never been reincorporated in any form into season 3

/fail

That’s exactly why S2 was a joke, on top of that they matched you against anything. Like you had 10 vs 1, anywyas to answer your question: that what esport/ pro players asked for because they couldn’t stand 5 vs 5. To some extent, I understand them. But S3 is a lot better, and even with thi adds on, since the rating of both sides is considered.

But the bolded statement would hurt lots of player in amber. (An assumption)

Phil.8901:

My experience

- longer queue than s2
- not better games than s2

So yes, it’s worst than s2

I don’t think you know what you are saying, anywyas is that subjective or objective?

This season is 100% still rigged. Just slightly less so than last season and they basically officially posted this.

Twonineone.3490:

I’m trying really hard to not full this post of bad words, but I think that matchmaking is still the same of the last season where if you start losing, you keep losing all the kittening day. I had a 12 streak loss after 1 victory.
I won’t complayining about ignorant people that accuse everybody to not doing their job, in an arena, but I think that they are frustrated as much as I am, because this PvP is really becoming not funny.

have you beat my friend almost 21 loss yesterday stuck on sapphire tier one for almost 2 day. score wise i am a bad kitten but not sure getting top score most of the time means anything